Your Transformation Station - 70. "YOUR Everyday" Paradigm 'Andrew Kim' w/ Favazza

Episode Date: November 30, 2021

"How" does a capable leader know what qualities to look for in others while moving on to the next chapter of their own replacement search? Discover the left-brained paradigm to (culture, strategy, and character). Because of the "cultural context" of any company, determining what is most important can be difficult. Support the showPODCAST INFO:Podcast website: https://ytspod.comApple Podcasts: https://ytspod.com/appleSpotify: https://ytspod.com/spotifyRSS: https://ytspod.com/rssYouTube: https://ytspod.com/youtubeSUPPORT & CONNECT:- Check out the sponsors below, it's the best way to support this podcast- Outgrow: https://www.ytspod.com/outgrow- Quillbot Flow: https://ytspod.com/quilbot - LearnWorlds: https://ytspod.com/learnworlds- Facebook: https://ytspod.com/facebook- Instagram: https://ytspod.com/instagram- TikTok: https://ytspod.com/tiktok- Twitter: https://ytspod.com/x Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Tell me about your position and how you would find someone that could take your place if you were transitioning to a promotion. For myself, if I was trying to, if I was trying to get someone to replace myself, that's the goal. Well, I'm actually a logical person who tends to like to master plan an architect. things. So obviously the replacement would have to have that skill set. How can you create a transformation in others if there's no transformation in yourself? Join your host, Greg Favaza, as your voice on the hard truths of leadership, your transformation station connecting clarity to the cutting edge of leadership. As millennials, we can establish

change, not only ourselves, but through organizational change, bringing transparency that goes beyond the organization and reflects back into ourselves. Extracting, actionable advice, and alternative perspectives that will take you outside of yourself. Thank you for coming on your transformation station. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me. Of course. What can you teach our audience today? Well, we're just going to talk about a different approach to business, one that actually takes into consideration, not just the systems and processes, but the culture of the organization as well. Okay. Interesting.

Yeah. And maybe a little bit about how to actually achieve that transformation process, but we'll see how time fairs and where the conversation kind of leads us. Beautiful. No, I tend to go down that rabbit hole with you. You just released a book and I think it covers the majority of season two. You want to tell us about that? Just a little bit. Don't monologue now. Just a little bit. Sure. It's called culture for the left brain leader. And as a title suggests, I myself am a left brain leader. So I used to think that business was all. about systems and processes. And they are very important. But I've come to realize that along my journey of leadership, it's a lot more than that. And so long story short,

and I'm sure we're going to be able to go into a much deeper dive in it, it's about some of those realizations, how to achieve it. And that's a big one, the how, because I think there's a lot of material and literature out there that discusses the importance of it. but not really how to do it. Okay. Yeah.

No, I do like that as far as the how there really isn't any, any just fine details of just, if you do this, this will happen. It's all about just circling around it and around it everywhere, blogs, books. So I can't wait to go into this with you to see if it backs up what you're

claiming. So that's fantastic. So let's start off. We'll see. segue away from that, and then we'll come back. Tell me about your understanding inside an organization. What's the most important aspect of an organization to run effectively? There's a lot of things.

First of all, what I'm saying that culture of an organization is important, I'm not downplaying the systems and processes. I acknowledge that they're really important. I acknowledge that that's what kind of keeps the organization. organization together. I also understand that's basically trying to replicate something that works, something that successfully penetrates a market and can deliver quality, quality goods or services in a profitable manner.

However, that being said, I'm saying it's not enough. I'm saying that the culture of an organization is absolutely. absolutely critical. In fact, along my journey of being an entrepreneur and a business owner, I was there trying to grow and scale an organization. And I approached it with systems and processes alone. And it works in the very beginning. But after you reach a certain critical size, it doesn't work anymore, simply because your systems and processes, you're stuck there maintaining it.

Someone has to monitor the processes that is keeping everything together. In which case, if the revenue demands, and in terms of the operational capacity, can't keep up, what happens is you start losing resonance with their customers, customers, resonance with your employees. And your operational expenses have significantly increased. That being said, you could be in a situation where you are healthy in the green and all of a sudden bleeding tens of thousands of dollars a month and not knowing, not knowing when that's going to stop.

Now, you're referring to lack of planning or in mind. environmental changes and the inability to pivot? Well, I'm actually more specifically referring to the priorities of the organization. Okay. Okay. And what I'm trying to say is that there's a lot more to an organization than here is, here are the instructions on what you have to do in order to get the job done. and move the business along forward.

Now, you mentioned environmental situations as well, too. And I'm assuming you're meeting just the overall market landscape shifting around. Is that what you're referring to? Yes. I think that's a great angle to this whole topic, simply because of the fact that a hierarchical, rigid approach of doing business, it fails to adapt. it doesn't allow the team to be able to pivot very well.

So that being said, a different approach is necessary, one where it is much more rich in collaboration and much more rich in synergy within the people. Okay. So I think business is encompassing all of those elements at once. To an extent, depending on the leadership style, and as well as delegating the authority down to the level. lowest level. I mean, is communication being given? Is communication actually being orchestrated in a way

that's top down where everybody understands what the hell is going on at all times? And is it going right back up? Absolutely. And because of that, actually, one of the things that I've seen that really helps out an organization is reassessing what I like to call the rhythms. It's just set touch points in which case you can discuss relevant matters and sometimes have open forums. The first one I like to recommend is something called like a town hall or state of the union address. One where there is a senior leader who gets to address the larger group of people within the organization. It's actually very good if the CEO can do it. But if some organizations are so large that it's unrealistic, in which case,

a relevant senior leader for their umbrella that's under them. Is there a psychological safe place for people to speak up about potential issues? Exactly. So it's not just whether you do it. It's how it's being done as well, too. And you can see how, let's just say that there's an organization where that psychological safety isn't there. the first few it might be rather quiet with crickets in the room. However, if it's done over and over again and people are starting to realize,

wait a minute, this is time for us. This isn't a time for senior leadership that's trying to force us to do something. So we better stay quiet or else we're going to be, we're going to end up sticking our heads out there for it to be loved off. Yes. So that's one of the spaces where I highly encourage, okay? So you hit it dead on. It's not just about whether we do it, it's how we do it as well, too. Another one is something I like to call cross-pollination,

where senior leaders can get together a group of middle managers. It actually works really well when they share a similar type of function. Of course, there's some coordination things can be discussed, However, not only that, it's a great place for middle managers to share how they problem solves and perhaps share ideas what worked for them. What's amazing about that is no longer all the ideas have to come from senior leadership anymore because sometimes they can feel bogged down trying to come up with a solution for everything. The last one I'd like to recommend, which oftentimes gets overlooked, are one-on-ones. one-on-ones between middle managers and their individual contributors and also senior leaders to middle managers. Because one of the key things is for an organization to really have the desired culture taken place, the middle manager needs to live it.

The reason why is because they're the ones that have direct and regular access to everybody. And because of that, they're the beacon for the organization. Now, those one-on-ones is great because it's a time for people to step back and talk about things that sometimes outside of work. The reason why that's important is because I'm guilty of this myself where I just forget someone. We get so busy that we forget to touch base as people. Yes, I'm an excuse. Yes, yes. But when it's in our calendar and when it's scheduled, it's a lot easier to apply it.

So that being said, it's a great time to talk about various things like what's going on in life. Do they have everything they need? See, what I don't like is that if you have to put it in a calendar, then there's something wrong with you as a leader. you should naturally be able to deliver that to the people that follow you, to the people that are in your charge. You should know who they are on every level because in return, you know how to motivate them to their fullest potential and critique them on future issues. Well, I would have to somewhat disagree with that. And the reason why it's like saying all extroverts should know how to. be introverted at times. All logical people needs to be able to apply their emotional aspect at

times. All introverts need to be extroverted at times. Not everyone can do that very naturally. That being said, I agree. That is a very good way to approach it. And not only that, it is, I profoundly agree that reinforcement in situational moments throughout the day is absolutely critical. And in fact, that's what allows us to build a critical mass in order to accomplish what we want to do in terms of the environment that we want. So then it's a leadership standard. There's a leadership issue then, right? If the leaders, if we have to look at it as saying introvert versus extrovert, the people who are filling in that role, they aren't right for the position. Is that what you're, is that what I'm getting from you?

Is that what you're trying to tell me? Well, there are certain propensities for leadership amongst individuals. I can acknowledge that. However, that being said, I have seen situations where managers and leaders struggled in terms of trying to keep their team together. So it wasn't naturally within their skill set. But by creating a schedule of touch bases during. During those touch bases, here are your objectives. Here's what you do.

It's amazing how it can be extremely effective. Simply because that's how they work. Some folks work based upon here are my objectives. This is what I'm going to do during that time. When there is time allotted for it, I have seen those who perhaps were a bit rougher around the edge successfully bring together teams. So if I were to tell such an individual, just feel it out throughout the day,

I probably wouldn't have had much success with them simply because they struggled with that to begin with. That being said, it enriched their everyday moments throughout their work as well too. because one of the things I believe in is it's the everyday moments that count. Use everyday moments as coaching moments. That's a philosophy that I believe and subscribe to. But that being said, I do believe that especially logic and strategy driven leaders, they sometimes need a little nudge on that people element. Yes.

Let's backtrack a little bit because there's a little bit of holes I want to poke in there. Sure, absolutely. With people that are in charge of a team. You're telling, from what I'm getting, you're saying that they need to put it in their calendars, that they need to make time for these people. I completely agree. And regardless if they have the skill sets or not, for those that don't have the skill sets that occupy this leadership position, whether it's leadership or management, I don't think that is enough to just say, hey, follow this standard, follow this procedure, and interact with your employees. Yes, I get how we learn. The best way to learn is not to read, but to actually get out there and do it. But there needs to be more

fundamentals in place to really establish camaraderie and a true team. Oh, absolutely. And it's a lot more than just some of the what some perceived to be the subjective elements. There's the values of the organization. And what types of values do we set in place? How do we reinforce it? I mean, there's a lot more to that discussion and probably outside the scope of a single hour conversation. But I do wholeheartedly agree.

It is the everyday moments that do count. Okay. But how do we approach those situations? Like for instance, let's just take a situation that I, that some people may relate to. When you're a manager or a leader, things escalate to you, right? X, Y and Z occurred. What should I do? Now, as a manager and leader, one who's in their situation,

they're probably in their position because they're competent. They know what to do. And so the natural response might be just to tell them what needs to be done. However, I find that to be a very counterintuitive approach to managing. The reason why is because you strip their opportunity to develop their idea and take ownership. Yes. This took me a long time to realize as a manager and leader myself. because I didn't realize that giving out all the answers all the time was actually harming the situation.

It actually would only win out in the short term in terms of productivity. In the long term, it would hurt it because they didn't know my idea inside and out. They weren't fully bought into it. And because of that, I find that when curveballs were thrown at them in the long term, they didn't know what to do with it and they would drop the balls. Yes. Go deeper. Go deeper with this.

This is really good. Right, right. So one of the things that I realized was as a situation is brought up to me, rather than telling them what to do, I would solicit their thoughts and ideas. And I'll be honest with you. There are times where you just have to guide them a little bit. Here's what I realized. as long as their idea is going the right relative direction, even if what they come up with isn't as intricate and elaborate as yours,

it will win out in the long term because they know their idea inside and out. And I find that to be a way to increase productivity in the long term. And not only that, it deepens a relationship between the leader and marriage, you with the individual contributor because not only that they know something that you don't know because they fill that rule for a specific reason absolutely so it enrichens a relationship it improves ownership it improves retention and so little things like this compounded day by day throughout the organization begins to make up what what we call how we do things or the culture of an organization.

So with people that occupy a leadership position, okay, how do we get these appropriate leaders in the position in the first place? Well, first of all, we get people in for two different reasons. Number one is because we did an internal promotion. The second one is external hire. Now, at least in terms of trying to maintain the desired way of doing business in the organization, internal promotions should be the preferred route. It can't always be done simply because perhaps we don't have someone that fits the skill sets. But internal promotions should be the preferred route simply because they already have knowledge of the processes or the organization.

They have relationships in there. Not only that, it gives the organization a chance to have leadership shadowing, one-on-ones, rotations even. It's a way to fill in those gaps before they get in the position. The reason why that's important is because managers and leaders are oftentimes thrust into their position, and they have to learn at that moment. But more often than not, there's issues for the first one or two or three months. They rub people the wrong way. They didn't understand how things went. So by strategically using internal promotions and preparing them ahead of hand, we can smooth in those moments.

And not only that, there's a greater chance for a fit. You know how they do things philosophically. Now, that being said, let's talk about external hires. External hires, you do run the risk that is going to be a misfit. but it does give you a chance to find people who are who don't who have the skill sets that you need that currently people within the organization doesn't have so it is a it is a very viable play however that being said we have to be a little bit more selective on who we bring in we have to look for whether there is that fit that culture fit and then that's when we can start talking

talking about various ways of how we start filtering people, if you will. Case questions, case questions are a great way to explore that. It's also good to standardize that a bit if it's a larger organization. And now with those case questions, now let me backtrack a little bit before I go to that round. When you say rub people the wrong way, you're referring to with outsiders coming in, bringing in their historical approaches from previous positions and letting them know that that does not work here, that this is all new here. Whatever you know, leave it at the door and be here ready to learn on how this culture operates because it will not operate like any other.

Right. Every organization has its own nuances, its own processes, its own people, culture. And not only that is own politics. And someone who just goes in does not know that. It takes some time for them to get to know that. So that is what I'm referring to the potential risks of it. Because, yes, a manager or a leader who's not a good fit can sometimes harm the overall culture of the organization. Yes.

You're utilizing an ethnographic understanding to look from the outside looking in. And also a sociological perspective of how they perceived you. Yes. So now with going back to the final question, last question of what you said, statement, I should say. Here's my question. The categories now, we're trying to understand the right fit of leadership with these categories. How would they answer these? Are they answering it as a leader?

Are they answering them as somebody who's potential or just as an everyday thing? like those questions can be confusing for a lot of people. All right. So I assume that we're talking about external candidates for management or leadership position. Is that right? Yes. We just transitioned over. Yes.

All right. So it is not just about whether they have the technical know-how. It is not about whether they've done it before. it also matters whether there is a philosophical match in terms of how we do business. If for instance, the coaching or culture approach is something that an organization takes seriously. We want to try to look into that a bit. And it is tough. It is tough to look at that.

And sometimes we do have to take a gamble on someone if we have a feel. But that being said, I find that case questions tends to be interesting, something that they can't prepare for. Yes. The reason why is if anything that is a bit more typical is utilized, they're going to have a scripted response and anyone can have a scripted good response. In fact, it is expected that they're going to come in with scripted good responses. something that catches them a little bit off guard, a scenario, one that doesn't have a clear cut answer, but actually shows the various considerations that's going on

in terms of available resources, problems, X, Y, and Z. How does their mind start processing where the priorities are, and how do they start conceptualizing solutions, and enacting a solution around it. And every company, every job function, every team or department has its own nuances. So I can't possibly tell you what it would look like for, let's just say, the marketing team,

because I'm not a marketer. But there are elements within the job or managing a team in that department that can really draw out how they think. And also people scenarios, I find that you can start looking into people a little bit more, a little bit deeper past the facade, if you will. Sure.

So, all right, well, tell me about your position and how you would find someone that could take your place if you were transitioning to a promotion. For myself, if I was trying to, if I was trying to get someone to replace myself, that's the goal. Well, I'm actually a logical person who tends to like to master planet architect things. So obviously the replacement would have to have that skill set. However, there comes, there comes a drawback. for such type of profile oftentimes.

Not always, but quite often, they could be a little bit rougher around the edges with people. So you're going to have to look for someone who can do that. So that's where it gets a little bit tricky because it's kind of like trying to get an engineer who's good with people. It's oftentimes tough to find someone who, who can do both. That being said, I don't think that's the only approach to replacing yourself. And the reason why I say that is because I've found that rather than looking for someone

who can do everything that you do, fractionalize it within members of the team. So perhaps someone's strong on the master designing part in the team, another person who's strong at rallying people. Another one who's great at just doing a job consistently because perhaps they like it a little bit more step-by-step approach. They like predictable work. Another one who's very good at reaching goals. I find that if you actually build such types of team, it becomes a lot easier to replace

you. because you fractionalized it amongst multiple people. Now, that being said, if you build a team in that manner, you do need to be prepared to be able to manage the personality and communication nuances between them. Because if you bring together people that are different, there are more what I like to call tension points amongst them. And what that tension point is, to spell it more clearly, do you know those moments when you tell someone something, but it seems like they heard something completely different? They're confused.

They respond a different way. You don't understand it. Understanding their perceptions. Right. So that's a tension point. And if you naturally bring together people with different skillsets and personalities and work styles, there's going to be an increased amount of tension. points and pretty much as a manager or leader, you need to be skilled at reconciling that, helping people grow individually to be able to handle and own those interactions themselves as

well too. Because once you establish that, it becomes so much easier to replace yourself without having the team implode. Because your first question was, how do you replace myself? That's correct. It's a little hard because I was willing, to go through an additional amount of obstacles and hurdles, because I did it from a business owner's perspective, and business owners are known to do whatever it takes in order to stabilize the situation. Sometimes a little bit, it might not be as realistic of an expectation, but to find someone exactly like that, but I do find it much more realistic to fractionalize what you bring to the team and work on the ownership and collaboration and communication so that when

you do replace yourself, it's a lot easier to find someone who can fill a fractional component of it. Yes. So the reason why I asked you that question was we can illustrate an understanding that a leader needs to know himself that much that he can go out and find an identical representation of himself through somebody else. So through your own explanation, we need to find someone that is someone of character, someone with tact, someone that's diverse and is able to communicate within unique cultures and still bring a team together to work effectively. Absolutely. Absolutely. Beautiful. I think character is extremely important. It can't be captured with discussions of personality and strengths and weaknesses alone.

I find that the word character has almost gotten diluted nowadays. A long time ago, it used to mean so much more. It used to mean discipline. It used to mean when you get knocked down, you get back up. It used to mean what you say you're going to do. You're going to do. you're going to do, it meant a lot of things. Somehow in today's society, it almost became synonymous with the word personality, which I find that to be extremely different. Character and personality are much different, and not only that introspection, the humility to be able to look at oneself. And if you can do that for yourself, you can also have the eye to look at other people as well, too. So I wholeheartedly agree on that character aspect. It says a lot about people. I like that.

So let's transition to our closing. Now, tell us about your book and what can others take away from reading it? Sure. The book is called Culture for the Left Brain Leader. It is a transformative approach to business. something that has taken me a lot of hard knocks in order to learn and realize. I spell it out really simply for people. So if someone wants to get those realizations, which involves multiple layers of an onion to see,

they can get that book. You can find it on Amazon. Again, it's called Culture for the Left Brain Leader. Anyone who wants to contact me, they can reach me at Andrew at CultureNStrategy.com. Also, they can find me on LinkedIn under Andrew, YJ. Kim. I share a lot of realizations that I made that have really transformed my life through my business. And so I hope to share those realizations to have. help other people along their journey as well.

Excellent. Well, I do appreciate you coming on the show. Is there anything you would like to leave our audience with? Well, one thing that I want to perhaps have people think about is sometimes a concept of culture can seems like a far off thing that doesn't really directly relate to their productivity. And so they sit on it and wait on it. one thing I want to get people to think about is you want to start thinking about this sooner rather than later because today's business climate, everything is shifting so rapidly.

Resonance with employees is getting more difficult. And we need our team to pivot with us to relate with the customers and the market. the solution is the culture. And the sooner we realize and act on it, the better. So rather than waiting until we're actually in a downfall, let's make the realization earlier. Because if we wait until we're experiencing the downfall, there's a possibility it might be late

because it's not an overnight transformation process. I could not agree with you anymore. Beautiful. Andrew Kim, I thank you so much for coming on your transformation station. Absolutely. Thanks for having me. You're welcome. You've been listening to your transformation station, your voice on the hard truths of leadership.

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