You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Wurli or Rhodes?

Episode Date: April 25, 2022

This Monday Adam and Peter hit those Speakpipe questions and discuss the differences between Wurlitzer, Rhodes, and the acoustic piano. Have a question for us? Leave us a SpeakPipeCheckout courses from Adam, Peter and more at Open StudioLet us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel.Follow us on Twitter | Instagram

Hey, Peter. Hey. It's Speak Pipe Wednesday on a Monday. What? I know. You got me confused. Well, stay tuned. I'm Adamannis.

I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear podcast. Jazz. Explain. Explained. Today, we're taking a speak pipe. So excited. Haven't had a speak pipe in a while that we've listened to.

We're going to turn this speak pipe into an explainer audio, video, not video. No video. No video. But we're going to try. This is from Birch. You know how I know there's no video. How? Because Adam has no hoodie on.

Do you think I have to have a hoodie on for a video? Exhibit A through Z. It has been my M.O. For like two and a half years. Ladies and gentlemen, in case you haven't checked it out, this is, of course, a wonderful podcast. You're at the right place. This is my co-host, Mr. Adam Manus.

The gentleman who first assigned the moniker, you'll hear it, to this very pod. Did you know that? Of course you know. I remember that. I was standing right over there. I said, we're going to start a podcast, and you said, we're going to call it.

you'll hear and I said so be it. And the rest is history. No, but not only do we do a podcast, but Mr. Adam Manus does some amazing YouTube videos, often adorned and fully shorned in an open studio hoodie. I don't know anything about that. No, he's usually, his hair is not cut, but some really wonderful videos.

So check those out on the Open Studio YouTube channel. Your video's getting a lot of love over there. Oh, thanks, man. I'm having a good time over there. And speaking of hoodies, you know, you can get our merch. We do have merch. Do we?

You can go to You'll hear it.com and get yourself. You'll hear a T-shirt, an open studio hoodie. I was trying to get a hoodie here in the studio. Yeah. And Caleb's like, oh, all that stuff's boxed up. Well, I've taken all of them. Okay. I'm going to order one and see if it shows up.

Actually, you know what's sad man? A lot of my open studio hoodies because I wear them like every day. They're getting a little raggedy. They are. Well, that's what happens. But we also have You'll Hear It merch in particular. That's really exciting. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Go check that. I always have fun when I. when I wear my, you'll hear it long sleeve tea. I love the long sleeve tea. My daughter wears the long sleeves tea to middle school. That's how you know it's cool because she wouldn't do that. She didn't come on beat up or anything. No, she didn't go to that kind of middle.

No, she doesn't. My middle school, Brittany Woods would have, you might have got slapped. That's right. And not in a Chris Rockway either. Well, maybe. Not in a nice way. So speak pipe Wednesday on a Monday. Tell me about this.

Well, we have this great speak pipe from Birch. I thought we would just check it out here. Okay. Because it's actually a question, and hold on to your hat here, Peter. Okay. We've never answered this question before. What? This is like podcast number 860.

Wait, let me guess. Before you've been hearing it. The question's going to be, what is a shell voicing? That we've answered like two and a half dozen times. Okay, it's going to be, how do you swing? That I don't know about. What is drop two? That I know about, but you have no clue about it.

Well, that we've both answered and I do not know. the answer. He still doesn't have dozens of times. We have it literally multiple courses at open studio. Have you ever heard of a stumbling block, a learning curve? A, you know. Well, and again, I say this every time. My favorite part is you play it like every tune you play it. I don't know when I'm playing it. I know. I'm playing it. I know. I'm trying to jeffery keiser when he was here the other day. Does he know drop to? No. Oh, good. I feel better. I know. He doesn't know drop two. And he was talking about block chords and locked hands and he's like, I don't think about that stuff at all. It's just octaves or tense. I don't know. like, oh, that's what Peter Martin does too. So there you go, folks. You don't need to study your drop two. I mean, but get the block chords making easy course from the studio. No, it's already out there.

That's right. It is out. It is out. But it just goes to show you that, like, one of the cool concepts, I think, that we've discovered, Peters, we've done this podcast is that all of these little things that we all play, we all think about it differently. And everyone does. You know what I mean?

Like, Barry Harris has put together a lot of, like, core concepts. And people are like, you know, that thing, the sixth diminish. And it's like, yeah, that's the only dude that talks about it like this. Right. You know what I mean? Like, we're all learning from him about how to think about it. Everybody plays it, but nobody thinks about it, like, one person or the other. You know what I mean?

But don't you think that did you, was there a time maybe when you went up to New York to go to school? Or for me, it was kind of when I first hung around people that grew up in New York. Yeah, I guess that's when I went up there. But it's like, you know, the stuff we kind of knew growing up, it's like, We talk about sit around listening with your friends or your peers listening to music. And they're like, oh, can you, I mean, even to the point of like where I didn't know they didn't have to the dominance. But then someone was like, oh, you big dummy. It's a half-stead.

I was like, oh, yeah, I knew that. And then you learn little things. Yep. But everybody from New York, they got way more. Because there's just more people, more access. They were so much more sophisticated. It was like the internet before there was an internet. Yeah.

They could do everything better except drive. They're not good at getting driver's licenses. They really are good at that. They can't drive. No. But I mean, they know. And they can't not tell you what's on their mind. Of course, right, right.

But yeah, a lot of that stuff they did kind of, you know, because they were at like a workshop with Barry Harris when they were 14 years old because they were New York or whatever. So they're always a little more sophisticated than us country bumpkins from the middle of the country. Did I ever tell you the time I was in New York when I was living there? I was at the bank. I was in line of the bank to get money. Remember that? Did you have a mask on and a gun in your eye? No, no, no.

I was just taking money out of the bank. Chase Manhattan, you know? This little kid comes up to me and he's like, hey, do you want to buy some candy? and I was like, no. And he must have been like seven, seven or eight. He's like, you want to buy some candy? It was to support a team or something. And I was like, I'm taking money out, but I don't have any money because I'm, you know, 20 years old.

I'm in New York. I'm like, no, I can't buy any candy. And he's like, man, you look weird. Is that great? Oh, that's so, New York. Now, to be fair, I did. And then he robbed you. Man, you look weird.

Seven-year-old kid. Yeah, they're so sophisticated, fisticated up there. They really are. Anyway, we do have a speak pipe from Birch. This is a great question. Like I said, a question, Peter, we've never answered. Excited. We might have been asked it.

You know what? Maybe we can't answer it. This could be a big faux pa, a big disaster. Let's find out. Big flailing on our part. And I know we're going to get listeners to be like, actually in episode 421, you answered this, but we'll see. We love you. We don't think you all talk like that.

Hey, guys. I'm a huge fan of the podcast, and I'm playing a whirlitzer right now, and I'm just thinking about voicings and how I tend to play pretty close minimal voicings on the whorlitzer where I might play tense in the left hand and thicker voicings in the right hand on a piano and so I thought it might be an interesting topic to hear how you guys approach whirletzers roads five andettes versus the piano thank you I think that's a real whirley too you could tell by how the key strikes yeah you know it sounds like the key bed of the whirley yeah sounded awesome yeah with those little speakers I know I love my whirling I got a two

200-A, you know. Yeah. I use on gigs. You're baller. I love it. I got a plug-in. I got a world-star plug-in. Yeah, let's hear it.

You got it going right now. That's a good one, man. It's KeyScape. Shout out to KeyScape. KeyScape, why aren't you a sponsor the show? Listen to this. Yeah, Peter Martin playing your product right here every day. We're not even going to say KeyScape anymore.

We're going to say that company that starts with a key. It sounds awesome. It ends with Scape. No, they really are incredible. Listen to that. You've even got the little, when you push it, it overdrides. Overdrives. It's a 200A from Keyescape.

Oh, is it specific that model? Yeah. So this is an interesting question. The first thing that came to mind, who asked this question? Dear listener name. Birch. Birch.

So, I mean, the obvious part, I think, is that you have movement, not only from the trim, but when you play the piano, there's interaction because most of the notes, if not all of them, will be multiple strings because of some stuff that I actually learned about. We need to talk about another podcast. I was at the musical instrument museum a couple days ago in Phoenix, Arizona.

Highly recommend great stuff on jazz, Steinway pianos, other pianos. I mean, truly a glorious place for a musician. But, you know, this thing that was developed by Steinway in the 1800s about doubling up the strings and having them come around. I forget the name of it. But basically, so it's striking multiple strings. So you get the interaction, even if it's perfectly. in tune of the sound, but it's very different from on a single, well, in this case, I guess it's bars like on a roads, right?

Same thing for the world, where you're striking almost like a vibraphone in there that then is electronically amplified. It's a little time, yeah. A little time, exactly. But you get just playing, you get some movement, some decay, some texture there that you don't get with the piano. So I think when you go for those smaller voicing, you can have some interesting. you can play the exact same things that you do on an acoustic panel, sure, but sometimes you don't have to, which is kind of cool.

It's true. I, you know, like I said, Peter, I play a 200A on a lot of gigs, man, even jazz gigs. I really enjoy it. It's not great for everything, but like it's not super ideal for swinging, for tipping, you know. But for anything else, just because the dynamic range doesn't really help us out, you know. But for anything... Maybe. No.

That's beautiful to me. then. But for anything groove based, man, the whirling will get you there. Yeah. But you don't actually need a lot of thicker chords. And I think it's just because the overtones are so much heavier. Yeah. It's more pure tone. Yeah. And so... And it does have that movement

in it. It does have that movement in it. Like if you play a C major 9 Pierre. Beautiful, right? That's thick. That's very thick. Play a C major in the second inversion. Just C major triad in the second inversion. With the root on the bottom. That's pretty.

be great. Like that's to me where the Worley shines. Yeah. Are triads. Isn't that beautiful? Just little trides, little seventh chords, you know? I mean, I do think about, I don't even consciously like, and now I'm going to restrict my extensions when I'm on the Worley, but you just do. Yeah, this is root and shell. It sounds awesome. It sounds awesome. Now do a big, like, C-13-11. C-13-11. Now play it as like a punchy chord, right?

everything gets kind of lost. It's not like a piano. Oh, what about this? That's great. Yeah, that's without even the 13. That's great. Okay, let's stretch Keyescape even more. We're going to go Rhodes.

Let's see, classic. Let's go Rhodes Classic suitcase. We're going Classic suitcase. Here's the classic suitcase from Keyscape. And Peter, if you can, maybe... Yeah, let me turn it. That's got a little chorus on it, right? Got a little chorus on it.

Slow tram, slow light tram. Now this gives you a little bit more. I think the roads, especially this classic suitcase roads, and this by classic suitcase, this is a roundtop. This isn't the later flat top models, which we could get into. But the round top, I think it gives you a little bit more flexibility, as far as like a little bit thicker chords.

I still wouldn't play exactly the same. same as I would on the piano. And like the inner voice movement is so different than a piano. Totally. You can do it. But like, check it out. You know what it is, man? Oh, it sounds great.

But you know what it is? It's almost like the same thing that happens with a B3. There's just not what's great about the piano, really, especially a great, you know, Big Steinway. I thought you was saying, especially a nice spinet. No, no, no. Well, I mean, even some spinnets, though, the dynamic range is so incredible. Yeah.

It really is incredible that I think with a lot of electric pianos, You just don't get that. Right. So on the roads, like, you want to take notes out of sort of, like, the voicing. Right. Right. Where they're still played, but they're in the background, which you can do on a piano. Yeah.

You can do that on a Steinway. You can voice your chords in a way that something stands out more than another. Keith Jarrett is like a master of this. So is Herbie, actually. But, like, it's hard to do on a roads because there's just not as much of a dynamic spectrum. Right. You know? It's almost like within one chord.

Like you're getting that sustain. Yeah. And that inner stuff can mean almost more than on a piano. But then there's less chance to really affect the nuance between. I mean, it's pretty, but it's harder to do really dramatic stuff. It is. But again, if with articulation. I would say that, like, if the Worley is great for triads and seventh chords, the roads, like, play like an F minor 11.

Nothing better. There's nothing better. You know what I mean? That sounds better to me than on a big Steinway. It just has a vibe. Right. Right. You know, like something like that or like a G minor triad with a C in the bass.

That sound, right? Or like, here I'm going to get in. Can I get on on the fun? Yeah. This is a vintage vibe here that we have. Right? It's a little bit thinner. but

well that's different than it's a little bit different yeah is that what our vintage vibe's gonna sound like I don't know we'll see but yours sounds so good man but this yeah right

you are the sunshine of my life stuff right F sharp over E it's almost like a cross between a whirly at a brood's right the vintage vibe yeah yeah I'll see if I can go to do you know that of course you know that progression

but like an F sharp over E F over E F over a flat, it's literally a F triad over A flat. Like that's what I'm saying ninth chords, I think. This isn't a harder fast rule, but it's like

to me that's where the instrument shines. I think it's one of those things like it's not that you can't do it. It's just like each instrument has a strong characteristic. Right. And you want to just use your ears and play it. So absolutely. And so one thing that is fine with this setup, but it's actually not ideal,

I would say it's like the kind of a because of the chorus maybe. right yeah yeah we turn well if we turn the tremolo off oh that's pretty as the tremolo's so on but the chorus is off right there's uh the tremolo's on it should be off oh is there another one there's a keyscape roads here that just says roads

classic wah juicy trim let's check it on real quick hold on okay here it is look out everybody look out nice little chelesta there well there you go birch hope that answers a question did we answer the question? No, but we still have it. Okay, great, we can try again. No, no, yeah, yeah, we did. We asked,

asked, answered and re-answered. Well, I think the, the answer your question, Bert is your instincts are correct that your ear kind of naturally goes towards things. Burch was playing some cool stuff while he was talking. So he was, man, you know, but it happens even on acoustic pianos from piano to piano. Yes, absolutely. And maybe even more so in a way on, well, with Rose and Whirlets is just more dependent upon the condition of them for sure and what, you know, what effects you have on it or whatever. But I mean, piano is just like, like we mentioned earlier, just have a bigger range between instruments and a bigger dynamic possibilities in a lot of ways. But to me, I think, you know, Rhodes, Worley's, they can do a specific thing so well.

Totally. You know what I mean? Totally. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you, Birch. And we'll be back here on Wednesday. For another speak pipe, first listen, went?

No. We'll see what we have. We'll see. If you want to leave us to speakpipe, go to you'll hear.com. Hey, by the way, if you're listening to this on Monday morning, which is when this truck. Yes. Join us today. Today.

p.m. Eastern. Wait, let me thrust myself into the future. There. I'm in my DeLorean. I'm there. You're there later today. Four p.m. Eastern. Yes. On Monday, when you're listening to this, brand new, because I know you all waited with... 29th. The 29th. We'll be live... My sister's birthday. Happy birthday, Nancy. Happy birthday, Nancy. We'll be live over on the Open Studio YouTube channel at 4 p.m. Eastern for live, you'll hear it. Our first one in a few weeks. Come join us and hang and ask some questions. We might play a little bit of this. Random keys. Ah, and lift them.