You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Solos, Being in the Moment, and Throwing in all of Your Chips

Episode Date: December 8, 2021

Peter and Adam respond to a listener's question about one of Peter's solos while playing at the Village Vanguard last week as part of Inside Straight with Christian McBride.Listen to the referenced tune "Gang Gang" hereHave a question for us? Leave us a SpeakPipeSupport the pod by spreading the word with the link youllhearit.com Learn more about Open Studio Pro: openstudiojazz.com/proInterested in more music advice? Go here to browse our catalog of jazz lessons and courses available for purchase. And be sure to check out our All Access Pass - every course from Open Studio on every instrument.Let us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel.Follow us on Twitter | Instagram

Hey, Peter. Hey, Adam. I'm looking for some kind of device that I could speak into and somehow like pipe a message to you so that you could know my question and maybe answer my question. Yes. Where would I? I know exactly what you're looking for. Let me stop you there. Pipe speak.

Pipe speak. You need a pipe speak. A pipe that you speak into. I'm Adam Anas. And I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to. the You'll Hear It Podcast. Music advice, inspiration, coming to you remotely once again. I know, man, we do these remote sessions occasionally because one or both of us are traveling.

And this time it's a pretty cool scenario because you've just finished up a week at the Village Vanguard, correct? Yes, we finished last night with Christian McBride. Inside Straight was our last night. Big shout out to all the folks in NYC. And from quite far, they came to the gigs and came and said hello. A lot of open studio members were in the house and Christian and the band. It was a wonderful, wonderful week. Big shout out to the Village Vanguard and the staff there and everything that they've done, kind of surviving, being shut down so long, but they're rolling again and super inspired to be there. Well, so this is going to bring us right into our first voice message.

So today is Speak Pipe Wednesday in case you didn't know everybody. Oh, so it's not Pipe Speak. Is that what you're saying? Nobody. Okay. No, you got it totally wrong. So close. So close.

Speak pipe. Wednesday. And this is where we take questions from our listeners. We have a service. If you go to service, like car service. If you go to. Dial 666, 666, 666. Tel Aviv Car Service.

It's 1985, New York City. Yeah. If you go to you'll hear it.com, you can leave us a voice message, also known as a speakpipe. And so coincidentally, we have a speak pipe today from Yoni, who is at one of your shows and has a question. about a particular solo that you played, and I think it's actually pretty good question. So let's listen to Yoni's question for Peter.

All right. From his show at the Village Vanguard. Hey, Peter and Adam. This is Yoni from New York. Peter, I saw you play at the Village Vanguard last night with Christian McBride's band. Fantastic show. But I was wondering if you could talk about one moment in particular.

There was a solo you had in the first set, a tune called Gang Gang, I think. And you just kind of seemed to hit another level. It was incredible. The audience was wowed. It kind of felt like even you and the band knew that there was something special happening. And, you know, if I'm not reading too much into it, I was hoping you could talk about

what that's like as a performer, you know, the difference between maybe just like a competent or even a very good solo and one where you reach something. a bit more special. And, you know, what that's like, how you reach for that, whether you know it in the moment, any thoughts on that experience from a performer at that level. Really appreciate the show. Thanks a lot, guys.

Keep up the great work. Ciao. Well, that's a great question, Yoni. And do you remember this particular solo that Yoni's talking about, Peter? Well, no, because I don't know when he left the speak pipe. But it's actually okay because I've been thinking about this. it is a great question. I've been kind of thinking about this issue anyway, and we played that. I'd have to even kind of reconstruct which nights. We played that tune a lot, maybe even every

night, but not always in the first set. But maybe it doesn't really matter because, you know, one thing about that general, you know, concept of like, how do you kind of go next level on something? How do you hit? I mean, we're always trying to put together a cohesive and interesting story in our solos. I think that's that remains the goal. It's not like, okay, we're just going to phone it in and every once in a while inspiration is going to hit us. I mean, no, we're always going for that. But I do think I understand what Yoni means in terms of that tune is very, it's kind of an epic tune that Warren Wolf wrote. It's a great composition, but it's a, it's a long form. It's got a lot of kind of built in drama with the harmonic movement of it. It's almost like this

big classical piece, but then it's got this great like 128 Afro-Cuban groove underneath it. So it's a big piece and it has, it's a big form and it's got a lot of opportunity and space to really do something with if you so desire. And in a way, it kind of, in a good way, it kind of forces you into doing something big. You know, it's like if you're in a big epic movie that spans 200 years or like Star Wars or something, you know, I guess you have to, I don't know, Adam, what's your acting career like. Have you done much acting? Could you speak on that?

I've done a little bit of amateur theater. Amateur theater, perhaps. In the Berkshires? I haven't. You know what? It's a fantasy mind someday to act, but I've never actually done it now. Okay. Well, yeah. So, I mean, you know, so good. We're both totally ignorant of this. But it's like I imagine if you're acting in an epic movie or something, you have to, you know, you have to move in a certain way and talk in a certain way and approach the role. And so I think that tune gang gang um and if you guys are interested in this we we actually have a version we'll

link to in the show notes for this episode um from live at the village vanguard from the new record it's not from a couple of nights ago of course but it's from a few years ago but it's uh actually i haven't heard it but i would imagine hopefully i hit something good on that one uh but the idea is like you have to the way i approach it is like you have to be open to being able to really be present and, you know, able to, in the moment, kind of rise to the occasion of these kind of bigger tunes. And that one all week when we were doing it was just two solos. Warren would solo first and then I would solo second. Steve Wilson, the great saxophoneist, is very rare that he doesn't solo on a tune.

And he doesn't on that one. I don't even remember why. So there's a little bit of pressure having to play after Warren because he kills it every time. It's his tune. It's like Taylor made for him. he's just like a maniac on the vibes and he builds it up and I mean the crowd is just so excited and just it's just like ecstasy at the end of his solo and Adam I don't know if you I'm sure you've been in this position before it's very exciting to like be accompanying somebody and the crowd goes wild

at the end of their soul but then it kind of dies down and then everyone's looking at you and it's like all right what you're going to do you know and it's like you're either going to go hide under a rock or you can't really you can't try to recreate what just happen because there's no way you're Oh, yeah, you're going to die. Yeah. You're going to die if you try to be like, okay, I'll just do what Warren did. Yeah, good luck. It's right.

Exactly. So, but I've done it enough where I'm kind of prepared for that. So it doesn't throw me off that he's going to play like a great solo. So that's the first thing. I really try to take inspiration from what he's doing. And I look at that. I kind of turn that all upside down. It's like whereas before and when I was younger, I would be like, oh, how do you learn

how to play after somebody that's so great that you don't even have the confidence that you can get to their level? So it's going to be a level. So it's going to be a letdown to the audience. So I try to turn that around and say, like, how can use the inspiration? Isn't it great that you have this fantastic solo? That's like giving me a head start, actually. Yeah. And I love that you mentioned presence and that it's a matter of presence

because I really think that that is the key to this Yoni is like, you know, obviously I'm not doing this on the same level that Peter can do this on, but I have this, we all, every musician who improvises and doesn't regularly goes through this same thing, of like, well, why are some solos feel like epic and effortless and others? It's like, yes, everything, at a certain level, everything is great, you know? It's all good. But, like, there are always some that are more special than the others. And then, you know, your question set up, like, the whole night was great, but this one solo really stood out.

Like, I think that's the presence of, of, of, realizing like you need to be with whatever is in the moment and sometimes it's not as epic the moment as it is at other times like sometimes you can't like force some kind of incredible transcendent experience on every single tune on every single solo because then none of them are transcendent or or epic it's all it just becomes this like everything has its place in a set and in an evening and on an album or even in a tune with the flow and so naturally I think in the set that, like you're going to be sort of keyed in on different things. The band is going to come together in, you know, in sync in different ways. And it can just naturally can't happen at every, like,

in the same way at every single moment. Like, and that is actually synchronicity. That is actually being present when you accept the fact that some things are just, they just have a slower tempo or a less intense vibe. And you just go with that because that's what's there in the moment. And you're, and you're playing with the band and that creates for great evenings. That creates for great solos that are honest and then that creates for like epic, like you know, really elevated solos

that can happen in the same space because there's space for them and because it's like you just haven't been trying to burn the house down all night and where you're just like taking huge haymaker swings at everything missing 90% and then the vibe gets all messed up from that. You know what I mean? So it's like if you can,

You know how I think of for this? Some of the greatest concerts I've ever seen, Wayne Shorter. And Wayne rarely is like just over the top everything out all the time, right? He's so, he could be, especially in his later age here, he's so understated and beautiful, but he just lets it unfold the way it's meant to unfold. And then you just never forget those moments. I have, there's so many countless unforgettable moments in the Wayne Shorter shows that I've seen because he just allows.

for whatever happened, whatever's going to happen in the night happen. And then when it does get elevated, right, when the energy lifts above our expectations and the pot boils over, it's so much more memorable than, you know, like a young cat who's just always pushing, I'm just like hanging on white knuckled or whatever, which is fun too, but it's not the same vibe. So I think, you know, what Yoni experienced there was, was Peter, you being in the moment, like playing everything that was coming at you. And when that finally apex of the evening was happening, you just got to grab it, you know.

Yeah. Yeah. I think to, you know, this idea of like, it's almost like, you know, you have a certain amount of chips at the beginning of the set. And you don't want to throw all your chips out there too early because it's not to say that you can't hit that ultimate apex on every tune. But you almost don't need to or want to because then it takes away from that big moment. But the biggest challenge with.

playing with this group is it's so loose and like Christian is making decisions on the fly about like what we're going to play next and like he's really good at feeling the room and like so we don't have set list you know the most we'll get is like right as we're walking up to the stage he'll be like let's start with this and sometimes we'll give us the first two tunes and so that helps a little bit but basically it's like you have to plan out the flow of the set as you go on like the micro level in terms of how you control the solo on each tune but also on the macro level within the solos and even more macro in terms of the whole set to give it a cohesive kind of feel. And so it's like if you hit that ultimate level on the tune before Gang Gang, and then you hit

it again, it almost takes away from it a little bit. So it's not necessarily a matter of like holding back or playing bad so that you sound better. I mean, you got to sound good all the time or try to hit that. But you do want to kind of control the energy level. I think that's what it is. And, you know, if you're, if you're present and you're listening to what's going on and you're feeling the vibe of the room, you don't really have to do much. If it happens, it happens. Right. And when it happens, it happens. And if it doesn't, then you just need to be in that energy level with what's there, you know, being present and in the moment and doing what, you know, what is required of that of that moment, you know, with the chemistry that's in the room. And that way, there's like a natural thing. You don't have to, you don't have to plan anything. It just kind of happens if you're present. Right. Yeah. No, totally, totally. And yeah, and that's why this kind of stuff, it's more of like a post-game, post-gig analysis in reality as opposed to thinking about these things. Because if at the beginning of that solo, as the wild applause for Warren is dying down and you're about to play the piano solo, if you're thinking about these issues at that point, that you're going to, that's going to be tough. We're talking about getting inside of your head.

You're all open there. But what I do try to listen to it actually on that tune because of how the chords are and the baseline and stuff, the beginning, there's like a lot of. space. The groove is going, but it's just sitting over D minor for quite some time. So what I do is like I take a big breath, a big deep breath as Warren's finished his solo and it's like the beginning. I don't jump right into something, partly because people are clapping so damn loud. They wouldn't hear it anyway, you know. But it's kind of just the natural flow of what that tune is. And so I take a breath. But then I'm very, I try to be very present and listen to some kind of good idea at the beginning. And that's, I can't tell you where that comes from. It just sort of happens and hopefully it

works. But I do feel the pressure of those kinds of tunes to start out with just something that works really well. It doesn't have to be. And in fact, it usually is not anything like super over the top because it's starting out. But it's something simple. It's definitely something like right within the groove. It's something like inviting to the listener and to me. I don't even know if I'm describing it great, but it's basically just it's important that first impression. So like I definitely take my time on it and it's and it's it really lends itself to that and so and I think it also gives me probably subconsciously the confidence if I start out right I'm like okay this is that now it's sort of like you're you come somewhere and you're like oh my god how am I going to clean up this

messy house and you're just looking at it you're looking at and then all of a sudden you make that first thing and everything starts to become a little bitty okay I made a choice my first choice to clean up this room was good and then things start to fall into place it's also you know you could equivate, let's go back to the theater analogy here, but you could, you could equivate it, equivocate it, equivocate. Excavate. We excavated the sub-theater

at a member, we brought up shovels, my dear, fine, sir. We're so undereducated, it's pathetic. Public school, hey, we're both the products of Missouri public school, so it's not our fault. I think you could liken it to like, you know, if you were to do theater in a, like,

in a public space, right? If you were to go into a park and you were to do Shakespeare in a park, right? Like you would want to incorporate things that are already there, things that are already hanging in the environment with you. Because you'd be silly not to. It's different than if it were in a black box and you just started from scratch or whatever. And it's kind of the same thing what you're talking about. Like you don't have to force an idea.

Use what's already hanging in the room. Right. Use the energy. Use the vibe that's already there. Yeah. Just like if you were to do, you know, Shakespeare in the park or whatever, and the park is part of the set. Like, the room is part of the set.

The music that's already being played or has been played is part of the vibe in the air. Use it. Absolutely. And I think that that goes along with, too, like, I'm in there in the vanguard and it's packed. And, like, you know, you can just feel that these are like, you know, really great music fans, but possibly harsh judging music fans because they are very knowledgeable. And it's like New York, everybody's an expert.

it like everybody's heard you know nobody's impressed by just you're showing up and playing a bunch of notes and so but i try to yeah i try to turn that upside down too and be like you know instead of like oh my god they're right up on top of me and they're gonna hear any mistakes i use it more as like oh they're they're right up on top of us but wow what what's so great to be able to get that energy from because you're not like the audience when it's a really good audience and they know how to respond it gives you more energy it's not like they're those kind of audiences where they're sitting on their hands and they don't know when to clap and they don't know how to, you know, a less experienced audience.

So I think that the advantage to having like a really hardcore, energetic audience that will give you energy is that you have it right there. So it's like take advantage of that. Absolutely. Thank you so much, Yoni. Great question. And glad you enjoyed those vanguard shows. Peter, we've gotten so much great feedback here.

A lot of open studio members came and checked you out. Absolutely. It was so fun meeting folks, some of which, you know, I knew, online only, so to be able to put a face with the name and the person was super exciting. Thanks, everybody. We'll be back on Friday for First Take Friday. We're going to be listening to some Gerald Clayton on Celia. Is that something that would interest me? Until then. Yes. I don't have the button, man. We're remote. We're remote. That's right. You'll hear it.