You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - We're Jazz Pianists and (we think) We Can Do ANYTHING

Episode Date: January 25, 2024

In the realm of pianists, a pervasive trait emerges—the unwavering belief in their capabilities. But is this self-assurance justified? Join Adam and Peter in this episode as they delve into the origins of this confidence and unravel the reasons behind its prevalence among piano players.Have a question for us? Leave us a SpeakPipeCheckout courses from Adam, Peter and more at Open Studio🎹 Head over to our YouTube channel for a better look 👀.Follow us on Instagram

I'm Adam Ennis. And I'm Peter Martin. And we're jazz pianists. We think we can do anything. Whoa. We really do. I'm excited about the title. I'm excited about that.

The title of this episode is, we're jazz pianists. We think we can do anything, which is almost certainly true. It was going to be, just in the psychology of us, it was going to be, we're jazz pianists. We can do anything. And at the last minute, Peter said, maybe we should put a think in parentheses. We think we can do anything. That's right. Today we're talking about one of our favorite subjects.

Yeah. Ourselves. Right, right. Jazz pianists in general. And kind of the psychology of what it's like being a pianist, this all stems from a brand new documentary that's on Netflix that I'm sure most of you have seen, most of our audience has probably seen. Yeah.

It's called American Symphony. It stars John Batiste, an incredible musician. And I want to say, former jazz pianist, he's so much more than that now. Yeah. He's like this complete ecosystem. of talent and music and beauty and light and definitely has roots in what we're doing here today as we're going to show you. But it's just amazing the confidence, the hubris that most people who do what we do have, Peter, us included, like, jazz pianists, we think we can do anything. We're always

the first ones to step outside of our comfort zone in my experience. I'm sure we're going to push back from drummers and guitarists. We're like, no, we think we can do it. anything. That's right. But yeah, when you tell a jazz piano stay in your lane, we're like, oh, cool, we've got like 18 lanes. We've got an 18 lane highway. No, I was thinking about, as I was watching the American Symphony last night, I was thinking about how, you know, John Batiste and his, I mean, he's, I was watching the Grammy performance of him, uh, singing Freedom at the 22 Grammy. The spectacular. And I was like, is this a jazz piano player? Is this Prince? Like, it's like the talent is unbelievable. And I think about other folks like you,

you, Peter, starting open studio as the jazz pianist, like, the audacity. I didn't dance a lot when I started it, but. As a CEO, though. And then, like, you know, John, even people like John Williams. We were just talking about John Williams before we started the episode. He's kind of a jazz pianist. He started out as a jazz pianist. And he's like, you know what I'm saying?

All these folks. So, I mean, you can, then you can get into like. Ray Charles, Stevie Wonder. Kirby Hancock, Neck and Cole, like, the audacity. I know, yeah. Of the jazz pianists. No, it's really exciting. And it's so cool to have.

have Jonathan as like, he's kind of our current protagonist, you know, exemplar of this idea of like, we all know him as jazz pianist and we're going to actually play, maybe we'll do it at the end a little, that was a little foreshadowing what we did there. A little bit of OG Jonathan Battees playing jazz. But like, I think we think of him as a jazz pianist still, but I don't think the world thinks of him as that at all. And he's kind of like, he's sort of that, I don't know, like, I don't want to overstate it, but he's such a New Orleans musician. Exactly right. You know, like New Orleans musicians know how, and it's not just in jazz, they know

how to transcend styles and make it their thing. And by their thing, I mean our thing. The whole world's thing. Yeah. Like it's a gift to the rest of humanity. It's a gift and it's a cultural, you know, culturally significant thing onto its own when you talk about New Orleans music. That's as broad and as specific at the same time.

And I think that Jonathan is a great, among many others, I mean, trombone shorty of course well Sullivan Fortner like in like Harry Connick like Harry Connick Lewis Armstrong that's what I'm gonna say going back yeah the people that transcend the music there's for some reason there's a a greater percentage that come out of that city right but there's that connective tissue of New Orleans in everything that they do you talk about somebody like Winton or maybe Sullivan Fordner where you Sullivan you would say like he's a jazz pianist like through and through in terms of what he's doing but if there's a connection still to that New thing, that culture.

And look, New Orleans is not the only place that has culture around the world. There's a lot of places. But the way... It's so thick. It's so thick and it's so well explained in the music and the food and all the things, you know. But anyway, I thought the movie was great, the documentary. I thought it was so interesting. I mean, you don't want to go into that thinking you're going to see a lot of jazz piano

play, which, of course, I always want to see more of him doing that. But I thought the story was so cool. Yeah, if you haven't seen it yet, there's not a lot of jazz piano playing happening in the documentary. He's in the middle of writing a symphony. His partner, Sulaika, is going through a serious illness. Who becomes his wife during the movie. Who becomes a wife during his documentary.

Are we giving away too much? No, not at all. Okay. Which is that story in itself. It's a tearjerker. It's such a beautiful story. And then you see sort of his rise as he gets nominated for 11 Grammys and wins five. Yeah.

And all the while, sort of writing this big symphony that is to premiere at Carnegie Hall. And it's just interesting to see this, you know, musician going through all of this, all of these things. And there's so many similarities that I was, you know, like, experiencing as a musician, even though it's a different scale what he's dealing with, with, you know, the Grammys and all the, all these things. But, like, time management is still a thing, you know, where to, where to, where to deploy your energies. Yeah. And, like, that, the problem of deciding what to do with your energy. your mental health. While you're dealing with the time,

you know, being an artist, being a creator, being a new husband. Oh, man, it was a lot. Yeah,

well, I mean, one of the most, I think, one of the most interesting parts for me was after he won all the Grammys. And he's, there's like a montage of like,

they're playing audio from obviously social media clips of people just like dogging on him for winning all these grandmas. Some people are like, who is he? Who is he? That's not Drake? That's,

yeah. Nobody, somebody listens to this music. It sounds like, you know, he's stuck in Farrell's happy video, all this stuff. It's just like these weird criticisms that if you ever do anything publicly, you are in today's day and age where, you know, people can comment, you know, have the freedom and the platforms to comment on anything and often do. Yeah. You have to, you have to, this is built in now part of the experience. There's no sheltered from everybody's thoughts about what you're doing.

And that in itself is a very weird experience. and one that I was especially awake to as we were watching the documentary. Well, I mean, when you put yourself out there, even at the small level that we do, one thing we learned, you expose yourself to the lovers, the haters, and everything in between, and just going to the process of having something evaluated that, you know, in potentially just a very immediate and trite way. Like, what is he doing, like something that you put your, heart and soul into or really thought through. And like I don't think even as jazz

pan is thinking that we can do everything. I don't think that any of us, any music, any creator, right, ever thinks that like everything that we do or even anything that we do is so great that it has to be embraced by the entire world. It's not going to be. No, it's not going to be. But it's also like, I think all that we hope and wish for and know that it's in this day age is probably not going to happen is that it either be, you know, accepted from kind of from a place that we, you know, it comes from our heart on some level, right? Yeah. Like, that it be accepted from that or rejected is fine, but to just be dismissed out of hand because of, because you want to be heard. Like, that's the weird thing about, and I can

imagine how much Jonathan has to deal with that in terms of like the, I mean, just from their mouth that we get. Oh, yeah. You know, it must be incredible. Like when you, the more you put yourself out there, the more you try to do something, you know, I think something, you know, I think something, something of meaning, something of depth, and we can debate or, everyone can have their opinion on if it if it resonates with them, which is fine, like his symphony. You know, if you're there in Carnegie Hall,

if you're watching, it obviously was resonating with a lot of people there. His performance on the Grammys was like, I mean, people were, they were talking about this is just, I think Farrell and like Taylor Swift and then were like up on their feet and not. Billy Eilish, yeah. Billy Eilis.

Yeah, I mean, they were some people that know what they're doing, potentially were digging it, right? It's crazy. His response, though, to that sort of montage of everybody saying that was like, you know, so it was something like, you know, this, it's not, it's not jazz enough for the jazz musicians, it's not pop enough for the pop musicians, or not classical enough for the classical musicians. It doesn't matter what you do. Yeah. Just be yourself. That's right. And I think that's, that's some really wise advice.

Another really poignant thing that he had said during one of his Grammy acceptance speeches, which they featured in the documentary, which hit home for me too, which I thought was a great insight. And I want to get to what makes jazz pianists so. cocky a. Cocky AF. But, but, uh, but,

but, but, but, Kahl, what did you call it? It wasn't hubris. I think it was hubris. When I started pop, pop, pop, he said,

Caleb was like, it stuck with me. That's why, that's why it means something. Caleb's like, whatever it was, I wish I'd never said it. He was like the arrogance.

No. Errogance. No. It wasn't arrogance. But, uh, anyway, no, no. As when he,

when John Visees was accepting, he, Cavalier. Cavalier. I think that is the perfect adjective. And not the Cleveland Cavalier, kind. No, no, no, no. Cavalier, Monsieur Cavalier.

But when he talked about his, when he was accepting the Grammy, he talked about art and music and, and how his, how music is a spiritual practice for him. That resonated with me too, and I think framing music is not something to achieve. Yeah.

And not an identity to, to hold on to, but as a spiritual practice of something that helps connect you to other human beings and to God or whatever it is that you think is, beyond explanation or the mystery of the universe, that the blanket is over, whatever it is that that means to you, or even if it's just the cosmos. Music is somehow this weirdly undefinable, mysterious connection to that, and the deeper

you get into it, the more it does feel like a genuine spiritual practice. And that's why, in fact, it's so tied to so many religious practices because it's so helpful to speak on the unknown in those terms. Yeah, and I mean, yeah, we always, you know, such a great point spiritual. It really is and like that's the place that so we're seen as sort of being cavalier or having to say we've got to use this word more often.

Well it's like people. It's brilliant word. Yeah. Cavalier. No but I'm like saying that's what we're supposed to be doing when we write music. When we play a solo when we practice like this is a spiritual practice and that was my thing about the comments and stuff like you don't just like religion you don't have to agree with it or love it but I think

it should be respected. You know what I mean? Like like to just be like out of hand comment like this is stupid or how come this is like that's like saying a religion maybe you don't understand it maybe it's not for you that's fine uh and we're not saying that i'm not saying that jazz is a religion no no but spiritual spirituality which every human experiences i think the world has a way of stamping that out of us if we're not careful yeah i mean think about all the different things you know in the beautiful things in school that you learn to connect you with spiritual things but then the other things that you can't do that you should do this the world

needs you to be this professional. There's a lot of things that can take you off that spiritual mark. I mean, if we want to be perfectly transparent here, Peter, you know, here at Open Studio, where we are a business, you know, I think we are always walking in line and struggle with, like,

I think the spiritual practice of music can get stamped out with trying to sell things to people or whatever. And so we're very, I feel like you and I specifically, we talk about, we have a lot of conversations about these kinds of things, but about like the tone of what you're doing, if you're a business selling things to people,

but trying to hold on to the magic of that unknown thing, right? In that, like, there's no pill that's going to, like, solve all your problems for anything. Yeah. And especially with music. Right. There needs to be a practice with it that is connected to the unknown. And that's, if you think about the best music you've ever heard,

the music that connects with you, there's no good reason why it does. Yeah. It's just, it's, it is an unknown thing. Yeah. that ultimately it is. I mean, you could definitely try to explain it away, and I love this groove and this whatever,

but why does it hit you so hard? Why does it tweak something in you? And to me, that's like the fine line that you've got to walk, if you're living in our current setup of systems. You know what I mean? It's like it can easily stamp out that important gift that we have. Yeah. And I mean, I think that, you know,

it was shown a bunch of the documentary. Jonathan has a great ability to tell, tap into that spirituality of music, that optimistic, that joyful. You know, a lot of it's the New Orleans thing, yeah, but I mean, it's also like he's really embraced that connection. I mean, we talk about jazz pianists, we can do anything. Like, he's a great example from the standpoint of like, what's the one thing we can't do as jazz pianist, that he's even overcome that, and you have too, which is like March.

Get out of your seat. Get out of your seat, so he's got the Melodica. Like, you know what my favorite parts? Like, that's the one thing physically holding us down. He's on the subway. He's got the melodica. He's, you know, when they show the origins of his band, he's, he's, playing melodica with stay human and they're on subways and everything.

And he's getting really shit on by everybody at Juilliard. Yeah. For playing some crappy kids instrument, you know, when you should be taking this seriously. And I was like, man, he is taking it seriously. He's trying to get out there and be himself. Right. And that's a serious practice. You know what I mean?

Just doing what other people tell you to do is foolish. Right. But he seemed like he had awareness of that or at least a vision on that from a very early age. Now, you can not like the melodica. That's fine. but like you can't not love that spirit. And then they show later there's a mural at Juilliard with a melodica. I know, I know.

I know. And he's like, this is crazy. Well, you know what? And I wonder, like, this is why it was such a great reminder of me. I'm going to kind of put this out there because I think somebody might need to hear this. Is it me? Are you talking to me? No, no, I'm not talking.

It's somebody out there in a podcast because, I mean, I learned so much stuff from people being honest in a discussion. But they kind of show. the struggle that he had at Juilliard as being a really interesting part of his story, which I think was true. I mean, you know, it's Hollywood or whatever. They might amplify it a little bit

or put it to the forefront. They may highlight a little bit, but I think that it's interesting because I remember Jonathan and his father in particular coming to me and some other, you know, older musicians or I wasn't like old then, that much older. But like, I remember him coming and saying,

like asking for my advice about where he should go to school. You were probably his age now. Yeah, exactly. No, I was younger, actually. But they were asking specifically about Juilliard, and Jonathan was very, this is when he was at Noka. I wasn't teaching there anymore, but he would still come by or I'd see him. He'd come to gigs or whatever.

And was very much asking about Juilliard. It's like, I know you went to Julia. How do I get in? I really want to go. And like, I never tell somebody go there, don't go, that this is good for you, this is bad for you. But I was a little bit discouraging of it. I definitely wasn't like stay away from that.

But I just felt like for him, and I told some other really good young players. I didn't recommend it. I was like, first of all, when I was there, there was no jazz apartment in the jazz apartment's new. But I'm just like, I know how that machine of Juilliard is. And I know that things, like, you have to overcome some stuff if you want to really be a free spirit in terms of music. It can be great for some people. Yeah.

It can be really, really helpful. If you're going right down the path and you're in there and you're going to make those connections and you want to do. Totally. You want to be part of that machine, just like any place, right? But it's elite levels. So it can be even more damaging or great. Like the highs are great and the lows are low. That's right.

You either spit you out on the bottom or at the time. pop. And so I was kind of like, I just didn't feel like he needed that. But I mean, he was very much like, I want to go to New York or whatever. I was like, oh. And so I remember the first time I saw him up there, we were doing a gig at Lincoln Center and he came like backstage or something. And there was a young singer that I kind of, they weren't like struggling. But they were like anytime you're trying to find your way and things. And I remember thinking like, oh, I hope this works out. Well, apparently it did. But it's just to say that like sometimes like what we can't predict, especially helping a younger musician or something, we can't keep them away from different struggles, but we also can't predict what that's going to do. And so it's not a cop-out to say, like, you've got to find your own path or anything. But it's also like, I mean, he ended up graduating from Georgia and getting his master's there. I mean, not that he needed that to go on the Colbert show, but the whole thing worked out and he wrote this piece. And of course, it worked out.

And then there's struggle still. And there's, you know, if you ask him, would you do it again? Who knows? But it's a journey. You know, it's a journey. And I think that Jonathan has done a great job. And I mean, you know, to get this back to Pianas, I think what we're good at as Piano's is organizing, like we need all the musicians.

You know what I mean? It's never, I mean, yes, we can do some things solo piano, just like guitarists can do, just like a trumpet can do. But I think that a lot of pianists are very good at attuning ourselves to that spirit of the music. And like, how do we organize things? And that's why it's like, can you do this in range? But yes, you know, we're optimistic.

We've got these different skills to be able to do these things. And we take that responsibility pretty seriously. Yeah, I think it all starts. we want to get just real quickly, if we want to get down to the micro level, I actually think the reason why pianists have this cavalier attitude is some skills that are developed, just literally by the physicality of the instrument.

The fact that each note is represented with one button, and it's all laid out, and you can see it before you hear it. Yeah. Thank you. Gotcha. You could see it before you hear it. Something like an inside joke, nobody knows. So obviously the guitar, there's multiple ways to play one note.

For a saxophone, even, And there's multiple plays to one note. Yeah. Trumpet has just three buttons. I don't know, there's a great... There's a combination of them. There's a great comedian named Pete Holmes that has a very hilarious bit on the trumpet

that I'm going to show at the end. Okay. But with the piano, you can see everything. Each note is represented by one key. And I think that does something over time to our brains in the way that we're able to see and hear and structure music.

It's why we're often tapped to do arrangements or orchestrations for things. obviously we can play all the harmony. You know, we can, like, more, we have more ability to play harmony than any other instrument. Right. Guitar and vibes, of course, can play harmony,

but not, they can't play this. Right. Guitar can't play that very well. Thank God. And not easily. Right. You know, and a vibes player can't play this, right? Ever heard Warren Wolf?

He did that one. But there's, there's just limitations that the piano doesn't have as far as harmony. I think just that literal practical physicality of how the instrument laid out. Over time, it sort of everything in the physical world molds our internal world, you know, for better or for worse. And I think whatever this is physically, it molds our internal way of processing music that pianists get the cavalier attitude that we can go ahead and

handle a lot of, a lot of different scenarios. Yeah. And I think it's part of the role. I think there's a reason why, you know, personalities are drawn to different instruments. It's a reason why there's a bass player personality, there's a singer personality, there's a drummer personality. Oh, I know. But I think they all revolve around the actual physical experience of doing the music. Totally. Well, and don't you think, too, just the fact that the piano, it's not the only instrument, but it's kind of the main one that we're in a lot of times, like, it's stationary. So like, it's natural for people to gather around us. You know, like you come over to the piano because we can't move our instrument over there. Also, um, I think the skills that, so there's the physical layout of the keyboard. Nice. Thank you.

Yeah. The actual skills that we're learning to become better pianists are things that lend themselves to arranging and composing and like kind of thinking about structures beyond just our instrument. And then some of the things we don't necessarily have to learn are not that important for those. skills anyway, like intonation. We don't really deal with that with piano. We might be able to hear it, but that's, so like, you know, like lyrics, just these different things. Sound production. Yes, of course, that's important the piano, but not the same way it is for a saxophone or a cello or a trumpet. So, yeah, I mean, we, I think we're molded around the instrument as much as the instrument is molded around us. And it's interesting stuff. You're over there looking for something. I'm looking for this people. You're in Google land, right? And sorry, that was me. Because I've got a good clip too. That was me on the on the what you'll want me play my clip oh my clip's the one we're doing

going out my clips my clip's the one we're if you made it this far congratulations we're at alone you could really do anything you should really do anything

if you made it this far what I was gonna play was and you can tell me if you think it should be on the way going out is a little Jonathan Battiste as a jazz pianist straight and straight

but you see the glimmers of really his personality and I think a lot of the other stuff that he's gotten into and this is from 2009 playing with none other than the great Roy Hargrove. Should we do that now? You got something else.

No, you got it. Okay, here we go. So this is boom. Boom. That's Jonathan Batisse when he's like 23, 24 years old with Roy Hargrove. Montez Coleman at the drums, the late grade. The late great Montez Coleman. Huh.

Ooh, Tess. That is. Yeah. Tess out. Ha. groove, simplicity, like that lens flare. A little glimmer of future stardom there,

wouldn't she say? I mean, we're going to the stage, so there's that too. I don't know. Should we say you'll hear it? Until next time? Hold on. I want to play this clip.

I want to play this clip. I don't have... It's so hard to find this for some reason. This is my Pete Holmes clip about playing the trumpet. And I can just do audio. Super apologies, everybody. This is the year that I would like to understand.

the trumpet. I don't want to play it. I just want to get it. Listen to me now. Three buttons. Excuse me. Three buttons. And it plays all the notes.

Fuck's going on. I want answers. Sometimes they're pushing two. Sometimes they're pushing none. That doesn't add up to 12. I checked. I like a more straightforward brass instrument. Like saxophone, he's got no secrets.

You hear.