Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Vivian Tu: How the Wealthiest People Work, Network, and Invest Their Money | Finance E267

Starting point is 00:00:00 The number one New Year's resolution every single year is to lose weight. The number two is to get their money right, is to get rich, an economic improvement. Because people are starting to think that all they've been doing is spending in December. And now they're like, oh, shoot, my savings account does not look where I want it to be. It's not looking good for me. Vivian, too, she got her start working on Wall Street before carving her path in the media space. She's built an audience of millions, generated billions of streams, but most importantly, help countless people get smarter about their money.

Starting point is 00:00:30 getting rich, it didn't feel like something that was made for people like us. It's so easy to dream. But when you go and you see this is what a rich person looks like, it can be really hard to imagine yourself in that position or really hard to imagine success for people who come from your background who may not have had a dad who worked in the business or a grandfather who worked in the business. I think a big misconception is that rich people work harder than us. Smarter, faster, stronger, better.

Starting point is 00:00:56 They're not. They are lazy, but they are smart kind of lazy. And what they have realized that a lot of people haven't is that money is... Young and profiters! One of the best ways to become rich is to learn how rich people think. This is the gospel, according to Vivian 2. And she knows what she's talking about. Vivian 2 is a former Wall Street trader and entrepreneur turned personal finance educator.

Starting point is 00:01:33 You may know Vivian best as your rich BFF. She's on TikTok and YouTube where she's taught millions of followers how to save, invest, and grow their careers. Vivian was also named as a Forbes 30 Under 30 for 2023, and she's the host of the popular personal finance podcast, Net Worth and Chill. Her first book, Rich A.F, is due out later this year. Vivian, welcome to Young and Profiting Podcast. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so looking forward to this conversation, and you are such an impressive CEO.

Starting point is 00:02:03 You made your first million dollars by the time you were just 27, but I did find out that you group in a family that was pretty conservative in terms of their view of money. So curious to understand, how did your early upbringing shape your mindset around money? Yeah, I think it was certainly a lot of a scarcity mindset. You know, my parents are Chinese immigrants. And for the first two and a half years of my life, I actually was shift back over to China to live with my grandparents. So my parents could get their feet on the ground. My dad would work in New Jersey and commute home to Maryland. my parents were doing what they needed to do to get by. And I think that led to a feeling of survival, survival, survival.

Starting point is 00:02:46 And we were super frugal. My mom still to this day washes Ziploc bags. Like sometimes they have a little mold growing in them. I'm like, that's disgusting. Throw that out. But, you know, I think we were really, really good about saving money. My parents were very much like throw it in the bank, where it'll be safe, or like a little bit of like the metaphorical, put the cash under the mattress. but there wasn't too much conversation around actually navigating career or investing or growing

Starting point is 00:03:13 money or getting rich. It didn't feel like something that was made for people like us. Getting rich and being rich felt like something that we watched in the movies and that was it. And what views did you keep from them and what views did you change? I am still very frugal, which is so funny. People joke about this all the time that I'm the only person who will, at my income, fly Spirit Airlines, and they're always like, what in God's name compels you to do that? And I'm like, well, it's 35 bucks. Like, I'm just trying to get from point A to point B. And they're like, it's a tin can in the sky, please. But there are certain things that I'm just like, it's not worth it to me to be spending money on a quick puddle jumper two-hour flight.

Starting point is 00:03:57 I've definitely kept the budgeting and saving piece. But I have certainly kicked away a lot of of the scarcity mindset, I would say, because when I started my career on Wall Street, I got a mentor who really opened my eyes to the possibilities available to me. And for the first time, I saw someone who looked like me. She was like a young Asian woman with the coolest designer bags and the stilettos that click-clacked on the floor walking into the office. For the first time, I saw someone who I wanted to be like. And the only way for me to get there was through growing my wealth, making more money

Starting point is 00:04:34 in investing. So let's talk about your time on Wall Street in New York. At the time you were single and you were dating around doing like once, two dates a week. What did you learn about financial literacy of people your age while you were dating? More like what I didn't learn. It really just felt like even people who worked in finance, people who had these high finance jobs who were moving millions, billions of dollars around on paper, were pretty bad with their personal finances, there were guys who would rather spend their money on a new Rolex or a new pair of Gucci loafers or an Irmez Thai than have an emergency fund and people who are living so far beyond their means and just putting it on a credit card and rolling that balance over month to

Starting point is 00:05:23 month. And it became pretty apparent to me that even if you worked with money, you weren't always good with your own. Yeah, that makes sense. So as an Asian American woman, like you said, there was not many people that really look like you and you found a mentor who did look like you. Nothing's better than finding a mentor in the workplace that you can kind of idolize and see yourself as. What was your experience like as an Asian American woman? Did you feel like you fit in on Wall Street? Not at all. My entire team was predominantly middle-aged white guys.

Starting point is 00:05:58 And my mentor and manager was the only other woman and the only other Asian person. They really said two-fer on both of us. And seeing her was the first time I realized that I could make it. Because it's so easy to dream, right? But when you go and you see this is what a rich person looks like and they all look a certain way and it's not the way you look, it can be really hard to imagine yourself in that position or really hard to imagine success for people who come from your background

Starting point is 00:06:30 who may not have had a dad who worked in the business or a grandfather who worked in the business. And she would tell me about her upbringing about how her parents ran a restaurant and how she went to a really wonderful college on scholarship and then managed to get this job and eked her way here and eked her way there and finally got to the seat and started making real money.

Starting point is 00:06:52 And it was like looking at myself in a time machine. And I so badly wanted to emulate her because for the first time, I saw a rich Asian woman, not just an Asian woman who looked like my mom, not just one on TV in a movie. It was someone who was powerful. It was someone who was confident. It was someone who had a shit ton of money. And I wanted to be just like that. And for the first time, I saw the dream in real life. And I knew it could happen for me too. So at what point did you realize that J.P. Morgan was no longer for you and that you needed to make a change? So I have this amazing mentor, right?

Starting point is 00:07:28 And she's like, okay, I'm going to teach you everything I know. And I am learning, learning, learning. Everything's great for the first year and a half until the head of our desk gets let go. And this type of thing does happen on Wall Street pretty regularly. But when the head of the desk gets let go, typically the people that he or she was close to, they kind of typically also go. The new boss got hired, ended up firing half of the team, brought in a whole slew of new people that he really liked working with, felt close to, and the team changed pretty much overnight.

Starting point is 00:08:03 And that was a really scary experience for me because that original team was the same one that I'd interned for, the one that I'd earned my stripes on, the one that I'd spent the past year and a half currying favor with doing nice things, picking up extra projects. I was going to have to basically do that all over again. and I ended up getting moved from my mentor to a new person who was the new head of the desk's right-hand man. And it was kind of just all downhill from there with this guy instead of being, you know, superstar, rock star. I went from being the rock star to being the girl who couldn't do anything right. I was called stupid.

Starting point is 00:08:43 I was told I was too girly for the job. This person was just not fit to be a manager and, frankly, work in any sort of environment. with other human beings. I just felt really disrespected. And one day I came to the office with a long cardigan on, and he touched his hands together and bowed at me and said, ooh, a kimono. Or like, ooh, is that a kimono?

Starting point is 00:09:05 And I knew from that moment on that regardless of how smart I was, regardless of how many hours I put in, how much elbow grease I rubbed on every single project I did, this guy was never going to be in the back room advocating for me saying this girl is too smart to lose. we have to pay her more, we have to promote her, we have to give her opportunities. He was never going to do that. He saw me as less than for reasons. I was never, frankly, ever going to be able to change. He didn't like the fact that I looked a certain way. I was a girl and it was time to go.

Starting point is 00:09:37 So I ended up telling my original manager, my mentor, and I was like, I'm quitting today. And she was like, don't be an idiot. You don't have another job lined up. There's going to be a massive gap on your resume. You're never going to be able to explain that. It's going to be really hard to find a job if you quit, just tough it out, we'll figure something out. And the way she said, we gave me so much hope and faith, because I was like, this person actually has my best interest at heart, and she's going to help me figure it out. So I ended up starting to interview, and coincidentally enough, she had a best friend who had left Wall Street and gone into the tech media world. And after a few rounds of interviews, I ended up working for my very first manager's best friend who became my first

Starting point is 00:10:22 manager at BuzzFeed. Amazing. And I know that you had an awesome career at BuzzFeed. What you're saying really resonates with me too, because I remember being a young girl in corporate at Hewlett-Packard, and I love that company. I started as an intern. I earned my stripes. Everybody respected me. I got promoted five times in five years. Then I went to Disney. I got poached at Disney. And all of a sudden, I was back at square one. Everybody treated me like an intern. Everybody was talking about how I dressed. Nobody respected me.

Starting point is 00:10:50 And I felt the same way. And I ended up starting my podcast, starting my company and all that jazz and leaving. So it's like, I know what you mean. Sometimes you get into these corporate situations. And as a woman, especially, it feels like unless you started as an intern and earned your stripes, essentially, you're always sort of starting from scratch, even if you have a lot of experience and skills. So I totally feel you on that. What was different about working at BuzzFeed in terms of the culture and environment for you?

Starting point is 00:11:17 Aside from the very obvious stuff of I wasn't working nearly as many hours. I was wearing ripped jeans to work. I was working on a little laptop wherever I felt like in the office versus a more chain-to-your-desk lifestyle on Wall Street. I felt like there were so many more women in the workspace. And it wasn't just a feeling. There were so many more women. And in some respects, that was amazing because I was able to pick up mentors that I identified with so much more quickly. But I will say this, it also did lead to a lot more, I would say, competition at the junior level.

Starting point is 00:11:58 When you see people who have your same job title and could be you, could replace you, you're getting paid roughly the same, like, there's a little bit of competition there, especially since I was how. hired as someone who didn't understand media, someone who had no experience in selling ads or building joint partnerships or doing any sort of marketing. I think a lot of people not looked down upon me, but felt like I had gotten that role unfairly because of my connections to my then manager. But I kind of let that slide water off a duck's back. But for the most part, I would say all of the people that I met at BuzzFeed were so amazing, so respectful. I had three different managers throughout my time there. Every single one was good.

Starting point is 00:12:46 Every single one. I have nothing bad to say about any of them. They were so supportive of me and my career. And that was the respect that I had gotten with my first manager that I didn't get with the guy who told me I was too girly and didn't like my kimono. And I knew that if I could get my boss to like me, I would be able to show you. case, the type of work I did and the amount of work I was able to do. And from there on, I'd be able to get promoted and get paid. And that's exactly what I did. At Yap, we have a super unique company culture. We're all about obsessive excellence. We even call

Starting point is 00:13:22 ourselves scrappy hustlers. And I'm really picky when it comes to my employees. My team is growing every day. We're 60 people all over the world. And when it comes to hiring, I no longer feel overwhelmed by finding that perfect candidate, even though I'm so picky. Because when it comes to hiring, indeed, is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job post noticed. Indeed, sponsored jobs help you stand out and hire fast by boosting your posts to the top relevant candidates. Sponsored jobs on Indeed get 45% more applications than non-sponsored ones according to Indeed data worldwide. I'm so glad I found Indeed when I did because hiring is so much easier now. In fact, in the minute we've been talking, 23 hires were made on Indeed according to Indeed data worldwide. Plus, there's no subscriptions or

Starting point is 00:14:04 long-term contracts. You literally just pay for your results. You pay for the people that you you hire. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed. And listeners of this show will get a $75-sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility at Indeed.com.com. Profiting right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com slash profiting. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring, Indeed is all you need. Happy New Year, Yap, gang. I just love the unique energy of the new year. It's all about fresh starts. And fresh starts not only feel possible, but also feel encouraged. And if you've been thinking about starting a business, this is your sign. There's no better time than right now.

Starting point is 00:14:47 2026 can be the year that you build something that is truly yours, the year where you take control over your career. And it starts with Shopify. I've built plenty of my own businesses on Shopify, including my LinkedIn Secrets Masterclass. So it's a two-day workshop. People buy their tickets on Shopify. And then my mastermind subscription is also on Shopify. I built my site quickly in just a couple of days, payments for setup super easily, and none of the technical stuff slowed me down like it usually does because Shopify is just so intuitive. And this choice of using Shopify helped me scale my masterclass to over $500,000 in revenue in our first year.

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Starting point is 00:15:58 trial and start selling today at Shopify.com slash profiting. Go to Shopify.com slash profiting. That's Shopify.com slash profiting. Yeah, fam, hear your first. This new year was Shopify by your side. Yeah, you ended up doing really good. I read that your salary was like 600K at one point at bus speed, which is pretty crazy. Like a lot of corporate people never reach that kind of compensation. So at some point, you realize that you had other passions and you started rich BFF, which is a huge brand right now.

Starting point is 00:16:30 You're huge on TikTok, huge on Instagram. We've got a new podcast. So talk to us about when you realize that people want to. financial advice from you. How did you realize that? It wasn't this evil plan or like whatever to start an amazing company. I had no aspirations of that. It was really when I got to BuzzFeed and I like started making new friends, they would all find out that I had started my career on Wall Street. And the immediate follow up question was, what should I invest in? Ha, ha, ha. The actual legitimate questions would then follow of like, but actually, what are you buying in your 401k? Can you help me? Which health insurance

Starting point is 00:17:05 plan did you pick? Is it the cheaper option? Should we be buying company stock options? What should I be doing with my money? And I was answering so many of those questions that there was oftentimes just like a small line at my desk to the point where like I was having a hard time like just getting some of my work done. So as not a joke, but as a little passion product just for my friends, I started creating content about being smart with your money. And what I didn't realize was I made the very first video on January 1st of 2021, and I was like, hmm, I've been seeing some really shady stuff going around, people telling others to put their stimulus checks into Bitcoin. Do not recommend. You need that money for rent, for food, what have you. I don't have a get rich quick scheme, but if you want to

Starting point is 00:17:51 learn more about money, I can teach you. It's not that hard. That was the entire video. And that video ended up getting 3 million views, and I had 100,000 followers by the end of the week. It was nuts. Oh, my God. Do you realize? how lucky you are. No, maybe not lucky. I don't know. Actually, that's a good question. Like, do you think it was luck?

Starting point is 00:18:11 There's so many content creators out there that create content day in and day out. And your first post went viral. You went from just not being a content creator or an influencer to the next day being an influencer, which people work years to have that sort of success. So what do you think was different with you? I think it was a little bit of luck, a little bit of authenticity, and a little bit of good timing. The number one New Year's resolution every single year, take a guess at what it is. Losing weight? I don't know. Yes. Yeah. Okay. The number one New Year's resolution is to lose weight.

Starting point is 00:18:45 The number two is to get their money right, is to get rich, whatever, an economic improvement. So the only type of content that I feel like I could have done even better is if I had a six-pack and I was like, this year is a year we're getting fit. But I didn't, you know, I can't do that. So I was like, hey, like, let's get our money right. And the timing of that being January 1st crushed it because people are starting to think about that. They've just spent an arm and a leg on holiday presents. They've traveled to and fro to see family. All they've been doing is spending in December. And now they're like, oh, shoot, my savings account does not look where I want it to be. It's not looking good for me. I have to go back to work at a job that maybe I don't like.

Starting point is 00:19:28 They wanted a way to improve their situation. So I think, the timing was really good. I was just really earnest. I called out, this is what I'm seeing. It's hot trash. You should not listen to crypto bros in their mom's basements and take advice from strangers on the internet when they tell you to do a risky thing. I think people really appreciated that I was real and called it out for what it was. And I was like, that's BS. I think people appreciated that I was honest. And I was like, I cannot make you a millionaire overnight. You cannot do that. Unless you hit the lottery, that's not happening for you. But I was like, listen, if you want, I can show you how to do it. And I think a little bit of it does have to do with luck.

Starting point is 00:20:09 In some weeks, I can tell. I'm in favor with the ALGO right now. Every video is a banger. And then other weeks, I'm like, am I like not funny anymore? Am I not cute? Do people not like me? Am I not smart? I think in part, you always have to chalk it a little bit up to luck. but I think my timing was good and the content itself was authentic. Yeah, I totally agree. So are you even 30 yet? I am 29. Not even 30 years old.

Starting point is 00:20:39 And you've reinvented yourself so many times. You started on Wall Street, then you got into sales at BuzzFeed and worked your way to the top. Now you're an entrepreneur finally. Why do you think you've been able to sort of reinvent yourself and pivot so much before even 30 years old? That is something I think about all the time because I'm on my third do-over. I think it's good because, so there's this quote, I believe from Francis Piccabi, like our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction. And what I love about that is you're never too old to do something.

Starting point is 00:21:14 I think some of the best advice that I've ever heard in my life is whether or not you do that thing today, two years from now, you're still going to be two years older. Five years from now, you're still going to be five years older. do you want to go to medical school now a little bit later than the standard medical student and get that doctorate, whatever? Sure, do it. Because even if you don't, time is still going to pass and you need to do what makes you happy. It's okay to take risks, especially if you have really, really analyzed the situation and have a safety net and have taken calculated decisions to get yourself there. I just don't think that reinventing ourselves is promoted as much as it probably

Starting point is 00:21:57 should be. I think we talk about living one life at 18. You decide what you want to major in and that's what you do for the rest of your life. And that's just not true. It's not fair. We're changing all the time. Our personalities change all the time. We're allowed to change. And I think, for one, change is a good thing. Yeah. And speaking of change and speaking of taking risks at one point, you decided to walk away from your $600,000 salary at BuzzFeed. That changes a little harder than most. You know, I did the same thing. I walked away from an executive job at Disney and started my business,

Starting point is 00:22:30 started my podcast, my agency. It's tough, but it's actually pretty exhilarating, right? So talk to us about becoming an entrepreneur and how you create a business model out of becoming an influencer. That's my first question. And then how did you decide that it was time to leave BuzzFeed? The business model piece is that from Jump, as soon as I had my 100,000 followers, I was able to get into the TikTok creator fund. I was able to get into the equivalence, the ad senses on YouTube, the reels fund, whatever, the bonus on meta platforms.

Starting point is 00:23:04 So I was starting to make just a little bit of fun money, certainly not enough for me to quit my job. I was not getting paid tons of money, but a couple hundred, a couple thousand dollars a month, just extra. Nice. While I'm creating content, the real money started to come in when brands started hitting me up and saying, hey, you want to make a video for us? I was like, yeah, I do. How much? I obviously went through some growing pains of negotiating my first three videos I did for like $400. I had like, I genuinely like can't even talk about it. It hurts my stomach. But like I was ideating, filming, editing, posting, moderating comments. for $400. And I had an audience at that point of 200, 250,000 followers. And I was like, this seems like a lot of work. But I was able to start getting my rates to a more fair place.

Starting point is 00:24:01 And what I realized was that I was going to be able to make six figures doing this. And my thought to myself was, hey, I may not make as much money as I do in my standard W-2 job, but if I can make $100,000, I'm not going to starve. I'll always be able to pay my rent. I'll always be able to buy groceries, and I might still even be able to go on vacation once a year. And for me, that was really the turning point of, okay, I can make a living, maybe not as lucrative of a living doing this, but I want to give it a try. Because I had so many other things I wanted to do, and I was just not having the time after my full work day at work on Saturday, I would ideate seven pieces of content, one for every day of the week. And then on Sundays,

Starting point is 00:24:51 I would film one video, take off my shirt, film video two, take off another shirt, film video three. I would like literally put on these outfits and they would just like progressively get layered onto me. I'd start in like a chunky sweater like this. And by the end, I was like in a tank top because I just kept taking off layers to film more content so that it looked like I was filming a new video every single day. And then it became to the point where like I was getting 30 emails a day. I was not responding to them because I just didn't have the bandwidth of the mental power to do so. And I had hired an attorney to help me look over contracts because that's just something that I didn't have experience doing and I didn't want to waste time doing. And I was like, I'm really underwater.

Starting point is 00:25:28 Like, what do you recommend? She's like, I think you might need a manager. And I spoke with this amazing talent manager. And I told her, I was like, I just want to be transparent. Like, I'm still in my full-time job. And she was really honest with me. And she was like, you. are so, so driven. You have such amazing goals, but there's a bit of hesitation on my end to take you on as a client if you are splitting your time between two jobs. And I'm going to be honest with you that I think that might be the case with any talent manager you speak to. And I knew what she was saying was so true. You're not going to hire someone who has another full-time job. And I had these big dreams of having a podcast and writing a book and having a TV show. And I wasn't going to be able to do that while

Starting point is 00:26:16 doing my full-time job. So before I quit, I set aside $100,000 in cash. I was really making sure I had that nest egg. And then I was like, ideally, if I can make roughly $100,000 of income through brand partnerships, through the platforms, I'll be in a really, really good spot. And I won't have to dip into that 100. But even if I do, that's fine. But I quit my job a year in three months into building your rich BFF, and it was the best decision of my entire life. I had my management team exclusively for three months. Then it got to the point where, like, my management team couldn't even handle all the work that we were getting. So they were like, we think you might need agency representation. So then we go, I end up getting signed with WME.

Starting point is 00:26:59 I mean, such a big honor. I now have a full service team. It's just business, left, right, and center. I'm able to pitch a book. I'm able to pitch a podcast deal. I have brand partnerships coming in. I am still getting paid that little fun money through the platforms. And now I have four or five income streams and only more good things to come, but it ended up exceeding my wildest imaginations. And now I make more money as the CEO and face of your rich BFF than I even did at my very, very lucrative corporate job. I know how it feels. It's amazing. It's amazing. being an entrepreneur and removing that ceiling of your potential to make money. I make more money every month than I did in a year at Disney. So it's pretty crazy. So let's talk about your mission

Starting point is 00:27:46 at Rich BFF and your new book. So what was the genesis of your new book, Rich A.F. What are you trying to teach? I think the content that I create on social media is really helpful. It's bite size, 60 to 90 seconds, and you get to learn one new thing every day and you feel good and you feel smart. But I was getting so many DMs of, this is helpful, but I want the bigger picture. I want it all at once. Is there a place on the website where I can have basically an organizer of things I need to be doing? Or, hey, have you ever thought about writing your thoughts down? It'd be really helpful to read them in an organized way. And it felt like the key word here was organization. People just really wanted a step by step. And I kept getting asked for a book, kept getting asked for books. So I said, fine, you guys want a book so

Starting point is 00:28:33 bad, I will write a book. And the genesis of Rich A.F wasn't even just my desire to write a book, but the desire for the BFFs to read one. And I think that in the generation above ours, there were some really killer money books. The richest man in Babylon, millionaire next door, rich dad, poor dad, psychology of money, just so many great finance books. But there were so few for our generation that acknowledged the systemic inequalities of the world, that acknowledged the student debt crisis, that acknowledged how wages had stagnated and the cost of living had gone up, up, up, up, up, and how society has changed and how making money changes and what that looks like. So I thought it was time for a refresh.

Starting point is 00:29:19 It was time to address money for this generation, for millennials and gensky, for people who haven't had someone to talk to them about money. because a lot of those books were written by and for the male, pale, and stale audience. And I was none of those things. So I wrote a book about money that caters to a crew of people that I've lovingly dubbed the leftovers, women, people of color, the LGBTQ community, people who grew up low income, immigrants. Anybody who has ever felt like the financial services industry has left them behind, they've been forgotten about, they have been completely taken for granted. This book is for you. Let's talk about some of the key themes in your book because a lot of your book is talking about

Starting point is 00:30:06 how rich people think differently. So just off the top of your head, what are the different ways that rich people think differently than other people? The first one is that rich people are really lazy. I think a big misconception is that rich people work harder than us, that they are smarter, faster, stronger, better. They're not. They are lazy, but they are smart kind of lazy. And what they have realized that a lot of people haven't is that money is a better tool to make money than our bodies and our minds. As a human being, you can roughly work max 14 to 16 hours a day for like a temporary period of time before you burn out and you're done. Whereas your money can work 24-7, no bathroom breaks, no lunch breaks. Your money can work for you around the clock. And

Starting point is 00:30:53 it's so important to recognize that rich people love touting hard work for us. They need someone to flip the burgers and pump the gas and check them out at Walmart, but they don't want to work hard. They want to kick their feet up as soon as possible. And the way that you do that is by at the beginning of your life and your career, working hard for your money, but then making sure that your money can work even harder for you. And over time, the amount of money you make through labor and the amount of money you make through money starts to shift in the opposite direction so that you're making more money using your money than you are through your job. So I think it's just really important to acknowledge these, I would just say, like misinformation that has been passed down.

Starting point is 00:31:37 We've peddled this myth that if you work hard, you get a good job and you can have this white picket fence home, this dream life. That's not the case anymore. You can't save your way to rich. You need to invest if you want to have any hope of retiring eventually. And I think it's a little bit of a rude wake-up call, but a needed one for our generation. Yeah. And to your point, you just said, you can save all you want, but you need to also be able to earn. I know that you're really a proponent of this. In your book, you say you can only save as much as you earn. And you say that's the best financial piece of advice that you've ever received. Why is that? Because the follow-up to that sentence is you can always earn more money. If we use

Starting point is 00:32:21 round numbers, if you make $100,000 a year and you don't have any expenses, I mean, nothing, right? You're living with your parents. They're paying for food. They're paying for gas. They pay for everything, everything, everything. If you pay taxes, obviously, you have a certain amount of money left over and you can only save that much. But do you understand how easy it is to ask for a $5,000 raise? How easy it is to ask for a $10,000 raise? Those raise numbers are not out of the realm of reality whatsoever. Do you also have any idea how hard it is to cut an extra $5,000 of expenses out of your life, that you are cutting out that latte, cutting out that avocado toast, cutting out your Netflix subscription? You are not enjoying your life at all. That sucks. You should not

Starting point is 00:33:08 have to live that way. It's a lot easier to make more money than it is to cut out every little discretionary purchase that brings you joy. And I think while it is important to practice mindful spending and thoughtful and considerate use of your own money, it's just as if not more important to learn how to make more of it. And that comes from asking for a promotion and a raise at your current job and picking up a side hustle or passion project that you might really enjoy doing. Hello, Yap Gang. I know my young and profiting listeners want bigger businesses and a better life. And the New Year is the perfect moment to reset and commit to your growth. But let's be real. You can't build an empire if your finances are all over the place.

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Starting point is 00:34:56 Young and profiteers. I know there's so many people tuning in right now that end their workday wondering why certain tasks take forever, why they're procrastinating certain things, why they don't feel confident in their work, why they feel drained and frustrated and unfulfilled. But here's the thing you need to know.

Starting point is 00:35:12 It's not a character of flaw that you're feeling this way. It's actually your natural wiring. And here's the thing. When it comes to burnout, it's really about the type of work that you're doing. Some work gives you energy and some work simply drains you.

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Starting point is 00:35:53 a lot of guilt around the fact that I didn't like enablement, which is one of my working frustrations. So I actually don't like to support people one-on-one. I don't like it when people slow me down. I don't like handholding. I like to move fast, invent, rally people, inspire. But what I do need to do is ensure that somebody else can fill the enablement role, which I do have, K on my team. So working genius helps you uncover these genius gaps, helps you work better with your team, helps you reduce friction, helps you collaborate better, understand why people are the way that they are. It's helped me restructure my team, put people in the spots that they're going to really excel, and it's also helped me in hiring. Working Genius is absolutely amazing. I'm obsessed with this model.

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Starting point is 00:37:56 in all areas. So another thing that I learned from your book and we were just talking about it earlier was the way that rich people use collaboration and nepotism and the way that they network differently. I mean, you even said yourself,

Starting point is 00:38:10 you got this amazing job at BuzzFeed because your mentor was best friends with the manager, right? And they put you in that spot. So talk to us about how rich people collaborate and network differently. Yeah. So I think for many regular people, it's a mentality of you or me, right? Hala, you or me are getting this promotion and that's it. And we are competing. We are

Starting point is 00:38:32 fighting. We are not friends. But rich people, really comfortable in their own skin, financially stable, rich people don't feel that way because you understand that you're an apex predator. You're not worried about these other predators. You're thinking, how can we all work together to hunt more. And so when we're rich, we are able to be time travelers. You can be in two places at once, right? If I am rich and I'm in a high, powerful position at my company, and there's a job opening that I'm not qualified for, but I'm like, how can I somehow make this work in my favor? And I'm like, oh, my girlfriend, Hala, definitely is qualified for this job. Let me get her this job where she makes so much money, where she's going to be really powerful, and she's going to owe me one.

Starting point is 00:39:18 because now I have a chip in my pocket because you're going to remember that I did you that solid. I got you that job. And then the next time a big opportunity comes up or you have an opening at your golf club, country club, whatever, that no one can seem to get into. You're going to think of me. You're going to think of that time that I did that nice thing for you and you're going to do me one back. So it's very much you scratch my back.

Starting point is 00:39:40 I scratch yours. And that's why when you hear people who are middle class or lower income talking about money, it feels like a finite pool and they're all fighting over the same dollar. It's because this upper tier of super wealthy people have tricked everyone below them into thinking they need to fight with each other when in reality, everybody at the top is sharing resources being like, you should use my accountant, you should join my country club, I can get you an interview at this job, or we should network, or like, you should meet this person that I know. They're trying to interconnect their webs to position themselves better and better and better over time.

Starting point is 00:40:19 And having those connections allows your name to be mentioned in rooms that you yourself can't even get into. And it gives you access in a way that very few of us ever have. And having access is power. I love this advice. It's so true. Rich people have an abundance mindset. They're of service. They understand that the more they do good for other people that they're going to get those favors back in return. So another thing you say, that rich people do is that they're never satisfied. They're always looking to trade up and you say loyalty does not pay these days. So talk to us about that.

Starting point is 00:40:52 Never, never, never, never. Rich people know their worth. They know their value. They know the value of their business. They are always looking for the next best thing. And I think our parents were told to be loyal company men, company women, company people. But that was because they were getting something called a pension where their employers had to set money aside for them so that they could have a nice cushy retirement. Pension has all but

Starting point is 00:41:19 gone extinct after the 401K was introduced. And now retiring and planning for the future is your problem. It's not your employers. So these days, it's not necessarily what your employer's willing to do for you in retirement that's keeping you around, which is why our parents were willing to stick around at one company for 20, 30 years because they knew they were going to be set up. We have to contribute to our own retirements. And the only way to do that while still having enough money to live your day-to-day life is to make more. So it's critically important for people in our generation to kind of always have one foot out the door. Always be willing to take that call with that recruiter, always be willing to meet with your friend who happens to work at the competitor of your company

Starting point is 00:41:59 because you never know what opportunities are out there and you owe it to yourself and owe it to the people you love to do right by you and make sure that you're getting the most out of every dollar and every ounce of life you have. And I think that also comes with the types of businesses we patron, right? When middle class and lower income people are charged a late fee, they're like, oh, shoot, that's my bad. Okay, I'll pay the late fee. Some of the richest people I know are the cheapest people I have ever met. They will sit on the phone with customer service and argue over a $35 late fee for 30 minutes until that thing gets wiped, or they'll even have their assistant do it. But frankly, they are not paying that late fee. They remind that customer.

Starting point is 00:42:44 company, don't you value my business? Don't you value the fact that I park a certain amount of money here, or I got my mortgage through this company, or I did that, or I did this, I did this, whatever. You owe me one. Waved the late feet, otherwise I'm leaving. And the customer acquisition costs of any bank, whether you are a high net worth player or just an average regular Joe Schmo is high. They do not want to lose you. The same goes for cell phone companies, utilities, any sort of subscription service, you can threaten to leave and say, I'm going to do right by me, and they will do whatever it takes, bend over backwards, do some backflips to keep you as a customer. You need to know your worth and you need to just never be content. I call my Wi-Fi provider every 12 months,

Starting point is 00:43:29 and I'm like, yeah, it's not looking good for us. I'm going to go unless you cut me a deal. And they do. They do every year. Wow. It's so true. Don't just negotiate your salary. Negotiate all. different things in your life. All right, last question, because we're running out of time and sorry young improfitors, we had a technical difficulties. You're going to have to go get her book, Rich A.F., because we did not cover enough of it, but you got a good glimpse. Let's talk about finding your FU number. You say that there's a simple way to calculate our own FU number. Let's use this as your one piece of actionable advice to our young improfitters today. Everybody, close your eyes and imagine your perfect dream life.

Starting point is 00:44:12 What does that cost you for one year? I don't care if you are living shoeless in an airstream at age 30. I don't care if you are 65. You have two homes. Your kids are in college and you've got the golden retriever in the backyard. Whatever you're happily ever after looks like, think about how much that would cost for one year. Then divide that number by 0.04. That represents 4%.

Starting point is 00:44:36 And when you get the number from that equation, that is the number you need to have invested before you can essentially kick over your desk and tell your boss, F you. Because at that point, you'll have enough in assets earning you money and 4% is a very conservative return. Ideally, your money would be earning you more than that and that's just gravy. But that is the point at which you will have enough money earning you money that you can live the life that you want to live without ever having to work ever again. I love that. And what is your secret to profiting in life this can go beyond financial in the topic of today's episode. The best tip I ever got was Vivian always buy them the chicken parm.

Starting point is 00:45:21 And I was like, what does this guy mean about this? Because I'm lactose intolerant and literally can't even have chicken parm. But this guy that I worked with on Wall Street, every random couple months, he would buy chicken parms for everybody on the team, everybody from the IT guy to the janitor to the random compliance guy in the corner. And the reason he did this was to remind them that he appreciated them. And he did it out of the goodness of his heart and he never expected anything in return. And it was always random. It wasn't because he got something. But when he did need something, the IT guy, the janitor, the compliance guy in the corner, they would come running to his desk because they would remember

Starting point is 00:46:05 that that guy was the one who bought them the chicken parm, treated them with respect, asked them about their families and their kids and took a genuine concern and interest in treating them well and treating them how they would want to be treated. And it just goes to show that when you being kind is a personality trait and not a strategy, people can see that. And that will do 10x for you as you have done for others. Amen. I totally agree to that. Vivian, where can everybody learn more about you and everything that you do? You can find me across social media as your rich BF And if you're interested in ordering RichAF my book, you can go to richaf.me. Yes, the URL is a manifestation because we all deserve to be happy, healthy, and wealthy.

Starting point is 00:46:50 I love it. Vivian, I'll stick all those links in the show notes. Thank you so much for joining us on Young and Profiting Podcast. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, fam, I identify so much with what Vivian has been through to make it to where she is today. And as young as she is, she already has reinvented herself several times and has passed up on lucrative careers on Wall Street and with BuzzFeed to do what she's truly passionate about. As Vivian put it so well, we're allowed to change. And change is a good thing.

Starting point is 00:47:25 And it certainly has been for Vivian, who is now a TikTok superstar. She helps millions of people save, invest, and grow their careers through her awesome rich BFF brand and company, something that started as a side hustle and now is a huge brand. And now she's taken another big leap, writing a book about money that she hopes will resonate with her generation of millennials and Gen Ziers. And according to Vivian, one of the best ways to become rich is to learn how rich people think. The rich are never satisfied. They're always looking to trade up.

Starting point is 00:47:56 They know their worth and the value of their business and investments. And they're always looking for the next best think. And while most of us unfortunately didn't have the head start that many rich people have received, we can learn from their mindset and their approach to money. Because the hard truth for the younger generation, as Vivian puts it, is that you can't save your way to being rich. That's a tough pill to swallow for some. But it can also be a liberating one.

Starting point is 00:48:22 Maybe you don't have to quit your daily latte or your Netflix subscription. Vivian says it's a lot easier to make more money than cut every little discretionary purchase that brings you joy. And it's precisely this abundance mindset that helps enable the rich to make them even more money. Thanks for listening to this episode of Young and Profiting Podcast. Another thing that distinguishes rich people from everybody else is that they routinely share useful information with their networks.

Starting point is 00:48:50 So if you listen learned and profited from this conversation with our rich BFF Vivian 2, then please share this episode with your friends and family. It could really help them out as well as us. That way we can all advance together and maybe get rich in the process. And if you did enjoy this show and you learned something, then please drop us a fire five-star review on Apple Podcasts. I love to read your reviews. It's my favorite thing to do, and I do it almost every day. If you prefer to watch your podcast as videos, you can find us on YouTube. Just check out Young and Profiting on YouTube, and you'll find all of our episodes

Starting point is 00:49:21 uploaded there every single week. You can also find me on Instagram at Yap with Hala or LinkedIn by searching my name. It's Hala Taha. And before we go, I did want to thank our incredible Yap team. You guys are awesome. Thank you for all that you do behind the scenes. This is your host, Halitaha, aka the podcast princess, signing off.

Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - Vivian Tu: How the Wealthiest People Work, Network, and Invest Their Money | Finance E267

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