48 Hours - The Murder of Kay Wenal

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

Help solve a murder case: a former model brutally killed in her Georgia home. Someone out there knows something...is it you? Erin Moriarty reports.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to this podcast ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app today. Even if you love the thrill of true crime stories as much as I do, there are times when you want to mix it up. And that's where Audible comes in, with all the genres you love and new ones to discover. Explore thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. thousands of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals, with more added all the time. Listening to Audible can lead to positive change in your mood, your habits,

and even your overall well-being. And you can enjoy Audible anytime, while doing household chores, exercising, commuting, you name it. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial, and your first audiobook is free. Visit audible.ca. I'm Erin Moriarty of 48 Hours, and of all the cases I've covered, this is the one that troubles me most. A bizarre and maddening tale involving an eyewitness account that doesn't quite make sense. A sister testifying against a brother. A lack of physical evidence. Crosley Green has lived more than half his life behind bars for a crime he says he didn't commit. Listen to Murder

in the Orange Grove, the Trouble Case Against Crosley Green, early and ad-free with a 48-hours-plus subscription on Apple Podcasts. It was a savage murder. That was probably one of the most brutal that I've seen. The brutality of this was what stunned us all. But to cut a woman's throat, it's revenge, it's anger. Somebody hated her.

Take a look at this. She's gorgeous, isn't she? Full of life. Just a little sweetheart. Once you knew her, you loved her forever. Can you give me her whole name? Her maiden name, Eva K. Smith, Eva K. Judd, Eva K. Wilson, Eva K. Gilbert, Eva K. Winnell. Each time, did she think, okay, this guy, this is going to be the one?

I guess. Did she think, okay, this guy, this is going to be the one? I guess. She was the wife of Hal Winnell, and Hal was a real estate developer. He was a very wealthy, successful businessman. He was a jet setter. He ran in a fast crowd of big money. He liked very pretty women and he liked the glitter of life. I'm Ned Timmons and my team was hired by Hal Winnell to investigate the death of his wife.

How would you all describe this case? Puzzling,rating. You want to right the wrong. Somebody is out there that took this lady's life and it's our job to try and find them. This incident happened on May 1st, 2008. Kay Wano was at home. She hadn't been feeling well. I think it was right over in this area is where the first encounter happened. The attack at the front door was brutal. And then I think he just like hits her like this. Somebody hit her with a prize fighter type punch and just smashed her face in. I think she recovered and ran for the kitchen. She was running for her life. And I think this is where the perpetrator, the assailant, got her. Caught her from behind, forced her to the ground. And then, and then cut her neck.

and then cut her neck. I believe Hal came home around 6.30 or 7 o'clock at night and found Kay. What's the hardest part about losing your sister this way? She's my best friend. How could somebody do that to somebody like her? We have found people have three lives. They have a public life, a private life, and a secret life. Do you believe Kay Wennell had a secret life?

I believe she did, yes. And that's where I believe the answer lies. Ellen Moriarty reports. Solve this case. Who killed Kay Wendell? And why are you talking to me? I'm talking to you because I want to find out who murdered my sister. At the time of her murder, Kay was married to real estate developer Hal Wennell, her fourth husband. He was smitten from the moment he first set eyes on Kay in a Reno airport. She said she bent over to get luggage off the rack and

that's when Hal noticed her. How could you not? Pam Sleeper says her sister was striking and vivacious. Hal was proud of her. He used to love to walk into restaurants. She was arm candy. Oh, look at that woman. Wow. And at the age of 60, Kay was still turning heads. And everyone seemed to love her.

Which made her murder in May 2008 all the more shocking. And difficult to solve. What's more, there is little physical evidence. Crime scene investigators took this video, which reveals no fingerprints, footprints, defensive wounds, hairs, or fibers. And all the blood tested was Kay's. So three weeks after his wife's death, Hal Wennell offered a reward that would grow to a quarter of a million dollars. He wanted to try to find out who murdered Kay and he was willing to pay

dearly to do it. But when months went by without a real lead, the frustrated multimillionaire hired his own team of private investigators, led by Ned Timmons. NED TIMMONS, We want this guy. We want this salt. JUDY WOODRUFF Timmons, a retired FBI agent, recruited former colleagues, his own ex-wife Kathleen, and John and Sonja. JOHN AND SONJA, You know, when you get involved in this kind of work,

you want to have closure. You want to bring them to an end. We brought them together with retired Gwinnett County Police Lieutenant Charlie Bishop, who also worked on this case, to re-examine a murder that continues to haunt them all. So can this be solved? Oh, I think it can. We need that lucky break.

Normally, we follow a murder case after an arrest has been made, but not tonight. Tonight's report is a true whodunit. So listen closely. Maybe you know something that can solve this case. May 1st, 2008 wasn't a typical day for Kay Wendell. She woke up that morning with all the intentions of going to work. Usually she was out finding tenants to fill her husband's shopping centers. She changed her mind saying, I don't feel well. So whoever did this knew that she was home. There are no signs of forced entry. This is where you believe the assailant came in. Is that correct? That's correct.

So John and Sonia believes Kay let her killer inside and was immediately assaulted. The proof, says Ned Timmons, is all that blood. And you can see by the way the blood droplets hit, her back had to be there and he had to hit her with a very, very powerful blow there that stunned her. And sent her glasses flying across the room. She realized, I'm in trouble, and then tried to escape. She flees to the kitchen, perhaps to get the phone there he gets her

and that's where he takes control of her and kills her by slashing her throat what happened next shocked even these veteran investigators then he decided to do what we call an insurance cut a second cut to make sure that she was going to die. I mean, that's a cold-blooded killer. Exactly right, yeah, it really is. And Kay's killer appeared to have carefully planned his attack. Nobody saw him coming in, nobody saw him leave. Which makes what the killer left behind so puzzling.

There's the bloody towel up in the upstairs bedroom. A towel with smudges of Kay's blood was found in her closet off the master bathroom. Why is he in there? It's her closet. Maybe he takes one final trophy. What are you looking for in that room? It's a big question. This is what investigators do know.

The weapon. I think it might have been a scalpel or something like that. Could have been a hunting or fishing knife. Whatever it was, it was extremely sharp. It did not cause any jagged lacerations. It was like... The assailant. You all use he. You believe a man did this?

Because of the strength that it took. I don't see a woman cutting another woman's throat like that. You know, are there women that could do this? Sure, I don't think it's likely. I think this was a man. A man that John and Sonia believes is right-handed. Because I think he hit her with his right, and I think the way the cuts were on her neck, it started from here to here.

If he was left-handed, I think he would start here and go this way. And he was probably wearing gloves. Pieces of a latex glove were found inside the house and on the back deck that didn't match ones used by first responders. That also is confirmation that whoever did this came prepared. I mean, who walks around with rubber gloves in their pocket? The motive. Everyone agrees this was not a robbery. She had plenty of rings on. Kay's wallet and credit cards were out in the open. Jewelry worth hundreds of thousands of dollars was locked in a safe upstairs.

If this was some guy that came to rob her, wouldn't he take the rings? Wouldn't he take something? The impressions that I got were that someone was very comfortable in that home, knew their way around that home, and this person has no concern that anyone is going to walk in and catch him, and then walks out the back door and departs. Investigators believe the killer made his escape through the woods behind the Wennell

home. He clearly knew where he was going to when he left. And that takes an awful lot of prior planning. But did he make a mistake? Who is this? I don't know, but I sure wished I did. I'm thinking, is this the guy that murdered my sister. In 2014, Laura Heavlin was in her home in Tennessee when she received a call from California. Her daughter, Erin Corwin, was missing. The young wife of a Marine had moved to the

California desert to a remote base near Joshua Tree National Park. They have to alert the military and when they do, the NCIS gets involved. From CBS Studios and CBS News, this is 48 Hours NCIS. Listen to 48 Hours NCIS ad-free starting October 29th on Amazon Music. In the Pacific Ocean, halfway between Peru and New Zealand, lies a tiny volcanic island. It's a little-known British territory called Pitcairn, and it harboured a deep, dark scandal. There wouldn't be a girl on Pitcairn once they reach the age of 10 that would still a virgin. It just happens to all of us.

I'm journalist Luke Jones and for almost two years I've been investigating a shocking story that has left deep scars on generations of women and girls from Pitcairn. When there's nobody watching, nobody going to report it, people will get away with what they can get away with. In the Pitcairn trials I'll be uncovering a story of abuse and the fight for justice that has brought a unique, lonely, Pacific island to the brink of extinction. Listen to the Pitcairn Trials exclusively on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Six days after Kaywanna was murdered, her family and friends gathered to say goodbye.

It was packed. Lots of people. There was a lot of policemen there. Gwinnett County Police took this surveillance footage. They were searching the faces for suspects. Pam's sleeper was searching for answers. Did Kay have enemies?

I didn't think she did, but apparently she did. Did she ever talk about having any fears? No. Anybody threatening her? No. You had to wonder about Hal, didn't you? No.

It just never crossed my mind, ever. But it certainly occurred to police to look at Kay's husband. Hal was a suspect from day one. Hal, however, appeared eager to cooperate, agreeing to this police interview in 2008 without his lawyer present. To the best of my knowledge, I will tell you everything I know.

And as investigators discovered, Hal had an ironclad alibi. We knew Hal physically wasn't there. We have video of him leaving his office. We have video of him going to a fast food restaurant. All within the time we believe the murder took place. There was also no evidence Hal had hired anyone. What's more, he seemed grief-stricken by

Kay's death. There are nights I wake up crying my heart out, middle of the night, like a child. It's horrible. It's really horrible, and especially if you don't know why, if she was hit by a car. Hal wasn't a part of this, in my opinion. So you don't believe he was involved? No. But I think Hal was protecting the memory of Kay. The secret stuff. The secret stuff, and he didn't want to divulge that because it would reflect poorly on Kay.

Secrets Kay didn't even share with her sister Pam. There was a whole lot apparently she didn't talk to me about. And you think somewhere in there is the clue to her killer? I sure do. Kay had a colorful past. As investigators discovered, she not only married a lot, she also had affairs. She needed to be loved, and she needed to feel that she could attract any man.

She was obsessed with this. In fact, Ned Timmons theorizes she may have been seeing someone at the time of her death. Hal knew her secret life. Hal was involved in the secret life, in my opinion. Do you think he put up with her then having affairs just to keep her on his arm? Absolutely, yeah. In a murder investigation, nothing is private. So the Wendell house was searched, and according to John and Sonia, more possible evidence of Kay's secret life was uncovered. Material we found in the house.

Right. Which would not be normal. In what way? What do you mean? It was unusual. Almost perverted. Kinky? Kinky, yes.

Kinky is a good word. Outfits detectives described as fetish wear. And when we talked to Hal about it, first he said, no, I don't know anything about that stuff. Oh, then the next time, oh yeah, we went to a masquerade party and she dressed like a French maid. But this Halloween costume is tame compared to what else was found in Kay's closet. The list in police reports is X-rated. These outfits were not something a French maid would wear. And if she's not wearing them for Hal, then who's she wearing them for? Kay is a beautiful woman.

If you came out and I'd line up 30 guys I know, they'd all tell you the same thing. Anybody, any guy would fall in love with Kay in a minute. Do you believe she knew her killer? I think she probably did. And cops do have one possible clue to his identity. A stranger seen in this neighborhood the very afternoon Kay was killed. This sketch was made with help from one of the Wennells' neighbors, KAY WAS KILLED. THIS SKETCH WAS MADE WITH HELP FROM ONE OF THE WENNELL'S

NEIGHBORS, WHO TOLD POLICE HE ACTUALLY SAW THE SAME MAN TWICE ON THE DAY OF THE MURDER AND THE DAY BEFORE. AND HE HAD A FLYER FOR A HOUSE THAT WAS FOR SALE IN THE SUBDIVISION, AND THE NEIGHBOR SAID, OH, IT'S WAY ON THE OTHER SIDE. AND HE JUST TURNED AROUND AND HE WALKED AWAY OUT OF SIGHT. THE FIRST ENCOUNTER STOOD OUT TO THE NEIGHBOR BECAUSE subdivision and the neighbor said, oh, it's way on the other side. And he just turned around and he walked away out of sight. The first encounter stood out to the neighbor because the stranger didn't seem to have a car. Now, this is an area you just don't walk around in a neighborhood.

You have to drive. Nobody, nobody walks. Police later discovered that the house for sale flyer was only given to people who had been inside that house. And there had been no showings on the day the stranger first appeared. The following day, the same neighbor was looking out his bathroom window. And he sees the same guy walking toward Wendell's house right about the time they believed that the homicide occurred. I mean, do you think this person could be the killer? I think it's a strong possibility. Obviously, we can't say for 100% until we identify that person he saw.

And for more than eight years, that's exactly what Gwinnett County Police have been trying to do. Sergeant John Richter took over the investigation in 2011. Lieutenant Stephen Shaw is his supervisor. It's a standard, you know, white male with wire-rimmed glasses that's aging and starting to bald. And there are probably hundreds and hundreds of males walking around that look something like this. And we've, you know, obviously explored k's inner circle and

and hal circle and and all of their friends and acquaintances they checked out everyone from k's doctor to a restaurant manager even a clerk at the local hobby lobby store who had a crush on k she said that's the strangest thing he calls me and wants me to go for a drink with him. Investigators have cleared and eliminated all three men. But they're still trying to find this man, pictured with Kay in a photo taken years earlier in Las Vegas, who seemed to resemble the sketch. Do you think that person is this person? Well, I think it's a possibility that that person is seated next to Kay and with another female.

It for sure could be him. You don't know whether he's a suspect or not. You just... I never could identify him. Nobody seemed to know who he was. As investigators were searching for the man in the sketch, Hal suggested they should also look at a man in Kay's past. I have something back in my mind. I don't even want to say it yet. That was years and years ago. The weirdest thing was, and I really don't even like saying it, is her ex-husband. Her third husband, Jeff Gilbert.

Was she still married to him when you two met? When we met, absolutely. Yes, she was. He was running Bally's Casino, where Kay was modeling, when Hal swept in and stole her away. He threatened her when she was trying to leave. I know that. But that's what she told me, so.

You don't think that would make Jeff angry enough to want to kill him? No. No. Never. But just a few months before Kay was killed, Jeff called. He was traveling to Atlanta and wanted to see her and Hal. I said, well, what are you going to do? She said, I don't know. We're not going. She said, he's livid about it. We looked at him because an ex-husband is, of course, on our suspect list, but no indication that he was involved. We don't have any evidence through airlines or phone records,

and we looked into it to indicate that he was in the Atlanta area. Then, nearly three months after Kay was killed, out of the blue, the most tantalizing and perplexing clue of all. I was in shock. I didn't know what to think. I stand on that bridge on the second floor. I look down at that front door. I say, Kay, what happened here? What really happened? Whoever did this did this because one of two reasons. They're very angry with her or they're very angry with you. I've been in this game for 40 years. Who the hell kills your wife? Not even the mafia does that. Despite what Hal Wennell believed, cold case investigators

Lieutenant Stephen Shaw and Sergeant John Richter wonder if the killer could be connected in some way to Wennell's business. We have to look at every option and every possibility to figure out who did it.

Back in 2008, Hal was the picture of wealth and success. At the time of Kay's death, what kind of shape was his business in? It's hard to tell. In the face, it looks like they had a lot of money. However, after digging into the case, it appears that it was maybe smoke and mirrors. We find out that maybe there was some fraud or some stuff that wasn't always on the up and ups. Hal Wenno made his fortune buying land, building shopping centers, and then selling the malls fully leased for a profit.

But according to Marie Lundquist, Hal would sometimes cook the books. He wasn't the most honest person in the world. Marie began working for Hal in 2007 as his administrative assistant. We sold a shopping center in Lawrenceville, and the whole deal was bad. He was paying tenants rent, so when the new owners bought it, the books looked like they were paying rent every month, He was paying tenants rent. So when the new owners bought it, the books looked like they were paying rent every month,

when in fact Hal was paying their rent, some of them. Yeah, I can say to you without reservation, I can't even think of anybody. We have tenants occasionally who fall out, but they don't blame me. Yet we found six lawsuits filed against Hal and his various companies, some of them from people who did blame me. Yet we found six lawsuits filed against Hal and his various companies, some of them from people who did blame him, claiming fraud. But Hal brushed it off. If you don't make any money, you never get sued for anything. The minute you make a buck, people come after you. Do you think

there's any possibility that the K's death might have something to do with someone angry with Hal? Yeah, because apparently he owed a lot of people money and he didn't make a lot of friends. It could be a revenge thing. Kay's sister Pam wonders if an investor was angry enough to hire a professional killer, which could explain the lack of evidence at the crime scene. There was a lot of blood there. And how this guy got away without a footprint, a hand mark on the wall, or anything, it's just amazing.

But the idea of a professional hit doesn't make sense to the investigators who've examined the case over the years. I think if it was a hired killer, it would have been a gun with a gun, no physical contact. Just boom, boom. Bye. Out the door, see you later. That's it.

I'm done. And what makes the hitman even more unlikely, they say, is what happened nearly three months after Kay was murdered. A peculiar letter arrived at the Gwinnett County offices of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. The letter wasn't published back then, but it was given to the police. The police department wanted to meet with us.

They showed us this letter. Cut out in little bitty, individual, different letters out of different magazines, all glued in to this page. And it was shocking. The envelope, postmarked July 21st 2008 had been mailed from Augusta Georgia some 140 miles away from where Kay was murdered Wow it's I mean it was bizarre odd the letter and envelope were taken apart and carefully examined by the crime lab, but no DNA or other useful forensics were found.

Whoever did this did it with gloves on. I mean, they cut each individual letters out and then glued them. So it was very time consuming to do that. Do you know how hard that would be to stick these things all on there with plastic gloves on? Oh, it's incredible. I mean, this is really a long... I mean, just to go through the magazine.

The letter is shocking, filled with expletives. I bet Kay Wennell never told anyone what she really was. It turns out she was just a money-grubbing whore. I loved her, and she said we could be together. She told me she hated her house and that fat, miserable, lying mother... MF and husband. She said she left me, but that was a lie too. I told her this would happen if she didn't keep her damn promises to me. Her family screwed everything up. Those white trash ass******.

His money was more important than our love. We could have been so happy together, but they f***ed everything up. On its face, it sounds like the words of a jilted lover. If you look at the letter, if we're going to go with the jilted lover theory,

that this person, she finally told him, no, I'm staying with Hal. In other words, did the family talk her into staying with Hal that irritated the actual perpetrator? But Pam's sleeper says Kay

never mentioned any plans to leave Hal. Although she admits parts of the letter have a ring of truth, especially about the house they were renting. I know that she didn't like her house. I mean, that was the first thing that stood out to me was, wow. I know she was kind of unhappy with Hal about that. So it was someone who knew her? Oh, yeah. Apparently. Who would go to such trouble?

Is the letter really what it appears to be? How many of you believe this was actually written by a spurn lover? Do you? Based on the reading of it, yes. Kathleen? I don't. I do because of the reference to the family, the house, and things that wouldn't be known to everybody. But those are exactly why it wouldn't be a spurned lover.

A spurned lover doesn't give a care about her house. A spurned lover doesn't give a care about her family. I believe at this point it's not a jilted lover. That's a red herring. Review the clues. Help solve this case. That's a red herring. Behind the bathroom mirror murder early and ad free on Wondery Plus and the Wondery app. Have you ever wondered who created that bottle of sriracha that's living in your fridge? Or why nearly every house in America has at least one game of Monopoly? Introducing the best idea yet.

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Plus, we guarantee that after listening, you're going to dominate your next dinner party. So follow The Best Idea Yet on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to The Best Idea Yet early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. It's just the best idea yet. The investigation into Kay Wendell's death got new life when this letter arrived in July of 2008.

It felt like something dreamed up by a Hollywood screenwriter. It felt like something dreamed up by a Hollywood screenwriter. It's what the author thinks threat letters should look like. This is almost scripted, so you have to say what's the purpose. Former FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole agreed to examine the letter for us. She now heads the forensic science program at George Mason University. This is someone I think that's pretending to be the killer, to create this boogeyman suspect and to push the police away from the actual motive in the case. The writer may not be a jolted lover at all.

From working cases like this, if this was a spurned lover, then this would not be the first note. A spurned lover is going to have notes preceding this one where K is the most wonderful thing in the world. I love you. We're perfect together. Even if it's a delusional stalker, initially they love their victims. They're beautiful. They're going to spend their life together. It's only after a few letters that you see that transition to you are now this horrible human being. I hate you. What's more, the investigation hasn't revealed any other men in Kay's life, exactly what Hal told detectives back in 2008. As God is my judge, I don't think Kay was having an affair or she had to be the best damn actress in the world.

It turns out that while Kay was sexy and flirtatious, investigators may have been looking in the wrong direction. They didn't find any evidence of an affair at the time of her murder. And Kathleen Timmon says neither did the medical examiner. And this letter that implies that she's got yet a very active current lover. And yet when they did the autopsy examination, she had no indication that there had been recent sexual activity. There's no indication

that she's involved with anybody, including her husband. Do you believe that the person who sent this letter is actually the person who went into the home and killed her? Not necessarily. O'Toole suspects the killer may have had help. I think it's possible that there are two people that could be involved. You could have somebody that wrote the letter and then someone that came into the home. Mary Ellen O'Toole says writers of cut and paste notes tend to have one thing in common.

They are women. I can tell you that that's my experience. I've seen them written by teenage girls. I've seen them written by middle-aged women. But the behavior at the scene, just that kind of violence, certainly suggests to me a male offender. If the profiler is right, that means a man and a woman could be involved in Kay's death, with the woman creating the note to throw police off the trail. Someone may have been interviewed and they felt like they could have been considered a suspect,

didn't want that, and produced this note. Isn't this a very risky thing? A terribly risky thing to do. O'Toole suggests taking another look at the people interviewed by police back in 2008. One of those people was this woman, a friend of Kay's and Hal's, Karen Scott. Karen worked for Hal, and she promoted herself as Hal's right-hand man.

And Karen was an obvious suspect of ours because she was close with Hal and Kay. In any investigation, you're going to start with who's closest to them. So close that when Karen remarried, it was Kay who gave the wedding shower and was matron of honor. Marie Lundquist was there. Oh, my gosh, it was a gorgeous wedding. Hal walked her down the aisle. And the day Kay was killed, investigators discovered Hal and a colleague had brought breakfast to Karen, who was home recovering from surgery.

And later, when he discovered Kay's body, Karen was his first call. She was destroyed because she and Kay were like very, very, I mean, extremely close. That's Karen Scott on police surveillance tape at Kay's funeral. You know, things change. Back then, we thought she was a good source. She would email me wanting to be kept up

on what was going on. All seemingly innocent that may not be. Documents show Karen had ongoing financial problems, but Hal was a generous boss. The money was great. I don't think she could have made that kind of money elsewhere. And she was ambitious. We looked into Karen. We looked into every other person at work. Who was closest to Kay, Hal, what they would gain if Kay was out of the picture. According to this police report, Karen admitted to detectives that with Kay's death

she possibly gained the opportunity to operate the company. But she also denied that she would have had any motivation to bring harm to Kay over those facts. And she described herself as Kay's best friend. And when I heard that I was like really? I mean that surprised me. Kay's sister and best friend Pam Sleeper. I know a best friend and their relationship was not like my best friends. Some work colleagues also question how close they really were. They were not best friends. Maybe to her face, but that's not what she was saying behind Kay's back.

We reached out to Karen Scott, and she sent us this letter stating, I lost my best friend to a brutal attack, but she declined our request for an interview. Karen has been questioned by investigators about Kay Wendell's death, and according to police reports, she adamantly denied any and all involvement. What's more, police say cell phone records back Karen's alibi, that she was home around the time of the murder,

and Richter says he's unable to connect her to the letter. We investigated that thoroughly, and quite frankly, we're still investigating it, but we can't find anything to suggest that Karen was responsible for the letter or that anybody in particular was responsible for that letter. With an unknown assailant still on the loose, Pam Sleeper says her determination to find her sister's killer comes with risk. I do walk around kind of scared sometimes. I wonder if he's going to be after me next because I don't give it up.

You think because you keep her name alive and you keep this case alive that somebody might come after you? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Hot shot Australian attorney Nicola Gaba was born into legal royalty. Her specialty? Representing some of the city's most infamous gangland criminals. However, while Nicola held the underworld's darkest secrets, the most dangerous secret was her own. She's going to all the major groups within Melbourne's underworld, and she's informing on them all. I'm Marsha Clark, host of the new podcast, Informants Lawyer X.

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That was the last picture taken of Kay on her 60th birthday. Pam Sleeper says that after Kay's murder, how Wennell was never the same. He called me every day. He was just lost. He missed her so much.

He would say, who? Why? I was like, I don't know how. That's what we're trying to find out. I try to stay busy morning, noon, night. I hate the mornings going to work because I know I'm coming home to that house at night. Weekends I despise. Howe may have hated being in the house, but he refused to leave it. If your wife or significant other was murdered in that house, wouldn't you want to get out of that house?

Private investigator Ned Timmons. You want to walk in the kitchen every day and have this vision of all this blood and her lying there with her throat cut you know it just didn't make sense still more perplexing to investigators how kept the house exactly as it was the day k was killed her sneakers next to the living room couch her book opened to the page she was reading, drops of her blood on the staircase. It was never cleaned up, even when our team showed up

months and months later. The house was exactly... Which is very strange. Very strange. Very strange. Exactly the way it was. You'd think you'd have a cleaning crew come in and cleanse that place,

but there was still the blood splatters. I want nothing more on God's earth than to find the guy who did this. And I'd give everything I have to get Kay Skiller. Even if it meant spending his fortune to do it. The Gwinnett County Police Department was having their financial difficulties. So it was really a bad time for law enforcement. Is that part of the problem here that... It's a problem everywhere. There was just no money there. Again, another reason Hal contacted these folks because they had so much more resources

available to them than we did. Ned Timmons says it was Hal who paid for much needed lab work to be done. I was dealing with a private laboratory weekly, and we sent a lot of fibers. We sent a lot of fluids for DNA sampling. And Hal would have to approve every time. Samplings are 5,000, 6,000 a hit. We had people in Las Vegas. We had leads in California. We had leads all over the country.

It was costing him a lot of money. Hal's quest came to an abrupt end in 2010 after he died of a heart attack. His estate cut off the $250,000 reward money and fired his private investigators. You know, there were things that we wanted to do, other leads that we wanted to follow up on. And then all of a sudden, you know, the executor says, you guys are all finished. We weren't happy about it,

I'll tell you that. As FBI agents, we don't ever want to quit. And we never wanted to stop, but we couldn't afford to finance it ourselves. The current cold case detectives seem to have made no headway, and their investigation appears stalled. This case on the face of it looks like it would be solvable. Why is it still open? From the amount of time put into it and the different investigators involved, I really don't have an answer for that, and that's the most frustrating part. And I think that's probably why we're here today, is that we'll get someone's attention and someone who knows something will call us. I know there's somebody out there that knows,

and I think they just need to come forward and let us know, you know. It would just help so much. We'd be so grateful. As they've done so many times, Pam's sleeper, her mother, and their husbands made an emotional visit to Kay's grave. If it was me, Kay would not give up. And I'm not going to give up.

Tonight investigators are asking for your help to solve Kay Wendell's murder. Once again, here is what we know. She was at home in Lawrenceville, Georgia on May 1, 2008, when she was viciously attacked. Investigators believe her assailant was a right-handed man wearing gloves who used a very sharp weapon. This unidentified man seen near the Wennell home the day of the murder may have been involved. And then, there's the cut-and-paste letter sent nearly three months later. People who think they get away with murder sigh a big sigh of relief when years go by, but this program is asked to contact

Gwinnett County Criminal Investigation Division Anonymous Tip Line at 770-513-5390 Crime Stoppers Atlanta 404-577-TIPS 1-404-577-8477 If you like this podcast, you can listen ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a quick survey at wondery.com slash survey. Paramount Podcasts.