You're Never The Only One - Bare-Faced-Fear + Shit With Money? You're Never The Only One

Episode Date: December 11, 2024

Episode 4 of You’re Never The Only One is the most emotional one yet. Inspired by Pamela Anderson and Drew Barrymore, we decided to do this one make-up free. For Cat, it was a bit uncomfortable but for Emma it was borderline traumatic. This episode dives into her feelings behind the dread of being seen without her make-up and yes…there are tears.   Cat talks money this week and discusses the impact of ADHD, your childhood, your marriage and your priorities when it comes to whether you are good or not with money.   They also discuss ‘munting’ which is probably the most traumatic part of it all.   If you want to get in touch to discuss anything on this episode or something we discussed on another episode, or if you just want to suggest a topic then you can email us at ⁠[e-mail]⁠ or leave a voicenote/message on 07457 402704.   If you are enjoying You’re Never The Only One and you want to support us, then please: Leave a 5* review wherever you listen to your podcasts. Hit subscribe or follow Follow us on our socials below   The Socials ⁠Cat on Instagram⁠ ⁠Emma on Instagram⁠ ⁠YNTOO on Instagram⁠   ⁠Cat on TikTok⁠ ⁠Emma on Tiktok⁠ ⁠YNTOO on TikTok⁠

Here she is. You're doing all right? Yeah, yeah. Can I see the... Do you want to? Or do you want to just... Have you not looked at it? Have you looked at it?

I've looked at it, but then I'm not... Struggle it. I'm not... No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm just... Whether I've done it or not makes no difference and whether you should do it. Will you look?

Oh, look, yeah. Do you want to close your... I mean, I'm not going to say anything other than... I'm not going to go, you look like a minger. Yeah. Because you actually don't. Okay. Do you want to look?

No, I'm not going to look. She's not going to look. How are your lips? Are they still sore? All I can hear in my head is, Ring of fire. The ring of fire. Well, at least those lips and not your bum this week.

Last week it was your butt. Everybody was. You're never the only one. You're never the only one. Don't live inside your strain. By the way, there's a, we'd share a lot. Overshare, you mean? No worries, I'm Latino.

Brilliant. We need a bit of Latino in the room. Definitely. Actually, these are all signs for me, because I always feel comfortable around, like, Latino people because of growing up in the Canaries. And also right opposite the studio is, do you see the cafe?

Well, the name of the cafe was. It's called Mollies. See, this is your higher power universe. guiding you along. I know. Should we go, going? Let's fucking do it. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening,

whatever time there is, you are finding yourselves with our dulcet tones in your loggoles, hello, and welcome to, are you ready, Kat? I'm ready. Episode four. What?

I know, of you are never the only one today. I'm joined, as you may have just heard, by the Linguistic Powerhouse, who's done so much soul-searching over the last few years, which sadly resulted in the confirmation of what we already knew she doesn't have one, the lovely cat sims.

Do you like that? Do you like that? I was nervous about writing this. No, I read that this morning because I was printing it off and I saw that and I said to Jimmy, I went, she's been savage this morning. I pulled back.

She's not wrong. So fair enough, listen, thank you, Emma and as always, it's a pleasure to be sitting next to you even though your outfit suggests that we're hosting a children's TV show rather than a podcast of emotional resonance. But I'm not actually going to roast you too hard this week Because deeply, and I know I've got a smirk on my face

Not meant to be, it's like a nervous laughter, it's an ADHD thing I know it's been a really tricky one for you But we're here And you look wonderful and we're going to move on Okay We're going to talk about, obviously, more in detail But I am so, I'm going to say it now I'm so fucking proud

that you're sat here doing this In my head down, I need to, I'll get better, I'll get better I'm not looked in the monitor and I think that was the best, that was the best option, call him talk. Right, anyway, let's we start off with a quick roundup. I went looking for an alternative to Vizzy Nickers the other day and fucking how, where that took me. Don't ever look up munting.

Don't ever look up munting unless you're into kind of some kind of weird necrophilia thing. I'm literally doing it right now. Oh my God, the Urban Dictionary of Munting. Roddy's laughing as if he knows what Munting is. Are you watching it? Are you reading it? Why don't you read it out for all of our friends at home? Okay, just so, I mean, I feel like this definitely needs to come with a trigger warning. Munting.

A variation of necrophilia involving two live people and one dead. Two girls, one cup. Two live, one day. Male or female, apparently. To Munt. Find and dig up a semi-composed corpse. This is not okay. I know.

Isn't it mad? Read it. I don't know. I want to. One person then goes, Oh! One person then goes down. I'm going to say it quickly.

I'm going to rip it off like a band-aid. One person then goes down on said corpse, while the other jumps on the dead person's stomach causing the juices, the decomposed organs to be forced from all orifices. These are then drank by the person orally connected to the corpse. And just in case you weren't sure how you might use it in a sentence. Yeah.

Hey, Mary, let's go munting. They buried your sister two weeks ago. She'll be ripe. Fucking hell. Oh, do you don't look it up. It no need now. Who kind of did that act to then come up with a word for it and thought, you know, it would be right to put it on?

There's a lot to unpack there, and we don't, unfortunately, we don't have the time. Anyway, the reason I was looking up Fizzy Knickers and why I came across Munting was because I started watching the rivals on your recommendation. I have questions. Firstly, why? Why do you think it's so great? Secondly, the casting. So disappointing.

Specifically, Rupert Campbell, Black, Smyth Fortescue, Smyther's the third, whatever his name is, the one the ex jockey. Yeah. He's supposed to be the man. Right from the get-go, you get the kind of mile-high scene. Yes. And it's like, oh, yeah, who's this? You know, this is going to be.

Great bottom. Great, and great cock, apparently. I'm wondering if that's why he was cast. Have you not seen the cock yet? The tennis scene. Yes. Yes, right, that's the first episode. Maybe I've played it up too much for you.

Maybe, and I know I'm not alone because a couple of friends are like, oh, I got a bit bored in the first episode. But, yeah, it's his real cock in it. I mean, that's worth watching. No, he's prosthetics, exactly. Do you think he's fit? I think he's very Rupert Campbell Black. Okay, right.

Because I looked at, yeah, I think he's very Rupert Campbell Black. Yeah. Because I looked at your other options. You put some other suggestions in, didn't you? I put some other suggestion. Jamie Dornan. Too young. Do you know Richard Madden from the bodyguard? I don't find, he need, no.

Really? No. I thought he could have been James Bond. Richard Madden just looks like a sixth former. I like that. That's another podcast. Theo James, Theo James, the guy that's in Guy Ritchie, He's the gentleman.

Yeah, again, there's a type here. Yeah. There's a type here. It's called my type. And finally, actually. Klaus Bang. I mean, the name. Do you know what?

More Rupert Campbell Black, but... Oh my God, he is so sexy. That is a walking wet dream. So I think a recast is needed. And no shade on, what's his name? The guy that plays, what's his name? Oh, Alex Hassel. Alex Hassel.

I'm sure you're a lot of people's cup of tea. Just not mine. That's all right. I just want to see all of those other people naked. Keep going. I'll keep watching it because I don't like. I've not got anything else to do. I'm not a quitter.

I'm not a quitter. And also Johnny likes it. And in terms of what I've been up to, obviously, we've had half term as well. I don't know about you, Emma, but I'm not sure. And I'm going to be honest, for those of you've listened to the podcast for a while, if you're here for season one when it was just me and my own, I'm reusing material here. Sometimes you have to recycle material. Okay.

But when you were a kid, did you have this expectation that at any given moment, in any scenario, you could say to your mum, I'm thirsty and she would reveal a bottle of water for you? Absolutely not. No, I don't think I ever, in the history of my childhood, drank water outside of the house. I act like they're beached whales. I don't know what's going on. Yeah, like they're literally dehydrated in front of our eyes,

like shriveling up like a sort of a witch court at dawn. But here's my thing. Right. I think that they need to be, if they're that thirsty, if they need to have access to water at all times, they need to carry their own water bottle. I am sick to death because of course I have to carry two water bottles because they're not going to share a water bottle.

So my backpack is weighed down with two water bottles. I think occasionally about putting a water bottle in for myself, but I think I can't carry it. No. I can't carry it. So I shall lay myself at the altar of my children's needs. And if they turn out and if they come out at the house and they don't have water and they whinge and complain,

I'm not buying water. You're not buying it? I'm not buying it. Because they didn't carry it. Because they didn't carry it. They didn't organise themselves. I'm sick to death of being a fucking maternal camel. I'm not doing it.

I'm not doing it anymore. Do you know what I found was quite a good. solution for this is getting the water bottles that have the straps. Don't give a shit. Don't give a shit. They can drink it. They can carry it in a fucking bucket they take to the beach. I don't care. Carrying wherever they're like, but they're carrying it. I'm done. I can't wait to see you shriveled up little kids next time.

I'm done. I know. Dying. Help me. I'm melting. Let's move on to You're never the only one our topics. Let's get under the hood and jumpstart this conversation, get the engine of this podcast purring like a well stroke. I read that. You see? It made me feel sick. I didn't say busy knickers.

No. Also, I feel like you talked over my, like, line there, so I need to, like, do it again. Start again. Do it again. Do it again, but do it better. Can you do it also in the M&S voice? Can I do it in your sex TV voice? Can you? Because I don't think I can do that today. I'll try.

Okay, so it's time for us to get under the hood and jumpstart this conversation. We need to get the engine of this podcast, purring like a well-stroked pussy. I know this is going to be big. and messy and probably a bit emotional because behind the scenes there's been some big feelings and some big discussions this week

so we're going to start with you over to you darling all right okay see the issue I haven't got right now is in this kind of like I'm all right here and I'm all right with you and I'm all right

kind of speaking into the microphone and in this room you haven't looked at me as much I have to say yeah and I haven't looked at the camera that's what I'm really aware of so we'll get there we'll get there Okay, so basically this all starts with Pam Miranda Anderson, actress, model, animal activist, 90s icon.

I'd say icon for a reason. She made the headlines when she decided to ditch her signature look and attend Paris Fashion Week without makeup. Let's try that again. Paris Fashion Week. I remember seeing the story at the time earlier in the year and I remember just, I've always had a bit of an obsession of, and I think a lot of us do women, like seeing like celebrities without makeup. on it's nothing new seeing septicel makeup on but it's normally done in a and certainly growing up it's done in quite a derogatory way yeah the narrative has changed definitely but there was there was something about this one that

that hit different and I think you felt the same as well didn't you and I kind of unpicked it a little bit after she went live on she went on Drew Barrymore's show sorry and it blew up again on social media because Drew Barrymore also took her makeup off live on the air and I first of all I want to say you know I watched the whole interview again last night. And I looked and I thought, you know, we've got to take into consideration people that are in the public eye or celebrities who've got access to, you know, bank accounts that can help with like treatments and tweakments and great facials and all that and have that, you know, that lifestyle, that beauty lifestyle as well. And I think some people also

have great genes. I think Drew Barrymore, she does not look even close to 50, does she? She's got a baby face, right? And I think, you know, Pam Anderson as well, I think she's, the way she's, the way she's, you know, the lifestyle she's had, her skin should not be that good. You know, she looks great. I don't know. Maybe they have had stuff done. Maybe they've had some profilo and, you know, kind of salmon spunk, you know, shoved under their eyes and stuff like that. Apparently trout spunk's the way forward. Is it? Yeah. The trout over the salmon. Apparently. I wonder why that is. I don't know. It was on Majorcy the other day, so it must be true. And she's, I can't, I looked at our problem. Actually, how old is she? And she is, she's nearing on

60, Pam. Nearing on 60. I'm surprised I thought she would be 60 already. She's not. No, no, no, she's not. And I think the reason it hit me so hard and the feedback that I got off my Instagram account when I said this seemed to be confirming it is that she was so iconic in my youth and probably actually some of my most impressionable years, like my teenage years,

and her appearance kind of contributed towards these, what felt kind of like impossibly high beauty standards for women at the time. You know, it was, it was, it didn't matter that it was fake. It was just, for me, it was kind of like she was a sex symbol. She was no different from Marilyn Monroe for previous generations. She was lusted after she was desired.

And who doesn't want to be desired? And I feel like that is a huge part of this, do you know what I mean? And particularly for me. So it's like a social conditioning. Yeah, it is. And it hit me, I think, harder. And the reason why I struggle to leave my house. It's all right.

I've spoken to you about this. cat. I've got a lot of, like, it's shame, it's embarrassment, it's fucking ridiculous, but it's my story and I'm, so I'm going to explain it and hopefully, you know, it will make sense because I say that it's not, you know, you're never the only one that just feels ugly without their makeup on, you know, and I don't want to and I'm really envious of people that don't, but I do, and that's just how it is, you know, and I spent, um, sorry, Roderie, sorry, sorry, already. I just spent the 90s feeling

quite invisible and without going to too much detail and I know we spoke a little bit about it in the past. My boarding school education started at quite a young age. I was eight and I was younger than anyone else that was already at the school in my year and nobody started that was my actual own age until

I hit 11. So I kind of became part of the furniture at the school. I struggled to find my place within friendship groups. I was really, I was, you know, I was really lonely and I just didn't feel very seen. And just all I saw was the pretty girls were kind of the popular ones. And I didn't feel pretty.

And I still, you know, I still don't feel pretty. I don't, I didn't feel, I didn't feel special in any way. And I don't know whether that was, because I didn't feel particularly wanted by the fact that I was at boarding school and my family were in a different country. I've never really unpicked it as much as I have had to this week so it's been a bit of an unraveling Also you know I just didn't I didn't feel particularly wanted at the school

I didn't feel like I was needed there I was just like I said part of the furniture wasn't wanted by any friendship groups And then one birthday And I remember it so clearly I got one of those Do you remember Argos used to do those shitty little makeup boxes

That had a bit of everything in them So you'd open up plastic things thing, they'd have these slide-out bits with like, but compartments that would have like the most garish colours of green and blue eyeshadows and they could probably a silvery white one in the shape of a butterfly and then you'd have like a black eyeliner, like a little red blusher.

Yeah, red blusher. And then you'd have like a little tiny mascara, shitty mascara. One colour of foundation. I mean, God forbid, you know what I mean? There were any different skin tones. And then like the same for the face powder. And I literally, I got it and I put a whole lot. I think I put everything.

that was in there on my face. And I went, I'd got to the age where I could go into, you know, into the local village. So I'd gone down there and it was just like night and day, you know, I just suddenly I wasn't invisible anymore. And I was getting attention and people were looking at me and, you know, now as an adult I look and I think, it's probably, you know, people were looking because you're like a young teenage girl

with a full face of like drag queen level makeup on, you know. But at the time, yeah, I was getting attention and I was getting attention from the opposite sex and from boys and what teenage girl doesn't want that you know so that gave me this confidence and this kind of power that I had over these boys as well like which I'd never felt before and then as I continued into my late teens I'd carry on and I caked on the makeup like and it was like the school I went to the ball and school I went to was a theatre school so we learned how to do stage makeup so that is what I would wear I would wear full on pan stick you know like thick like pan stick

I looked like I was going on stage and I wouldn't let anybody see me without it because I was insignificant without it that's how I felt you know I just I didn't feel valid without it and even good friends and I just couldn't look people in the face

you know without any makeup on I just felt like they would see you know what I felt and they I just didn't think I would be good enough and they just wouldn't I don't know it's ridiculous it's not ridiculous I like this confident version of myself and so I wanted to stay that's not ridiculous that's really common and I suppose did you ever think of it as because when you speak about it I feel very similar feelings to how I used to use

alcohol right okay you know like interesting um you talk about how you were awkward in the room or you felt invisible and you didn't have the confidence and you weren't seen when I obviously because I don't drink anymore but when I did drink I drank because it gave me the that confidence I could talk to boys I could be funny I could be in the room I could turn up and so that was why a huge probably the main reason as to why I started drinking that feeling of just complete not having any agency not like disappearing yeah but when I drank I didn't I didn't have I didn't have that anymore I had the confidence I could go and I was and I was that person and I could and then I sort of slipped into this chameleon thing

which lots of addicts in recovery will resonate with, which is like I sort of lost myself a little bit and didn't know who I really was. So I would walk into a room and my biggest fear was being rejected, probably boarding school as well. And so I would bend myself into what I knew they wanted me to be. So like, I mean, I'd lie.

I'd say like I'd listen to an album that they were talking about when I hadn't, you know, just because that fear of rejection or that fear of being caught out, or not included was just so severe and my inability to be myself, the confidence to be myself meant that I drank and drank and drank.

And I couldn't ever imagine going out without drinking. I never went out without drinking. You know, in that sense, it's a really similar... It's a mask. It's a mask. Definitely. Yeah. And it got, the thing is that because I was wearing so much

started getting really bad skin. So then it became impossible to, you know, to not, wear it really and I'm not I'm daily panstick will do that yeah exactly my skin couldn't breathe and I remember you know my my sisters and everybody you know my older sister would be like what you're doing you got so much on it's going to be awful for your skin I didn't care I didn't care I mean I used to go I've got my makeup bag by the side of this little kind of hair in case she needs to like emergency panstick she doesn't my um what do you call it when you take an animal on a plane it's

You're blankie. It's like, yeah, but you know when you have like, your emotional. Yes, your emotional support. It's my emotional support. Makeup bag. It's there by the side of the, by the side of the chair. And that used to be me. So if I was seeing a guy and I was saying it his, it didn't, you know, we were sleeping together.

And it didn't matter how drunk I got, even if it was a one night stand, I didn't have that many of those. But if I had, I, I would. If you were to have one. Yeah. When I was going out, I would always have my makeup bag with me. It was, you know, I couldn't do a clutch. I always had a make.

makeup bag, full makeup bag, and no matter how drunk I was, I would leave it by the side of the bed, strategically open with concealer, a mirror. Those were the main things. It was my skin, massively, it was my skin at that time, you know. So that when he woke up, so you would always make sure. And my body clock, and I'm not a morning person. I am heavy sleeper in the morning, you know, it takes a lot. But my body, the fear clock would wake me up and just be like, and then I would bend over, look in the mirror, like, readjust and kind of like, you know, reapply and make, you know, put the moss straight, put it all back on. because I just thought they would, I just thought they saw me, is it really? Yeah.

I mean, I just felt like they would, they would not want to be with me. They wouldn't, there's nothing beautiful about me. They were there because of how I looked and the rest was an added bonus. You know what I mean? And it's really difficult because it's, it's, there is obviously like a disconnect between what you see and what everybody else sees. And, you know, when you came in downstairs and I was like, you look amazing, you were like, don't pity me.

And, and I get it. I get it because it is impossible for you to see. that because it's not about facts it's about a story that we've built in our heads that we're not good enough or that we're not acceptable as we are like but it's really it really breaks my heart it's like i say it's it's embarrassing because there are people you know who are you know i look at people like katie piper and what what she's been through and i knew katie she used to work with me as a presenter when i knew her before and just you know that's that's such an inspiring story and I want to be able to you know we did discuss and you put it out on

on insta about the raising money and I you know that put a lot of pressure on and I thought I've got to do it and then obviously we haven't reached the target and but I was just like you know what I know this is coming from a good place and I know you know it's got it's got to be done but I still feel I feel like a bit of a fake around it because I've you know I've had my eyebrows died I've had my lashes lifted and tinted I've put something on my lips to try and make them go a bit redder and plumber You know it's not

I mean this woman has undergone some serious pain Like the lip gloss that she put on herself But you know what like I mean Like people have filler People have Botox I've come a long way And I have to say a big part of this is Johnny Because for the first time Johnny my husband and Johnny

Johnny's made me love myself past all that because he's really made me you know he just are you without your makeup on around johnny yeah it took it took it took a while and there was a time where he took my panstick and i literally had a full-blown panic attack and he was like this is fucked this is fucked and and but he's always been from the get-go he's never been about sexy lingeries and it's just like he's all about the pure rawness and you know he we met at work and i was you know you know it in a relationship at the time where I would come in and I was in a mess and he's he's a he's a he's a you know he wants to save he's a fixer and he wants to save people and and you know he was he was a bit

of a night in shining armour and he's really really helped me and I do I look in the mirror and what I like what I see rarely more rarely now since I've since I'm aging but I've got a health I've got a healthy confidence about and a love for myself through my friends through my partner do you know what I mean, that I didn't have before, and that's come with age, definitely, and experience. But the makeup is, you know, as I said at the beginning, it's become a part of who I am. There's also an element I love applying it.

I love, it's quite mindful. It's quite therapeutic. And, you know, and I think everyone would agree, if you look good, you feel good. And I want to feel good. And I did actually put it out. Just before, just while you search for some stuff. Yeah.

Do you, obviously, you know, we've, it's been a big week, tricky and I definitely underestimated the effect that going make up free would have on you like I knew you were reluctant but like I didn't realize quite how deep rooted the anxiety was yeah I didn't advocate for myself enough though did I and I just because I didn't want to cause a fuss and I didn't want and also because I'm so embarrassed about it you know it's just like ridiculous me going you know we're doing a new podcast and and you going to me going to go make up free it's really it's great it'll be great for the podcast as well and me just

going no I'm not doing that I felt like you know I was the problem here in that sense I have to own my part in it because I didn't under I did underestimate it and it didn't occur to me and I should have given you more space to stand up and go I'm not doing it having said that I'm really proud that you have done it and my question is I guess I suppose my question is, would you want to be at a point where you feel super comfortable and confident being makeup free? Or are you just resigned to the fact that that's never going to be the case? And if you do, like, has this in any, I know it's been super traumatic, but has it in any way been a little bit freeing? Or has there been any positives to it?

I guess I'll see you afterwards I feel like it's can you pass my lip balm please I'm drawing up I need to try that spicy one I think it's what's really struck me is the similarity between how I used alcohol and how you use makeup and the difference obviously is that

being an alcoholic is destructive in a very massive way around to people around me so I'm not suggesting that it's the same sort of thing but what I'm saying is we use it for the same reasons and I think it's been from my point of view is somebody who's given up booze and had and lived like learned to go out without drinking and learned to live without it's been the most freeing thing I've ever done and I wonder if there might be a parallel there that like if you if this was the first step in maybe I'm not saying never wear makeup again but maybe this was the first step in not having to you might find that there comes with

that quite a lot of freedom yeah I don't feel very free I feel no I don't feel confident no I can imagine I'm really kind of lots of there's lots of things I've had to do to like so not looking in the mirror kind of, you know, and making sure I just fake it till you make it, do you know what I mean? That's all in my head today, I'm just like, you know, if I don't look in the mirror and I don't see what I look like. But the end of that is that you make it. Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm saying, let's see, let's see, definitely.

Because I'd love to see you step into that because I know that you think I'm pitying you, but you are an incredibly beautiful woman. She's got teeth like, I mean, she's got teeth like she went to Turkey. We've talked about this before and they're not Turkish teeth. They're getting yellow now. They're getting old and yellow.

Okay. Do you know what we're going to do? We're going to start this thing where every time you say something negative about yourself you're going to do a handstand. God, fucking out. That's going to make me feel even older. I did that with Kira.

Yeah. And her mum adopted it. Do you know what my mind straight away went then? If I do that, then I'll probably get a bit more colour in my cheeks so I'll look better. That was the first reaction. You want colour in your cheeks? I can punch her in the face.

Give me a smack. Give me slack. I should have done more of this before we came on. All right, so I did a bit of research. I asked my followers, ladies, how often do you wear makeup? What do you say? What do you think?

How many people... Well, I voted twice on this. Oh, did you? Well, because I voted from you're never the only one and then I voted from not so smugnail. Did you say the same thing? Yeah. Okay.

What did you say? Every time you leave the house, just for work, just for day, night or special occasions, or never. Well, I put just for work because a lot... Whenever I leave the house, basically only leave the house if I'm working. Because otherwise I'd just like to be at home. And really not even just for... because sometimes I go makeup free,

but for me, it's really a, it's probably become more of a thing as I've got older. I probably wear makeup more. Yeah. And I'm on camera more. Yeah. But really, I'd say just for work. Just for work.

Or special occasions, like a combo. Were you in the minority there? Because that was only 17%. So the majority of people wear it every time they leave the house. Okay. What was the result? What was the percentage? Well, I mean, I might have played that to my advantage there.

That was actually only 41%. But. But. Wow. We love a bit of skewing the results. Yeah, 36% said just for a day or night out or special occasions. So I feel like it's basically. So it's about the same.

He's about the same, yeah. Then I asked, why do you wear makeup? The biggest result was, 54% a confidence boost. After that, 29% to hide blemishes, other facial features. Only 8% of people said it was to hide signs of ageing. Did anybody, did you, I'd like to have seen what they would have said if you said, because they felt they should, they had to. I did ask about social if people felt it. It was really low. Nobody felt like it was because of social pressure. Yeah, because of social pressure. That's good to know. Really low. Yeah, I thought that. That's why I didn't include it in this. But anyway, do you think makeup impacts on how others perceive you. I found this question interesting because that's a really loaded question. Because that's about, because that isn't actually about others. That's about you.

Yeah, it is. But equally, I do, I do, I have. I've felt, and I've had some messages from people that have had the same thing. Because they choose, you know, and what's something you asked me last week? Do I wear makeup when I exercise? I do. And I'm a small percentage of people that do. 27% of people said they do as well. The other 73 said they didn't.

But I'm the kind of person that would wear full face makeup. Full face makeup to go to Barry's boot camp. To go to Barry's boot camp. Lucky Barry. Yesterday I was a boot camp and I was going to it. And my PT was like, why don't you want to wear makeup? I'm like, because I love. look awful kieran i don't i that's why i'm not wearing makers i look awful so he doesn't know any

different but i've mastered it i think to look like i'm not wearing loads but i for me i know that's taken me a good half an hour to put on i also you know the negative impacts of what people think when you put a full face of makeup on and they think oh you're full of yourself look at you all dolled up and they and i don't think a lot of people realize the people that are wearing that much is because so they said that to you i just i've yeah it's a vibe it's a vibe it's a It's a feeling. And also girls. So it's not a fact.

As a feeling. Oh, here we go. Here we go. Sorry, I'm getting a bit therapy. Just saying. Okay. Yeah, I get where you're coming from. Girls, I think, as well, friendships, as you got older, as I've got older, I found that.

Girls can be quite bitchy. And I think if you've, if you look nice, maybe there's, and I've always had to fight with that, people feeling maybe intimidated because of how I look. And I'm like, I don't look like this. Yeah. So I'm like, I want to be friends. But you're, you know, you're intimidated by the person I'm not. So there's always there for a disconnect between the person you're presenting and the person you actually are.

Yeah. That must be really hard. Yeah. Like kind of. But as I'm wearing, but now as I'm wearing less, less so. So that's a positive thing. I'm definitely wearing less. Do you think makeup impacts on how others perceive you back to that?

Yes, in a positive way, 49% of people said that. They think that people have. That's 50% of people who think that people like that. them more if they're wearing makeup. Yeah. And the other, pretty much the other 50% said, I don't think it makes much of a difference.

I said I don't think it makes much of a different. Because I think for me, I've never really given that much thought. Right. My weight, on the other hand, I would think far more about that than my face. Do you think that people would perceive you differently? If I was thinner, 100%.

I don't know. I think that, you know, we talk about, in recovery a lot about self-centered fear. And I remember my friend saying to me, you're pretty self-centered. And I remember thinking, how fucking dare you? Like, I've never thought of myself, thought a lot of myself internally. Yeah.

And she's like, yeah, but she says, you don't think a lot of yourself, but you think of yourself a lot. And it was really interesting because it made it clear to me that that self-centeredness didn't have to be, I'm the best, I'm the bomb, I'm the, because it's always associated a little bit with arrogance and uncaring and selfishness. And actually, I spent so much time thinking about myself,

in relation to what other people were thinking of me. Actually, they probably couldn't have given less of a shit. I don't believe that. That really annoys me. Nobody's looking. Nobody cares. I look. So therefore, do you know what I mean?

I would be like, but do you judge? Yeah. Do you? Yeah, because I'd be like, why don't you make yourself more presentable? So that's, but that's a you problem, isn't it?

Yeah, then probably. Yeah. Massively, but then of course then I'm, you know, you could look even better like that or you could look even better like that. But what if they feel, totally comfortable. Yeah, yeah, I know, which I'm also jealous of.

Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot to unpack there, isn't there? I think maybe you should go to, like, Makeups Anonymous. I was thinking that. Do you know what I said to Johnny? I said, the more and more I hear about recovery, the better it sounds, I just need to get an alcohol problem. Okay, any other, did you get any voice notes?

I think there was a couple of WhatsApp that I can read out. We had, this was an interesting one from Steph. Thanks for this, Steph. I appreciate this. Hi, I'm it, Steph. I hope you're good. So, makeup. In society, if I don't wear makeup, everyone asks if I'm okay.

Like, if you don't wear makeup, you must be ill. Like, women have to put this front on to be a functioning member of society. Men don't. They just get up and go. This is years of conditioning from the patriarchy that was built to keep men superior and women below. Women have been taught to be pretty for the history of our civilization. Be quiet and look pretty. Once we finally got the privilege,

to be allowed to work and earn our own money. So what better way than to make us feel like we had to look a certain way to be successful? And better yet, the men make the money off it, makeup being a huge part of that system. And now it's so entwined in our daily lives, it's normal. It's not normal to wear makeup. So that's my two pence.

I don't want to be that woman that bangs on about the patriarchy all the time, but like it's the fucking patriarchy. It's like there is this expectation. It's always a way of controlling women, some way, shape or form, whether it's how you should look, what you should put on your face, where you should work, how much you should earn, how seriously your health problems are taken, it's all there.

I mean, yeah, what I said, didn't I, when I said about kind of feeling desired. You're not, yeah, you're not doing this for you. That's the thing that I think maybe, if you were to ask for my unsolicited opinion, which you haven't, but I'm going to say anyway, because this is a podcast, kind of the point. you have sort of said that you would love to have the confidence to not have to wear the makeup and you don't feel free I'd like to be beautiful enough to not wear the makeup that's what it is

I think that you are sort of maybe working under the illusion that you do this for you when actually it's about making other people feel comfortable I think it's a mate so Kat is going to go first one bit to the camera there she is Kat is going to go oh yeah on the red carpet it tonight completely make-up free. I am.

That's, that's, I mean, listen, I, because you go makeup free on your Insta, you go out in public like that, like I've, I go out in public with my actual face, I do. Like, with this. I hate myself. I'm so sorry. I know. Can you believe it? I take this face out in public without any makeup. Sometimes I don't even wash it. It's not, uh, that's worse. Sometimes I pick the i bogeys out with the walk along. No, no. I'm sorry, I didn't mean it like that. Oh, I sound so awful.

No, it's fine. But it's, I don't take offence in any way, shape or form. I love you. And I know that this is not about anything other than something that you have a very, almost trauma response to. So there's nothing you can say it's going to offend me. I mean, if you called me a fat bitch, probably climb over there. I'm wearing my spanks. You know, you had your veins done?

I did, yeah. How did you feel about your veins? Yeah, I hated them. Do you know, funny enough, I was thinking about this this morning, like an equivalent, and I definitely hid my legs because of the veins. Yeah. And I'd still say I'm quite self-conscious about them.

I fake tan, that hides it a lot. I use a bit of Sally Hansen airbrush. Yeah, brilliant. By the way, the best product ever invented. Incredible. just old it's like the OG oh yeah yeah yeah it's like the pretty poly of skin it's incredible it's unbelievable although I did I did learn the hard way that it doesn't stay on like fake town when you're getting a pool oh no it goes patchy but it doesn't come off properly either no it's the soap and water takes it off oh

oh well centre parks I mean there's the chemicals in that pool and all the wee they strip you sorry it strip everything that's layer of skin that's the chemical peel you want yeah just put your face in the rapids at centre parks you'll be fun Listen, there's a lot that's fucking wrong with me. I have a lot of trauma. I have a lot of stuff that I can't do that. I can be a real cunt. But when it comes to my body and physical appearance,

there are certain things I don't like, but not in a way that would stop me from doing anything. Right, okay. So like my legs I wouldn't love, but if I was on holiday, I wouldn't hide them. Yeah. Like I'd be in a bikini. Yeah.

I would feel conscious of them. And I still do. Yeah. But. I mean, I hid, you know, Johnny went out and I forgot I got myself locked out. once. I did hear this story. And I hid in the porch. We were in a basement flat in Shepard's Bush at the time

and it was October and I was out there for eight hours because I was in my dressing gown. My skin was really bad as well at the time I'd been picking and I just, and my legs were hairy and I thought, I can't anyone see me like this. So for eight hours I sat there until he got home.

I don't have no phone, no nothing. I say this to love, aside from the insanity of that like the thought as somebody with ADHD of having to sit in one place with nothing to fucking do for eight hours. It's madness. I couldn't do that now. I've progressed a lot.

I could be stark, bollock, naked. No, you wouldn't. I would go out. Would you? Would you? Yeah, the thought, I'd rather walk, stark bollock naked down the street than sit there for eight hours with nothing to do. Not even a fidget spinner.

No way. No way. Anyway, should we move on? Let's. That was a bit dismissive. Let's not move on very briefly. You're a fucking incredible human. And I'm really like, I'm cross.

It's not incredible for fuck sake. But I'm cropped. No, you're not incredible that you've turned up without your makeup on. But you are an incredible human for other reasons. I don't give a shit what your face looks like. But what you've done today is really big. It's for me, yeah. No, it is really big.

Yeah. It's like jumping into a pit of snakes, even if you're terrified of them. Wink. I'm really proud. Are you now going to secretly go down here and put some ink on? No, don't you're fine. What I'd quite like is some of the spicy lips. Have you got spicy lips with you?

You have to try it. Because I feel like it might be fun. You made it sound as if... So before I came on... Here we go. Listen, if we're ever worried about a sponsor for this particular episode, I think we're going to be fine. Okay, so, yeah, this is my blooming.

You can find the link in my bio. So this is, that tightens, okay, and that helps with the aging skin. And then I put a bit of this stuff on, which is plumpet. I feel like I'm on Insta. Plumpet, a volumizing lip plumpur. And I've seen a lot of people struggling with this,

but that made me want it even more because I thought, You've seen them struggling because it hurts. Because it's quite stingy. Okay, I'm going to do it live. Not live, obviously, but like on the camera. I need to get a... Really pump a load of it out. It's all right. Get a load of it out.

I've got a little glossy tip. My recommendation wouldn't be to go too far out your lip line. Did that the first time. Oh, God, now I've just seen my face. Got the shakes. Okay. While she's doing that, I'm just going to put on my tripeptide plumping lip balm. Oh, no, I can't!

You got it on the tongue? Yeah, I got it on tongue a little bit. Okay, that is, who makes it? The devil. Yeah. I said, someone said, does it work? I went, yeah, it's the devil's work. Okay, that feels, I tell you what that feels like.

It feels like I've chopped a chili up and rubbed it all over my lip. Mm-hmm. This isn't like anything other than like traumatizing your lips into swelling up. Yeah, yeah. I'm still doing more. You're going more? Because I'm an addict. Because you saw me put it on earlier.

It's the pain. No, it's the dopamine hit. I'm getting from the pain. Are you? Yeah. Really? Yeah. After this, I'm going to go get three tattoos. It is, it's a dopamine hip from the pain.

It's like, I need it, but I love it. Oh, now it's gone down the back of my throat. So please, it's your turn to tell me about your topic of the episode. Okay, I just need a minute. Where's that you're drinking? What is that? Gombucha. Well, we are in Hoxton.

Oh, right. I'm shaking, actually. That's really stinging. Mm. Okay. It feels like your lips are seeping, doesn't it? It feels like they're crawling off my face. Yeah.

That's what it feels like. Are they plump? A little bit. Right, my topic is this week. You're never the only one who's shit with money. And I sort of did that for the succinctness of it. But the reality is actually I wanted to hear about everybody's personal relationship with money. Yeah.

Because I think it's a really, in our house, it's a very tricky subject. Because I am, a bit like I am with my face, you don't really care about money that much. Like, I like to have enough to do what I want to do. Yeah. And I like to have enough to make sure my bills are paid. But savings, for example, that's never going to be my vibe. Like I wish it was, and maybe it will be, but I am a spender. It comes in, it goes out.

Well, no, it comes in, I take some off for tax, and then it goes out. Oh, that's really kicking in now. Press your lips together. No, I don't want to. Do it. No, do it. Have you given me? So, anyway, money for me is a very, I think I don't have enough of a relationship with it to really care about it in the way that my husband does.

for example. Yeah. I think it's a lot to do with how you brought up. My dad was very much about appearances and it's really hurting. Very much about appearances.

Like, you know, I went to boarding school. I know there were times he couldn't quite pay the bills, but it was important to him that I was at boarding school. Yeah. Not because it was the best thing for me. I made that abundantly clear.

Like, he wanted his daughter to be at boarding school. He went to Harrow Boys, so it was like a thing. Not anything that I hold a resentment against him. I got a lot out of boarding school as well as not loving a lot about it. But money was always something that we used to make the external look shiny. And that's definitely something that I've inherited.

And I also am ADHD and there's a significant feature of compulsive and impulsive behavior and spending money is one of those dopamine hits that we get that's like very easy, very quick and very effective. You know, like when you're not feeling quite yourself, but you have to go out, so you go, I'm going to go buy myself a new top. No. No, because you're normal. But that's a dopamine hit for me.

And I think that's going to, basically it changes the way I feel because I'm an addict as well. So anything I can do to change the way I feel, including spending money by a top that's going to make me into the person I need to be that night. It's going to give me that hit. Yeah. Traditionally, I'm not great with money, but I did put it out there to the podcast Hive Mind. Here we go. I love a voice note. I love a voice note too. This one really, really broke my heart a little bit. Here we go.

I'm just trying to get ready to the gym. I've just seen your Instagram and I thought I would send you a message because maybe now is the time to get this off my chest and step into my truth. She's never said this before to anybody else. I am so ashamed of this. And actually, like, my heart is beating, just talking to you right now. And I do love a podcast worthy of a WhatsApp message or vice versa. A WhatsApp message worthy of a podcast. Sorry about my blind. Nobody wants to see me getting changed for the gym.

When I was 19, I inherited over £100,000. And I did buy a house. But I blew most of it, and I have lived deeply regretting that for the rest of my life. Last Thursday, I'm getting a bit emotional. I got diagnosed with ADHD. I've always been really, really crap with money. And I've watched my sister have the most amazing life because she married this guy who's really good with money. And they both, she inherited the same.

And they are just heading for retirement, and they're going to have this amazing retirement. And when I was 26, I met a guy who's very wealthy, had a child with him. It was a terrible relationship, so destructive. And I walked away from it, and I walked with nothing. But we, and we share, we co-parent, we share our daughter, I get no maintenance. And he lives in this, like, fancy place with horses and all that jazz. And I'm still here in my little damp garden flat, just getting by. And I was self-employed for 17 years.

I had a cafe. and then I opened up the very first cafe in Bristol Temple Meads. I had a cafe in Weston and then over COVID that got shut down and I turned my shop into a zero-way store which I loved but then decided to give it up because of the cost of living crisis and then I went online, completely went online, got and proper zero and it just didn't work out and I'm currently working. I'm really grateful for the job. I've got a great job. I love it.

I've worked from home and just trying to make ends me and I'm literally just making inroads now into getting my website up and running again and going to try and make a better life for my 14-year-old, but she'd be 15 in a few months, and I kind of feel like I might have missed the boat for her. And yeah, it's so much. Oh, and I also inherited another large amount of money just before COVID, which I then spent a lot of on the cafe in Bristol Temple Meads, which I then lost within a year because of COVID.

It's been wild, and that's... the first time I've ever said it all in one go out loud. I'm so sorry this is so long. It really touched me because that ADHD diagnosis, this is why when people are everything in diagnoses ADHD, that has suddenly everything is clicked into place for her, like that impulsive behavior, that marrying the wrong person, that leaving with nothing, that all of that stuff is like tied up in our brain. And I hate it. I hate that ADHD comes into everything but it is my breath like it's my brain i don't do anything without my brain so of course it affects everything but hearing that and just that like emotion that she gets when she's like i was

diagnosed with ADHD it's that comes from and now it all makes sense and that and that anger i guess and grief for the life that you could have had if somebody had just gone you're a bit fucking different so i felt for her on that we got a few emails and things like that as well we said She said, hello ladies, as a child of the early 70s, learning about money went as far as playing with toy money in the toy post office till. God, I loved that. Consequently, I'm 100% shit with money.

Learning about how to save, invest and budget was never, ever taught in school. The teachers were more concerned with pie and algebra and trigonometry and while pupils constantly failed at it. I mean, what the actual fuck was that all about? Is that, eluding to the fact that they do teach it in school now? No, they still don't teach it in school. They don't. I remember getting a store card.

I think it was probably in, at the time, pennies. Do they even do school cards anymore? Well, I don't know, but at the time, I remember they, and they were like, do you want this store card? Do you get like 20% off today? And it was basically. With like 45% APR or something, but nobody told you. And I got home and I said, my mom, I got like free.

She was like, no, took it, cut it up straight away. And then, you know, kind of just sat me down at that point. And I was probably. Well, you must have been 18 because you couldn't. Yeah, yeah. I must have been like early 20. Yeah. She was like, no.

And it took that long for me to go. And I just, since then I just got terrified, never even got a credit card until last year. We've also got an unheard voice note, which is always quite fun. Oh gosh. Should we try it? Yeah. Come on, TJ. Don't let me down.

Hello, Kat. My name's Tim. I'm 38, and I have been rubbish with money all of my life. I'm not really sure the reasons for that, but I think partly it was just because I was never able to prioritize. I wanted to live this particular lifestyle and I, you know, month by month I was sort of living hand to mouth, spending what money I've got and not really considering the future

and how it might affect, you know, the things that I really needed to save my money for, such as like healthcare or rent and things like this. So I've learned to prioritise over the years. I have ADHD as well, So I think part of my spending was trying to get dopamine and get dopamine hits, dopamine. I think that's probably part of the reason why I used to do it. But also, I remember in school not really ever having any real-world scenarios to apply mathematics to.

And I think that's something that we're not sort of taught enough of. And not just apply the math, but like, it's... Yeah, I struggle with this. And I struggle still to know that in some schools, we're not taught about budgeting at all. Like, it's not even a thing. And I'm just, it blows my mind that we're not learning this. So I've had to learn that myself.

And as I said, I'm 38 years old. Literally only in the last 28 months have I learned how to budget. Oh my God. First of all, I love that we've finally got a man's voice on the podcast. Secondly, can you send us your budget spreadsheet, please? Because I feel like I could really benefit from that. Two. But thirdly, you know what it is?

It's also, it's a bit like my fitness pal. Yeah. It's like I'm back on my fitness pal. Right. And it's not that I'm great. Like yesterday was a right off. It did not go well. It was quite an emotional day.

I ate emotionally. I had a whole packet of those like, like that size packet of those like chocolate wafers squares. Yeah. With the hazelnut chocolate. They don't count their wafers. Yes. They're air, basically. Their air.

Because I had my fitness pal, I put that in anyway, didn't look great. But then I was like, okay, but I've logged it. It's almost the act of like recognizing it. Yeah. Knowing it's there and then you can manage it. Otherwise it sort of builds up mentally. And if you don't write it down. Yeah.

If you don't concrete write it down. Yeah. It becomes this like massive thing in your head. And then you go, well, might as well not fucking bother. Whereas now I'm like, okay, I had a bad day. Written it down. It's between me and my fitness pal. Nobody else needs to know about it,

apart from everybody to listen to the podcast. The gazillions of, people listening and it's a bit like that with your budget it's like if you just write it down yeah but that in itself is a discipline that we need to get into and it's not it's not easy and I think um this email very quickly and then we will move on but it said I grew up within a very toxic household with many forms of abuse from parents and step parents and part of that abuse was financial right and I think this idea of financial abuse is something we don't talk about nearly enough um often it's men controlling women through finances, or lack of access to finances. I always feel like I want to

prove my financial stability to my other family members to prove I'm not like my mum. I feel I have to have things to prove to myself that I have money, but I have ultimately been at times reckless with it. I've always had my own savings for the last three years and I don't have debt, so I know I'm not like her, but I find myself hiding that I've bought things from my husband or feeling deeply uncomfortable asking him to buy anything for us that isn't completely necessary and that is 100% me projecting from my past so you know I came from a family of quite a lot of privilege my husband came from a very regular middle class normal working like family working middle class family um I certainly grew up on the face of it with more material stuff more money

and he brought into his adult life this idea that people with money was somehow a bit gross. Okay. And so he hates when he earns money, he earns good money, but when he really hates spending it on himself, like, he's like, can I have some more underwear for Christmas? I'm like, absolutely not. You can buy your own underwear.

I'm not buying your underwear for Christmas. That's like saying I'm having a shower at self-care. Yeah. No, it's a basic human necessity. Yeah. Of course, he only wears Calvin Klein underwear. He once had to buy a pair of new balance by, like, because he packed without packing any underwear.

And his approach to packing is a whole different. topic that we can unpack at another time, pun intended. But he didn't pack any underwear. Right. So we had to go to TK. Max and they only had new balance. And he was devastated. Therapy.

But he's really good with money. He's almost, in fact, actually I would say that I'm not good enough and he's too good. Like he won't treat himself. He doesn't like to spend anything. He's always like the boiler's going to break. We're going to need to get a new roof. Whereas I'm like, it'll be fine. And we're sort of.

of always right it always has been fine yeah and we've never really needed to get a new boiler so are you are you quite money driven i'd love to be more money driven i'm not at all i'm a saver but i'm not i think as i've got older it's really interesting that you say that because i certainly wasn't i'm a creative and i'm an addict so i'm all about the pleasure and the experience and the joy and the impulse and spontaneity so no but i think as i've got older i've started to realize that i needed to be more money driven but it's more the freedom that that money gives me than the money itself like I don't care about having stacks of money in the bank the freedom of choice of being of not having to worry about things of being able to do things that I want to do not having to necessarily go I've got to wait and save and do

that like I mean I probably should wait and save a bit more but I thrive like my biggest thing is the freedom I hate the idea that I'm out of control because I don't have enough money and it's a security thing and I think it's an independent as a fiercely independent thing as well You know, and also it's a self-employed thing. Jimmy and I both self-employed. So neither of us have any idea how much money we're earning each month. You know, that's, and that's, I don't love living that way, but I can manage it. Jimmy hates living that way.

But it's also, I mean, if he doesn't play base, what the hell is the man going to do? Yeah. as I've got older and as I've earned more money, I've gained the confidence that I can earn that money and that I am able to. And I didn't have that for a really long time. You know, it took me ages to figure out what I was going to do with my life, how I was going to earn money. I did loads of different jobs. I was a fashion buyer. I worked as a teacher. I did ski seasons. I was a tour manager. I ran a charity. You know, there was never, I just wanted to do something that I loved. Yeah. But I think as I got older, I realized that I wanted to find something that I loved

and that paid me really well. And I'm there now. You know, I was, but it took me until I was 38, you know, to even consider that I could actually earn that money that I was worthy of it. Right. Both my half-brother and half-sister from, have done incredibly well. They've built their own businesses. They are ostensibly what you would call like millionaires.

Like they're big. And they've done it all themselves and they're incredible. And I think there's always been a little bit of insecurity in me because they didn't go private school they didn't get all the grades yeah and they've been so successful yeah whereas i think that there's i've always described myself a little bit as the post child for unfulfilled potential because you know i had in my eyes and i guess in everybody's eyes like i had everything the private school education i had this i had that parents who didn't divorce i had and yet i couldn't find my place and i think it was only as i approached 40 that i was able to go like

what the fuck am i doing like why am I not just doing it? Yeah. Why am I not just doing it? And it also meant I had to have a chat with Jimmy because Jimmy was very much, like we had young kids. Yeah. And I had to, I guess to a certain extent, and he might disagree with this, but I guess I

had to prove to him that I could earn money and that was worth the time I was going to take away. Yeah. But I had to, I had to believe that I was worth that money. Yeah, I think I'm kind of there at the moment. And it took me a while to believe that that would ever happen. Yeah. Time for me is the most valuable asset.

If I can buy myself time, I will throw money at that problem. So when it's like, yes, I can decorate my living room. Of course I can. It's going to take me two or three days to do it. If I pay a decorator to do it, I've just bought myself two or three days. That's exactly Johnny's mindset. I need that because I then what I do is say, I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it.

And then I beat myself up because I don't end up doing it. And then if I do end up having to pay someone, I'm like, failed. Or then when you do do it, you're like, well, I've got so much to do when you're stressed and I'm a horrible person. Oh, you've got to throw money at the problem. At least my paintings, no. Yeah, at least I did my painting. Oh, I'll send you your medal.

Anyway, listen, money, it's a big thing. We didn't even really touch the sides there. So just a reminder that this podcast is all about you and hearing your voices. So if you've got anything to say about this episode or previous episodes or any upcoming topics that we're going to share with you now, please email us at you're never the only one at gmail.com.

That's y-o-u-u-r-e. Or leave us a voice note on 0-7457-402. 704. That's 07457404. 402704. Right, next week's topics. What are you going with? I'm going with, I'm a bit scared now that I've done it, but I think it's going to be really good. You're never the only one who's estranged from a close family member. We're going with estrangement.

Classify as estrangement. Like you don't talk to them anymore. At all. Never will. It's not a hiatus. No, like, well, maybe it is, because I think never say never. but it's a conscious decision. You've made a conscious decision

or they've made a conscious decision to have nothing to do with that person. So that's what we're talking about. I want to know if that's you, whether you've chosen to be estranged or whether somebody has estranged you. I don't think that's a verb, but you know what I'm saying.

How you feel about it, what it was that made it happen and all of that stuff. And I just want to know about that because it's real and I don't think we talk actually quite a lot about estrangement. It's so real.

I am going, to cover the topic of you're never the only one who feels invisible after 40. Why that noise? I think it's a really juicy topic. Oh, God, no pressure. Just a reminder, if you want to talk about any of those things, you've got anything today, we'll obviously be putting it on the Instagram, but get in touch as well at your...

The Instagram. Sound like my mum. And the internet, on the worldwide web. Are you on the Instagram again? The tic-a-tok. The Tic-Tac. So if you've got anything to say, you can do it at you're never the only one at gmail.com

or on the WhatsApp voice. note message, which is number which is 07457404. We'll also put that in the show notes, save the number, and I think that's us. Is this the point now we're at episode four? We should start saying to people that they should leave reviews and five star it and say how great we are. The things I say do, I'm always what I mean. I'm neither saying or similar. I'm somewhere in. between this world is complicated

everything moves so quick and lying to yourself if you think that you've got to live everybody you're never the only one Don't live inside your strength Because everybody makes mistakes Oh

Don't judge me I'm a weakness Don't judge me on my floor Because no one's really perfect By the grace of God goes all Everybody in love You're never the only one You're never the only one Don't live inside the shame

Because everybody makes mistakes Oh Taking the time to make sure Everything's okay Picking up like everyone else each and every day When I've got nothing left for you to spend on you You're allowed to be happy to

You're never the only one Don't live inside your shame Because everybody makes mistakes Oh You're never the only one You're never the only one Oh Don't live inside your shame

Because everybody makes mistakes Oh