You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - "Still Crazy After All These Years" — Paul Simon

Episode Date: August 4, 2025

Broken Record's Justin Richmond joins us to talk Still Crazy After All These Years. Paul Simon's Grammy-winning album was born out of divorce, and produced some of his greatest songs of all time, like 50 Ways To Leave Your Lover, My Little Town and I Do It For Your Love.We dive into the story behind this remarkable album, including Steve Gadd's famous drum beat and how Stevie Wonder's Innervisions may have been the catalyst for Paul Simon's divorce?! Plus - Adam shares why this has been such a transformative album for him, and how it influenced his playing. And, we ask: Is this the ultimate sad boy album? Is this the apex moment of boomerism? We kick off our new season with these questions and so much more!🟠 Get the YHI newsletter for bonus stories that didn't make the pod.🔵 Start your free Open Studio trial for ALLLLL your jazz lesson needs.

Hey, Bob, do you like podcasts? Well, you know, with everything terrible in the world, no... Actually, you don't have a mic, so Adam, do you like podcasts? Oh, man, I love podcasts. In fact, I'm on a podcast right now. Yes, I'm aware. Do you ever listen to the Broken Record podcast? Yeah, that's one of my favorites with Justin Richmond.

Yeah, so I asked him if you could join us on the show today. Oh, that's very excited. And he's going to be here in just a minute. Very thrilling. And speaking of Broken Records, I think you broke a few on this arrangement. Oh, yeah. Yeah, most number of Moor-Core. ever.

Yeah, that sounds like something I do. Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear a podcast. Music, Explore. Explored, brought to today by Open Studio. Go to Open StudioJadioJazz.com for, you're jazz lesson needs. Peter, we are not alone today.

We are not alone. Yeah, we have an in-person guest with us. The great Justin Richmond from the Broken Record podcast, Justin. Man, thank you for having me. Man, thank you for coming to St. Louis. So pleased to be here. Thank you for talking music with us. We've already had a great time.

You've been here for a while. Yeah. I feel like we've done the podcast I know. We've already talked for several hours about music. I wish we'd had the microphones on. Yeah, it's so great to have you here, right? Surreal.

I'm a podcast royalty. Big watcher of your guys' stuff. Crazy. That's crazy. Likewise. And subscribe. I'm a subscriber. Oh, you subbed me?

Oh, you're an Opysudia member? Yes. You went to Open StudioJet.com for all your channel. It was too easy. I just put them on PayPal, pay lay. I don't know. It's great. We get you.

Yeah. Well, man, we are. talking about one of my all-time favorite albums today. Paul Simon's still crazy after all these years, 1975. And Justin, this was on a list that you gave us of like things you might want to discuss. And before we get into it, and we were nervous when Justin Richmond gave us a list of albums that he wanted to discuss. We didn't like start shaking as we look through the list. Believe me. No, not at all. But I'm just curious, why was this on your list? Man, well, okay, this has a bit to do with my neuroses.

I just didn't. I was scared. So I was scared. So I kind of wanted to nerd out. I really wanted to get deep into jazz with you guys. I was kind of wanted. But then I got, so I feel like my first list aired towards Zach

because I was like, I want to go, I want to talk like Mingasong. Like, you know, a classic jazz, you know, record. But then I got, I was like, you know what, man, like, it's not my lane. Let me get out. You get back to what I, you know. It's Peter's face, isn't it?

It's just super intimidating. Yeah. I'm gonna get chewed up. So hold on. Let me just recommend something that I feel like is, that's very much a classic album. And incorporates jazz

and is in the, you know, takes from the milieu, but is firmly in the pop arena. Yeah. And this was definitely, you know, like I think I sent some earthwind and fire

suggestions, that was something, but this seemed to be like the most, I don't know, compelling in a way. Yeah. And a little bit strategic. It sounds like.

A little strategic. Yeah. Now, that's great, because we want to talk to, to you about something that you could really sink your teeth into and that I think we could. And you're right. This album is filled with jazz musicians.

And we'll talk about that more when we get to it. And we've been using the term jazz adjacent. You know, I like the, you know, jazz influence and stuff. And it's going to be really interesting to get your guys take on how much of that. Obviously, jazz musicians on there. There's always the idea of, like, jazz musicians on a pop record playing pop. Or like, how much are they invited in to bring jazz, to bring group? like is it a harmonic kind of thing?

Is it a sensibility? Is it improvisation? Which this record has some, but not really a lot. Not a lot. It's very truncated, you know. Yeah. But it's super interesting to me to hear how people, like whether or not it gets to the point where it's, well, there's one point. That's going to come up later where it definitely gets very jazzy.

It's like falls off the rails jazzy. All of a sudden, too. Yeah. Which I think is great. But other than that, you know, I'm not sure. Well, let's get a little backstory here on what was going on before this album was made in 1975. So Paul Simon grew up in a musical home in Queens, New York. His dad Lou played bass professionally for radio stations,

and he encouraged his son to appreciate music and study piano. But Paul didn't really take to it. That is until he heard doo-wop and rhythm and blues on the radio. He was just a kid, maybe nine or ten, and he was completely changed by what he heard. He would obsessively listen to the radio after school, listening to songs like Hearts of Stone by the Jewels. For Shaboon,

For Shaboon by the crew cuts. I love that sound. Or Goodnight Sweetheart by the Spaniels. Good night, sweetheart, where it's time to go. He met Art Garfunkel in school and the two started singing together, recording their voices on a wire recorder and playing it back to hear how their voices intersected. Did you say a wire recorder? We got to talk.

I'm not to have to Google that. Then they started singing together at school, talent shows, and even writing songs together. They both fell in love with the Everly brothers with songs like Bye Bye Love. And then one day after school, they walked into a recording studio in Manhattan and paid $10 to record this song. Of course, that's Paul Simon. Everybody knows that. Simon and Garfogle. So this was recorded under the name Tom and Jerry,

not Simon and Garfunkel, which is a very funny name. It just so happened that Sid Prozen, who owned a small record label, was in the room. He heard them sing and offered them a contract to release Hay School Girl on his label. Did you say Sid Prozen, who owned his... You didn't have to say Sid Prozen owned a small record label. That was implicit in the name. They quickly found their sound, became famous, and eventually broke up.

Oh. But... Well, foreshadowing. It was another breakup that we created. the conditions for one of his best albums. Still crazy after all these years. So, thank you very much. We don't often think about Simon and Garfunkel as like a doo-op group,

but that is certainly their origins. And you can hear that in The Hay School Girl. But really interesting origin story from Paul. I knew his dad was a musician, but I'm curious, Peter, like your father, also a professional musician. Not in the same context that you are. But I think that musical,

there's so many, astounding musicians you yourself included who come from like a dad who's like a work a day musician. Right, right. Yeah, and I wonder I'd love I think that's an interesting part but I think a music lover

parent, you know, like that's the trend I hear with a lot. I don't know for you I know for you Adam, your parents, your dad had great taste in music and we'll play stuff and I'd be interesting you, Justin, just like I think having parents, because both my parents are actually musicians is an interesting angle, but it's almost more like, is music in the home? Like, how is it present? Like, not that you're at the altar of it, but like culturally, is it a big part of, you know,

your upbringing. Yeah. I mean, for me, neither of my, you know, both of my parents sometimes have asked me like, how did you come? But for me, it was my, I think my mom's mom's mom, my grandma, who was really, she's from Detroit and for whatever reason, just loved, she would always just tell me, like, you know, the stories of some celebrities you heard. Like, I always knew not to do, I learned not to take drugs because Judy Garland. I was watching Wizard of Oz and my grandpa told me Judy Garland died in sleeping pills. You know, I'm like, don't take pills. Okay.

But then she would tell me things like, don't sign with MGM. Yeah, exactly, you know. Don't, you know, she would tell me about how Nat King Cole used to like to smoke because it would keep his voice. Like, you know, he liked the way he made his voice sound. Right. But that would push you with the lung cancer. You know, so then that was the flip. So, okay, so don't smoke.

Or, you know, she made me do, she made me join the swim team because Frank Sinatra, swam for like greater like lung. So my grandma just liked singers and would always like make me listen to things and she'd tell me singers were trash. Yeah, you can learn everything about life in terms of like, you know, don't overeat. You're like, Pavarotti. It's a lot of that stuff. Yeah, yeah.

So I think it was my grandma. Yeah. And I hated vocalists growing up. But I've come back around to it now it's all, I love it. I love a good, love a good singer. Yeah, yeah. Well, I think too, like you hear the music that do, I mean, obviously none of us, even me, being the elder statesman here, came up listening to that

duop style. But like, I remember my aunt and my uncle. And my parents, too, like, they're more like classical musicians, a little snobby. But, you know, I think it's hard for us probably to understand the impact of that sound. I remember my aunt, Carol, talking about Fats Domino, you know, and like one of his hits would come on the radio. And like, she was like, that's when I fell in love with your uncle. And like, just like that sound.

And so, you know, hearing, I never realized that Paul Simon. Simon and Gar, but it totally makes sense. Came out of that, but it's got to inform everything that they did. You can hear that. No. Like the constant harmonies in everything that they're doing is Simon and Garfunkel. A long way away from Tom and Jerry Hayes Skips. A little elevated.

Yeah. So after Simon and Garfunkel are defunct, Paul makes his first studio album, self-titled Paul Simon album, with some good success. I love this album. Incredible album. So good. This is the one the cover with... He's got hood up for a hood. This is a 10 out of 10 album cover.

Yeah. That's me and Julio down by... That's a 10 out of 10, right? In 1973, Paul releases... There Goes Riemann Simon. Also a good album. Not as good as the self-title or as still crazy, in my opinion. But some good stuff, including this track, Coda Crown.

That mix. Such a good song. But as we're already hearing here and still rhyming, the sound quality for 1973, that's some high level. Yeah. Is this same producer? Is this Phil Ramon?

Yeah, I was just wondering if it sounds like his kind of... But I mean, Simon apparently was very... I think anytime, like you talk about the engineers and the production, and of course still crazy, I think it was Phil Ramon and Paul Simon produced it together. But I think, like, you explore with Michael Jackson, him, Marvin Gay, Stevie. Like, they, when you get that pristine sound, whatever the direction is, like, the artist

almost always, I mean, occasionally you'll hear about with artists like, I do whatever. Yeah. And then they create this magic, but they are usually very meticulous with how they want, not only their voice, but the whole, you know, the whole thing. Yeah. After there goes Riemann Simon by 1974, Paul and his wife Peggy had a son together, Harper, who Paul adored. His musical career had been a success so far.

but he was still so sad and didn't know why. He was isolating himself from his family, spending most nights away from the house. One night he came home and hopped in the shower to wash off the sadness. He burst into tears, and this phrase came to mind. Still crazy after all these years.

Soon after... That was a productive shower right there. I gotta say, I wish... There's a dark moments I'm never going to hit out of it. That's Paul Simon for you. Soon after that, his solo album, There Goes Rhyman. Simon was nominated for a Grammy

for album of the year. He was up against Stevie Wonder's InnerVisions. Ever heard of it? InnerVisions won the Grammy that year. This is Golden Lady from Intervisions. Imagine hearing this. It being a working artist. We talked about this but talking about.

I'd go out at the shower and come up with nothing, man. If you're listening to Stevie here in this 70s run that he's on, you've got to be like, well, I guess it's done. I guess music is over. Hanging it up. Yeah, we should all pack it in. And that's kind of what Paul did. One day he was pouring over Intervitions

when his wife reminded him it was time to leave. Paul didn't move. He kept listening. She reminded him again. Now he was feeling angry. She reminded him a third time. This is like my household, by the way. This happens at my home weekly.

I'm amazed that I'm still married. He walked out the door and went to a hotel. That was the end of his marriage from Intervitions. Steve one or broke up. I didn't get some executive decision making like, oh, man. Well, think about it. Like, everyone's like, Stevie Wonder, he played pretty much every instrument. Well, you know, he did everything on the record on Intervision's and Talking Book.

Yeah. Except, like, background book. Well, he even did that. But come, he wrote everything, played everything, killed it. And it was also like breaking up marriages at the same time. So Paul wrote the album, Still Crazy After All These Years, from that same hotel as he was divorcing his first wife. And he ended up. I feel like it was a lot of him.

I feel like it probably was. Yeah. He ended up writing this. Time Square. One of the crazy. He's so glad to see me. He really sounds great on this track. He really sounds great.

That's Barry Beckett on the Fender Roads. Yeah, the muscle, shoulders rhythm section. Yeah. Still crazy. After all these years. Great kick drum sounds of all time. The phrasing between everyone is... Yeah.

And there's these little details in the songwriting, going to that... I'm not the kind of on the four chord, just that one time... Yeah, one little change. And I think that, like, to start out the record, like, a lot of Simon's stuff, and it's definitely Simon and Garfunkel before this, it's like so guitar-driven. Like, to start out with the roads on this, with... I don't think there's any guitar, and then it has, like, the strings. It really places his voice, and, like, you said, the phrasing in a different place.

One of the greatest bridges ever. One of the weirdest bridges ever too. String arranged by Bob, by Bob James. Bob James. Shout out Bob James. Still doing it. Jazzy flute. What stuff is weird here. Because it almost gets a little dark foreshadow and dark a little bit.

This would get you kicked off Spotify. And then into this, Michael Brecker. Learned the solo. Yeah. Also very kind of unbreckerish solo. Very unbreak-known for these huge waves of sound. Yeah. Like the least amount of notes he's.

I mean, it's a short solo, but normally Brecker would be trying to get in more notes per beat, if anything. Killing key change. In the middle of the verse, the character. What do we think, fellas? I mean, it's impeccable. I mean, it's like pristine and like there's the church stuff. That 4-1 movement that starts there, ends there, book ends in, and there's a lot of that in between kind of. You know, we mentioned Barry Beckett.

So the muscle, this is all with the Muscle Shoals rhythm section. Which, yeah, exactly. We'll talk more about them. They're on these first two tracks. This was not recorded at Muscle Shoals, though. They play different, though. It doesn't sound like necessarily the Muscle Shoals rhythm section, you know? Which is cool in a way.

I don't know. Yeah. Everybody's playing different. That's the theme of this album, I think. It's like all the jazz musicians are playing a little differently. Oh, not Phil. Well, we'll get to that. Not for eight seconds.

I love this Rhodes Park. It's just a beautiful example of the very simple church chords. It's just played flawlessly. The voice leading is unbelievable. Obviously, the sound of a Rhodes in 1975. But normally, they'd be a little bit more like a little bit of bluesy. Like, I feel like they were, I think Simon told them or somebody, I don't know if that was Phil Ramon was involved.

Like, oh, no, you know, which is, I mean, that's probably. appropriate for what it is, but for me, I kind of want to hear a little bit, just a little bit of grit or something. So you think a little more grit would, it's a 9.5, a little more grit, make that a 10 out of 10. Yeah. Like, what if Donnie Hathaway was playing that road? Oh, my, yeah. Yeah. Well, 11. Right. But I kind of agree with you. It feels like, I mean, for Barry Beckett, it's pulled back a little bit. But do you think... For Michael Brecker, it's pulled back. Right. Do you think, Justin, like, what you were talking about, like, the phrasing that Paul Simon is singing with...

that that would have, more grit, would it take it away from that? I don't know if, yes, I think in terms of way Paul approaches songs and sings, I think that sort of more pulled back, restrained playing is probably more. Like, if Donnie's singing and playing, you know, yeah, it's going to go there. Not that Paul's not a great vocalist, but it's just, you know, yeah. It's not what he does, though. It's not what he does. It would be weird.

If Paul was, like, sang in. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It would feel a little weird. That sort of understated putting, putting, real focus on the lyrics and the turn of the phrase in a very gentle way. That's the Paul Simon I think about my head when I think about his talent as a vocalist.

We can hear that here without any backing. She seems so glad to see me. I just smile. And we talked about some old times and we drank ourselves some beers and we drank ourselves some beers still crazy after all these years oh still crazy after all these years. It's like you're walking with a friend in the Upper West Side. Yeah.

Right. He's like telling you his story about running into his ex. It's so conversational for sure. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. You know. And his voice really lends like the authenticity of it because his like I think the little bit of stank or grit that he does bring is that, you know, the pitch is, he has really good

intonation, but he does play around just a little bit with the pitch. Like, he's, he's not afraid to have it to be a little, like, stylized. Yeah. Especially when you hear it isolated, because it can seem so like, I mean, thank God he's not doing this in the pitch correction, you know, I mean, if they had, because it doesn't need, I mean, it's like, it's so subtle that you need to kind of kind of hear those, like, that's part of his style, you know, because the words, it's like, I mean, we did DeAngelo a couple. This is like the opposite words like, wait,

what was the lyrics that he sang for the last five minutes? That was really dirty. I don't kill it, but what was he talking about? No idea. Was that in England? But like,

this is just like very, you know, still crazy. I mean, like, it's right down the middle. And, I mean, it's, it's impressive.

And I think, too, that this track is such a, it's almost like theatrical. You know, it's like, it's telling the story, but it's like, you're going on this journey

and it builds up. And like, obviously James, Bob James like totally understood that and crafted that with the arrangement because that gave it a little bit of epic feel for just a little bit at the right time. It'd be like a studio film.

Like you know, that'd be like the scoring for like a studio film from that era of like thing. Yeah. I 100% agree. That mix of conversationalists with that drama or that theatricalness is I don't know, that's top tier for me. Yeah, yeah.

I agree. Back to the Woodward arrangements and the string arrangements from Bob James, you can hear that. this was obviously put on, I think, after the rhythm section and maybe even after the vocals, because Bob James will do some things with Barry Beckett that you wouldn't put on a chart. He follows his voicing, much like the Shirley Horn, Here's the Life arranging. It's a great example of how that can work really, really well.

And obviously Paul Simon just told him on the bridge like, hey, Bob, that's your part. Go nuts. Yeah, do some weird stuff with the obos. Second. Radio's not going to lose this. This is 975. We're all good. Again, the rhythm section is the muscle shoulders rhythm section at the time.

Barry Beckett, David Hood, and Roger Hawkins, you might have heard them on stuff like this. And that already has more crib. You put your light up. My favorite bass line all the time, man. Should we just listen to this for the rest? No, no. I mean, that's how versatile they were, though. Ram shot is so.

Oh, man. Staples singers. I'll take it there, obviously. It's that, it's definitely the gospel influence, but it's like that southern kind of folky, but it's got a little bit of that new one. You know, it's just, you know, it's just, yeah, those guys knew how to do it.

So this album would be Simon's first solo album on the Billboard album charts. Still Crazy After All These Years, won a Grammy for Album of the Year in 1976, which is incredible. In his acceptance speech, he thanked Stevie Wonder, who didn't make an album this year. Right.

That's great. He slipped in. And then that's just track one. Track two is we get a Simon and Garfunkel reunion with My Little Town. Again, this is,

this was recorded at the Muscle's Shoals studios in Mississippi with the same. Alabama. Sorry, in Alabama. No one's going to get upset about that.

No one's going to get upset about that. This is, again, with Barry Beckett on acoustic piano, David Hood on bass guitar, Roger Hawkins on drums. car on the electric guitar. David Matthews with the horn arrangements, Ralph McDonald's with the percussion. Shout out Ralph McDonald's killing it on this record on a bunch of...

100%. His own little kuchermonts, they really do some cool stuff. This is My Little Town. That's Alabama. Now the New Yorkers have arrived. But it works. Consumant New Yorkers too. They would direct from Montauk to muscle shills. Peter, and the mix to lean upon me as I pledged allegiance to call Peter, what's the form of the

dirty breeze after it rained that the colors weren't there it's just imagine things are same Peter what's the form of this verse? Well, you know what?

You know what I think is great. I'm realizing, like, part of the genius of Paul signed with his songwriting and then how it's, like, actualized in the song and the arrangement is that pacing, that breath. Like, that's worked in. They're these odd, like, little two-beat things and stuff, but that works for when the lyric comes back in, the pacing of. When you look at the chart, and I'm thinking about the meter, it's like, why, that's weird. Why did they put that three, four in, or whatever? But it works for the storytelling. Yeah. And, like, highlights the lyric and the melody and the pacing. Such good storytelling. It's a through composed verse, but it pays off with this like just repetitive hook. Yeah. Somewhere else now. Yeah. It's a different part of time. Saving my money.

Dream it'll go from those fries and major songs. Weird, like minor second harmony in the background vocals. And those horn like, Those horn lines, like, a lot of this stuff shouldn't work as well as it does. 100%. Like, to wait that long to bring in the horns and have them kind of like, you know. The entire song shouldn't work. Yeah.

And Ralph McDonald in there, like, it's like, like, you know, like, pusher man or something. They're like, what in the world? I don't know. Curtis Mayfield record. Like, phenomenal. Yeah, yeah. And then the muscle shills guys, the rhythm section is like, that was a lot of, like, either reading or, like, figure it out, you know, all those little,

because they're kind of groove and then they got to weigh some extra beats and then come come in and stuff. Yeah. Cool stuff. Love the sound of the piano. What do you think about that piano sound at the beginning? At the beginning, that's one of the most, so that unison, can you just play the very first note that you get to nerd out?

It's not exactly in tune. It's like, I was trying to see like the unisons are almost, they're like on the edge of, oh, and then that delay from when the guitar. But so just to nerd out real quick, but it's sort of of interest. Like a piano and down in that range would be two notes. Two notes. There's actually two strings. and the hammer's hitting it.

And so, like, if one of the strings is a little bit out of the tune, you get this kind of weird, you know, it sounds out of tune on its own. If it gets really out of tune, it sounds like a honky tongue piano. Yeah, it's like a saloon piano. But this one is like just on,

I don't think it's actually out because you don't hear the waves going, but it's like very close. So it gives, and I mean, his touch is, it's such a simple thing and you see it on these people, like, greatest piano intros of all time. It's like, it's an easy one to learn,

but maybe not to play it like that, you know? Yeah, it's a beautiful record. Yeah, it's a beautiful record. and the horn, I don't know, man. Like, I don't, they must have really hated each other too because to make that record, can you imagine? To be like, okay, we're going to make a record together. You make that record.

Say, screw it now. I can't stand you still. How do you make that and decide and you mix it? You, the whole thing, nowhere in the process, you think, let's put it aside. Can you imagine ever in your life making bridge over troubled water and be like, I never want to see this person ever again? It's amazing. And wasn't this like the third time they were coming back together?

They've done it several times. Yeah, like, always try. But they sound so good on that. And wasn't this released also on Art Garfunkel's album? Art solo record. Yeah. Yeah. And I think the same position too, like track two.

Like I just went like. So they obviously both approved of the recording. It's insanely good. Yeah. Yeah. Classic case of two people whose personalities can't handle each other. Yeah. And they end up making some of the greatest art.

maybe because of, even, not even despite of, but... Reminds me a couple guys, I know. We don't speak outside of the podcast. These cameras are, oh boy, it's icy and you guys have been dealing with some shit this whole time. Oh, that was cool. And I think, too, like, one thing that's always interesting to me

is, like, how, you know, when I was coming up learning music, it's like, oh, you're going to get into this, and they do some, like, weird diminish chords on, I'm like, that's where the thing is. But the reality is, like, how do these tunes start? And like the ending is different because there's so many fadeouts on. And this was the age of like the beginning of the fadeouts, you know, which is my own little quibble bit. But like how these first two tracks start with like that road sound at the beginning.

So from the backup. Backup. You have a cool bit with fadeouts? Yeah. I'm like, end the thing. End it. Yeah. That's your. Yeah.

It's like for radio, it's great. But it's also like when we were here. I mean, this was a little before my time when I was hearing on the radio. But it's like the DJ's had so much control over when the thing was. was gonna, like, that's when I came up in the era of, like, you didn't know what it was gonna. It was definitely before, like, I remember that, um, what is it, uh, do I do? Stevie Wonder where Dizzy Glassby plays that. So, like, that never, my sister had the LP. And so I remember she played it that. I was like, wait, what is that? Because it never, it never occurred on the rate,

like, it was always faded out before you got to that. They're like, we're gonna play the jazz on the, on the, top station. I was like to the imagination that some, some of the fade outs are like a cop out, but then sometimes, like, like, you know, the end of like, uh, like, uh, like, I want you back. You're like, Michael's cooking. You're like, what it? I know. What happened? I think that to me, that's the genius of a fade out is you're hearing all the good stuff. And you're like, where is it going?

But it gives you this mystery to what's that song could still be going on. We don't know. Yeah, is it still going today? They never stop. Yeah. And then it's also like, well, like when we can talk about it as we go too, like this is I think when we are just reminiscing about this or prepping for this,

somebody mentioned or we all commiserated about this is a great you know, put the vinyl on. We did put berets on and went, got a little pour over coffee before we said that. It was espresso, I believe. Yeah, but I mean, that's another thing is like, how do you get from, like, if you are listening to this as an album and you're not getting screwed up by Spotify, doing some weird, like, what does it feel like to transition from each track, you know?

It feels great. Yeah. That's true. Unbelievable. Yeah. Well, speaking of feeling good, I think this track three for me is, well, we'll talk about it later. It might be the apex.

This is, I do it for your love. And for some reason, this is a favorite of jazz musicians, well, not for some reason. But it is a favorite of jazz musicians, as we'll talk about in a minute. Might have been a favorite of Steely Dance, too. We've got a brand new rhythm section on this one. We got Kenneth Asher on the Fender Roads, Jerry Friedman on electric guitar, Joe Beck on electric guitar. The great Tony Levin on bass and the immortal Steve Gag on the drums here. Force.

And again, Ralph McDonald. percussion. Yeah, it really is. You know what the instrument that is? That's vocals, right? It's accordion and vocals from an artist name, Civuka. This is why jazz musicians like it. It's a long-ass solo in the middle of the track.

So an incredible song. Man, I was just thinking, like, I would have been scared. I mean, like, this is a really fun way to play on a studio record like this, and I can relate and think about things. But I would, like, the details, I mean, obviously with Paul's vocals and the backgrounds and the way he's, I mean, it's like everything is perfect. I don't think it's antiseptic, but it's like very much like,

I feel like if I played one little, oh, I think I'm going to do this. Like, you fuck the whole thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You got to fall in line on this one. You got to fall on line. And I think maybe now I'm feeling like the muscle shows rhythm section moving to this one because there's a certain stylized way that the album is produced, that it kind of works.

Because normally you start shifting rhythm sections, you know, on, track three, that can, their cohesion can, but it's totally cohesive, blowing into it. Yeah. The most Paul Simon lyric that I think has ever been written, besides maybe like Mississippi Delta shining like a national guitar, is the rooms were musty and the pipes were old, all that winter we shared a cold, drank all the orange juice that we could hold, I do it for your love, just that little glimpse of a daily life that is unbelievably beautiful song. Yeah, yeah, just the mundane, whatever, just, you know, and it's like, but when Paul sings it, too, it's like, oh, super difficult to land that and not be super corny.

And he does it, he pulls it off. Is this a good time to bring up? I have a question for you guys. Is this the ultimate sad boy album? I mean, he was going through a pretty hairy divorce. Yeah, I think so. It is. It is.

But this is the best, this is also like the platonic form of that. It sounds like if you're going to do a sad boy album, do it tasteful. Right, right, right. Yeah. Like, you know. Put a bunch of Fender Rose on tape. Yeah. And don't overcall her out by name.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. And then throw an accordion's vocal solo. You're right, right, right. Also, I think Bob James, I was listening some of that harmony. I think he might have had a little something to do with some of the, the composite. Yeah. At least some of the, I mean, I guess that's technically not the songwriting.

That's like the harmonic arrangement. but I'm hearing some stuff in there. Which would make sense. I mean, he's in there. If you don't know Bob James, might know him from this. I mean, who doesn't know Bob James? Great jazz pianists as well.

Incredible jazz pianists. Bob James, incredible pianist composer. This is the Angela, the theme from Taxi, TV show Taxi. And super sweet, nice guy. I met him when I was in high school. I think I've ripped that off in so many songs over the years. Don't worry, you're not low. No, I met Bob James.

Shout out, Bob James when I was in high school. And I was at this, like, band thing in Texas. Same day I met We're a hard girl. Wow. But Bob James was just like, I would assume he came over to me

after he heard our high school band playing. He was like, yeah, you sound good. He's like, I'm Bob James. I was like, yeah, but it's just one of those guys that you know, it's like, you know. He could have been like, yeah, you sounded like shit. I'm Bob Jay. I would have given up music.

I would have been like, you're great. I guess I'm in the wrong field, you know. Did you know is Bob James before he said he was Bob James? No, because he was so self-assassist, you know, I mean, just so like, just like, hey, you know, I'm like, why would he be here? So I Do It for Your Love was covered by Herbie Hancock on his 2005 album possibilities.

With Paul Simon. With Paul Simon. It sounds way different. Yeah. Actually, did it. Paul asked him to do it in a minor key. Yeah. And to do it on just one chord.

And Herbie's like, I don't think we can do that, Paul. Yeah, Herbie's like, I can play one note here. I'm going to put a bunch of Herbie shit on top, which is exactly what happened. That's exactly what he did. So it's just piano percussion in Paul. It's like Ravel, Herbie, Pauls-on, like that stuff. Yeah. The sky was yellow and the grass was gray.

We signed the papers and we drove away. I haven't heard this in a while. This is cool. Yeah, I heard. Yeah. Man. All that winter we shared a cold. There's good footage of them recording this too.

I mean. Yeah. I mean, another feather in the cap of maybe a case for Herbie just being the goat. I mean, truly, what other jazz pianist of the big three or four that we can think of could step in and do this in this way? I mean, I don't think any of them would want to even or even want to do it. Or be curious enough or open enough for have the personality that is so attractive that Herbie seems to have. You've noticed how much he attracts other artists. He's just a magnet for people.

Yeah. Paul's, you know what? I listen to that too. I'm like, we've had some conversations about Paul parachuting into things. But I think Paul might have the right idea, man. Paul does. I mean, if I was like the idea of someone of Paul Simon's caliber and stature and culture, being like, let's rework this, you know, album cut from one of my big albums.

Not even a hit. Not even a hit. Yeah. And just, you know, it's like, you know, I don't know. I don't want to, you know, most people aren't going to do that. That's what's cool about him. And that's how I would use my powers too. Yeah, yeah.

I'm like, let me just get with Herbie in the studio real quick. And, you know, like, man. Like, yeah. And I was just thinking a similar thing in terms of like shout out to Paul Simon for going in. Because I know that he's so detailed oriented and would understand and know that when you get in there with the studio. Like Herbie's the sweetest and nice cat, but he's also going to be like, like, it's not going to be easy. Yeah. It's going to be wonderful.

and if you're willing to come in and kind of let your guard down a little bit, like there's a chance for you to kind of, like, he will elevate your stuff. But I've heard from other vocalists that play with him, they're just like, it's hard, like, if you're not totally open to it and to just being yourself, and you can hear that, like, Paul's just singing the thing, and Herbie's kind of doing different things. And Paul is allowing that to kind of envelop his composition. I mean, he's totally reworking the thing.

Yeah, it's not the same. And I know Herb, like, however many he takes they did, everyone was different. I guarantee you that. That was not like Herbie's. like, oh, okay, we're going to go to F minor, Paul. Is that cool? Awesome. So, I mean, I think that it is one of those things where it could be

like this beautiful, wonderful thing. But if you're kind of, because that whole record, that's a killing, this is on possibilities, right? Yeah, yeah. There's a bunch of people, and there's some, I mean, all of them, I love that record. A lot of, like, Harbourie people are like, that's his worst. Herbie's a good. Herbie doesn't make a bad album, man. He really doesn't. But for jazz folks, a lot of them overlook

that record because it's like, I think there's, um, I'm forgetting. There's a bunch of kind of weird combinations. I think great stuff. Angeli Kijot is on there, I think, has a really cool thing that she does. This is after like the new standard era. Yeah, Raul Me Dunn.

He does a cool thing with Herbie. But it's all people that are like, yeah, I'm willing to come in and, you know. I mean, Paul was probably the big. Actually, I think Sting might be on that too. You know, Sting's another one that can kind of, is he parachuting or is he, is he walking in the front door? Is he private jetting it? Yeah, Sting is it? That's a good question.

That's a good question. Yeah. Hard to know with it. What are we going to do our police episode, man? Come on. It's a comment, man. Let's check out the next track was a hit. Well, we do the jazz police everywhere.

We do the jazz police every week. We're ready for that. The next track was a hit, and it's 50 ways to leave your lover. Let's check it out. Problem is all inside your head, she said to me. The answer is easy if you take it logically. I'd like to help you in your struggle to be free. Something missing here?

That was the coffee house version Without gas No, this song Notorious It sounded just as compelling I don't know about just as But it sounded very compelling Did we just start the Paul Simon remix project

That really shocked me actually Well that's This song there's not much to it There's not much going on if you take the drums out You just slip out the back jack We got to talk about the course. I know.

One of the weirdest transitions ever, man. It's like two different, too. It's like, uh, you know, a lot of, like, you know, a lot of people hate, like, or, or talk about, um, uh, Ozzie's, uh, what is that, uh, crazy train. Crazy train, you know, like the transition from the intro riff to like the verse. Yeah. That's one of those, man. Yeah, for sure.

It's very, very jarring. So the chorus came out of a fun rhyming game that Paul was playing with Harper, with his son. And this was he talking bad about his mama? It's like, listen, son, let me tell you about divorce. Sometimes you just got to slip out the backjack. That's exactly like, what? No, this was happening during the divorce. Paul was playing with Harper in his hotel,

showing him simple rhyming games. The rhymes they made up made it into the song. You slip out the backjack, make a new plan stand. Was the game he's playing with his sons. Right. Is that? Dad, why are you leaving mom? I got to make a new plan stand.

Come on, Mick. You got to make a sabore out and like daddy. Dad, can you not turn this into your album right now? I'm actually kind of broken inside. It's not about you, dad. Do you think he had the verse or the course? I mean, he's doing the ryming,

or did he have the verse and then didn't have a course and he was doing the rhyming game? It's a great question. I would think if he had the rhyming, that would have been a chorus kind of... I mean, how do you... I've heard lore... I've heard lore that he...

You know, because so Steve Gad is a young jazz musician at this point, he's coming out of the military and where he's, you know, in the field band of the military playing snare drum. And so that's the gad stuff. Like, when he's playing his gad shit is when he brings out that sort of, you can hear him, there's some great videos of a drum battle with him,

and Vinnie Caly Uda and Dave Wechel. And Vinny Calyute and Dave Wechle are doing some just like incredible technical fireworks. Yeah, yeah. But then Steve Gad comes in with his like, and the place just lights up because it feels like this. So I've heard, and I don't know if this is verified, but I've heard stories that Steve is like playing his military stuff and Paul walks in and says that's what I want

for that verse and wrote the verse around the drum part. Just what I've heard. I would love to see Paul's face when he heard. I know. He was like, he's like, oh, let me grab some of that and then I'm going to give, I mean, that's great arranging. When I hear this drumbeat though, I don't think like slip out the back jack.

No, right, right. You know what I mean? So he had to write, yeah. Well, and the thing about Gad, too, is like he's the kind of drummer. Like you say that like everybody that aren't drummers are going to be like, Damn, that feels good. Like, you're not, you're not, you don't know why, but like his precision, I didn't even know about him being in the middle. And I got a chance to play with him once.

And I was always like, Steve, I play with other great drummers. But man, his thing was like. All right. Can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, can we, I want to, I just want to read. This is the high I want to read the highlights of gas Stepping on the personal story, man. This is the goods.

This cat's Wikipedia out on me, man. No, go ahead. You're right. I want to corner gas for a minute. Let's do it. Let's do it. Come on. I'm trying to slip out the back door, Jack.

He didn't even run, man. And it's time, man. No need to be quiet, Ron. Let's go. That was cheat, Pete. So here's just, Here's just like, I swear to God, this is 25% of Gads' dysography as a side man. So just people that he's recorded an album with, right?

And most of these, by the way, he's not on one album, he's on multiple albums. Lori Anderson, Herb, Albert, Asford and Simpson, Chet Baker, the Bee Gees, George Benson, Carla Blay, Brecker Brothers, Edie Burkell, Kate Bush, Larry Carlton, Ron Carter, Tracy Chapman, Ray Charles, Cyrus, Chestnut, Eric Clapton, Stanley Clark, Joe Cocker, Natalie Cole, Judy Collins, Jim Crocee, Christopher Cross, John Fattis, art farmer, Maynard Ferguson, Aretha Franklin, David Foster, Peter Gabriel. That's a random, like, what's the order to this list?

Art Garfunkel, alphabetical. It's like Ron Carter, Christopher Cross. Art Garfunkel, David Gilmore, Dave Gruzen, Jim Hall, Freddie Hubbard, Janice, Ian, Milton Jackson, Bob James, Al Jaro, Dr. John, Quincy Jones, Ricky Lee Jones, Dr. John. B.B. King, Rasshan, Roland Kirk,

Gladys Knight and the Pips, Yusuf, Lateef, David Leibman, Kenny Loggins Paul McCartney Michael MacDonald Taylor Taylor Charles Middler Charles Mingus

Peter Paul and Mary Michelle Patruciani Bonnie Raid Diana Ross Joe Sample a ton of David Sandborn albums Tom Scott Paul Schaefer

Howard Shore Carley Simon Paul Simon Frank Sinatra Spiro Dyrus Steely Dan Barbers Drysan James Taylor Richard T Cedar Walton Dion

Deon Warwick Grover Washington Jr. Weather Report Yeah and Nancy Wilson Jesus Okay so yeah I'm we're we weren't fully aware

but now we are of his resume like he's that guy got it and that's like that's just a glimpse that's not even the full picture well no I mean I think it's like you know Steve Gad is this is someone I'm like when you talk to drummers he's he's not necessarily like your average drummer's drummer where they're going to talk about him first

but like the great great drummers that I know like the jazz drummers especially are like he's that guy you know what I mean so like the more because I mean his technique is so high level that like what do they call like you know he's like a player's player or a coach's like

were the ones who really know but also you know he makes all these artists you know want to call him back because it's wild too like Mingus played with like one drummer his entire career like you know it's like Danny Richmond and it's like and Steve Gadd

like on a very strange record you might have found the only artist that wasn't on that list Charles Mingus right no he was on that's why I was like I never would have known that next to Peter Paul and Mary All three? No, it's an insanely varied group of artists and just, I mean, of the last part of the 20th century and the early part of the 21st century, it's like incredible. And he's on, it's not just like he's just on, you know, on Ery.

He's on like streetlights. Like, he's on like. Right. So it's the steely Dan, you know, the incredible solo. It's on Asia. Yeah. Listen to that. And you're like, that's all of 70s and 80s radio.

Like that he just owned the radio. Like. Yeah. And so think about the influence on the drummers today. They came up listening to that stuff, the top guys and gals. Like that's, this is, you know. Yeah. Guys, let's do one more track.

Come by my way, can I say one more thing about GAD? Yeah, please. How do you own- We're in Gag Corner. Let's get some of the safe space for Gad Lover. Let's go right back real quick then. Because how do you own a record in that way on an album? And then you just kind of doesn't disappear.

But then you just kind of like go back to, you know, that you don't like, that is like the genius of that guy I guess you know like that you could just on every song you I'm sure to get done that to every one of these right he's like well yeah this particular moment when it starts out yeah yes we got this this that was all and this this this is the one that needed it right I'm gonna step up a little bit and then I'm gonna go back to yeah again taste made he's a taste it could be like he's validating the story that uh something's in my conscious about the the part of this song whereas he wasn't intentionally putting this as the part to shine yeah he was doing this just warming up as they were getting ready and paul sim and was like no

that's going in. Yeah. But everything he chooses to do is very subtle. His own parts are super. And they are on that whole discography I just mentioned. And I think that's why he gets hired so much. He sounds incredible. The pocket is deep.

Yeah. And he just adds the right thing at the right time and nothing more. Okay, great drummer that listens. You get gigs. How many drummers have a part that they probably get sick of being asked about? Like the way like, you know, like Paul McCartney must be sick of like, you know, like, you know, whatever. All the Beatles questions. He's just got to be like, I don't want to answer that anymore, you know?

50 ways? Yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm sure he's just like, yeah, I mean, I do other stuff. Yeah. And then if he's ever in a situation where there's like, drunk dudes are like, eh, dude, New Orleans. Yeah.

Probably just smacks the shit up. It'd be fun to follow Steve Gatt around NAM with the camera. Oh, my God. I would avoid that if I was him. I know. Well, plus, I think, too, people always just like, what was that kind of snare? Like, because drummers, it's like a lot of them, especially at the lower levels, it's all about the gear.

It's like, well, how did you record? that bass drum. Well, you got a fucking killing-ass drummer name, Steve Gadd, and you put some mics up and make it sound like what he's, what he's playing. Yeah. All right, guys, let's do one more track here. I'm going to do Peter's favorite. I think this, I'm going to say this is Peter's favorite. I don't know if this is your Desert Island, Pete, but I'm guessing it's this. It's not, but it was on my list of a possibly. Oh, is it? I changed it. Is shampoo, a desert island movie? No. No.

Not a hater, though. This is Bob James on the roads on this one. Yeah. This was weirdly in seven. Yeah, one, two, three, four, one, two, three. I should go to that. But a voice in my head says, oh, what the hell?

That's eight. Valerie Simpson on the backing vocals. Man, one of the great background vocal wise. So simple. And Valerie Simpson and Patty Austin On this album Nice touch Right

Right Exaggerating that they don't have no fun Good resources to be able to pull up on You know it's like It should let Paul draft for the Knicks You know Like this guy can pick man Like Jesus Christ

Well you know he's a Knicks fan Yeah That's right Give him a chance That's right We got to listen this whole track Tony 11 is killing on it. Gad too.

Again, Gad. Man. Just playing exactly the right kid. I got a chance to play. He does not play loud. Even when he's grooving, his control of dynamics and, like, intensity of the groove

are totally independent. That's what's cool about this song, too. It's quiet, but it's just... It's subtle, yeah. That diminished chord is weird, man. Not a lot of loud moments on this album. Right. Not at all.

Sad boy. Sad boy. Yeah. I like this line. God bless our God bless our standard of living. Let's keep it that way. Damn.

That's a divorce line too. Oh, man. Oh, man. Hopefully for both, but, you know, you're not sure. And, man, Steve Gad, too. We're not to retitle this. This is like the Steve Gad appreciation podcast.

No, but like, I'm so... What Asia would turn into as well, if you remember. I know. But, like, Asia, like, so the solo on there, he's so busy, obviously, Wayne, like, it's such a thing. But, like, I appreciate what he's not playing on this. Hold on.

There's so much, like, Phil Woods. I love the way, too, like, all, he's playing all this bebop, and then all of a sudden, it's almost like he remembers weight. I shouldn't do, and he's like, dude, he does a little bit of walk in the bar kind of bluesy. But then he's like, do, but he's like, he can't help himself.

He's just, like, beepopped out. Do you think he did just, like, set up a mic and just let him run for, like, 30 minutes, and then just pick that big or, or? It just begs the question, how, why, Why? I don't know. I'm like, what?

Let's listen to that transition more time. I think it might have been Paul side, part of the whole like, I'm downtrod and so fuck it. Let's just have some B-B-B-B-B. Let's have some. It doesn't matter? Yeah.

Fuck it. We're going to put it to end. We're going to lose to Stevie anyways. I'm going to lose to Stevie. This is when the record label guys were like, wait, what? You're talking about the most, the most, like, traditionally. This phase out, too, doesn't it all, though?

Yeah, the most traditionally marketable song on the entire album. just going to put a giant bebop solo saxophone. Yeah, it's not even like he comes in. Like, he could have come in. Well, first of all, Phil Woods would not necessarily be the guy. Like, that's his kind of playing. You know, he came up as, he was one of the Charlie Parker acolytes and it was like bebop for life, you know.

But he could have come in over that groove, that one to four, you know, one to five and kind of be, or Brecker or Sandborn for sure. Sammore would have crushed it. There's something else on here, but not soloing. So it's kind of cool. that they have him doing his thing, even though it's just like, what the? Yeah, for sure.

And I love B-Bitb. But I'm like... How do you think this album has aged? I mean, because it was, it won album of the year, 1976. I remember growing up, and this was a big deal album in my parents' household and their record collection. I remember being in love with it from the time I was a kid. Well, respectfully, he's like, his parents.

He wasn't his household. My parents' house is definitely one of those albums that was like, I inherited. So it was your parents' record in a way, if you're a certain age. For sure. For me, it was because, you know, my parents got married in 1975. Not divorced. Still going. And for me, this is something that...

Wait, what year were you born? No, 78. Okay, cool. Yeah. But I don't hear people talking about this as much. No. But, you know, like... Yeah, it is weird.

Because this is, in my mind, like, because I came of age at a time. I feel like, you know, we're all in the last gasp of like boomerdom. You know, we're like, we're seeing it in real time. Like, boomers come, go from, like, the heroes of, like, culture and society to long enough. Like, you're like, yeah, live long enough. Yeah, and you're like, whoa, but, you know, and it's funny, like, uh, night game is on here. Like, I have this theory that I'm just going to workshop here. Yeah.

That, like, like, like, peak American culture is like 1935 to 2005. and it's like 1935, you get canned beer, night baseball games and like Monopoly. And then like... I like where this is going. And you kind of like get this like thing. And then like peaks right around like 1970. And then you just kind of like this long tail down to like iTunes 2005 and like whatever else. And boomers are such a big part of culture.

So they, you know, like in my mind, this is like an unassailable album. Like it's like you can't say anything bad. But it does feel like as as as, as, as, as, you know, as boomers have lived long enough to become villains, it's like this album is now, it's gone from, you know, maybe overrated to like, to underrated. I think it's underrated now, you know?

It is quintessentially a baby boomer expression. Yeah. Yeah. It's how a baby boomer deals, literally deals with his divorce. Yeah. And it's a really interesting take that you would not see a similar expression today

from the generations, the subsequent generation. This is the most boom. We didn't talk about your kind, but this is the second to last track on the album. The lyrics, you're kind, you're so kind, you rescued me when I was blind, and you put me on your pillow, you know, whatever. You're so good to me.

You introduced me to your neighborhood. It seems like I ain't had so many friends before. It's because you're good. You're so good. Why don't you treat me like other humans do? It's just a mystery to me. It gets me agitated when I think that you're so, that you're going to love me indefinitely. So goodbye, goodbye.

I'm going to leave you now. And here's the reason why I like to sleep with the window open. you like to sleep with the window closed. Just go talk to a therapist, Paul. That level of pettiness. It's like you're building up to this beauty. It's like the windows. That was just that.

That's like, I don't know, that's boomerdom in a nutshell. Yeah. It's a great call. Wow. Also done in the form of the blues. Yeah. And then the 12 bar blues form.

Again, a very boomer expression. You're kind. You're so kind of rescue me. When I was blind And you put me on your pillow And I was on the wall You're kind So kind, so kind

You're so good You introduced me to your neighborhood Seemed like I ain't never had So many friends before That's because you're good That's the blusiest he gets on this record That last line You're so good

Why you don't treat me Like the other humans do Paul Simon Major 7th Corr. Right there. Like you said, ultimate boomerism.

Ultimate. Vietnam is horrible. But it's over. Barney and Nixon, Barbardine and Nixon, Day one. Ford, he's great too.

Yeah, Ford. Yeah. I like to sleep with the window open and you keep the window closed. So goodbye. What a nice. How much

She gave you everything, man. She rescued you. She gave you friends. She treated you better than anybody. Brought you into the neighborhood. You're so caught. Goodbye. Like, later, I wouldn't want to belong to any club that would have me as a member.

Yeah, dude. For sure. Wow. Yeah. That's the apex moment of boomerism and of divorce on this record. Just like, what in the world, man? You know, what's interesting you were mentioning, you know, your parents, your dad. saying this was such important.

I was thinking back to like, why was this, I didn't hear this record growing up. My dad is a little older. And he- Silent generation. He, right. But not only he's silent generation. He didn't know, this is a difference.

But even when I think with boomers, like we're all aware, like my kids are just like, especially the younger ones that are like Gen Z. They're like, oh, millennials, man. I'm like, all you all the same. And I call one of them an iPad baby. No, the other, they're, they're, I was an iPad baby. I didn't have it until I was this age.

I was like, okay, cool. But I was telling my dad, this was like, Within the last year, I said something about boomer or whatever. And he's like, we had to look it up because I was like, wait, are you a boomer? He's like, I don't know. He's like, we didn't ever talk about that. It's like you guys brought that thing up. He didn't know what generation.

So I'm looking on. I said, oh, actually, you're in the silent generation. He's like, okay, I'll shut up. Is that what you're trying to say? Like, he had no concept. Like, how do you go 80s five years of your life? But like, there wasn't a thing. Like, especially for the boomers, they were just like, this is our world.

Well, dude. They define what it is to be a teenager and what a decade. Like, the 60s. It's like, this is their world. Well, this is a very typical thing of the baby boomer generation. They created the concept of a generation and being a group. And by the way, like, I don't disparage boomers as a generation. I actually think it's super fascinating.

I also love the culture they created. And I think that I just like the most Gen X thing you ever said. No, no, but here's the Gen X thing. It's like, here's the Gen X thing. It's like, I'm just tired talking about it. Let's get back to work. Because they were so impactful on our lives, the generations that happened,

there are our parents, obviously, and they've created this culture. It's just like, can we just like take a break from talking about, you know, the Beatles for a second and Paul Simon and even though that's a lot of what we talk about.

But I think they're going to be studied for long after we're gone because I think it's a fascinating case of this like explosion in this particular time, this particular place, make some of the most incredible art and redefine what culture is.

But I'm tired of it for now. Yeah, I'm tired. We're tired, but they're going to live. Oh, for sure. I mean, nothing matter. Like, what matters before 1935? What matters like after? Like, nothing's going to, nothing sticky from before.

Right. Buddy, there's still the president. Yeah. I know. But I'm still president. There's still president. Yeah. And I think that that like this and we always, you know,

getting knocked for like we hitting so many records in the 70s. Sue us. There's a lot of great records from that time. A lot of great. You tell us what's sticky after, you know, whatever. Exactly. Well, we were talking about it earlier. We had a list, but it wasn't like the Steve Gadd list.

Bro, teenage and 20-something boomers were an unbelievable force of nature. Yeah. Incredible. And, I mean, look, there was also a lot of luck, like, any kind of, like, generation or culture or country or people that, like, hit on something. Like, it's like, remain humble and realize that you were at a time when, like, records and radio, it was pre-internet. So, like, there was technology, everything kind of lined up. You won the wall. You live in a poll.

You didn't have to go. You go to war, but you won the war. I guess you had to go to Vietnam, but, you know. Yeah, yeah, but not if you were rich. Not if you were rich. Most of the boomers that made the Coljeanago, you know. Exactly. And I mean, also, like you said, like, we have great standard.

Good old USA. Great standard of living. Let's, let's keep it. Yeah, let's keep it that way. For us. For us. So by going till now, you know, the wealth divide and everything. So, I mean, um, crypto, babe, baby, on the way out.

Just going to pump a numb crypto. Let's go. Well, we got five years. Let's go. Last gas. Fuck the dollar. Who needs it anyway? Right.

That served us well that. Now we're going to play it up for all y'all. The dollar. Now the dollar. I've barely got some savings. Now dollars don't matter. I need crypto. I give up.

Meanwhile, Steve Gats. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. What a pocket on those guys. Incredible. Rolling stones selling out stadium. No one else can. God damn it, man.

Guys, Desert Island tracks on this one. What are our votes? Peter, where you have? So I've got 50 ways to lose your lover. I think it's just like, you know, sometimes on these I like to go anti-establishment. And after just the last five minutes of talking, I kind of wish I had a little bit more.

Bring out your Gen X quality a little more. But now I'm going to fall in line like I should, Gen X. And I mean, look, that's like, to me, that's the track that there's super interesting stuff. Musically, Gads, you're just killing it, of course. But it's also like, I mean, it's that, because look, I don't know if you,

You've heard how we do this. Adam kind of likes to use this as a catch-all for whatever he missed earlier in the episode. I use it literally as if I'm stuck on a desert island I can only have one of these tracks. What do I want it to be? So that would be it. Very subjective.

Sell me out, man. What are we doing to each other? Justin, what do you got for your desert island track? I'm going to take, I'm going to read it like, like, Peter. Like if I was really stuck on an island, what song would I want to hear a people? Because I think my little town is my favorite.

Yeah. But 50 ways to leave your lover. it's like, I don't think I could ever, I don't think I would ever be bored of it. 50 years later on an island, I'm not gonna be, it's just, it's, yeah, that's the mood of being stuck in an island, really. Also, could you imagine the rhymes you can come up with stuff on an island?

I know, with that game. You'd have 50 courses of, you know, like. And it's got such diversity in terms of palm trees. It's almost two tunes, you know. It's like the minor, then it goes to the, you know, it's really like.

So I also think about this is what I would like to listen to on a desert island, despite what my co-host says. And I, I picked I do it for your love. I have been in love with that song from the first time I heard it and I was still him. Okay.

Apex moments on the album. What do you all think? What you got, Justin? You know what? I'm going I'm going with the writer of Mr. Magic. There you.

Ralph McDonald on my little town. Yeah. He's getting into that. Like that little section of that with the horns. I don't know. It's just unbelievable.

But it's driving. driving it forward, man. It's like... But the, you know, the bridge on Still Crazy. I don't know, man. I'm going to go with that moment at the end of my little town. Nice. I'm going with the bridge on Still Crazy from the Bob James arrangement into the Brecker solo, I think is my favorite part of all of that. Okay, so we're going to change what you have written here?

Gotcha. What are you talking about? I got Brecker. Oh, you got, oh, got you. Got you. No, but you know animosity in the... You barely... This is a glimpse into the off-camera situation here.

That's why we don't talk. shield and we got a we got royalty now which kind of threw me off my game we're still holding the grudge from the Lewis Armstrong episode so go ahead that's right right I mean I got Phil Woods you know and have a good time like he finally somebody had it

everyone's having a good time but Phil gave you finally some jazz street cred out of Sad Boy Summer and it's yeah sad boy summer brought like Charlie Parker and the jazz police all up in that b'atch yeah so yeah I mean

it's it's the most unusual and jarring but I think it's a cool thing. So bespoke Spotify playlist. If this were on a playlist, what would it be? I have Lauren's Hampton playlist. Paul Simon famously friends, like best friends with Lauren Michael's S&L creator. And I just feel like if Lauren has a house in the Hamptons, which I assume he's got at least one.

Multiple. Yeah, that he's got an old like third-gen iPod out there. That just has, it just has Lauren's Hampton playlist. It's mostly Paul Simon and, and Rolling Stones, but yeah. And then wasn't there a connection with the, was the first Paul Simon appearance on S&L in that first season?

Well, so, yeah. They do My Little Town. They do My Little Town on the very second episode of Saturday Night Live ever. Okay, so for Bespoke Spotify playlist, I have, okay, full disclosure here. I saw yours first, and it's so good. Lauren's hand, I was like,

I got nervous and I went to Claude for some help on this. And this is what Claude gave, but I kind of like it still. Large language model. Still spinning after all these years. Okay. Yeah. Because this,

I mean, this is a great, like, this is fun listening to it and here we can trigger the stuff. But like, you get the vinyl going. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, like, you, I should have went to Claude, man. I, honestly,

Lawrence Hampton's playlist was so good. I hate to cop out. I hate to have come all the way out here to just, to just, you know, shrivel in the moment. But I have,

Lawrence Hampton's playlist. It's like, it's really good. Perfect. I'll take it. Don't look at it more as like you're not degrading yourself to this ridiculousness. That's the way you should look at it. Okay, all right.

Up next, what is coming up next on the playlist? What are the other albums, tracks, anything that pairs with this? So on this I did, because I always like to think about, especially this stuff that's kind of before my time a little bit, like what was happening at that time. I always think even in history, that's like really interesting. It's like, because, you know, when we did a Lewis Armstrong, it's like, he's revolutionizing. Like we look back on the 20s and we think the 20s are like, yeah, jazz kids.

And then you have this artist that like set up not single handily, but more so than it has ever happened. Is this a Lewis Armstrong episode of Paul Simon? I can't remember. No, but it's like, but then you think about the 20s and like the depression and just all these things. It's kind of amazing. So 75 is not that long ago.

But these are three records that came out in 75. Bob Dylan's blood on the tracks. Earth, when it fired, that's the way of the world. And Keith Jarrett's Kohn concerts, the best-selling solo piano record of all time. Yeah, we got to do that story

of the world at some point. Also, we got to do Kohn concert at some point. Yeah. I like those picks. Those are good. Justin, you got any?

You know, I went with CSN's 1977, self-titled, just because it felt like it'd come on, you know, after we listened

to this on Lauren Hampton's Hampton Play Clit. It makes sense. On Lawrence Hampton Playlist. Like, yeah,

I want to hear like, Dark Star by CSN. It's a yacht vibe. It's a yacht vibe. I'm going to go, Intervisions. I'm going to go, like, I want to listen to this album,

and then I want to listen to the album. And then you're going to divorce your wife. You're going to slip out the back door. Man, I love, you know, the classic is like the pet sounds, Beatles playing off each other, but I love stories like this where someone who I think is a top tier artist,

here is another top tier artist, feels challenged and inspired. because don't forget, Paul Simon at this point has made some bangers. It's not like he's just like an aspiring artist. He's already been through Simon and Garfunkel. He's already made the self-titled album. He's already made, and here goes, Raymond Simon.

And he gets beat by Stevie Wonder, and he gets super into inner visions. And just like how we were talking about, I have this vision. I don't know if this is true, but I feel like when Stevie made Talking Book, I can hear Let It Be on that. Like, I can hear Stevie listening to the Beatles

and being like, I can do that but better. And I feel like this is Paul's, maybe not, I can do that, but better. but his like answer to inner visions and his thoughts about it. Not that you could ever compete with inner vision. But Paul's not scared to like go to the map. Sure.

Right. And I really like that thought that these two albums were like one after the other at least in Paul Simon's mind. Yeah, that's great. That's a great big. Quibble bits, anything that you want to quibble bit on this one. I'm gonna go, you know, we talked about this a little bit,

but this is a front-loaded album. Yeah. Like the first side of this record is incredible. the second side is, I, you know. It's kind of like boomers. Yeah. The first half of it was. Man, boomers are taking strains today.

We don't want to generalize. I'm just wondering, like, could they have... But wasn't this the era of the front-loaded? Like, literally the... We talked about it for Asia. I have a fix for this, though, and this goes in my quibble bits. Leaving off slip-sliding away was... So dumb.

And the album was slip-sliding away. Justin. genius sure produces this album. That's how you hear the demo of Slip Sliading Away on Spotify. But imagine Slipside in Away as track number seven or eight on this album. Unbelievable. Unbelievable.

Unbelievable. The rescues the second side. I mean, the second side is great, but it needed a slipside. It needed a song that good. Yeah. Great call. Yeah, I think it's just like,

it's the whole thing of like, we talk about the advantage of technology at this time and like, you know, just to be able to write stuff like this and have people's attentions and ear for a huge album. like this. Yeah.

But there is another thing of like the turning over of the record. Because I remember like certain records like it was just like nah, you don't, and that was okay.

Like it was still worth the seven bucks or whatever. But, and that's why I think like Steve, you talk about certain records. Like Stevie had that run where it was like, it was key,

I mean, talking about the apex moments on the middle of the B side and stuff. Especially if you're into music. Like that was an exciting thing. But that was not the norm. Um, so quibble bits I have.

And if you're, feel free to pause this or fast, this for some folks if you don't want to hear this. Well, how would you know? Because you haven't heard of it yet. I love this setup. Where you don't have?

No, some of the grooves on this record are sanitized to me a little bit. Let's dig into that. Like the whole, I mean, there's nothing that's not grooving. So you're saying that you're saying that Steve Gad isn't grooving? No, I mean, of course he's grew, but I think he's been, and I wouldn't even, I have no knowledge. It's not like, oh, I heard they told him don't play this or don't dig in. I think it's just he appropriately played the situation and listened to it to it with you guys

and getting your feedback. I'm kind of turned around on this a little bit because I think situation, especially as you go through and listen to this record, everything's appropriate. Like we get into this thing where we're really analyzing, and I'm thinking like, oh, I know what Steve Gag can do.

I know what the muscle shows guys can do. But it's like you don't have to bring any of that. If you just take it for what it is, it totally stands on its way. But it's just like, like Steve Gat can really hit a New Orleans groove, like 2X that, no problem. You know what? You're not wrong, man, because, you know,

and Paul, like we listened to, Cecilia. Was it Cecilia up top? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then this is the guy that made rhythm of the Saints, and then you listen to the demo of Gone at Last

versus not, you know, Richard T's playing is great, you know, whatever, but you listen to the demo of Gone at Last compared to the, you know, and you're like... Exactly.

Now, that's probably the most sanitized track on here. It's very same. Which is weird, because like Richard T. I think is one of the greatest like blues, gospel, anything pianist.

It sounds like it's from a musical. Yeah. It's like, the whiz. Oh, that's a Greya. Damn, I'm not going to be allowed to hear that. And there's nothing wrong with the way that this is like perfect gospel musical. But you know what?

Someone said, I don't know who, Phil Ramon, someone said white people have to listen to this, you know? Oh, I'm sure. Sorry, guys. This was that. This is totally the error for that. Yeah. And it was like, yeah, please. Paul was probably like, yeah.

We need to win a Grammy. Richard T. is killing. I don't care what anybody said. No, he is killing, but like this is probably the least, it's weird because like the inspiration, like even you hear what he's like, it's almost like he would have been like, da, da, da, da. Like there's just little things that if you know, you're like, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you know, so to me, but again, like it's, it's kind of better when you don't know how this sausage is made to listen to this stuff because you're like, wow, this is gospel. You know, and it's like, I mean, my parents would totally be like, oh, this is gospel.

I hear what you're saying. We're going to church. I think if I could, if I could. paraphrase, what I think you're trying to say here is it feels like there's like, these are the grooves are in broad strokes. Like we're not getting the details that you would get in sort of like a more loose, gritty situation

where you're just letting the musicians do what they want. It just feels like this is a songwriter's album and we're going to do this in the sort of Broadway possible so that people in the middle Missouri can listen to this and feel okay about it at that time. Yeah.

And yeah, I mean, that was done all the time. And I don't know that like, you know, was Paul Simon and Phil Ramon and others like, like I definitely couldn't see Bob James being like, okay, I can help make these, I mean, I don't know how conscious or if that was just sort of their default way of like, oh, I like gospel, let's do some gospel. But Paul wasn't afraid to like stretch, you know? Like, so I can't, maybe it was him.

It was the zone he was in, but I can't imagine Paul was, would have been afraid to go off the rails with, you know. I mean, he's made whole albums where they just were just jamming. Yeah. And then he pieced it together later. Yeah. That's how Grace Land was made. He just recorded a bunch of people, just playing and then pieced together.

So that has a whole other history. It has a whole other thing. But, yeah, I can see that, Peter. I don't fully agree in that I do think, when I think about this album, I don't think about, like, oh, this has got to be like some authentic gospel. It's more about the expression of Paul's lyrics you are telling the story of. I get that. And I think it's a balance because you could lose that pretty easily if it goes out of whack. You know what I mean?

Maybe it's, maybe Paul felt that stops being a divorce album if we go to, you know, if we go too up, we're too, you know. It's true. And there's just a cohesion thing

that nowadays wouldn't matter as much because of how people listen. Yeah. But like if it had been going like, you know, the muscle show the guys were like, really? And then you're going,

you know, singer song right. It could be jarring. It would have been, probably, probably would have been jarring. So maybe I understand why I think they did it. But, uh,

all right. Would you have quibble bits? Yeah, I did the, it was front loaded. Justin, I kind of have the same one. Oh, that's right. Snobometer.

I'm listening. How snobby is it? Is it on the low end of the scale where it's very commercially accessible or is it at the high end of the scale where it's super snobby? Not very clear. So that's how we're defining it? I mean, that's how I've always decided to define it, Peter. I put this as a two.

Yeah, I mean, I put it as a three just because, like, I almost think it's sort of a one. But as we mentioned before and talked about, like, it's sort of changed. changed over time. So I don't really have it, like, is this snobby now? I mean, definitely, like, it won a great. I mean, it was a huge record

when it came out. So it's not snoppy, right? It's a one or a 10. It's like, it's like, this is not, like, so I'm torn it's like one or two. It's like, this is quintessential New York and that in one sense.

And so it's like a 10. Yeah. But it's also like, what's not? It's pretty excessive stuff guys. Oh, and see, Justin has seen right through and found the fault with the snobometer. No, that's an imprecise. Honestly,

measuring tool. It's kind of this. You know what this? It's kind of like a Woody Allen movie. Like, it's like, if you're the right kind of fan, it's super accessible. Right. But if you're not the right kind of fan, it is not, you're like, what is this? And it's a little bit outdated.

Is it a supero or a snoppy car? It's kind of like that. But if you go in on superoos. No, but it's hard to rate in the same way, right? Did you give a number? One or ten. Don't know. So I've fallen into that.

Well, that's what I did. But he gets mad if I give him a five. I still think it's a one or a ten. Yeah. Well, that's what I, sometimes. I think the same thing, so I'll average it out. Okay, so five. I'll say five. This is so classic snobometer right now.

This is just perfect. The snobometer sucks. Is it better than K-O-B? Is it better than Miles Davis's 1959 masterpiece kind of blue? You had maybe. I know, I was not to say he changed it. He changed it.

I don't want to curse something, but I was messed up about that. I thought about it. And I was like... I was surprised. I knew he liked this record, but I was surprised. I just thought about it some more. I've been listening to it, obviously.

You had an exclamation point after maybe, too. Well, only because that's been a thing of me. I usually get on Peter. Peter always does maybe or like even. He doesn't like what I said maybe. I never do it, but I kind of, I did it first. I did move to no into the no category. Okay.

I just think it's just not as good of a work of art as kind of Lewis. What had you considering it as? How important it was for me as a musician. Okay. Like, you know, again, I learned that Rhodes part on, like one of the first things I transcribed that wasn't jazz. So that's how we're deciding. if it's better than,

it'll be, it's like how much stuff we learned off of them? No, no, if it's, I have a personal connection to it. It means it has meant a lot to me.

That's almost, even as a songwriter of like, of, of, you know, I occasionally do like to write pop songs. And Paul Simon is like my number one for learning how to,

because he does a similar, a similar workflow that I do where he apparently does, you know, melodies syllobically first, and then writes a whole form around it and then inserts a, a story later, which is, by the way,

insane for how great his stories are. Like, usually when the lyrics are that good, it's the other way around. To reverse engineer. He's like, he would be a Sudoku master at filling in blank spaces because he's just so good at that. And so, it meant a lot to me personally.

So, yes, but I did move it away because I am a rational human being. Gosh, now I feel bad. I don't want to give you a hard time on that. No, no, I was thinking the same thing. I remember, I saw that maybe. Yeah. Because I was surprised.

You all are relentless. What you got, Justin? We'll say, hell no. Hell no. Hell no. You know what? I had that, I had a strong no. I had a no with the exclamation on another record.

I got to be more confident in that. Yeah, hell no. I mean, it's just. That's our first hell no. Objectively. But I like it, because there could be a hell yes, which would be like a 11. Like, oh, yeah, that's way better. We could have a whole meter.

It could be like, no, hell no. Hell maybe. Hell's no. Yeah. F no, you know. But okay. Acutramance, album cover and whatnot. I have a 10 just for the mustache.

The mustache is good. I have a nine, and I probably would have done seven or eight. The reason I did nine is because I know I'm starting to see. I didn't realize how influential this style is right now. Like there's a bunch of people kind of, and it's come and gone a couple times with having the little picture within the solid background on the cover. I'm seeing that.

So I don't know why that would push it up higher, but it seems like it would be important. I'm going to say like four. I like it. And, like, on one hand, personally, I like it. I think it's one of his best. I still think the self-titled album cover is better. Incredible.

And then, like, bookends is, like, a great... So if we're including Paul... Bookends is an all-timer. It's an all-timer. So it's maybe, like, the third best. But, like, it might be partially... It's not, like... It's just not in your face enough that I wonder if that's why the album is...

You know, you know, for casual listeners, you know, I think if you're going to pick a Paul Simon album off of like whatever streaming, like I don't know if that album cover is going to like, and it might be why it's aged not as great as it maybe could have. I mean, it's aged sonically very well. But in terms of like in the popular imagination of like what a great album is, like a more like iconic like, you know, cover that pops. It's definitely not made for like a little thumbnail.

No. It is definitely not made for that age. It's made for a 12 inch LP cover. Yeah. I think what I like about it is, you know, we're talking about the divorce, we're talking about what personal things that it means to Paul. It looks like someone snapped a photo of a guy trying to look happy when he's going through some shit.

You know what I mean? It totally does. Like he's grown a mustache. Then he has, like, he's growing his hair out. He's definitely going through a breakup. He's got like an Indiana Jones. But he's from Queens. This is a man who is living at the plaza and he's, he's cosplay.

That's his divorce guy. He's got a new, he's got a new apartment fill a, IKEA furniture that he just got. He's grown a mustache and his hair out. He's a guy going through it. He's reading niche in his apartment. He's got reen-neesh. He's right about 70s swingers.

He grew the mustache. Wait a second. It's a subculture here. Right. Yeah, well, I think that also this is such a great reminder. And thank you, Justin, for being here and bringing your spirit. Like, you're, and having listened to you so much, like, your approach to, like, music appreciation and like connection is so deep and I think you know we we we go into that and then

we'll get pulled out with like oh the eight major seven bro high five but I mean it brings back and like what you were saying too it's like the personal connection with these things yeah guides like the accoutrements right yeah like that yes we could sit here and be like well the design is not according to the standards of whatever but like when you learn a chord or like you're going through a divorce I mean could you imagine if you were going through your own break up at the same time and you lived in New York and you liked to wear Indiana. Like you would connect on that, you'd be like, that's my man.

But I mean, you would and you're trying to keep your standard of living going. Paul probably got some high fires walking around the city back to the floor. But I mean, that's the and then the music, you know, I think more than holds up in terms of that.

And then if you have that connection with it, even more so. So it's been excited for me to like just experience this with you guys. This is the, you were talking about Woody Island. This is, this is, this is, I don't know. Like, this is a Woody, this is, I don't know. Like, that's, just final thoughts is like, yeah, that is the great, like, it's, it's, it's a, I mean, masterfully made.

There's almost nothing you could nitpick, but you can nitpick, you know, but it's like, it's just, it's, like, precision. It's great. Yeah. It's a great album. Yeah. I've gone back and forth about, like, whether, like, how much I love this or not over just the time I've been here in St. Louis. Well, I'm, I love it. It's a great album.

I think it's at that stage of its life where people are kind of going back and forth on it. Yeah. Yeah. And we all are kind of going back and forth on even that era in certain genres. And if like there's, you know, I think to your point about the broadness of the grooves and not going fully deep on it, I think it holds it back in retrospect a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. And I think even any of the quibble bits like that one or any of the things we've talked about that may be a little questionable, I think we'd have to question more the time.

I think we'd have to question more the times and the way the music industry was set up at that time. It's not like a Paul thing or even a Phil Ramon thing, although obviously they're part of that system. But it would be more of a slight indictment upon that whole period. You know, and the system they were working with. It's not the fault of... But then to indict...

We were talking earlier to indict our current system, like where tracks or songs, whatever you want to call them, are much more about the atmosphere created and the vibe. Yeah. This would feel a little antiseptic and a little, like, but like, but at the same time, I feel like no one values the level of songwriting here. No one values that as much as they should anymore. First minute and 15 seconds in my little town.

What is happening? It's insane. You would never hear that on a modern, like from one of the biggest pop artists in the world. Yeah. Writing a song like that where it's just this through composed line and chords are happening and space is happening. And then there's this like hook out of nowhere. Yeah. These two incredible, iconic, angelic voices that have sung together since they were children.

Yeah. And apparently we're not too fond of each other at that point. Who hated each other. There's baggage there. But like just the way it's written with the sheen of the 70s production is, I think makes it stand alone a little bit. But it's interesting because that has not aged well because people don't do it. Because people don't value it. People don't do it.

No one necessarily. No one has the time to like make it through like those extended verses. People don't even write bridges anymore. Like let alone like a bridge that changes keys by a major third. You know what I mean? Yeah. Or a bridge over troubled water. No one writes that anymore.

I think we got to go out on that. Pete, wow. Justin, thank you so much. Man, thank you for having me. It's been great. Even my daughter loves St. Louis. So we'll be back. Whether you want us or not.

Yeah. You got come to the earthwind and fire. Yeah. Done and done. And I'm sure you guys are. already know about it or listen, but check out Justin on Broken Record with occasional guest appearances from Rick Rubin

and Mock and Black. Rick's now doing Tetragramerton, but you know, we love that too. I love Tetragrammerton. But Broken Record, I see I'm doing that. Yeah, what do you got coming up on the Broken Record? That you can talk about. That I can talk about. You know, who... Or that you can not. If you want to break news here. Can I break some news? Can I break some news?

This is the end of the pot. An hour to half pod. No one's here. This isn't making of the show. What I have coming up? You know, I'm excited. I've, I've, maybe not that excited, but I'm excited. I'm talking to John Oates next month, which I'm excited about because I talked to Daryl Hall three months ago.

Right. Are you trying to mend that relationship? Yeah. Are they talking? I'll say there's not much. I thought like, like when I was talking to Daryl Hall and I love both of those guys, but when I was talking to Darry Hall,

they got to bring up, you know, I approached that interview by like, I'm going to pick some like songs to highlight where it's very clear. Like they collaborated and like they kind of like in my little time. Like, I wanted to pick some stuff I was like, look, what you guys did is undeniable without saying it.

Right. And he wouldn't budging in. She was just like, John didn't do shit on it. Oh, he never has either. He said that was the, I told him to sing that part. He never wrote anything. Like, I think he wrote half of that song, you know? Like, so I am going to like, you know,

I'm going to pull some quotes from my Daryl Hall interview and read him back to John and see what he thinks. Oh, that's amazing. It's going to be great. So I'm excited to do that. And, you know, other than that, man. I got a kid coming, so I'm going to take a little break. There you go. I got some other fun stuff.

Yeah, that's right. That's right. Good. Well, man, we appreciate you, and this was fun. It's good to be here. Thanks, guys. Until next time. You'll hear it.

You'll hear it. Yeah.