48 Hours - Live to Tell: The Railroad Killer

Episode Date: May 16, 2024

Holly Dunn tells her account of the August 29, 1997 attack on the railroad tracks by the University of Kentucky. Chris Maier was killed and Holly Dunn, who was stabbed, beaten and raped, miraculously survived her injuries. Fourteen months after Holly’s attack, Dr. Claudia Benton was murdered inside her Houston, TX area home, located near railroad tracks. Lexington Detective Craig Sorrell received a call from ViCAP, a national crime registry database, linking the crimes. Through fingerprint analysis, they identified a suspect. This classic "48 Hours" episode last aired on 8/3/2013. Watch all-new episodes of “48 Hours” on Saturdays, and stream on demand on Paramount+.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to this podcast ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app today. Even if you love the thrill of true crime stories as much as I do, there are times when you want to mix it up. And that's where Audible comes in, with all the genres you love and new ones to discover. Explore thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. Thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. Listening to Audible can lead to positive change in your mood, your habits, and even your overall well-being. And you can enjoy Audible anytime, while doing household chores, exercising, commuting, you name it.

There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial, and your first audiobook is free. Visit audible.ca. It was 1989 in Titusville, Florida. Kim Halleck said she and her ex-boyfriend Chip Flynn were kidnapped and attacked at gunpoint. Kim fled the scene, but Chip didn't make it out alive. Did you kill Chip Flynn? No, ma'am. Crosley Green has lived more than half his life behind bars for a crime he says he didn't commit. I'm Erin Moriarty of 48 Hours, and of all the cases I've covered, this is the one that troubles me most, involving an eyewitness account that doesn't quite make sense. A sister testifying against a brother.

They always say lies. You can't remember lies. A lack of physical evidence and questions about whether Crosley Green was accused, arrested and convicted because he's black. Just because a white female says a black man has committed a crime, we take that as gospel. Listen to Murder in the Orange Grove, the troubled case against Crosley Green, early and ad-free on Wondery Plus and the Wondery app. I began writing as a process of healing. The writing I found really helped me deal with what had happened. Since as far back as I can remember, I've had the same dream. I'm running.

I was constantly running away from someone. We lived on 13 acres, so I could never get someone to hear my screams or run fast enough. I would run down the hill or the front to our house across the fields. There were many mornings that I would wake up after a night of running all night in my dreams but then run down the stairs to play with my younger sister. We had a great time growing up together. We had that special bond that you hear people talk about. We were so close. I didn't get to hear the answering machine until I got home that night. I remember there being an oddly high number of calls,

but three of the messages were from my dad. The room was dark and she woke up. She was lying on her side and I put my head to her face and just held her. It was there that she told me the worst story that I had heard in my life. In late August 1997, I was a student at the University of Kentucky. It was about the second night of classes. It was a Thursday night and I went to a party with my boyfriend, Chris Meyer, not far from campus. It was a little bit boring, so we packed up Chris' backpack with some beers and we were going to head down to the tracks.

We sat there and talked for a while. I'm not sure how long, but we got up to leave and go back to the party. And we started walking along the tracks. And when we got to an electrical box beside the tracks, a man came out from behind it. He asked us for money. We, of course, said we don't have any money. We're poor college kids. And I don't know if it was an ice pick, if it was a screwdriver,

but he had it on Chris really the whole time. He asked Chris to get down on his hands and knees. He went through his backpack and didn't find anything that he wanted. And I didn't realize it, but he was tying up Chris's hands with the backpack behind his back. And he took off my belt and tied up my hands behind my back with my belt. And he actually pulled Chris from the tracks on the gravel into the grass beside the tracks. In my head, I was panicking.

And I was like saying my last prayer and thinking I'm going to die. Maybe this is what I have been running from in all those dreams as a child, this horrific story that happened to my sister. It was very dark, and you couldn't see very well. It was very dark and you couldn't see very well. So it was very startling to see someone come out that was crouched behind an electrical box.

Chris and I were looking at each other, I think, in disbelief that this was actually going on. Like, we were looking at each other very confused. Like, what in the heck is happening? You know, I remember saying, why are you doing this? What do you want? Do you want credit cards, ATM cards? You can have our car, it's just parked down the street.

You know, we were just trying to figure out what he wanted. And at this point, our attacker ripped a shirt and he gagged us. I actually stuck my tongue out so that the gag wouldn't work. It just fell off. We had split seconds in where our attacker would go back up to the tracks and we were down in the grass. And so we could talk to each other. And Chris and I started strategizing, you know, saying, okay, should I run? Can you get untied?

I got my hands untied. I couldn't get my feet untied. I ripped Chris's gag off of his mouth. And so we were talking to each other, trying to figure out how we were going to get away, because Chris kept saying, you know, if you can get yourself untied, get away, run away. Because he couldn't get it.

His arms were all tied up in his backpack, and he couldn't get untied. And I really don't know how much time passed before our attacker came down carrying a rock, and he came over and literally just dropped it on Chris's head. I think at that point I went into survival mode. I, you know, see him drop this rock on Chris's head, and he climbed on top of me. I realized at that point that he was going to rape me. I fought him. I tried to hit him.

I tried to kick him. I tried to scream. That's when he took that weapon that he had, and he held it to my neck, and he said, look how easily I could kill you. That's when he stabbed me in my neck. So I just stopped. I was like, okay, well, you know, what's gonna happen is gonna happen.

I was staring at every scar he had, every tattoo he had. I was thinking, let me remember everything about you that I can because we'll get you at some point. I tried to rip off my fingernails and dig in the dirt so that if I was taken away, someone would know that I had been there. I started saying, you know, where have you been? What do you need? You know, how can I help you?

You know, I really have a family that wants to see me again. I said, do you have friends? Do you have a family? I was begging him, please don't hurt me. You know, I will let you go. I won't tell anybody what happened here. Just don't hurt me. And that's when he started hitting me.

I don't remember being hit. I was hit with some sort of wooden board. I think I put my hand up to block it, but I was hit five or six times in the front of my face, and then I turned over, and I was hit with some sort of wooden board. I think I put my hand up to block it, but I was hit five or six times in the front of my face, and then I turned over and I was hit five or six times in the back of my head. I'm positive that he probably knocked me unconscious, and my breathing was shallow enough

that he thought he had killed me. enough that he thought he had killed me. I don't know how long I laid there, but at some point I got up and I realized that he was gone. I knew that I was injured, I knew that I was hurt. I don't think I knew what my injuries were. You know, I realized that my mouth wasn't shutting right, and I was covered in blood. I walked about 200 yards or so,

maybe on the rocks along the tracks. It was probably 1, 2 in the morning. It was between 1 and 2. I was sitting in my chair studying. And out of the corner of my eye, I just glimpsed something go across the front yard. She was covered in blood from head to toe, and I could not figure out where all the blood was coming from. Her face, it looked like a boxer whenever they get cut during a boxing match.

At that point, I brought her in and sat her down on the couch, and she collapsed on the couch. I thought she was going to die there was no doubt in my mind and she started she i kept losing her a little bit here and there and i just kept talking to her because i definitely didn't want her to pass out you know i was just trying to keep her keep her awake until the the paramedics got there and i did keep saying to him, my friend's still out there. You know, like, be sure they know my friend's still out there. My friend's still out there.

In 2014, Laura Heavlin was in her home in Tennessee when she received a call from California. Her daughter, Erin Corwin, was missing. The young wife of a Marine had moved to the California desert to a remote base near Joshua Tree National Park. They have to alert the military, and when they do, the NCIS gets involved. From CBS Studios and CBS News, this is 48 Hours NCIS. Listen to 48 Hours NCIS ad-free starting October 29th on Amazon Music.

In the Pacific Ocean, halfway between Peru and New Zealand, lies a tiny volcanic island. It's a little-known British territory called Pitcairn, and it harboured a deep, dark scandal. There wouldn't be a girl on Pitcairn once they reach the age of 10 that would still a virgin. It just happens to all of us. I'm journalist Luke Jones, and for almost two years I've been investigating a shocking story that has left deep scars on generations of women and girls from Pitcairn when there's nobody watching nobody going to report it people will get away with what they can get away with in the Pitcairn trials I'll be uncovering a story of abuse and the fight

for justice that has brought a unique lonely lonely Pacific island to the brink of extinction. Listen to the Pitcairn Trials exclusively on Wondery+. Join Wondery in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. On August 29, 1997, I received a call at home about 3 o'clock in the morning that there had been an attack on two students along the railroad tracks. My lieutenant asked me to come out and said it was a bad one. Another detective and I were sent over to the University of Kentucky Hospital to check in on the victim. On the way we learned her name was Holly Dunn. Her face was disoriented.

She had a broken eye socket, a broken jaw, lots of cuts across her face, and then of course staples of where they could just to stop the bleeding, they couldn't even cut her hair, they just stapled on top of her hair. And even in that state of her looking the way that she did, I can just remember this feeling of overwhelming gratitude and love that she was alive, just feeling so thankful that she was alive and that she was there. I have felt so guilty to not be there,

to know that your sister is begging for her life. She is begging someone for her life, And you are, you're sleeping. I remember they weren't talking about Chris and eventually I asked my dad, I just said Chris is dead isn't he? And my dad was like yes he is. It was very hard to accept the he is. It was very hard to accept the fact that I lived through this and Chris didn't. And, you know, it was just, I just felt like it wasn't fair. It's not fair that I'm still alive and that Chris isn't. Chris was so friendly. He was very laid back and down to earth. He loved the outdoors. He didn't have a care in the world. I couldn't attend the funeral. I was really upset about that only because I really wanted to attend. I had never really got the chance to say goodbye, and I wanted to, you know, have that chance to have some peace.

Despite her state, she was ready and willing to try to communicate what had happened to her. I was really trying to remember every detail about my attacker. And I remember hearing his accent, thinking, that is a Mexican accent. Holly described the suspect as a male, possibly Hispanic, 5'6", 5'8", in height, kind of a wavy black hair, wearing glasses. She said that he wasn't muscular, but he seemed somewhat wiry. They repaired my jaw.

They actually kind of just realigned it and wired my mouth shut. And really that was the only thing that they could fix. The broken eye socket, there was nothing they could do. As soon as I could get the surgery to get my jaw wired shut and my jaw fixed, my parents took me home. I definitely think that there's parts of me that wanted to retreat away. Right after this attack happened, I just wanted to lay in bed and not get out of bed again.

But, you know, there's always something that's pulled me out of that. My sister was my rock throughout this entire process. And she doesn't, maybe didn't even realize how much she was helping me by what she was doing. We received a lot of phone calls and a lot of tips. And we followed up on a lot of people who thought they had seen this person. We were able to establish that we had DNA sample of the suspect from the rape.

The sketch was the best thing we had, and the DNA evidence, of course. And then we also entered it into the national database for violent offenders in the hopes that maybe someday down the road there would be some similarities to other cases that i could become aware of to to try to track this fellow down ¶¶ In December of 1998, a doctor was murdered in the Houston area. She had suffered both stab wounds and blunt trauma to the head, and she was also the victim of a sexual assault and then pastor and his wife were killed in Weimar and the pastor and his wife were murdered in their bed with a sledgehammer that was

found in a tool room there at the house. When we first started working it, we approached it from the standpoint of a fugitive investigation. That was trying to learn as much as we could about the subject at hand. We knew that we had forensic evidence. We had fingerprint evidence that linked to a particular suspect. And both houses were in the near vicinity of railroad tracks. Somewhere around May or June of 1999,

I got a call from FIACAP, which was the national database that we put the info in. Got a call from FIACAP, which was the national database, and we put the info in. We got a call from them saying, listen, we've had another homicide near railroad tracks in Texas. It's a loose connection at best, but it was near railroad tracks. And after two years, we hadn't had anything of substance anyway, so we chased any lead. Detective Sorrell called, and we compared details about the cases and realized that we not only had a serial killer that was within 150 mile radius of Houston,

but we had one that was in other states as well. They were able, through fingerprint analysis, to have a suspect. The suspect at that point had been identified as Rafael Resendez Ramirez. The majority of his attacks were by surprise. Often the people were in bed asleep when he was getting them. So he's like the boogeyman coming into your house.

He supports the fact that true evil does exist in this world. To know that he was doing it again, that he was more violent, that he was killing more people, I started to feel like, wow, this is a lot bigger than me. It was almost like my worst nightmare coming true. That was when it became a national serial killer manhunt. We were driven. We had to catch him before he killed somebody else. We knew then we had a serial killer on the loose. We knew that he was extremely violent,

and we had no information as to where he was. Our last clue was Texas, so it was an all-out race then to try to figure out where he was and get hands on him. So everybody went to Texas. From what I've come to learn of Resendez, he was an immigrant, trans in. He had done a lot of odd jobs, migrant work. He was prone to violence at least 20 years prior

to this killing spree. prone to violence at least 20 years prior to this killing spree. He was nicknamed by the media as the railroad killer, and he got that moniker just by the fact that most of his murders happen in and around railroad tracks and that that was a mode of transportation that he used to travel across the country. a mode of transportation that he used to travel across the country. The drag net for the suspected rail-riding serial killer now stretches from Ohio to the Mexican border. As part of the search there, there was actually a huge operation set up to stop trains. A bunch of Texas agencies participated, had helicopters in the air to fly over various train tracks.

If they saw somebody, we'd get the train stopped and identify anybody on it. The sense of urgency was, it was unbelievable because people were dying. He was continuing to kill, and he was killing effortlessly. No one was stopping him. He killed two women in one day, 90 miles apart. Four days later, he's in a different state. People were scared.

We are here today to announce that Rafael Resendez Ramirez has been elevated to the FBI's 10 Most Wanted list. Ramirez is the 457th person to be placed on the list. I just got really scared because it got so big and they still couldn't find him. They didn't know where he was. And that was a very scary time because I just, I knew that he knew I was still alive. I felt that.

So I just, I was afraid. I thought he would come back and get me. I was so scared that I had to get out of the country. I signed up that day to go to school in England. The FBI, all the local agencies. There is evidence. Everybody was running leads. So the volume was huge, and you just started piecing the things together but truthfully be the tip that made the case

was a call from a family relative to America's Most Wanted tonight we've got breaking news on a suspected serial killer this is the man police have been looking for based on information from that phone call, it led us to go to New Mexico to speak with his sister. She hadn't been in touch with her brother, but she had been in touch with someone that was in touch with her brother. And that's where we started the discussions about Resendez

and the fact that he was tired and that he might be willing to surrender. She became the liaison between United States law enforcement and the serial killer. I believe that his options were limited. This man had no friends. I mean, he was a loner. He had a high price on his head. And he had an entire nation, really two nations, looking for him.

And I think the amount of pressure that was put on him ultimately led to him to have to make a choice. It was early in the morning, and Drew was on one side of the International Bridge waiting, I mean, on the Texas side, and not knowing, I assume, whether he was going to show up or not, if he was going to show up armed. I mean, who knew? And so then, you know, the doubt sets in, like, all right, is this going to happen? Amount of time passed, and you see a pickup truck driving up,

driving across the bridge. And there's three people in that old pickup truck. And the center passenger I immediately recognized as Resendez. And that's kind of when I thought to myself man this is really gonna happen I closed my door and started crying because I was so relieved. I don't want another case to prove up.

I don't want another dead body. It was such a sense of relief. At the time of his arrest, Resendez was linked to six murders in Texas, two in Illinois, and one in Kentucky. For two years, we had operated under the belief that his name was Rafael Resendez Ramirez. We learned that he had a variety of names, but ultimately it was determined his name

was Angel Matarino Resendez. I had been waiting to see this guy. So when they walked him in, it was a great moment, but he was so scary. He was a little guy, but wiry and strong, ropey muscles on his arms and curious. He would look, he'd look at everybody in there. He'd looked at me and there's nothing there. There was nothing there. No humanity, no emotion. It's like somebody took a black magic marker and colored his eyes. They were flat black and an expressionless face. On December 17, 1998, Harris County, Texas. But I just buckled down and just decided this is going to be, it's got to be about the victims.

And it's got to be about getting this guy dead, honestly. It's gotta be about convincing a jury to give him the death penalty because he so richly deserved it and earned it. I knew that I was going to testify and I always wanted to testify. I just wanted the chance to tell what had happened to us, and that was my chance. And I wish I could have seen his face when he heard that someone was living.

I wish I could have seen his face when he knew she was coming to testify against him. I just would love to know what he thought when he found that out. Hotshot Australian attorney Nicola Gaba was born into legal royalty. Her specialty? Representing some of the city's most infamous gangland criminals. However, while Nicola held the underworld's darkest secrets,

the most dangerous secret was her own. She's going to all the major groups within Melbourne's underworld, and she's informing on them all. I'm Marsha Clark, host of the new podcast, Informants Lawyer X. In my long career in criminal justice as a prosecutor and defense attorney, I've seen some crazy cases, and this one belongs right at the top of the list. She was addicted to the game she had created. She just didn't know how to stop. Now, through dramatic interviews and access, I'll reveal the truth behind one of the world's most shocking legal scandals. Listen to Informants Lawyer X exclusively on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

And listen to more Exhibit C true crime shows early and ad-free right now. Have you ever wondered who created that bottle of sriracha that's living in your fridge? Or why nearly every house in America has at least one game of Monopoly. Introducing The Best Idea Yet, a brand new podcast from Wondery and T-Boy about the surprising origin stories of the products you're obsessed with and the bold risk-takers who brought them to life.

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It's just the best idea yet. I don't have things that I think about all the time. I can't forget about Chris being hit, the rock hitting him. That really is probably the part that I try the hardest and can't forget. She was definitely our star witness. She was our only living witness. Nobody else could speak out against him in first person. This is what happened to me. This is what he did to me.

We didn't have anybody else. Well, if what we know about him is true, he is everyone's worst nightmare. Trial started in May of 2000. It was held here in Houston. He was so different at trial. I guess sitting in jail, he got fat. He got the jailhouse pallor.

It grew his hair greasy. There was not a shred of humanity about this man. He did not deserve to live among us. I wanted to put him down. Present his face's capital murder charges in the stabbing death of Dr. Claudia Benton. She had been sexually assaulted, stabbed, beaten in the head. He was only charged with one because that's all you need to get the death penalty. He was only charged with one because that's all you need to get the death penalty. He ultimately pled not guilty by reason of insanity. The evidence was overwhelming as to his guilt, so that was really his only out was the insanity defense.

We knew we were battling with the jury not wanting to believe that someone could do these horrible things to people and be sane. A lot of people did not want to believe, you have to be crazy to do that to somebody. You have to be crazy. The jury reached a verdict after many hours of deliberation. Mr. Resendez, would you please rise? It was pretty nail-biting. We, the jury, find the defendant unheld, Macarino Resendez, guilty of capital murder,

is charged in the indictment. I actually got involved during the penalty phase of the trial. That's, you know, when they say whether he gets the death penalty or life in prison. We're going to tell you about the people. The people who've been murdered, most of whom murdered in their own homes. I knew that I wanted Holly to testify last, The people who've been murdered, most of whom murdered in their own homes. I knew that I wanted Holly to testify last, so by the time she took the stand, the jury had heard the gruesome details of all the other murders that we had solved at that point.

It was a horror show. Heads beaten to a pulp, knives put all the way through the body, that's how much force was used. Just horrific violence. We were the last of the cases presented. I testified as to the evidence at the scene, presented the pictures, and then lastly, Holly testified as the only surviving victim. I flew into Houston with my family the night before I was going to testify and I woke up during the middle of the night screaming and crying.

I talk about the trial as the hardest day of my life. What I was most worried about I think when I testified was seeing him again. I cannot imagine the amount of courage she had to marshal to come into that courtroom, to walk in and face him. She told me, don't look at him. Look at me. I'll be right in front of you. Look at your family.

They'll be right behind me. He'll be off to your left. Just do not look at him. The first question was, what'd you do last weekend? And so I was like, I graduated from college. It felt good for me to be able to say, you know, I graduated from college in front of the guy who basically could have ruined my life

and destroyed it. And not that he cared, because I don't think he did. For me to be able to say, you didn't destroy me. I'm still here. I'm still strong. I'm still the same person I was. It felt good. It felt like I finally had my chance.

I told all the details of what I knew, what I remembered, and cried through the entire testimony. I was crying. All the jury was crying. Sometimes you don't always have the human picture. There's no victim to stand in front of you to tell you what they experienced, what they went through.

Holly gave that to Chris and all the others that had been murdered. She was able to give a real live person to give them a real feeling of the brutality of this man. They got to the moment in the trial when they say, is the person who attacked you in the courtroom today? I hadn't looked at him yet. I knew he was there. I said, yes. I hadn't looked at him yet. I knew he was there. I said, yes.

I wanted it to be the last thing that jury heard, and the last thing they saw was Holly Dunn sitting on that witness stand saying, that's the man. They said, well, could you tell us what he's wearing? And I turned and looked at him. It was surreal. I said, he's wearing a white button-down shirt. I mean, I literally, I felt my hearing going into my head.

He had like the smug look on his face, and I mean, I was so close to feigning when I looked at him again that, I mean, I don't know how I didn't. It was devastating, and it was the best part of our case. I mean, she basically, from his perspective, came back from the grave to nail him. Should we give him some points because Holly didn't die?

The jury did find that he was a future danger to society, so the judge sentenced him to death. I felt, I guess, relieved. I mean, it just felt good to know he would never be able to hurt anyone ever again. After the trial, Resendez was sent to death row in Huntsville, Texas. He was not tried for any other crimes. He had gotten the ultimate penalty. When the last appeal was denied, he was put to death in June 2006. I chose not to attend the execution.

Resendez represented all those angry feelings that I had, and I decided to stay with my family. I had already seen one person die in front of me, and I did not need to see another. I read an account of the execution, and it said that right before they injected him, his feet were shaking under the sheet. And I hoped that he experienced some of the fear just that Holly did. That gave me a small sense of satisfaction that,

that he was scared. Did you know that the movie Candyman was partly inspired by an actual murder? Listen to Candyman, the true story behind the bathroom mirror murder early and ad free on Wondery Plus and the Wondery app. I definitely feel like I have another opportunity at life. I want to live it to the fullest. I can't explain how this changes you. I am a stronger person because of it. My whole life focus changed because of it. I'm a different person today because this happened. I knew that I had to heal physically first, and then I had to deal with Chris dying.

I had to deal with myself almost dying. And then I had to deal with being raped. Your brain works in amazing ways, and it kind of sort of let me deal with each thing as I could. In 1997, I met Jacob Pendleton at the outdoor store that I was working at. He was the first guy that I dated after the attack. He just, like, reintroduced me to the world. He just reintroduced me to the world.

I don't think Jacob even knows how much he helped me. There'd be days that I would literally cry to him, and he would just listen to me and really wouldn't judge me at all, which was great. To see Holly happy, married, it is wonderful. She has led our family in how we have recovered from this. It could have gone a completely different way where our family was devastated by this. And instead, you know, we are just so happy for how she has led her life. Please welcome Holly Dunn-Penn.

It was August 28, 1997. It's the second day of classes at the University of Kentucky. I started speaking about two years after the attack. He said, look how easily I could kill you. And then he raped me. To me, it felt like part of my healing process to talk about it and to cry about it and to be emotional because for so long I had to kind of detach emotion from it. The way that I went on with my life was I had to forgive him and look for the good that could come from this. When I was speaking, I didn't have to worry about that. I went on with my life was I had to forgive him and look for the good that could come from this.

When I was speaking, I didn't have to worry about that. I could work through my emotions and that really helped me in my healing process. Being a survivor is one thing, but helping other survivors and knowing how to do that in a professional manner was another thing. Holly's House is a child and adult advocacy center in Evansville, Indiana that provides a safe reporting location for victims of intimate crimes. We opened on September 2nd of 2008 and we have served over 300 victims since that time. How are things? They've been pretty steady. Holly is a hero because she did not let what happened to her destroy her.

She decided to make it her reason to live or her reason to help people. How are you? It's important to me for victims to be supported, for them to know that they're not going through what has happened to them alone. I get support through victims that come through Holly's House. I feel like through helping others, they're helping me. We sort of do it together.

This case for me has become one that I have looked back on many times. I keep a little bit of a reminder on my desk, a rock from our crime scene and a railroad spike that I got from down in Texas. Not so much as a reminder of the largest case at work, but more a reminder that if you stick with a case and follow up on everything that you can be successful. So be determined, Don't give up. I've stayed in touch with Holly since it began.

She's really just an amazing person individually. She is the model of Survivor. I remember Chris in a lot of ways. I like to keep things around me that remind me of him. I'm lucky enough to have my amazing husband and have Chris be a part of our lives. I think to get over my survivor's guilt that I had, I had to know that I live my life not just for me and not just for Chris. I'm living my life for all of Versenda's victims, for all of them.

all of them, and that I have to, or I want to, be the best person I can be and live the best life I can because they didn't get that chance, and I did, so I want to live for them. I want them to be remembered. I want them to, and I would want them to be proud of, you know, me.