Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Amy Porterfield: Break Free from the 9-to-5 Trap & Build a Business You Love | Entrepreneurship | YAPClassic

Episode Date: August 22, 2025

Trapped in corporate life and chasing external validation, Amy Porterfield faced the life-changing decision to either stay safe in her job or take the leap into entrepreneurship. Choosing the latter, she quit her job, became an entrepreneur, and built a multi-million-dollar online business. In this episode, Amy shares her secret to starting a business and achieving lasting freedom in entrepreneurship. In this episode, Hala and Amy will discuss: (00:00) Introduction (01:38) Her Leap From Corporate to Entrepreneurship (10:05) Choosing Between Freedom and Security (13:14) Two Weeks Notice: Planning Your Exit Strategy (22:46) Business Mistakes and the Importance of Boundaries (32:00) Identifying Profitable Ideas and Audience (38:21) How to Build a Valuable Business Offer (45:45) Why Websites and Email Lists Matter  (56:39) Top Revenue Strategies for New Entrepreneurs Amy Porterfield is an online marketing expert, bestselling author, and host of The Amy Porterfield Show. Having generated over $120 million through her email list, she teaches entrepreneurs how to create and scale their side hustle or online business. Today, Amy has empowered more than 100,000 students worldwide to achieve financial freedom and flexibility through entrepreneurship. Sponsored By: Shopify - Start your $1/month trial at Shopify.com/profiting Indeed - Get a $75 sponsored job credit to boost your job's visibility at Indeed.com/PROFITING  OpenPhone - Get 20% off your first 6 months at OpenPhone.com/profiting Airbnb - Find a co-host at airbnb.com/host  Mercury - Streamline your banking and finances in one place. Learn more at ⁠⁠mercury.com/profiting⁠⁠  Policy Genius - Secure your family’s future with Policygenius. Head to policygenius.com/profiting  Framer - Launch your site for free at Framer.com, and use code PROFITING Resources Mentioned: Amy’s Book, Two Weeks Notice: bit.ly/2Weeks-Notice  Amy’s Podcast, The Amy Porterfield Show: bit.ly/TAPS-apple  Active Deals - youngandprofiting.com/deals  Key YAP Links Reviews - ratethispodcast.com/yap YouTube - youtube.com/c/YoungandProfiting LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/htaha/ Instagram - instagram.com/yapwithhala/ Social + Podcast Services: yapmedia.com Transcripts - youngandprofiting.com/episodes-new  Entrepreneurship, Entrepreneurship Podcast, Business, Business Podcast, Self Improvement, Self-Improvement, Personal Development, Starting a Business, Strategy, Investing, Sales, Selling, Psychology, Productivity, Entrepreneurs, AI, Artificial Intelligence, Technology, Marketing, Negotiation, Money, Finance, Side Hustle, Startup, Mental Health, Career, Leadership, Mindset, Health, Growth Mindset, Passive Income, Solopreneur, Founder, Networking

Today's episode is sponsored in part by OpenFone, Shopify, Mercury, Indeed, and Framer. OpenFone is the number one business phone system. Build stronger customer relationships and respond faster with shared numbers, AI, and automations. Get 20% off your first six months when you go to openphone.com slash profiting. Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you grow your business. Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify.com slash profiting. Mercury streamlines your banking and finances in one place so you can focus on growing your online business. Learn more at mercury.com slash profiting. Attract interview and hire all in one place with Indeed. Get a $75 sponsor job credit at Indeed.com slash profiting. Terms and conditions apply. Framware is the designed first,

no code website builder that lets anyone ship a production ready site in just minutes. Launch your site for free at framer.com and use code profiting to get your first month of pro on the house. As always, you can find all of our incredible deals in the show notes or at young and profiting.com slash deals. What's up, young and profiting. Are you stuck in the 9-to-5 grind, dreaming of building a business that gives you freedom instead of just a paycheck? If so, you don't want to miss this episode.

In the CAP classic, I spoke with Amy Porterfield. a leading online marketing expert and a pioneer in digital course creation. Amy went from corporate employee to building a multimillion dollar business online, and now she helps thousands of entrepreneurs do the same. Amy reveals how to quit your job with confidence, find your perfect business idea, and scale without burning out. You'll also learn why your email list is your most powerful asset,

how to create valuable offers that convert, and how to protect your boundaries so you can profit with purpose. I left her discussion feeling inspired and recharged, and I know you guys will too. So sit back, relax, and enjoy this conversation with the one and only Amy Porterfield. So I'd love to learn about your journey before we get into all of that. So I learned that you actually started in corporate at Harley Davidson, and then you worked for Tony Robbins, and I had no idea you did that. And it was so clear to me that, wow, like that six-ish years that you worked at that company,

you must have really realized what was possible working for somebody like Tony Robbins. So talk to us about your experience at the company. What were you doing? How did it inspire you in terms of becoming an entrepreneur and starting all these digital courses later on? Yeah. So I'll actually start a little bit even before I got the job working for Tony. I was at Harley Davidson, like you said, and I was doing marketing at dealership levels.

and I had broken up with a boyfriend, and I was devastated about it. So every night I couldn't sleep, and I would lay on the couch and just watch TV in the middle of the night. And Tony's infomercials would come up all the time. I think there's some stat, like every minute of the day, there's a Tony Robbins infomercial somewhere on TV. And so at the time, this is many, many years ago. So I would say, this is over 20 years ago, I was sitting on this couch watching these

infomercials and thought, this guy knows his stuff. and I need to change my life around. I'm depressed. I'm in a weird place in my career. I just need to make some moves. So I was really inspired by what he was teaching and I kind of got into that world a little bit. And once I did, I realized this is an amazing company. I love the people who work here. I want to work for this company. So fast forward about a year and I applied for a job, move from Ventura, California to San Diego, California and started working for Tony. And I was a content director, which meant that I got to work on the content that Tony does on stage, like unleash the power within, date with destiny. If you know Tony Robbins, you know those events.

And I got to work on the content, which meant I got to travel the world, I got to pitch and catch with Tony and his team, and really just learn what it's like to take control of your life, change your mindset, and go after what you want. So you're right. It was a huge inspiration in my life. and I was about, let's say, six years in, and there was this one fateful meeting where Tony was bringing in a bunch of online business owners into the San Diego headquarters. Now, this is very humbling. I was called in to take notes. So I wasn't invited to the main table. There's this big oak table in the middle of the conference room. All these guys, they were all men. All these guys were around this table. And I was at a side table taking notes.

And Tony said, tell me about your businesses. Because one thing that Tony does well is he finds people that are crushing it and he dissects how they're doing it. And he was doing more and more online business with his own digital courses. So he's like, tell me what you guys are doing. And one by one, they went around the table and they talked about their businesses. Now, if you know anything with online marketing or online business building, Frank Kern, Jeff Walker, Ebbin Pagan, Brendan Bouchard, these are some of the people that were at the table. At the time, I had no idea who they were. They're like the grandfathers or the OGs of online business building and marketing. and so they went around and they talked about their businesses. Now, they talked about the courses

they were creating, the masterminds they had, the products they had. All I heard was freedom. These guys were working when they wanted, how they wanted, where they wanted. They were making a huge impact and lots of money. And the fact that there were no women at the table kind of rocked me a bit, but I thought, I don't know what these guys are doing, but I want a piece of it. And it was the first time in my life that I thought, I am not free. I do not have freedom. I'm not working when I want, how I want, where I want, but I want that. And so it took me about a good year from that meeting until the day I drove out of the San Diego headquarters and started my own business. So during that year, that's where I kind of built a formula for how to quit a job and

start a business. But that's what kind of kicked the whole thing off for me. I love that. That's a really inspiring story. Let's talk about how you acted in corporate. For my understanding, you were really obsessed with external validation. And that really impacted the way that you showed up to work. Can you talk to us about that? Yes. So I was all about the praise, the raises, climbing the corporate ladder. You said jump.

I said how high. You say you need it. I'll give it to you yesterday. I was obsessed with Tony and the team thinking I was incredible and wanting me to climb that corporate ladder and do big things. And so that external validation, that's where I found my worth. If you said I was doing a good job, I felt great. But if I didn't feel that external worth, I didn't think I was worthy, which is a huge problem of itself. And it kind of goes back to had a really strict father. And so when he was

proud of me, I felt like I was on top of the world. When he wasn't, I didn't think I was that great. And so it started with my dad, I guess I had some daddy issues, and it went into my corporate world. But yeah, that's how definitely I navigated that. Yeah. And one thing that I want to note is that you didn't just graduate college and decide you wanted to be an entrepreneur. You were in the corporate world for almost a decade, right? And you got those experiences. You got those role models, those mentors. And then you decided, well, I can take this on my own and start to dabble in it and find something that sticks. So you mentioned before that you were in this room and it was a total boys club. I think you became an entrepreneur. What was it, 2009? Yeah. Is? Yeah. Did you feel like that was really strange for a woman to become an entrepreneur at that time?

Like, was that really unheard of? Very few examples. Very few examples. I looked around and all I saw was men doing it. And funny enough, in 2009, 2010, the men were like standing in front of the Ferraris talking about making money while you sleep and showing the private jets and the bro marketing kind of feel was alive and well. and that's all I knew. And literally, that's what my marketing looked like. Now, I didn't stand in front

of the fancy cars or whatever, but I had a lot of masculine energy in my marketing in the beginning because I was learning from all these guys. But yeah, that was really my only example. There were a few women for sure, but it was very rare. And now, even fast forward to 2023, yesterday I was at a John Maxwell entrepreneurship event. And it was invite only. And literally there was maybe 40 men. And there was some men's wives, like two wives and Heather Monaghan, who is the one who invited me. Yes. And I was like, it's 2023 and there's two out of 40 people are women. There's so much work that needs to be done still with women becoming entrepreneurs. It's so true. And it frustrates me when I see that. I recently was at a mastermind where there were more men than women, but the person putting

it on said to me, who do you know? Let's get more women in the room. It was a guy that was saying this to me. And I loved it, and I invited all my entrepreneurial friends to come with me. And the women added so much value to this table that we were at. But days before that, there wouldn't have been any of those women there. So we, I think, as women and men, we need to speak up and say, like, who's in the room. I do that also with people of color. I used to be in these rooms 10, 12 years ago, and it was a bunch of white dudes. That's all that was in the room. So at least now I'm seeing more diversity, but that's because I'm asking for it. it. Other people are asking for it. We got to speak up.

100%. And I also am noticing the trend of men being like what women are out there and wanting, like people don't want this to be the case, but it just is the case. So let's talk about freedom. You've said in your book that people care more about freedom than they do security. What do you mean by that? Well, I want people to care more about freedom than security, but I think what stops people in their tracks is that they are valuing security more. And what I mean by that is when I was in my nine to five job, I had only known corporate up until that point that I decided to go out on my own. I really liked the paycheck every other week, the health insurance. That tends to be a big thing for entrepreneurs. What am I going to do about my health

insurance? There's a lot of solutions for the record, but we tend to think like, this is security. I'm getting a paycheck every other week. I have insurance. I have paid time off. I am safe. And if we value safety over freedom, we don't take the risks, we don't get in the game, we sit on the sidelines, and we absolutely are playing small. So over the year, if the day I had that meeting happened to the year that went by where I decided to find the courage to leave, I had to start valuing freedom over security, which meant that I wasn't sure if I was going to make enough money right out of the gate. I had to research to figure out where am I going to get this health insurance if I'm not getting it from an employer. And what will it look like

on my own making decisions? I've never made decisions on my own in my life until that point. So it was a mindset shift that needed to happen over time. Yeah. And I feel like these corporate companies, they put these golden handcuffs on people, right? So this idea of benefits. And I remember when I was quitting my job at Disney to become an entrepreneur, I was so worried about benefits. And then it turns out it's like $600 a month, $700 a month. Not a big deal. It's really not. Big deal. In your head, it seems like it's this huge burden that you're going to have to take, but it's really not that serious. And the other thing I want to point out is that there's risks on both sides. Staying in corporate, not staying in corporate. There's risks in anything

that you do, right? It's so true. Would you say that everybody has cut out to be an entrepreneur? I want it, actually. And the reason I know this for sure is because I have a sister. She's two years older than me. She's been a school teacher since the day she got out. to college and she's really good at what she does. And she looks at my life as an entrepreneur where I travel a lot and I'm on stages and I do podcast interviews and I have a team. So I have the stress of other people's livelihoods on my shoulders. She looks at that and wants nothing to do with it. She has no desire to hustle and make things happen and put yourself out there and get out of your comfort zone. She loves the work she does and she feels safe. And she values safety over

freedom and that's just who she is. There is nothing wrong with that. Imagine if everyone were an entrepreneur, we'd have some issues for sure. And so we need both types of people. So no, I don't believe everyone should be an entrepreneur. I believe people listening to a podcast like yours have it on their heart to explore it. And likely, if you're listening to something like this, you should be an entrepreneur. You should go after it. So it's just really what you desire and what you want. And so this book that you recently wrote. I think it came out just in 2023 this year, two weeks notice. I love the book, by the way. I highly recommend that everybody go out and read it. What compelled you to write this book? I have been in business for 14 years. So I am best known for helping people take their knowledge,

know-how, and skill set, and turn it into a digital course. So I've generated over $85 million in course sales, helped over 50,000 people in my courses, start businesses, start digital courses, all that. But I didn't want to write a book on how to create a digital course. I have a program on that that's already locked in. What I realized is my biggest struggle was taking the leap from nine to five into entrepreneurship. What does that look like? What's the roadmap? How do you do it in a way that you can almost guarantee your success? How do you get over all those roadblocks and those mental limiting beliefs that stop us in our tracks? And I look back at that year that I kind of put together a plan to leave corporate and I was terrified at every turn. This is the book I wish I had so it would

have been easier to make that transition. I love that. So we're going to spend a majority of our interview really talking about some of the strategies people can take to transition out of their job, pick a business idea, pick an audience, help them pick something that's going to be revenue generating. So let's start with what you call the unbossing process. You say that we need to schedule a date to remove ourselves from the corporate world, why do you suggest that we do that? So this is the first thing. If we're going to put a roadmap together for you to leave your job and start your own thing, the first thing we're going to do in this idea of unbossing, becoming your own boss, letting go of the bosses of the past, you've got to choose a date.

One thing I learned from Tony Robbins is you've got to schedule it to make it real. And so if you don't have a date of this is when I'm leaving, you're going to continue to kick that can down the road. Like, I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. You're going to get nowhere. And so what I want you to do is say, okay, I'm going to leave this job. Is it going to be in three months, six months, nine months or a year? Anything over a year, you're making excuses. And when you choose that date, you're writing it down on a post-it note. You're putting it on, let's say, a mirror where you get ready every day. You have to see it every day. And you ask yourself, what is one thing I must do today to move me closer to that date? I'm going to give you an

example of what that might look like. So when I was still at Tony Robbins, I put the date on the calendar. At that point, it was six months away. When I decided to choose the date, it was six months from that date. And every day, I wanted to do something to move me closer. So one day, there was this woman online that had a business like I wanted. She had digital courses. At the time, she had a blog, podcasts weren't really even a thing. She would show up on social media in a really cool way. I loved her website. I just loved everything about this woman's business. I didn't know her, though. And so I sent her a message and I said, look, I know you don't offer this, but can I pay you

for an hour of your time and talk about how you grew this business? I'm really impressed with what you've done. I'd love to pay you. And she wasn't a big creator yet. And so she said yes. And I was so excited. I love when women support women that way. So the day that the call was going to happen, I had this little office with thin walls at Tony Robbins.

I crawled underneath my desk at my lunch hour. And at the time, I had to lay in line. grabbed the landline, pulled it under with me, and whispered through the whole conversation. I'm sure she thought it was weird, but I was terrified someone was going to hear me and I didn't want anyone to know of my plans yet. So I asked her, how did you create your first digital course? What did you do to get your blog set up? How much money did it cost to get started? And she shared it all with me. She's still my friend to this day. So that was one thing I needed to do to start understanding the direction I wanted to go. So you've got to choose the date.

Okay, so you choose the date and let's say you say it's six months out from now. I'm going to quit my job. And then you do what you call a runway, which is basically a plan to accomplish your exit. What should we think about in this runway period? I like the advice that you just gave of calling up somebody and getting advice from somebody who's done it before. What else should we think about? So another thing you want to think about is, although it's scary, we got to look at our finances. We've got to look at how much money do we have right now? How much debt do we have? how much do we need to bring in when we go out on our own? So when you go out on your own, your first year you're going to sacrifice. You're not buying new wood floors for your house or a new car or going on vacation. You're going to sacrifice that first year. And so if you're willing to do so, you've got to figure out how much money do I need to make each month just to get by? We're not rolling in cash just yet. We need to give ourselves that runway to figure this out. And so you start to kind of look at your finances and ask yourself, do I need to save a certain amount of money before I leave. Now, I thought I had to save tons and tons of money. I might have had $2,000 in the bank

when I left. So I don't think you need a big nest egg. So let's not get crazy here, but you might need to save some money or get out of debt. And that could be in your six-month plan or your plan before you leave. Getting clear on your finances is really important. Another thing that you want to do is start to ask yourself, should I have a side hustle? I love a good side hustle. So for me, what I did is I started to take clients on the side doing their social media. Was this the end all be all for me? Did I want that to be my entire business? No. But I needed to do something that I could do right away that I could figure out quickly. So in the mornings, nights, weekends, I would work with clients on their social media as my side hustle to bring in a

little extra money, but more so just to prove that I could put myself out there and do this. So I'm a big fan of a side hustle, whether it's you create a course, a membership, consulting, service-based business, whatever it might be, but just something on the side to give you that courage to get going. Yeah, I have a very similar story. You know, I started YAP Media as a side hustle doing social media services. And services are the easiest thing to start. Because if you know how to do something that you get paid for in your regular job, you can then become a freelancer and people to pay you for it. And you don't need a website. You don't need to build anything new. You just need yourself. Once you figured out, all right, I've got my plan. I know when I'm going to

exit. You've got to actually give your notice. And sometimes giving your notice can be really scary. It can pull up a lot of emotions. It can make you think twice about your decision. So what kind of emotions typically happen or turn up during this period of when you have to actually give your two weeks notice? And how do you recommend that we do this without burning bridges? So the first, thing is, before you give notice, you're likely going to want to tell a few people of your plans to get support. Be very careful who you tell. So I only told three people. I told my future husband. He wasn't even my husband yet. I told my mom who thinks I could land on an unidentified planet. She believes in me more than anything. And my best friend, three people knew throughout that six months

because I knew I was really vulnerable at the time. If I told somebody I was going to do this and they told me all the reasons it wouldn't work, which people will, I would have believed them. Recently, I heard the story from Sarah Blakely, who started Spanx. And she said, when I cut the feet out of my panty hose and created the first prototype of my product, I didn't tell anyone because if they told me it wouldn't have worked, I would have believed them. And that's exactly how I felt back in the day. Be careful who you tell. Not everyone could hold your dream. And so that means that that pesky, nosy, coworker of yours probably doesn't get to hear about. your plans, and that's okay. So protect your heart, protect your dream, because it's important.

These are very vulnerable times. So now that you've told a few people that are going to cheer you on no matter what, you're going to start to think about, well, how am I going to quit? For me, it was important that I did not burn bridges with Tony Robbins, but also with the company. I loved the team I worked with. And so what I did is I actually asked if I could start to work from home a few days a week. The company was in a little bit of a transition, so things were moving around so it was a perfect time. So I worked from home a few days a week and that gave me a little extra time. I didn't have to commute so I could work on the side hustle. Then I actually asked to go part time in my role and just manage these two events that I was doing and that was it.

And they said yes. I had worked there a while. I was in great standing. So they kept saying yes. And then eventually I gave my notice. And I gave a month notice and said to two weeks because I was there for a long time, and I knew the transition would take a bit of time to train somebody else. So I did what I felt was appropriate to really keep that bond, but also I had to be careful because I needed to burn the boats and storm the island, another thing I learned from Tony, meaning once I let go and left, I couldn't look back because the allure of my nine to five job and working with Tony Robbins and having that regular paycheck was very sexy to me. And so I didn't look back, meaning I didn't take odd jobs with them.

I didn't become a contractor with my 9 to 5 position. I did cut ties, not relationship-wise, but money-wise. I was out on my own when I left. And that was important as well. So I took these baby steps to get there, but when I was done, I was done. Yap, gang, I recently heard a stat that really made me pause. Nearly half of American adults say they'd face financial hardship within six months if they lost their primary income earner.

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your business finances, you'll love Mercury. Ready to see what powerful banking can do for your business, visit Mercury.com to apply in just 10 minutes. Disclaimer, Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. For important details, check out the show notes. Talk to us about what your first business look like and some of the mistakes that you made with that? Oh, so, so many. Okay, so the first thing I did was I took that side hustle and I just made it a full-time thing, which was really helpful, meaning I was doing social media for small businesses. So I had two clients when I left, and then I put some feelers out there. I didn't have a big following or anything like that. So I told friends of friends, hey, I'm for hire. This is what I do. I do social media for small businesses.

got a few clients in there. So I was making enough money to cover my bills. And my goal was to make enough money to meet the salary I was making at Robbins, which I think at the time was around $160,000. So I wanted to make $160,000 in that first year. So I had a goal and I had to get the clients. I was doing social media for them. And the truth is I hated it. I hated this business that I created. One of the biggest mistakes is that I was desperate. I was so scared of not making enough money that I freaked myself out at every turn and was terrified I was going to lose a client. And so I really, if I could go back and talk to that girl, I'd say, let's chill out just a little bit. We're going to be fine and we don't have to like be so desperate and hold on to

everything that came our way. So I said yes to everything that came my way. And I was a yes girl to my clients. I'd get on a phone call with a client and we would leave and I'd have 20 action items to their one thing that they needed to do over the next two weeks or so. Like, I didn't know how to set boundaries. So I resented my clients. I hated them. I hated working with them. I hated the work I was doing. And I did this for two years. And then I realized, this is worse than a nine to five job. I feel like that freedom, where is it? And I think there was this idea in my head that I'd be sipping my ties on the beach with a laptop in my lap. Like, I thought that was entrepreneurship. I really do think that sometimes we're sold a lot of junk that's not true. So I had to reevaluate my

expectations. What does entrepreneurship look like? What do I want out of it? And how can I change this business model? So two years in, after I had no boundaries, taking clients I didn't want to work with and starting to feel burnt out and resentful, I thought, I need to change my business model. It just wasn't for me. It was for a lot of other people. They love one-on-one work. I didn't. And so that's when I decided I'm going to create a digital course teaching, marketing, instead of working one-on-one. I really love this idea of one to many so that I could make as much money as much impact as I wanted. So slowly but surely I transitioned into digital courses.

I love that. And I can relate because I remember when I started my social media agency, I still have my social media agency, but I set boundaries now, which we'll talk about in a second, which keeps me isolated or more isolated from my clients so that it doesn't become a situation where I have 30 bosses instead of one because when I first started, it would be like everyone's calling me directly on my cell phone. By the way, that's a boundary now. I don't really want my clients to call me on myself. My legacy clients that I've had forever that are now my mentor's different situation. But new clients, they don't get to call me on my cell phone, right? So setting boundaries is

super important, especially when you're creating something like an agency where you're going to have multiple clients that you have to interface with. It is going to be impossible to satisfy all of their demands. Also, this idea of being a yes person when you have an agency where, for example, if someone's like, well, I don't want your exact service, but I want these specific little elements of it. And then I want you to add this. If you always say yes to that, you're going to be a mess because your team's not going to have consistent processes. Everybody's going to be nuanced. that's not how you scale and get better and become an amazing agency, right? So talk to us about these non-negotiables.

This is what you call them in your book and boundaries and some of the examples that you should be setting as an entrepreneur. So after two years of hating the business I started and things not working out, I realized I need to have some non-negotiables, which basically is what I do or do not do no matter what, full stop, period. And so one of the non-negotiables that I created is that I am not one. working every night and every weekend. The first two years of my business, I work seven days a week. There is no doubt about it. My husband was a firefighter, so he was gone every other 24 hours,

so I had a lot of time on my own, and I was using every minute of it. And so, of course, that's going to create burnout. So one non-negotiable. I stop at 6 p.m. and I don't work most weekends, once in a while, but not every weekend. That was one of them. Another one was my husband actually said to me, like, I never see you. We're two ships in the night right now. And it scared me because I was newly married at the time. And I thought, okay, I need to get my priorities straight. And so I know this seems kind of silly, but one of the non-negotiables was a few days a week, I would have coffee with my husband in the morning. Instead of rushing and getting on my phone right away and starting to work like I was doing, which is very unhealthy, like I'd roll out of bed

and work. We can't create a business that way. So I'd slow down in the morning. I got a morning routine that had to do with working out and eating healthfully in the morning and spending a good 30 minutes with my sweet husband who values quality time over anything and just be present with him. So that became a non-negotiable that I committed to, his name is Hobie, I committed to Hobie that I would do that and we would be present. We still do that today. This morning, we had our non-negotiable coffee time 14 years later. So it's really important to us. So it's basically thinking what matters to you? What are you willing to do and not willing to to do. When I teach this to my students, a lot of them will say, I'm no longer taking a client at a

desperation of making money. If I don't like that person or want to work with them, it is a no. That's my non-negotiable. So you've got to think about where you're struggling the most and where do you need some boundaries and rules to take care of yourself. Something that I want to ask you about, you mentioned that for two years, you didn't set any boundaries. I was very similar for like four years. I just worked seven days a week. But I don't regret it. I always talk about how I don't regret sacrificing that time. I feel like I wouldn't be where I am now. And now I do have freedom and boundaries and all these things. But it was because I set up a foundation. So do you feel like there's a place for sacrifice and

sort of just nose down, grinding, hustling and things like this? Or do you feel like it can be possible while setting boundaries? I feel like this question says so much about how you and I are the same because absolutely I think there's hustle. I think you have to. I tell my students, in the first few years of growing your business, you're going to make sacrifices. You're going to work more than maybe you want to work, but you have to say yes to opportunities

because you don't know what's going to work or not and what you like and what you don't. So I agree with you. I don't regret any of that time. It was hard. You know, I say two years. It definitely spilled into years after. It just kind of looked a little bit different

once I had non-negotiables, but I still worked more than I should have. and I think I could have stopped it sooner. But I would say at least the first two years, you're making those sacrifices, you're working more hours than you'd like, because we've got to set up that foundation. So I don't know if realistically there's a way around it. Yeah, I totally agree. So something else related to boundaries that I love that you talk about in your book is called

Tiger Time. Tell us about Tiger Time. Okay, so Tiger Time came about because there were things that I wanted to do in my business that I knew would move it forward, but I never made Tiger Time. for. So, for example, I wanted to create my first digital course, and it took me a long time to start it because I never made time for it. And I would say, my clients need me. I need to be there from my clients and doing all the things. So my new business model kept getting pushed to the side. So I created this thing for myself called Tiger Time, which meant there were chunks of time

in my calendar, two hours here, an hour there, that no one could penetrate. I was like a tiger with her cubs, nobody could get in. I was going to protect that time. And I would be very clear about how I would use that time. So this two hours on Tuesday morning, I'm going to create the outline of my first digital course. This hour on Thursday, I'm going to write a promo email to promote that course. But I was very intentional. Now, it was just a few hours a week in the beginning because I had all these clients, but I knew I'm never getting out of this business model and into what I want to do if I do not make the time. Schedule it to make it real. I live by that. And so Tiger Time is what I teach my students that you should have a few hours at Tiger Time every week for the stuff that

matters most that you're not getting to. I completely agree with you. At Yap Media, me and my executive team, we have no meeting Wednesdays. So the entire Wednesday is just a focused day. We're not allowed to schedule any meetings, nothing external, internal, and it really helps us ensure that we've got weekly time to work on our priorities because you can just get distracted by all the different people and the opportunities that are going on, but this ensures that we have focus time. So I love Tiger Time. I love the way that you named it. Let's get into actually discovering our business idea. As an entrepreneur myself, I have a lot of people who are always asking me, how do I think about what side hustle to create, what business to create? I want to be an entrepreneur. I don't know

where to start. Or they'll be like, I have so many ideas. I'm not sure which one to pick. Can you Tell us about how they should go about picking their business idea. Okay, so I've got something called the sweet spot formula to help people come up with their initial idea for a course, a membership, one-on-one coaching, consulting, whatever it might be. So there's four different quadrants, and the first quadrant is your 10% edge. So when I say that, what I mean is what results have you gotten for yourself, both professionally and personally? We're going to look at all of them.

Where do you excel? So you've gotten results for yourself or for clients, customers, a family member, a friend, and you can teach how you got those results or you can help other people get them in whatever capacity you want. So we're looking for your 10% edge. The reason I say 10% is you do not need more education, more certification, more time. You likely already have something that you can start, but our brains tell us we're not ready. That's very, very normal.

So we're just going to be 10% ahead of those we serve. We're going to lay out the roadmap, show them. how to get it done, but let's not think we have to be the expert of all experts just to get started. So we're looking for your 10% edge. Most people have a few different areas where they would excel in. The second thing, the second quadrant, is who do you want to serve? So when you think about what you're good at and where you've gotten results, who can you serve in terms of a solution for them, meaning they have a challenge or a pain point or they have a desire that you could meet. So a challenge, pain point, or desire, what is it? So let's get clear on what do they

need and how are you going to solve it? We need to align those two quadrants. The third quadrant is your profit generating opportunities. So if you think, okay, Amy, I'm really good at meal planning. Let's say you took nutrition classes. Maybe you are a nutritionist. You want to do meal planning for people virtually. You're really good at that. That's your first idea. Remember, it doesn't have to be your end-all be-all. What I started with 14 years ago looks dramatically different with how I make millions today. So we're just going to start somewhere. So when you think about, okay, I want to meal prep for people virtually, ask yourself, are there books about it, podcasts about it, other courses about it? Are people consulting or coaching in this area? Are people spending money to have you do what you want to do for

them or learn it themselves? And if the answer is yes, that's your first initial validator. Now, what happens is, because I teach people how to create courses, they'll say, well, there's already courses on the topic I want to teach. And I say, ding, ding, ding, that's a great thing. We don't need to be first to market here. We need to prove that people are spending money here. And if there's other products doing what you want to teach or do, that is a great validator. Let's take that as a win. There's enough room for all of us. It's a mentality we all have to adopt. The fourth and final quadrant is, does it light you up? Notice I did not say, is this your passion in life, your end-all, be-all thing? No. You just

got to enjoy it because you and I both know if you're going to teach on it or do it, you're going to be eating, breathing, sleeping this topic. So you at least need to enjoy talking about it a lot or teaching it or doing it, whatever it might be. So again, what's your 10% edge? Who do you serve? What is their challenge or desire? Where's the profit potential? Are people spending money in this area and does it bring you joy? This is the first initial step to start to come up with your idea for your business. What you're saying is so important, especially doing some research on, is there a market here? Are people actually going to spend money on this? I think the biggest thing that I see people mess up on is they create some problem that nobody has. And then they're

like, nobody's buying my stuff. It's like, well, nobody wants it, right? There's no demand for it. Exactly. Another important piece is picking your audience. And I always tell my students, your audience is your choice. Don't forget that your audience is your choice. I love that. And you can decide whether or not you're going to work with people who can afford services or not, whether or not you're going to work with audiences that are like finding a needle in a haystack or not. And it's really important.

So what are the things that you think about? And I know I think you call it a customer avatar. What are the elements that you need to plan and try to research about your audience? And what's your advice for selecting an audience that's going to convert? One of the fastest ways to choose who your audience is, and this is what I see with a lot of my new students just starting out, is they were their avatar. It's one of the easiest ways. It doesn't have to be, but one of the easiest ways, and this was me, I struggled with creating courses and marketing courses. I had no idea what I was doing. So I was my avatar. I know what they feel,

what they think, where they struggle, where they get stuck. I know everything about my student because I was my student. So that is one of the easiest ways to get started. But that's not true for everybody. So you don't have to be your student. And one of my students, he's a male, he's like 30, and he teaches women in their 60s how to get fit. He was never a woman in his 60s, but he's done enough research to learn. He's interviewed them. He's asked him questions. He's listened more than he's talked to them so he understands them inside and out. So it can go both ways. But I love that you say you could choose your audience because sometimes my students will come to me and say, Amy, I want to sell XYZ, but I can only charge $47 because my students are on aid. They can't

even afford it. They're getting scholarships for school. They have no money. They'll never be able to afford me. And part of me is like, yeah, let's choose a different audience then. Why would you set yourself up for that kind of hardship? It is true that some audiences cannot afford you. choose your audience wisely. The beautiful thing is this happens over time. You don't just lock it in one day and it's there forever. My ideal customer avatar has absolutely changed over the years to the point that now I'm really clear who she is.

But I wasn't sure in the beginning and you have to experiment. So let's talk about ensuring that you've got a valuable offer that people will say yes to that will convert, right? So what are the elements of a valuable offer? Like, how can we tell if our product or service is going to do well in the market? Okay, so the first thing is going back to that research. We've got a research. What's out there?

What are people paying for? Who are your competitors? What are they selling? What are their price point? What does their audience look like? We're going to do some research. I'm not talking about six months of research, but some really quality time where I want you to document what you're learning and what's out there.

So that's one of the things we're going to do is we're going to create. create an offer. But once you start to sit down and put together your offer, you need to really pinpoint the challenge you are solving or desire your meeting, but it's usually a challenge or a pain point. So I want you to have a statement at the top of a Google Doc where you're taking your notes, this is the challenge that I am solving. These are the results that I am promising. Now, this is very clear because when you start to create whatever it is you're going to put together, it always comes back to, but is this true? Whatever I just put together, is it going to solve this problem?

Whatever I just put together, is it going to meet that challenge where my students are at or clients or customers right now? And a beautiful offer takes into account, let's say the core thing you offer. Let's say you're going to do one-on-one consulting and you're going to take five clients. So your offer is one-on-one consulting. Okay, for how long? Let's say you say six months. You get six months of one-on-one consulting.

Now, get clear on what that is. Is it every week they get to talk to you? How long do they get to talk to you? How do they talk to you? Is it through Zoom, Vox, or Slack, whatever it might be? So you've got to set those expectations early so people know what they're paying for. So get clear on what you're offering. Another part of the offer is the price point.

So playing around with the price point is very normal. What I always suggest to my students is, let's start a little bit lower and go higher over time. It's very awkward. this firsthand going high and then feeling like you need to bring it down. It's just an awkward thing with the people who paid the bigger amount of money. And I've been there before. Sometimes mistakes are made, but I'd rather see you gradually increase your prices versus having to take them down. So we're going to come up with the price point. Another part of your offer is, is there a payment plan? So I've had a lot of success over the years with my one-on-one consulting and with my digital

courses to offer a payment plan to make it an easy yes for people to get involved, especially when I was a no name. When no one really knew who I was or what I could offer, making it easier for them to get into business with me with a payment plan always worked out well. So if that makes sense for your offer, I'm all about it. And another part of your offer is the guarantee. So for a digital course, it might be 30 days, 60 days. For consulting, you can kind of play around with what if they're not a good fit? How do they get out of it? Whatever it is that you want it to be, you're the boss. You're the creator. Make sure it feels good to you, but then you've got to communicate it. The only thing that matters is expectations. They are very clear what they're

paying for and what they get. So these are some elements that make a really beautiful offer. Yeah, bam, picture this. Somebody who is crucial to your business unexpectedly quits. You've got just a couple weeks to fill that position, you've got no time to waste. So what do you do to hire fast? Well, that's easy. You've got to use Indeed. When it comes to hiring, Indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get seen on other job sites because Indeed's sponsored jobs feature helps you stand out and hire faster. So here's how it works. Your post jumps to the top of the page for relevant candidates. So you reach the right people quicker. And the results speak for themselves. According to Indeed data, sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed, receive 45% more application. than non-sponsored jobs.

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That's all lowercase. to Shopify.com slash profiting. Again, that's Shopify.com slash profiting for your $1 per month trial period. So this podcast is called Yonge and Profiting. How can we ensure that we're going to be profitable with our offer? What are the things that we need to consider?

Okay, so number one is you've got to stay on the field. And what I mean by that is I made $267 with my first offer I put out there. $267. I thought I'd make $100,000. I looked online. Everyone else on social media looked like they're making millions, which we know now. That is not true. But I bought into it and I thought, I'm going to make $100,000.

Put out my offer, crickets by the end, $267. I cried for a week. I thought it meant I'm not cut out to be an entrepreneur. If I took that and said, I'm not cut out to do this, I need to go back to a 9 to 5 or change my business model altogether, I wouldn't be sitting here. with you today with the success that I've had. So we have to stay on the field. It might not work the first time. It might not work the second time, especially if you're just starting out. But if you're willing to figure out what didn't it work, why didn't it work, can I try something new? Are you willing

to fail? That is so important. I know you, because you're so successful, you must have had failures along the way. Am I right? Of course. I've never met a successful entrepreneur who can't tell you their battle story, their battle wounds, show you their battle wounds and say, this was a disaster. There's a chapter in my book where I did not want to tell the story. It's near the end. And I tell a story of the fact that I brought on a partner in my business. After I'd hit almost a million dollars in revenue, I still believed I couldn't do it on my own. And I brought a partner. He was a younger guy. He was awesome, very strategic. And through the next few years, we did big, big things together until the partnership didn't work, which tends to happen with

partnerships. And I had to get out of it. And it was a disaster and I almost lost my business. It was the one thing in my business that took me to the ground. We were this close away from literally dissolving a business I had created that was making millions because we couldn't agree how to get out of it. We didn't have a good contract. I made a million mistakes with that. Now, fast forward to today, I did get out of it. I did get my business back and thank God, hallelujah. But that brought me to my knees. But it needed to because I am a totally different person today with what happened during

that partnership. Like, I don't even recognize that girl anymore. I wouldn't trade it for the world. Let yourself make the mistakes. Can I ask you, how much equity did he have in the company? Okay, so here's what happened. I'll tell you real quick. So I had almost made a million dollars in my business.

we were in a mastermind together. I went to him and said, hey, can you help me with X, Y, Z? And he said, I've got a better idea. Take me on as a 50-50 partner. And we will explode this together. I was three years into my business. And I'd like to tell you that it took months for me to decide. I'd like to tell you I went to my mentors. I went to a lawyer. I talked it out. One night's sleep. One night sleep. And I woke up the next morning and I said yes. No, no. He got 50% of my business. there was a very loose contract, and I blame myself for all of it. It was that I can't do this alone. I did not believe in myself, which is why I talked to my students about really owning what

you're capable of and allowing yourself to make the mistakes. You do not need anybody else to guide you. You've got it in you. I didn't believe this when I was three years in. So you got 50% of my business. I did get a little extra off the top because I had started it. Regardless, trying to get out of that was the scariest thing I've ever done. We ended up going to mediation, thank God, hallelujah, and we came to an agreement, but it took a whole year of my life of thinking I have made the biggest mistake ever. So it was rough. Well, I'm happy that you got that figured out.

So let's talk about building a website. You actually say that it's one of the most important things that you can do. So why do you believe that it's so important to have a website and not just sell on social media or your DMs or something like this? Social media is fickle. That algorithm can change like that. We've seen it with Mark Zuckerberg, now Elon Musk. They could change anything and our whole business will change. So a website is your hub. It's what you own and you want to drive traffic to that. Sometimes people will say like, well, if I put out a podcast, do I drive to iTunes? No, no, no, no. We want a central hub where we're going to bring people to us and they can engage with our content there.

And so the thing is, though, it doesn't need to be a beautiful website. 14 years ago, I think I had the ugliest website on the web, and I made a million dollars with it. Now, today, because I'm showing my age here, I've been at this for a while, you can get a template that's gorgeous that will blow any website out of the water. So today it's so much easier to have a beautiful looking website. I don't think that's important, though. I think the content is important.

I think you creating weekly original content and posting it on your website is important and being very clear about how you serve people. There's elements that are important, but it should not be something that you're waiting to start your business for six months because you don't have a website yet. That is an excuse and you do not want to do that. I love that you called that out because I was going to call that out too. A lot of people procrastinate thinking, oh, I need a logo. I need a professionally designed. I need a professionally designed website. Don't go spend $10,000 on your website. Go get a free trial from Shopify, Shopify.com slash profiting. It's a dollar for three months. Boom. There you go. And it will take you two days to create your website. Like, that's all you need to do. And

anybody who can use a computer now can build a website. You don't have to like overcomplicate it or anything. So let's talk about email lists. Why do you believe that email marketing is so valuable? Because I know it's one of the top things that you actually speak about. What value do you see in creating an email list. You own your email list. Those names and emails that raise their hand, they said they want to be on your list, they want to hear from you. You own that. You do not own social media. So that's my point about social media is fickle. The algorithm can change. And boom, your whole business could change overnight. But when you have an email list, you have a captive audience. And an email list converts four times higher than any social media post when done right. I can't even imagine having the business I have today without putting a focus on growing an email list. Yeah. And I have to say that I only started, and I'm kicking myself for this, I only really started my email list a year ago. It would be so much bigger now. And I've gotten so much ROI from it and so many opportunities from my email list. It is one of my biggest regrets is that I didn't start my email list sooner. So what is your top, and let's get into quickfire. I'm going to ask you a bunch of questions. What's your best advice for getting email subscribers? Number one, you've got to have a great lead magnet. You don't need to have five of them. Let's just start with one. cheat, cheat, checklist, 10 minute video, quick audio, something of value that people are willing to give away the hot commodity of their name and email in exchange for this freebie. You got to have a

freebie, but it's not enough just to say, I have a freebie or post about it in your bio. Let's talk about it at least once or twice a week driving traffic to it. Another one is that you have to have it as an intention in your business. Like the top three things you do, list building has to be something that you're very intentional about. You have to be intentional in terms of setting it up, email service provider, freebie, making sure that people know you have an email list, and emailing every single week. I know not everyone agrees with me, but I'm going to put a stake in the ground here. This is what I believe. Every single week, you should have an email going out, same day, same time. What the email's about is up to you. Mine is, I've got a new podcast episode, just came out,

here's what it's about. This is why you don't want to miss it. Click here. my downloads would go down every week if I did not send this email. It's a huge part of my growth for my podcast. And so every week, every Thursday, you're getting an email from me. That's full of value. Or you could just send an email that gives a story, gives value right there in the email where they're not clicking anywhere or you're just walking through some of your methodology or whatever it might be. But I want them to hear from you every week because when you're ready to sell, they're used to seeing, opening, and engaging with your emails. I love that. And I love it that your email is not salesy. That's every week. You're actually

offering education and value. And we learned that from Neil Patel. He says 80% education, 20% selling. Agree, 100%. Okay. So let's talk about what is your best advice for improving open rates? Okay. So there's a website called subjectline.com. And I love it. And it's free. And it's fantastic. but you've got to pay attention to those subject lines. A few things you could do. Whenever you see a great subject line that grabbed your attention and you absolutely opened it up, put it in a swipe file. Keep it to just give you some inspiration. No copy it, but let it inspire you when you're stuck next time with the subject line. Also, using a tool like subject line.com allows you to test a few different subject lines and get some ideas for them. So I think that's important as well. And also play with

the length, longer, shorter, you've got to experiment. But here's the thing. None of of this will work if you don't track it. A simple Google Doc where you are tracking your open rates week after week with looking at that subject line and what it was to start making some correlations is important. We need to know our numbers. Not a hundred different numbers in our business, but there's a few core, especially with email marketing. I want to know my open rate. I want to know my click-through rate and I want to know my unsubscribe rate. And I know like with subject lines, I always think of them as like the thumbnails of your email, right? It gets people to click. really important to have pattern disruption, all of that. What is the best way to actually increase

click-through rate and ROI from your emails? So number one, you'll increase your ROI when you get your audience in the habit of opening up your emails and engaging with them. That's why that 80% value, they're more likely to click on a sales link when you are promoting because they know they can trust you. So weekly emails with value is very important so that you can sell more. Another thing is that link, if you want someone to click the link, let's say I want them to click a link to go listen to my podcast, I'm not just having one link in that email. You know the top, in the middle, on the PS, like three different times. It's a link that says, like, click here or here's the podcast title and they click that. So it's just to make sure you have it more than once in the

email. And the same URL. Same URL every single time. Yes. That's another thing. You do not want an email with two to three calls to action. I just have one. There's one thing I want them to do every time I send an email. It could be something different, but there's one goal with every email. Okay, my last question is like, what kind of automated email campaigns are you doing for your business? Ooh, I love this. Okay, so we do a lot of many chat and DM strategies that are automated. So when we're talking to social, we do a lot of automation where I might make a video and say, okay, type in the word simple below and I'll DM you a link to my latest podcast episode about how to simplify your strategies, that kind of thing. But we also do it with lead magnet.

So we grow our email list using this mini chat DM strategy all automated. That helps us grow our email list, but that's not email marketing, obviously. Another thing that we do is we have an entire automated campaign to a webinar. The webinar is about list building. And I teach for about 40 minutes and then I tell people about my digital course about how to get started with email marketing. And so we run ads to this funnel. We email my list about the funnel. We use social media to get them into the funnel. But this is an automated campaign that runs every single day and is a multimillion dollar maker in the business. So it works really well. But I love using funnels and automated email sequences for webinars that then sell my courses and products. So when somebody

first signs up for your email list. Do they get like an automated welcome? And if somebody checks out of your, you know, to get a course and then they don't convert, do they get an abandoned cart? Are you doing that kind of stuff with your email marketing? I am. So to answer that second question, let's say somebody gets into one of my sequences, my email sequences, and they watch the webinar, they do not buy. And afterwards, they will get an automated email inviting them back, reminding them of the value what they're going to miss out on. So we do a lot of email sequences after the fact. We absolutely do a cart abandonment email as well. So if someone goes to my sales page, if they're already in our system, we have their email, they're clicking around, they don't

buy, they're going to get an email as well. And so, yes, we do that type of automation. And then also, when someone joins my email list, depending on where you're coming through, we do have onboarding sequences where we welcome them. We tell them what they're going to get in my community. We might suggest a podcast episode or two or my book or something to get them into the fold. And we might send two or three emails where that's all they're going to get. They're not going to get anything else that I'm sending out. Once they're through their onboarding sequence, then they'll start to get my weekly email. Okay. So last question on email. My favorite way to get subscribers now is do these free webinars and people, when they sign up for the private Zoom webinar, they put their

email, their name, and then we're collecting all these emails. So far has been the fastest way to grow my list. What is your favorite lead magnet? Exactly what you just said. So we do free webinars and that is the biggest, fastest way to grow our email list because you're offering amazing value. Now, we sell on our webinars, but I always have this motto. No matter if they buy or not, they walk away feeling excited, inspired and driven to take action. So you get massive value when you get on. But the second way we've grown our email list to great success is with a quiz. So a quiz is a great list builder. People love to learn about themselves, whether it's what does your favorite Halloween candy say about your personality to what kind of course creator are you? Like there's so many different kind of quizzes

out there. But people love to learn about themselves. And once they get the results, you could show them the next step that they should take. Quizes work like gangbusters. for list building. What kind of platforms can help you generate a quiz? There's one called interact and bucket.io. So those are the two that we've used, interact and bucket.io. Awesome. So let's talk about revenue strategies. I know we have very little time. So you recommend three main strategies for revenue generation for online entrepreneurs. Can you quickly go over those strategies and then we'll close out? Yes. So one of them, you can do one-on-one coaching consulting. That is a business in it of itself. And you learned so much about how to serve people

when you create a business model such as that. Another thing you can do is a service-based business where you're actually doing the work for them. And it's a great entry point because you don't have to create the course or the membership of the mastermind. You're just doing the work that you already know how to do. So it makes it a quicker entrance. But both of those options are trading time for dollars. So in my opinion, you don't want to stay there too long. Find a business model that's one to many. I'm biased. Digital courses would be the third way that I think is a great business model where you create a course one time and then you launch it over and over and over again so that you have that recurring revenue and it's one to many. So there's so many different ways

you can get started online. I think my biggest advice is let's just get started because how my business looked 14 years ago versus how it looks today is dramatically different. So don't overthink all those decisions you're making in the beginning. Just get started and it's going to work itself out over time. Young and profiteers, I know that there's a lot of you out there that are corporate professionals and want to be entrepreneurs or side hustlers that are looking for a plan to quit your 9 to 5 job. So I highly recommend you get two weeks notice. I loved the book. Amy wrote it beautifully. It's so practical, actionable, easy to read. So I highly recommend you get that. We'll put it in the show notes. Amy, we end our show with two questions. The first is what is one actionable thing

our young improfitors can do today to become more profitable tomorrow? Start growing your email list yesterday, but the next best time is today. I totally agree. I couldn't agree more. And what is your secret to profiting in life? And this can go beyond financial. Getting really clear about what you want and in owning that. Whatever it is you want. You want to live on an island. You want to get married with a bunch of kids. You want to be a millionaire. You want a homestead. Whatever it is, own it. But get clear about that so that you can start making decisions toward that. And where can our listeners find you and everything that you do? And what do you think is the best resources that you have available for my listeners? I think my podcast would be a great

place to start. It's called online marketing made easy. If you love podcasts, which I'm guessing you do, go check that out. I talk about list building, course creation, entrepreneurship, building an audience and everything in between. So online marketing made easy. And then my book, two weeks notice, you can grab it on Amazon. Thanks so much for asking. Of course. And we'll stick all those links in the show notes. Amy, again, it was such a pleasure to have you on. I've been looking up to you as another female podcaster in this space for a long time. We're both in marketing. So you've been such a great role model. Thank you for everything that you've done for me and other women out there. Thank you, my friend. I feel the exact same way about you. So

thanks again for your time. Thank you.