Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Marc Champagne: The Power of Being Present | E139

Episode Date: November 1, 2021

Want to live your life with more intention? In this episode we are talking with Marc Champagne! Marc is a creator, author, podcast host, and mental fitness strategist. In 2016 Marc co-founded the digital journaling app KYŌ once he saw a need for a digital guided journaling tool for people. After fast and immense success with KYŌ, he made the decision to end the business and delete the app permanently after realizing his business model wasn’t sustainable or profitable.  In 2019 he created his podcast Behind the Human, which has since become a top 50 health charting show, where he talks to some of the greatest minds about how to live with more intention and presence. He created his own brand strategy business using his mental fitness theory called THRIVE, and has become an acclaimed mental fitness strategist through his work with THRIVE. His first book, Personal Socrates, “is an exploration of questions that shape the lives of legends and world-class performers—questions that have the power to change your life and work”, and is hitting shelves in October 2021. In today’s episode, we discuss Marc’s journey with creating and ultimately ending the popular journaling app KYŌ and how that led his path to writing Personal Socrates. We also discuss Marc’s full-proof formula to getting unstuck, why journaling actually works, and the questions to ask ourselves to live with more clarity and intention. If you’ve been searching for questions to lead to inner change, keep listening! Sponsored by -  Kraken. Visit kraken.com/yap to learn more about Bitcoin & Crypto Social Media: Follow YAP on IG: www.instagram.com/youngandprofiting Reach out to Hala directly at [e-mail] Follow Hala on Linkedin: www.linkedin.com/in/htaha/ Follow Hala on Instagram: www.instagram.com/yapwithhala Follow Hala on Clubhouse: @halataha Check out our website to meet the team, view show notes and transcripts: www.youngandprofiting.com Timestamps: 00:54: Marc’s Backstory and Journey to Entrepreneurship 05:34: The Question that Led Marc to Shut Down His App 09:04: Marc’s Path to Writing Personal Socrates 11:08: Marc’s Formula to Getting Out of a Rut 19:13: Why Journaling Works 21:43: The Questions Marc Asks Himself 24:40: Breaking Down the Socratic Method 28:54: The 5-4-3-2-1 Principle 30:24: Marc’s Favorite Profiles in Personal Socrates 36:48: Marc’s Secret to Profiting in Life Mentioned In The Episode: Marc’s New Book Personal Socrates- https://www.baronfig.com/personal-socrates?title=default+title Marc’s Website- https://www.behindthehuman.com/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This episode of YAP is sponsored in part by Shopify. Shopify simplifies selling online and in-person so you can focus on successfully growing your business. Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify.com slash profiting. You're listening to YAP, Young and Profiting Podcast, a place where you can listen, learn, and profit. Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Halla Taha, and on Young and Profiting podcast, we investigate a new topic each week

and interview some of the brightest minds in the world. My goal is to turn their wisdom into actionable advice that you can use in your everyday life, no matter your age, profession, or industry. There's no fluff on this podcast, and that's on purpose. I'm here to uncover value from my guests by doing the proper research and asking the right questions.

If you're new to the show, we've chatted with the likes of X FBI agents, real estate moguls, self-made billionaires, CEOs, and bestselling authors. Our subject matter ranges from enhancing productivity, had to gain influence, the art of entrepreneurship, and more. If you're smart and like to continually improve yourself, hit the subscribe button because you'll love it here at Young and Profiting Podcast. This week on YAP, we're chatting with Mark Champagne, an author, podcast host,

and mental fitness strategist. In 2019, he created his podcast Behind the Human, which is now a top 50 health show where he talks to some of the greatest minds about how to live with more intention and presence. He created his own brand strategy business using his mental fitness theory called Thrive. His first book, Personal Socrates, is an exploration of questions that shape the lives of legends and world-class performers, questions that have the power to change your life and work. In today's episode, we learned about Mark's journey creating and ultimately shutting down his app, Kio, and how that led him to writing personal Socrates. We'll also discuss Mark's fool-proof

formula to getting unstuck, why journaling actually works, and the questions to ask ourselves to live with more clarity and intention. If you've been searching for questions to lead in our change, you'll love this conversation. Hey Mark, welcome to Young and Profiting Podcast. Thanks, Hala. It's great to be here. It's a real honor. I've been a huge fan of yours, as you know, and I'm excited to jam. Me too.

You know, thank you so much for having me on your show earlier in my career behind the fan of yours as you know and I'm excited to jam. Me too. You know, thank you so much for having me on your show earlier in my career behind the human and you've got such a great podcast. And now you have a new book called Personal Socrates that is coming out really soon. When does that come out exactly, Mark? It is depending on when this releases. It might already be out. It's coming out October 19th, which

as of now it's next week. Oh yeah, we'll put that out. We're going to put this episode aligning without release dates. So I can't wait to get into that book and to talk about journaling and the benefits of that. But before we get into that, you have a really interesting backstory. You actually started in the corporate world like me and then you became an entrepreneur and you were in big pharma, you were doing marketing and branding and then you had this big idea to start an app for journaling because at the time this was like 12 years ago, they didn't have anything like that and so you decided you would quit your job, team up with, you know, I think a relative and start this app. So really cool stuff. Talk to us about that transition,

how you got into journaling, and how you ended up jumping into entrepreneurship. Absolutely. I mean, it's so crazy to me to reflect back because when I was in the corporate world, I actually, I was doing well. I was, you know, you're used to this or you know how it works. I was moving jobs every two years essentially, right? Kind of

climbing that ladder. And I was actually quite happy in the role. I was working with really great people learning a ton and never had any desires to jump into the world of entrepreneurship. It kind of just happened out of not wanting to regret trying this new idea that he had brought up, which was the journaling app, Kio. And that came because, or it came from about eight or nine years of actually using a practice like journaling. Because when I was hired out of university,

I started in sales. We all went through the same training. It was like a four week intensive flight of Montreal. We're all going through the same program. And I remember thinking, well, how possibly can I stand out in a sales role if we're all being trained the exact same way, right? So I just started getting up a little bit earlier, not much, and started reading positive content.

And year after year, essentially. I mean, I'm happy to share like that first year or second year in sales. It was top sales rep in the territory, and I really credited it to all of that early morning like mental fitness, which is not what I call it at that time. But essentially what was happening in reading blogs and different books and websites, you start coming across very similar mindsets when it comes to personal development and keeping your mind thriving. And journaling was one of those practices.

And I remember coming across all of these different interviews and it wasn't journaling from the perspective of what I used to always get when we started the app, which was, oh, you're talking about the 12-year-old girl right in her diary about the boy at school, right? And I'm like, there's nothing wrong with that. But no, I'm talking about what I've been seeing in these big, powerful life and work questions that the people we're following and reading their books are are pausing to think about.

So I would write those questions down, and then the next morning when I would, you know, get up a bit earlier to do the practice, then I would reflect on them based on where I was at in my life. And I did that for, like I said, a good solid eight years. And eventually, though, at that time, then grew really frustrated with the digital solutions that were available. Because I was traveling a lot for conferences and whatnot. So I was always doing this practice on my phone or on an iPad that I had really kind of tacked out in the sense of no notifications as kind of like a sanctuary in terms of technology. But there was nothing out there from an app perspective that would take the combination of knowledge, and in my case questions, and link that up with a guided journaling practice.

Now there are options, but essentially that's what created the, or sparked the idea of Kio. And I linked up with my brother-in-law and co-founder of the app, said, here are my frustrations. Would you be interested in trying this out? He wasn't, and still is an entrepreneur. So that gave me a little sense of confidence or security that, OK, I'm not just jumping in by myself here. And then we started working on it.

That's awesome. So the app was pretty successful out the gate for my understanding. Apple was featuring it and you got like 86 million impressions on it and lots of active users. But you didn't figure out how to really monetize it. You didn't figure out the business model. And I can really relate because when I was my first entrepreneurship gig was the sorority of hip hop, strawberryblunt.com. It was a blog site that I blew up. I was so popular hosting parties. I had a big name out there in the tri-state, but I wasn't monetizing.

I didn't figure out the business model. So even though we had a big brand and people knew about us, I wasn't making money and I had to shut it down. And something similar happened to you where you ended up shutting down this app and deleting it. So my question to you, since you're like the Mr. Question guy, is what questions were you asking yourself that got you to that decision to shut it down? Well, it was actually a question sparked by an interview I had done with Scott Belsky, who's now in the book as one of the profiles. And it was just around the idea of, why am I building this? And also, do I still have the same level of passion and conviction that I did when I first

thought of the idea when we started the business? Do I have that same level of passion now? Because that's what you need. If not, do you have the same level, if not more passion now? Because that's what you need. If not, do you have the same level, if not more, frankly, because that's what you need, as you know, to kind of push through that messy middle and continue. And the answer at that time was just, no, I had lost that passion along the way. We were financially strapped mentally at the max of our journey. And we had learned enough

for the, along those three years of creating the app that, you know, we could continue to iterate it. And I am confident that we would have figured out the proper kind of user flow and would have been able to make our, you know, our business model work. But we weren't naive to the fact that that wasn't gonna happen in the next iteration.

And we were already on the third development team. Now we had a homegrown kind of Toronto-based team, which was way more expensive. And there was just no, not even a sliver of certainty that, okay, well, if we do this, it's going to result in, okay, at least we'll start covering our, you know, expenses or server costs. So that's what led to the decision of, you know what, and at least we'll start covering our expenses or server costs.

So that's what led to the decision of, you know what, for me at least, I had found the path and the work that really lit me up, that I didn't know was my true calling and purpose, but that vehicle, which was the app, is something that sparked that world for me, and I'm grateful for that, but that was time for that to close.

And I just, I trusted the journey enough for the path knowing that just because I'm in that space of self-development that if it's not the app, it'll be something else, but the work in general, the practices, the prompts, and all of that, I mean, that's what really mattered. And I'm curious to see from your perspective, when you were going through it with your adventure,

the big learning I had there was to never fall for your own hype. We had 86.9 million App Store impressions, all these features, we were collaborating with massive brands like LinkedIn and Lego and VaynerMedia, which was just providing all of this, almost like false confidence that we were just going to thrive, but we hadn't figured out the business model yet.

Yeah, honestly, now I look back and it's probably not what you're expecting to hear. I look back and I wish I kept going. Oh, wow. Okay. Because I realize now that having a brand is so powerful and I just had the wrong business model and had I just kept tweaking and tweaking and tweaking until I found something that had product market fit

or got a TV show or whatever it was. It probably would have been another six months or a year and I would have been really successful faster. But you know, everything happens for a reason and I'm not positive that would have happened but having a brand is powerful, you know, and you just need to figure out how to monetize that brand. So anyway, every failure is a stepping stone.

And I'm sure you learned a lot from that experience that you use now. So what are you up to these days? Well, I mean, interesting enough, I do feel like I have kept going. It's just like I said, the product or the offering or the service has changed. It's changed into a book, it's changed into corporate mental fitness activations and speaking and things like that.

But it's all the same content and practices and prompts. So, I mean, for me, it feels like the path just kind of got, I took a bit of a right turn there, but I'm still going up the same mountain essentially or following the work that lights me up. So that's what led to the book, though. The book was, you know, when I deleted the app, I mean, you know, I don't want to speak too lightly of that because I remember looking at that Apple dashboard and thinking,

okay, I see 86.9 million people. And the next step is to hit delete from App Store. I mean, how could we fail at such a colossal level? Like, what would all my ex colleagues think? You can probably relate to this. I remember telling them I was leaving, right? And they're like, there was this feeling of, oh, I have an idea too.

Like, you're so courageous for going to do that, right? There's, you could feel that. And here I am now, like, what am I gonna say to to those people? And I also didn't want to go back to that industry because I had found the space that really lit me up. But now I just deleted the vehicle that was keeping me in there. So it wasn't until doing everything possible to dial into the present moment and unleashes many gratitude practices as possible, which I was picking up through all the interviews and the content in the app, that I eventually got to this realization

that we are all myself included one question away from a completely different life. And that question for me happened to be, what do I want for my life, which pulled me out of a, essentially out of a depression that was heading into a deep depression and who knows where it next. depression that was heading into a deep depression, who knows where next. But that was enough the pause, the looping narrative, to then put a plan together.

And then that led to the next question, the question after that, and as it turns out, there's a, there's a whole method to this madness, which is the psychotic method. Yeah, so I want to dig really deep into that. Let's talk about people who are in a rut, because a lot of people are out there struggling. Maybe they lost their job from COVID. They still haven't really found their new job. And people are in a rut. So you were in that place at one point and you just said you used a lot of gratitude practices that you had learned over the years from interviewing people on your podcast. So talk to us about some of those specific methods. What did you do?

Well, I mean, there's a formula, a really easy formula to remember, that works in really any situation. And that is, to first get clear, then you can start acting with intention and whether that's practices, decisions, or conversations, then that will lead to an expansion of possibility or opportunity. But you can't, you know, the first step in that whole process is you have to pause the internal narrative because it's nearly impossible for us to think clearly and do our best work when our minds fogged with fear, anxiety, uncertainty, which is how I felt after deleting

that app. So again, just thinking of, you know, having something as simple as a list of five or ten things that you know without question will put a smile on your face and that you can default to that list. That's different for all of us. That's the point is we have to find the things that light us up. I was taking a lot of walks during that time.

I never skipped any workouts at the gym. My number one goal during that period was to keep my mind and body as healthy as possible. Because then your mind's clear, right? And it's just, it's no different than if you take the visual of a physical room and you open a door to a room and you see it's full with boxes, floor to ceiling. And you know there's a door in the back there, but you just can't see how to get to that door

where it is. Our minds are the same thing when they're flooded with emotion or an abundance of decisions to make or relationships that are bothering us. So once we start clearing that out, then we just have to trust that our minds are gonna do the work and connect the dots and we'll know exactly which path to take.

So I mean, it sounds easier said than done, but the easiest way to pause that loop is to dial into these practices or activities that you know will put a smile on your face, right? Yeah. So let me reiterate this really quick. The first step is to get clear. The second step is to live intentionally, intentionally. And the third step is to expand possibility. And then you have questions that align to each one. So let's really drill down here and teach people how to do this. So what are the questions for each bucket? Well, I think, I mean, again, a good quality question to me is a

question that's well timed and relevant in your life. Right? So if I were to ask myself the question again of what do I want for my life, it would serve as a nice check-in, but it doesn't have the power that it did, you know, a few years ago, which pulled me out of a depression. So the first thing is to really sit down,

and if you have the book or if you're looking at any other prompts is really to follow your intuition in terms of, you know, what feels right for you. Starting with a clarity type question, and that's something that's progressive as well, right? other prompts is really to follow your intuition in terms of, you know, what feels right for you. Starting with a clarity type question and that's something that's progressive as well, right? So what do I want for my life? You're going forward in movement or, you know, to borrow some of the prompts from James

Clear who has a profile in the book as well, but just understanding like, who am I optimizing to become, right? Like am I climbing the right mountain? Because we can feel like we're doing the right things. We feel busy, but if we're busy doing the things that we don't want to be doing, or that's not leading to the life that we desire, then we're kind of wasting that time. Right? So again, getting clear with questions on like, who do I want to become? And then from there, well, then what do I need to do?

Like, what's one step I can take today? And then it's all about setting reminders and doing the mental fitness, whether that's five or 10 minutes in the morning, just to remind ourselves of, this is where I'm heading, bringing in, again, gratitude, or bringing in some stoicism, for example, and focusing on, okay, this is what I can control today.

For example, there's profiles on Ryan Holiday in here and Marcus Aurelius. And then that's all you have to remember because if you're doing the first two steps of getting clear than living with an intention and doing the practices that will help, this possibility and opportunity shows up by default because you can see it, right?

Coming back to that room, you can see, the door is right there. The path is like this. This feels right. I'm going to follow that journey. Got it. So in terms of the reminders, are you saying basically scheduling time in your day to reflect on what you got clear on? Like basically you're asking yourself questions, then you get the clarity statement, whatever that is. And then you're saying set reminders to think about that information that you're clear on now. Yeah, so the reminders are, this is critical because if the whole intention of all of these practices is to pause us and pause the autopilot, because if we just let ourselves go in regular society, just like nutrition or exercise,

I mean, we'll be led down a path that is probably not the most healthiest for us, for example, right? It's just like going to a grocery store. I mean, if you just follow the aisles and the marketing, you're not gonna come out with a cart full of healthy groceries. It's not gonna happen, unfortunately. So you've got to be intentional with what you're doing

and have a plan when you're going in. So it's no different with our mind. I remember Apollo Ono. So he was on the show and he has a profile in the book and he's at least at the time, he was the most decorated winter Olympian in US history, short track speed skater. And I'll never forget because he, you know,

I write about it as here are the Olympic, the Olympic reminder system that Apollo uses and it's posted notes. You know, he starts with just getting clear on what on his objective in his goal. And then he looks around his house and thinks of the places that he sees the most often, whether that's your fridge or your, I think he had them in his closet, just little postits with an intention. You know, and it has to resonate with you, but it could be today I want to feel energized or I'm working towards X.

And just again, subtle little reminders. I use my iPhone wallpaper on the lock screen. And what's fun about that is like, you know, now we get all these screen time reminders. So you can see, I just prime my mind 78 times today from picking up my phone. And I just have some one liners on there that I need to hear right now, right? Small things like, you know, in the process of obviously this book launch, it's so easy to go down this comparison track. Okay, well, it's ranking here in Amazon. Like, what does that mean?

So-and-so did this, but I'm here and in comparison to them. And just to cut that and just have a one-liner saying, be present, forget about comparison, I can remind myself of that 78 plus times a day. Young and profitors, do you have a brilliant business idea but you don't know how to move forward with it? Going into debt for a four-year degree isn't the only path to success. Instead, learn everything you need to know about running a business for free by listening to the Millionaire University podcast.

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I want to hear from you. Here's a recent review from Rady Lopez. He says, Yapp has a timeless wisdom. Yapp has timeless wisdom you can use throughout your journey. As a young safety professional, this podcast has been a great tool in my success. Even from the first episode, first impressions, the podcast has helped me develop communication,

organization, and leadership skills. What's awesome about this show is that regardless of when the episode was aired, it can still be used today. I'm so glad you started this. Oh, thank you still be used today. I'm so glad you started this. Oh thank you so much Ray, I'm so glad I started this too. Yap has been the best blessing in my life and you're so right. You could go back to episode number one and still find value in the show.

In fact, it's really rare that any of my episodes are outdated and that's why I put out those Yap classic episodes so that I can resurface some of those older episodes that are so so good that you guys may have missed. So thank you again Ray for that amazing review. And if you're out there listening, what are you waiting for? Drop us a review on Apple Podcast or your favorite podcast platform and make our day. And maybe I'll read your review on Young and Profiting Podcast 2. Young and profiting podcasts too. I love that. I did something similar, not knowing what I was doing. I always make my passwords something that's some sort of a goal. So like for a while, I was really impatient.

And I had a really big problem with like wanting to get promoted and having to kind of wait in line. And all my passwords were like patients, like in a bunch of numbers, you know? Or when I was building YAP, I was like number one podcast, you know, and then every time I type it, I'd be like, yes, I'm working on my number one podcast, you know. So I think just any way that you can remind yourself of your goals, and then the more that you repeat stuff and listen to yourself, the more that you start to believe in and take the actions you need to actually get things done. But that's the intentionality part, right? You were doing it and it's simple and simple works.

We stick with that. I had the same thing. I had the, for the longest time I had a password that was just happiness. I love that. So talk to us about why journaling works. Is journaling only sitting down at a desk and writing on a piece of paper?

Oh, I'm so glad you asked that. Because I mean, I think we, most of us think of journaling as sitting down and writing kind a piece of paper? Oh, I'm so glad you asked that. Because I mean, I think most of us think of journaline as sitting down and writing kind of pen to paper or like in our case when we had the app using an app to do it. But if you really break down the actual practice, the practice is reflection. And that is the number one theme that has come up with 200 plus interviews with all these

exceptional humans as they take time to steal their mind and think. And again, that's to help pause that autopilot and make clear decisions. So I don't care whether you're writing in a book or if you're doing that in a notebook or if you're taking a walk and taking the walk without music or a podcast and just going on that walk with a question in mind, for example, that's reflection, that's journaling, but the key is that you're taking that time to do it. So for me, I mean, from my experience,

a good 70 or 80% of the people I've interviewed have some sort of meditation practice, but 100% of them have a practice like this where they're taking time to think. So again, you know, figure out in your own routine, if that's the morning, which is usually a little bit easier to do because then life happens afterwards. So you can start the day owning your morning, owning your day, start with a prime mind, asking some questions like, how do I feel today?

You know, where do I feel that in my body? Do I feel anxious as that tightness in my chest? And sometimes, are often just acknowledging that we're feeling that releases it. And then you don't carry that into the day. Again, coming up with that clogs your mental real state and really hard to make really great decisions or perform at our best when we're clogged like that.

So small, that takes minutes. One of the staples in my routine is as my coffee is brewing, I have a copy of Ryan Holliday's book, The Daily Stoic, and I just read one passage. It's one page, and it's usually a really solid perspective shift that no matter what's going on in my life right now, someone, oh, someone else has been through that. This is kind of how they handled it. It's not that bad. I can focus on either what I can't control or what I can control.

And sometimes that's all I need. Then you start to be motivated and excited and ready to go. Yeah, I love that. So in terms of the questions that we ask ourselves, do you tend to ask yourself like the same question every day or are you switching it up depending on what's going on in your life? Like how do you decide what question you're going to ask yourself? I mean this comes back to a decade ago essentially when the practice started for me and it was when consuming content or knowledge or wisdom then searching for those pieces,

or those nuggets, those questions that were there that then felt right to reflect on in my life right now. So that's the reason the book is set up in the way that it is in these two to four page profiles and that they're all loaded with an opening prompt is that they're all different. Whether it's Kobe Bryant or Maya Angelou or Stephen Hawking, they're all different. Whether it's Kobe Bryant or Maya Angelou or Stephen Hawking, they're all different and they're designed to meet you where you're at. So I would just encourage people

to not put so much pressure on themselves, but to really land at a question that feels right when you're going through the book, or if you're reading a book, to really just slow down and think about, okay, so, you know, what am I trying to get out of this, right? How can I apply this information or how can I apply this podcast to my life right now and make it applicable, for example? And then there are just, you know, I just really encourage no matter what you're doing to always have some sort of gratitude element to it.

Whether it's journaling, whether it's meditation, I typically do everything possible to have some sort of questions around, what can I celebrate about today? Or a great practice on a Friday, for example, three questions. You get to, let's say, midday Friday, not at the end of the day so that you're rushing to finish your day,

but in the midday, take 15 minutes and just ask, open up your calendar and ask, what did I learn this week? What would I have changed about this week? Maybe the way you reacted in a conversation, these are all just little nuggets of data that normally just pass through and we don't think about and then lastly, what can I celebrate about the week? And it's just a great way to finish off the week because again, you're not carting over

all this mental narratives and loops and stuff into the weekend. You're starting the weekend fresh, you're starting Monday fresh, and you just learn to ton about what you just did in the last five days, which is a lot. We forget about that, right? There's so much to celebrate, but we don't remember these things unless we stop and think about them. I really, really like that actionable Friday gratitude activity. That's really great.

It's a good social media post, too. You give me an idea, I think, of the way around. Amazing. Tag me. I will. Okay. So let's talk about the name of your book, Personal Socrates. And pretty sure everybody knows who Socrates is.

He's known as like the great thinker, but I don't know much else about him or the Socratic method. So can you break that down for us? Yeah, and I was in the same place and I actually hated the title of the book originally. It was from Joey, the founder of Baron Fagan and the publisher, but as I was explaining what I was picking up through all the podcasts and also how I was using questions He was like, oh, you're talking about the Scratic method. Scratic what?

I mean, again, I know the same level of detail that you just described. So, I went into it, you know, and just started doing some Google searches and I was first of all blown away that Socrates was born in 469 BC. So, he invented this method of questioning, and that's literally stood the test of time. All of us are doing it in some capacity, but without really thinking about it. And I was thinking, well, how do you then modernize the method

so that we can be a little bit more intentional with this practice and that we can get the most out of it. Because if you ask me that there's six question types in theocratic method, I can't even ride those off from memory to you, and that's the problem. I mean, there are questions around seeking clarity or challenging assumptions and things like that. But if I can't remember them,

then we're not gonna just intuitively apply the principles, right? And that's where the structure of the book and what we've been talking about of making it a three-part process of first getting clear, then getting intentional, and then by default the next step happens, right? And so that's the backbone of the book is based on the secratic method, but it's grouped in a way that we can all remember that first we need to get clear on what we want to do, right? And then from there, take action.

And here are a whole bunch of questions and stories and practices that help support, you know, where you're trying to head. Yeah, I love that. Let's give some examples. You mentioned that Koby Bryant is in the book. What kind of questions did Koby ask himself? How did he set intention and then, you know then get the opportunity on the other side? Yeah, so Kobe's profile was really fun to work on and the research was a lot of fun and insightful.

And his opening prompt is, how do I get to the rim, which has nothing to do with basketball. It has everything to do with how he was a master at his own internal negotiation. So through the research, and shortly after that opening prompt, the whole concept behind his profile is that Kobe was human like the rest of us. I mean, when his alarm went off at 4 in the morning to get the extra work out in, the fourth workout from which was one above his team members, I mean, he didn't want to get up either. And there was this whole, you know, I went in this rabbit hole about how, you know,

we all can negotiate ourselves out of getting out of bed. Like in microseconds, right? I mean, we're so warm, it's cozy in here. I'll do the workout after. In my case, it happened when I was writing the book, I'll write in at 2 p.m. instead, I have a window there, and what happens? Life happens, meetings happen, you don't write.

Or you don't go to the gym, for example. So for him, he started to really focus on getting clear on why he was getting out of bed to put in that fourth work. And for him, it was very clear to win an NBA championship, right? For us, we need to figure out what that thing is. And then the intention is, soon as the alarm goes off, you can use something like Mel Robbins, five, four, three, two, one principle, which is in the book as well, to just rise and get up.

Because you know, once you're out and you start about your day, and again, if you start stacking on and layering on these practices and you land in your kitchen, you have the post a note, again, reminding you start stacking on, and layering on these practices, and you land in your kitchen, you have the post a note, again, reminding you of why you're doing this, or you're making your coffee, and you're reading the passage, and something related to the book or stoicism, all of these things stacked up. There's micro moments of reflection. Just get us closer to where we're trying to head. I love that. So you interviewed Mel Robbins. I think she's coming on my podcast too,

and I'm so excited. I did an interviewer. I just, I included her principal in Kobe's profile. Let's talk about that principle since we brought it up. In case people haven't heard about it, it's pretty powerful. Her backstory is that, you know, she was, she had a lot of anxiety at one point. And then eventually just decided that,

I just heard her on a podcast recently tell the story. I think she was watching or she saw a commercial where there was a rocket launching or something like that and she made the decision that tomorrow I'm going to launch out of bed. Like enough's enough, I'm not going to loop into this anxiety and she just the next morning she just said 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. And that was her trigger, you know, at one, get up. And now she uses that for everything. And so do I, frankly.

So I just stack that within Kobe's profile because I think, you know, I have an interviewed Kobe, so I don't know exactly the question he was asking, well, he's in bed. I know he was clear on his intention, but if we can loop in Mel's principle with that now, it's super powerful, right? Yeah, and so the idea is don't just keep hitting the snooze button It's so unhealthy like to just like not want to get out of bed

Keep hitting the snooze button and then you wake up groggy once you hear alarm It's just like let's go get out of bed 5 4 3 2 1 get up and you can use it for anything, right? Like an email you're hesitating to send or if you're trying to you know Let's go. Get out of bed. 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, get up. And you can use it for anything, right? Like an email you're hesitating to send, or if you're trying to, you know, cool message someone or give them a call, just 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, go. Do it. I love that. So what other cool stories do you have in your book that you want to share?

Like something that you feel would teach our listeners something impactful. Another mutual contact or friend of ours, Navin Jane, he has a profile in the third part of the book, which is around unlocking possibility. And I like to share this one because, you know, for the most part, we talk about these practices from the standpoint of when you're emotionally charged or you're trying to process anxiety or depression

or whatever it is, right? But then there's a whole other side of these practices that relate to unlocking, you know, your imagination. So Navin's profile is all about the language that we use and slowing down and writing out, imagine if, right, imagine if I did this or started working on this project. Like, what do I see transpiring here? You know, what can I do? And this is a fun exercise to do right before you go to bed because it just sets your mind

into this realm of possibility. And then when you go to sleep, your mind continues to work on that path, for example. So not only like you're putting your mind in a positive and happy creation state, right? Because we're either in a creation state or we're in a survival state. We're never in both the same time and it's either or. So practice is like that and that kind of language brings us back into that creation

and that motivated state where we're excited and we're pumped. So his practice is something that I use often, even for this book, I mean, just imagine if this happened or that happened, and it doesn't mean that it's going to, but it's at least charts the path. And then you start feeling more clear. I'm like, okay, well, then maybe I need to do this to get to that end result. And also, people start showing up or start surrounding you, for example, right?

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TV, and my personal favorite way to learn is their audio mode to listen on the go. That way, I can multitask while I learn. Get unlimited access to every class. And right now, as the app listener, you can get 15% off when you go to masterclass.com slash profiting. That's masterclass.com slash profiting for 15% off an annual membership masterclass.com slash profiting. Yeah. And I feel like that's probably really helpful for pessimistic people who have trouble kind of expanding from reality or what they feel like is certain. I think that when you're optimistic, it's kind of easy to imagine and kind of just say

affirmations and believe things that are unrealistic. But when you're pessimistic, maybe a tool like that would really help you think outside the box. Yeah. Well, and it brings us back to, I mean, I have a five year old and that's essentially how he speaks like right now. He doesn't know he's doing this, but he's like, imagine if I was strapped on a rocket ship and I went to the moon,

right? It's just that child-like imagination that we all had. It's just as life goes, for many of us that gets tampered down, we also stop asking as many questions until we hit these big roadblocks in life. Then we then we start asking the deep questions. Right? And the thing with that, like the other thing, when you're asking these questions, and this one's from Chip Conley's profile,

around curiosity, but the most curious person in the room is also the most present. And people feel that presence, right? Like you and I feel that we're engaged with each other versus looking over the camera or doing something else. You can feel when someone is not present or engaged. So they win, you win, and you're training your mind to see the detail. When you see the detail, then you see the detail when you're putting together a brand strategy or pitch deck or your research for whatever it is. So it's all these little micro moments of training that

really prepares for the big game, which is life. So true. So there's one quote from your book that really caught our eye. And it was with Coco Chanel. And you said that confidence with presence breeds irreplaceability. So tell us about the exercise that we can do

to foster legendary confidence like Coco Chanel? Yeah, Coco Chanel was fun too. I was a really hard profile to write because again, she's one of them. But half of the profiles are people, anyone that's alive today, have interviewed in the ones that are not, I haven't. So the ones that I haven't, those were hard because like Coco Chanel, there are biographies written on her and that wasn't my intention, right, to write a biography.

So I was trying to figure out from her life and what I could research, how can we leverage the questions and the practices or bring in practices that will help us. And with her, it was just this, it's interesting because everyone knows the brand, obviously. She herself had this presence of arriving in the room from what I've gathered in my research that people would just remember when Coco entered the room. And it's the same thing when people show up with Chanel number five. I mean, it's just, it's been around for so many years and it still holds that presence. So the practice in the profile is for us to pause and think,

well, what presence am I leaving behind? Or what presence do I want to leave behind when I'm in the room with someone? And again, just slow down and think about that because whether we like what we leave behind or don't, we're leaving something behind. We're leaving an energy or we're leaving people feeling a certain way. So I'd rather spend a bit of time thinking about, well, you know, I want people to feel energized

and excited after a conversation with me. I mean, that's the greatest gift I can give because I like to feel energized and excited. And that works for me. So then what, you know, how do I need to show up? Or if you're giving a, if you're giving a presentation or a keynote, how do I need to show up? Or if you're giving a presentation or a keynote, how do I want the audience on the other side to feel after I'm done speaking? Again, you're just setting the intention,

and your mind goes and pulls the things that you need to do to make that real. So Coco was just really fun to dive into her history and world, and also have the parallel of actually her brand and products doing the exact same thing. Super cool. I mean, this is really powerful stuff. It's super simple, but people don't take the time to ask questions, reflect, set intentions,

and attack the world with a perspective of how they want to attack the world. I feel like a lot of us are on this hamster wheel. We just do the same thing every day and we don't step back to reflect. This was an amazing interview. Thank you so much. The last question that I ask all my guests is, what is your secret to profiting in life? It's doing everything possible to pause the autopilot and to think, right? It's so easy to, like you just said, it's so easy to just spin and I fall into this all

the time, but the more I deploy these practices, the more self-aware and the more I can catch myself and give that micro-pods to make a different decision and see the path forward, right, or the one that feels the most right. So yeah, it's presence for me. I love that. And where can our listeners go to learn more about you and everything you do and where can they get the book? Yeah, I mean, the easiest place is just one link

which is behind thehuman.com. That's just my personal website. The podcast is there, the books there, and Amazon, Baronfig. By the time you listen to this, if you're listening to this on launch week, there's still a whole bunch of launch bonuses, so free mental fitness guides

that I wrote up that will accompany the books, sleep guides, moonshot thinking guides, and all the prompts that link to them. So yeah, and let me know, I mean, I'm obviously can probably tell them a bit obsessed with questions. So if you've got some great reflective questions that have made massive changes in your life, I mean, tag me in those prompts and let me know

and I'll keep them on the list. I love that. This is awesome. And well, definitely, I know you mentioned the moon shop thinking and the sleep guides. Why don't you send me those links for a pop-in and the show notes? Because I think my listeners will love that.

And if you guys are tuning in, check out my episode with Navine Jane. We talk all about moon shots. And so it's really awesome stuff. Mark, it's always such a pleasure to speak with you. I hope your book launch is super successful. And I can't wait to come back on your podcast when I've got something new to talk about

and just so great to chat with you like always. Absolutely, Holly. You know you're always welcome. Thanks, Mark. Thanks for listening to Young and Profiting podcast and my conversation with Mark Champagne. I could relate to so much of what Mark was saying, especially with the shutting down of his app, Kio.

I'm a founder and entrepreneur. I have been since I was in my early 20s. And I remember in my first entrepreneurship endeavor with the sorority of hip hop. I had a website and we had such a big brand, but we couldn't monetize. And I had to make that tough executive decision to shut that down and move on with my career so I could keep growing. And so that everybody could keep growing who was on my team because we were failing. And sometimes it's important to know when to quit, just as much as it is to know when to start something. And I think a lot of people have pride in quitting and it keeps them stuck for a really long time. But sometimes you do have to pivot to create a more sustainable

business for yourself. And both me and Mark have that in common in our journeys. And I love how Mark said that even at the end of something as big as Kio, he still believes that everything happened for a reason. He wasn't salty about what happened. He felt like the act was a great experience that led him to find passion and mental fitness, and he also learned how to be present and intentional with his next endeavors. Even if they don't end up the way that you thought they would be, you still get these experiences that help move you along in life. And a huge takeaway for me in this interview

was the idea of reflection and slowing down and taking the little things into account when you're trying to visualize or reach a goal. Like when I mentioned using my computer passwords as intentional triggers to help me practice patience, which I really need some help on, or how Mark has different lines on his lock screen, they make him feel grounded. And the more that we practice putting these intentional ideas and processes around us,

no matter how small, the more that we are exposing ourselves to those positive mantras, and eventually we can't help but incorporate them into our behaviors. And I love how Mark made journaling so easy. We don't need to be stationary, stuck at a desk with a pen and a paper. We can take a walk without any distractions, turning off your phone, and just reflect on a question and think about having that intention to make it a reality. Thinking about creative ways we can ask ourselves those questions that will get us to who we want to become is something that I never really thought of before. And the idea of figuring out who we want to become doesn't feel so woo-woo when Mark talks about it, but rather something we can really take time to think about and eventually

reach because we're so clear on what we want. We just have to be able to shut out the noise around us and be present with ourselves and our questions. This was truly an amazing conversation with Mark and I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. Be sure to check out his amazing book, Personal Socrates, which is out now. If you want to read his amazing profiles on some of the world's most interesting people. If you enjoyed this episode and you want to hear more about living with intention and abundance, go check out episode number 22, becoming astronomically ambitious with Navine Jane. The last point I want to make on this particular subject

is that most people, when they go out and want to solve a problem, they always somehow are stopped by their own mind power because they believe they know nothing about this subject. So how are they going to go out and make a impact on something they know nothing about? And that is the second thing that I learned is that if you are an expert in a field, you become useless in that field. And what I mean by that is once you are an expert, the best you can do is to make incremental improvement. And you can make a 10% improvement,

you can make a 15% improvement, you can make a 15% improvement, but you'll never be able to go out and change it 10X or 100X. Because as an expert, you have to take the foundation of that thing for granted. And unless you're willing to challenge the foundation, you can never make this disruptive improvement in anything. You'll always be stuck with the incremental improvement.

Again, if you liked this episode and you want to feel even more inspired, go check out episode number 22, becoming astronomically ambitious with Naveen Jane. Thanks again for listening to Young and Profiting Podcast. If you guys want to connect with me on social media, you can find me on LinkedIn, just search for my name, it's Halataha, or Instagram at YappwithHala. Big thanks to the Yapp team as always. This is your host, Halataha, signing off. Are you looking for ways to be happier, healthier, more productive, and more creative? I'm Gretchen Rubin, the number one best-selling author of the Happiness Project. And every week, we share ideas and practical solutions on the Happier with Gretchen Ruben

Podcast. My co-host and Happiness Guinea Pig is my sister Elizabeth Kraft. That's me, Elizabeth Kraft, a TV writer and producer in Hollywood. Join us as we explore fresh insights from cutting-edge science, ancient wisdom, pop culture, and our own experiences about cultivating happiness and good habits. Every week we offer a try this at home tip you can use to boost your happiness without spending a lot of time, energy or money. Suggestions such as follow the one-minute rule. Choose a one-word theme for the year or design your summer. We also feature segments like know yourself better Better, where we discuss questions like, are you an over buyer or an under buyer?

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