You're The Voice | by Efrat Fenigson - Freedom, Forged in Art - MADEX | Ep. 155

Episode Date: August 13, 2026

MADEX is an internationally renowned artist, designer and creative director from Alberta, Canada. He built the Bull Bitcoin brand alongside Francis Pouliot, and runs MADEX, a fine art, jewelry and regalia project he describes as a freedom project. In this rare conversation, MADEX explains why art has been captured as a vehicle for collectivist ideas and how he is pushing the opposite, what his three pillars of freedom are, why he refuses to put the Bitcoin ₿ on anything he makes, and why everyone should have children.→ Please like, comment, share & subscribe, to help me beat the suppressing algo's. Thank you!– SPONSORS –→ Download the free report on second citizenships & setting up a plan B in another country with Expat Money: https://expatmoney.com/efrat→ Access liquidity without selling your Bitcoin with Ledn, get 0.25% off your first loan: https://ledn.io/Efrat    → Get your TREZOR wallet & accessories, with a 5% discount, using my code at checkout (get my discount code from the episode - yep, you’ll have to watch it): https://affil.trezor.io/SHUn→ Have you tried mining bitcoin? Stack sats directly to your wallet while saving on taxes with Abundant Mines: https://AbundantMines.com/Efrat - Claim your free month of hosting via this link– AFFILIATES –→ Get 15% off “Born To Be Free” all-natural, tallow-based skincare products on a bitcoin standard, using code EFRAT: https://oshi.link/1nvZYq  → Join me in these upcoming events & use code EFRAT for discounted tickets: https://www.efrat.blog/p/upcoming-events→ Get 10% off on Augmented NAC to detox Spike protein, with the code YCXKQDK2 via this link: https://store.augmentednac.com/?via=efrat (This is not medical advice, please consult your MD)→ Watch “New Totalitarian Order” conference with Prof. Mattias Desmet & Efrat - code EFRAT for 10% off: https://efenigson.gumroad.com/l/desmet_efrat– LINKS –MADEX on Nostr: https://primal.net/madex MADEX on X: https://x.com/spacebull MADEX art: https://madex.art/ Efrat’s X: https://twitter.com/efenigsonEfrat’s Channels: https://linktr.ee/efenigsonWatch on all platforms: https://linktr.ee/yourethevoiceSupport Efrat’s work: ⁠https://bit.ly/zap_efrat– CHAPTERS – 00:00 - Coming Up...01:33 - Introduction: MADEX05:28 - Why MADEX Is a Freedom Project08:41 - Judge a Society by How It Treats Its Entrepreneurs09:32 - Ad-Break: Expat Money & Ledn13:01 - Why American Pickup Trucks Keep Getting Bigger17:56 - Fiat & Global Agendas Influencing Companies & Brands20:03 - Madex' Childhood in Alberta, Building Toys24:35 - The Three Pillars of Freedom: Transact, Defend, Communicate27:48 - No Compromise on Quality & Great Products32:35 - Bitcoin as a Patron of Arts38:40 - AI, Creativity & Divine Connection42:14 - Ad-Break: Trezor & Abundant Mines44:03 - Beyond the "B" in Bitcoin Art50:55 - "MADEX Manifesto" Film and a Future One55:55 - Value Has to Be Created Before It Can Be Stolen59:34 - What Makes MADEX Bullish1:05:27 - Free Your Mind & Soul1:11:28 - "MADEX Manifesto" Short Film

Money has to be made before it can be stolen. Value has to be created before it can be extracted. As I've become a professional and improved my skills, it's just made that connection to the divine more frequent. And this is what AI can never do. And if you're a creative person, do not be threatened by AI. It will never replace you. I think you can measure the health of a society

by the way it treats its entrepreneurs you hold bitcoin long enough it starts to finance your dreams and bitcoin doesn't have an opinion on what you should or should not do at the point that 0.01 bitcoin becomes enough to finance a company for 20 years i think we're really going to see an explosion of innovation true capitalism none of us watching this or around us has ever actually experienced it's been dead for over 100 years bitcoin obviously destroys the central banks destroys fiat destroys the federal reserve the u.s dollar just wipes it all out what makes me most bullish is the amount of bitcoiners that are having children fiaters really do not want us to have kids and there is psyop on every level about having children and it might be time to just shut

the fuck up and buy the coins and just forget about it hello and welcome to another episode of you're the voice i am so happy to be here with you on a monday morning i think it is monday right we're bitcoiners we don't know what day it is okay i think it's a monday morning we are in prague once again at the fancy beautiful my favorite studio of trezor thank you shout out to trezor for hosting us once again i really love you guys you do an awesome work and this studio is my favorite studio to hijack in the world because i hijack a lot of studios this is my favorite. Yeah, it's great. Very comfortable. Acoustics are amazing. And this is my friend Madix. Hey, Madix. Hi. How are you going? Well, yeah, we just had a very successful few days

at BTC Prague, above and beyond the most well-executed Bitcoin event in the world. I agree. Yeah, very happy to have been a part of it this year. And everything I've done this year, we're in a you know quasi bear market and uh all events were ghost towns and somehow the guys at btc prague yes filled the place they sold more tickets than last year it was even better than last year the production quality was incredible it they are as professional of a team as you can get i agree so i'm looking forward to next year we'll definitely be back for sure me too and i'm looking forward to our next hour together because I've been waiting for a long time to have this conversation with you so first of all thank you for agreeing to come on the show and secondly I

want to make sure people know who you are so I'll just start by saying beyond being my friend you are an internationally renowned artist designer and creative director of bull bitcoin and I think my audience knows bull bitcoin both because I think it's one of the best companies in this space but also because Francis was on the show actually right here where you're sitting and we had a blast it was a really good episode I think it went viral here and there and um Bull is based and we need more based people and companies out there you're the creator of I think the most beautiful art collection in this space that I have seen and one of my favorite and you also make jewelry which i love so i am wearing a madex necklace today beautiful my open dime silver

looks great and i also have earrings and i have others but this is what i chose to put today and i think i don't know if you know my my sword it's not yours but it fits your style so much yeah and i think we have the swords in the bull in the bull bitcoin merch as well i would love you to make more sword stuff because i really love swords yeah please do and you recently designed the cover art for the sovereign individual book in french right yeah the french translation of a very famous book from the 90s 1997 yeah that predicts bitcoin cryptographic money yep and is essentially about the collapse of nation states and sort of the balkanization of the whole globe and uh francis pouliot wrote the foreword for it so it's a great

uh collab as we have um the history of working on bull together and then uh we both have french roots and so to do the cover and for francis to write the foreword was a great honor for us I just saw it for the first time when we got to BTC Prague, the physical books. So very exciting. Seeing that, but I'm going to put a photo of it here. You describe your work as a freedom project. I want to start there. Can you tell our audience why do you see this as a freedom project?

And when for you did art and Bitcoin merge or become one in the same? I describe it as a freedom project because I'm pushing the opposite of what has become mainstream and high-level art. Art has, in our present times, been co-opted as a tool to spread the influence and ideas of, for the most part, communists. And I'm on the other end of that, pushing capitalism. I believe capital is the root of all good. and all of the art follows principles of excellence and I'm in pursuit of excellence with it. And so I say it's a freedom project

because I'm using the artwork to communicate free ideas and to promote the sovereign individual and to promote tools like Bitcoin. and I want to inspire people with it to be free so that's why I call it a freedom project and I don't think there are very many out there especially if you want to have success in the traditional art markets it's all a big club and there's so much capital in it that artists and creators and designers, they are sort of forced to sell out into it to push these Marxist ideas and commie ideas and all that kind of collectivist, I'll say, collectivist ideas.

And thanks to Bitcoin, there's an opportunity for creators to produce work backed by capitalism and true capitalism, which we've never, none of us watching this or around us has ever actually experienced. It's been dead for over 100 years, well over 100 years. Do you think we've ever had it? I think we've had pieces of it because you can see the results from periods where entrepreneurs were celebrated and allowed to thrive. You know, we have the architectural skeletons, you could say, of it. And we're kind of remnants of it. Yeah, the remnants of it. It's so powerful that we're still benefiting from the times that it did exist today. And those who seek total control over human populations have sort of taken the elements of capitalism and merged and mixed them with these

with all the elements that allow them to maintain control. And that's what we've kind of been riding off of. And then, of course, like what capitalism does is create threats to monopolies. and so they've shaped capitalism to be the bad guy and it's what they teach people in schools. Yeah. I think you can measure the health of a society by the way it treats its entrepreneurs. The entrepreneurs, the core of progress,

the core of civilization and in a society that celebrates, promotes, cultivates entrepreneurs, there's progress. and why is the entrepreneur so important because the entrepreneur creates the entrepreneur finds the gaps in the markets the entrepreneur is in tune with the demands of the market the demands of all of us and uh and it has to be because it's small yeah so it will not survive if it doesn't listen to the market right exactly unlike the big corporations yeah so it's kind of a signal of truth in a way tired of feeling like your freedom and future are fading away do you live

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slash efrat to get a free report on plan b residencies and instant citizenships this is an easy free way to help support the show while learning how to protect your freedom with a plan b that's expatmoney.com slash efrat ever find yourself needing cash but refusing to sell your bitcoin that's real life for many bitcoiners because most bitcoin sales aren't financial decisions, they're liquidity decisions. And that's exactly what Ledin solves. Ledin is the global leader in Bitcoin-backed lending. They've issued over $10 billion in loans since 2018 with a perfect track record for protecting client assets. Here's what makes Ledin different. With their custodied loans, your Bitcoin collateral is not lent out to generate interest. No credit checks,

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Like the closer we can get to true free markets, the better everything. And the entrepreneur is the greatest communicator with the free market because they're incentivized to listen, to pay attention, to adapt. And currently with that sort of fused system where we have capitalist elements but mostly totalitarian and Marxist control. The incentives of most companies today, especially large ones, are the customer is second and shareholders are first. And this obviously provides terrible service to the customers

and it provides sort of a disrespect to the customers. Like we can look into the market and we can see so many things that are being made that people don't want. and aren't asking for. And because there's such moats to entry and there's such opposition to entrepreneurs, it's very difficult for competitors to rise and be built. And it's not a fair balance at all. Great example of this is in automobiles. People may have noticed that in the United States and in America, vehicles are getting larger and larger. So why are the vehicles getting larger and larger like a pickup truck now is the size of a bus

in the united states and in canada and really they're that big they're huge yeah if you compare you know a 2005 or a 1995 pickup truck to the ones they have today um they're at least 30 percent larger okay but with the same amount of cabin space and the sort of same amount of carry space And the reason is all these green policies that were making an elite few people very wealthy at the expense of everyone were put into place that said in order for the pickup trucks to go, and not just pickup trucks, but all of the SUVs and the larger vehicles, in order for them to go on the road, they had to meet certain emissions requirements. And so people who have no connection to reality or to automobiles or the customer base came up with these rules that they established of what defined efficiency. And what they dialed into was the engine output. The efficiency of the engine had to be proportionate to the vehicle's size. And so what they wanted was more efficient engines, but what they got was larger vehicles because it's much cheaper to just add a whole bunch of unnecessary aluminum and parts and just kind of inflate the size of the truck than to redesign from scratch a new engine that can meet the emission requirements.

I did not know that. That is fascinating. The market is not asking for this. The market doesn't want this and it's just forced upon us. And now there's a huge premium on early vehicles. And can I say, it just reminds me as you're giving this brilliant example that, you know, I come from marketing like 20 plus years in marketing. What does any average marketeer do when the company comes and says, we have to increase the revenue, but the market is kind of not signaling the demand for the product? What do they do?

They then either decrease the size of the actual product versus the packaging or they increase the size of the packaging and keep the product the same so that they pretend to sell you something larger or bigger, but really they give you either lower or the same type of output while they increase the price. So that like they cheat and they try to convince you that now you're getting a better product, but really they're just changing the wrappers. And that's the same as what they're doing in this brilliant example with a car. But with the car here, it even goes for, I mean, these are all by Fiat design, right? These are all downstream of the Fiat, you know, it has to be this way. Because fiat forces companies and people to continue this incessive growth of the monetary issuance. So they have to continue growing themselves, even if they don't want to grow or they don't need to grow or they don't want to issue more of their products or services or, you know, because the debt has to continue growing. So that just dictates life.

So you see it everywhere. But what you're saying is even worse because it's integrated together with some sick, stupid agenda. Yeah. Another one you see with things like appliances and a great example is a dishwasher. That's one of the few things where the name is what it is. It's the purpose of the product is to wash dishes. And yet when you walk into an appliance store, all of the marketing material on the dishwashers are around efficiencies and water conservation and how little water the dishwashers use. Very little on the actual quality of the dishwashing itself, which is, again, completely disconnected from what the customer is looking for in that marketplace.

And there's just dozens and dozens and dozens of these. And I used to work in a real estate company. Yeah. And it was like commercial real estate where they rented out office spaces, a bit like we work. And the product was office space, right? Like you get certain meters where you can come with your team and work there and whatever. and one day we started I mean it started happening more and more we started getting emails from potential customers or customers existing customers that would ask us can we see your diversity and inclusion policy of our company and I was like I was the chief marketing officer I would look at this and because they're customers and sometimes they would post this on like social media or whatever and tag us so we have to like answer them I would look at it and I'm like what the fuck does diversity and inclusion in our company has to do with how many meters of

office space you get like why do you care and i'm not saying i mean i'm a woman i care about women but it's not about that those agendas are being put in there and then those people who are brainwashed think that you have a better or worse product if you have a diversity and inclusion agenda It is not connected. It is like if the company has missions and values and a vision and everyone's aligned on it and there's integrity in the company, that would be probably a good company and the product will be good and the price will be good. You know, people don't care about that anymore. Customers are confused. So it's all shifted to value extraction and even the brands themselves that we've had for hundreds of years are being diluted.

and they are gutting the product quality like in designer goods you can compare a Louis Vuitton bag from 2026 to a Louis Vuitton bag from 1995 and the quality difference is immediately and instantaneously recognizable are they recognizable even for my untrained eyes or just certainly yeah Yeah. And this is happening across all of them because these sort of like super conglomerates and this shift to caring only about shareholder returns and not what's delivered to the customer and sort of this attitude that like, oh, well, they'll buy it anyways because it's the brand. Well, what makes the brand in the first place is supposed to be quality. That's why we created brands so that if somebody makes something really good that works really well, you're able to find them. So wait, I want to get into the quality thing with you deeper. Wait, wait with that.

Before we go there, take me back. You're based in Alberta today, but take me back to when did you even start with art and why? Art's been all my life, so from as long as I can remember. Okay. Both my parents were artistic. They weren't artists, but so I grew up with it and it was just... Were you painting as a kid? What were you doing as a kid?

Yeah, I was making stuff. I was doing everything creative as a kid. I was writing a lot and I was painting a lot and drawing and, you know, just keeping, that's how I kept myself entertained. I grew up deep in the woods and, you know, there was... Also in Alberta? In Alberta, yeah. And so to see other people was, you know, a big ordeal. I grew up in the countryside and didn't have a lot of people around me. My friends were very far away, so I had to figure out how to keep myself entertained. and one of the first sort of art projects I could say I was working on is that I had a rifle very early in life being deep in the woods but I wasn't allowed to play with it I was allowed to use it time to time but wasn't allowed to play with it the guns were tools and not toys but I was a young boy so I wanted to go out and and play war games like I'm sure many young do young boys do maybe not today as much but and uh so I was uh creating my own um toy guns from scraps and pieces and I

would uh get myself taken to hardware stores and buy bits of pipe and create bolts and magazines and things and so I think that really began my like working with materials sort of stuff and was doing that from I don't know six six or seven years old and onwards then so I was always making stuff always creating things I would make things for my friend groups I and uh I would figure out how to get shirts made figure out how to make um you know would print cd cases and make and sell CDs. And then eventually cut all the way to the future. I went to a technical school to study the business of fashion from cotton fields all the way up to merchandising windows and patent drafting. I learned how to sew. And during that time, that was also around when I

discovered Bitcoin, but it had negative money and I wanted to... Negative as in you were in debt? Yeah. Yeah. For the school stuff and all kinds of other things. And so I wanted to build something that could produce an income for me while I was working hard at school. And that would also kind of be in line. And somewhere I read, start with your strengths. And so I began just working on art projects and, you know, creating like clothing brands. And I had a very supportive group of friends that would help me to make the sales on collections and things like that. And then that just kind of slowly evolved over time. If I look back, I should have believed in myself earlier with that work that I was doing at the time. But the area I was in was very hard industry focused

and not a lot of space for creativity. And so I figured I had to earn money and earn a living and get a real job before I could have the capital to basically invest in scaling out the art project and such. And so I meandered into different fields, learned other skills. But throughout that time, Bitcoin began to grow and eventually Bitcoin became my angel investor and Bitcoin became my venture capital and VC backer and put me in a position to finance Madex in the early days. And along that road led me to meeting Francis Pouliot and becoming a part of Bull Bitcoin. And, well, at the time it was a different company. And then I came on and created the Bull Bitcoin brand and then have been flying sort of the two projects in parallel ever since Madex and Bull.

And both are becoming very successful. Yeah, and they also correspond really nicely, I think. Yeah. Well, there's a major freedom overlap. So the pillars of freedom are the ability to transact, which is Bitcoin, the ability to defend. So freedom to transact Bitcoin, freedom to defend yourself, which is 3D printed guns, and freedom to communicate, which is companies like Start9, private servers and private routers. And all the guys out there working on mesh networks and anything that gets out of, you know, the big communication sort of monopolies. And so as Madex is a freedom project, I am working to support these three pillars, I would say. They're pillars of freedom. And so I have my work with Bull, which takes care of freedom to transact. where i am the 3d printing guns is all very illegal but there are places in the united

states where it is legal and so i'm able to provide um like some graphic design and merch stuff to a few of those guys uh like deterrence dispensed and then the last one being the freedom to communicate which is uh the work i've done with start nine um and i'm looking to work with other guys doing cool things like mesh net and uh whatever else bit chat was very exciting there's any of these projects that enable freedom i have also doubled down very hard on nostre recently having a great time using it same here shout out to all the nostriches out there watching us yeah it's funny many complain about all these things with how nostre works and i actually i mostly you know it's a little bit slow it's a little bit buggy you don't always kind of see

replies it's you know not perfect not perfect but I think that that's its most powerful feature because I've been working to cut interaction with social media from my life and interacting with Noster and it being kind of a little bit buggy and a little bit you know it is not the casino slot machine that Twitter is, that Instagram is. Noster is a peaceful beach experience. I would describe it. It's like a retired experience. And I really appreciate that and enjoy that. And I'm still able to get my messages out there. I can reach lots of people. I interact with some here and there. And it's nice to have this sort of release of not having to interact with every single comment every single post and you know i know you have you get that anyways on regular

social media if you get famous enough but um where i'm at i still see pretty much everything that comes in i love the slogan keep nostril weird it just i think encapsulates what we have there which is lovely and i really love it okay what let's now go back into what you started um touching on before with the way you see, the way you perceive art and products in general. I know you care a lot about the quality of things and you prefer to do less and do better than do more and have it be crappy or compromise on the quality. So can you share, like, how do you see your vision for fashion, for art, for consumer products going forward? And how do you see the vision for your work and your brand evolving into this? I think people have a desire for well-made

original products. I think they have a desire for natural and sturdy environments. And Fiat is currently working hard to replicate this. For example, the sheer scale of fake leather and fake wood um is is massive and uh fake wood yeah fake wood like veneer and stuff and so they use particle board and then they put a very very thin sheet of wood over it so there's a demand out there for stuff that lasts i think there's a huge explosion with plastic everything just started becoming plastic and plastic was so great and now we're starting to find out all the problems with plastic and that it's great for some things but it's not great for other things and personally I'm working to live in an environment which has as little plastic in it as possible and only the

things that are that truly require the technology of plastic use it. Working on switching all my clothes over to 100% cotton or merino wools or cashmeres or silks and it's a great measure of inflation um that everything used to be cheaper and 100 cotton and original uh or organic materials and now everything is more expensive and it's all just plastic yes imitate imitating natural materials and um it a great measurement for inflation as we were talking about the um you know the shrinking and the inflating of stuff um i think the truest like sailor came out with this whole calculation of measuring inflation i think all you need to do is look at the price of beef okay because a steak is one of the few things that exists even though they're working very

hard to fix this but steaks are one of the very few things that uh you can't dilute yeah you can't you can't well they try to inject water sometimes yeah they're doing all kinds of ridiculous stuff but but it's hard for the most part if you look you know like i think in canada it's like almost 30 percent over the last year and you know you can't you just can't can't fake it and I think for people yeah for people who are paying attention you also can't fake um leather and uh you can't fake um you know the the the feeling of quality something that's been well made that's been cared about in your hands and I like I have a line of lighters that I'm working on with madex that's um takes from uh all the principles i believe in and things that should

be generational and last and every single person i show one of these lighters to immediately whether they use a lighter or not it's just communicated to them that it's a you know a piece of value and and as opposed to like bick lighters which we're all used to um you know yeah we accidentally pocket them all the time and we lose them all the time and it's a very disposable i think there's going to be that's one of the good things that came out of all the environmental craziness which is uh there's there's two sorts of discussions with that which is all the doom stuff that's used for extortion and taxation and all that but then there's actually the conversation that is not being had as a result of all the craziness which is like should we pick

up the garbage and the answer is yes um and i think the impact with people around the world is they're looking to get away from disposable stuff you know we use disposable cups less and paper plates and things like that and I think overall we're trending towards going back to things that you keep for a lifetime yeah I can't wait to be like five to ten years from now and see where you're at because I'm like just so curious to see what what kind of products are going to go into the market and what kind of what kind of creativity that's gonna get out of you because you just do such beautiful things and i think uh yeah i'm curious you participated in a panel at btc prague called um the renaissance

2.0 why bitcoin is the new patron of the arts the original renaissance was funded by merchant wealth and political power what makes bitcoin a different kind of patron well for madex bitcoin was the the first patron with number go up technology and i mean the most immediate difference is that you hold bitcoin long enough it starts to finance your dreams and bitcoin doesn't have an opinion on what you should or should not do so it's a very uh it's the equivalent of receiving the artist's ultimate dream is to receive a blank check with few strings attached for the production of and bitcoin does this you have to be very patient with it but over time it does this that's its its greatest characteristic in the role of a financier

for artists or designers. But I also think that over the years, I often contemplate the sheer scale of wealth in the fiat world that's out there. And when I look into the world and there's some very cool projects out there, but I think that the amount of incredible stuff being done is not proportionate to the amount of fiat money that is out there. And I think that Bitcoin has selected and sort of molded this group of people that are very passionate about projects and Bitcoin will eventually enable them to fulfill their visions with those projects. And as number goes up higher and higher, I just think we'll have more and more Bitcoiners will convert to entrepreneurs and because they care so much and they're financed by Bitcoin,

They don't have to worry about the shareholder problem. So I think pretty well every Bitcoin-backed company and individual going into the future will be able to act entirely off of their heart's desires and off of market desires and have no influence from the parasitic class and be able to create freely, experiment freely. And so at the point that 0.01 Bitcoin becomes enough to finance a company for 20 years, I think we're really going to see an explosion of innovation because that's really what will truly unplug the majority of people. I mean, there's just so few that were able to catch the wave of having a thousand coins or having, you know, 10,000, whatever the number was. Very, very few because pretty much everyone, including myself, was forced to sell along the way. I often joke that the only critical mistake I made in Bitcoin is that I was poor when I discovered it. And so the people who did the best were the ones who were able to discover Bitcoin, buy a bunch of Bitcoin, and they had cash flow businesses and they were making money already and they didn't have to think about it or look about it, look at it. and bitcoin was never a sort of a dream of escape for them whereas for myself and for many early

bitcoiners it was it was a dream of escape that okay you know this will one day improve the quality of my life and so very few people have the means at 10 000 bitcoins even less have it at a thousand even less have it at a hundred even less have it at 10 or sorry the other way more of it at 10 And then at 0.01, we have, I think, a really big explosion of creativity. Beautiful. As you were speaking, I kind of thought, you know, I can see you in 10 years on top of all the projects you have. I can see you running also a branding agency. So all these entrepreneurs that will show up and all these startups that will be in this space, but in a much larger scale than today. you'd probably be the go-to branding house for people to come and say, okay, build my brand. Can you do that?

And of course you can. I don't know if you'd want to, but I can totally see it happening. Yeah, for projects that are aligned with Madex, I'd absolutely love to do that, that are aligned with my pillars of freedom and that are aligned with Bull Bitcoin. That's sort of the ultimate dream at the end of this is to be the person that I needed in my life

for the next generation of entrepreneurs. Right, when you were starting out. When I was starting out. Most everything I built myself, I had some very good influences around me, but because what I've done with Madex and with Bull and all the other projects is so unique and complex, there's not really all the mentor

or all the people I could look up to in the world that have created something. I can only take some elements from each one of them and I think with Madex I'm building something completely new and that will put me in a great position for these projects coming in the future. Because I think the multi-disciplined creator is going to become more and more prevalent, especially with the additions of these computer tools and making these computer tools, making a lot of the steps in production and the steps in design faster. It'll give artists the ability to sort of master multiple disciplines. So these sort of fusion projects that have never been done before are going to multiply. Interesting. I kind of want to ask you how you see AI integrating into art. I'm sure, you know, fiat art we know, I think.

But Bitcoin, what do you think? Yeah, well, AI is a tool, so it will not replace you as the driver. It'll just help you get there. so AI will certainly just increase the value of a creative and original mind because all AI can do is recycle information even when it comes up with something new it is just sort of splitting different ideas together that it already has and many would argue well that's the same thing as creation and I think that those people are in a completely different class than those who are connected to the divine and understand that a reanimated corpse with

the personality of a dead friend is not the same thing as that friend. And these tools will be used to optimize the time of the creator and the artist and will help them to get their visions out faster. I think a lot of creators are sort of black pilling on AI right now, but is the wrong way to look at it because the whole parasitic, they do not want you to find a way out of any traps. And so they want to discourage anybody in pursuit of greatness. And that's why there, I think, is so much push on like, oh, marketing is going to replace all these creative areas and i'll say that the thing like visions are not revealed to ai within a dream that there is a disconnect um whereas oftentimes in my own my own creative goals the answers uh come in the

night or the answers come from i don't know where and i've had moments in my creative journey where i felt a divine connection through the work and i think that's what all creators should be in pursuit of is is bringing their skills uh to the level that they are able to interface with that beyond more freely and more predictably because in the early days when my skills were just developing i was still finding moments where i would feel that interfacing with the divine and where i would feel sort of the universe flowing through me as a conduit to bring something new into existence and as I've become a professional and improved my skills it's just made that connection to the divine more frequent and this is what AI can never do and if you're a creative person

do not be threatened by AI it will never replace you and find ways you can use it as a tool to improve the output of your work and keep making we need it creativity and original thought will be the most valuable commodity now I think and just fiat hasn't recognized it and also into the future and in the past I think it's always been I think it's the that connection to bring something new into the world has always been the most valuable thing to find in a swath of people you're the voice is brought to you by trezor the original bitcoin hardware wallet company pioneering the development of self-custody for crypto assets since 2013 empowering individuals with an open source device enabling beginners and experts to easily and

securely hold their coins i find my trezor super easy to use and recommend it to my friends and family. Enjoy my 5% discount on Trezor products by clicking the link in the show notes and using the code FLAT. I want to introduce you to Abundant Mines because they take a very different approach to Bitcoin mining. Most people buy Bitcoin, but the smart ones mine it straight into self-custody. With Abundant Mines, you can do it without giving up your privacy. Abundant Mines was founded by Bo and Christine Marie Turner, a couple who lost more than half a million dollars to providers making empty promises. Instead of walking away, they built a company that raises the industry standard and puts client first. And that's why I like them. With Abundant Minds, you own your

machines. They never touch your Bitcoin, never skim a revenue share, and you choose your own mining pool. Their customer care is unusual. Clients speak to a real person for self-custody education, privacy consulting, and even visiting their site. They serve clients from around the world, but U.S. investors specifically enjoy a big tax benefit and 100% bonus depreciation. This is more than just mining Bitcoin. It's about freedom, privacy, and purpose. You can book a free strategy call, see how it works, and mine some of your first Bitcoin for free with a special offer for my audience. Learn more on AbundantMines.com. Wow, that's really cool. Yeah, I'm with you. Amen to that. Okay, so speaking of art in Bitcoin, a lot of the artists that I see in this space,

first of all just shout out to anyone who's doing art in bitcoin because i know it's not easy and because i love the passion that this community has but what i do see a lot of is art around the b of the bitcoin and it's a little bit cliche it's like the easy thing i think um to like you know create around that and so my question to you is how do you go beyond that bee and how and and what do you do you think it's like it's legit like that's you know the most known symbol of this industry and it makes sense that we will create around that or do you think there is space to go beyond and we should go beyond we must go beyond okay the b is is great it is a it is the symbol of for those who don't know what i'm talking about the b the b yeah it is the origin

symbol um it has a lot of power but when it comes to art it is the ideas and the principles which the B is backed by, which matter. That's where the why is, why we're doing all of this. That's where the dreams are, what will come next. So the reason I think we have, because I'll use the B in certain ways, but I think the reason we have this feeling with the B just sort of being dropped into artwork is that it's cheap and easy. And it's not deep. It takes a lot more thought and processing to extract and develop and explain the principles behind Bitcoin in an artistic form. So it's a great starting point, but I almost wouldn't even start with it. Like when you're creating what are we making for and who are we making for and i get requests

for stuff with the b all the time i don't make any of it because you know if if you want uh something with just the b you can buy that from china very easily right and what you're paying for with madex is the time and energy that's gone into converting these extremely complex economic and philosophical ideas into symbols that can communicate and advertise the purity of the quest that we're on. And I think everyone who is creative can definitely do it. It's just the bee is like this shortcut. And the market, I don't have any data on how much the market supports that sort of stuff because I've only ever focused on the things I make. But in the same way As I said earlier, that people want real leather, want real cotton clothes, they want authentic experience, that the art that is created and the design work that is done that goes even just one, two, three steps beyond the B, people feel that extra effort.

wealth is in the details and the last two percent of the effort into a project I think is what makes the difference between something that is good and something that is great and it's it's worth it to to to push further and I I think the market will respond well to it it's responded I mean incredible to Madex. I've been told many times that I have no competition and I don't want that because I too am a collector. I too care about quality products and fine things. And so my goal on top of everything else I'm doing with Madex has also been to be a signal of what's possible and to show that the Bitcoin community is willing to invest in products of quality and ideas of quality and things that have taken effort

and send that signal out to other extremely talented makers out there. You know, when it comes to how talented people can be, I think I'm maybe in the middle And I want to attract better and better makers because I want to go to a Bitcoin event or go online or whichever and even outside of Bitcoin, just freedom ideas and show that there's a market and freedom and people with Rand principles and have higher and higher quality stuff be created that's in line with what I believe. And so the principles I'm communicating through Madex and will be working very hard to broadcast through media over the next few years are the same as what I want to find in the market. I'm trying to say that I am also the consumer of these potential ideas. So I really hope that in another few years that I can look around and when in terms of product quality and the amount of thought that's gone into things that, you know, it's not just Fractal and Crypt and Madex and Crypto Graffiti and that there's a whole swath of others. And I will say that I've seen this starting to happen. I met someone new at BTC Prague who had some incredible creations.

And I made a purchase from another artist who has delivered on what I just prophesized and has put a lot of thought into what he's making. And so it's starting it's starting to happen slowly. And I'm taking some big steps with Madex over the next year, which I'm looking to 10x the project and then 100x it. And hopefully that success and especially that success through through film and media will just be a big advertisement for Bitcoin to bring more creative energy into the space and whatever discipline somebody is professional in. Remember that clip you had? I think it was a couple of years ago. I think that was the first time I saw anything from you or about you. It was a clip where you, I don't know if it was yours or Bull or someone else's, but you were on your bike and you had the longer hair, right? Yeah. When was that? Like a few years ago? That was 23. Right, 23. Yeah, the manifesto video you're speaking of.

Right, yes. the made x manifesto yes yes i saw that and i was blown away i was like oh my god they there are amazing people in this industry i didn't know you then it was kind of the beginning of my journey i started around 21 too so that was a year or two later and i was like oh god i gotta meet those people and it didn't even feel real to me that i will one day sit with you and that you'll be my friend you know like I to me I looked at it and it was like wow great production amazing people messaging here and there and I'm looking at it and I go wow this is there is thought behind this I can feel the depth I can feel the quality of the creation of this video even though you're not a

video creator I was really overwhelmed by that video and then when I met you and when I met Francis and I was like okay I get it I understand it's like this thing like people there are some deep people in this community and this is so refreshing so beautiful yeah like thank god it exists it really gave me a lot of hope I think and and something to look forward to as I was starting my journey so yeah maybe maybe we'll even finish this interview with putting that video if you give me the video i will put it in the end yeah great so that people can watch it and maybe be the judge if you think it's as good as i thought i'm working i'm working on the second one right now the follow-up to it okay and um the first one was great but it was uh i realized after

the release that it's very niche there's a lot of very obscure sort of references that tie to what was going on at the time with nfts and uh ordinals and so the next one um not that it disappeared not that we still we still have them yeah yeah the next one will communicate the same messages that power made x but will be uh less niche and for kind of a more broad uh audience more um dialing into freedom and yeah the focus of which working on it now the theme of it is that freedom will always find a way and that sovereign people will always be ahead of the totalitarian state in whatever form it comes.

Since they are a parasitic class, they cannot be their own host, and so we will always be ahead, always. And that gives me a lot of hope, And it is really hard to find that hope. Wait, there's black pill everywhere, right? And I see from being heavily involved in the Bitcoin world and also just observing things that have happened, for example, during the whole virus episode we had recently, the state

put all this law in place. A lot of it fake law, like just marketed law, but that you weren't allowed to go places without certain documentation. And what was incredible to me is that around the world, the ability to produce this documentation outside of the authority that was supposed to be producing it exploded everywhere. And people that the market saw the entrepreneurial opportunity to fix this problem and was so, so ahead of the state and all their efforts. And I think that that will just continue to happen in every every move they make. we're faster and i mean bitcoin is just the only barrier for bitcoin is kind of is the wide adoption but it doesn't need the wide adoption to succeed so it's not even a barrier because just intelligent people will figure out how to use bitcoin period because of market forces

and that will never stop happening and so that so tying it in that's sort of the focus of the video is to communicate the message that free people are always in the lead and will never be overtaken i love that and you said a sentence there the powers that shouldn't be are a parasitic class and as such they have to be you know absorbing or extorting someone else's energy and if we are not that class we will always be ahead because we're the ones that they're trying yeah we're producing the energy we're producing the value did you watch paul rosenberg's uh presentation at bvc prague i i caught a piece of it so he he was right at the end he was saying you're the primal creators yeah you're not the secondary ones yeah yeah that's exactly it right yes yeah i'm money has

to be made before it can be stolen value has to be created before it can be extracted and so i see on a long enough timeline that uh it is impossible for the value creation to stop and the great mission is to cut the thieves out of the equation and we will reach that point with certainty because it's just a it's a it's a part of the process of design it's the part a part of the process of problem solving. It's necessary for progress. We are people who, well, we are species that produces. In order to produce more and compound and grow larger, we have to stop the theft. Bitcoin obviously is an amazing way to do that. Destroys the central banks, destroys fiat, destroys the Federal Reserve, the US dollar, their hegemony. It just wipes it all out.

And in every one of these other freedom pillars, we're destroying their kind of their control and their tentacles coming into productivity with communications like what Start9 doing is just incredible. The data storage is such a weak point in the whole equation and the ability to spy on communications is such a weak point. And there's even Bitcoiners working on building their own phones and building the hardware and just getting unplugged from all these tools. And actually also last night I spoke to a guy who's like rebuilding or re-architecting the Internet itself, like the way we access the Internet. like we don't have to go through an architecture of hierarchy where on the top of the pyramid you have someone holding the access to all ip addresses and granting entities with ip addresses so they can use the internet through through that mechanism they're working on mesh networks that you know can connect us peer-to-peer just like the internet is able to to allow us to to yeah

it's interact with each other it's incredible and when the tools are available last night after the talk with you i'm like oh my god this is like i've been here for five days in btc prague and this is the most exciting thing i've heard yeah and when the tools are available we'll use them The fiat distorts market signals so powerfully that all the large companies in production, there is such a disconnect in what's being made and what the market actually wants. And Bitcoin is just way ahead on identifying these breaks and filling the need. And to have a private server, I think, is mission critical. And Start9 is solving this problem. And it's something that the average person doesn't think about at all.

They just use Google Drive or use iCloud. But the moment you present an alternative that's, hey, you can very simply just run your own iCloud. You can have your own Google Drive and you don't have to worry about your data being on somebody else's computer and being compromised. Every single normie person that I've presented that to has been ready to get started immediately. So what makes you hopeful and bullish? I know it's hard to draw hope for me too. It's like, because we're so aware of everything that's happening and we see what is being built around us.

Yet we have this amazing seed of entrepreneurial people, community that is not stopping and is getting more and more pumped as they are closing in on us as kind of like the yin and yang pushing in different directions, the polarity of our existence, our third-dimensional existence. So when I see that, it makes me bullish. But I don't know, do you draw hope from there? I mean, I draw my bullishness from my own ability

to have reached goals I've set in the past and my pursuit of goals into the future. And that as a driver of my own force into the world, I know that when I reflect on my life and what I've achieved up to this point, that when I set big goals for myself in the future, I have a divine confidence that I will achieve what I've set out. And what makes me most bullish from a community standpoint is the amount of Bitcoiners that are having children. Yes. And how mission critical that is for the future.

Yes. Without what children give you the most is a stake in the future. Yeah. And the Fiaters really do not want us to have kids and there is psyop on every level about having children, about it's bad for the environment, it's expensive, it's this, it's that, and the world, oh, it's just war. Anyways, they're really, really trying to stop it from happening.

They're trying to stop intelligent people from having kids. They're trying to stop rational thinkers from having kids. That's what all the targets are on because if they can keep the intelligence for themselves, then they'll have less threats to their monopolies. But I'll say to anyone who's on the fence about having children that if you do not have kids, you will die alone. In the end of your life, you will be alone and there will be nobody there who cares about you. Over time, all your friends will pass on. All the people you were connected to will pass on.

and at the end of life the only people who will be there for you no matter what are your children and as well we have the ability when we're young to move around and to live and to discover and we have this whole life experience and when we're older we lose our mobilities and we lose our we're not able to do the things that we were able to do when we were young but then we can live vicariously and happily through the adventures and pursuits of our children. And it's critical to your happiness in the future. I think that those who do not wish to have kids think that they will be young forever, that they will live forever. And they don't anticipate this end of life period coming where there will be many years of no news and silence. So I deeply

encourage everyone I meet to take on the challenge and to not overthink it and prepare the future because it'll also motivate you to work harder and fight harder to have a better world for your children and as we've seen and as we have the evidence of that's what our ancestors did for us yeah and it is our obligation duty and responsibility to set up the next generation create the next generation, and make all the effort we can to destroy the forces of evil and corruption in order to enable a better life for them, just as our fathers and forefathers have done for us. Amen. Amen, brother. It's beautiful. Maybe I would just also add that it's just fun. Yeah. Kids are fun. Kids are really fun. And they kind of, you know, you spoke a lot

about your connection to the divine which i also identify with very much i think there is something in kids that is so pure and so raw that they connect us very quickly to why the hell all of this is happening you know and they're like a conduit themselves directly up there yeah it's very uh it's very enlightening and liberating um we have all these sort of control systems and nets that have been placed on us. And right, it is the child that is truly 100% free because no matter what environment the child grows up in, there has been no mental restriction. There has been no invisible walls built for them yet. Their only limitations are in their physical ability and their physical environment. And then we grow and build all these sort of fortresses and protections

and we're influenced by very sophisticated media nets to create walls that are not of our own and protections that are not of our own. And there are many great feelings in life. Some of the top ones for me are to discover a new and exciting piece of information for the first time. And the next is to destroy a barrier within your mind that was not placed by you in the first place. I love those two very much.

Eliminate a wall that you did not construct in your psyche and in your mental and to be able to then unlock a whole area of freedom. I mean, it was said by someone that, you know, you can physically trap them in any environment, but because their mind is free, they can never truly be a prisoner. I think about that a lot with Bitcoin, that, you know, we are operating in a parallel universe. Yeah. And I don't really think that Bitcoin will overturn fiat and replace fiat and maybe on a long enough timeline eventually. But I think in our lifetime, we will just see like an alternate dimension sort of rise up. So you can choose to live your life on a Bitcoin standard empowered by Bitcoin and you will be forced to interact with the fiat world. But as time goes on, your life will just get better and better.

You'll have this angel investor in your dreams and your desires, which is Bitcoin. And you will not have the traps laid out by fiat. You have a really one of fiat's strongest elements is debt. But fiat debt is crippling to fiat man, but it is liberating to Bitcoin man because we're able to take on debt with a smile because of Bitcoin's progression quickly make those debts meaningless in the future. Whereas when fiat, if you're living a fiat life, you're trapped by that debt forever. No matter what it is, you can get locked into a car payment for eternity very easily. So that's extremely exciting. And the parallel society that Bitcoin creates is just going to be

a much brighter place to live in. And I encourage everyone to make the attempt. And many people have old friends that they tried to get into Bitcoin very early. I did because I was a hard evangelist in the early days. And I often say to them now, I'm like, man, just look at where my life is from making this decision and look at where you are. And it might be time to just shut the fuck up and buy the coins and just forget about it shut the fuck up and buy the coins and forget about it what a beautiful sentence to end on and where should people find your beautiful soul creation and inspiration well thank you for having me on here it's been very exciting i think it's my first like professional studio appearance yay um i'm honored yeah you can find me this will

be a collector's item itself yeah yeah yeah um we'll do an nft out of it no we will not we will so not go on so bullbitcoin.com we're available all across europe we're available in canada mexico costa rica colombia argentina switzerland and my personal art project is madex.art there i'm selling fine art i'm selling the regalia and the jewelry and by the way everyone at btc prague were wearing them this year it was just so amazing to see either the open dimes or the How do you call the round ones? I mean, the round ones are just Madex pendants. I don't have a specific name for them.

Yeah, so it's like people were just wearing them in masses. It was fantastic to see. Yeah, it was great. It's becoming more and more mainstream for this non-mainstream community. Yeah, yeah. And it was a bear market and sales went really well. I was completely surprised. Fantastic.

So madex.art. So I have fine art available there and also all of the jewelry and regalia. Everything is purchasable online? Everything's purchasable online, but not everything I have or I'm able to do. I can do custom engagement rings. I'm working on a few of those right now. I can do custom pretty much anything. I can make anything.

I'm a designer and a brilliant creative. and each project i'm working on is designed to prove that to the world so i can take in more commission works and become a part of more larger scale projects and then i'm on twitter and i'm on noster and i'm sure you'll have links yes of course you will give me everything and i will put links um over there wow i just want to tell you how much i love you how much i love your energy how much you inspire me with probably without even knowing like sometimes I just see your stuff out there because you know we meet here and there every few months or once a year and you know I stumble upon something you would do or say and it would kind of remind me once again why this life

is awesome and worth living and people like you really make it so special so thank you for being who you are thank you thank you it really means a lot to hear that and i'm happy we're connected and yeah yeah the future is going to be very exciting it will be it will be awesome because we are the ones building it yes let's go thank you madex i love you yeah a madex manifesto in the realm of creation where the soul's expression finds form in color sound and shape there lies a sacred covenant between the artist and their craft this manifesto is a declaration of fidelity to that covenant a refusal to succumb to the siren calls of mediocrity and avarice, which threaten to corrupt the pure

essence of our work. We stand at a crossroads where the path of integrity diverges sharply from the road paved with gold, but lined with the hollow shells of compromised vision and deluded passion. The charlatan, cloaked in the guise of opportunity, beckons us towards the latter, promising riches and acclaim in exchange for the very soul of our artistry this manifesto is our resolute answer we will not be swayed art in its highest form is an unyielding quest for truth and beauty

a journey inward to the depths of the human experience and outward to the vastness of our collective imagination. It is both a mirror reflecting the world as it is, and a window to what it could be. To reduce this sacred pursuit to mere commodity, to churn out soulless creations for the sake of profit, is an affront to the creative spirit that dwells within each of us. The charlatan preys upon our fears and insecurities, whispering of a world where survival hinges on conformity and success is measured in material wealth. But we know that the true value of art cannot be quantified by currency or popularity. It is found in the moments of connection and understanding, in the shared humanity that emerges from the

canvas, the page, the melody. Therefore, we reject the false promises of easy fortune and fleeting fame. Our commitment is to the enduring legacy of quality and depth, to works that challenge, inspire, and move the human soul. We pledge to uphold the standards of excellence that have guided the masters of our past, even in the face of a culture that increasingly values the quick and the cheap over the timeless and the profound. Let this manifesto serve as a beacon to all who believe in the transformative power of art. in defiance of the charlatan's temptation we choose the path of resistance the road less

traveled fraught with challenges but rich with rewards our creations will not be the product of compromise but the embodiments of our most authentic selves and our deepest truths in solidarity with artists everywhere who labor in the name of beauty and truth we stand firm in our resolve we will not dilute our visions or betray our talents for the sake of convenience or profit our art will remain a testament to the indomitable spirit of creation a light that no darkness of mediocrity can extinguish let this manifesto be our vow to never falter in our dedication to the craft to always strive for the pinnacle of artistic achievement, and to live and create in a manner worthy of the gifts we have been bestowed.

In the face of temptation, we hold fast to our principles, for in the end, it is not the applause of the present, but the respect of posterity we seek. Our legacy will not be one of compromise, but of unyielding commitment to the excellence and integrity that define the true essence of art. Lastly, please share this with your friends so they can also get value and choose to take some positive action. Till next time.