48 Hours - "48 Hours" Presents: Murder at Sea?

Episode Date: July 5, 2015

Devastated after the FBI bows out of the case, the family of missing cruise ship honeymooner George Smith vows to fight for answers. "48 Hours" correspondent Richard Schlesinger updates the case.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to this podcast ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app today. Even if you love the thrill of true crime stories as much as I do, there are times when you want to mix it up. And that's where Audible comes in, with all the genres you love and new ones to discover. Explore thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. Listening to Audible can lead to positive change in your mood, your habits,

and even your overall well-being. And you can enjoy Audible anytime, while doing household chores, exercising, commuting, you name it. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial and your first audiobook is free. Visit audible.ca. In 2014, Laura Heavlin was in her home in Tennessee when she received a call from California. Her daughter, Erin Corwin, was missing. The young wife of a Marine had moved to the California desert

to a remote base near Joshua Tree National Park. They have to alert the military. And when they do, the NCIS gets involved. From CBS Studios and CBS News, this is 48 Hours NCIS. Listen to 48 Hours NCIS ad-free starting October 29th on Amazon Music. 48 Hours presents. On July 5th, it will be 10 years since George Smith disappeared from his honeymoon cruise. His family has been on a mission to find those responsible, but their long quest for justice is now in jeopardy. You can't look at the water and at the sea without remembering what happened to George.

It's got too many bad memories for me now. Oh, I miss him. I miss him every day. I miss his voice. I miss him every day. I miss his voice. I miss his phone calls. He called me all the time. I just miss him as a son. Pretty much every night I go to bed,

I see his face. No parent should have to lose their son that way. This is Captain Michael. May I get your attention please? A person may have gone overboard last night. I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that my son was murdered on that cruise ship. There's so much evidence. It's overwhelming.

It's just been a complete and awful nightmare for my family. And we still do not have justice for George. The first suspect is the surviving spouse. She said she couldn't remember anything. Eyebrows started to go up about, well, what exactly did Jennifer know? But the FBI soon turned its attention from George Smith's widow to a group of young men, the last people to see George alive. There were sounds of a fight, a struggle inside my brother's room. I heard some males arguing on the balcony.

What we're trying to do is sort through the facts and figure out what happened that night because unfortunately this has become pretty much a cold case. While on the cruise, did you meet George Smith IV? There was a series of questions that I asked in each of the depositions of each of the boys. Do you know what happened to George Smith? Were you present when George Smith went overboard? Did you kill George Smith?

Something crazy went down that night. And I hope one day that they find out the truth. A 48 H hours investigation has uncovered failed polygraphs, questionable alibis, and a provocative video made by some of the men just hours after George Smith disappeared. On the videotape, you've got them joking about George's death. Very callous and at one point incriminating. I just can't comprehend that someone could snatch my brother from a cruise ship,

throw him on an overhang, and dies alone in the water, and then nothing's done about it. The evidence is huge. Why hasn't someone been arrested? . I'm Richard Schlesinger. Tonight on 48 Hours, murder at sea. . In the Pacific Ocean, halfway between Peru and New Zealand, lies a tiny volcanic island. It's a little-known British territory called Pitcairn, and it harboured

a deep, dark scandal. There wouldn't be a girl on Pitcairn once they reached the age of 10 that would still have heard it. It just happens to all of them. I'm journalist Luke Jones, and for almost two years, I've been investigating a shocking story that has left deep scars on generations of women and girls from Pitcairn. When there's nobody watching, nobody going to report it, people will get away with what they can get away with. In the Pitcairn Trials, I'll be uncovering a story of abuse and the fight for justice that has brought a unique, lonely Pacific island to the brink of extinction.

Listen to the Pitcairn Trials exclusively on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. As a kid growing up in Chicago, there was one horror movie I was too scared to watch. It was called Candyman. It was about this supernatural killer who would attack his victims if they said his name five times into a bathroom mirror. But did you know that the movie Candyman was partly inspired by an actual murder? I was struck by both how spooky it was, but also how outrageous it was. Listen to Candyman, the true story behind

the bathroom mirror murder, early and ad-free, with a 48-hour plus subscription on Apple Podcasts. Sometimes you still think, ah, he might be still out there. Because we don't have a body. We don't have a body. It doesn't get any easier. And you know what? If we had our answers for George and know what happened, maybe. We don't know. For 10 years, Maureen and George Smith have been tormented. They don't know what happened to their 26-year-old son aboard that cruise ship.

We have to just keep pushing the buttons and we won't let it go. It's our son. It wasn't supposed to be this way. George Smith IV had seemed destined to have it all. Fine young man, handsome, hardworking. He was just an all-around great kid. He was the funniest guy, you know. I would sit and have a couple beers with him and he'd make me laugh for the whole night. And besides, he was so good-looking, the girls just fell all over him. It was a lot of fun. He was just a great guy. George was about to take over his father's liquor store in Greenwich, Connecticut. George made the store. He was much more of a lively guy than I and loved to talk and he had that gusto in him and he really wanted to take the store and build it.

Stop by today. This is George working alongside his father in a local commercial. He always called me the old man because I wasn't into modern tools and techniques like he was. So I was the old man. I was the dinosaur that he had to deal with. George's future seemed even brighter when he met Jennifer Hagel, an aspiring school teacher. I was overwhelmed with her because she had this dynamic personality. She was very fun-loving like him, very attractive, and he was very happy with her. With this ring. After a three-year courtship... I thee win.

George and Jennifer were married in a ceremony overlooking the sea. It was a really lavish affair in Newport, Rhode Island. It was a storybook wedding. It was absolutely beautiful. George's older sister, Bree, remembers the day very well and how excited they were to go on their honeymoon. They were so excited to be starting their life together and they couldn't wait to start their cruise.

I can remember shaking his hand in the street and saying goodbye to him. No one could ever imagine that just less than two weeks later George would be missing. Just less than two weeks later, George would be missing. In late June 2005, Royal Caribbean's Brilliance of the Seas set sail from Barcelona. The footage you see is from a sister ship. Fellow honeymooners Paul and Galina Kvitnitsky were on board with the Smiths. We sat down next to one another, and the first day we became acquainted. The couples hit it off immediately. They were really great. I mean, they were just very normal, down-to-earth, happy people. I would say we spent a lot of time

together. They loved the sights. I remember they were taking a lot of pictures. Like, they were like always with the camera. And back on the ship, they socialized into the early morning hours. I think he enjoyed himself a lot, you know, having a drink or two. He didn't have a good tolerance for alcohol. Like, you could see he would have, like, four beers, and, you know, you could see that he was pretty much drunk. Around midnight on July 5th, the two couples headed for the casino. It would be the last night of George's life.

Jennifer, who's seen here on casino security cameras, spent much of her time at the blackjack table. And George, who was also captured on tape, headed for his usual spot at the craps table. He was just having fun at the table, and you could see that right away. George was soon joined at the table by another shipboard acquaintance, California college student Josh Askin. 48 Hours spoke to Josh in 2006.

Hung out with him for a little bit, nothing too in-depth. Jennifer played a little blackjack, played a little craps with George. There were a lot of other people around as well who we'd met on the cruise so far. And a group of Russian-American students were also making the rounds that night. Cousins Zachary and Greg Rosenberg and their friend Rusty Kaufman. Zachary and Greg Rosenberg, and their friend, Rusty Kaufman. Josh had met them on the cruise as well. Everyone who was over 18 pretty much congregated in the casino. Everyone was in high spirits.

And George and Jennifer were high rolling. At one point, George, who's seen here at the casino with Josh, went back to his own cabin to get extra cash for Jennifer. I think George looked prosperous. Additionally, had a really nice watch, which was a Breitling watch, was worth a bit of money. And Bree Smith wonders if someone on the ship was getting the wrong idea about her brother. People may have made assumptions that George was a millionaire, even though he wasn't. brother. People may have made assumptions that George was a millionaire, even though he wasn't. And one thing that was clear to Paul that night was that by the time the casino closed, both Jennifer and George were already drunk. And I just remember telling him,

it's time to call it a night. It's time to call it a night. Paul wishes his new friend had listened. Two hours later, George Smith would be gone. Hot shot Australian attorney Nicola Gaba was born into legal royalty. Her specialty? Representing some of the city's most infamous gangland criminals. However, while Nicola held the underworld's darkest secrets, the most dangerous secret was her own. She's going to all the major groups

within Melbourne's underworld and she's informing on them all. I'm Marsha Clark, host of the new podcast, Informants Lawyer X. In my long career in criminal justice as a prosecutor and defense attorney, I've seen some crazy cases, and this one belongs right at the top of the list. She was addicted to the game she had created.

She just didn't know how to stop. Now, through dramatic interviews and access, I'll reveal the truth behind one of the world's most shocking legal scandals. Listen to Informant's Lawyer X exclusively on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify, and listen to more Exhibit C true crime shows early and ad-free right now. Have you ever wondered who created that bottle of sriracha that's living in your fridge? Or why nearly every house in America has at least one game of Monopoly. Introducing the best idea yet, a brand new podcast from Wondery and T-Boy about

the surprising origin stories of the products you're obsessed with and the bold risk takers who brought them to life. Like, did you know that Super Mario, the best-selling video game character of all time, only exists because Nintendo couldn't get the rights to Popeye? Or Jack, that the idea for the McDonald's Happy Meal first came from a mom in Guatemala? From Pez dispensers to Levi's 501s to Air Jordans, discover the surprising stories of the most viral products. Plus, we guarantee that after listening,

you're going to dominate your next dinner party. So follow The Best Idea Yet on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to The Best Idea Yet early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. It's just the best idea yet. As the sun rose over Kusadasi, Turkey on July 5, 2005, 16-year-old Emily Rausch stepped onto her balcony to snap some photos. It was around 7.30 in the morning, and I noticed something on the overhang of the lifeboats. Instead of a spectacular sunrise, Emily's camera captured this. A huge bloodstain on the lifeboat canopy.

This is Emily's account from back then. I just assumed that someone had died there. Security quickly determined the occupants of room 9062 were unaccounted for and snapped these pictures of the room. And then they began paging the Smiths. I had a state room attendant outside my room and I said, you know, you should probably go into that guy's room and wake him up because he's not going to hear that page because he was probably still sleeping. because he's not going to hear that page because he was probably still sleeping. In another cabin, Paul and Galena were startled by a visit from ship personnel.

And that's when the guy came in and he said, have you seen George? And I'm like, what do you mean, have I seen George? And we said, what's going on? And he kind of told us he's missing. We're like, missing? By now, they had been summoned to guest relations. Jennifer was also there. She'd been located at the ship's spa, getting a scheduled massage. The crew soon delivered the crushing news that her new husband, George, was presumed overboard. She just kept saying that she doesn't remember what happened. I can't remember. I can't understand. I don't remember.

Jennifer said she had almost no memory after leaving the casino and that when she had awakened in the cabin, George wasn't there. She had just assumed George stayed with Paul and Galena. She's shocked and panicked, and she doesn't understand what's going on. She just kept saying that, I want to call my dad, I want to call my dad. Half a world away, in Connecticut, the Smiths were trying to absorb the shock from the call from Jennifer's dad. It's disbelief.

You know, we just couldn't believe it. He's got to be on the boat. But the Smiths had not yet been told about that bloodstain or the investigation now underway on the brilliance of the seas. Turkish police had boarded the ship. Royal Caribbean documented the forensic investigation. And in the ship's lobby, they rounded up Josh Askin and the group of Russian-Americans, Rusty Kaufman and Zach and Greg Rosenberg. They had all partied with George the night before.

JOSHUA COFFMAN, I just didn't know what was going on. I knew I did nothing wrong, and that's all that mattered to me. PAUL SOLMAN, This video, secretly recorded by Josh's father, shows the police interview. Rusty Kaufman on the right appears to be shocked when he hears about the blood. It's crazy. The video only captures snippets of what has emerged over the years as a very complex story. A story and a timeline that would be dissected and debated for years. Can we drop him off?

Yes, sir. We closed the door. We never saw him again. Never saw him again. I just started. I'm done. Never saw him again. The young man's account begins at 2.30 a.m. after the casino closed.

It was on an elevator to the disco where Josh says he noticed some odd behavior from casino manager Lloyd Bota. There was maybe a time when Lloyd, the casino manager, put his arm around Jennifer and we thought a little awkward moment. It was just a little awkward for a second. At the disco, the party was in full swing and the guys smuggled in a bottle of a potent liquor called Absinthe. They weren a potent liquor called Absinthe. They were having shots of Absinthe. They were having shots. Albert Diane represents Rusty Kaufman. We spoke to him in 2006, and Diane says

there was tension between George and Jennifer at the disco. Rusty does not hear what is being said, but he does observe Jennifer kick George in his groin. Jennifer stormed out of the disco, and according to Zach, Rusty, and Josh, the casino manager followed after her. Josh would emphatically make this point when questioned by Turkish police later. She has no idea what happened. She was with another man, the casino manager, Lloyd. You need to get him in here. The men claim they didn't know where Lloyd and Jennifer went, but by 3.30 a.m., the disco was closing,

and George was in bad shape. George was kind of slumped over in a chair. I asked my buddies, will you help me take him home real quick? When they are walking to the cabin, they are literally carrying George. At 3.52 a.m., the guys entered the Smiths' cabin. The ship's key entry log records the time, but Jennifer is not there.

Did you see her? No, she wasn't there. she wasn't in the room. George all of a sudden expresses a wish to go search for his wife. And at this time, the boys are having a loud discussion, debate about whether they should go and assist George. The group heads out again, and after a brief search of the ship's solarium, they return George to

his cabin at 4 o 1 a.m. I went to the restroom right when we went in I probably saw him for like a minute 30 seconds they actually lay George on his bed take off his shoes and he displays a tremendous gratitude towards these young men in fact he hugs and kisses one or two of these young men. Just remember, not at one point or no time did he ever seem angry or anything at all. But shortly after 4 a.m., passenger Cleet Hyman, a vacationing deputy police chief, hears a disturbance next door. My wife and I were awakened by yelling coming from the Smith cabin. This yelling sounded what I would liken to a drinking game. A few minutes later...

Suddenly, though, there was an argument out on the Smith balcony. This argument appeared to be between three, maybe four male individuals. But Rusty's lawyer insists that the men never went out on the balcony. After about two minutes of the argument, we heard one lone male voice repeatedly say, good night, good night, like they were ushering someone out of the room. I looked out and saw three male individuals walking away from the room. Three males walking away? Then where was the fourth man? Diane insists all four men

left together. Rusty is a pretty wide type of a young man. I believe that the witness just failed to observe the fourth one. What Cleet Hyman hears next would become the subject of endless speculation. Next would become the subject of endless speculation. Was George alone in the room? At this point, we heard just a lone male voice in the room. We heard what sounded like the cupboard doors being closed loudly and also sounded like furniture being moved. Greg and Pat Lawyer, in the cabin on the other side of the Smiths hear something similar. There was what I call trashing of the room sounds. I thought somebody was throwing furniture around, either

mad or having a good time, so we dismissed it at that point. After about two minutes of total silence, however, there was a large, what I would call a horrific thud. That thud is believed to be the sound of George Smith hitting the metal canopy at around 4 30 a.m. About that same time, Jennifer is found passed out in a hallway. As for the men, they say they were all back in their cabin ordering a lion's share of room service. Room service. We ordered room service. They were definitely in their own cabin, in Zach's and Rusty's cabin, ordering food at that time. But as it would turn out,

the young men's alibi would be called into question. It doesn't hold up at all. As the details surrounding George Smith's disappearance emerged, so had speculation about his bride, Jennifer. Was George murdered? Was Jennifer somehow involved? The widow went on Oprah to defend herself. Not only to lose your memory, but then to have nobody believe you. I don't know what happened. And Jennifer wasn't the only one in the spotlight.

What about the Ruskies in this story, the Russians? What are these three guys hanging around a honeymoon couple for? Well, I mean, obviously. Did he fall overboard? Was he pushed overboard? They found this big blood stain. It's a CSI story that keeps unfolding by the day. overboard. They found this big blood stain. It's a CSI story that keeps unfolding by the day. The FBI would begin an investigation that would span nine and a half years. At the time, the ship's captain described it as a likely accident, theorizing that an intoxicated George sat on the railing and simply fell off. The Smiths never bought the accident theory.

The blood is compelling evidence. There was blood in the room. Photographs taken by Royal Caribbean inside the Smith cabin revealed two small lines of blood on the bedsheets. The Smiths say it was George's blood and another sign pointing to foul play. In addition to the blood, there were sounds of a fight, a struggle inside my brother's room. The Smiths hoped that getting access to Royal Caribbean's investigative case files would provide some answers. So that shows the room. And they brought on attorney Mike Jones to help them.

Then you got the blood spot. What it's not about is an accident, and what it's not about is a suicide. It's about a murder. Jones immediately got to work, setting his sights on the ship's documents and the four men last seen with George. I took Josh Askin's deposition first.

Do you know if George Smith was murdered? Invoke my Fifth Amendment right. Do you know who killed George Smith? Invoke my Fifth Amendment right. That's a yes or no answer. Josh Askin took the Fifth. I invoke my Fifth Amendment right. On everything.

Invoke my Fifth Amendment right. Invoke my Fifth Amendment right. Invoke my Fifth Amendment right. In late June of 2005, did you go on a Royal Caribbean cruise with your family? I invoke my Fifth Amendment right. My Fifth Amendment right. In late June of 2005, did you go on a Royal Caribbean cruise with your family? I evoked my Fifth Amendment right. I had him take the Fifth as to his date of birth, his name. Attorney Keith Greer represents Josh Askin. And so I told him, the only way we're going to do this, Josh,

is if every single question you're asked, you plead the Fifth. Greer says that Josh has always been cooperative, speaking freely to everyone. But there came a point when he had to shut him down because the feds were getting aggressive. And they have told us that if Josh ever says anything that is different than what he said before in the grand jury, anything, they will fly him back to Connecticut on perjury charges. I couldn't have that happen. Attorney Albert Diane says Rusty Kaufman got the same treatment and has stopped cooperating with the FBI.

And the more he wanted to speak with them, the more he wanted to tell them what happened, the more they accused him of foul play. You don't think that's the truth? I do. During his deposition, Rusty Kaufman didn't plead the fifth, but his memory on a lot of things seemed a bit rusty. When you say we put him to bed, who put him in the bed?

I don't have a recollection of that right now. Josh said that he was, he actually used the bathroom at that point. Do you remember that? I don't have a recollection of that okay when exactly my name is Michael Jones Zachary Rosenberg also invoked his right against self incrimination was there any commotion in the room I'd like to invoke my Fifth Amendment right the only one who appeared forthcoming was Greg Rosenberg in 2010 Mike Jones found him in a Florida prison. Why are you here in prison?

Trafficking. Greg was serving three years for trafficking in oxycodone. He says to support his expensive taste. I'm a fanatic for clothes, jewelry, watches. That's why I'm in here, man. Murder's a different deal. Murder's a different deal, man. I don't have it in my heart to kill nobody, man. Did you have anything to do with George's death?

No. Never did. Never would. Never thought about it. No. Greg brought up that room service party. All right, what did you eat? Tuna fish sandwiches. I know that. We had, like, tuna fish sandwiches and... I think cheeseburgers. I know we had something that fast food type. We were infatuated with the fact that we can order whatever we want.

They ordered so much food and they couldn't have killed George because they were in the room eating the room service. I mean, it's a nice story, but it doesn't work. In 2010, Mike Jones finally got his hands on those Royal Caribbean internal documents. The room service party is pretty much blown by the information we got from Roker. I mean, that's a big fact. The ship's records show that although several short calls were made from Zach and Rusty's cabin to room service after 4.13 a.m., there is no record of any order of any kind. The handwritten records show that the room service was never delivered.

Was it human error they didn't write it down? Keith Greer insists the room service party did take place, but it was never really an alibi to begin with, since the food would have been delivered after George went missing. The food service itself doesn't prove that they were in a certain place at the time George went missing. The food service itself doesn't prove that they were in a certain place at the time George went over,

because George goes over about 4.20 in the morning. So at that point in time, really the only alibi they have is each other. If the ship's records raise some questions about where the men say they were that night, they also cast doubt on where they implied Jennifer was. Remember the casino manager the guys said she left with at the disco? She was with another man.

The casino manager would. And that didn't happen. That just didn't happen. Other witnesses say Lloyd did not leave with Jennifer, That just didn't happen. Other witnesses say Lloyd did not leave with Jennifer, and key records show that he entered his girlfriend's cabin at 3.25 a.m. while the Smiths were still in the disco. And he had gone to his girlfriend's room, and she was able to corroborate that. So I think Lloyd became the victim of this attempt by the Russians

and by Josh Askin to deflect attention from themselves. As for Jennifer, several witnesses saw her leave the disco alone and unsteady at 3.30 a.m. There are some witnesses from the cruise ship, cruise ship employees, that actually escorted her onto the elevator and tried to help her get off the elevator on her floor before she ended up going the wrong way on deck nine. An hour later, Jennifer was found passed out in that hallway around the time George went overboard. Lloyd Bota and Jennifer both passed FBI polygraphs.

People that the Russians and Josh were pointing fingers at both came through very cleanly on their polygraphs. The four men are still on the FBI's radar, and the discovery of a homemade videotape only raises more suspicion. It's ridiculously provocative. Unfortunately, obviously, after eight years, this has become pretty much a cold case. For the last few years, Mike Jones has been trying to reignite a case he believes has gone cold in the Connecticut FBI office. If you talk to the FBI, they'll say it's active and open, but I don't really believe that. And Jones also doesn't believe the account of the four young men last seen with George Smith.

When you left George in his bed, all you guys left, no one stayed behind. Nobody stayed behind. When you left George in his bed, all you guys left, no one stayed behind? Nobody stayed behind. We all left. There's a lot of evidence to suggest that that was not as simple as the Russian men and as Josh have said. You look at the behavior of these young men. They're not good boys or good Samaritans. Royal Caribbean documents show complaints were made against some of the men for smoking, sneaking liquor, and verbally abusing ship employees. They were dropping F-bombs on the room service people. And two days after George Smith went overboard, an 18-year-old passenger came forward with a major allegation of sexual assault.

She stated that she was in one of the Russians' rooms and that there was group sex with was in one of the Russians' rooms and that there was group sex with her with some of the Russians. In the woman's statement, she says she was completely intoxicated and in between blackouts, remembers having non-consensual sex with Greg Rosenberg, Rusty Kaufman, and Jeffrey Rosenberg, Zach Rosenberg's younger brother. And they actually videotaped the group sex. And the fact that they videotaped themselves doing this, I mean, who does that?

Rusty's lawyer says the sex was consensual. That whole escapade was non-criminal in nature. The tape itself revealed that. Josh's lawyer, Keith Greer, says Josh did not have sex with the young woman, but he was there. Josh walks into the room and there's one of the Russian boys having sex on the bed with the girl and another one of the boys filming it. And Josh was concerned. It became clear to him very quickly that the boys weren't taking advantage of her. The girl was taking advantage of the boys. Before he left CBS News to rejoin the New York City

Police Department, John Miller investigated the case for 48 hours. People who have seen that videotape have told me that the person holding the camera is doing kind of a narration and asking her questions and she's responding to them but as this continues she's crying i haven't heard anything about any crying from anyone royal caribbean had had enough and rounded up all of the young men and their families for a tense meeting with the ship's lawyer. Josh Haskins' father was, again, recording. The FBI has asked us to detain your sons. We're going to have to ask you to put your — have your sons go to their cabins, and they're going to have to remain there.

The group angrily denied the allegations. They're ready for the lawsuit. Quiet! Quiet, please. This is life. Everything is life. The four men and their families were then removed from the ship in Naples, where Italian police looked into the rape allegation and washed their hands of it, saying they had no jurisdiction. No one has ever been charged in the sexual incident, and lawyers for the men believe the tape saved them. But for that tape, they could have been charged for something that they did not commit. But that tape may come back to haunt them. The tape in the FBI's possession contained something else, a lunch meeting filmed by the Russian Americans just hours after George went overboard. Josh Askin was not present. They pass a video camera around filming themselves commenting about George's death in a very callous

way, and they're laughing and joking very callously about him being wealthy. And certainly the way they were talking, they either knew or they had a pretty good sense of what had happened. A source close to the investigation has told CBS News that on the tape, one of the men, Rusty Kaufman, refers to George going parachute riding off his balcony. It is not an admission, but it is, at the very least, provocative. And there's more. The really sort of incriminating statement is one of them stands up at the end of the tape and sort of hunches his shoulders and flashes gang signs and says, told you I was gangsta. And that's in the context of the discussion about George's death,

almost as if he's bragging about having done something to George. Jones says that young man was Greg Rosenberg. I just don't understand how the FBI could have had this tape in their possession, and still we sit here. Get the guys in there. Question them. Lawyers for Zach Rosenberg and Rusty Kaufman declined to comment on the video. In the spring of 2013, John Miller tried to see if Rusty himself could provide any more answers. There's a statement made on videotape where you say George went parachute riding off his balcony. I have no comment. Please, please contact my lawyer and then we can arrange a time to speak.

Greg Rosenberg's lawyer says Greg didn't know George was dead at that point and that his client was just making a stupid comment. I don't think they're kidding around. It's just not something you would just come out and say you're kidding around because if you didn't do it, why would you be saying it? But if George was murdered, the question has always been why? Mike Jones believes there is finally enough evidence to piece it all together. The first thing you look at is motive, okay? George and Jennifer dressed well. George had a very expensive Breitling watch. They sort of flashed the money in the casino.

What's more, witnesses heard George and Jennifer saying they had thousands of dollars in their cabin. And this got around because there were other passengers not within the circle, the Russians and Josh, who heard the rumors about the money in the cabin. We don't believe it was true, but perception is everything. Jones believes that perception fueled a robbery attempt, one that was hatched when they put George to bed and Josh had gone into the bathroom. The theory would be that they were arguing about whether or not one of them or two of them should stay behind

and see if they could find the money and take the watch, because George was in no position to argue or to put up a fight. That arguing, Mike believes, is what Cleet Hyman heard on the balcony. Jones also believes his theory fits with what Hyman saw, just three men leaving. And one of them stays behind, starts to rifle through the drawers and the cabinets. He has a possible explanation for the blood stain. The blood is on the sheets. The blood is in two sort of centimeter long splashes. And almost looks like if you were taking off a watch and you pinched your skin, it would be compatible with the blood splatter that

was on the bed. While they're doing that, George wakes up, says, what are you doing? Fight ensues, which is consistent with the noises that people on both sides of the cabin heard. And George goes overboard. Other people hear the loud thud. Josh Askin's lawyer, Keith Greer, argues that is all nothing more than speculation. Even Cleet Hyman, he even said that he did not hear the sounds that you would expect if there was a fight. You know, you dirty so-and-so, the smacking, the kicking and stumbling and yelling of two guys going at each other in a fist fight. I just don't think it makes sense. Greer thinks that there's a simpler explanation for all that took place aboard the brilliance of the seas, the sex assault claim, and George going overboard. I don't know why everybody's missing the Seas, the sex assault claim, and George going overboard.

I don't know why everybody's missing the theme here, because there's one common element, and it's too much alcohol. And we can go and, you know, blame it on murder and blame it on aggressive sexual behavior here. You know what? It's just everybody drinking too much and stupid stuff happening. That fits. But does it fit with what Josh Askin was heard saying on an elevator? Mike Jones is a persistent man, and he believes his persistence will one day pay off. It's just a question of pulling together enough evidence to get an indictment and a conviction. Jones and the Smiths maintain

the key to solving the case lies in California. Our theory is that Josh Askin knows what happened, but we don't believe that Josh was involved in the actual tossing of George overboard. To support his theory, Jones is pointing to an intriguing clue uncovered by Royal Caribbean. A ship employee overheard Josh Askin speaking to a friend on an elevator. He said, I know more than they think I know. Those a**holes almost got me arrested in Turkey. Keith Greer argues the comments were taken out

of context and Josh has nothing to hide. Do you think that Josh Askin has told you everything he knows? Absolutely. No doubt. But Greer admits the FBI told Josh he failed a polygraph. Greer questions the test and the result. I think it's another rubber hose ploy, you know, where just to freak Josh out and upset him more, I think it was just the psychological war that they were waging on him and his family, or they didn't take the time to do it right, one or the other. Sources tell CBS News Rusty Kaufman also was tested, one or the other. Sources tell CBS News Rusty Kaufman also was tested and he too failed. Greg Rosenberg was administered a private polygraph test. I took a polygraph. You did take one? Yeah, it was inconclusive because I'm ADHD because you could tell I like to move a lot.

It was inconclusive. There ain't no lies that I need to tell. Generally, it's much easier to tell the actual lie on your own. 48 Hours decided to bring in Phil Houston, a former CIA case officer who, for more than two decades, specialized in detecting deception. We asked him to take a closer look at those depositions. Is there anybody of the group that particularly jumps out? That's the honest truth. Greg stands out above and beyond everyone. There was just a ton of deceptive behaviors. You can't judge a book by its cover.

In Houston's opinion, it's not what Greg Rosenberg says that seems deceptive. It is often what he doesn't say. What we should hear and see his focus on is, I didn't do it. It wasn't me. You got the wrong guy. Instead, we don't. Where we hear his focus so many times are reasons why he wouldn't do this. But in no way, shape, or form would I ever do anything like that

to an individual. No reason that's not me. And it appears some questions are more difficult for Greg than others. Did they find anything in either room that was connected to George's disappearance? He hesitates. He's clearly thinking. The question has thrown him for a loop. It's almost, what could they have found that would have connected someone to the disappearance? No. Okay.

No, of course not. And then it's like as he thinks through it, he realizes I've got to answer the question. So he goes, well, no, no. So he's thinking about something that is not going to come out in his answer. That's correct. That's correct. Something he's not sharing. But Greg doesn't hold back on the one thing the Smiths would agree with.

He says George's death was no accident. George Allen Smith did not disappear or kill himself or hurt himself or slip and fall off a boat at 6'4", however tall he is, and just dive off. I know that didn't happen. Something crazy went down that night and I hope one day that they find out the truth. In the years following George's death, Jennifer has remarried and tried to move on. But for the Smiths, it's not so easy. In 2014, they announced they are offering a reward, $100,000, for information that leads directly

to the arrest and conviction of whoever is responsible. We're hoping with this $100,000 reward, this might just be the thing that we need to get the arrest, to get the convictions. Until the day this case is solved, the Smiths vow not to let George's memory die on that ship. There you go, Georgie. We'll get justice. We'll get justice. Somehow. Somehow we'll get justice for George.

Somebody will talk. And shame on them that don't. Shame on the people that have put us through this hell. On January 9th, 2015, smith family suffered yet another blow the fbi announced they were officially closing the case on george smith the fbi has determined that there is not sufficient evidence to continue the investigation when we were called in for the meeting that finally closed the case down, it was just devastating to my family. How do you collect 97,000 pages of an investigation to determine after almost 10 years that an accident may have occurred? Still, the family stands by that $100,000 reward, and they still believe it was murder.

The money that was going to be left to George, we thought that since he wasn't going to be here to get that money, somebody else could use it to help our family. We're hoping to generate more leads with the reward and we're hoping the FBI will reopen the investigation. But the toll is great. I never expected to be 67 and still sitting here trying to get answers for my son. It's sad. We should be on with our life, but we're not. They could say there's no conclusive evidence. They could

shut down the investigation, but they're not going to shut down me, and I'm going to continue until there is answers and justice for George. for George. Anyone with information should call 1-844-651-1936. The Smith family is pushing for a bill to require cruise ships to be equipped with man overboard technology. If you like this podcast, you can listen ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a quick survey at wondery.com slash survey.