Your World Tonight - Liberals prepare for budget, Quebec municipal elections, Fighting fungal disease in bats, and more

Episode Date: November 2, 2025

Prime Minister Mark Carney is back from Asia - and facing a delicate political test at home. His government's first budget lands on Tuesday, setting the stage for a crucial confidence vote. He’ll ne...ed opposition support to pass it and right now - it's not clear where that will come from. Also: Voters cast their ballots across Quebec today for municipal elections. In Montreal, there are more than 420 candidates running for dozens of positions - including the mayor. We'll look at the issues that dominated the campaigns.And: White-nose syndrome has devastated bat populations in caves across eastern Canada. Now, as the fungal disease threatens to spread west to British Columbia, one scientist is fighting back with a unique tool: a probiotic cocktail. Plus: Yukon election, Getting aid to Jamaica and Haiti, Day of the Dead celebrations in Mexico, and more.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 This ascent isn't for everyone. You need grit to climb this high this often. You've got to be an underdog that always over-delivers. You've got to be 6,500 hospital staff, 1,000 doctors, all doing so much with so little. You've got to be Scarborough. Defined by our uphill battle and always striving towards new heights. And you can help us keep climbing.
Starting point is 00:00:27 Donate at lovescarbro.cairbo. This is a CBC podcast. Canada is entering a new era. This is our moment to define our next century. Mark Carney is preparing for his biggest test so far as Prime Minister as his government puts the final touches on Tuesday's budget. This is your world tonight. I'm Kimberly Gale.
Starting point is 00:00:57 Also on the podcast, Trump, tariff agenda is set to face a major legal hurdle in the U.S. Supreme Court this week, arguments from businesses and states say Trump's use of a national security statute is illegal. And... So far, it does look like the probiotic bacteria that we're using is keeping the fungus that causes the disease. It's keeping it at bay. A Canadian scientist using a blend of bacteria to save our dying bat population. Donald Trump's Treasury Secretary is hinting the U.S. President may back down from his latest threat to boost tariffs on Canadian exports.
Starting point is 00:01:43 This comes as those same Trump tariffs face their biggest legal challenge yet. A case before the U.S. Supreme Court. Mike Crawley reports from Washington. The U.S. President boards Air Force One after spending the weekend at his Mar-a-Lago resort. It's now been more than a week since Donald Trump said he was increasing what he called the tariff on Canada by 10%. Yet the Trump administration hasn't specified which tariff he was talking about, hasn't given Canada formal notice of any change, and when a reporter asked Trump when the tariff would take effect? I don't know when it's going to kick in. We'll see, but I don't really want to discuss it. Trump's Treasury Secretary, Scott Bessent, was pushed to discuss it on Sunday in an interview with CNN's Jake.
Starting point is 00:02:28 Topper. Let's talk about Canada for one second. When can we expect that 10% tariff to be taken down? He hasn't put on a 10% tariff. He threatened to put on a 10% tariff. So he didn't actually do it. It hasn't been put on yet. Besson pivoted to criticizing the Ontario government ad that provoked Trump to call off trade talks with Canada and to announce that new hike. Nobody likes foreign governments trying to sway public opinion. So the 10% tariff has not been enacted and it might not be enacted. We'll see. anti-tariff ad used excerpts from a Ronald Reagan speech. Trump has claimed it was an attempt to
Starting point is 00:03:04 influence a looming case in the top court of the U.S. Ronald Reagan loved tariffs, and they totally changed that to say that he did, because they're catering to the Supreme Court. On Wednesday, the court will hear arguments on the legality of what Trump calls his Liberation Day tariffs on dozens of countries over longstanding U.S. trade deficits, and the tariffs he imposed on Canada, Mexico, and China over fentanyl trafficking. The stakes of this case are extremely high. Elizabeth Weidre leads the Constitutional Accountability Center, a non-profit legal group in Washington.
Starting point is 00:03:38 For the Trump administration, tariffs have been a big leveraging chip that they've used in bargaining. Weidra says the stakes are also high for the Supreme Court. They have so far, this second Trump administration, been very much acquiescent in Trump's power grabs. This will be a test of whether they actually will be the check that the Constitution envisions on the executive and whether they will put a halt to this part of the Trump agenda.
Starting point is 00:04:10 Just days after Trump said he was hitting Canada with another increase, he announced he was reducing the 20% tariff he'd imposed on goods from China over fentanyl. His stated reason, China's promise to crack down on exports of the chemicals used to manufacture the drug. Mike Crowley. CBC News, Washington. Mark Carney is back from Asia and facing a delicate political test at home. His first budget lands Tuesday, setting the stage for a crucial confidence vote. He'll need opposition support to pass it, and right now, it's not clear where that will come from. Failure to get it through could send Canadians back to the polls.
Starting point is 00:04:50 J.P. Tasker reports from Ottawa. Our budget will respond head on, head on to the challenges of our time. After a nine-day swing through Asia, Prime Minister Mark Carney is promising what he calls generational investments back at home. Tuesday's federal budget, the first in 18 months, is expected to include more money for the military, housing, and workers affected by U.S. tariffs, but also cuts to rein in spending that ballooned under Carney's predecessor. Canada is entering a new era. This is our moment to define our next century. We have the resources to transfer. our economy from one of reliance to resilience. This budget presents a politically perilous moment for the minority liberal government. If the opposition votes it down, Canadians could be headed back to the polls before Christmas.
Starting point is 00:05:42 Carney says he's ready, if it comes to that. I am 100% confident that this budget is the right budget for this country at this moment. This is not a game. I'm always prepared to stand up for the right thing. Conservative leader Pierre Pauliev has made a series of demand. in exchange for his party's support. He wants Carney to scrap the industrial carbon tax and present a much smaller deficit.
Starting point is 00:06:05 The Liberals have dismissed those requests as outlandish. Driving inflation and the cost of living even higher. That is the cost of Carney. No compromise for Mr. Carney whatsoever to make for an affordable budget and an affordable life. Leaving Pollyev with a decision to make. Do you want an election before Christmas? We want an affordable budget that will give Canadians affordable life before Christmas.
Starting point is 00:06:32 But we will not vote to raise grocery prices and increase housing costs as the liberals have done over the last decade. Canadians cannot afford any more liberal sacrifices. Meanwhile, the Black Quebecois has demands of its own, including higher pension payouts for seniors and more health care spending. Jean-Denigérant, the party's finance critic, says the separatist and people, are voting no if they don't get what they want. At the moment, the government didn't seem to be very interested in negotiating. That leaves the NDP to solve this political puzzle. The small seven-member caucus hasn't decided what it will do.
Starting point is 00:07:11 Dead said against voting for an austerity budget, they could tip the scales in favor of an election. Intram leader, Don Davies. We want to see policies in this budget that respond to the very real struggles that working people are facing right now. With 169 seats in the House of Commons, the Liberals need just three opposition votes to get the budget through and hold off a second election in less than a year.
Starting point is 00:07:34 J.P. Tasker, CBC News, Ottawa. British police say one of two men arrested over a stabbing attack on a train has been released without charge. The remaining suspect is a 32-year-old British man who is in custody on suspicion of attempted murder. Superintendent John Lovelace speaks for Britain's transport police. Counterterrorism policing, we're initially supporting our investigation.
Starting point is 00:07:59 However, at this stage, there is nothing to suggest that this is a terrorist incident. And we continue to work to establish at pace the full circumstances and the motivations that have led to this incident. The mass stabbing on a London-bound train around 80 kilometres north of the capital spread fear and panic on Saturday evening. One victim remains in a life-threatening condition. a member of train staff who police say saved lives with his heroic actions. Israel says it has received the remains of three more hostages.
Starting point is 00:08:33 They were handed over by Hamas to the Red Cross, which delivered them to the Israeli military. Hamas says the remains were found in a tunnel in southern Gaza. Israel is now working on the identification process. After today's handover, there are eight more bodies of hostages still to be recovered. Still ahead, we'll take you to Mexico City, where families are honoring lost loved ones for the Day of the Dead, a festival rooted in indigenous heritage, now influenced by Hollywood and infused with pop culture.
Starting point is 00:09:09 That's coming up on your world tonight. Shocked gas, before utter deflation. Toronto Blue Jays fans at the Rogers Center react to the final out of game seven of the World Series. Canada's team was beaten by the Los Angeles Dodgers in a nail-biter Saturday night, losing in extra innings by a score of five to four.
Starting point is 00:09:40 Jay's fans say they're disappointed, but proud of what the team accomplished. And I think it was maybe one of the best world series anybody has ever seen. It was a phenomenal, phenomenal run. And I'm so proud of those boys. I can't. I'm sorry, but I am. I'm so proud of them. It's hard to explain. Like, it hurts. Obviously, it stings. But it's like, you know, I'm still proud of this team. Last year we finished last. This year, we're just one win away. We couldn't do it, but still so proud of these guys.
Starting point is 00:10:13 They gave it their all. And what can you really do? We're that close, but there's always next year. Yes, there is always next year. Voters cast their ballots across Quebec today. in municipal elections. In Montreal, there are more than 420 candidates running for dozens of positions, including for the mayor. Sara Levitt looks at the issues that dominated the main campaigns. It's been a fiery campaign in the fight to become the new mayor of Montreal. Valerie Plante had been at the helm for the past eight years as the first woman to be elected to the job, but decided she wasn't coming back.
Starting point is 00:10:53 Her successor as head of the party, Project Montreal, was one of the main candidates. Luke Rabouin! Luke Rabouin has been a mayor of a Montreal borough since 2019 and said he wanted to build on Plont's legacy, facing him, though, a formidable opponent. It's an honor to you present the next maresse of Montreal, Soraya. Ensemble Moria's Soraya Martinez-Ferada. A former Montreal City Councilor, she was until February this.
Starting point is 00:11:23 year, a liberal member of Parliament in Ottawa and a member of Justin Trudeau's cabinet. This campaign has shown Rabouin and Martinez Ferrada see the future of Montreal differently. On the number one campaign issue, affordability of housing, Rabouin says, We need a bylaw to make sure that affordable housing, not-for-profit affordable housing, is mandatory. It's not an option. It's mandatory. Affordability is mandatory. Martinez-Ferrata, on the other hand, says private development. developers will just decide not to build if such a bylaw existed. Instead, she wants to send them the message.
Starting point is 00:11:59 If you partner with a non-profit and you offer social housing in the construction of your project, you can have free permits, you can have fiscal incentives. A more contentious issue has been bike paths. Under Plant, the city saw its cycling network grow by 35%. Rabouin wants to build even more. While Martina Ferrada says the consequences of some of the paths have meant less parking and more traffic.
Starting point is 00:12:23 She promises an audit will be done and if need be, some paths will be removed. But it's not just voting day in Montreal, but in municipalities across the province. Including in Languay on Montreal's south shore where mayoral candidate Catherine Fornier cast her vote to have a second mandate. But things haven't gone entirely smoothly leading up to this election day in Quebec. The Canada Post contract dispute means there were delays in receiving voter-immonic. information cards which ensure citizens are on the electoral list. And in Montreal, a transit strike means public transport is only running during rush hour, making it hard for some to get to polling stations. Sarah Levitt's CBC News, Montreal. About 4,000 kilometers away,
Starting point is 00:13:11 Yukoners will head to the polls on Monday to elect a new territorial government. And as Virgini On reports from Whitehorse, it will likely be a significant shakeup for the governing liberals. signs are that this will be a major transformation of government. University of Saskatchewan Professor Ken Coates describes the feeling going into this election. And that's in part because after almost a decade of being in power, not a single Liberal Cabinet Minister is running again. So you've never seen this before in Canadian politics where basically the entire government decides not to run a second time.
Starting point is 00:13:44 Liberal leader, Premier Mike Pemberton, who's been in the job for just a few months after Ranch Police stepped down, is facing off two experienced party leaders. That's NDP leader Kate White and Yukon party leader Curry Dixon. While the liberals haven't been able to assemble a full team of candidates, the other parties have. Coates says the liberals went into this knowing they have a slim chance of winning, which explains why only one MLA is seeking re-election and why the party had a hard time finding candidates. But it tells you you're seeing a government in severe decline. But that's not all.
Starting point is 00:14:18 Coates adds that Yukon politics are not like national politics. It's intensely personal. It's extremely hard job in a place that in the Yukon. Everybody went to school and everybody. They're down the street and you see them in store all the time. Local politicians face more and more daily criticism. The Yukon's population has been growing fast. And over the last few weeks, voters have been loud about what matters most,
Starting point is 00:14:42 affordability, housing and health care. I spent six months in Mexico and I get better health care there than I get here. One time, I just went there at a grocery and I buy a gas. gallon of 2% milk. I'd pay $10. Don't make promises to us that is broken. That last voter is Sheila Hager. She's a citizen of the First Nation of Natural Nightonag Dun in Mayo. A recent environmental disaster in her traditional territory
Starting point is 00:15:08 is fueling her frustration with the government. Some 300 million liters of cyanide, a solution initially spilled from the Eagle Gold Mine in 2024 into the environment. It destroyed our survival. It destroyed our moose. But surprisingly, the booming mining sector barely came up on the campaign. Even as the next government will face decisions on casino mine, the largest copper gold project ever proposed in the Yukon.
Starting point is 00:15:35 No matter who wins, this Yukon election could make history. After almost 130 years after being a territory, if the NDP or the Yukon Party takes power, Yukoners would have their first premier born right here in the territory. Virginia Ann, CBC News, Whitehorse. In Edmonton. Justice justice for Sudan! Justice, justice for Sudan!
Starting point is 00:15:58 Dozens of protesters stand on the steps of Alberta's legislature, some waving the flag of Sudan. Others hold up signs with slogans like Sudan is bleeding and save Alfasher. That city was overrun by the paramilitary rapid support forces last week. The protesters are calling for an end to the bloody civil war, which began two and a half years ago. Sam Samson was at that rally. Sam, what did people have to say about the war and what they're going through?
Starting point is 00:16:28 They told me of the absolute heartbreak, worry, and anger. So many people brought up videos of violence that they say they've seen both online and had sent from family members that are still in El Fasher. That includes Niam Bashir, who's part of the Sudanese Cultural League of Edmonton. She's from the Darfur region, and she moved to Canada when she was 14. And she says she still has family in El Fashir. I'm not doing okay. My family is not doing okay. My community is not doing okay as well. We are just pushing through to not break down. Because if we break down our own family, our siblings, our cousins, our young ones are all going to break down. So we're fighting to go through. This is just super inhumane. We don't know what to say. We don't know what to do. Her aunt, Agla Sabil, lost her sister during the conflict a few years ago.
Starting point is 00:17:21 She told us just days ago she lost more family members and friends. After the RSF seized El Fasher, she says she saw videos of their deaths. So many, many, many, my friends, my cousins, uncles. say in the videos, you know, they're shooting down, yeah. Others who I spoke with say it's just so frustrating to be here in Canada and not be able to help their friends and family still in Sudan. That includes Ahmed Abul Gassim, who's been in touch with his cousin, who is in El Fasher. It's very limited to which way you can help them.
Starting point is 00:18:04 You just try to, like, you try to send money, but also like the community. It's very hard to get money in there because there's no infrastructure is working over there. So you just give them tips how to like find out, just encourage them just be careful, find a way to get out, you know. I also heard from some very young people who I could just tell or really carrying the weight of this. And that included 15-year-old Wahad Sad al-Din,
Starting point is 00:18:34 who says it feels like the world is not paying as much attention to the war in Sudan as it is to other. conflicts. It's just us in Sudanese community. We're here today trying to find a way to support us, but this isn't like enough. Like we need something to help our people. Soon enough, Sudan's going to be wiped away
Starting point is 00:18:51 and we're not going to have a country no more. We're not going to have a place to say that we're from anymore. And I spoke with 14-year-old Aham Issa, who was born in Canada, but has visited relatives in Darfur multiple times. It's so emotional because back then it used to be a beautiful rich country and now I just see videos of everything demolished, everything I know. Do you hope to go back to Elfashir one day?
Starting point is 00:19:19 I hope to, after the war is finished. What do you hope to see when you go there? My home, all the places I went to, all my friends. So Sam, what's the latest on how the Canadian government is addressing the conflict? Late last week, immigration, refugees, and citizenship, Canada announced it would continue special measures for Sudanese people already here. So extending things like open work or study permits or allowing people to change their temporary status without paying application fees. But the program meant to bring refugees from Sudan to Canada stopped taking applications earlier this year.
Starting point is 00:19:57 And beyond that, many people I spoke with say they want the Canadian government to call out other countries like the United Arab Emirates, Egypt and Saudi Arabia, which have been accused of funding either side of the conflict in Sudan. All right, thanks for this, Sam. Thank you. Sam Sampson reporting from Edmonton. Help from Canada is on the way to Jamaica and other Caribbean islands following the devastation of Hurricane Melissa. The Category 5 storm, the strongest to ever hit the island,
Starting point is 00:20:28 is blamed for at least 28 deaths in Jamaica alone. Dozens more were killed in Haiti and Cuba. As Philip Lees-Shanock reports, members of the Caribbean community in Canada are coming together to help. In the town of Black River in hard-hit southwest Jamaica, Pamela Foster looks at what's left of her home. The roof is gone and only the wooden studs remain of the walls. Furniture and debris are strewn everywhere. I have some place to come to. My other sister, them don't have anything to go to, and them last everything.
Starting point is 00:21:01 Teams from the U.S. have joined the search for survivors after devastating Category 5 Hurricane Melissa. Government Minister Dana Morris Dixon says the death toll may rise as the Jamaican constabulary force arrive in more remote areas. We do not count the numbers until the JCF has been able to go to the site and retrieve the body and confirm it. There are more than a quarter million Canadians with connections to the island nation at the Toronto headquarters, of the Jamaican Canadian Association, volunteers gather donations. Harold Maddox says everyone in the community knows someone impacted and want to help. In Jamaica, there's a saying, every liquor make a mucker. What the meaning is that every bit adds up.
Starting point is 00:21:49 He says, as in any disaster, some fraudulent fundraisers have already popped up. There's a lot of scamming going on, and people stop at not. Even in this disaster, you will find people trying to scam and make a quick box. He says to look for credible organizations or government entities. There are some listed on the Jamaican Consul General to Toronto and Jamaican High Commission websites. The Canadian government has donated $7 million for humanitarian relief to be distributed by the Canadian Red Cross.
Starting point is 00:22:22 Churin Levera says thousands of blankets, tarpaulins and shelters are already on the way. People need food, medical assistance, water, and shelter assistance. So this is exactly what we're sending. Rahul Singh of the nonprofit disaster assistance organization Global Medic says it's sending thousands of water purification kits to Jamaica, Cuba, and Haiti. The kits are simple and low-tech, just two buckets and a heavy-duty ceramic filter. So Mum is basically able to collect the dirty water she has, pour it in the top bucket, and gravity, no electricity, gravity pulls it through.
Starting point is 00:22:56 She'll have clean drinking water for her kids, stored in the bottom bucket. But the storm also damaged many of the island's farms and killed thousands of livestock. Jamaican authorities say the country's 2.8 million people could face food shortages. Philip Ashanox, CBC News, Toronto. White-nose syndrome has devastated bat populations in caves across eastern Canada. Now, as the fungal disease threatens to spread west to British Columbia, one scientist is fighting back with a unique tool, a probiotic cocktail. The remedy, which is already gaining traction across the border,
Starting point is 00:23:48 could be the key to giving BC's bats a chance at survival. Camille Verne explains. Now we're going to hear the bat. In a shed near Mission BC, scientist Corey Lawson likely shakes a bag with a bat inside. That sound is the bat detector, which allows humans to hear the sound of echolocation, and it helps identify the bat. That is definitely a eummiotus. This particular species is only found in the West,
Starting point is 00:24:18 so we don't know yet how badly they're going to be hit by white-nose syndrome, but we do suspect they're going to be devastated. White-nose syndrome is a fungal disease that has devastated eastern bat populations. It affects their skin, wings, and nose while they hibernate and ultimately kills them. We've seen die-off rates in the eastern part of their range in North America
Starting point is 00:24:43 of well over 90%. Lawson is part of a team from the Wildlife Conservation Society looking for a remedy. We just call it a cocktail. This cocktail is a mixture of probiotic bacteria that comes naturally from bats. The scientists spray it into their habitat, and the bats spread it around as they groom themselves. I call it a Robin Hood approach, because we're literally taking from the bats that have the good bacteria
Starting point is 00:25:14 and making sure that all the bats get the good bacteria as well. It's a race against time, because the fungal disease is not yet in BC. but it's present in Alberta and Washington State. So it's not a matter of whether it will get here. It is a matter of when, and it might already be here. Since 2022, the U.S. has been testing the Canadian cocktail. Abigail Tobin is a scientist for the Washington State Department of Fish and Wildlife. She and her team of volunteers are near Darrington to capture bats.
Starting point is 00:25:49 And it's a tricky task. They're on to us, so we'll see. Hopefully we put the net in a spot where they normally like to fly out to go forage. Finally, a few bats are caught. Tobin looks at a bat with white spots at the end of its wings. Over here, it looks more suspicious of white nose damage right there. Through the swabs we collect from bats' wings, the lab that processing those is finding that there are higher levels of probiotic
Starting point is 00:26:16 and lower levels of the fungus on bats that are being treated. It's showing that the probiotics. is staying and hopefully suppressing the growth of that fungus. Once all the data is collected, they release the bat. There she goes. Preliminary results are promising, according to Corey Lawson. So far, it does look like the probiotic bacteria that we're using is keeping the fungus that causes the disease.
Starting point is 00:26:41 It's keeping it at bay. In the fall, some bat species are heading into the forest. Despite tagging, it's still not clear where they hibernate in BC. But Lawson hopes that if the disease is here, her cocktail will give the bats the protection they need to return in spring. Camille Verne, CBC News, Mission BC. In eastern Mexico, A family sings in front of the grave of a loved one as part of Day of the Dead celebrations. Festivities culminated this weekend with a parade that drew tens of thousands of people.
Starting point is 00:27:20 tourists and locals, alongside deeply personal ceremonies focused on honoring the dead. Jorge Barrera reports from Mexico City. Araseli Cruz, with broom in hand, sweeps clean the joint grave site of her parents at the San Isidro Cemetery in a northern borough of Mexico City on the final long weekend of the month-long Day of the Dead festivities. There were many dried leaves. and flowers, she says, after planting and watering fresh Mexican marigolds in flower pots,
Starting point is 00:27:58 the ceremonial flowers for the Day of the Dead that help guide souls back to their families. Who says other families bring food to share a meal with the souls of the departed, all part of this tradition? The cemetery bustled with families and their own rituals. One couple simply sat playing music on a cell phone. Day of the Dead celebrations rooted in Mexico's indigenous heritage, but practice in different ways based on region, family, personal choice, pop culture.
Starting point is 00:28:36 Like Mexico City's 8,000 strong grand parade, giant skeletons, magical beasts, dancers dressed in Aztec regalia held Saturday. It was inspired by the opening scene of a James Bond movie. same, but we think now, 50 years ago. So if you don't involve, you die, so we don't want this tradition to die. Enrique Saint-en-Vajer comes from the state of Colima along Mexico's Pacific coast. The main tradition, the main things, El Artaire de Muertons, things like that, remain the same. So the heart of this is the same.
Starting point is 00:29:17 Cruz built El-Beltar de Muertos, or shrine to the dead. in her living room with photographs of relatives and pet dogs that have passed. She says she leaves the water and food among the candles because souls arrive thirsty and hungry for the once a year visit among the living. She says she placed a bottle of beer on the altar, a favorite of her husbands who recently died. This is the first time she's left him offerings.
Starting point is 00:29:44 Cruz says her mother told her you have to give souls at least a year to journey to the other side. It's hard, but also beautiful, she says, because I know he's here with me. Jorge Berger, CBC News, Mexico City. Gee whiz, baby, please, let me take you through an island of the sweet cold breeze. On my way to Jamaica, it's going out with some supplies. Jamaican-American reggae musician Shaggy, aka Mr. Boombastic, on TikTok, showing a plane laden with bottled water and other relief supplies.
Starting point is 00:30:22 Jamaica needs you more now than ever. A community so integral to Jamaican culture, mobilizing after Hurricane Melissa. Musicians from the Caribbean Island, raising money, donating relief supplies, and sending messages of support in the wake of the disaster. When you talk about destruction and devastation,
Starting point is 00:30:43 you know, it looks like a bomb hit out there. Jamaican dance hall singer and rapper Sean Paul speaking to CNN from his hometown of Kingston, urging anyone who's ever visited to help with the recovery. Everyone who has ever had a great time in Jamaica, give $10, give $1, anything that you can. As officials caution the slow process of getting life back to normal, the Bob Marley Museum in Kingston, posting on Instagram,
Starting point is 00:31:12 The Winds may have shaken us, but they could never break our spirit. to one of the late Reggae Pioneer's most famous songs about resilience. We'll leave you at that tonight, on Your World Tonight. I'm Kimberly Gale. Thanks for listening. For more CBC podcasts, go to CBC.A.

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