Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Jennifer Cohen: Bigger, Better, Bolder. How to Get the Life You Want by Being Bold | Entrepreneurship | E204

Starting point is 00:00:00 I get this question a lot, and that is, do you have to be born bold? And the answer is no, absolutely not. I think boldness is a skill. Like anything else, if you want to become good at karate or Spanish or whatever you want, you need to practice it and you could get better at it. And I think of boldness is the same way. People feel so uncomfortable asking for such little things. Like if you are uncomfortable asking for these little things, how are you going to get comfortable asking for the bigger things. We need to learn how to be resilient. And the only way you learn how to be resilient is to actually fail and then pick yourself up again and try again and again. What is up Young and Profiters? You're listening to Yap Young and Profiting Podcasts

Starting point is 00:00:53 where we interview the brightest minds in the world and turn their wisdom into actionable advice that you can use in your daily life. I'm your host, Halitaha, aka the podcast princess. for listening and get ready to listen, learn, and profit. Jennifer, welcome to Young Improfiting Podcast. Thank you. Howell, this is great to be here with you. I am so excited.

Starting point is 00:01:29 I love having my friends on the show. It always makes for a more natural interview. I know we're going to have a lot of laughs and learn a lot. So I'm looking forward to introducing you to my listeners. And Young Improfitors, Jennifer Cohen is a woman I highly respect in the self-improvement and podcast space. She's an entrepreneur, a brand strategist, a podcaster, and a fitness trainer. And she's considered one of the most influential people in health and fitness and one of the

Starting point is 00:01:53 most impactful fitness entrepreneurs in the world. Jen's world famous clients include Hollywood celebrities, Olympic athletes, top CEOs, and so many more. And she's also the author of three books and the host of a top podcast called Habits and Hustle, which is actually a new addition to our Yap Media Podcast Network. And on Habits and Hustle, she's interviewed people like Mark. Cuban and Tony Robbins and celebrities like Chelsea Handler and Matthew McConaughey. So it's an awesome podcast.

Starting point is 00:02:20 I hope you guys check it out. It's Habits and Hustle. And today's episode is going to be focused on Jen's recently released new book. It's called Bigger, Better Bolder, Live the Life You Want, Not the Life You Get, where she brings readers one step closer to boldness, one chapter at a time. And so in this episode, we're going to learn how Jennifer climbed the top of her space and created her dream job, how boldness is a skill that anyone can learn. and we'll also get the 4-1-1 on how to develop a 10% mindset.

Starting point is 00:02:48 So, Jennifer, today you're top of your field, but you didn't always think of yourself that way when you were younger. And when you were in school at a young age, you were regularly sent for extra tutoring because of your poor performance. And one day, your mom told you that your teacher had called you average at best. So let's talk about that. How did that experience shape you as a young person? That's a great intro, Hala.

Starting point is 00:03:13 you know, thank you for that. It's amazing. I never was a great student. And I always thought that was my big Achilles heel, right? That I wasn't smart enough, that I wasn't talented enough or athletic enough. And over my journey, what I really recognized and what I realized was all those things really take a backseat. And the most important thing for success in anything, it could be professional, it could be personal, it could be whatever you are and trying to do. It's boldness is and was the secret sauce for me to get me from where I wanted to go. So when people had these laurels that they can rest on, right, if they're like super intelligence, there's a reason why they say, you know, the fortune favors the bold, not the brilliant, because it's actually very true. When you really think about these people

Starting point is 00:04:00 who actually really get to really high heights of success, it's because they actually went after what they wanted. They were bold enough to ask for what they wanted to go after. They chased what they wanted versus just taking what they got. And when I noticed that at a young age, that's when my life really took a pivot and really changed for the better. Yeah. And so I loved learning about you.

Starting point is 00:04:23 Me and you are friends. We chit chat all the time, talk on the phone for an hour here and there. And I didn't really know about your come-up story. And I come to find out that 12 years old, you got your first job at Olive Garden. And then from then on, you just sort of crawled your way to the top

Starting point is 00:04:39 and created your own dream. job later on, which was just so incredible to see. And I know that you always say that you see yourself in May when you talk to me. And I never understood why. And it's because we're both two really scrappy women who don't take no for an answer. And so I'd love to have my listeners understand how you went from, you know, Olive Garden, hostess to then becoming a fitness trainer for celebrities. Well, by the way, let me just say one thing. Both of those things were not things that were available to me. Like how I even got into the fitness business was a total fluke. It wasn't my trajectory, right? And I'll get to that in a second. But when I was 12 years old, all my friends

Starting point is 00:05:20 wanted to get jobs to make extra money and they naturally thought of babysitting as their only option. And even at a young age like that, I never really thought that myopically. I thought, well, what are the options available? And then let me like place myself in one of those places. Because I didn't want to babysit. I wanted to make more money or what have you. So I did notice that the Olive Garden was hiring was a new place near my house. And I walked in and asked the manager if I can work. And he laughed at me, obviously, because I was a kid. And you can't usually have kids working at a place where there's like a liquor license. So that was my first entree, so to speak, in being bold, where I created an idea and an opportunity for myself by suggesting myself being an

Starting point is 00:06:09 greeter where I would stand outside the restaurant opening the door for people as opposed to being inside and seating people. And that way, I'm not on the premises technically. And I think that he was so taken it back that I would actually even think of an opportunity like that when I was such a young person. He just said, sure, he gave it a shot. And that was when I first noticed like, I think I might be on to something where it's not just about what's available and what people think in their box of what's available is the only thing that is. I mean, you have to take agency and this is what I really talk about and this is something that it's part of my platform, my philosophy is that if you want something to happen for yourself, you need to take agency

Starting point is 00:06:55 and ownership of your own life and go after it. And you can't rely on other people or other people's perceptions of what you should do and what society tells you to do to be the destiny of your future. So changing and reframing that type of mindset is crucial. And so that led me down a path of always looking at things a little bit differently than other people. And so when I wrote this book, it really was something that I wasn't speaking, I'm not, I'm not speaking from this white ivory tower of what you should do because I say so. It's, more like, you know what, I'm just an average person from a small town and these things happen to work for me and a lot of other people that I know who's actually reached

Starting point is 00:07:42 success that they never even thought imaginable. And the through line through all of it is that they actually were bold. And so I just kind of talk about all these little experiences of bold moves that created this life. And that's how I view it. This is how I want people to think about it. It's a reframe of how you shift and take on life. We were talking before how your teacher called you average at best. How did that make you think about life in terms of asking for what you want and taking bold moves? Because that was sort of the only way you could get what you wanted, right? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:08:20 And I think that if I was to be honest, I would say that kind of gave me like a little bit of a chip on my shoulder, right, where I felt like I had to prove something and prove myself because, of what she said about me. And I felt like, well, I'll show her type of thing. But you can use that type of negativity as fuel for you achieving and going after certain things. And I don't believe in staying down for very long. I believe like, yeah, I had to like lick my wounds, so to speak, and it was not easy to hear. But then I think being mediocre is actually a superpower. I think having mediocrity kind of helped me build grit and be resourceful because I had to learn how to do those things versus somebody who was just always naturally super smart. They can rest on their laurels.

Starting point is 00:09:11 They never had to build character. They never had to build these other ancillary traits and skills because they can just rest on the fact that they were always told they were the smartest or the prettiest. what I noticed in life is that if I really look at where they are in life and versus the other people that were mediocre, the imbalance is very obvious. 100%. I always look at who I graduated with from college. And I had a terrible undergrad. I graduated with a 2.3 GPA because I was in my sorority, partying, cheerleading, escaping my parents, you know. And so I look at people who graduated with a 4.0 in undergrad. And I'm like, wow, I sort of skyrocketed. compared to them. But that's because to your point, when you're smart, you think that life is just all about taking tests and everything is just easy and you don't realize how to be creative, I guess, or how to get what you want without playing in the lines. Yeah, I just feel like you don't have, you're not forced to figure it out. I feel like recently I did a talk at MIT, which is obviously

Starting point is 00:10:18 MIT is where the smartest people in the world go for college, right? And I did a talk under this program that they created called fail, which is about resilience. And I thought to myself, this is really kind of ironic, right? Here I am at the school where the hardest school in the world to get into with the most smartest people in the world. And I'm talking, me, I am talking about failure and resilience to these people. Super surreal moment. And the reason why they even have that program and developed this program was because people

Starting point is 00:10:51 who are always used to winning when they fail. they can't handle it. And this particular situation was based around the fact that the suicide rate at MIT is so high because when they do fail, they don't have the wherewithal to understand and figure it out versus someone like me who has failed so many times that I had to kind of learn how to be more resilient and I'm more desensitized to failure because it's happened so often that when it happens now, I'm so immune to it that I don't care. I'll just get right back. up and I'll try again, you know, and that's why when people ask me about this, I say, you know what, I have a master's in failing, but I have a PhD in getting myself right back up and trying it again.

Starting point is 00:11:36 And it is the truth, and this is the point that if you are somebody who you think that you're just average or mediocre, that actually is a strength. That is a superpower for you. That is not a weakness. And that can work to your advantage over and over again if you just, implement these small things to kind of create the bold life that you want. And so for me, you don't have to be what your brain says you are. You have the power to change whatever that is. I don't believe in like you were bored on this life to kind of find yourself. I believe in a life where you create yourself. Yeah. And I do want to get into the content of your book, but I want to spend time for my listeners to really get to know you, Jen. You have created

Starting point is 00:12:23 this bold life, right? You started in the music industry similar to me, and then you literally ended up creating your own dream job leveraging, your network, everything that you had learned in the past and your passions. I would love for you to tell that story of how you made that transformation. So, yeah, I was working in the music world, I'm Canadian, and I was working for a record label in Toronto. I got a job offer, and I went to work for another label, Sony, in L.A. And the job was fantastic. Like, listen, like I was a young girl, super young. I basically did very well. I was kind of like on the fast track at that age to where I was going in the marketing department. And I got this job and it was a cush job making much more money than I thought I would make in the U.S.

Starting point is 00:13:12 versus Canada. Great office, doing great things. And then eventually the music industry started to really shift and change. And this is back when budgets were very different. We didn't have we had now. There's no such thing as Spotify and these streaming platforms. The job started to change and I didn't love where it was going. It was becoming much more of a digital play versus the ANR aspect, which is like artist relations, which was what I was like kind of like my sweet spot. And how old were you at this point? I don't know. I was probably like 25. 25 years old, 24. I was the youngest executive. Everyone else was at least 78 years older than I was. And I want to tell the listeners that when you're Canadian and you get a job in the U.S., for those who don't know, we have a working visa.

Starting point is 00:14:04 So whoever sponsors you is where you have to work legally. And if you don't have that job, you kind of have to go back to your country or else you have no other means of making money until you find another company to sponsor you, right? So when I quit my job, I really had no other means of making money. And I didn't want to go back to Canada. I wanted to stay in L.A. I love the weather. I love the lifestyle. So in that moment, I thought, you know what, I'm going to go to school. I'm going to become a personal trainer, just kind of like a placeholder until I figure out my next move. So that way, I can make some money and then I can get paid under the table. And that way, then I can buy some time until I figure out my next move. And that was really my intention and plan.

Starting point is 00:14:46 Like, I didn't really have more than that. I had a direction. But I didn't really have more than that. I had a direction, but I didn't really have much of a destination besides that. So I did that. But as I was going through getting my first certification, I have all this background and skill set, like transferable skills from being in the music world, knowing how marketing budgets work, knowing how that world works. Basically, I went back to the label I had a relationship with. And keep in mind, when you work in the music world, you know lots of people in the music space, and like in any industry, not just in the one place that you work, but I knew people at different labels all over the place. So I had this idea and I went back to one of the labels I had a relationship with.

Starting point is 00:15:27 And I said, listen, I want to talk to you about an opportunity. I want to become a label trainer where I would train the talent and I would get paid like a finite amount of money, a retainer, no matter if people show up or not. And I know how the marketing budget works. I know how the money is allotted. Let's do that. And in my brain, that was a much better way. of making some money versus me doing what I was originally going to do, which was having a ceiling

Starting point is 00:15:55 and being making some cash under the table, right? This way, I basically guaranteed money and I have an opportunity for this label to sponsor me. Therefore, it would be much more kosher and it would work out better. And the guy laughed at me and said, what do you know about training? I'm like, well, I have my first certification right here and I know how to work with talent. Give me a shot. and with a little bit conjoling and ever saw it, whatever else, he agreed and gave me a shot. And it turned out well. And one label turned into two, turned into three. And then lo and behold, I was like this trainer to like all of these different record labels where I had to hire a bunch of trainers underneath me to like train people because there was only one me. And I created an entire

Starting point is 00:16:42 fitness business by just a kind of a fluke by going down and different direction that I was otherwise doing, but I used the opportunity from all the other skills and like I said, from the background I had. And I combined the two into my own opportunity. And that changed the entire trajectory of my career. And like I said, you got to take ownership, you've got to figure out and you've got to create your own opportunities. And that's how it started. I love that story. It reminds me of this concept that I always talk about called skill stacking, where basically you take all the experiences that you've had before and you put them together in a unique way.

Starting point is 00:17:20 And something that I'm curious about is that, you know, I know you pretty well. I'm like you don't really like social media, right? You know you have to do it and you do it. You ended up blowing up on Instagram. And I'm talking about real Instagram followers, not all these like, you know, influencers that buy their followers and things like that. You ended up really growing on Instagram. How did that happen?

Starting point is 00:17:41 How did you start to build your brand? Because I think you even had a, of sneakers at one point? And so how did you get so well-known and blow up like that? There's like a big gap right in between. Not to age myself, but like at that time, there was no such thing as Instagram and there was no such thing as social media. And I never thought out to be an influencer by any stretch. But my career took so many different evolutions. I wrote some books in the fitness space. I actually started some companies in the fitness space. My last company was a fitness app that got acquired by Weight Watchers five years ago.

Starting point is 00:18:18 This stuff had nothing really to do with like social media. But I think what happened eventually was social media or followers or whatever you want to call it was more of a byproduct of the other things I was doing. I wasn't seeking out that. That to me wasn't the business I was going after. And you're right. Like I'm not someone who's loving that stuff. I feel like it's something that it has to happen.

Starting point is 00:18:40 and it's like a full-time plus job. But I never really concerned myself what everybody else was doing. I really concerned myself of what I wanted to do and what was good for me in terms of like my skill set, my strengths, my weaknesses. And all of that stuff happened way, way after. If you focus on being really good at what you do and what you're doing, all that other stuff, people will know. Like you have to be so good that people,

Starting point is 00:19:10 find you that it's so loud that people can't help but notice versus what's happening now, which is people are trying to have these big platforms on social media when they know nothing and then hope that people will show up in the world that I remember and where I'm from, it's like you need to do the reverse. You need to be so excellent at what your craft is and learn it so well and always be learning and always be up on it that all that other stuff becomes the byproduct. And I think that people just have it wrong a lot of times. And that's why I also feel that people have to be very wary of who they get their

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Starting point is 00:23:01 people like you said. They don't even have an expertise, but they want to teach. Jen, you are one of the most, you know, networked people that I know. And you always tell me this. I do business in real life, right? And sometimes that matters more than this social media world or matters just as much, right? And we'll get into social boldness. But let's introduce your book first. Okay. So you wrote this book, bigger, better, bolder, and you did it right off the heels of the pandemic, right? So why is it more important than ever for people to be bold after we just went through this pandemic for over two years? I think that it's really important. I think number one, it was actually off the heels of a TED talk that I did that went viral. I did that TED talk right when the pandemic was happening.

Starting point is 00:23:49 And what I noticed was, and what I think happened, is that people realize that life is short. And you have one time to live. It's a finite time. So why live in a place of good enough when you can actually try to self-actualize to who you want to be and what you want to do? The reason, again, that I wrote this book was for people to have a rich life. And that's not about money and cars and planes. I mean, that's not what I mean by a rich life. What I mean by a rich life is a life that is fulfilling and satiating to you with meaningful relationships and experiences.

Starting point is 00:24:27 And a lot of times we don't even attempt at getting a lot of that. And we just kind of settle for what's in front of us because we have a lot of self-doubt or we don't think that we are good enough, which comes back to that whole average or below-average comment that you and I were talking about. And so I think it struck a chord when I did that TED talk because what happened was it did so well, I went viral. And because of that, I noticed that there was a real need for people to have that assurance and that extra boost, a nudge, I should say, of trying because of the fact that. that life is so short. And I think what the pandemic did, it just showed us that we want to

Starting point is 00:25:13 enjoy our time as much as possible and we want to be fulfilled as much as we can. And just kind of like phoning it in isn't okay. And it's not good enough. And so if we can move that pendulum or that needle a little bit to actually create what we want, even better. Yeah. And so you mentioned this phrase, not good enough, right? And I know in your book you talk about, about the good enough mindset. What is wrong with this type of mindset and how can we escape that kind of a mindset? You escape it by not putting up with it anymore. You know, this is not a magic pill. It's about having a little bit of self-awareness. And from that, knowing and looking at your life and being like, okay, you know what, where am I phoning it in? Where could I improve? Where do I want to

Starting point is 00:26:03 improve. Where am I just kind of just taking what's in front of me? I mean, if you really do kind of an inventory on your life, not you personally, I'm saying in general, right? And if you think about all the people that you ask like, oh, how's your marriage? It's okay. Or how's your job? Man, it's all right. Everything is just in this, eh, it's okay. You know, status quo place. And I find that to be really upsetting, right? And by the way, I'm not any different. I'm not singling myself out. I think it happens with me too. So you've got to constantly do this self-assessment and be like, where is this happening? You've got to really zero in on those places and attempt, attempt at making it better versus just being okay with this good enough idea. Like, I'm getting paid enough.

Starting point is 00:26:49 My girlfriend is fine or my boyfriend is fine or my husband is fine. We want to strive for better. We want to strive for the best. And that to me is self-actualization. You don't want to look back at your life and feel like, you know what? Yeah, I could have done that, but I didn't. I prefer, in my opinion, I'd rather have a ton of rejection than a little bit of regret, right? Like, regret's the worst thing. That, to me, stays with you forever. Rejection, you get over it a little bit. Like, you know, it never hurts for a second and then you move on eventually after a day or so. But regret, like, I should have. What if I did? That's like gut-wrenching. And to me, that's where I'm trying to shift people's mindset from going away from that

Starting point is 00:27:37 into a place that's much more authentic to who they really are. I think that's super powerful stuff. And I couldn't agree more. I want to dig into a quote that I found in your book. And I think it's really important. You say, asking and failing and asking again is the foundation of boldness, which I think is really, really interesting because it's so true. You've got to ask for what you want.

Starting point is 00:28:01 So I'd love to hear more on that. for me. If you ask for something and the answer is no, how do you look at it, Hala? You look at, and I know you. I don't think of you as someone who's going to be like, no, okay, and then just kind of like walk away and never attempt again. You probably are similar to me where you think, well, that no means not right now. Yeah. Right. Of course. Right. And because of that mindset and that reframe of how you look at that, that's why you're successful. That's why you create these little wins for yourself. It may have not have happened that day. It may not have happened the next day, but it eventually will happen, either with that particular thing that you want, or by you continually

Starting point is 00:28:42 trying, another opportunity will present itself that you never knew existed because you got yourself up and you didn't think about that no as the worst thing that ever happened to you. And you have to think about something as what is the worst thing that can happen? If we thought that in every situation, people would make way more attempts to get closer to what they want. Like, what is the worst that can happen? Like, okay, that person said, no, all right, I'll try again later, or maybe I'll do this thing, or I'll be able to that thing. But it's not about you being extraordinarily talented or extraordinarily smart. But what sets you apart is that you are persistent, you're relentless and tenacious, and you don't see it as the end-all be-all.

Starting point is 00:29:26 right? And so it's kind of like the squeaky wheel gets the oil. These are all sayings because they're actually true, right? Yeah. These are saying because these are actually truisms. And I think that what happens is we try to complicate these very simple truisms in life versus just taking them for what they are and then acting on them. And I want to go back to what we were talking about in terms of the good enough mindset because I was going to say something before and then it like flew out of my head. They're actually weak spots. All those things that you were talking about in terms of, oh, your relationship's mad, your work is meh, anything that you feel mad about is something that could collapse and is a red flag

Starting point is 00:30:11 in your life that you need to look at and then see how do you actually make that stronger and like you said the best. And that takes making bold moves, right? So I'd love to understand your definition of boldness because I have a feeling it's a little different than what we all think. Well, from what you just said about this, like these red flags that are put on these situations, I have this whole theory and I put this in the book actually, these three Fs, which is this farm it, fix it or forget it versus just dwelling. And to me, if you have a weakness, there's three things that you can do about it. You can fix it. You can farm it out. You write delegate to elevate, right? Or you could forget it.

Starting point is 00:30:57 Accept it for what it is and move on and don't let that slow you down. I talk about this also. It's like I always hated my nose, right? Like as a kid, as an adult, whatever. I never like it. You can look at it now. And it made me feel like, oh, I was so ugly. I wasn't this. I wasn't that. And eventually I'm like, well, I didn't farm it out, right? I didn't fix it. So I had to just eventually forget about it. And then I never really thought about it again. It didn't really slow me down.

Starting point is 00:31:25 Maybe in my own head or maybe someone that thinks I'm not as attractive, who cares? But if you can find these pillars or compartments to place these weaknesses that you feel are so hard and weak into one of these buckets and then let yourself kind of move past them and go, you're not allowing that thing to be a way. you're not allowing that thing to be a weight on your shoulders. Love that, by the way. Thank you. And it's the truth, right? Like, we all have these things about us that we don't like about ourselves, right? We all do. And then we let that one thing stop us from going after whatever it is, that guy that you like, that job, whatever it is,

Starting point is 00:32:03 as opposed to figuring out a way to deal with that one weakness to not let that hold you back from your whole life. ahead of you. When I was younger and there was a guy I liked, right? I let the fact that I thought I had a big, bad, ugly nose hold me back until I figure it out like, all right, I'm going to forget about that. If I liked somebody, I was going to ask them out. I wasn't going to just go out with the person who asked me out. To me, that's like putting agency and ownership in someone else's hands and then I'm only doing what someone else is offering me. Going back to the asking, right? Ask for what you want. Don't just take what you get. Exactly. And it's, It's just, it's very freeing when you're able to do that with a weakness.

Starting point is 00:32:45 And then you lean into these strengths. Because we all have strengths, just as we all have these weaknesses. If we really lean into those strengths, we can dominate and not let those weaknesses be the ones that are dictating our life choices. Yeah, I love that. So Jen, you break down boldness into two categories, social boldness and self-actualization. So I'd love to first talk about social boldness. you are truly an expert in this space.

Starting point is 00:33:13 I think this is honestly one of your best qualities, in my opinion. Social boldness is about getting what you want in your career, relationships, and connections. So I'd love for you to explain what that is and how we can put it into practice. Yeah, social boldness is the reason why that is there, by the way, also, is that you could be bold in one area of your life and not be bold in another area of your life. It's not that you're either bold or you're not, which is a whole other area that we can talk about afterwards, if you like. But there is different kinds of boldness. And that social

Starting point is 00:33:44 boldness is all about, you could be very extroverted and socially bold and bold in building relationships and in your overall like social communications. And I find that if someone is needing to be more bold in those areas, then that's the area that they can focus on. The self-actualization boldness is much more about if there's actually something that you're really trying to accomplish, like climbing Mount Kilimanjaro, right? That actually makes you more self-actualized internally as a human. I have this whole bold types quiz that you can take to see where you fit and where you are. But I want to talk a little bit about the fact that I get this question a lot.

Starting point is 00:34:28 And that is, do you have to be born bold? And the answer to that is absolutely not. I think boldness is a skill. like anything else, if you want to become good at karate or Spanish or whatever you want, you need to practice it and you could get better at it. And I think of boldness is the same way. If you are somebody who is naturally not bold, more shy or feels nervous about standing up for themselves and asking for what they want, you can absolutely change that behavior pattern by practicing these little bold moves daily to increase.

Starting point is 00:35:06 your boldness. And what I do in this book is I give people these actionable things that they can do to actually go from a place of shyness or find the courage, I should say, or the bravery to ask for what they want tomorrow, where they don't feel the courage today to ask for. And so a little bold move can be something as simple as going to a restaurant and asking for salad dressing on the side of your salad. people feel so uncomfortable by asking for such little things. And in my opinion, it's like if you are uncomfortable asking for these little things, how are you going to get comfortable asking for the bigger things? So it's like challenge yourself to just ask for what you want,

Starting point is 00:35:53 even if it's not a big deal or you don't even care that much about it, just to put yourself out there so you can practice and sort of build that habit. Right. And there's a person I know, a friend of mine who attempted this. and I was talking to them about this. And what he did was everywhere he went for six months, he asked if there was some kind of discount, some kind of like local discount that he can have or get by anywhere.

Starting point is 00:36:23 He would go to the coffee shop and ask. He would go to the mall and ask like a whatever, like a clothing store. He would ask the movie theater. He saved $7,000 in six months by just asking the question. And it wasn't for the money that he just so happened to save $7,000. He actually saved $7,000.

Starting point is 00:36:42 But again, that was the byproduct. It was a test to see what happens when you ask and if you ask what you get and to become more comfortable in the process of asking. So he became so comfortable in asking that then he started asking everywhere at all things. So he realized that all these local joints around him, he got 10% off, he got 20% off. Most of the restaurants, no one even knew that they had all these little discounts

Starting point is 00:37:11 for people who were locals or who were 40 and below, whatever. I don't remember exactly what they were, but I was going to say like 65 and under, but he was much younger than that. But my point is, like, there are so many little, like, things

Starting point is 00:37:25 if you just put yourself in a situation or just ask the question. Yeah. And so if I have this, right, social boldness is about asking for what you want with friends, family, colleagues at work, for example. Does it help us build a better network when we do that? Well, this is the thing, right? So it's not just about this sheer ask, ask, ask for what you want.

Starting point is 00:37:47 Boldness is much more than just asking for what you want. It's about a mindset. It's about having this life that you curate for yourself and take initiative on and take ownership of. It's not just, Hala, I want this, I want that, I want that. But I do talk about this idea. this thing called the bold of directors, which is creating a team around you who are like-minded, who have the similar goals than you as you, who want you to win, who don't want you to lose, who are great people to kind of just riff with and see if, like, there's a way to help each other out. You are a sum of the five people you surround yourself with, right? That's just a known fact, right?

Starting point is 00:38:27 So you want to make sure you put yourself in circumstances around people who can help you win and elevate. So that's the idea. It's first to build these bold of directors around you versus, you know, I call it like bold versus board of directors where it's a mutually benefiting relationship. It's not like you're constantly taking and taking. It's like, how can I help you? How can you help me? Who do you know? How do I know? It's like kind of like a very mutually beneficial relationship where these people want for you what you want for yourself. In life, no one is self-made. I don't believe in that. I think that's a load of crap. I think that someone had to like lend you a helping hand somewhere down the road, right? It could be something as so trite and small. It's like

Starting point is 00:39:14 letting you sleep on his couch for a day or for a week or giving you some advice or having a meal with someone. Not everything has to be these like huge, outlandish, overt ways of giving. But I believe that being collaborative and helpful and having good people surrounding you, that's, you that's can help you get to these things is super important. Yeah. So boldness, like you mentioned, is a skill that can be learned. So I'd love to understand if you have some like hacks that we can take with us. I know everyone's going to go out and get your buck, but what can you tell us in terms of how we can actually learn boldness as a skill? It's a muscle like anything else that you have to work on consistently. You know, if you want to be strong, right? I'm going to use a fitness analogy, okay?

Starting point is 00:40:00 If you want to be strong, you don't go to the gym one day and think you're going to be strong for life, right? Same thing with being bold. Bold is for life. You have to work that muscle and continually and consistently to be able to be bold and practice over and over again. And so by doing these little bold moves daily or doing things daily to kind of like increase the building of your bold, so to speak, it helps build this as a skill. Right. So if you do these small little bold moves daily, if you do it consistently, if you see yourself winning, this is very much tied into like a confidence piece, right? Like, you know, when you want to build confidence,

Starting point is 00:40:39 the best way to build confidence is to have these small wins. And that last win gives you the confidence to do the next one. And that is the same thing with being bold, right? You've got to like do these little wins and see yourself achieving them to give you that extra umph to be bold again. And as you go, these accumulate and compound over time. and eventually you become much more bold. But you've got to start somewhere.

Starting point is 00:41:08 And the reality really is, it's momentum, right? Something in motion stays in motion. Something that's stagnant stays stagnant. And that's why you see these people, a lot of times, people who have a job are usually the ones who get another job offer. Or the people in relationships are the ones usually meet somebody else because they're already doing it. And that's why another cliche for you would be like,

Starting point is 00:41:31 If you want something done, you give it to a busy person because it's the idea that something is that's going and doing. So true. Right? It's unbelievable. If I have something that needs to be done an errand and I'm giving it to someone who has nothing to do, I'll be waiting until doomsday for that thing to happen. Versus, that's why a lot of times I'm like, I'll just do it myself because I know I'll get it done because I'm already going and doing. Again, there's a reason why these things are these are saying. It's because it's actually very true. There is no secret. That's beyond that type of mentality, but it's something that's true. If you're just sitting there waiting for opportunity while you're not doing anything for,

Starting point is 00:42:11 you'll be waiting a long time. You've got to create your own opportunities. Yeah. And I totally agree. But here's the thing. A lot of people, people who might be reading your book or listening to this show, they might consider themselves to be like timid, shy, polite, extremely polite. and doing things like sending food back at a restaurant might terrify them.

Starting point is 00:42:33 So I'd love to understand from your perspective, how can people get over that hump if they feel like, I don't want to be mean, you know? Well, right. And that's what I was saying to you earlier is that you have to get over that ideology if you want to get to a place of a life that you've curated for yourself. The reality is this. This is not for everybody, right? This is for people who want change and want to live at a higher elevation of what they are doing now. This is for someone who is at a job and they don't want to be at that job, but they really want to have a different job that they really like.

Starting point is 00:43:08 They want to have been a relationship they love. They want to have meaningful relationships, meaningful experiences with meaningful people. If you're happy with just settling for second best and good enough, then what do I care? I mean, all the power to you. But the part of this whole thing is like realizing that like not everybody likes vanilla, not everyone loves chocolate. You're not going to please everybody all the time. Everyone has an ideology of what they want and what they like.

Starting point is 00:43:35 If this is something that's not interesting to you, then it's not interesting for you. But truthfully, I think if we really were being honest with ourselves, we all want to live something closer sometimes to a life that's much more authentic to who we are versus to what is sometimes around us and available. I was not necessarily born bold. I was super insecure. I was super shy and timid at some point, but I realized it really wasn't getting me very far.

Starting point is 00:44:06 And then when I started to ask a little bit and be a little bold, what I was actually getting from it. And because of that, it propelled me to keep on going. It's like exercise, right? It's like anything. The stop is in the start. It's always easy to think of all the reasons why something will go wrong, why it's not good for you, why you shouldn't and how you're going to hurt this person or offend that person. It's not what you say. It's how you say it. You can be bold and not be rude. You could be bold and not be bitchy. I think there's a misconnotation of what the word bold really does mean.

Starting point is 00:44:46 It doesn't mean be overtly rude and aggressive. It means taking ownership and a stand for who you are and what you want out of your life and what you are willing to accept and act accordingly. That's all it is. By the way, you can be shy, but also be bold. You could be more timid, but also be bold in other ways. But you've got to pick and choose what is important to you and where you need to be bolder, where you want to be bolder. that's the point. That's why I was saying earlier, it's about having bold types. You can sometimes maybe like being okay with what food is given to you, if it's cold or at the restaurant, you don't want to make a stir. But maybe one area that you really want to improve is the fact that you're in a relationship and you're not getting the emotional connectedness that you are looking for. And you're just accepting that because you don't want to make a stir. Maybe that's where your pain point is. But figure out what that pain point is that's really bothering you, that's really holding you back, and then make a change. If you want to eat cold food all day, eat cold food all day. Maybe a lot of people don't care.

Starting point is 00:45:56 Like, I'm not even being funny. I'm being serious. Like maybe like, okay, fine. So I had the salad dressing on. I'm still going to eat it. I'm hungry. That's like a microcosm. But in real life, there's other areas where that may not suit you and serve you well. Yeah, you're going to grow up, like you said, having a lot of regrets about the time that you wasted. And, things like that, the chances that you didn't take. We'll be right back after a quick break from our sponsors. Hey, young improfitors. As an entrepreneur, I know firsthand that getting a huge expense off your books

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Starting point is 00:50:38 So something that I found really interesting in your book was that you mentioned that you're Gen X, right? I'm a millennial. You're Gen X. You mentioned that you feel like Gen X people are more likely to be bold because of the way that they grew up, which I thought was really interesting in the way that they were parented. And I know that you have two kids. So I'd love to understand why you think maybe Gen Z millennials are at sort of a disadvantage when it comes to being bold. Not everyone because there's definitely exceptions, of course.

Starting point is 00:51:10 And also how you've learned to then make sure that your kids act in bold ways. That's a good question, Hala. I like that. I talk about that in my book. I actually, this is something I truly believe in. What I refer to a lot is what's happening in the world today is caudal culture, where we get coddled a lot. God forbid you say the wrong thing or you do the wrong thing.

Starting point is 00:51:32 You get canceled right away. And there's a lot of helicoptering parents out there who helicopters their kids to such place where everybody wins and gets a participation trophy. All of those things, I think, are doing a disservice for a lot of people in the world, our kids in the world, let's say, right? Because that's not how real life is, right? Not everyone in life gets a participation trophy. You know, the more you coddle and just caress people because you're nervous and scared of them failing is not teaching you or growing in any real way. And it's like, not actually accurate to how life really works. And when I was younger, we had much more of

Starting point is 00:52:17 figure it out type of approach, you know, like not everything, not everyone was getting, some people were getting the participation trophies, but not where I was, but I feel like we need to learn how to be okay, not being okay. We need to learn how to be uncomfortable and be uncomfortable in discomfort, right? And failing. We need to learn how to be resilient. And the only way you learn how to be resilient is to actually fail

Starting point is 00:52:48 and then pick yourself up again and try again and again. And this is why I feel when the whole idea of, again, we're not talking about everybody. But I think in the time that we are right now with the participation trophy and the helicoptering parents and the idea that I'm enough and all these, body positivity. There's all these hashtags where it gives people this permission to be okay with the status

Starting point is 00:53:17 quo or with who they are. And my entire message about that is about, well, is it okay? Like, don't you want to be the best version of yourself? Don't you want to grow? Don't you want to self-actualized to your fullest potential? I know when I'm lying on my deathbed, God willing, not for many, many, many more years, but I want to know that I did absolutely everything I can to have and use all the potential I had and try to make my life as complete and full as possible and not fall on this ideology.

Starting point is 00:53:51 It's like, oh, it was okay. I gave myself permission to maintain being okay and live a very average life. There's a big distinction, I want to say, between feeling mediocre, and living average, being average, right? I'm talking about like how we view ourselves, right? When we view ourselves younger as average or mediocre, that works for our benefit. But that's not the same thing as I'm living my life. It's okay.

Starting point is 00:54:20 And it's average because then you have the onus to make it better. I'm smiling because you're reminding me. I was talking to you offline that I broke up with my boyfriend. And so I'm on the market and I'm looking for new, new guys, you know what I mean? I love it. Anyone? Any takers? You talked about this idea of self-actualization. It is such a compelling thing. It's such an attractive thing to have somebody who goes after what they want and who can create things and self-actualized for themselves. And I meet so many guys who seem great. They're cute. They're handsome. They seem smart. And then like they've got like a very boring job.

Starting point is 00:54:58 They've been in for 20 years. And to me, kudos to you, but it's unattractive to me. because I'm like, well, what have you self-actualized? Like, you got a job after college and then you just stayed there. You know what I mean? And so for me, I feel like this concept of self-actualization is something that I've been thinking about a lot because I feel like it's such an attractive quality in a person. I think it's very attractive. I agree with you.

Starting point is 00:55:20 I think that there's nothing less attractive than somebody who just is fine with, like, letting themselves be okay with status quo. I think the most attractive thing in the world was when people want to push to be better because who wants to stagnate in life? The truth of the matter is I don't think anybody does, but I think what happens is life happens and then it goes fast and we're busy and then we forget and we're tired and we don't have the energy and effort to put in to what it means to do something else. That's really where it gets like the rub, right? Because if we're not going to be focusing on that, then what's the point? One day will bleed into another, that bleeds into another,

Starting point is 00:56:09 and you look back in 20 years and you never did any of those things that you wanted to ever do when you were a kid or accomplished when you were a kid. Don't let that happen to you. You have the ability to take that control into your hands and be the CEO, so to speak, of your own life, and make things like change that trajectory for you. That is the point. I think it's very hard sometimes because we do get in the rut of life. And you have to make a decision of what you want from your life and how you want to live that life. And you don't have to have a destination necessarily, but have a direction and play out that direction. Because a lot of times, just in that process, all these doors open to you that you never even knew existed because you never

Starting point is 00:56:56 even went down that road before. I think you should go watch my Instagram. And you tell me if you think my kids are bold. My little girl who's seven years old did a post about buying my bigger better. She's like, welcome to my channel. And I want you to buy my mom's book, Bigger, Better, Bolder. It's so cute. And the reason why I think it's, well, it's cute because she's my kid. But that's not what I'm saying.

Starting point is 00:57:22 I'm saying kids learn not by words, but by watching, by action. Your kids mimic you. So you can say all you want, talk, talk, talk, but what they are actually really kind of tuning into is what you're doing. And they mimic what they see, not what they hear. And I may be a lot of things in the world, Hala, but one thing I am 100% through and through is honest and authentic and real. Whatever I preach, I practice one million percent. I'm not just sitting here blabbing and blabbing and then not actually practicing it. I'm actually practicing it all the time. And my kids see it. And so my message and why I'm even saying that is my kids, they're kids, right?

Starting point is 00:58:06 They may not listen all the time and they do their own thing. But I think little essences of what they see does slowly seep in. They see me exercising all the time. They know that movement's really important for me. That's a healthy habit that I believe that we should all kind of integrate into our lives, not because having a great ass or great legs, but because of the cognitive abilities and what it does for you in confidence and mental toughness and strength. So I do that and they see that. I think every parent should really kind of try to instill the importance of activity because of what the other stuff, the byproducts that they get from that as well. If you want your kids to be a certain way, you've got to be a great role model and show them. And then that's how they learn. Yeah, I love that because it's often forgotten. A lot of people, like they're great role models at work,

Starting point is 00:59:00 and then they come home and they watch TV all night or something, and that's what their kids see in terms of like what home life is supposed to be. That's a really good point. Because I think a lot of times we give all our energy to sometimes one area, we go super hard in one area of our life, and then we forget about these other areas that are actually in real life more important. I talk about this whole energy allocation theory that I have, and that is that put certain things on autopilot,

Starting point is 00:59:28 of your life, so then you have energy allocated to the things that really matter. And for me, what really matters are my kids. And so I'm never too tired for my kids. So no matter what, I'm going to allocate energy towards them so I can have a balanced life. And to me, that's about being bold. It's about recognizing these weeks boss of what happens in your life, because when you have a busy career and you've got a busy life professionally, it's really easy to lose sight of all those other things personally that you just say, oh, I'll get to it some other time. But having, again, like to circle it all back, having a rich life is having a rich life both personally and professionally with meaning

Starting point is 01:00:08 and fulfillment. And you've got to create that life balance for yourself. You've got to curate that for yourself. So do certain things and put certain things on autopilot. So you do have time for those really important things like your kids. I love this. And I think this is a great way to close out the show. So Jennifer, it was so great to have you on. I always ask two questions at the end of the show that are the same. And then we do some fun stuff with them at the end of the year.

Starting point is 01:00:36 So the first one is what is one actionable thing that our young improfitors can do today to become more profiting tomorrow? They can start acting bold by doing one bold move a day for the next. 30 days. Amazing. And what is your secret to profiting in life? And like you, it's very similar to your rich life concept profiting in all areas of your life. Collaborations. Collab with people who are like-minded, who also want to see you win and you guys help each other. Again, nothing is done in a vacuum. You need to have to have a support of really good people to help elevate. And like I said, nobody is self-made. If you want to be successful, surround yourself with success.

Starting point is 01:01:20 Love it. And where can everybody learn more about you and get your latest book, Bigger, Better, Boulder? You can buy my book at any fine bookstore, Amazon, there's Barnes & Noble, anywhere you would normally find a book. They can find me at the real Jen Cohen. They can go on my website, Jennifer Cohen.com. They can find me on Habits and Hustle, which is my podcast. Amazing. We're going to put all those links in the show notes. I had such a fun time talking with you. It's always a pleasure, Jen, thanks for coming on the show. Thank you for having me, Hala. Yeah, fam, it's always a good time when one of my friends comes on the show. It's just such good, natural, organic energy. And I get to learn about my friends in ways that I never did before. It's super funny to have seen how

Starting point is 01:02:13 Jennifer's come-up story is so similar to mine. And it's no wonder that we hit it off right away and we get along so well. When Jen was young, she struggled in school and she was sent for extra tutoring because of her poor performance. And after a teacher said that she would be nothing but average at best, young Jen stepped out of herself and into her boldness. And she clawed her way to the top. She was super scrappy. And today, Jennifer is one of the most influential entrepreneurs in the health and fitness industry. And I'm proud to call her one of my clients at the Yap Media Network. And I want you to remember, Yap, bam, every successful person has a different background. Their background will never be your background. And every successful person has followed a different path

Starting point is 01:02:59 and that path won't be your path. Every successful person use different strategies to get to the top and those strategies won't be your strategies. But there's one thing I know and there's one thing I know for sure is that every successful person took bold, decisive action more than once. boldness is a common thread and it's more important than brains or connections in your network. It's what separates top performers from those who don't achieve their potential.

Starting point is 01:03:30 And I hope this episode inspires you to be bold, take risks, go after what you deserve, ask for what you want, and exercise your boldness every single day. And guys, if you listen, learned, and profited, share this episode with your friends or family. And while you're at it, drop us a five-star review on Apple. and I have to say, nothing makes me happier than reading your positive reviews.

Starting point is 01:03:53 You guys can find me on social media. I'm on Instagram at Yap with Hala. You can also find me on LinkedIn. Search my name. It's Hala Taha. Big shout out to my Yap team. Super excited for 2023. We're going to crush this year.

Starting point is 01:04:06 This is your host, Hala Taha, signing off.

Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Jennifer Cohen: Bigger, Better, Bolder. How to Get the Life You Want by Being Bold | Entrepreneurship | E204

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