Young and Profiting with Hala Taha - YAPSnacks: Persuasion and How to Influence Others with Hala and Jordan | Sales

Episode Date: December 12, 2019

Hey everyone, you're listening to YAPSnacks, a new short series of bite-sized, digestible, and actionable content hosted by the YAP team. Today, I'm joined with fellow podcaster Jordan Parris, who has come on board as a Yapsnacks co-host. This week on Yapsnacks, we're talking all things, influence, negotiation, and persuasion. I've had a lot of episodes on this topic, like number 23, negotiate like a boss with Chris Voss, who is a former FBI hostage negotiator. and he also wrote a book called Never Split the Difference is a very popular book. I've also interviewed Scott Adams, who is a cartoonist and persuasion expert. The episode is number 38, The Persuasion Playbook. And number eight, hacking human behavior with Chase Hughes, who is a police trainer and a behavioral profile expert.

That was a mouthful. It was, yes. But hey, I'm eager to get to this today because human behavior, is definitely one of my favorite things to talk about, obviously, I would file all of this under human behavior. I think I even mentioned that when I was talking about Robert Green and the first Yap snacks that I just love learning about all this stuff, talking about all this stuff. And Chase Hughes, who I'm going to be speaking about today, one of my favorite books, the one that he wrote, I've interviewed him as well. And I just enjoy all things. Chase Hughes and Human Behavior.

So let's get to it. Totally. And my audience loves the topic of influence and persuasion. All of our episodes on this topic get really high download. So I think everybody tuning in should enjoy these actionable tips that we're going to be talking about. So let me start first with Scott Adams. Like I mentioned, he is the Dilbert creator. And he's also a hypnotist. He studied persuasion his whole life. And he wrote a book called Win Bigley. And it's all about how Trump won the 12. 2016 election through his negotiation and persuasion skills. So I'm going to go through some of his top tips that we talked about in the episode. The first one that really resonated with me is the fact that Scott says that you should be descriptive and illustrate a visual to influence others. And this can help persuade people more than just a concept can. So for example, make America great again, that red hat, right?

A lot of controversy around it. But at the end of the day, this is. memory of a red hat and people in the crowd all wearing red hats, that really stuck with you and became something powerful for Trump to leverage, you know? And same thing with Hillary and people wearing pink. And for her campaign, it also helped support her and kind of made things more memorable and influenced people. So using a visual, I'll give another example. He went on SNL. Trump went on SNL and he had a skit where he pretended to be president, right? and that helped stick it in people's minds like, oh, he could be president because I literally saw him in the Oval Office pretending to be president.

So that's another way he used visual. Super interesting, right? Yeah, I didn't even know that S&L skit existed. I'll have to check that out. I wonder, was that during the campaign or years prior? I think that was during the campaign. And funny enough, Hillary went on S&L 2 and her skit was being drunk in a bar. So who is thinking more critically in terms of how they want to appear in the public.

Also, speaking simple and straightforward to ensure your most important points are remembered. So again, with Trump, everything he says, this is great. You know, we're the best. Everything is super simple and people might think he just might not have a great vocabulary. But in fact, he's on purpose being simple and straightforward. So that's a tip that we can take when we're trying to persuade others, be very simple. be very repetitive. Use very simple words. Yeah. Keep the simple things simple. Totally. Another one is using hyperbole because in today's world, facts don't matter. And I know that

sounds harsh. And I was even talking to Jordan before this. Like, should I say that? But it's true. In today's world, emotion is really what drives people. People aren't really fact checking all the time. So I'm not saying to totally lie, but you can exaggerate a little bit. That's what hyperbole is. It's exaggerated statements not meant to be taking literally. So again, if we stick to the example of Trump, he says things like, the economy is the greatest. The military is the most powerful it's ever been. America is winning like never before. These are all like these general statements, but it really gets emotions riled up. And lastly, Scott in the episode talks about something called a linguistic kill shot. So,

For example, Trump called Jeb, who is his opponent, low-energy Jeb. I love that. It was so funny. And then after that, everybody just couldn't look at him the same. And he was just like, oh, gosh, compared to Trump, he really is low-energy Jeb. For Hillary, it was crooked Hillary. And then she was painted as a criminal the whole time she was running. So very effective to brand your competitors. And that's called the linguistic kill shot.

Ah, I think, I just thought that whole. the Trump's linguistic killshots, so to say, were hilarious. I still think they are. He's a funny guy. He's a funny guy for sure. He is. Yeah, I like him on Twitter. I mean, other people get outraged by it, but I just kind of, I like observing.

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Terms and conditions apply. Hiring. Indeed is all you need. So I want to talk about, though, Chase Hughes. Again, I mentioned I really enjoy Chase's work. He's a good friend of mine. I've interviewed him. Holla's interviewed Chase in episode 8 of Young and Profiting.

And in his book, The Elypsis Manual, Analysis and Engineering of Human Behavior, it's a mammoth of a book, almost 400 pages. I read it cover to cover. In the book, he talks a lot about body language. And accompanying the book comes a behavioral table of elements. Instead of the periodic table of elements, the behavioral table of elements. And I have it, I'm touching it right now. I have it laminated.

I have the two pieces laminated. And it's every single body language gesture and vocal tonality from head to toe, like literally everything and levels of deception and all sorts of other information and statistics attached to these body language gestures and vocal tonalities. And what I wanted to discuss today, I wanted to zoom in on just about one page of Chase's book here, where we're, I mean, he talks about this, but throughout the book, he talks about vocal tonalities throughout the book, but I really want to talk today, zoom in on increasing your vocal speed. I'm actually, I'm working with a speaking,

coach right now and he told me the other day that speaking too quickly is associated with, you know, your audience could think that you are untrustworthy and low status. And the opposite is true when you're speaking calmly, clearly, slowly. People associate you, they view you with high authority and high status, right? And trustworthy. So Chase in his book talks about the increase in vocal speed and what it means. You know, of course you have to establish the baseline of people's vocal speeds first, you know, because it's all relative between different people, their vocal speeds. But in an attempt to, quote unquote, get it over with, subjects frequently speed up the rate of speech to lessen the amount of psychological stress experienced

and exude nonverbal signs of deception during the deceptive statement. So people are going to speed up when they're talking about something uncomfortable or maybe something they're lying about, right? So as to not exude these bad body language gestures that could indicate that they're lying. And so as to just get rid of the psychological stress that it will entail, right? And another thing with vocal tonality is that Chase Hughes talks about in his book, and it's also a mixture of a lesson that I learned from Vanessa Van Edwards, and other social superhero of mine, is that the rising vocal pitch within your sentences here. And so let's think about it in a sales situation, Hala.

Okay, so I'm talking with Hala right now, and I'm trying to close her on a deal. We've been talking about this deal in a meeting, and I say, I'm like, all right, Hala, the price will be $5,000? I don't think so. It sounds like a question. You are just begging. I am just begging Hala to negotiate with me. Me saying it like that says that I'm unsure of that price and you should be too, Hala.

So let's think about it. Authority is conveyed with a downward inflection, a downward tone at the end of a sentence. So I would just say, be very confident. The price is $5,000. It's what it is. And I don't, you know, I just say the price is $5,000. And I don't start talking and running myself in circles after that. I say it and I'm good, you know?

I'm confident that that is my value. And in that way, I'm not begging Holla to negotiate with me. Totally. I have a couple of things to add there. So first off, in terms of the speed of how you talk, it reminded me of something else Chase Hughes talks about, which is blink rate. And similarly to speaking too fast, if your audience is blinking, too fast, that means that they're not paying attention. They're not interested. What you're saying

is not resonating. So you want to pay attention to the rate in which people blink. So that's just an easy way to remember it. Speaking fast is bad. Seeing other people blink fast is bad. So I guess slow in general just means like connectivity, trustworthiness, engagements. Like I think that's the the red thread throughout those concepts. Also, in terms of voices, Chris Voss, who wrote Never Split the Difference, he also talked about voice tones that you can use in negotiation. So he talks about something called the late night FM DJ voice. And you use this voice selectively to make a point. And like you were just saying, Jordan, you inflect your voice downward. You keep it calm and slow. And it really creates an aura of authority and trustworthiness

without triggering any defensiveness. There's another voice you can use, which I think I pretty much use all the time, which is a positive and playful voice. And it should be your default voice. It's easygoing, good-natured, it's light, encouraging, and a tip is to smile while you're talking. It helps you have that positive, playful voice.

And then lastly, you can have the direct or assertive voice, and honestly, this should be used very sparingly because it creates problems and pushback. So you want to either use the late-night FM DJ voice when you're talking about something like Price, like Jordan gave that example. And then also that positive, playful voice in general is what you want to exude. Yeah, might I add, too, that smiling while you're talking is such an important piece here that you're talking about because, and I don't have the study offhand, but I just mentioned Vanessa Van Edwards. I, you know, this is something that she talks about. it's that people who smile the last 30 seconds on the phone,

they're actually, when they ask the person on the other line, they rated the person who was smiling the last 30 seconds as far more likable than people that don't smile the last 30 seconds on the phone. So you can actually detect that. It actually does change your vocal tonality, smiling. I know. And you can detect that without even.

seeing the other person. Yeah. So that's a trick I use on air. If I feel like I need more energy, I start smiling when I'm talking. And it automatically helps me sound more energetic. And, you know, I've heard this from multiple people. I interviewed Jack Schaefer, who's also an FBI negotiator. It was on my first episode on how to be more likable. And he also said that over the phone, it's scientifically proven that when you're smiling, you come across as more likable. So, it doesn't even have to be in person, which is amazing. Yeah, I remember that episode. That was a long time ago.

I know. I mean, I listened to it probably like, I don't know, five months ago. It's a really good one, though. Still one of my favorites. I highly recommend I'm putting a plug in there to listen to episode one of Young and Profiting. Thank you. And then another thing that you said, and we'll call it a wrap after this because

this is a Yap Snacks episode, you mentioned saying $5,000. and staying on the theme of never split the difference, Chris Voss says that if you name your price, you should never, ever change it. So he does not believe in compromise whatsoever. He does not believe in win-win whatsoever. He thinks you say your price. If they don't want your price, you don't get the deal.

Well, what's, if you can knock $1,000 off the price hauler, or if I could actually do it for $4,000 with you, then what's that say about me? says that I was trying to knock your head off with that price, that I wasn't being completely honest. Totally. All right. Well, this is the conclusion of our second Yapsnacks episode.

If you enjoyed these topics, go check out number 23, number 38, and number eight. You'll get a lot more information on influence, negotiation, and persuasion. This is Hala and Jordan signing off.