You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Sneak Peak-isode

Episode Date: May 27, 2022

Adam and Peter tell all about the newest OS course to drop! Blueprint for Jazz Bass with Maestro Ron Carter. Join us this week to hear all about our newest course and what it took to make it happen. View course: Blueprint for Jazz BassHave a question for us? Leave us a SpeakPipeCheckout courses from Adam, Peter and more at Open StudioLet us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel.Follow us on Twitter | Instagram

Hey, Peter. Yep. Is that a... Is that a baseline you're playing there? Well, that's cool because I've been wanting to, I don't know, make a plan for playing bass lines. Like a blueprint? Yeah, like a blueprint for a jazz bassist, you know. And you're good.

You're really good. But I wonder if we have something from, I don't know, perhaps the greatest bass player who's ever lived? I think we might have something. I'm Adam Manus. And I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear podcast. Jazz. Explain. Explain to be this, Peter. How did we end up with our dinky little open studio getting one of the all-time greats on our roster? Ron Carter is officially an open studio artist. He's releasing a course this week. It is eminent and imminent and upon us. I know it's such a. It's beyond even. Well, you know what? I would say it's almost beyond like a dream come true because I don't know that we actually ever dreamed this. because it kind of felt like

not beyond what we could do, but just you know, I mean, yeah, I guess we did dream it, but it was also just sort of like like, you know, it's kind of like saying like I dream that I'm going to drive a Rolls-Royce one day or own one. When the reality is like, if I could just sit in the back of one, that would be great. But maybe we should aspire, you know, to owning a Rolls-Royce.

But in this case, this is the equivalent of it. We've got the role of course. Having Ron Carter is the base equivalent and it's such an exciting thing. And we thought today we would just sort of talk a little bit, a little behind the scenes of what it was like to be in the studio, how the kind of, you know, the origin story of why this came about. Yeah. And just, you know, reminisce a little bit in celebration of the release of Blueprint for Jazz Bass Bass.

And they even talk a little bit about some of the instruction Ron gave that we thought was really cool because there are lessons to be learned, even for pianists about constructing baselines from this course. Oh, absolutely. Blueprint for the jazz bassist. I mean, just the innate logic of kind of intersection of the logic and the artistry of Ron Carter is such an interesting and applicable to like

I mean beyond just like all the instruments just everything kind of in the arts he has such you know a deep well of understanding of art and science you know and how and then just technique on his particular instrument but things that we can apply to how we approach stuff and then

he's so you know at the same time approachable and yet not approach it's like a rose royce once you get in the thing you're like oh my god this is the most comfortable for you actually i've never been in one have you i've never been in one i was close to i was invited to go into allen two science in new orleans and i was on the outside of it which is very exciting yeah but i mean i my in my imagination i have been in ass class mercedes you know it seems unattainable once you get in it you're like this is the greatest thing it's so welcoming and comfortable you know i poked my head in a bentley one time at a gig that had a bunch of that stuff in there right that was kind of cool right right right um so

I wonder if we could just start with. So first of all, so as we record this podcast episode, it's late May 22. Yes. We went to New York City in February 2022. Yes. Already for me, it was a special trip because it was my first trip back to New York since the pandemic started. I was super stoked to just be in the city. Right.

But then on top of that, we spent two glorious days. Well, one and a half. We can talk about that. Glorious days with the maestro, Ron Carter. I just wonder maybe we could start with some things that about the session, about, about Maestro that stood out for us because there certainly were for me a couple of things, um, musically,

professionally, just personally like how he handled himself that I was like, I mean, I was, you know, you're just trying to soak it in, right? Right. Like taking it all in because,

you know, there's a lot to, there's a lot to learn from someone who is as high of a level as he has for so, so long. Yeah. And I think one of the first things. that struck me, and it's really the kind of the gift of the course and what's amazing about the course, the blueprint for modern jazz basis, is how simple he makes everything. He makes his

own playing and his own job with things relatively simple. That doesn't mean that it's easy or that it's basic, but it's very, he has a very simple philosophy when it comes down to it. Yeah. And like, I was struck by the fact that of the two days that we recorded and he stuff with you, he did stuff solo. He didn't want to talk about bass solos or how to blaze on a solo or anything like that. He is so interested in his role as a bass player and what it means to play the bass and how to create the, uh, you know, a baseline that really, as he says, like, can make or break a band, can really change the direction of any band. That to me was the lesson of like, you know, know your role within the music and, and like work your hardest to make that simple so that you can make

these beautiful artistic choices. When I think back on his playing over the decades, that simplicity really stands out to me, too, when I think of him. I don't think of Ron Carter as this blazing jaco soloists doing all this stuff, even though he probably could do all of that. Right. I think of him. And he kind of does some of that within the baseline.

He can. Yeah, exactly. But I think about him more as like being able to create a vibe in the rhythm sections that he's in. And that's where his genius comes out. Absolutely. And he talks about that in the core. And he talked about that with us and just it really pervades his, I think his philosophy in terms of, you know, how he teaches, but more importantly, how he plays.

Yeah. And it matches so well with what he professes and just, you know, talks about in terms of like the bass as being the quarterback, you know, everything kind of coming out from the base. And it's not from the sense of like self importance of the position of the instrument. It's really because of the way that he's always played. And of course, you know, he's probably the musician that we've, and a lot of the people listen to this podcast, have listened to more, even if like you're a guitar player. Yeah. Like, or a pianist or whatever. It doesn't matter.

You probably heard Ron Carter playing more than anybody. The whole, this whole thing happened, like the Maestro reached out to us because we did, you'll hear an episode on the five greatest, seven greatest bass lines of all time. Well, we should start with this origin story. It's very interesting. Well, like four of them were his. That's right. And that's why he was three. Yeah, yeah.

Three of them. Three of them were his. And that wasn't planned. No, that's just because he made the best face. Right, right. And we used a picture of him, I think, on the YouTube video maybe, on like the thumbnail. And so we received a call from Mr. Carter's assistant here at Open Studio HQ that Mr.

Carter would like to have a Zoom call. Yeah, I like to think of his people called our people. His people did call our people. I think we might have answered the phone. Yeah, his people called our people and said he'd like to have a phone conversation with us. and because of the silly, insecure Midwestern pianists that we are, we became fearful instead of opportunistic

when we heard that. Remember we were like, uh-oh, is he going to be upset that we used his picture and talked about his baselines and stuff? I mean, we cleared everything, the music, but we didn't talk to him, obviously, in advance. And I had met Ron Carter two times in the past, but I knew he wouldn't remember me. But, I mean, I'd met him before,

but I was in no way like friends with him or anything, just an admirer. from afar more than anything. But he asked to have a Zoom call. And it was like three days from then. He's like on Friday. It was like on Tuesday. Yeah.

And so we scheduled for Friday. So we had like three days of kind of not. I don't know about you, but we had some nervous energy those days. And we were all still separate and kind of, you know, quarantining or whatever. That's true. And it was like,

what is he going to be in trouble? I mean, we definitely weren't like is he calling because he wants to do a course with us. That was not on our radar. Yeah. No, it turns out. He just wanted to be on the podcast,

essentially. Like he. I think, but he never even said that. He just kind of wanted to talk. I think he just wanted to talk. And set us straight a little bit. What's a little bit of setting straight?

Setting us straight. He was, he was the, basically was the vibe like, hey, listen, if you're going to talk about my baselines, why don't you just have me on and I'll talk about my baselines? Because I know more than you jokers do about my baseline. We're like jazz explained. He's like Ron Carter explained. I'll take care of that. And, you know, he was right.

That's right. He was right. And then out of that, we made a video with him, a very long video that became a very popular video for us last year. He was on the podcast here. And it was a remote interview, which can potentially. eventually be the most awkward thing, especially when you don't know people over Zoom, like you don't have a rapport. Yeah.

And even like with the delay and the video or whatever, but he really made it easy. I mean, you know, he was very like, you know, wanted to state how he believes in things like he always does. But in terms of like he was super gracious. And we were a little bit fearful because there's stories out there that he can be very demanding in terms of recording sessions and gigs and interviews and that kind. of thing, but he was just, he gave so much. I mean, like so many just interesting answered and gave us like time and was very generous. And we did, we did find out he likes to be early. He's, I don't think we've done a Zoom meeting with the maestro where he wasn't there before we were there. That's right. And we show up early. And we, uh, and so now we just started coming

like a half hour early. Right. And kind of funny thing about that first interview, remember, we had some technical snafus as we were setting up. And, yeah, he actually played a joke on us and pretended like he was going to sleep. We're like, oh, no, we've lost him. He kind of laughed. But he was super warm and really funny and it was great to talk to. And then we ended up. And very open to talking about, I mean, we talked about the Japanese commercial and all that stuff, you know.

And then a few months after that, I think this is maybe September, October was the second time we talked to him. Right. Right. Maybe October. Seems about right. We had him on the podcast again. Because, you know, we kind of have, you know, we know Ron Carter now. Yeah.

Yeah, he's not in myself. A little bit of a deeper dive. He's not on my phone, but I believe I have an email. Yes, right. For his assistant. For his assistant. But so we did another one. And then after that was over, it was just like, okay, well, thanks again, Mr. Carter.

And we'll see you next time. And do you remember what I said after that, Peter? Yes. Okay. So let me take over here because this is just a genius thing. I mean, we finished and we were so excited. Oh, that's the one. Actually, we had the real technical stuff.

We didn't even realize we lost a bunch of footage. That's right. But we were so happy about how it went. We're like high five. in each other and we're just like chest bumping. We weren't shaking in our boots the second one. We weren't as nervous. Right.

That's right. And it really went well. I mean, you can see it on the, and we'll link to the, uh, to both the interviews, but we felt even more at home and we felt good about the rapport that

we had and just, you know, the, the, the knowledge and just funny stories and interesting stories, but really just like that deep connection with a legend that we were able to facilitate in a little, a bit of a small way.

Yeah. Um, so we were like, high, like, this is great. And then I remember in a moment of euphoria, you looked and be like, let's get him, let's get him to do a course. Let's have him do a course.

You said it to me. The first one was about his book about the Autumn Lee's bass lines with his time with Miles' group. The second interview he did was about his book, Blueprint for the working jazz basis. That's right. And like this book that he created so lines up with our philosophies here at Open Studio and with the things that Christian McBride has done and Rubin Rogers has done and Bob the boo has done. that it just seemed obvious. And also it seemed like he keeps agreeing to talk to us about this stuff. And I was like, are we, are we just too scared to ask the pretty girl to the dance?

Like, you know what I mean? And that's exactly what you said. And it brings to mind a great quote of Warren Buffett. We don't normally quote here at the podcast. Always on our mind. What's up? Oracle of Omaha. Whoa.

Toyota Carolla. But he says, when others are fearful, be greedy. When others are greedy, be fearful. Or something along those lines. I might be paraphrasing. Say it again, when others are fearful, be greedy. When others are greedy, be fearful.

Right. And he's talking about in terms of, I think, the stock marketer investing his company. When everybody's, you know, afraid and selling off, that's the time to buy. I think. I don't even know. But it made me think of this because, like, as soon as you're like, let's, let's, let's ask him to do a course. I immediately got fearful because I was like, oh.

I was like, whoa. I, you know, just because I think that's an initial thing of like, we're not good enough for that. Yeah. You know. And but you were kind of being greedy because like the thing went really well. I was being fearful and you got greedy. And you're like, you know what?

Interview, interview. Let's have them do a course. And it was a man. You know what it is, Peter. Honestly, like we've done so much. I don't know if the audience knows this. But we make so much content. Yeah.

We've talked to so many great people of, especially over the last two years, like since the pandemic. And we've really, when you're and I's musical careers kind of took a little bit of a halt. And we really started to, uh, to, sharing out the content. Yes, because we had nothing else to do or bored, essentially. We just were like, let's just make some content. Right.

But really started talking to like all kinds of folks that, you know, during the pandemic, think about all the amazing jazz musicians. We talked to, things that we made. I'm honestly just so and hearing from all of our, you'll hear it listeners, all of our open studio members, about how much they're appreciating all the things we're doing. Just, you know, the last year or so, man, and I feel you on this energy too, it's just like, let's get to it, man. Yeah.

We've got like we're, you know, we're confident in what we're doing at this point. It's like when you, it's like playing, actually. And it's like learning how to play. You know what I mean? Like once you get across, there's not a, it's not like a threshold that's so, you know, marked. But actually you can kind of think of it as like learning a new tune. There's a point where you're not thinking about the changes.

You're not thinking about the melody or the form. It's just ingrained. And then this freedom starts to happen. Right. And that's how I feel like what, just, you know, to our own horn here in this situation. Like the last year or so, it feels like we really know the tune. Like it feels like we have the confidence to be free with stuff. And like, whereas two years ago, I'd be like, ah, we probably shouldn't make a course

with Ron Carter. It's Ron Carter. You know, certainly there's someone better for that. No, we are, we are as, you know, like I want to present these people because I think we can nail it, you know. And I think we did. I think with getting more confident and, you know, we can think about this through the lens of practicing and improvisation as well, part of, you know, building your confidence

up is being willing to make mistakes. Totally. And so let's jump right to the session here. And I want to just mention to you just to frame the discussion. We'll kind of talk about what it was like to be in the studio in New York. But kind of a high point and a low point came for me. Oh, this is incredible. We'll start on a high note, was getting a chance to play duo with Mr. Carter, which was his request.

I want to put that out there because I know people are going to be like, oh, I see you're playing on a couple of the lessons. I guess you may put that on the content. I did not. of course I wanted to do it, but I did not want to impose myself. But he asked me to accompany him on the course to demonstrate some things. Can you be a little, can you be honest? Yes. Were you a little nervous?

I was very nervous. I could tell a little bit. I was very nervous. I could never tell if you're nervous. You're so ice cold usually. Yeah. Ice in his Peter's veins. He's played with everybody.

He's been all over the world. I could tell you were a little bit getting into it. You were like, oh, snap. Well, everyone's going to be able to evaluate it from themselves because we only did one take of everything. because remember we just like he played it then he's like okay well no no so we didn't even go over the endings or anything

he was very specific in advance but then we just started playing I'm like well he didn't I wanted to do it wasn't like a recording session where you're just playing he was very specific like play to play the melody then play two things and then we take it out well I just want to be clear to our listeners here you will not be able to tell Peter was nervous

from the playing at all because you might and that's a lesson in being a professional like you sounded great you sounded just like yourself I could just tell by your body language You know, you've always got a little high. You started sweating a little bit. Pooping in my pants. You just seemed not quite as, as, as, as, uh, as, uh, as, uh, liberated as usually.

Exactly. But the playing was great. And hearing you guys play together and figure stuff out, like, without talking about it. And it was a very, like, I've never played with anybody where we're recording, especially with video that I had never played with before. Yeah. But yet somebody who's like playing, I know so well. Right.

So it was just a weird thing. Like, because he didn't, like, I was trying to warm. He's like, hold up. He's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, save it for the I was like save it we're about I was like can we get you know comfortable but I mean it was just he's just such a professional that you know that's going to be there so that yeah it was a lot nervous so that was a high point though yeah getting to do that totally um and then the low point for me you probably will remember okay was when I kicked the minstrel's bass in the first hour

of recording no I mean yeah like first 10 minutes minutes of his arrival one of the first things Peter did at the session was kick the base yeah by accident I mean let me put it out there and it was loud it was not injured or damaged, luckily. But it was super awkward. It was literally the worst way to start the session. And I remember thinking like, well, I'm always preaching about be willing to make mistakes.

I was like, huh, how are you going to own that one, buddy? Yeah. It's half a million dollar base. What if he can't use it for the session? What if, you know? Yeah. And let's just say that Mr. Carter did not turn to me after I kicked it. First of all, it was very tight in there.

We're trying to get comfortable. I was trying to help out where I probably shouldn't. You know, it wasn't like I kicked it. And then he said, oh, don't worry about it. He looked at me and was like, ah, he let out like pain like his child had been kicked or something, which it kind of was. Yeah. So, but I do remember thinking, well, you can only be uphill from here.

Because literally, it couldn't be any worse. It couldn't be any worse. You couldn't start any worse. Well, so. Well, if it had been actually damaged and unplayable, that would have been. I don't have many low points from the session. I didn't, I mean, I didn't kick his base. So.

I didn't want to instill confidence in all you guys. Thank you. But it was, it was crowded there. We had a lot of camera angles. We had camera folks. audio. I mean, we had it to the smallest group that we could, but we wanted it to be, you know, right. And we wanted to capture this historic, you know, tutelage from, you know, a master. So we had to have people in there. But it was, and we were in a great studio that

Ron really wanted to be in, like kind of one of his favorite places with one of his favorite engineers. Yeah. And so it was a special. Dave Darlington. Dave Darlington. Incredible job. Who ran audio there and was just a real bridge, having worked with Mr. Carter a lot. My highlight was I was tasked with bringing an open studio hoodie and giving it to the maestro. And I did at the end of the session. And Peter, I'm not making this up. His face lit up.

It lit up when I brought the hoodie to him. He's old school. He likes swag, man. You know, he's seen our stuff. I'd like to think maybe he's seen my videos. And I don't know if you know this, Peter, but I like a hoodie. I like to wear a hoodie in a video. I've heard.

Sue me. Right. I like an open studio hoodie. They're comfortable. Yeah. They represent open studio. They're free. They're free.

So I like to think that maybe he's seen me in a hoodie and he recognized, oh, here's the hoodie guy, going to give me a hoodie. And I was like, I'm happy to give you a hoodie. But he actually was really super warm and super into it. We gave him a backpack and a hoodie. And I was like with open studio swag. And he was incredibly gracious the whole session. And, you know, another funny story. One other lesson I learned from him.

And this has nothing to do with music, but it does have to do with being a professional and with, I think also. with like managing our energy with you know because he's uh he just celebrated his 85th birthday right and i'm 43 right so so i have a ways to go but i still run into things like managing time and managing energy of course we had three days schedule you're human we have three days scheduled for this shoot at the beginning of the second day the maestro ron carter says we're going to be done by today at three p.m we're scheduled to go to five p.m. that's day and then a whole other day. And we, the whole crew was like, what?

He's like, we're going to be done by 3 p.m. today. Let's get to work. Let's get to work. And you know what? He was, like, we were freaking out. He was absolutely right. He got everything he needed to get musically, all the promo stuff we needed to get. And he was in a cab going uptown at 3 p.m. on the dot.

And we were elated to get what we got. And to me, that was a real lesson of someone who's done it thousands of times. I was going to say a thousand times, but thousands of time, thousands of sessions, thousands of video shoots and commercials and films and TV. Right.

And he knew what he had in the tank. He knew what we had to go. Yeah. He managed himself and his time and his energy. Yep. Better than any human being I've ever seen. And I'm not kidding. Like that is,

that's mastery level there. We talk about bass mastery or whatever, but you don't get to be a master of an instrument or of music or your career without being able to do things like know how much time you have and how much time things will take and then how much energy you can put in and say something before there's diminishing returns. He was organized. He was thoughtful and he had a

great empathic feeling of the vibe of the session and his own vibe. And to me, that is like the gift of a lesson. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think it's it just speaks to his, you know, professionalism and experience. Because as many thousands of sessions as he's done, I don't think he's ever done anything, well, I know he's never done anything just like this. Yeah. You know what I mean? So it still was a new kind of a thing.

But I think that, you know, no matter how good you are at what you do, and all the things that go into getting to that point where you can play at that top level, where, you know, really, even if you go back in history, there's, you know, a single digit number of bass players that are in the discussion in all genres. Yeah.

And that he is there. And he's probably at the top of that list. But when you're talking about your one of the, you know, Hall of Fame, Hall of Fame level. I'm not even talking about top 50 in the NBA. No, he's fucking top 10. Yeah. And so like that's one thing to get to that, but to what you're talking about to the professionalism part as well and to still be able to do that to know how you can deliver at that top level. You know, because implicit with his, we're going to be done by 3 p.m. was like, I don't know if you guys are going to have your shit together, but I will have everything you need by then.

Yeah. Those cameras got to be working. Yeah, exactly. It puts some nice pressure on us. And it kind of elevated everybody. You know, and I think that it's very indicative of what he does on the bandstand and part of his philosophy. And like people don't always notice that because they're like, oh, yeah, of course he's

great. He sounds great. He's playing the Miles Davis quintet, but Herbie's great and Tony's great. And yeah, of course they're all great. But there's also like a supporting. There is somebody like, and when you go back and listen to those recordings, he was leading from behind in a lot of ways that you can really start to hear. and like so.

Well, but I've heard other stories of this. Like, Benny Green has been posting excerpts of a book he's, Benny write the book already. Come on, on, man.

You want to read the book. That's right. I don't want to be on there reading it, but I want to, I want to hold those stories in my hand. And let Open Studio do the book, the audio book version. That's right.

Come in and do a podcast. No, but Benny Green's been posting excerpts from a book he's writing on Facebook, and he posted a passage about Ron Carter, about him making a record. I think it was, I think it was a blue note record, but he was very young.

And he was a little bit, he wasn't taking the session seriously. It was a Christmas thing. He was doing J-Zu Joy of Band's Desiring with Ron Carter. Yeah. And he didn't really, Benny didn't prep. He was very, very young. It was like one of his first things.

He didn't prep the tune until he got to the studio thinking like, oh, man, I know this tune. Like, I know J-ZU, like, I'll just be able to wing it or whatever. And he got there and he got in the studio and he was really kind of, he describes, I'm not saying this is him saying that he was kind of flinging. Layling on, you know, the melody, the changes, what he wanted to do with it, the vibe of it. And Ron basically stopped him after a couple of takes and was like, we're going to end this session now. We're not going to continue because you don't know this.

And you don't have it together. That's right. And he said he wasn't mean about it. He was very warm about it. He's like, let's reschedule when you have time to prep this because I'm not doing this. And that's out of respect for the music. Out of respect for the music. It's not personal.

It's about the music. And it's one of the great lessons, you know, that you could ever learn. And I think like that's, that was huge for me. Absolutely. Yeah. Agree. Well, you know, I feel so fortunate to have experienced this and to, you know, producing it with you at him.

We had a blast. And so unleashing it on the world is, is even more exciting. Sharing it, you know, sharing with you guys. So check it out. It's blueprint for jazz bass. Blueprint for jazz bass. If you're an open studio, all access pass member or bass access pass member, you already have it on your dashboard.

That's right. Yeah. If it's not there, it will be there. You'll have early access, as we say. That's right. So, well, great stuff. Until next time, you'll hear it.