Your Transformation Station - 93. Organizational Leadership and Ethics

Episode Date: February 14, 2022

The Shots of Insight with (Manish Bundhun) on "Organizational leadership" and business ethics Join me, Greg Favazza, as I get familiar with the industry expert Manish Bundhun, author of Shots of Insight, an expert on all things leadership and empathetic behaviors in both business and teaching.PODCAST INFO: Podcast website: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com⁠⁠ Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/apple⁠⁠ Spotify: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/spotify⁠⁠ RSS: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/rss⁠⁠ YouTube: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/youtube⁠⁠ SUPPORT & CONNECT: - Facebook: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/facebook⁠⁠ - Instagram: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/instagram⁠⁠ - TikTok: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/tiktok⁠⁠ - Twitter: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/x⁠⁠ - Pinterest: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/pinterest⁠⁠ - Linkedin: ⁠⁠https://www.ytsthepodcast.com/linkedin⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

How do we sustain that momentum that we've created? Yeah, so it's like you systemize it. It's like a system takes over. If you make the best examples, the best companies in the world, they rely on four elements which systemizes the culture, that is on strong rituals, on powerful stories, on artifacts, as well as a specific kind of language, which defines the way of being.

How can you create a transformation in others if there's no transformation in yourself? Join your host, Greg Favaza, as your voice on the hard truths of leadership, your transformation station connecting clarity to the cutting edge of leadership. As millennials, we can establish change, not only ourselves, but through organizational change, bringing transparency. transparency that goes beyond the organization and reflects back into ourselves. Extracting. Extracting. Actionable advice and alternative perspectives that will take you outside of yourself. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back.

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Thank you. This is your transformation station. And now your host, Greg Favaza. Mnich Bunhun, welcome to your transformation station. How you doing? Fine, thank you, Greg. May I call you Greg or Gregory? Greg is perfect.

Somehow I've always put my full name out there, but Greg is my preferred name that I would like to be called. Okay. Thank you, Greg. Thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be with you. Excellent. Before we go right into our conversation, I would like to lay out some ground rules for the dialogue for this episode. What I would like from my guest and what I will reinforce from our guest is an authentic conversation.

where we don't go into monologing or use glittering generalities to cover the basis of what we're trying to explain. But more or less of having a authentic conversation with you and I highlighting your specialties, your strengths, and extracting actionable advice for our audience to take away and apply it into their organization. Beautiful. I'll be happy to engage in that quick. Beautiful. And for any recommendations you would like to put out there as far as a book or something we all have that that we all would like to give a shout out to,

we will save that to the very end. and then the floor will be yours. Yeah, sure. Beautiful. Excellent. All right. So tell us, what can you teach our audience today?

That's a good question. So what can I teach? Well, I don't have much to teach, I'd say. I would say I'm more humble. In a way, I can only share my own experience, what I've been through what I've experienced, what I've learned. and I hope it can help to people.

You see, I'm the field of human resources. I'm an executive coach, but I'm also now a published author. And whatever I've written has always become from what I've experienced, what I've learned and what I've practiced. So to come back to your question, if there's one thing I could share, is really about how to be aware of your own hero's journey, what you're going through in your life. and how do you be open to it, be true to it, and to learn from it? Okay. Beautiful. No, I like that.

Now, when it comes to leading organizational change, there are some requirements that are involved for those that are in charge of an organization or those that are in a managerial position. Now, if that's the case, what is some information you can pass? along to those that are in that position? So what I would pass on to those who are in a leadership position or management position is if I would focus is on one idea, one notion, that notion is of self-leaders. That is to be able to lead others, you need to lead yourself first. That's for me the basis of all good managers, good leaders, is if you want to look at the quality of leadership in organization,

look at how they lead themselves. us, those people, meaning to what extent they are self-aware, to what extent they keep learning by themselves, and to what extent they self-regulate, that is, they're able to stop, to pause, and to reassess their own situation and see how they can improve. Okay. So with the change process, when you're trying to implement a new policy, I hate using policy, it just feels like it's too formal. and I want to try to avoid that.

But when you're trying to implement a new way of living in the culture, where it's an internalized norm there, what is the process like? Where do you start first? Do you create a communication plan outline? Or do you start creating the vision? And then you put the outline together. Like what are the steps of strategically making a, making the change process occur inside an organization.

Okay, so what I would say is, not to be generalized, but let's take an example. So if you say I have to shape a new college training and organization, where we start? I wouldn't start with a plan. I would start more with the center of the organization, that is the management team or the leadership team. So as we say, this train restarts from the center has the highest potential for impact, meaning shape the culture with our team first, so create alignment, create clarity, and create agreement to what we need to do. So what it means is, I would say there are three steps to it.

First is shape it, shape the culture, or shape the change you want to create. So create a clear outcomes with the core team, with the people at the center. of what we call the leadership team. So everyone is aligned. From there then you diffuse it. So you have a plan to diffuse it in communities across the organization. So I normally call it core captains and crew.

So you have your core team. Then you have the next level, what you call change captains, or who are basically people who are your opinion leaders, ambassadors who are going to portray or carry to change. And then finally, from captains then to the community. So you diffuse it in front of the community. three steps, four captains and crew. And the final step after the diffusion is systemization

of the change. So how do you systemize it? Systemizing means, as you mentioned, one word that I too, I don't like, is policies. Because it's too policing. I prefer guidelines. I prefer practices. So it's really how do you work around the wheels of change. So what's the language that you need to use? What are the rituals that you need to put in? in place what are the stories and what are the by rituals i mean the processes and the systems the stories that you need to talk about um beat success stories or lessons learned as well as what are the artifacts that you need to put in place in order to systemize the change initiative so in in a nutshell three steps you define it you diffuse it and you systemize it okay so what about

is communicating a tentative timeline where everybody is on the same page. What's a realistic timeline? I know if we're trying to establish this kind of change, we're not looking at a five-year span. We're trying to motivate people immediately and get the change to occur now. Yeah. So the timeline would depend on what is the type of change you want to implement. So if you're trying to implement a new culture, then it's six months is not feasible.

It will take at least three years for culture to set in. But if you want to implement a new structure, then three months or to six months, it's feasible. So it will really depend on the type of change, the size and the scale of the change. So as to see what is the best time run, which would be most optimal. Why three years for the culture? That's interesting. Well, culture, if you look at it, is the way we live. The way we do things. It's the art of doing, the art of being, and the art of knowing.

and in that sense to diffuse to create a to shape a new culture you need to find ways for people to unlearn what's not working what is not required anymore and then you learn the new cultures reinforce it with rewards with recognition and with other practices and stories

so in general what I'm saying three years three years is what we call a bit the best practice in terms of if you've done everything right A strong culture sets in when you've done all these things right over three years. Interesting. I like that. How do we sustain that momentum that we've created? So you sustain the momentum by not relying on champions.

Yeah. So it's like you systemize it. It's like a system takes over. If you make the best examples, the best companies in the world, like Google, like if I take in airlines, Emirates, as well as Singapore Airlines, for example, they don't rely on culture champions. They don't rely on people who are going to be the figureheads of culture. They rely on four elements which systemizes the culture, that is, on strong rituals, on powerful stories, on artificial. facts as well as a specific kind of language, which defines the way of being in the organization. Okay. That's, I, I really like that.

What about, so if we're leading organizational change, would there be a time where we would ever sacrifice a code of ethics in order to make this change occur? Go to ethics? No. if you have to sacrifice on ethics, then you shouldn't be thinking, why are you doing in this organization, right? Yes, there's a loaded question there.

What is your code of ethics when it comes to a business interaction? I would say values, right? So it's really about the values and principles which drive you, as long as, for me, the main code of ethics for me is, as long as I can sleep soundly at night and see myself in the mirror every morning, every day, without any regrets, without any doubts, then for me it's fine. I like that. Okay.

Now, let's transition. What are the top three shots of insight you have for our listeners? Okay. Well, okay, so let's start with one. Today, um, happens to be St. Valentine's, 14th of February. Right. Yeah. Yes. So, uh, my, happy, happy.

Happy. Happy Valentine's Day. Happy. Happy. Yeah. Big to you all so great. Uh, the number one for me is, um, just like the notion of leadership to lead others, you need to, to lead yourself first.

So the number one for me is to be able to, uh, find love and to be love. You need to love yourself first. It starts with self, self love. Um, so everything. everything starts with self, self awareness, self-love, self-leadership. So that's for me the number one shot of insight. Oh, I'm going to challenge you. Are you ready?

Let's do this. Okay, so self-love, yeah, I agree. But when it comes to managing a team, don't they come before yourself, don't they? I didn't get the question? When you're managing a team, don't they come before you? So you lead by example, you want to take care of them. you want to provide for them everything they need in terms of servant leadership. I don't have to challenge you back on this, right?

Let me allow me to challenge you back. People in a team will only follow you because of your strengths, right? Agreed? Correct. We're leading the team and you can only lead through your strengths. That is by leading on what you're good at. If you're a great communicators, you lead for communication. So in that sense, leading by example,

really focusing on your strengths. That's one. And secondly is it's not being responsible for others. Is being responsible to others? That is if you're in my team, I'm responsible to you to provide my time and the right resources to you, but I'm not responsible for you. You're accountable for your own results, for your own outcomes. I'm responsible to be present with you, to accompany you, to support you, to stretch you, to challenge you, to give you perspective. but I'm not responsible for you. Hell yeah.

Hell yeah. No, I like that. No, that's good. All right. Beautiful. Keep telling me the other two. Okay. So the other two,

let's think about it. For me, the first one is the self notion. The second notion I would say in terms of sorts of insights is focus energy. Yeah. Well, that's number three. Number two is actually clarity of mind. So it says clarity of mind is every journey starts with a clear mind. It doesn't start with a first step.

It starts with a clear mind about where you're going to do the first step. Okay. So what means is clarity of mind is being clear on where you are, where you want to go, how do you get there? What are the challenges in front of you? So you develop clarity in terms of what are decisions you need to take. very often we get stuck because we're not clear in our minds our mind is I would say the word out comes to mind here is we are often confused or cluttered there are too many things happening at the same time so we need to declutter and really focus to find that have the discernment

to have a clear mind on what we need to do so so that's for me then the number two in terms of of shots of insights beautiful let me hit on that a little bit that's the reason why I brought up leading organizational change with going in line with your shots of insight having this clarity tell me like it goes much deeper than what you've explained and you did a fantastic job at doing that but this is a malleable formula that we can apply not just to an individual level but to an organizational level. Now, if in terms of clarity inside an organization and establishing organizational change, what are some things that we need to take into account with making a change occur? Okay. So being clear on what is the change that you need to drive,

it starts with being clear on why do you need the change, isn't it? Start with why. Driving organizational change, you need clarity. And clarity of mind at an organizational level starts with being clear on why do we need to change. Okay, so that's the starting point. As Simon Sinek said, start with Y, which will help you get more people.

Your Y will define what's next, right? So start with why. Second then is what you want to achieve. So being clear on the outcomes as crystal clear as possible so that people get it, the Y plus the what. And, finally,

Finally, then, when and other dimensions like what would not happen if we don't do this, what would be the consequences, what are the stumbling blocks and so on. Once you develop those kind of elements to be clear, then it becomes pretty simple to focus your energy and to implement, actually. I really like that. But I also like the sound that's coming in from your background. It feels like the windows open, there's cars driving by. It's very soothing.

it's worth the point that. It's a fun. I usually sleep with a fan, so that it's just like, ah, this is nice. It really is. But I completely agree with clarity, but I also want to caveat that

communicating this clarity that everybody understands the bigger picture, like reinforcing to all the levels up and down all levels to who is involved in this and this change. I mean, your stakeholders, everybody that's involved, the importance of why we're making this change and the transition

and then capitalizing on the vision that we want, which would be the desire change. Yeah. So a couple of one element on this. You know, for me, the job of a manager or a leader in his team is two things. First is to generate clarity in his own mind. And it's important as a leader that you're clear in your own mind. People will follow you naturally. If you're not clear, you're lost. Then your team will also be lost just like your organization.

So to generate clarity in their own mind and then ensure that there's clarity around him in his team. The clarity around him means being clear on why we need to do this, where we're going, what we shouldn't do and what are the immediate next steps. No, I definitely agree. People pick that up like a natural like thermostat. Like if you don't have your shit together, people can just sense it. It's like, I don't want to be around this dude because he's bringing off this vibe where it's like, yeah, he doesn't know what he's doing. He doesn't know how to put his pants on because apparently they're fucking backwards.

Yeah. Okay. So what are, what can you help us with painting? points inside the organization. What would you recommend? The pain points inside the organization, I would say if you take it in a contextual way, everyone is talking about the great resignation. So a lot of people are leaving their jobs. Yes. Moving on. One of the pain points again comes down to leadership. So very often the management or the

leaders haven't evolved with the times. especially with new generations joining the workforce, which means people are no longer looking for, what I would call a standard of link, they are looking for a quality of living. So earlier generation, when you have leaders of today or managers of today who are mid-40s, when they join the organization,

you can say their scope was you would join an organization at that time to have a standard of living. to have a car, to have this, to have that, to possess, to be more well-off and have better well-being. But the next generation which came up, they're looking not for a set of living because that was established by their parents. They're looking for quality of living. And quality of living is really about experiences, about purpose and meaningful work, and about

feeling fulfilled in whatever they do. So that's where, that's one of the main pain points is organizations are. are unable to cater for what people are looking for in terms of purpose, in terms of flexibility, in terms of growth opportunities. So there is a shift in terms of how leaders engage with people. So I ask to create a workplace where they can grow, perform and thrive. I like that. All right. So let's go into a little roleplay here. All right, I'm working for you. I just got a job with you. And I want that purposeful connection that you just described.

That's beautiful. How can you give that to me? Can you illustrate that to our audience? Sure. So, Greg, what is it that makes you happy, actually? Jeez, actually getting that flow state of mind where I know that it's contributing to something much bigger than myself. And what's important about that for you? seeing some results.

Like if I don't see the results happen in real time, I don't fucking care. And what's about getting the results in real time for you? Say that again? What's important about having the results in real time for you? The results are, it's like a reinforcer where my actions are making something physical occur right in front of me. Okay. and what's importer of that fee one more time?

Shit, I don't know if I go any deeper. Let's see. Once that, yeah, I don't know. I understand you might not know now, but if you did know, what would it be? I would say, so getting that result

and seeing that occur, it just makes me feel like that not only I'm a part of something, but I have the ability to do something that I didn't think I could do. Okay. So what we just had is a quick interaction to help me understand what drives you. Now, so let's come back to the question where you're saying to the rule play. How can I provide who work for you?

So it starts with understanding, leading with questions, understanding what's your why? What would help you feel fulfilled? That's one. Second, I would like to understand what is, Greg. for example in your view what are your strengths assuming you said what are my strengths yes what are your strengths okay my strengths in terms of an individual i would say i have a i have the presence of a leader uh i can delegate authority like nobody's business like if i know exactly what has to be done i will communicate that and i will execute that down to the lower level and I won't micromanage people because I will have that understanding already with my

employees that I know that I can trust them and trust is relayed right back to me. What kind of role would you feel fulfilling that you believe you can contribute positively, you know, and create impact in terms of, which will satisfy your purpose and your strengths? Okay. So if I don't know, what would you tell me? if I don't know what I would tell you is understand why we do what we do as an organization so what are the outcomes we are looking to achieve results and how does it make the world a better place

how to do that and then from there based on your strength what I would propose you is a team leader position for me it would be really understanding leading my questions understanding your purpose what you do and what drives you. Secondly, is understanding you what are the strengths which, well, your key strengths that you can

leverage on. And third would be what kind of role do you see yourself in, which you feel would be fulfilling? So having those three questions in mind, those answers will help me me tailor me, what kind of role would fit. So in my view, for example, you'd be their sales team leader would be some of your interest to you. Okay. All right. There's no issues.

All right. I kept thinking something's about to happen. No, we're good. So is that the HR coming out of you? I would say, yeah. We call it, Deformations professional. Oh, wow. No, that's really.

It's the HR speech. it's not as funny now because I said it like three times and it's like it would die every time. I'm like, damn it, it's not funny anymore. This is stupid. Beniche, let's transition. Tell me a little bit about your, let's go a little deeper into your background and highlight your expertise. And I'm going to give you the floor to where you can open up to what. you wanted to talk about a little bit.

Thank you, Greg. What I would like to talk about is that we learn, we live, and we kind of experience a lot of things in shots. It's like you're taking a shot of vodka. So it's the same thing. You experience many things in shots. So tangible experiments, moments of truth. The best moments in life are really experiencing shots.

So that's the whole gist of shots of insights is small bites that we call shots that you can learn to learn and to lead better. So that's a bit what I wanted to share. So always focus on which make a difference. Is that, are you still there? Yeah, I'm still here. It was, I was watching you smile. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no. No, no, I like that.

Because when I was looking at this book, it's just, it looks very appealing other than I'm not much of a drinker as I used to be back in the day. I would throw shit down. But now it's like I just, I stopped drinking all together. And now I prefer energy drinks over fucking alcohol any day. But I like that because it's just little shots of wisdom that can really change somebody and align them with the direction they're trying to go. So tell us a little bit more what inspired you to write this, to write your book and to help others. Well, what inspired me to write is my own journey. So, and as you mentioned, to be authentic at the start. So I'd like to share that. I had the apportioned the hard way at the early age, at the age of 18, actually. in Singapore to join my elder brother

who was studying there in third year, engineering. And coming from an Indian family Indian background, you don't have much of a choice. I either become a doctor, an engineer or family disappointment. So I ended up choosing to be an engineer. But what happened then was

as I was in first semester, my brother passed away on campus after a football match. He was 20. I was 18 and it all happened in front of me on the pitch. The ambulance came, they had to give him electroshocks. So, and he passed away in the ambulance. And I was 18, you know, so I was studying there that got under scholarship, a

birth tree and I had to forego at that time. And the hardest thing I had ever had to do in my life, 18, when I had to call home and inform my parents that my elder brother had just passed. There were just two, right? Two siblings. And the next three days, I, well, I was emotionally, and I didn't have any tears coming out.

So only thing that came to mind was you need to organize everything, pack everything, and come back. So I kind of suppressed all my emotions just to be able to make fruit, to make it through. So it's only when I reached home three days later from the next. next flight in Mauritius that reality of the situation sank in. When at the airport, I saw my parents after four, five months, actually, and my father had aged by 10 years in the matter of months. So in that week, actually. So, and that's where the reality hit me. And I realized that I'd lost my elder brother, why he was my mentor, my role model.

those three days of not having been able to express my emotions, having suppressed it, so I became what I would call emotionally constipated. So everything, my whole range of emotions was very reduced. So I would never really express myself. So that kind of triggered me to start working on myself. I had gone, I went for depression afterwards and I had to pick myself up, start with. And so for go to my scholarship and start working before starting studying again. And then from there, I had to rebuild myself up one step at a time, work, be there for my parents.

So the trigger for me to start journey. If you don't mind me asking, how did your brother pass? What was the cause of this passing? The cause was he had What we believe now is he had a congenital Heart aren't aware of So as he was playing on the football pitch He had a

A malise or what we call in French a malice or cardiac arrest Oh shit What you footballers Soccer players collapsing on the field So that's what he had And at that time we didn't have the The first aid or he helped support to be able to save him.

God damn. I'm sorry to hear that. That was the cause that got you started. Yeah, that was kind of the trigger which got me started in terms of work on myself. So it's really about working on myself and overcoming this trauma. So I had that drive to, you know, I couldn't express my emotions. I couldn't express myself. So I really needed to work on myself deeper at a deeper level in terms of finding my purpose, understanding my values, my emotions, my competencies and what I really want to do out of my life.

So that's why I shifted from engineering into management and resources by an accident of nature, by a tragedy. So these are kind of experiences which from learn. and then to see how I can share it. Because I know what it means when you go through such experiences and how you need to pick yourself up and rebuild yourself. So, in fact, with the support of my loved ones, I was able to rebuild myself. I like to stop you right here because this is a good little talking point. I want to cover for people that are in a leadership position

or anything that, or they're in charge of a team. I feel like this is a good point for people who don't know who they are leading, that they should take the time to understand what is driving people. Do a lot of leaders, or any leaders, in fact, go that deep with the people that work for them to understand important things that happened in their life, like for you with your brother passing or for me whose experience numerous traumas that

that finally been dealt with but back then affected me and I chose to ignore it by overworking my ass yeah I can relate to that and also well my belief is

not many leaders invest that time to get to know people to get to know the stories in fact when it comes to your work, the work situation and the workplace, many people just treat the team members as objects as vehicles to a means to achieve. So it's just a number. But when you get to treat the person as a human being and get to know the person, individual level, that's where you really bond. You create the trust, you create the rapport. And that's where you create great teams,

actually. So getting to know the person, the stories that they have gone through, their moments of breakdown, their moments of break. So what they learn from it, this is what makes us really offensive. Then they have a sense of empathy and a sense of care that no matter what you know, do you back and vice versa. I like that. I really do. Just out of curiosity, what is your leadership style? Leadership style, I would say, is I would say an enabling leader to be an enabler.

My role is to help the person develop clarity, to help the energy on what matters and to help the person keep seeking better outcomes. So that's CEO

as an enabler, clarity, energy, and outcomes. Beautiful. I like that. Now, tell us about your book

and where we can find it if we want to learn more about it. So my book is called Shots of Insights, 101 Inspirations to Live, Learn and Lead Better. You can find it on Amazon. And it's available on Kindle. It's available on hardcover and paperback versions. And in two months' time, also on audiobook, audible version.

So shots of insights by Manish Banden and how you can learn, lead and live better. fruit, bite size. Beautiful. Now, if our audience wants to learn more about you, Manish, where can they go? And if you want to cover any points that you haven't got to cover yet, now is the time for you. Well, I write every day, every two days on LinkedIn, so I'm pretty active on LinkedIn. You can connect with me on LinkedIn. So Manish Bunden.

And so I happen to be in human resources. I happen to be a coach. but also I happen to mentor people. So if you're looking for mentorship in the leadership that I mentioned or resources, for example, or else if you're looking for a mentor for your career, happy to touch base, to engage. Well, actually, there was one point which you had to ask me the three questions, the elements for thoughts of insights.

Yes. I didn't mention the third one. That's right. We kept phasing out. I completely forgot. Yeah. No, we could definitely, we're still rolling, so tell me a little bit about that. So the third shot, as I mentioned, the first shot is a self-leadership and self-love.

Second shot is about clarity of mind, and for me, it's really focused energy. You see, in fact, your most important resource as a person, as a team is not time. It's not about your energy. How do you generate positive energy in you and around you? And how do you focus that energy on what matters? Today, in the world we live in, if you look at it, we are bombarded with information. You are constantly disrupted by notifications and constantly your mind is everywhere. Agreed.

It's quite dispersed. So it's really how you focus your energy to be that laser focus to be effective. Some call it deep work. Some call it focus energy. So I like to call it focusing energy for maximum impact. So knowing what having that discernment, what you're going to do and what not to do so as to be effective. Okay. How do I do that? Tell me. So focus your focus energy in that sense.

Playing to your strengths, knowing what you are to delegate, what you need and what you need to do yourself, right? So it starts with being clear again on the next steps. And then focus energy is about generating energy in yourself. So physically, look after yourself. How do you sleep? How do you exercise? How do you nourish your body? So that is high on energy.

And then from there, focusing on how do you use your time then? So you might allocate time. but at least you have the mental space to be fully present to it. The focus energy is about being fully present to the time that you've allocated yourself to. So you're not, you switch off your distractions, you switch off your notifications, you put your phone in the corner, and you're being able to practice a form of deep work. Okay. So what if, what if I can't do that?

What if there's like, what if I need to respond to certain people that I just can't turn it off? So you have a choice, right? Yeah. You have a choice. And it doesn't mean that every time you have to give in, you have to say yes. Because every time you say yes to you're saying no to yourself. Yeah. Yeah.

So it's clear on what you say no to, including if you really block time. We block time for now. We're not having any disruptions. I've already said no to others. I'm really focusing and being fully present with you. So it doesn't mean you need to do a full day for it. There's a nice technique called a Pomodoro technique. Pomodoro, Italian, it's my tomato.

I like it. So the Pomodoro technique is every 25 minutes, you take a five-minute break. So five minutes, you're really focused. Ooh, it sounds like a smoke break to me. The five minute break, you mean? Yeah, it sounds like 25 minutes of work, then everybody take five, go smoke a cigarette, and get back to work.

Yeah, or go to rehydrate or dehydrate or dehydrate. Agreed, yeah. No, I like that. I do. That's, I, I'm Italian and I always, find that fascinating to hear those different little things from the culture that I'm coming from that I don't need that I don't know much about. So that's awesome. Thank you with that. So now if let's say that I don't want to put this. If I if I do that and I'm still

not getting the results, I know we got to I mean, I know we got to we have to block the time out. I know we got to fill out the calendar and don't do it by daily. Do it. Don't do it. Don't do it biweekly, but plan out bimonthly. But what if I just don't have the time and I don't want to do the calendar? What if I just, sometimes I fall off. Sometimes I feel like I just don't want to block anything out and I just want to rely on impulse. Is that okay? Is that normal?

Well, as long as it helps you achieve what you need to achieve, right? The thing is, you need to find to develop a form of routine. Right? If you don't have a routine for it, you don't develop the habit of it. Yes. And you need to find a way to develop the habit. You just a cigarette break, right? To smoke, a smoking break.

That's a habit, you know? Nothing is disrupting your, when you take your smoking break, isn't it? Yes, that's true. Are there to disrupt your smoking break? No, shit. I mean, I got a vap. So I'm doing my smoking break right now as we speak. So I find a way to cope with it.

So you will find a way to, if it's important enough, you need to connect to the Y, why you're doing this. If the Y is not important enough for you, you will not, the mechanism, the routine that you need to put in, to focus your energy.

I like that. I definitely, I agree. I mean, your Y isn't big enough. It's not going to drive your how. I've heard that everywhere. And I couldn't agree more.

now menish is there anything else that you would like to share with us before i let you go no i'm fine i think we had a very interesting session great yeah this is beautiful in the pleasure thank you no i'm just going to definitely air it how it's been it's been playing out so this is this is great well minish once i get this corrected and ensure there's no gaps and we Fix all that mumble jumble, jumble that happened in the middle. I will get this published and I will send a copy over your way through email. Thank you. It's much appreciated.

I hope, well, I hope it turns out well with all the interruptions, but I'm sure you'll do a great job with it. Oh, I will. I'm a magician. I can just make it happen. All righty. Thank you for your time. And we'll be in touch. Do and stay in touch.

I'd send you at a LinkedIn invite by the way. Beautiful. All right. You take care. You've been listening to your transformation station, your voice on the hard truths of leadership. We hope you've enjoyed the show. We hope you've gotten some useful and practical information.

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