Your Transformation Station - 71. What is "Connecting YOUR Purpose" 'John Lee' w/ Favazza

Episode Date: December 9, 2021

"John Lee", designer and creator of CustomMobileApps. He specializes in building personalized apps for podcasters. --- New episodes on Mondays for free. All episodes ad-free. https://PodcastYourTransformationStation.libsyn.com/site Find us on social media (YTSthePodcast) Support the showPODCAST INFO:Podcast website: https://ytspod.comApple Podcasts: https://ytspod.com/appleSpotify: https://ytspod.com/spotifyRSS: https://ytspod.com/rssYouTube: https://ytspod.com/youtubeSUPPORT & CONNECT:- Check out the sponsors below, it's the best way to support this podcast- Outgrow: https://www.ytspod.com/outgrow- Quillbot Flow: https://ytspod.com/quilbot - LearnWorlds: https://ytspod.com/learnworlds- Facebook: https://ytspod.com/facebook- Instagram: https://ytspod.com/instagram- TikTok: https://ytspod.com/tiktok- Twitter: https://ytspod.com/x Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

out to the same meaning. And yeah, I agree to agree to a fucking degree. Yeah. Like that is, that's how you get people to connect and applying it towards the specific outcome. Because let's say you are someone in charge and you are a perceived asshole and you know it. It's like, okay, well, you can frame it this way, but it will get you by so far. You're going to have to change your leadership mentality. How can you create a transformation in others if there's no transformation in yourself? Join your host, Greg Favaza, as your voice on the hard truths of leadership, your transformation station connecting clarity to the cutting edge of leadership. As millennials, we can establish change, not only ourselves, but through organizational change, bringing transparency.

that goes beyond the organization and reflects back into ourselves. Extracting. Extracting. Actionable advice and alternative perspectives that will take you outside of yourself. Can you just give us a little snapshot of who you are? My name is John. John Lee. I'm a software product manager by day.

I have a side project, like I said, running that small business, making mobile apps for podcasters. And I've got two hobbies at the moment. One is Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, which I started a couple months ago, and I really enjoy it. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. I'm a white belt forever, but I still love it. And then the other one is philosophy.

I love thinking about philosophical questions and having discussions about them. And so I think we're going to have one today, hopefully. Yes. Definitely. No script here. I got nothing. But that's awesome. one fucking jujitsu that's fantastic i did jiu jitzu for a little bit in the army did uh my uh combatives

level one and level two which is the equivalency of a blue belt when they just try to rush you in there for three weeks it's non-stop it's like a gauntlet every day or so i i miss that and then i also did craub mcghaugh for about four and a half years and that was my other little side thing that I enjoy doing. But you definitely brought up some interesting aspects about yourself that bring a lot of curiosity to a lot of people as far as how do you, like how does one go about establishing a side project that could bring some sort of financial return when they're working full time or when they're apparent, when they're doing all these different things and their plate is full, how do they get this moment of time for themselves to get something back for themselves?

Yeah, I mean, for me, it took multiple years. It takes a lot of work. It takes a lot of upfront investment. If you don't know what you're doing, like, I didn't know what I was doing in the beginning. So I did spend a lot of money that I didn't need to spend to get things started. Tell me about that. There are no easy answer. Yeah, tell me about that. Because I definitely, I understand with blowing your fucking money on these random things that you think you need. It's like, oh, I got to get this. Like, I got to get all the software to help me podcast when really you don't. You can do it for free, but Greg, you're wasting a shit ton of money. Yeah. So my current business is not what I started a couple years ago. I tried to start, I try to make my own app,

try to make my own social podcast app. And having had no experience in building apps for myself at the time, I hired an agency to help me do that, like a development agency, and that costs a lot of money. It'll cost that, you know, it could cost up to $100,000 to build an app, like, for your business or if you've got an idea. And I didn't have that kind of money, of course. But, I borrowed some. I asked friends and family to invest in my idea of a company back then. So I got family and friends to come in with me. And I so appreciate how they trust me.

And I'm obligated to give them a return on their investment. But yeah, I just started. So I just decided to start the journey because I wanted to be an entrepreneur. I wanted to have my own business. So it was just about starting. and there's a lot of learning that happens in between, a lot of failure. But I don't regret starting the journey because you don't learn and you don't grow unless you're on the path, right, unless you've started that process.

Sure. So long story short, like that didn't work out. And it was a horrible experience with that agency. And I didn't get a product out of it that I could publish. I can get out there into the world and really see if it would work. And Did you have a pivotal Sorry,

Did you have a pivotal point that Like prior to starting this This app here Did you have like some sort of drastic change that like Fuck this. I'm not doing the nine to five anymore. I'm going in. I'm going to start working for myself.

No. I've always had a full-time job. And I wasn't in a position to quit that Because I had a family to provide for. and their responsibility. That's not an option for me. Agreed. It had to be a side project that I could grow eventually,

and maybe if I were lucky enough or blessed enough, for that to become a full-time job. But it was never an option for me to quit anything and go all in on a side project. But, yeah, just long to short, my initial idea was a failure. It wasn't going to work financially. It wasn't going to work on the app stores.

So last year I decided to pivot and started experimenting with maybe we can turn my app into a branded app for podcasts. So there were some podcasts that I had come across that had their own mobile app. But the vast majority of shows don't have their own app. It's just too expensive like I experienced. So it hasn't been an option on the table for most podcasters to have their own mobile app. So that was the initial idea. and then as I tried to get beta partners to come and just have us build them an app for them, even get them interested in that, it gave me just enough validation, I think,

where I thought maybe I can pivot my business and start like a little agency and see if I can find more podcasters who would like to have their own mobile apps on the apps. So in January of this year, I pivoted, made a new website, and started reaching out to podcasters about making an app for them at an affordable price. So like our prices, I think, are just unheard of compared to going to an agency. We charge 25 bucks a month to have an app on the app source for your show, which is just unheard of. But without a marketing budget, it's just me reaching out to shows one by one, having conversations like you and I are having to get the word out. And the hope is eventually it'll just start to snowball on its own and it'll spread by word of mouth.

And my clients will get enough value out of their apps and they'll just start sharing their peers. So with designing an app, like for me, like how would I go about doing this? I know Google has a lot of great information. If you know what the fuck you're looking for, they'll give it to you. Like, yes, if we were to type in the Google bar, but I'm talking about actually Google developer. if you go into the very in-depth of what it takes to design anything. They give you all of it, and it's fantastic. So how would I go about doing it in a logical manner for someone who doesn't understand?

Yeah, so I think for the normal person like you or I, I'm not a developer myself either. It's too big of a learning curve to become a developer and to build up my own mobile app. It's just not going to happen. And so that's why there are companies and agencies that help with that. So whenever we onboard a new client, we use a platform to build these mobile apps and they'll go to the app store or Google Play, and we can draft an app for the client based on their requirements, based on their website, their goals for the show,

how they plan on monetizing their audience. And they can go in and have a look at a pre-built mobile app. And we can tweak that and customize that so it looks and feels just the way they want. want it and then we can publish that to the app store. So it's it's like a high touch, um, low effort way for podcasters to have a mobile app for their shows on the app stores. See, I got this, I'm feeling like that vision happening right now when you just think of a great idea and you can't hold it in. So rather than just doing an app for podcasters, why don't you like, have you ever considered having an app for everyone?

You know, like we all have a Facebook account. We all have a fucking Twitter. Well, we all should have our own app that has all that shit inside of that. And you just, you look like a badass. Hey, man, just go download my app if you want to get to know me, you know. I mean, that's what we built. Yeah, we built those apps for podcasters. So if you were to say, come download my app, you'll get access to all of our content in that app.

Plus maybe exclusive content. You can connect with us directly there. It's just the best way to get in touch with us. instead of listen to us on Spotify, listen to us on Apple Podcasts, where you have no connection to the host. Yeah. No, no, no.

So what I was referring to was an app for anyone, like somebody who isn't a podcast or somebody, it just, it's like another social media account that contains all the social media accounts. Are you talking about like a generic podcast app or are you talking about like you are small business maybe? I mean, you can call it whatever.

It's universal, but just having like, I don't know, I think this is a great idea. Like, I'm feeling some really in-death elevation happening. But just like making an app in general for anybody, you know, because somebody would want something because it sounds cool. It sounds like this is something for me. Somebody who wants to be elevated, be like, hey, I have, I got an app. Like, do you? Like, this has got all my social media. It's got the All About Me section.

Because everywhere we go, we got to keep. doing the same shit over we got to fill in our our g-mails all of our all about me our likes our topics about us why can't we just have one just one that contains all of it and then that's it that's our identity it's like a fucking driver's license but it's an app yeah I mean that's it can serve that function too like if you're just a person and you want your own app I've got the Gregory Favatsa app and download my app You got access to me. All of my socials, all of my content, writing, videos, whatever.

It's the same idea. Yeah. That would be a branded app for you as a person. We make branded app for podcasts. Yes. There you go. Well, you know what? That's my idea.

I had it up in the air for you, but you know what? I'm just going to pocket that and keep that for myself. Yeah, we could do that too. If you want an app for yourself, we could make that as well. It's the same idea. Yeah. Awesome. Awesome.

So tell us, all right, what drives you every day? What motivates you to wake up in the morning and do what you do? Yeah, so that's a great question. That speaks to like, what are my life priorities, basically? Bingo. Top of the pyramid and down. So, yeah, I spent some time thinking about this, actually, and it's been really helpful for me. So top of the list.

So this kind of goes into our discussion about purpose. So what is my purpose in life? I believe my purpose in life is to know God and love my neighbor. So love God, love my neighbor is my purpose in life. How that looks like for everyone is going to be different, and how it looks like for me is different. But generally that means my highest priority is to love my family, so my wife and my son, to the best of my ability.

So that's top of the pyramid. And then below that is to love our extended family and friends. so the wider circle of my social network to the best of my ability. And then below that would be those who are further out. So they would be my coworkers maybe. And that relates to my work, my job. So the motivation for me, so the motivation I ought to have to do a great job at work, I think should be to serve my coworkers and to serve my peers to the best of my ability.

And that's the way I'm going to love them, quote unquote, love them well. That's pretty much it. I mean, that's going to fill up the rest of my life, right? They love my family, love our friends, love our neighbors, to the best of my ability. And that's what I can't get to move in the morning. No, I like that. I mean, is there, is this food and, like, you know, like some place to stay on, on that little hierarchy of needs? I think that's just, yeah.

I just assume that's tougher. No, of course. If I didn't have shelter, yeah, then that would be top of the pyramid. But those are the team. No, you had me thinking of Maslow's hierarchy

and he's framed it that way. With that, with what you said, though, is just like serving and helping others within the workplace, I'm going to turn this towards. Now,

what kind of leadership mentality would you call, that? I think that's servant leadership. Yes. Yes. So now, what makes, how do I want to frame this? Who comes first? The leader or the follower and what makes them great at it? Can you say that question in a slightly different way? Sure. It's because I'm thinking what comes like the chicken and the egg and I had this articulated really nicely. And again, I don't like to use show notes. So there are great leaders and there are great followers. Now, how does one become a great leader if they're a great follower?

Oh, yeah. So I think that is the right order. So you have to start by being a great servant, a great follower, in order to them become a great leader. And I think the greatest leaders are followers that are assigned to the position of leadership. Just kind of maybe involuntarily. They're just assigned to it. The situation calls for them to step up and lead. And they're not becoming leaders because they want to lead. They're becoming leaders because that's what the situation calls for.

And that's what they're the best position to provide that leadership. So they step into that role and fulfill that role. not out of ego, but out of necessity and for the greater good. I think those are the best leaders. I think that's like the, that's a good example. It reminds me of how superheroes, like with any movie you think of, you know, somebody gets this great power and how they want to utilize it. And for good or for evil, that's a fantastic way of looking at it.

Now, for those that become this leader, how do they act if they don't understand what other people perceive the potential that they hold within themselves? I think what you're talking about is like if I were assigned to a leadership role and I felt completely inadequate in that role, how would I go about it? Bingo. I mean, just personally, I would trust those who had put me in that position. And let's just say, you know, because I'm a Christian, I would admit that I am completely inadequate for almost anything. Like, my job, whatever leadership role that I'm put in, I am inadequate. I'm a human being. I don't know enough.

No one knows enough to be competent at everything. And especially as a new leader, you're going to be. to be incompetent. I'm going to be incompetent. So there has to be, I think, some faith involved there in my ability to perform. For me, it would be faith in God to empower me to perform in that role that I believe he's put me in. He's assigned me to this role. He wants me here, and he's going to help me fulfill that. Okay. So there's a fine line now with admitting our vulnerabilities. because they see something in us. Now, whether it's being authentic or the ability to be confident, whatever one they see,

where is that line and how do you approach it without, one, bending your character or being someone you're not, but two, not being an autocratic asshole? Yeah, I think for me, it would be, admitting my inadequacy. So not being, like you said, being vulnerable, being honest about my inadequacies. But at the same time,

being very confident in God's help and his empowering of me. So I'd like to portray not self-confidence, but my confidence in God to work through me. That, I think, is the balance that I'd want to project to maybe my son or my family. I'd show them that I'm not I'm not Superman, right? I'm not a genius. I don't know everything. I'm going to try to figure

things out as I go, but I'm very confident in God's help and his presence with us and in me and he's going to carry us through whatever circumstance we find ourselves in. I like that. I really do. With just that approach as far as you are not the greatest at every single thing, I think that is the first thing that anybody has to admit for someone that is in charge of a team. They have to be authentic. They have to illustrate that they just don't know.

But even though I'm in charge, I will do whatever it takes to say, serve you. I will do whatever it takes to get you the resources so you can be at your best. And if I don't know, I'm sure as how can I fucking find out from everybody and give you the resources. Exactly. Yeah. I think that commitment to serve is really important. Yeah. And being humble and strong enough to admit that I don't know everything. But I'm going to try and figure out and I'm committed to serving this project you all to the best of my ability. Hell yeah. So could you relate to someone the commitment?

Like what would drive them if they weren't as close to God as you are? Or if they have some other transparent or just something inside them that drives them? How would you relate your ability to go forward and trust your source for someone else to trust their source? I don't think if I were on a team of just maybe strangers or coworkers, I don't think we all have to believe in God to be on the same page. As long as my followers felt my commitment toward them. and trusted me to be their support and to have their back. I think that's all that's needed for the team to unite.

And yeah, I don't know. I don't know about that. I mean, I think there needs to be some arguing. I think there needs to be some grab ass. I think there needs to be a lot of different things. Because let's say I'm in your team and I say I suffer from spiritual destruction. because of my childhood issues and my fucking mom just cramming it down my throat. It's like, well, how would you feel about that?

It's hard to talk about these things like in abstraction. I was just thinking generally, like, if you're from the military, I heard a picture one time where in the Marines, like, it doesn't matter if the leader is like the strongest and most confident person on the team. if the people on the team don't feel like that leader has their back, the team is not going to work. They all have to feel completely confident that every one of the members has each other's back. There's complete trust.

And that team will be higher performing. So I think as long as the team, there's trust among the team members that we're all in it together and we've all got each other's back. We're all in it for the same course. goal, we're all going to have to say goal, then that'll be a good culture, a good environment, and it'll produce the best performance.

No, I feel like there's more to that. Like, I mean, within an organization, within a team, there is a little, there's politics to it. I mean, for somebody who's a Democrat, for someone who's a Republican, and they are in the team together, I feel like there can be some, like, there is, there's a Democrat. There's a little bit of a brick wall between them. So you as a leader, all right, we'll segue away from the religion and we'll look at it as a political aspect and say, well, how would you handle that? Yeah, I think everyone's going to have differences, personality differences, right?

Some may be extroverted. You said political differences. But all of those have to be secondary to the goal. The team ought to have a goal that we're all achieving. We're all rolling the same direction. We're all going toward the same goal. The goal has to be the unifying factor that pulls us together and helps us discard our differences for the sake of the goal. So I want to reiterate and emphasize we've all got a common goal here.

Our differences can't get in the way of us achieving the goal together. Maybe that'd be one way to help unite instead of divide the group. No, I like that. And I caveat that with just communication on just the outside aspects that's allowing for us to work, like, things that they just don't see that only you as the leader know. I feel like if we were to communicate the outer workings, it would give people transparency and understanding about, okay, so I know this is happening. Now I really got to be due by due diligence because it affects things that are not just here, but outside the workplace. Yeah, no, I think you're right. I think if the leader is able to see something that's kind of invisible to the others, like there is some budding of heads going on.

There's some miscommunication going on because of differences, maybe personality or styles of the communication. Yeah, the leader ought to raise that. So everyone can see it and then we can address it together. Yeah, I think that is a talent. an ability that good leaders ought to have, yeah, to see these things and to raise them up so everyone can see them also dress them together. Okay, so if somebody were to quit their job, do you, like personally, do you think they, they quit their job because it just didn't work out or they actually just quit their management?

It could be a variety of reasons. I heard most people quit their jobs because they, they, They don't like their managers. I think that's, that may, there may be stats out there that say that's, the majority of reasons why people quit is they don't like their bosses. But people quit for all kinds of reasons, right? You may get a better job so you can quit to get a better job, a better opportunity. Now, that's back rationalized or in hindsight.

That's what they want to think. But what, I mean, there's definitely some, there's, there's a line there that I want to poke at and I don't know what do you is there do you just think that there's a possibility that they couldn't deliver the things that they were perceived that they allow they somehow allow the people applying to perceive that there's possibility but wasn't guaranteed but they would wave it in the air like hey you could get this if you just do your job but then they don't do it you saying do people quit because they find like they're not moving up in the organization.

They're not. Yeah. Correct. That's the reason I've left jobs in the past. Yeah, I wasn't moving up the way that I thought I ought to and I wasn't getting paid what I thought I ought to. So I got a better job. And that's definitely a reason people move and quit.

Okay. If they would have been more transparent, would you have stayed? Like, hey, we're not going to fucking, we're not going to promote you. We're going to keep you right here. if they didn't see any prospect of moving up or yeah getting paid more yeah that's a big part of work right you want to know you're making progress in your career right you're growing as a person as a professional and you're going to be rewarded for that growth so uh there must be a term for it but let me like upward mobility yeah very development motivation for people. And if that isn't there, they're going to look for it somewhere else. So now that's where we bring it back to you as far as, is that what you saw when you decided to go down this path as you're working? Oh, yeah. So the reason I started a side project was

I wanted to have my own business. I think the upside of having my own business is far greater than working at a company. It's much more difficult, I think, to build a sustainable business and build a successful business, but the upside is unlimited. Whereas if you work at a company, there will be salary caps. There will be a limit to how much maybe you can make in your particular profession. So, yeah, that's the reason I wanted to explore building my own small business. What's the hardest?

Shit. Sorry. What's the hardest part with, like, defining your target audience and understanding that, just knowing that this is what they need, they're just not sure yet. The hardest part about defining the target audience is finding them, figuring out if it's true. You can think, you're going to have to think about who that target audience is. And then you're going to have to go out and try to talk to them.

all of that is very difficult. But once you start talking to your hypothetical target customer, you may begin to realize, oh, I've got my persona has to be tweaked a little bit. I've got to refine that persona a little bit. And that's a process. But yeah, from beginning to end, it takes effort. It takes effort to think hard about who's going to want my product

and then making the effort to reach out to them and talk to them on the phone. listen to them and see do they really actually want my product? And if they don't, is there another segment, another persona that would want my product? So trial and error, reaching out, having conversations, refining who your target customer is based on real conversations, real information. All that is difficult. But in the end, it's going to help you be sharper in your communication, more targeted in your marketing, and ultimately more successful, right? Because you'll be targeting the right people,

not, you'll be targeting people who are interested in what you're selling, not just, yeah. Yeah. You know, I like, I like that fucking comment, okay? And this is why, this is why I wanted to tailor the show on a macro level,

as far as helping people understand their target audience, but through a real life, example of you and I. Right now you have, you and I have been communicating back and forth and me being the podcast or you being the developer slash app guy. So, but you're, you're learning from me. I'm learning from you. Now, what have you gained, have you gained any insight from our conversation and like, oh shit, Greg is interesting. He made me think about this. I'm just out loud.

Like what movie I'm learning for this conversation. It sounds to me like you're pretty serious about what you're doing, like your show. You've purchased the equipment. You've got a great looking mic right there, and you've got a good setup, and you're taking the show very seriously. So you may be close to my target customer,

the serious podcasters who's thinking about turning their show into a business or using their show to grow an existing business. That's who I think my target customer is. Someone who's using podcasting not as like an end in itself so much, but as it means to an end. So as it means to growing another business. So it's like it's one way they're going to market that business through the podcast.

Yes. Or they're going to turn that podcast into a business. So driving listeners toward some other offering. Maybe like selling merchandise or selling a book or selling courses. or something, but the podcast is not the end. It's going to be a means to grow in a business. Yes. And a little bit about me. I'm using this podcast to, one, get to know coaches, get to know leadership experts. As I finish up with my bachelor's and organizational leadership, I'm going to transition over into corporate consulting next year to the following year,

do the schooling to get the certificates for that. But I want to learn how to approach people and how to understand the very hidden dynamics that we miss, that we suffer, and how to navigate around that and illustrate a new standard of leadership. But also develop culture. I mean, there has to be a well-balanced culture in an organization. I mean, we got to look at employee welfare. We got to look at just the connectivity between everything about everything. And I think that requires risk management. It requires attention to a priority of presence of what really fucking matters.

Yeah. Now, what you're describing is about as complicated a thing as there is, right? That's kind of what I want to do to eventually in my career. I'd love to be able to drop in into a team. be able to diagnose the team, assess like where are the gaps? Yes. What are the issues here that are holding this team back from performing at their best? And then coming up with a plan for that team to transform itself and become a high performing team.

That's what consultants do, right? But the project of that is so difficult. It's so complicated because people are involved. People are complicated when you've got a group of people together trying to work together and achieve something, achieve a goal together, there are an infinite number of factors that go into what a high-performing team, how they function, right? So it's a great, wonderful problem to think through. And I think different consultants go at it at different angles. They attack that problem in different perspectives at different angles. But yeah, I mean, great on you to

to have that desire and to be learning maybe the foundational frameworks for understanding teams and high performing teams, how to help teams become high performing. I think that should be very satisfying work. Oh my God. I have a lot of examples to put a good structure together. And I don't want to share it because it could be something that's life changing. And fuck, I want to be that guy that be like, hey, I fucking talk. told you.

Yeah. I think as I work, you know, over the next, like, three to five years in different companies, at some point, I'm going to want to write down what I think are the factors

and elements that go into a high-performing team. That's like a framework, right? Every agency is going to have their own framework. Here's a consultant company A, we have this framework for developing high-performance team, and they've got, they're going to have like pillars. They're going to come up with just a model for how to come with a plan,

like a transformation plan for this team. So all that is going to get distilled down eventually. I just don't think I'm there yet. I don't think I have enough experience to start writing that out and defining that out into some kind of a defined framework. But that's what it sounds like you're after. You're going to come up with a framework that you're going to apply to different teams, different companies, and help them, if they follow your framework, become a

high performing team. Well, Deem, I kind of want to share it a little bit because you really, you're tempting me. But I'm going to do now. Okay, I can't help it. I really think it's, it's about connection. I mean, I mean, real connection, but I, but building connection through pressure, through a situation.

So from my experiences, I've built connections and drew people in close that were completely different cultures, people from completely different cultures, different sex, doesn't matter. In a situation where everything is against us, knowing we were going to fail, but we still continued and pushed ourselves to do our very best. I feel that if companies were to lay off the boring monogamous fucking meetings on meetings on meetings and just do something that will like a fucking obstacle course. That's what they need to go do. If you're going to work in my office and do all this stuff about marketing, you're going to do an obstacle course and we're going to do it as a team collaborative event. That is the only way I know you can work with me because you can work with me physically,

then sure is how we can work with each other mentally, spiritually, every way possible. Yeah, I know what I'm hearing from you is the power of casting a vision, the power of like having a common enemy, even a common threat. Like, you know, when the aliens have kept the earth, right? and they're going to destroy humanity. The countries are going to disregard all their differences and work together to fight the common enemy, the extraterrestrial,

come in to blast the earth, right? So that's the power of having a common threat, having urgency. That definitely bind and unite. And I think the government, I mean, governments use that a lot, like COVID, the common threat. Like, we're all on this together.

We've got to like, we've got to, like, unite we have to work together in order to to make this common enemy. There's always going to be something like that that they're going to put in front of us to nurture and like encourage unity. I think that's true. Companies to the degree that they can cast a vision and help

their people believe in the vision and feel like it's a meaningful thing to work toward together, all that's going to contribute toward high performance. Definitely. Hell yeah. Have you ever heard of the example like where you they would say there's like tall grass right in front of you and there's a fucking lion in there and like how do I get around the lion?

Because I want to get to the other side. Do I climb the tree and then leap from tree to tree to get around this tall grass? Or do I just take a five mile like ruck all the way around this fucking tall grass or do I just book it as fast as I can and hope like hell I don't get mauled? No, you haven't heard of that again?

example. No, I guess that's like an RV thing or some shit. I don't know. But that that's kind of like the mentality of what you described, but me describe it in a completely different way, but still equal out to the same meaning. And yeah, I agree to agree to a fucking degree. Yeah. Like that is, that's how you get people to connect and applying it towards the specific outcome because let's say you are someone in charge and you are a perceived asshole and you know it

it's like okay well you can frame it this way but it will get you by so far you're going to have to change your leadership mentality oh yeah no i think people will follow leaders to the end if they're inspiring right they'll follow an inspiring leader to the end but they'll only follow a dictator insofar as maybe they're safe. Like as soon as a dictator, as soon as I can get away from the dictator, I'm going to jump ship, right? So your leadership style definitely, I think, affects how your people will follow you. And if your style is like a tyrant and you're using fear to get obedience,

In the end, you're not going to get right far. You're going to get abandoned. Your people will abandon you in the end. So inspiration, I think, is a far better strategy for unity and for obedience than, I think, fear and tyranny. I'd like that. Because right now what we're describing here is different styles, even though there are different styles of leadership. they have a connection, not just because they're fucking leadership. That's not the connection.

But it's the approach to getting the team to accomplish the mission. It's the how. Now, if we were to go deeper, do you think that what makes like these different types of leaders, Do you feel that it's been instilled into them based on their previous learnings from other leaders? And that is now affecting them with a combination of, let's say, generation style, of course, experience in their past, trauma, all of that is what is creating these unique style leadership styles? Yeah, probably. I mean, we're all different. we've grown up in different circumstances.

We've seen different kinds of leadership. We're raised by different kinds of parents, right? Different parents. So all that I think informs the way that we try to lead our people, whether that's our family or our employees. But again, I think leading, getting obedience or getting compliance using fear is self-defeating in the end. And you're not going to get the best performance out of your people

if they're following you just because of fear. Whereas if you're leading you people because you are inspiring them to go after a meaningful goal, then I think, yeah, you're going to get much more performance, much better performance. Happier employees, more fulfilled employees

mean better performance in the end. And you as a leader, I think. Leaders best protect, maybe their position as leaders, when people want them there, right, they respect their leadership and they want where that's the most protection, I think. How would, like, what would be an example of a leader inspiring someone? Like, do you, like, like, give me something that would really just drive someone to go fucking the mile? I mean, it can be anything, if you're part of a sports team, right?

And like, I don't follow sports, but just as an example, if you're part of a team and the goal of the team is to win the championship, that and your coach is inspiring everyone to be their best. And as a team, we have, we have the potential to win this thing. That can be hugely inspiring. Okay. But what about the other guy who doesn't follow sports? Now that's a huge turnoff. Now you just fucking created a gap. What do you do?

Oh, yeah. So I was assuming we're all part of the team, like a soccer team or something, and we're all going to the championship. But maybe like in the military, right? For every mission, you've got an important mission that's being assigned to you from above. This is very important for the Army or the country to achieve a goal, keeping our people safe maybe. And so this particular mission is contributing to that higher goal.

It's very important that we as a true. achieve this mission, achieve our goal. And so inspiring new people to feel the meaning of this project, of this mission. And also feel like the team itself trusts each other and we're going to rely on each other. It's very dangerous also. So that element of danger can also heighten the unity. Ah, yes. Yes, that's what reinforces my thought as far as to get people to literally tighten the bond inside, not just the military, any organization is fucking put them through an obstacle course. Make them do fucking burpees. That's what you got to do. All of them. Mass punishment. Every single. No, I'm joking. All right. I think we're getting at like the stakes have to matter right

people people know when things don't really matter and when they do matter and communicating that our work really does matter the stakes are real and whether we achieve this goal or not it's going to matter hell yeah fuck yeah okay so what's transition to our closing here if you can leave our audience with a piece of advice that can change their life right now, what would you tell them? Quit their fucking job right now. Go ahead. I take the time to think through what your priorities are. For me, that's really helped me make everything else easier.

So once I've set and defined my priorities in life, just making the list one, two, three, here are my priorities in life. it helps put everything else in perspective. It helps balance the tasks that need to be done in the day. Like, what are things that I can push off? Because they're not feeding into my highest priorities today. So that's good internal work. It's good.

It's time well spent, thinking through what are my top three life priorities. So I'd encourage people to do that. I like that. I mean, just having that on your mind 24-7. Make it your fucking password. Just somehow articulate that. So you're always thinking about. And next, if you had a chance to call yourself your 20-year-old self right now,

what would you tell them to do differently or to do right now? 20-year-old self, I'd say... Stay away from the booze. I'm done. I'm done cut you out. Stop caring so much about girls probably at that age. It's not that important. Focus on getting as wide a breadth of experience as you can. Travel, do different jobs.

Don't worry about finding your career at that point. Just figure out your own interests. It'll take some time and a lot of exploration to discover what your interests are. Because once you discover your interests, then pursue those interests in the kind of work that you want to do. Your work will not feel like work if you're just pursuing your interests and your curiosity. So I think it's really important to discover what your interests are. That's really possible because then you have more time to pursue them.

And it's just life is more fulfilling when you're pursuing what you're interested in, genuinely, and not just pursuing something that for the sake of a career or for the sake of achieving some financial goal or whatever it is. Someone else's goals, right? You want to discover yourself, your own interests and pursue them. So you can get the most of the life at the time you have. That's what I'd say. Hell yeah.

Hell yeah. Mr. Lee, Mr. John Lee. What would you like to leave our audience with that you didn't get to say? You didn't get to mention. You did not get to say at all. Huh. Well, I'd say for folks that are maybe feeling a bit lost or feeling like it's hard to motivate themselves to get going to work or pursue their goals, I'd say don't give up. Keep thinking about the bigger questions, like I said earlier. Take the time to think about what your priorities are. And if you don't give up, keep thinking about. like the bigger questions like I said earlier take the time to think about what your priorities are

and if you don't figure them out immediately, don't worry just keep thinking about those. Keep at it and keep talking to people, keep having conversations and asking others what their priorities are because it'll help inform maybe what your priorities ought to be as well. If you take into consideration why our priorities, I think personally I think everyone's goal ultimately is to love your neighbor

as yourself, right? So focusing on that, I believe, will make you the happy as you can be. But it's just my perspective. So I'd encourage you to just consider that. Maybe that can go into helping you define what your top of your priorities might be. I like that. In other words, everybody, just get after it. Go fucking, just don't die. That's also a great place to be like don't die. I learn the most and I learn the fastest when I'm in a situation where I'm just trying not to die. Whether it's a new job, I'm just dropped in. Everything is new.

I'm just trying to keep my head above water. It's uncomfortable, but you learn the most and you learn the fastest in that kind of an environment. So don't be afraid of those environments and try to put yourself in them voluntarily if you can. I think you'll grow the fastest when you do. There you go. That's the sweet stuff we were looking for. I like that a lot. Put yourself in there voluntarily rather than being put in there.

That, oh, God, that really hits home to me because people will wait until they are forced to do something. And then they don't want to do it. thus they fail and then then they have that in the back of their mind the next time so then they don't even try but the fact of you voluntarily doing it is what helps you adapt and that is one of my things that I will share with that the military would help us overcome because they will give somebody a chance to raise their hand to be the first one to do something before they just fucking start crack and whisp like everybody get the first. fuck up now because nobody wants to volunteer you all get to volunteer but that is how you develop

yourself yeah that's true i think free will goes into that and i listened to jordan pearson a lot and he talks about how like a voluntary piece of it like opting into it makes all the difference it activates genes it activates like a lot of things that makes it beneficial instead of traumatic because if if you're not volunteering and a difficult thing happens to you, it becomes a trauma. But if you volunteer into that difficulty, it becomes activating and you start to grow and you start to just become a more fuller human being. Hell yeah. No, I just read his latest book. Fuck, I can't remember the title. I know it's like 12 something. God, it's going to drive me. Or is it 12 rules for life? Yes. Thank you. Thank you.

Great book. Did you get to read it? I haven't heard any of his books, honestly. I don't know. Yes, a big fan of his podcast, definitely agree. Now, let's transition out of here. How can our audience get in touch with you and get more details about your work? Yeah, so they can find me and my side project at custom mobile. And they can email me directly at john at custom mobile. That app, happy to hear from any one of your listeners. And if they want an app, we are happy to start them up for free.

They'll get their first month free. come through your show Gregory. Oh, fuck. Hell yeah. Awesome. Do you hear that, everybody? Just go ahead and just say, Hala, Greg Favaza.

No, no, no. To say your transformation station, that's better. And it'll hook me up. He's going to give me some love. All right. Thank you. Thank you, John, for coming on the show.

Thank you, Greg, for having me. It was a pleasure speaking with you. And good luck with everything. You've been listening to your transformation station. voice on the hard truths of leadership. We hope you've enjoyed the show. We hope you've gotten some useful and practical information. Make sure to like, rate, and review the show.

Remember, your transformation station is on all major platforms, including Facebook, Instagram, Pinterest, TikTok, and YouTube at YTS, the podcast, and visit the website at YTSThepodcast.com. Till next time. Till next time. LifeLock, how can I help? The IRS said I filed my return. But I haven't.

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