Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Mike Winnet: Get Demotivated | Entrepreneurship | E19

Episode Date: February 25, 2019

Let’s get demotivated! Taking a turn from the usual this week, we’re yappin’ with comedian Mike Winnet, who describes himself as the UK’s #1 Demotivational Speaker. Mike is a successful entrepreneur who sold his last business for multiple millions. He now spends his free time on a parody LinkedIn account making people laugh through his hard-hitting advice and unconventional wisdom. Tune in to hear Mike's perspective on what it takes to become an entrepreneur, and uncover how he plans to confront get-rich scammers or ‘contreprenuers’ who prey on those with low self esteem. Want to connect with other YAP listeners? Join the YAP Society on Slack: bit.ly/yapsociety Follow YAP on IG: www.instagram.com/youngandprofiting Reach out to Hala directly at [e-mail] Follow Hala on Linkedin: www.linkedin.com/in/htaha/ Follow Hala on Instagram: www.instagram.com/yapwithhala Check out our website to meet the team, view show notes and transcripts: www.youngandprofiting.com

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Visit compasshq.com to learn more. You're listening to Yap, Young and Profiting Podcast, a place where you can listen, learn, and profit. I'm your host, Halitaha, and today I'm talking to Mike Winnett, who describes himself as the UK's number one demotivational speaker. Mike is a successful entrepreneur who sold his last business for multiple millions

and now spends his free time making people laugh through his hard-hitting advice. Mike gives folks a reality check on what it really takes to become an entrepreneur and confronts get rich scammers or entrepreneurs who prey on those with low self-esteem. Hey Mike, welcome to Young and Profiting Podcast. Thanks for having me. Thanks for inviting me on. Of course.

I'm excited and scared for this interview because you're the first comedian that I've had on the show and so I don't know how it's going to go, but I'm excited for it. Am I your first English guest you've had on? No, I have a lot of listeners from the UK, and I've had Philip Nunn. He's a cryptocurrency expert. Yeah, no, I see him on LinkedIn. Okay, so you've made quite a name for yourself over the years. You've worked with some of the UK's biggest businesses. You have a huge LinkedIn following. You sell out talks around the world, and you call yourself a demotivational speaker, which is not something we typically hear of. In fact, I never heard of that before you. So can you explain to us what is it that you exactly do?

So I just let people realize that you can't be everything you dream that you can be. You can't achieve this huge, successful life that a lot of these motivational speakers are trying to convince you can do. So I basically just tell them to sort of reevaluate their goals, ambitions and be a bit more realistic and understand the reason why they're being told they can achieve these things by motivational speakers, inspirational leaders and these entrepreneurs on social media, Instagram, LinkedIn, stuff like that. And so where did you come up with the idea of becoming a demotivational speaker? Well, it's kind of a play on the fact that if you look at social media now, anybody can change their bio and be an expert in their field,

and it can be any field they choose. So it was just a play on that fact. So I didn't know any other demotivational speakers on LinkedIn. So I just thought I will change my LinkedIn bio to say UK's number one, the motivational speaker. And lo and behold, the request for me to come and talk started to rolling. And it was kind of a play on the fact that it's so easy to create an online persona and a background. And very few people actually do any background checks or research the people that they follow online.

And it's just showing you how easy it is to create this false narrative that I call them sheep or would sort of buy into. That's so funny. You've actually grown a huge following on LinkedIn. Why do you think what you do is so compelling? I think it's because people are a bit more aware of what's going on. I think on LinkedIn now, we are sick of the copy and paste posts by self-proclaimed inspirational leaders. And I think there's like a growing sort of crowd for that. And I just appeal to that crowd mainly because I'm saying what a lot of these people want to say,

but can't say because they work for companies where if they sort of said that thing online, it could be detrimental to their employment or how they're seen online. So I think I get to say and do and be how a lot of these people would like to be. And I can't wait to get to that and talk more about that. But before we do that, I think a good introduction from my listeners is to go over some of the funny and catchy terms that you've coined over the years about people that we may encounter in our professional lives. You talk about things like entrepreneurs, humble braggers, entrepreneurs. So I'd like to unpack these. Let's start with humble bragging. What is that? Tell us about that.

Well, we've all seen humble brags. You know, you see them on Facebook, you see them on Instagram, and it's a growing trend to see them on LinkedIn now. So what it basically is, it's somebody that wants to boast or let everybody know of something that they're proud of, but they realize it's a bit wanky to say, look at my new Range Rover sports or look at my new Lamborghini. So instead of just saying, aren't I amazing, I've got myself a new sports car, they try and dress that fact up in a really nice story. So it could be, look at the weather outside today. I'm stuck on my drive. It's terrible weather today. And then it's a picture of the brand new Lamborghini with a little bit of snow on top. Now, we all know what they're up to. And that's kind of what a humble brag is. So it could be,

I've gone and helped some homeless person today. And there's a photo of them with a homeless person, giving them a coat. It's like, well, you could have done that deed without telling the world. But what you want is people say, you're an amazing person, hon, or you're an amazing inspirational leader. And that's what it is, but it's a growing, growing trend. And again, I think a lot of people are doing it, but it's so cringy. I don't know why people continue to do it because we all know what they're up to. Yeah. Okay. How about a want entrepreneur? What is that? A one entrepreneur is pretty much 98% of the people that would attend a Tony Robbins event, a Gary V event, Grant Cardo and 10x events. These are people with all the gear and no idea. They'll tell you about their million dollar idea, but they'll tell you while they're on the lunch break in the 9 to 5 job. They will watch, I'm not your guru on net. but in reality they are not going to do anything to make that dream a reality. But they would love to tell you about the new book that they've read by the latest popular

inspirational guru. And they'll tell you that, oh, I'm booking a day off to see Tony Robbins, but they're never ever going to actually do anything with all this knowledge that they're acquiring because they'd rather post about it online, talk about it to people that aren't really interested rather than actually put in the hard yards and the graft to be successful. So they're entrepreneurs and they're an easy group to sell to because they're, smart enough to realize they want to escape the nine to five or they realize they need to do something about it yet they haven't really got the ability or the balls to go and take that step. What's your advice from turning from a entrepreneur into a real entrepreneur?

Do you know, honestly, I don't think there's any advice I could give to help them. If they can't do that by themselves, then they're not going to make it anyway. Do you see what I mean? They're a great group for entrepreneurs to trick and separate from their money because a fool in their money is parted very, very easily. So that's who entrepreneurs usually target is one-trepreneurs. Okay, so tell us what a entrepreneur is. So a entrepreneur is, and this is what I'm mainly focusing on the moment, so these are people that are selling shortcuts to success to

entrepreneurs and idiots. So these are people that you'll see in your Facebook feed, you'll see in your Instagram feeds, telling you how you can do a three-day boot camp with them for a discounted price of $1,9,000. $997 and you will be making six figures from drop shipping in six months time or from passive income through property in six months time or how you can make money flipping products and e-commerce or how you can make a million dollars a year through crypto mining. But they're always selling you a course to achieve that. The best example I can give at this would be the gold rush.

There's a gold rush on to be rich and wealthy, but these people don't own any gold and aren't mining for gold or aren't digging for gold. What they are doing is selling the spades to idiots. So idiots can go and dig for the gold. They're making more money from selling spades than they are making from actual gold. And that's what entrepreneurs are. And there's hundreds and hundreds of them on social media.

What are the red flags to look out for so my listeners don't get scammed by a entrepreneur? Well, red flags are they'll be talking at a success resources event. They've paid to be at that show. They're telling you they've got a time-limited offer on an online course or they've got limited stock. of an online course. If it's an online course, how can it be limited? You're not physically selling a product off a shelf higher. And they'll be telling you, it gets the back of the room now,

and they stack their value. The price will usually end in a seven. So for one day only, it'll be $97 for the first 50 people that go to the back of the room and sign up now. They'll inflate their achievements. But really, look at a success resources event as a perfect example. How many people in that crowd are actually going to become a millionaire or make six figures from the thing that this entrepreneur is selling, I would guess probably less than 1%. Yeah. In any other industry, if you had a product that only works 1% of the time, there would be something done about it, wouldn't there?

You'd be done for false advertising or for faulty goods. But in this industry, because it isn't regulated, they can get away with it. And that's what they hang the hat on. They hang the hat on that one story about one person that's been to their course once that's gone on and done well as proof it works. But imagine in medical trials for a new drug. If you had a drug that only cured one in a hundred people, would everyone be rushing to use that drug? Yeah, it's so true. And now that I think about it, there's always these weird commercials on the radio and on TV, and it's like they're allowed to freely advertise their scam. It's kind of ridiculous.

And this is kind of where we're at at the moment. And this is probably why Mike Winnit does well on LinkedIn. It's because there's a movement now that's aware of this, because with the internet, it's a double-edged sword, surely you can target entrepreneurs and idiots to potentially. sell your scam to. But on the flip side of that, these idiots have also got social media. So when you do scam these people, they're quick to announce it on social media. Look at the Grant Cardone 10x conference in Miami recently. On the first day, there was about 2,500 tweets saying about how the speakers were just trotting out the usual drivel. It was just basically an hour-long pitch by each of the speakers there. They were teaching you how to suck eggs. So what are you actually gaining from being there? nothing apart from you get the gravitas that's attached to your social media post saying, hey, look at me in Miami at the 10X growth con.

But that's not going to make you rich. If anything, it's major poorer being there. You've took a day off work and you've spent money to be there to hear something you could ultimately hear for free on YouTube. I know that you're trying to uncover these entrepreneurs. I was browsing through your LinkedIn and you've got a goal for 2019 to uncover the truth behind get rich quick schemes pushed by entrepreneurs. So you're trying to see if these shortcuts to success can really work and you're actually investing your own time and money into different popular passive income streams.

So whether that's cryptocurrency or real estate, YouTube revenue e-commerce, all these different types of things that entrepreneurs are trying to sell us. Tell us, what are you trying to prove with this experiment and what are your thoughts on passive income? So it's an interesting question here now. So passive income, I do believe in passive income because there's some things that I've invested in that are long, term proven strategies. So I've invested in properties. I've invested in other businesses. I've invested in stocks and shares. They're shown to work, but they're not very sexy and they don't give you the returns promised by what these entrepreneurs push on Instagram and social media. So I do believe in passive income, but it's a longer play. In the short term, what I wanted to do is actually

investigate some of these, what I would call cons or scams and see if there is anything in them because it's easy for me to stand on the outside and say it's all nonsense or bullshit, but that's just opinion. So I thought, I was successful in my last business. It's sold for multiple millions. I'm now in a position where I don't necessarily have to work. I was being targeted by people on LinkedIn to say, you're just negative. The reason why you aren't successful because they don't know my backstory is because you won't give these a go. And so I thought, do know what I will do then I will play you at your own game and I will do the courses and the scams and try these passive income streams that you are promoting and I will report it to my sort of crowd or people that follow me or are connected to me online. And they can see the journey from start to finish.

So I will do all the boot camps. I will do all the online courses. I will join their Facebook groups and I will do to the letter as I am told by these entrepreneurs and report it as is for people to say. for free on my YouTube channel. I don't think necessarily that all of them will be successful. I don't necessarily want to go out and try and prove that they're all wrong. I would love to be proved wrong. I would love to be wrong about every single one because then if they are right and I can make a million dollars from all of these passive income streams, this time next year I'll come on the show and say, I was wrong, but I'm also six million dollars richer.

And so you're giving each one of these passive income streams a con rate. Con rating, yeah. You're hilarious. So you're giving each one of these a con rating. Have you started already? Have you seen if any of them are working or not working or one's more viable than the other? Yeah, so we've started now. And in a weird way, this is like the lull, the quiet before the storm,

because we're undercover in a lot of these groups. So I'm going to boot camps undercover. I'm in Facebook groups undercover. I'm doing online courses undercover. So I can't give too much away. but we will start releasing content on the YouTube channel so people can see what scams we are investigating, where we're up to,

and what we hope to do is maybe do a little docu-series or a little documentary on each scam at different stages. So this is what we did to start, this is what we found out, this is while we were doing the courses, and this is what the end results were. So you can kind of follow that online. But once I can tell you about, so we've got crypto mining rigs running,

so far they've not hit the numbers that we were promised, not by a long shot. And we've also had some technical and hardware issues with the mining rigs already. So they were supposed to last three years. We're three months in and we've already have to start replacing parts. We've got the properties that we've got in the UK. They're not making the yields promised. We've got a villa in Spain that we're just about to start advertising to rent that out.

And again, the numbers promised there aren't the numbers that we're now looking at after we've made the purchase. So a lot of the people that hooked us in with these huge headlining figures and return on investments, not one of them so far as living up to what was expected, which, to be honest, was kind of expected anyway. But it's easy to say that I'm not do it, but now I can do it and say, well, look, this is exactly what we did. This is exactly where we advertise it. This is exactly how much money we made or lost. So on some of them, I can't tell you anything about them because I'm actually working alongside or in these groups with what I suspect are entrepreneurs.

Some of them even like me and think I'm the best student they've got. You know, it's so funny that you're doing this because people might think that you're negative and that you're just trying to like cause trouble. But really, you're trying to help people. You're trying to help people from being scammed and being tricked into losing their money and investing their money in something that's just going to make a entrepreneur rich. So that's actually a very noble thing that you're doing. Do you know what I would say? I will say this now. And this goes to people that run these courses. is if you hand on heart genuinely believe the hyperball that you use to promote your course, you would have no problem in inviting me in.

Because why would you? Because this would be the best advertising you will ever get. Because I am going to go and put it on YouTube and put it on LinkedIn where some of my posts are doing between 500,000 to a million views. And that will be the best one of advertising for you. If I come and do your boot camp or get mentored by you and then I go on and make a million dollars a year doing that, surely that's the best advert ever. but you'll be amazed how many don't want to know or don't want to speak to me. And I think if you think this is

targeting you or you think that this isn't right or makes you feel nervous, then you are part of the problem. A hundred percent. I can imagine this to be like a Netflix series. Have you ever considered anything like that? Well, if Netflix, if you're listening, I'm open to offers because everything I've invested in so far the last three months hasn't made me a penny so I could do with the money. Yeah. Okay. So another fun fact about you is that you've got a lot of fake, books out there. They're on your website and they look legit. And actually my research assistants, we're looking all over for them. And then we came to realize it was just a joke. Yeah. One of them is called entrepreneur. Everyone is winning but you. The other one is called,

Are You Average? Forty telltale signs that you're average. These books are fake, but you do have like a deeper meaning behind them. You argue that the average person leads a beautiful and fulfilling life, but nobody wants to admit that they're average. Why do you think that nobody is okay with being normal? And maybe let's start with some of the internal psychological factors that might be at play. Yeah, so I would say some people are okay being normal or average. I just wish more people were happy with that. Because if you're unhappy with what you've got now, it doesn't matter if you go and make a million dollars or $10 million,

you still won't be happy because those deep-rooted or underlying issues will still be there. And I know that from personal experience. When I sold my business and it's crazy as this might sound so on, you would think you'd be happy if you had two. $2 million in your bank account or $3 million in your bank account or $5 in your bank account. But honestly, I felt completely indifferent. I did not feel any happy by having that money. So unless you're happy with what you've got and you appreciate the things that you've got,

it doesn't matter how much money you have, you're never going to be happy with that. But I think people aren't happy with being average or they have convinced themselves, they can't settle for being average, mainly because of social media and how everything's pushed online. what you're seeing now is heavily filtered or photoshop's images pushed online with hundreds and thousands of likes and then people start thinking that that's what's important but really this is a false image of a moment in their life that they've heavily filtered and altered but then they're putting that out as if they look like that all the time or their life is like that all the time when in reality they've probably leased that

car they're probably at house viewing but they've made sure they've filmed their Instagram live there and stuff like that. So I think social media's got a lot to blame. It's the equivalence today of, say, body issues or image issues that people might have had during the 90s, you know, with magazines and stuff like that. It's just on a wider scale now. Yeah. So that's what I think is what people are more interested in. They'd rather look successful or look happy or a detriment of real life in their everyday life. So people are putting pressure on themselves to aspire to be something that they see almost 24-7. But that's external factors that are probably implementing their internal psychology,

if that makes sense. Yeah, totally. So your books aren't the only thing that is fake. Your name is fake too. Mike Winnett is actually just a stage name. What's the story and motivation behind creating this alter ego, Mike Winnett? Really, it was just

a two-fold thing really. I was demonstrating how easy it was to create a fake persona online and show you that if I can do it and actually get bookings for demotivational talks, which have never happened, anyone can. And the funny thing about it was, I started getting testimonials and reviews for my talks that had never happened. So people would say that they'd been there and I'd changed their life or some of my words, how would they affect them and stuff. But none of these

events had ever happened. And I wasn't asking for these reviews or testimonials. Wait, so you never did any talks? That's just all fake. I've never done one. I've never done one, but I get booked. People contact me every week, ask me if I'll come and do one. That's so funny. And this is what I'm saying. I'm doing this purely for fun. And I've not got a product to sell to you. Now imagine if I had a product where I think everybody can be successful in a millionaire and I was selling it to you for $2,000. I could easily use this for evil or bad, but I don't. I'm just showing you how, if I can do it and convince what you'd consider smart, intelligent, professional people, that this is real. Imagine if I was actually crafting targeted

ads to you, if I was getting fake testimonials, video testimonials, going on stage, and talking at an event saying about, you know, how this course has changed all these people's lives. Do you think I could make money from doing this? Yeah, definitely. And is it ethical to do so? No. So now this is where I think what I do is possibly misinterpreted. The people that probably think that I'm being negative and not very nice or mean or calling them out,

I'm probably doing this to help them in a roundabout way, but also taking the piss out of them. Because if you're stupid and you would fall for that stuff anyway, then you deserve to be laughed at a little bit in my mind. Okay, so why the fake stage name? Why didn't you go under your name? Well, really, because when we sold our business, because I had a business with some of my friends, but when we sold that business, when you go through the sale, they hold back a certain amount of money and they have certain conditions linked to that. Now, I know how I talk online, even as my old name, didn't really align with how they wanted to take that business. So for the sake of ring fencing that future payment that I was due, I thought it would be better to remove any reference to my

old business and also change my surname so there was no link to the old company. So that's what I did. Got it. So your real name is Mike, just not Mike Winnett. Yes, it's the same first name, which is confusing sometimes. So for our listeners, is there any advice within that that they can take away? If they're working at a corporate job where it slipped down upon sometimes, even just have your own personal opinion or just not post about work, would you advise? that they might take a stage name instead

if they wanted to either start a side hustle or give whatever perspective that they feel like. No, it's a stupid idea. It's hard enough being one person without having to juggle two personas. However, a lot of these fakers do have an alter ego. They just openly admit it. So you've got all your people on there

pushing these copy and paste motivational stories online, but that's all a persona that they've created. All these ultra-successful back-slapping groups that you see an engagement group you see on LinkedIn, they've all got a fake persona online. They just won't admit that. So my advice would just be you.

Stop trying to jump on what other people seem to do and seems to get attention or seems to be successful. Everyone wants that done for you, guide to success riches or creating an online brand. And if you're going to have to create an alter ego for your own personal brand, or you're going to have to outsource your personal brand, then you're missing a point completely, I think.

If you're dull and boring, just be dull and boring. don't try and be funny or try and create an online persona that's the opposite of that, because why would you do that? It's like almost be comfortable in what you are. Honestly, I'm like Mike Winnett when I'm not Mike Winnett, if that makes sense. It's almost just a name now. I've always called bullshit on this kind of stuff. I did it when I used to have my own business.

I'd call bullshit on the sector that I worked in or the industry that I worked in. I still call bullshit on people on LinkedIn. I think really that's what you need to. If that's how you are, really, you can live and die by those decisions. it's when you're creating this image and then if you go and meet that person in real life and they're not like that, it's a disappointment. And then you feel ripped off or let down or disappointed.

So I wouldn't say create an alter ego, just be yourself. And if yourself is funny, be funny. If yourself is a bit out there and a bit left field, be a bit out there and left field. Okay, let's talk about before you were Mike Winnett. You mentioned a few times that you co-founded a startup and I'm sure that was a lot of hard work.

And Elon Musk himself has described starting a company to be like eating glass and staring into the abyss. That doesn't sound very fun. So what was your startup experience like? Mine was a bit different to Elon. So he started off with no hair and got hair at the end of all his businesses and success. So I started off with hair and I've started to lose mine. So my tail towards compared to his, it's completely different. But I'd worked in startups for 10 years in total, five years for other people. And then I felt like I'd learned enough to kind of do this on my own. But I would say it's not for everyone. I enjoy and thrive in that sort of chaos and uncertainty, but I don't think many people do, or not everyone can thrive in that environment.

So if you think hand on heart, you have the drive determination and you're willing to risk not getting a regular wage and living and dying by solely your decisions, because that's a big thing. Most people always look for an excuse and at work, it'll be, well, I've not done that because I don't like my boss or I don't like my co-workers or I didn't get that sale because of price or whatever. You can't use that bullshit excuse when you're your own boss. It's you eat what you kill. You've got no money coming in. You've got no investors if you wanted to do it the way I did it. And then you have to make a product, get it out there and sell it as soon as possible. Because if you don't, they're taking your house off you or you can't pay your bills.

So if you're willing to do that, live by your own decisions, have no scapegoats, no excuses, sure try it. I'd say it's worth it. But a lot of these people that turn up to these shows looking for that one secret ingredient that they're missing or that next life hack or business hack to be successful. Don't bother doing this stuff. There's no point. Just be happy with getting the best salary you can get that's guaranteed. Because in that environment, you're probably going to earn more than what you would, you know, setting up your own business, if that makes sense.

Okay, so you're saying that not everybody is cut out to be an entrepreneur, but how do you know if you are cut out to be an entrepreneur? Yeah, we have a super unique company culture. We're all about obsessive excellence. We even call ourselves scrappy hustlers. And I'm really picky when it comes to my employees. My team is growing every day. We're 60 people all over the world.

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and get 20% off, you can use code profiting. Go to workinggenius.com. Again, that's working genius.com. Stop guessing. Start working in your genius. Well, I think you'd know. If you've gone to your fifth Tony Robbins event and you'll still not set up your own business

or you've still not started your own side hustle, that life's not for you. So save yourself the $10,000 that you spend every year to go and see him and put it into something else. put it into stocks and shares, put it into the bank account, put it into property. You're not going to be an entrepreneur or a success in your own company or setting up your own business. You're not going to be that thing. So I don't know necessarily what I can say there to

say, how do you know you won't be? You do know. Some people do this because they think they have to. Other people do it because they know deep inside and that this is something that they can do and they are going to do and they're not going to stop. And they will do the 100-hour work weeks, stuff like that that's needed. And they will sacrifice a salary. and they will risk it for the longer term reward. But if you've got a question about against any of those things, then what's the point? Don't bother. Okay, so one of the things that I heard you talk about

that I thought was really interesting is that you believe that if you start a business, you need a clear exit strategy and that there's a big difference between creating a business and creating a job for yourself. I think this is an important lesson. Yeah, so especially with a lot of these things where if you create an online group,

and it could be an online group where you post content every day and it is the whatever group it might be, it's the Mike Winnet marketing group or it might be the Mike Winnet property company. And I've got a little property group on Facebook and every day I'm going on there and I'm doing the content and then I'm doing all these shows. All I'm doing there is creating a job for myself

and I'm sacrificing my own time for money. So all I've done there is created myself a job. Creating yourself a business where you can remove yourself from that environment and it can run and make money and you can do other things. And that's just an example on social media. There's other examples where you could have a beauty salon and you could be a beauty therapist there.

But if you're there working the most hours in that business and if you go on holiday, the business doesn't run effectively or it doesn't make any money again. You've just created a job for yourself, which is cool if that's what you want. It's just I think a lot of people confuse having their own business with being self-employed, if that makes sense. Yeah.

How do you suggest that we create a business that can be sold? Well, I always say start with the ending in minds. Like, what do you actually want? Because you'll be amazed how many people haven't got a clue what they want. So I was very clear in what I wanted. Our target was 10 million pounds,

and it was in three years. So every decision we made was to make that possible. And we just backwards plans from that. So it makes every decision easier. Do we hire that person? Yes, we do because that helps get closer to 10 million in three years. Do we do that piece of work? Well, no, while it might appeal to you

the short term because it was a big piece of work or it was worth a lot of money. Does it help you get to your end goal? Well, no. Well, we won't do that work then. You don't go and chase the shiny objects. You stay focused on that goal. So I always say backwards. If you want to sell a business for 10 million pounds, you've got to think, how do I make it worth that for a start? Who could potentially buy it? How do I get on their radar from the off? How do I let them know that it's something we're interested in? What would my product need to look like? Or how would it complement potential buyers products. These are all things that you have to think about. But if you're just thinking about should I go leaflet dropping around my local area, you're not thinking of the bigger picture. Well,

you know the answer to that. If that's going to help you get to your goal because you know what your clear goal is, I don't think people think about this enough at all. Some people are two, three, four years into their business, but they haven't got an actual clue where they're going or what they want. But we were and I was very, very clear in what I needed to do. So that made pricing easy. Because if you want $10 million, let's just say, you can either sell one product for $10 million, you can sell 10 products for $1 million, you can work out your numbers. Then if you can work out your numbers and you've got an end date in mind,

you can say, well, how many of these do we need to sell per month to get that goal? And then if you can look at potentially who could buyers, you can decide, well, do I want to create competitive tension with that potential buyers so they buyers because they want to protect their own business? Or do you think, well, shall we befriends that company so we can complement their product and they might buyers out because it complements that product? So all these things are things that we thought of in week one, two and three. Now, how many people think about this in week one, two and three of a business?

I would guess probably less than 10%. But if you do that and you've got a clear goal of where you're going and what you're doing, it's so much easy. So if your side hustle is making, I don't know, picture frames on Instagram, newsflash, you're not going to sell that business for $10 million. So don't have that goal. But you might say if I can do $100,000 a year, I'm happy. Well, cool, that's now your end goal. Work backwards from that. How many frames do you need to make? Okay, can you physically do that yourself? No, so you'll need to employ someone. How much will that cost? So it makes all them decisions easy then, I think in my mind. Business isn't hard, honestly. Business isn't hard if you follow the rules and you're willing to put in the graph. Yeah, I mean, I think that is exceptional advice. You actually just inspired me. I feel like I need to think about my end goal. Oh, don't say that. No, no, don't say that. Hopefully I've demotivated you from doing this stuff. It's too hard. Don't bother doing it.

No, I'm a go-getter. I'm not worried. But that's what I'm saying. And this is kind of something that always gets put to be like, oh, well, some people just need encouragement. I don't think they do. It's like, if you're going to do this, you do not need encouragement. If you are going to do this, you aren't going to be demotivated by me or anybody else, all the naysayers. You will go and do it. But if you are easily swayed by these things, then you aren't going to be successful. I'll be honest. I'd never heard of Gary Vee a year ago, as mad as that sounds.

I'd never ever heard of the guy. I'd never heard of Grant Cardone a year ago. I never heard of these guys. I never watched these entrepreneurs or these sort of celebrity business people on YouTube. Do you know why? Because I was too focused on my own shit to care what they were doing or saying.

I just worked hard, did the things that I thought were right and inevitably it turned out to be right. But I can name you hundreds of people I come into contact with or speak to online that could quote every single Gary V episode or every single Grant Cardone quote, but they don't do anything about it because they're too busy looking for that next thing

and focusing on the next tip from an entrepreneur to actually work on their own shit. Does that make sense? Yeah. I think you actually found me from Gary Vee. And funny story about Gary Vee, so everybody thinks I'm a huge fan of Gary Vee, but I'm really not like you. I didn't know about him last year. I just saw an opportunity to use automation to target his audience. And now every comment that I post on his posts, I'm like number one comment with 100 likes, all this kind of stuff. So is this on Instagram? Are you doing this on Instagram? On LinkedIn. Oh, LinkedIn. Yeah, so I don't follow him on LinkedIn. He's not really his platform, is it? LinkedIn. He's more YouTube, Instagram. He's more YouTube Instagram, but LinkedIn is my platform, so I've just been targeting on there. It's as if he owns shares in these

companies. I know. He's huge. You go and see him talk and what does he do? Nobody tells you to go and put your money into what advertise on Instagram, advertising on Facebook. Yeah, that's true. But what you should always do when anyone's giving you any advice is follow the money. Why would someone give you that advice? Well, because he's got shares in them companies. So there's more people advertise on them things. The share price goes up. Advertising becomes more expensive. Did you know this? No. Now what do you think? It's a good marketing strategy. If I own shares in a company and I could proactively talk to an audience of three million people a week and my advice of them was and advertise on Instagram.

Yeah, I own shares in that company or go and advertise on Facebook, but I own shares in that company, and I know that the price to advertise on these platforms is going to increase. Therefore, the share price will increase. Why am I giving this free advice to people? Follow the money.

Who gains from this information? And you'll be amazed by how many of these companies or how many of these people are involved in other companies and other things that you just don't know what I mean. Yeah. Well, I would say out of everybody, Gary Vee is probably the best motivational speaker.

At least he does say real stuff. In my opinion, he's sort of like real as I've been like listening to his stories. He's not a entrepreneur, I don't think, compared to the other. No, I don't think he is. This is what I want to say. I've not got up with all these people. I think it's cool if you're making money and you're successful and you've got all these business.

And if you look at Gary, the numbers show you that he's got multiple businesses and he makes money doing all these things. But it's the ones I think are the next level below it. That's the one I've got the most problem with it. it's these almost like copy and paste or paint by numbers Gary V that are saying, oh, well, Gary V signs off his video with a signature, so I'm going to do that. And then I'm going to sell a 1-997 Instagram course,

or I'm going to do this, that, and the other. It's like, well, you're not doing the hard yards. Do you know what I mean? Gary Vee was doing this in 2006. If someone comes out of the blue, you've never heard of three months ago, and then all of a sudden they're all over Instagram, they're all over Facebook with all these. You've got to ask why, how, is it true?

Where have they got this money from? At least with certain people, you can say, oh, I can see their story that they did have that business. That business was sold in 2008. That business was sold in 2011. They acquired that business to 2013. But I just think people are too lazy possibly to actually go and look at any of these gurus that they all follow blindly.

Yeah. And I think a big red flag is if they're certified 10x teacher or whatever they're calling them, I'm like, if you have to take somebody else's course and just regurgitate whatever they're selling, it's obviously a scam. Well, I had this other day, someone said to me, without knowing any backgrounds, if you want to be successful, you should let me mentor you. So I said, cool, I'm down for it. You tell me the time and place and I will come and do it because I was thinking this will make a great episode for the entrepreneur.

So I called him out and said, all right, then fine, let's do it then. And then sent him two messages, he didn't reply. And then filled in his website. He still didn't reply. and I said, come on, let me be mentored by in, just let me film some of it. And again, he sent me a message now and saying, oh, I don't want to do this, sorry, blah, blah, blah. It's like, why not? If it was legit what you were doing, you'd be happy to.

I would. If someone had to come here now and film what we're doing this year for free, by all means do so, it will save us having to buy videographers or pay videographers. You can come and film everything we do because it's all real, and we're not selling you anything at the end of it. I'm not going to sell you crypto mining rigs. I'm not going to sell you stocks and shares. I'm not going to sell you a three-day bootcamp to how I'm,

to invest in property in Spain. Yeah. We're not. It's just like, this is what we've done, this is how much money we made, or this is what we've done, this is how little money we made. There's no edge to it.

And that's the bit I think people can't get the edge round. Let's take it back from before you had your startup company. You actually did work in corporate. You were, I think, at a bank early in your career. Yeah. You have a funny story about when you decided to leave, and I think my listeners will get a kick out of it. Can you tell us that?

Yeah, so I worked for the bank, and that is what you're now. or your grandma would say was a job for life. It was a job that is well respected in the community. So I worked for one of the big banks in the UK. And on my fourth day there, my line manager had a broach on, like a pin badge, a certificate on the wall, and he was looking through a catalogue. And I asked him what he was doing.

And he said, I have been here for 30 years now. I'm allowed to pick anything I want from this catalogue. And I said, right, okay, what are you going to pick? And he picked a lawnmower. And it just made me think, 30 years service, the best 30 years of your life, you've dedicated, you've worked overtime, you've been through ups and downs in the bank, and you're rewarded with a lawnmower. And that was the day I decided to quit.

So I was at the bank for four days and I quit. And my dad couldn't believe it. And I said, I'm not working for anyone for 30 years just to get a sit on lawnmower. That's so funny. And he was happy with that, by the way. He was happy with that. He was made up that, oh, I can't believe I can pick anything from this catalog. You know, we could have picked a club.

He could have picked a set of golf clubs. But no, no, he settled for that lawmower. And I thought, no, I can't be asked doing this. So you were an entrepreneur from basically, you were always an entrepreneur then if you only spent four days at a bank? I mean, I did other jobs. I should know what it was. I just think, like, I have never, ever felt that someone else can put a value on what

I'm worth. And I've just thought, well, I'll just do my own thing. Like now, I could easily just go get a job somewhere. I could easily do business mentoring. But I'd rather just do my own thing. think. Yeah. Well, it seems to have worked out. Awesome. So let's talk about your community on LinkedIn. You've garnered a lot of fame. You call yourself a LinkedIn influenza, a play on influencer. And so tell us, how did you grow your LinkedIn network? So I talk now the same way that I used to talk

when I had a business. So I've only been on LinkedIn four years. And for two of those years, it was pushing my own company. And I just made observation about what I thought was crap or wrong. with LinkedIn, what I thought was rubbish about the industry that I worked in, and I just spoke or communicated on LinkedIn in the very same way that I do in real life. I ever think something stupid, I'll say that stupid, if I think something is a bit wanky, I'll say it's wanky, I'm not really fussed about that and I had literally no filter. It's just, if I think that, I will say that. And it got a reaction from certain people, as if you can't talk like this because it's

LinkedIn, but it's no, why are you changing the way you talk because it's LinkedIn? So I was just being myself and it just kind of grew arms and legs really Some people used to like it Some people used to not like it As the case may be But it didn't really bother me I just stayed kind of real to who I am

And what I am And just carried on making those observations Whether it be about business, life or LinkedIn in general And the influenza tag that I added Was obviously a play on words Of being an influencer Because all of a suddenly

started popping up here there and everywhere With no sort of backgrounds No sort of credibility No qualifications So I was saying that they are spreading like a virus, but by using the word influenza, I would get corrected probably daily from idiots saying, oh, you don't even know how to spell influencer. And I just thought that was quite amusing that people would constantly tell me stuff like that. It's like, oh, I didn't even realize. Yeah. And something else that's funny that you do on LinkedIn is that you mimic this broochie style that Josh Fetcher, who actually came on my show, coined or started. And you do this, but then you talk about totally opposite things. demotivational content.

Yeah, so Josh was one of the original ones to block me, actually. So he was one of the inspirations behind this because he is kind of the godfather of this absolutely ridiculous, paint by numbers, inspirational posts that will break the algorithm. He started a lot of that. He's got Banff Media, which then can do these posts for you. Now, if you're outsourcing your posts and your social media to Banff Media, is it really a personal brand? Is it really you?

No. It's just Josh and his team. of, I don't know what you'd call them, like buzzword kind of, they probably just sit there, just regurgers, sitting the same stories, because you see the same stories being passed around the inspirational leaders that are in the top voices on LinkedIn. You can tell a bump for me to a client, a mile off. I can anyway, because it's all exactly the same thing, but yeah, so. Hello, young improfitors. Running my own business has been one of the most rewarding things I've ever

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written. End on a question. End on agree. Start with an opening line. It's so basic. It's so basic. And I can't believe people can't write them themselves, number one, or can't think of a way to write, which is more engaging than that style. So, first of all, I love Josh. Oh, I don't mind him. I don't mind him. I think he's the smart one. It's everybody else who's stupid.

It's not his fault that everybody else falls for it. Yeah, cool. No, I get that. I get that 100%. It's cool that he does that. And everybody needs a dance partner, don't they? And mine was just Josh for about two weeks before he took his ball home and stopped playing.

But it's cool because I've got another like 15 of his clients to go after. Oh, my God. And they all block me. And they all report me to LinkedIn. and they all try and get me, but then they say, you've copied my post, but I've not copied your post. If you read the words, I've changed your post. You want to be more concerned with the people that are in your engagement pods

that have copied your post word for word. I don't see you complaining about them. So when LinkedIn get in touch of me to try and say, we've had a complaint from Bridget or we've had a complaint from Oleg, we've had a complaint from Tim Denning or Michael Chapman or any of these online characters, but by the way, check their backgrounds. And let's see if they really have hired,

a different person every day. Because if you notice, they always seem to hire people that are ill-equipped for the job. Every single day. Now, what company in the world could employ 300 people a year that can't do the job, that aren't qualified to do the job, that haven't got shoes on their feet, that turned up late to interview, savage by a shark on the bus on the way to the interview? Because we all know that's bullshit, don't we? So if you've got a company with 300 hires in there, and they're all your best hire ever, because that's how they all end, Number one, your hiring is rubbish. You need to get a new hiring manager. The company wouldn't make money because you've got no one in there that can actually do the job that they're employed for it. If you've got someone working in admin that is never done admin before, you've got someone in there doing sales, it's never done sales before, you've got someone in there that's got no arms and legs and he's driving the bus to get to work, it's not going to work, is it? So it's so obvious it's fake. And I'm just amazed at the brain dead sheeper that click like. But then obviously it doesn't really happen as much now. So that's why they created the engagement pods and they all like each other's content. If you look at all these posts, it's the same 75 people that comment on them first,

and it'll always be amazing stories, so inspiration. It's almost like they're told what's comment as well, which I know if you're in, say, Michael's engagement pod, he does pretty much tell you what's a post on them. And I know this because that's the pod I had the most trouble with. Okay, wait, so explain this engagement pod more. Yeah. So an engagement pod is when a group of like-minded individuals get together and say,

look, the content we post is pretty shit and no one engages with it. So why don't we all like each other's content? And then LinkedIn's algorithm will think it's popular and then they'll push that content out to more people. So we'll get seen by more and more people. But they all label themselves authentic or honest and all this kind of thing. And they've got this fake persona where they're all really nice on the surface. However, once you're in that pod, if you don't like so-and-so's pod quick enough or you don't make the right comment or you disagree with that then they threaten to kick you out, and then they threaten you with,

where your content's not going to get seen anymore. So I know people in their pod that are almost held hostage. But the ironic thing about it is, they claim to be authentic and genuine and posting content that's good, yet they rely on the pods for that content to be pushed. So if anything,

you're making your own platform sterile, and it's not authentic. If your content is only boosted or seen because it's unauthentically boosted, is that authentic content. So there's the iron, isn't it? Yet they would say that they've made LinkedIn a better place, but no, what you've actually done is someone here that's not in a pod

could write the best piece ever, the most honest and open piece of content today, and put it on LinkedIn, and it could be a real tale of a genuine hire. The underdog that's done really, really well, and blossomed since they've been employed. But no one's going to see that content. Why?

Because we've got Tony, who's also Bammy or Lacey, his wife, or Tim Denning posting some absolute drivel that's then liked by 100 people in their pod within two minutes, and then that gets forced into all of our feeds. Now, that's not authentic. That's not genuine. And newsflash, you've not written that. One of Josh Vetchers' minions has written that for you.

So you've not even hired that person. And I'm talking to people like Liz Ryan here. They all know, because I parody their posts all the time. What I've done is, which kind of made my sort of name with, really, is I've just took their look at me, aren't I, amazing type story, and I've made it into look at me, aren't I a really bad boss? But I'm not self-aware, if that makes sense. So I think it's amazing advice that I'm giving you,

but really I'm a really bad boss, like when I say stuff like, hire women because there's a gender wage gap so you can save money on your business and stuff like that. And that's all I do. I just take their good news stories and their fake inspirational stories and just turn them into unhappy and demotivational stories. I'm just taking the piss out of them, really. And I'm taking the business out of how easy it is to create that online sona.

This entrepreneur, get rich or die, buying series that I'm doing now on YouTube, investigating these passive income streams, has only really been born out of having time on my hands and realizing that I might as well do something positive or good with the Mike Winning character rather than just continually calling out individuals for posting crap banff media posts. Well, I'm not taking sides. I like both of you. No, but like I said, you know, he may have skeletal, didn't he? Batman had the Joker. So Mike Winnit wouldn't work if there wasn't this stuff on there.

If I had nothing to parody, then what would I be doing? Yeah. Speaking of your parody, do you ever worry that what you're doing is kind of discouraging people who might just need a little bit of positivity? Or do you really feel that if you need positivity or motivation, then you're not going to be anything anyway? Yeah, it's like you should be self-motivated. There must be something inside you that makes you do things. If you're looking on LinkedIn for a post by a self-appointed Australian inspirational leader that has a hashtag brains over boobs, you need to really readjust your sort of mindset. If you're watching videos by people like that for a little bit of inspiration, then you've got it all wrong.

You should be motivated by, I don't know, your kids or your financial situation or your social status or whatever. It should be inside you to motivate. Here's one. Look at the world's most wealthy people. And I'm talking about the top 0.1%. How many of them do you think are on YouTube or Instagram or LinkedIn looking for a motivational meme or a good news story to motivate them for the day? They don't give a fuck. They don't care. They are out there motivated to be successful. They're probably not even in Instagram. They're definitely not pushing a course for 1997. They're definitely not asked about like. and followers. They don't care about any of this stuff. So if you look at what we are force-fed, it's not what the very, very successful and ultra-rich people do. They don't do any of this stuff. They're not watching YouTube videos about the 10x growth con for three hours a night rather than actually doing stuff about it. Okay, something that you say pretty often is action versus the law

of attraction. So can you explain this thinking? Yeah, you can put all you want on your vision board, but if you're not going to do anything about it, nothing's going to happen. that's it in a nutshell. What use is a vision board if you're not going to do anything about it? You've actually got to take positive, proactive steps to make them things happen. So it requires action to achieve things, just sitting there hoping it's going to happen and putting a few pictures on your vision board isn't going to make things happen.

But that's what you'll get. That's what you get from a lot of people. So that's why I say that the law of attraction is bullshit. The law of action is far more powerful. Yeah, I think the law of attraction is, puts you in the state of mind, but then you actually have to do something about it. Nothing's just going to fall on your lap because you're thinking about it.

But that bit's the hard bit, isn't it? Yeah. That bit is the hard bit. It's easy to find that picture of that Malibu House and cut it out or print it out and then put it on your whiteboard. But what is your actual plan to get that? What are you doing today to make that happen? Where are you going to be in 90 days?

Where are you going to be in 120 days? Where are you going to be in five years time? But that bit is too hard. But having your little vision board on your desk at work, so your colleagues say, oh, wow, you go into the Tony Robbins event. or, oh, that's interesting, you're going to have plastic surgery or whatever. But how do them things happen if you don't go and do something about it? Yeah.

Do you see what I mean? People are always trying to get rich. People are always trying to lose weight. And people will always look for shortcuts for them things. So there will always be people willing to part with cash to find out a shortcut or a lazy person's way of doing it. But there are guaranteed results that will help you get these things, but they are hard to do. And that's why most people don't do them. What's the stat? Is it one in 500 people a millionaires?

I'm not positive. I think it might be that. So just based on that number, say if there's 30,000 people at a Grant Cardone convention and Grant Cardone saying, you can all do it. Well, the stats tell me that you're telling me you're lying, Grant. You're talking bullshit. But of course you tell us we can all do it because you need to sell 30,000 seats at this event. Honestly, if I had a product that I could sell to these people and I was happy doing it

and unethical enough to push that product, I would. would tell every single idiot I come across. You can definitely be a millionaire. Definitely just buy this course now teach you in three days. So speaking of financial goal, with your whole Mike Winnett character, all the stuff that you're doing, do you have an end goal in mind? No, no. It's just literally at the end of it. I'm happy to death the character once I've done this Get Rich or Die Buying series. Once I've done that and hopefully people can then see and they can make an informed decision whether these passive income streams are as lucrative as they're promised by these. people that are selling them, then I'll just go and do other things. Because like I said, I do

have genuine investments that work. And by the way, if these passive income streams genuinely work, I will just continue doing them, but I just won't really document it anymore. That's awesome. Well, I commend you on what you're doing. It's very interesting. You're very entertaining. It was so nice to have you on the show. Where can we find out more about you? And do you have any other companies on the horizon or real books that you're going to put out? Yeah, so the actual book that you mentioned, So the entrepreneur was a book that I actually started to write, and we were 75% the way through writing it. And when we spoke to publishers,

we realized that we didn't even like what they was telling us. So the publisher was telling me how they could make me an Amazon bestseller. And again, it's a con. What you do is you pick a niche that's really easy to sell in because there's not much competition. You drop your price to 99P. You sell that book at 99P for 48 hours. You sell 200 books, and guess what?

You're an Amazon bestseller. And I said, no, no, I want to be an Amazon bestseller because I've sold thousands and thousands of books and made a lot of money to sell in the book. I don't want to make 99P off 200 books. I can't be asked writing a book for that. But you'll see people lap that up because they want to say that they're a best selling author

because then it means that they can then go on stage and then they've then got the credibility. So even that just made me think, Jesus, I'm trying to write a book called the entrepreneur and now you're telling me a contributor way to becoming a best seller. I don't want that. So I just sack the book off completely.

And then I thought, so what can I use the word for? Because I quite like the word. and I thought, well, why don't we just turn it to, instead of sort of targeting people on LinkedIn, which was the original premise for the book, you know, how you can easily create a fake persona and grow it online, why don't we actually look at the schemes and scams and passive income streams, and then turn it into a series and put it on YouTube and just make it free for everyone? So that is what I'm doing. But in terms of actual companies, I've got a property investment company that I've got some of my investments in,

and I've also got a production company that I've co-founded with. one of my old business partners from the online training company that we sold in 2017. So I've got two genuine companies, but they're not like public or what would you call them, like customer facing. They're just like stuff that I do my own thing through. So you can find me on LinkedIn, which is Mike Winnit. It's sometimes a bit hard to find me as LinkedIn, make it difficult to find me on there. I'm on YouTube, which is the main place to find all this entrepreneur content we're going to be uploading. And also, we've started to upload some of the Josh Fetcher inspired humble brags, I've started to animate them as well.

So instead of just putting them out in written format on LinkedIn, I'm also turning them into cartoons. So you can see them. They're on stuff like feminism in the workplace, equality, diversity, work-life balance, mumpreneurs. So they're all sort of like subjects that are worth watching. It's all done in Mike Winnett style. They're quite funny. And then we've also got the Instagram page, which is also Mike Winnett's on Instagram. Awesome.

This was such a funny conversation. I'm so happy you came on the show. and I hope we keep in touch. Cool. Thank you. Thanks for listening to Young and Profiting podcast. Follow Yap on Instagram at Young and Profiting. And check us out at Young & Profiting.com. And now you can chat live with us every single day on our new Slack channel.

Check out our show notes or Young &Proffeting.com for the registration link. And if you're already active on YAP Society, share the wealth and invite your friends. You can find me on Instagram at YAP with Hala or LinkedIn. Just search my name, Hala, Taha. And a huge thanks to our international YAP team. My partner in crime, Timothy Tan, producer Stephanie, Shiv, and Hasham, our audio producer Danny McFatter, marketing manager steves and her promotions team, Kayla and Pardth, our web manager Christian and project manager Ryan, and last but not least, our Yap Society on Slack team, Nicholas and Julian.