Actions Detrimental with Denny Hamlin - "Can't Take Anything For Granted"

Episode Date: October 20, 2025

Denny Hamlin, Jared Allen, and Travis Rockhold recap a "typical Talladega" race that still provided plenty of excitement. Playoff chaos was in full swing with Chase Elliott getting caught up in an early-race wreck, Kyle Larson running out of gas during overtime, and Chase Briscoe stealing the win to clinch his spot in the Championship 4. What was Denny's week like as he turned his attention to the Phoenix finale, and does he think having a head start on preparation will help his Championship chances?1:01 - Typical Talladega 10:34 - Ty Gibbs Helps a Teammate17:28 - Bigger Bummer: William Byron or Kyle Larson?28:15 - Penske Mad at Brad Keselowski39:56 - AJ Allmendinger and Chase Elliott Wreck41:37 - Josh Berry and Ty Dillon's Pit Road Incident44:34 - Austin Hill Outclasses the Field...Again48:58 - Gio Ruggiero's 1st Truck Series Win50:45 - Martinsville Mindset for Bubble Drivers57:42 - Martinsville as Winner-Take-All Track58:47 - Off-track News and Updates Real fans wear Dirty Mo. Hit the link and join the crew.👇https://shop.dirtymomedia.com/For more Actions Detrimental content: https://www.youtube.com/@ActionsDetrimentalFanDuel Disclaimer: Must be 21+ and present in select states (for Kansas, in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino) or 18+ and present in D.C. First online real money wager only. $5 first deposit required. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable bonus bets which expire 7 days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG. Call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut, or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit GamblingHelpLineMA.org or call [phone] for 24/7 support in Massachusetts, or call 1-877-8HOPE-NY or text HOPENY in New York. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

I, however, am fairly decent at Martinsville, and I know that if there are three people that I know I'm going to have to beat this weekend, two of them are seventh and eighth. You're decent there? You're d'clock. The following is a production of Dirtymoe Media. I believe that I've been a competitive view for 20 years. Opinions from tonight's podcast, strictly biased.

You're going to hear from my point of view. I'm a fighter. No, you are not. This spoils a victory for Jared Allen. He's got better luck than Rick and Drake to win. I know, you do. Two trophies missing from your collection, a championship and the most popular driver.

Someone told me that their drinking game is when I say for sure. Yeah, and I've already said it. Hey guys, welcome to Actions Determinal post-Taladega, the middle race of the round of eight. We got two to go. Two to go. Two to go. um

counting down i'm getting tired how do you balance like i'm getting tired you got this championship you're fighting for but also for 38 weeks you're just going and like need the rest i'm tired

um I mean last week was a good off week for me um uh but still like I don't know what's going on lately but I'm sleeping

a lot and then waking up far more tired than I was when I went to bed. Like just, like I have this whoop that kind of monitors my sleep, and I'm getting April's sleep, plenty of sleep, and I'm even showing in the green. But golly, it's, it's, my sleep's not good or something. Maybe it's too good. Do three kids have anything to do with this?

Not really. They, not really. I think it's just the grind. It's just, you know, we're at the point of the season. This is how many straight weeks? Like 20 something? Oh, yeah, because off week was in. Not for me, though.

Not for you. No, but the off week was Easter this year, right? Yeah. Yeah, so. Sheesh. Okay. Well, Taldega was, I thought, typical. I don't know. I thought the end was predictable. I mean, if you looked over the last few Talladega races and kind of the track trends, it hasn't been a crazy wreck fest like we've had.

You get one. Yeah, you get one multi-car four, five, to seven, and then it doesn't happen. I mean, we almost had one, but somehow Buster was a solo. Yeah, that definitely could have been another one. But it turned out that was just one. But it's, yeah, I thought it was a pretty typical Talladega race. A lot of fuel saving going on for the larger chunk of the race, especially the reason that we do save fuel is that we're trying to make the pit stop under green as short as possible. so we try to save fuel. And the reason is that, well,

wouldn't track position over supersede fuel. The answer would be no, because when the pack is only separated by a second and a half, someone that can save, you know, 10% more gas, that's, you know, a couple seconds than pit road, so it can leapfrog you from being at the very tail to all the way at the front. And then there's a lot of other factors

that play into it as well, how good you get on and off a pit road, you know, plays a factor, how good you get in your pit box, all those things matter. But, yeah, it's typically, these races are mostly fuel mileage, mostly execution of how you do on pit lane.

And then it's the very end, you'll, it's who can, you know, master the, or guess right on the lanes that are, going to go at certain times. And so I thought the end of the race was exciting and certainly saw a lot of storylines up there. You know, the Toyotos made a great run. They had their line going there at the end. I think leading with Bubba, Chase and Ty, those three together was really getting a line going and moving. And they found themselves at the front, the 19 of Chase Brisco,

found himself up front at the end, winning the race and moving on the championship four. It was interesting. Chase even said he was okay just to keep pushing Bubba. Yeah. He thought, you know, that was the fastest, you know, best way for him to finish, you know, likely because due to the points, you know, he had won stage two, correct? Yeah. Or one or two.

Yeah, he was likely going to be in a pretty much locked in scenario anyway. I didn't see the points live. I didn't go back and see it. But I figure even if he finishes in the top two or three there, he's probably in a very, very good points position. So he was probably going to be okay with that result. But I think what happened is Bubba pulled down. No, Bubba didn't move down, right?

Bubba didn't move down. Larson ran out of fuel, which opened up that bottom lane. Yep, yep. Larson pulled down in front of Bubba. Is that what it was? and then Bubba lost the guy that was in front of him? No, Bubba was in the top lane the whole time. I think he could have moved down and he did it.

And then Briscoe did, I think. Yeah, and then Ty went with Briscoe and Gillen filled in behind Bubba. So, yeah, it was just a lot of chain of events there. And I certainly thought that when the five lost fuel, it was that definitely changed the complexion of how the end of the race played out. Just simply because whoever was in that line, you know, you just, you lose a car. And so your line automatically goes a little bit slower.

But then it's, you know, then you've got to get the line reorganized. So you've lost your leader of that line. There now needs to be a new leader. And then the others have their responsibilities to keep that line moving. So I thought that was just an inopportune time for those that were in Kyle Arson's line to, for it to work out for him. And ultimately, I think that's, I mean, you can go back and watch the replay and correct me for wrong. but I feel like that's a big reason why Briscoe ended up winning this race

because Bubba's line, the top line, falls apart coming off turn four. I don't know what happens to SVG here or Reddick, but the top line just completely falls apart and Bubba has no push from there. Yeah, it seems like the trend is, if I'm kind of thinking back, I remember Ross Chastain winning a Taldega race once where he didn't really do anything but just stayed on the bottom line. and he let the others fight up top.

And what happens is that that yellow line is your friend, especially off a turn four. The yellow line is your friend because you know no one can go left of you. And then to the right, if those guys try to go to the right and the track is so wide that they end up not pushing each other, they end up just fanning out. Well, then whoever just stays in line and most organized on the body, bottom, typically that line lunges to the start, finish line the best. And it's not every time,

but it just seems more times than not that the organization of the bottom, because they're pinned in there, helps that line go. Yeah, if you were to, if you were to go back here, when the bottom line falls out on the backstretch, if you're driving the 23 car, do you just stay where you are, or do you try to move down to that bottom line if you're trying to win the race? It looks like he wanted to stay middle there. Like he didn't want to go to the bottom and then just let Chase go by on the outside. So truthfully, the 23 did what probably I would have done. And that is, if you want to go to the bottom, go ahead.

But I am going around you no matter what. I'm going to stay my line. Know that help is coming. Because Chase made the decision to ultimately, you know what, screw it. I'm going for the lead here. The issue was, is that the 9th, for the 23 is that the 19 had the 54 behind him, who followed his teammate as he should. And so it still was like ample opportunity for either one of those cars to win,

but it's just the bottom lane, you know, if you look off a turn four, they just, they were more organized. And the top was still trying to figure out, are we going to go two wide, three wide? Right. And so it allowed them to just push out there just enough. And so the race winning move was made by Chase to I'm pulling out on the 23 here. And I think it was the right move for him.

And I think the 23 made the right move for him. And that is I'm staying my line. I want to be the top. I want to be the leader of the top line. Is this also smart by Britschle? Because if he goes down, Bubba, a Toyota has the top line. he's down in front of Byron. So now he kind of hedges his bets there.

You are. You're hedging your bet, no doubt. Which is why we saw the Hendrit cars line up, not nose to tail, but hey, let's just control both lines more than likely they're thinking, okay, well, the five or the 24 is going to win this race. Usually if you got both lines covered, in a green-white checkered, a third line is not really going to have time to form and get up there. So you're essentially liking your chances of winning if you just go ahead and let those two race it out.

You know, whoever gets the best push wins. So a teammate Ty Gibbs with the big move. Yeah, it was good to see. And a lot of it is he was definitely boxed in there. I don't know where he, you know, I don't think he had a lot of options, but he did have the option when the 19 pulled out. And that was to either stay straight and go with the 23

or push the 19. But I think that in that moment, more than likely, he was like, okay, I'm going to go with my teammate here and end all doubt on that. But also that would have been the potential winning move for a tie, right? Like he's got a better chance of winning this race by going with the 19 and potentially clearing the 23. I think the chances are equal.

I mean, when you're the second car in line, it's, again, it's so 50-50 on which lane's going to push the best. but yeah actually i'm looking at this the outside line didn't the outside line fell apart because the 45 went to the outside of the 88 okay so that's what happened it wasn't that that ended all the top lines momentum um all it takes is one person in that top line to pull out and go three wide i'm telling you folks you can't you can't imagine at home you're thinking everyone's wide open

and we're just running as quick as we can, but when you can feel inside your car and you hear the RPMs, and it's singing at a certain tone, the minute someone four cars back of your line pulls out or gets out of line, you can instantly hear it go, like your line just dies and speed. And a lot of it is because the drag that is getting divided by 10 cars, is now divided by seven cars.

And it's just, it's not, it's not going to be as fast. And so if you look, the top line actually looks like they still had a legit shot. But when the 45 pulls out a line, it's the whole line just, it just goes dead ass backwards. And that's just the benefit of being in the bottom line is that those cars can't go anywhere. They can't pull out to the bottom. They can't go anywhere. They got nowhere to go. And so, yeah, that was a key moment, no doubt about it.

But it's at Super Speedway Racing. It was whatever line stays organized, the best wins, and the bottom line did it. Well, now we've got two JGR cars locked into the championship for yourself and Chase Brisco. Yeah, it's great for Chase. He's such a good dude, and he's been a really good teammate and really happy for him and James Small. and I know that James works really, really hard for that 19 team, and I love all their crew guys over there. Really happy for them to have this opportunity.

Does that change the amount of resources that are going into prep for your car now that you've got two JGR cars into Phoenix? No, I don't think so. Yeah, I don't think so. I don't know how soon that stuff all gets determined. What it does do, from my standpoint, it's another data point. I'm going to know what one of my competitors has. Now the downside is one of my competitors will know what I have. When it comes to more than likely at some point, we will run each other's setups to see, you know, what does he like?

What's he going to go into this weekend with? And I'm going to probably do the same. You know, one variable, though, for me personally, and we're all cocky and we all feel as though we're the best is that I'm not going to get beat by equipment. You know what I mean? For at least one of my competitors. So it just puts more pressure on me to go out there and get it done.

But that was more than likely going to happen anyway. The chance of more than one JGR driver in the championship for it was fairly likely. Yeah. Yeah. How we left Vegas, yeah, they were in a good points position. If they avoided getting wrecked at Talladega, it was, they were likely going to be in a great position. And they still are.

The X factor is who wins Martinsville, right? I mean, this thing looks very uninteresting from the outside. You got guys plus 36, plus 37. But I'm telling you, if someone comes from that bottom, bottom and wins this race, that complexion, the race for fourth becomes wildly entertaining. Yeah, because all day, Larson and Bell need to points race each other to make sure that neither one of them are the fourth guy in case Ablaney or Byron or Lugano or Chase. Yeah. Elliot wins the race.

Yeah, and to be clear, Larson was okay with a chase victory. I'm okay with a chase victory. Bell is okay with a chase victory. So there's four, and Chase, of course. So there's four of us that were, this is all good, no problems. Now for me, again, they said, well, don't you want to know or pick or choose who's going to be in? No, I say one, come on, come all. I'm going to have to beat them all to win the championship anyway.

So it doesn't really matter to me who you put in that in that final race. Now, I think that, you know, what I'm getting to is that if someone from the bottom four won this race today, yes, it changed that. Now Larson's in a more vulnerable spot. Briscoe, Bell, they're all in such a vulnerable spot now

because that spot got taken that, you know, know, it wasn't planned for. You know what I mean? You scored, you had two really, really good races, and you're still right there on the cut line. So that's the whole thing with winning you're in. It's just, it's really nervous when you get someone from the bottom that wins. And so I think this was, again, Larson probably was okay with this because it didn't,

it still put him in a really good points position. And, you know, talk about, I don't. I don't know that it's luck, but just crap finish of, he goes from thinking he's going to race for the wind to 25th or something. Like, what a bummer. Still better than Byron, though. You think whose was more disappointing? I think Byarsons.

You all got two different answers. You said Byron? Yeah. I mean, they're both disappointed. I would have said Larson because he's leading his line going down the backstretch. Byron, he's coming off a turn four thinking, all right, I'm going to finish in the top five. So I give the nod to Larson on that, but still Byron, you've got to have a little bit of sympathy for. That's what I'm saying.

He's like, look where Byron sits now, though, whereas he would have been. Where would he have been? I would have loved to see. Minus 15? Where is he right now? Minus 37. And they said he lost 24 points. That's what they said on TV.

20-something points. So he's right there. And then, I know we're just, we're doing this on the fly. But he would have been minus 15 to who? Bell? Yeah, Bell. No. Larson had more points than all of them.

I'm saying if Briscoe won and... Briscoe wins. Then he's... Okay, so then he's minus 15 to both of them. Because they're essentially almost tied in points, I think, plus 36, plus 37, Larson and Bell. So he would have had, he could have out, he's thinking I would have been minus 15 to those two guys. All I need is one of them to have a bad day. Or not even a bad day.

Like you can just beat him by a couple spots each stage, and next thing you know, you're there. So, yeah, I see your point, Trav, that it's probably Byron because now he goes from thinking at Martin's always got a legit shot to just run well and get in to, yeah, must, must win. Where Larson went from being locked, you know, if he's 20 points more, yeah, he's locked in to now Larson's in a, I don't know, I think he's in a vulnerable. spot. Like, Chase or Blaney are the most likely of the bottom four to go out there and win and get themselves in. Just off of results. I'm just talking Martinsville results.

I'm not downplaying Byron, Lugano, any of them. I mean, Byron, I guess I could see that too. I like Byron when he plays from behind. I am a big Byron fan when he's on the office. offense. Defense, I don't like Byron. For the record, I'm only saying Larson was more disappointing because I'm factoring how the race ended for these guys, right? It was Larson's situation of running out of fuel completely within the team's control, whereas, yes, Byron just gets, it didn't tap wrong from behind. Right. That's not as to control. And so

yes, the team cut him short on fuel. They're trying to get him. track position with 17 laps to go, putting in the bare minimum fuel that they need to. Now, did Larson stay in his box as long as they told him to? I don't know. These are all the details, I don't know. But either way, they didn't get enough fuel in the car for to get to the finish. And really, lots of cars are probably lucky this didn't go into another green. white checkered. If you looked at the 22 and the 12, they pitted on their green white checker, you know, because they cut their fuel so short.

We know Penske cuts their fuel way, way short. You know, if we ever get in overtime, it's 99% of time Penske cars will not make it. I know. Unless there's seven overtimes. National is a different, I'm talking about on super speedways. They cut it, they cut it way, way short. So, and they ended up getting bit by it. Eventually, the law of averages say that, okay, you can only be short so much before eventually

you're going to catch a caution that's not going to be advantageous for you and it's going to burn you. And it, I don't think it changed the, I don't think a Penske car was going to win going into the two laps to go. I think you saw Blaney was stuck on the bottom. Ligano was, he actually went back to the back of the pack. did a reset. So he was... Well, that was before the restart. Yes, before the restart.

He did a reset because he saw that his inside line was just getting murdered. We can argue why it was getting murdered, but it was just... They just kept going back. And everyone on the top line just kept going up, pulling up in front, going up, pulling up in front. And they find themselves 10th car on the bottom. Like, I think Ligano at that point just aborted and says, okay, let me just get to the back of the back, get back to the top and reset. you know and they still ended up having to pit on that green white checkered but regardless i know

we're all over the place um i think my point was is that while things look that like they're pretty much in focus of who's going to be in the final four i just you cannot undersell number seven and eight in points blaney and elliott is being the two most wildest of wild cards going into this weekend. And if that happens, then the Bell Larson duel will be epic. Elliot 20 starts one win, Blaney 19 with two wins. I mean, the Bell Larson duel is going to be epic no matter what. I hear you. I, however, am fairly decent at Martinsville. And I know that if there are three people that I know I'm going to have to beat this weekend, two of them are seventh and

I was going to add that Blaney has 10 top fives and Elliot has eight top five. So if you're right in that picture. They are in the picture every single time. You're decent there? You're a... You were, I think for the first time that I, since working with you, were animated about the car and your issues. Oh, no, I've been animated before. But the last...

Since you've had this podcast, though, I feel like you never say anything on the radio or the podcast that in any way, shape, or form is negative about the pit crew or anything? I don't know. I don't know that that is true. But by the way, my tone yesterday wasn't like angry or anything like that. It was just a matter of fact, like, we got to get, we got to get it figured out. Like, yeah, it's really, really frustrating because you want, again, we want our results. dictated by our performance on the racetrack.

Nothing, I'm telling you guys, nothing would absolutely suck worse than to go to Phoenix and have a mechanical or something happened that took your opportunity to achieve your dream out. And so it's just, we've had some issues with batteries and starters and clutches and just lots, lots, lots, lots, lots this year.

And I had all three. And, you know, I always like to, you know, how should I word this? You know, I go there and I took the week off as far as preparation for Daga is concerned. not that I really prepare for Dega as much as I'll prepare for another racetrack most of my time was spent obviously on a few weeks from now but you know

I'm thinking well what if what if we didn't win you mean like this could have been a pivotal moment in our championship hopes that's kind of where my frustration lied and I don't think anyone at the shop, you know, when you look at the issues that we had,

I don't, I don't think it's anyone necessarily at the race shop that is doing something wrong. You know, my, especially the guys that put my cars together just are phenomenal. Brandon and his whole team, like I, I would go to war with that A team versus anyone. It's just more of a, I don't know, just more of a, just a mechanical issue. And it's not necessarily things that we put together that, you know, would love to see us fix. I don't know that we're going to fix it in a couple weeks, but you just hope that it doesn't play a factor when it really, really counts at the end of these races, especially the final race. So how do you not worry about something like this? that you say is kind of out of years.

Yeah, because I can't change it regardless. If it happens, it happens, it doesn't, it doesn't. But you just cross your fingers and hope that the luck gods will stay in your favor for one more week or the final week. It also just feels like just a little reminder of like, hey, we're in the championship. Let's just do everything in our power to remember that let's have everything buttoned up. Yeah, that's a great point, Jared. Fantastic point.

that like it sometimes it is a good reminder that you just can't take things for granted you know what mean and and nobody is you know trying anything out of the ordinary or again i don't think it's i said the shop but that is a very let me just say that's a very vague term that's not i don't believe these issues are in in the race shop that makes any sense and i'll leave it at that Penske's mad at Kislauski? Yeah, Penske's mad at Kuzlowski. Yeah, I had to go back and look at it. I see their beef.

I don't know that, like, you're not always going to have things go your way. But what their beef was was that the six was not keeping their line moving. and we've said on this podcast many times that when you see your favorite driver in a given line and you're hoping that line goes forward, it goes way beyond that driver's responsibility. And if they're leading it, the leader of that pack is just a bystander of what happens well beyond him. And we talked about when the 45 pulled out of the top line, it just killed that whole top line coming. of the start finish line. It's while who was in front, the 22 or the 12?

I think it was the 12th. The 22 was doing his best to stay attached to the 12. I thought he was actually doing a really good job. The 6 always kind of had like a gap to the 22. And so he wasn't giving Joey enough of a shove to push the 12 as much as he probably wanted to. and then that goes back to well then i as a competitor because i know how this works i'm like okay well who's behind the six you know and you got to kind of back it you got to keep backing up to

figure out where's the disconnect because all it takes is one person and that line choosing to say i don't want to go all out i want to i need to save fuel here it just takes one person in that line to not be all out for that line to just not go anywhere And so I don't know the details. It looks like to me that the 6 should have been able to keep up with the 22. He didn't for whatever reason. And I don't know if it was trying to save fuel. Maybe they were short on fuel.

Maybe I look at the 60. By the way, that whole other side issue, me and you were trying to look, and I'm watching the replay on, okay, on a computer like this. and I couldn't tell who the fourth car in line on the bottom was. I'm looking and I'm like, who is that? And I'm like, that's on TV. It's a larger issue. You could not even tell what car that was.

That's a different tangent. But it was the 60. And so, was he doing his job, you know, keeping the six? You know, he's got to stay tight on the six to make sure he takes the drag off the six to then he can get to the 22. and then the 22 now can be more aggressive pushing the 12 and then that line forward. There are so many factors that you would truthfully need a simulcast of someone explaining this as you're watching it for the fans at home to understand it.

But we're trying our best today to tell you all the factors and why maybe your driver didn't, you know, their line didn't go on a given day. but that's what Penske was complaining about is that the six was not staying close enough to them to keep their line moving. And Joey said something about, well, me and the 12 were doing our jobs, but if anyone in your line was,

if they're trying to save fuel, then your line's never going to go forward. I don't know whether maybe he was told that the six was saving fuel, but you said that Bollin said after the race, they weren't saving fuel. Yeah, they were fine. He told Jordan Bianchi.

Yeah, so then I, as a driver, I would need to go back and look and see, was Kazowski wide open during that last run or was he laying off for a reason? Or was he not getting the help that he needed? My thing is also is, so what if he was saving fuel? That's not his problem. Like, it's okay for you to save fuel during the race, but at this point you don't want people to save fuel so it's not allowed? Well, I think what he's saying is that everyone came to pit road to get the fuel they need.

So everyone should have been fine on fuel. So there was no reason for anyone to be saving fuel inside 15 laps to go. This just feels like general frustration. The race was going great for Penske all day. And here's the last moment that we can point to of where it turned. But truthfully, there's 10 plus laps to go. And if it wasn't this, it could have been anything that shuffled Penske out of the mix. Jared with the A plus take again.

And it's just, I don't know. It is. It's sour grapes. but it's understandable. They look great. I have sympathy for it because it's like, damn it, we had control.

I would feel the same way. I'm like, I'm telling you, if I were Joe, I wouldn't, I don't know if I'd say what he said. Maybe I would. But I would feel the same way.

It's like, come on, dude. Like, you got it. You can't be lagging back on me. I need you on me. At all times, we have to keep this lane moving.

And again, without more information, I'm telling you, the six was not. not on the 22 as much as he should have been. But I don't know whether it was his fault or not. Yeah, if it's like there's just could have been a lot of factors. Yep.

Involved. Oh, do we want to get into a weepers and SVG? Talladega is notorious from if it rains the day before. It's usually got weepers. It's got parts of the track that that water does come up. And I was in the bus when it torrential downpored on Saturday. early Saturday morning, late Saturday night. The first thing I thought of was those poor people

and those tents out there, holy cow, it was, that was as hard a rain as I'd heard or felt in quite some time. And then when I wake up, I'm thinking, and I hear the track drying going on, my first thought was, I don't need to see it. I know there's going to be weepers coming to pit, lane and then there's going to be a weeper on the exit of pit lane right by the start finish line we saw john hunter

spin out there um last last last race or maybe it was two races ago same thing he hit it on corner uh on pit ex pit exit and he spun out but then when i'm looking at it on our pace laps i'm like i was looking and there was not a clear lane without hitting water somewhere some of it it seemed like you know, let's just pretend the racetrack, the yellow line, a car width on the inside of the yellow line, let's call that lane one, lane two is extra car down, lane three is another car down. Lane two was like the best for not having water, but each lane had some water. And that's just a very vulnerable part of the racetrack where we are trying to get all we can. and I talked about earlier, this is an execution race of on and off a pit road.

Everyone's going to try to get all they can. And I just, I didn't see a way that we weren't going to wreck, just simply because of the amount of water that was there. And just, there was no way to really escape it. So I was surprised that it was only a single car incident. I mean, you saw like when he was sliding, like he clipped the 24. It was actually not bad because he didn't cost the other people that much time. I mean, he did screw up the Penske cars.

NASCAR was doing their best and not through a caution because it was in the middle and they hadn't pitted yet. Yeah, but yeah, what they were, which they obviously made the correct call because you can't leave the 88 sitting there in the grass because what happens is if the Penske cars come back around, which they were going to come back around and pit, if they missed pit road at all. and hit maybe the same water, they could have slid right into the 88 who was sitting there.

So it was unlucky for the Penske cars. However, when I told my team early on, just FYI, someone's going to wreck coming to pit road. At 226, you said that. Like, basically the race just started. Yeah, it's because I wanted to make sure we were the first to pit lane. That way, when the caution does come out for whoever wrecks,

we'd already done our pit stop. and that cycles us to the front. That was my roundabout way of telling the team, make sure we're not last to pit road because someone's going to wreck during it and then we're going to end up getting caught being at the tail end because we hadn't pit yet. Yeah, surprised though, that it took until stage two

for that time? Surprisingly. Like it wasn't the first pit entry of the day. And a lot of it was because that was the most cars that I'd seen come to pit road at one time. other like in the first stage it seemed like it was broken up and do five cars here six cars there like that was a pack of cars it seemed like a third of the field that came what happened with you and the hendrick cars there early in the race you're trying to get down to pit i was um early in

the race i decided that i'm going to try to save fuel uh which i did and i think i went back to last yeah was i last i thought i was yeah And then I saw that the pace just slowed down so much that I'm like, I think I can drive to the front here. So just go ahead and burn the fuel because the field had gotten spread out so much that I was probably four seconds behind the leader because it had started to single file out and the field was running slow. So I'm like, well, no matter how much fuel I'm saving here,

I can't make that back up with less fuel when we come to pit road. So I just said, screw it, I'm going to go ahead and go wide open here, drive to the front. We did. The downside of that is I ended up getting stuck in the top lane. And I was so close to being able to pull down. I think at the time I had Kyle Bush or somebody right in front of me. And he kept motioning me to push him because I think he wanted to pit. so he wanted me to clear him so he could get low.

I think he was able to. I was not. My team was screaming at me like, we're almost out of fuel. So I actually, if you watch, during that SVG wrecked the pit lane, I was up on the wall and had to pull down. I had to go to the back of the pack. So even though I drove all the way at the front, we were going to run out of gas. So he says you have to pit now.

And I'm at the, I am trying to get out of the top. of the way. I'm up by the wall off a turn four, trying to let everyone go so I can pull down and pit. And it was a cluster. I don't know what else to say. I just, I pulled down eight lanes turned left and hoped that nobody wiped me out on the way to pit lane. But luckily, that was when the SVG thing happened and it actually worked out. Two other incidents in this race, in that wrecked involve Chase Elliott. It's the wind knocked out of him, and then the car catches on fire.

Yeah, I couldn't. I couldn't, I saw what happened, but I didn't know what happened to AJ, but I guess he did say that the wind got knocked out of him on that one. Yeah, and then the smoke. Yeah, so my guess is that's probably not a good combination. Apparently it took like 40 seconds or something, for them to get to him.

So the people are a little critical about that. Now, I understand that, but I don't know whether, did he keep driving? Is my question? Like, sometimes it's hard for them to get to you if you are still moving because you're now a moving target versus just wherever you crash, just stop.

So it usually does take more time. And I saw that he was nearly the entrance of pit lane and that's definitely not where he crashed. Yeah, the video I'm watching is him getting out of the car and then he just lays on the ground. Yeah, and they're trying to get to him. Yeah, that was a tough one. That caught up Chase Elliott amongst some others,

but he was the most notable because he was in the points fight. Just wrong place, wrong time. I looked at Chase's end car and it's just like, I mean, what do you do? You know, it's just the Taldega gods. motioned you at this time and there's not really anything he could have done about it. Another incident, not sure if you saw a replay of this or not, but the 21 car is on the jack, on pit road and there's a crew guy in and under the right rear wheel well. And then the 10 car pulls out of his box running over or into a tire that's sitting there.

Just the safety issue here. Yeah, it's certainly. I mean, it doesn't look good, but I'll try to give the benefit of the doubt. I never think that anyone has ill intentions to screw anyone else over or hurt someone. In my opinion, if everyone had to do it over again, Ty Dillon was just backed up. I don't know where he was in the pack at that time. Was he fighting for track position to try to get off a pit lane as quick as he could? it looked like to me that the 10 was a first too deep in his box um if you look at the replay of when

he did pit it appeared he was you know and he wasn't going around anyone that i saw he went too deep in his box well then you know the 21 is sitting there i guess they're working on his car and so he doesn't want to have to back up go back forward and then lose probably another five positions that you'll lose by having to do that. So he tries to squeak out of there. And I've done that before where I'm trying to squeak out of there. Now, I would say if I'm Todd Dillon, and this is the part where I try to rationale with his thinking,

is that does he even see that there's someone working on the car? Like, I'm telling you in the car, you can't see anything below a certain level. You know, when you're looking out the windshield, you can't see a tire sitting on the ground. You certainly can't see a person. on the ground. I don't know that he saw that.

I think that he just said, well, if I can clear the bumper of the 21, then I'm all good. But unfortunately, someone was sitting there with a tire right behind them and knocked the tire into the guy. So, yeah, it certainly looked bad.

Is that on the crew chief? Like, hey. I was about to ask, is there in a situation like this? Is there anyone spotting the pit boxes around you being like, hey, heads up. There's a guy.

I think they would normally tell me that the 21 will be in his pit stall. They're working on their car. That's it, though. That's it. That's all they would say to me. But if you're tied Dillon's, what that means is that you've got to back him up. So wherever he chooses to come in into his pit stall,

move the sign back, allow him room to get out without cutting it close. but it certainly had a lot of his car in their pit box on exit. Austin Hill wins the Xfinity Race. Who saw that coming? I did. I did.

Me and Jared, hey, here's the good news. Not all is lost. I did get a text from someone in sales at JGR saying, just making sure that you're still wanting to run an Xfinity race.

race at Daytona. I says, yes. Please. So if you are a company, we are looking, I'm looking for a one race sponsorship for Daytona in the Xfinity series. Ohio State, pick up the phone. You know, Ohio State car. It's frustrating. And it's not Austin Hills Fall because I'm watching the drivers behind him and they just cannot get it. organized enough to create a run. And when they do create a run, they allow him to block and then they just lift. And so it's painful to watch. But he's just, his car is better than everyone else's and he is better than everyone else.

And it's not his fault. So he's going to continue to win these things as long as these Xfinity drivers don't learn from their mistakes. and figure out how to create a run. And it's not always the second place driver's fault. Sometimes it's the third place, because what the third place driver does, and I've seen this multiple times now, Jared, you brought it up,

and the bus is that even when the second place driver, and I'm explaining drivers, I'm trying to help you out here, even when the second place driver starts to back up to the third place, the third place pulls out of line and then starts racing the second place guy, And it's like, you will not win that way. You're now giving the win to whoever is currently leading.

You need to push third place Xfinity drivers. You need to push the second place guy beside the 21. And then you have options. You have the option to either continue to follow them, go three wide, or you've got the option of these two are going to get together and I'm going to go sweeping by on the inside and win this race. So the problem doesn't necessarily lie always with the second place driver in the Xenity series.

It does in the third and fourth because they're so caught up in racing each other instead of creating a run to win the race. That's where they got to get better. And it's, listen, names are made here. Most of them haven't been here a long time and they are learning. but that's how I see Austin Hill as an unstoppable force in the Xfinity series is that he knows how to get to the front.

Now his car, I think information in the insiders would tell you his cars, his engines and such are definitely faster than everyone else's. But he knows what to do and nobody else does. Yeah. Yeah, it just takes a collective group. Once he gets the lead, it takes a couple people. to have to get together to pass him, not just like one or two people.

Yeah. And now, listen, if I ran Xfinity race and I were second to Austin Hill, we might have the same result because whenever I start to back up to third, they're likely to just pass me or try to pass versus creating a run. But you never know.

I'd love a shot at it. And not just because of Austin Hill. I want to because it looks really, really fun. Those Xfinity cars have a, bubble behind them that is larger than what the cup cars are. So you create runs. There's more space between the cars. And so there's opportunities to make runs, build a run, take the run, get back in line. There's space to do that where if you look at the cup cars, we're all just two by two by two by two, and now we're all just hitting each other trying to get our line to go, where XFindy cars has much more

space. And that's more like what Super Speedway used to be in the cup series. series. Gio Ruggiero gets his first win winning the truck race at Talladega. What did you say, Travis? Someone named... A guy not named Coreyheim. He came close. Congrats, but... He came close. Great, great win for him.

He's kind of been like, I don't know, the second in line at Tri-Con as far as, like, performance. Performance-wise, I think that's probably fair to say. It kind of depends on who's on the one truck on any given week. But, you know, awesome for David Gilland and all the work that that whole Tri-Con team has put together. Yeah, they're just, they're killing it. Toyota's won a bunch of races. Surely they've won the manufacturers. I don't even know if there is the manufacturers and trucks.

But they continue to put out race-winning trucks. It was a great race to the end. Corey, I thought, was going to get to the out. outside of them, but just it almost looked like to me, Corey was like, seconds okay. Like if I go up and he blocks and we crash, like, I just felt like he was resigned to the fact that like, all right, I'm going to push here. And then if I see a blindly obvious move, I'm going to take it. But if not, this is where I'm going to finish. Resigned to the fact that I've won 10 races this year and I'll push you

Yeah. And a side note in Xfinity, I guess Connor Zilch's street got broke, right? Of like top five, top twos or some like that. The kids going nowhere in life. I know. What a failure. Speaking of Martinsville coming up, what's this week like for specifically the cup drivers, but any of the ones that are below that cut line? Like you've, or you're above but you're not safe. like what's this week like for a driver? Yeah. I think it,

so the week for Elliot Blaney, Legano, and Byron is 100% every waking minute of this week is focused on Martinsville and doing everything you can't. You're trying to find any slither of information

that maybe you haven't turned over in the past that is going to make the difference in you winning this race or not. There is no Phoenix for them. You got to think that, especially Penske, they don't have anyone that's borderline in. So at least the Byron and Elliott have Larson that's probably doing some Phoenix work, which is, I mean, truthfully for me, it's probably less of an advantage now for me have winning that first race in Las Vegas because now I've got, one, so one that's locked in and then two that are virtually if those other guys don't win.

So what I'm saying is the advantage of winning the first and being able to work an extra time that others don't is not as much because there's no doubt that the Bell and Larson's are working on Phoenix this week. Just simply because of their points position. They're not having to go all out, all in on Martinsville. Really? I don't think so. But they got to be better than each other at Martinsville. I mean, it's very, very much likely that Elliot or Blaney or Byron could win at Martinsville. So if you're...

You're saying it's more likely than not that the odds would not agree with you. I know what the odds would say, but you've just seen it so many times here. It'd be interesting. that's a very good hypothetical that I would love to see. Does someone, so you get Byron, Ligano, Blaney, and Elliott versus the field. I hope the odds come out with that. I would love to see that number. My guess is it's probably Byron, Ligano, Blaney, Elliott versus the field.

I mean, I still think you're getting plus money on that. I still think that the favorite, I don't know, those are, it's close. It's close. I still think it's more unlikely than not, but it's close. Just based on the fact that there's 40 cars in the race, yeah. Yeah, but there's not 40 cars that can win. You can take a few out. Yeah.

Yeah. And, you know, are we going to see a surprise winner? I don't know. Todd Gill. No, we're not. We're not going to see a surprise winner. It's going to be the cream of the crop. These eight guys are going to be up towards the front. I just think if you're the 20 team of the five team, you've got to make sure that you're better than the other car because you don't want to be fourth in the standings. Yeah, you're right. You're right. But I can tell you, they're not working on Martinsville as much as those bottom four. I don't think there's any way.

Sure, sure. Well, those, yeah, those bottom four have to win. absolutely. On a scale of zero being no issues and 10 being absolute show, what do we see from the Exfinity cars? Can someone give me the points for that? I'm just talking about just how they race. Forget them.

What do you mean? Is trucks theirs too? Yeah. I mean, what's fuck? For the Xfinity series, Zillich is already through. Algar is already through. Jesse Lovis plus 40.

Carson Quapples plus 11. Sammy Smith is minus 11 Brandon Jones minus 20 Sam Mayer minus 22 and Sheldon

Crete's got to win it's always a shit show Trav I don't know what to tell you there's going to be a caution with 20 to go and then it's just

going to be caution after caution after caution and everyone's going to be shoving each other into the corner just yeah no regard

I love to give them the benefit of the doubt but I think we've seen enough they've lost that yeah and if that Xfinity series points situations into it before you the truck series

Corey Hyme is obviously through Raja Karuth plus 14 Tyler Rankine Raja's second plus eight Caden Honeycutt plus five Ty Majeski minus five lane rigs minus six Daniel Hemericks probably must win minus 32 and Grant and Finger is I will be tuned in

so that one's close I'm tuned in FS1 on is that Friday night Friday night Oh yes show engaged Oh that one's That one's got that one's got all the

the elements just primed for a show. Yep. Yep. Yeah. Who do you like in the cup race at Martinsville? Other than yourself. You can't pick yourself. God bless.

Who would you be least surprised to see win this race? The easy answer is Ryan Blaney because he's done it before. my I'm going to say William Byron I think

William has the potential to go set on the pole and dominate the race and you know it becomes execution at that point but you know but then I put Chase Elliot right

1A 1B who are my least surprised Blaney who would I not be surprised Byron and Elliot I just I know that's not the answer you're looking for but it's

I'm telling you three of the favorites are freaking fifth, seventh, and eighth. When it comes to needing certainly three of the top five favorites. You got to think. Yeah, for sure. When it comes to needing to have to win a race, we have to win this race to move on to Phoenix.

Where does Martinsville rank in all of the Cup series tracks? It's like, if we got to do this, that, I want to go and do it. I want to be racing there, you know. If you have to win a race, you're not going to want to have to go to Talladega and do that. Where's Martin'sville? I think it's a fair, fair indicator of strength of team and driver. Yeah, I do. Now, it's got a little bit more variability because of, you know, sometimes the restarts can get out of control. It depends on how many of these guys are up front in the first couple rows if we do have a restart inside

you know 20 30 laps um but i think it's a fair indicator of strength of car and driver so i it's good no issues there a few off track news here justin haley out at spire going in 2026 uh yeah it's unfortunate for justin you know he was running so well in that Rickware car and obviously got the call up, got traded to Spire for Corey LaJoy. They switched rides. But just never, I don't know, it just never clicked.

It just never clicked. And they had Rodney Choders at the beginning of the year. and I don't know it would be interesting from a statistical standpoint of I know when Spire got rid of Rodney, I think I'd saw a few mentions of look at the results. He is better. That team is better than it was before. But they chose to get rid of him. And it just, I don't know, he just never saw.

I just never saw enough out of the seven that I was seeing in the seven. 77 or the 71. And so I don't know the reason for that. I don't know the company enough to know the strengths and weaknesses. Is it leadership? Is it engineering? Is it the pit crews far worse? Or is the driver not as good as the driver as the other two? I don't know. So for me, it would all be speculation and I don't really care to throw anyone under the bus. But certainly you can't argue that the results were not there for whatever the reason were. Jim Pullman to RCR to crew chief Kyle Bush in 2026. I think that's probably the best option they could get, right?

I think that it's good to see some of these crew chiefs getting the call up to the Cup series. We did it getting Charles DeNike from the 19 truck. last year and putting him on the 23 this year with no cup experience whatsoever um i i guess jim did have a role at rc rc rc at one point yeah and he i think he even was doing something when the next gen was coming in with them so like he's got at least some experience not obviously crude shaving but yeah and it that's some of the reason we were uh we recruited uh billy scott so much um for the 45 back in the day was that you know he he he he he

He knew the next-gen car. He was part of the development. When he was at RCR, he helped NASCAR with the development of the next-gen car. So we thought we'd get a leg up by having someone who was familiar. Now, enough time has gone by in the next-gen era that, like, I don't know that Jim's going to know anything more. His title at RCR before was Head of Research and Development. Yeah, so he probably, more than likely, he worked with Billy Scott at some point on the development. of the next-gen car.

Now, like I said, enough time has gone by to where I don't think that there's an advantage, but maybe it's just a fresh set of eyes, right? I like that RCR is hiring out of the company versus promoting someone. More than likely, if someone was really, really good within the shop, their cars will be running better, right? And so bring in a new set of eyes

that hasn't seen this thing for a while. maybe he can make maybe he can come up with something to where why aren't you guys looking at y versus x you know what i mean i think that there's advantages to doing that and that is the advantage of hiring from the outside is it's very very difficult when you're within a company for such a long period of time to not just morph your ideas into the same overtime so hopefully it gets cowbush the the performance uh jump that he's looking for lastly, the booze were back at driver introes this week.

I didn't think they were as bad, were they? You were there. I mean, they were, I don't know, they were noteworthy. Jeff tweeted about them. But it's also because we just saw the previous week where there was none. So it's like, all right, the fans are like, all right, we gave you your flowers.

Now, fuck you, Daddy. It's okay. And I think that has to probably feel a little good, right? No, it's fine. It's all good. As long as there's not silent. That would be the worst. See, that would be funny if the fans could somehow get together and just come out and they're just crickets.

Really? That would hurt my feelings. That would just be funny for one week. Yeah, I don't think they're going to get organized enough to do that. No, it's, I thought it was fine. I didn't notice anything. I thought it was 60-40. Cheers?

Where it's usually 40, 60. or maybe 70-30. I don't know. I don't mean to over-understate it. But go ahead. I can review here from Hugh Sprag. This old racing fan totally enjoyed the badass way you won this race accompanied by the display of emotions in the moment,

referring to Las Vegas last week. I was pissed my guy, had to finish second, but such as life in racing and straight-up competition. Hell, you had me pulling for you to win the championship and get a 60-plus wins. Appreciate that. Thank you for that review. We appreciate you tuning in. And yeah, it's Vegas. I don't know. That was just, it just was a super gratifying one for me, no doubt about it. But it is in the past.

We've got to look forward and got two more weeks to get this thing done. So appreciate that. And I guess we'll see you guys after Martinsville.