American Presidents: Totalus Rankium - 16.1 Abraham Lincoln

Episode Date: May 25, 2019

It's a big one! A young axe-wielding turkey-murderer set out one day to find his fortune - little did he know that his path would lead him to become the president of a country on the verge of civil war. But just how did Abraham get there? How was he with the ladies? Did he tell a ripping good yearn? was he really all that honest? Find out in this week's Totalus Rankium (With improved sound!) 

Welcome to Totalus Rankium. This week, Abraham Lincoln. Part 1. Hello and welcome to American Presidents Totalus Rankium. I am Jamie. And I'm Rob, ranking all of the presidents from Washington to Trump. And this is Abraham Lincoln. Oh, who? It's a big one, Jamie. It's a big one. We're finally here. Thank you, but who's the president? Oh, you've got to find out more about him today.

Oh, this is quite exciting, actually, because I know a little bit about Abraham Lincoln. You do? Well, in the sense that he didn't have a beard, then he had a beard. Yes. He was president during most of the Civil War. Right. And through the end of it is what I believe. I could be wrong.

Yeah. Yeah. The Emancipation Proclamation. Nice. And he was shot by John Wilkes Booth. Is that the name? No, he's shot in a booth. Oh, shot in a booth. Yeah, people always make that mistake.

Right, okay, well, most of that is actually going to be next time. Because today we're going to go from Washington's early life all the way up to his inaugural address. Nice. Are you ready for this? Yes! Blackness. Then just the sound.

Clickety-clack. Clickety-clack. Clickety-clack. It's a train, James. Oh, train. Yeah. It's a dodgy train. That is so much better.

That is so much better. Told you. You're in charge of train noises from now on. Yes! Let's start that again. Responsibility. Black. Okay.

Then, Q-train. Don't stop. My tongue's getting tired. I didn't think that could happen. Okay, well, we'll just if you're listening, pretend that's continuing. Right. Okay. Woo-hoo! A shot. Says a passenger. He's very happy.

Yeah. Shot through a window. Dark landscape. Things whooshing by. Trees and things in the distance. Then a shot inside. Close-up of someone tapping their fingers. They're looking a bit nervous.

Then a shot of a light swinging in the... What were they called? Carriage? Carriage. But they had compartments, so they're just called compartments. Yeah. Oh, okay. Yes, there was a light swinging in the, what are they called? Carriage. Carriage. But they had compartments, so they're just called compartments. Oh, okay. Yes, there was a light swinging in the compartments. More train noises.

Good, good. Then a shot of a man in a dark carriage checking his gun. Ooh. Yeah. Don't really know about guns, so he was probably checking that the stabilisers were in sync.

Or making sure that the springs are adjusted to stop it going unlevel over bumpy roads. Exactly. So he's checking that. More train noises. Shot of another man laying opposite on the bunk. Got a bit of a beard he has. He's staring at the ceiling, unblinking.

He looks worried. Are his eyes closed and unblinking or open and unblinking? That's a good question. They are open and unblinking. Nice. Yes. More train noises. Another shot outside, dark skies, but in the distance, the outline of the Capitol building.

Shot of the man again checking his gun, but he's now actually checking a couple of sharp knives that he has on his person. Oh. He's armed to the teeth, this man. He's tied his tie, like, around his head. Oh. Rambo style. Yes.

Yeah. He looks up, quietly speaks to the man lying opposite him. Mr. Lincoln, sir, I think we're safe now. We're approaching Washington. Ooh. Close-up of Lincoln, still staring at the ceiling, looking grim. More train noises. Fate.

Lincoln. But not that Lincoln. Yeah, no Daniel Day-Lewis in this version. Oh, no. We've got the real thing. Although we have to watch that after we finish these two episodes. Oh, we do. We definitely do. So, there you go.

That's our opening for today. That's quite exciting. It is. It is exciting. Okay, we start this week on February the 12th, 1809. Yes, that's right, Jamie. Two days from my birthday. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I was about to say. In 118 emperors

and 16 presidents, we have never had one who shares one of our birthdays. But this is pretty close. I think you win that one, then. Yeah, I think that's mathematically actually quite unlikely. With both of us, yeah, that is actually quite unlikely. Yeah, oh well, maybe one day. Anyway, we're in a log cabin

in Kentucky. Log. Oh well, maybe one day. Anyway, we're in a log cabin in Kentucky. Log. Oh yes. A boy named Abraham, named after his grandfather, has just been born to Thomas and Nancy Lincoln. Thomas worked odd jobs, a bit here and there. You know how that is. So like cleaning the odd horse hoof, that kind of thing. Yeah.

Not all four, just three odd. Oh, I like it. Yeah. Changed the wagon on a carriage, but only three. Yeah. Or one. It was a peculiar quirk of his, but that's what he did. They learned to live with it.

Yeah. And we know next to nothing about Nancy, unfortunately, but there you go. That's who they are. They were typical settlers in the West, hoping to find their way. I like at this point they still consider Kentucky the West. Yeah. Now, Thomas attempted to make money in buying and selling land, but soon he got caught up in legal dispute, shall we say.

Oh, dear. Yes. Someone wasn't happy with him. So the family moved and decided to move to Indiana for a fresh start. Nice. They moved to a new log cabin with a hard earth floor. Ah, so that implies they're not that well off then. No, no, they're definitely not.

Little eight-year-old Abraham slept in a tiny little attic room in this tiny little cabin. Trying to find something useful for the boy to do, Thomas taught his son how to hunt. Fairly easy to hunt where they were because there was a whole bunch of wild turkeys literally just outside their door. That's helpful. That is. So Abraham was given a gun and told, have at them turkeys, son. We'll have turkey sandwiches for tea. Oh dear. Three broke windows later. Well, no, apparently Abraham stood in his doorway. I mean, he didn't even have to leave the cabin. Just thousands of turkeys outside. Yes. Or just staring.

He took aim and what do you think happened? He missed. No, no, he killed it. Oh. Got it right in the face. Oh. Yeah. Abraham didn't like this. No, he decided hunting

wasn't for him. In fact, even fishing wasn't for him. He just didn't like this no he decided hunting wasn't for him in fact even fishing wasn't for him he just didn't like going off and killing animals didn't like it

I'm a bit like that yeah I can fully understand so there you go he pretty much freaked out and refused to do it again perhaps worried that

the boy was completely useless and had developed a fear of turkeys Thomas then looked for something else that Abraham could do I'm not surprised he had a fear of turkeys after Thomas then looked for something else that Abraham could do. I was worried they had a fear of turkeys. After killing the first one, they're all just like... The rest turned.

Wherever he goes, in the background. Mother, I think they're following me. Don't be silly, Abraham. They'd stand on top of each other so they could get to the attic room window and be staring at night. Well, Thomas, figuring he's got to teach his son something just to get his fear of turkeys away, decided to teach him how to swing an axe. Nice. From that point on, little Abraham was clearing the land, axe in hand. Rarely seen without an axe, he was.

Yeah. He became really quite good at it, apparently, and supplied wood for his father's new carpentry trade. Then his mother died. Sickness swept the area. Nancy became ill, and she died. Oh, that's unfortunate. Yeah.

The little cabin now housed a depressed Thomas, little Abraham, and his sister who is two years older. Aww. Yeah. And an orphaned 19-year-old cousin called Dennis, who started sharing Abraham's attic room. Lincoln would annoy Dennis, because Lincoln had taught himself to read by this point, with the help of the occasional travelling teacher. And he threw himself into one of the few books available to him.

And he kept hurting himself. But then he figured out you have to open it. Yes. You don't keep hitting your head against it. All became easier then. Yes, this was Aesop's Fables. He loved them, he did. Dennis looked at his little roommate

with his head buried in his book with confusion and said, and I'll quote here, Abe, them yarns are all lies. Lincoln looked up and replied, Mighty Dan, good lies, Danny. Oh, good answer. Yeah, Danny hit him across the head slightly in a playful way and then Abraham picked up his axe and just looked menacing.

Yeah. Whoa. Abraham picked up his axe and just looked menacing. Perhaps this is where Lincoln develops his love for a story. I like a good story. Oh, he loves a good yarn, does Lincoln. Throughout his whole life, particularly later on, he would just stop conversations and say,

that reminds me of a story, and then just tell a little tale. That must be infuriating. Oh, it infuriates a lot of people. But yeah, he's constantly doing this. Excuse me, sir, the enemy are approaching, sir. That reminds me of a little story I want to see. Yeah, quite literally. We're going to get to that. Oh, wonderful.

Yeah. So yeah, he loves a good tale, does Lincoln. Anyway, despite the stories, the place becomes very gloomy and sad. And then little Abraham died in a tragic accident when he was kicked in the head by a horse. Shorter episode than you thought. Yeah. Yeah.

And Dennis took over his name. Picked up the Aesop's fables. You know what? Maybe there's a moral in this. It is a damn fables. Yeah. You know what? Maybe there's a moral in this. It is a damn good liarn. Yeah. In fact, I'll quote, the kick to Abraham's head apparently killed him for some time. Oh, like heart stopped sort of thing?

Yeah. Oh, wow. But what didn't actually kill him only made him stronger, apparently, and little Abraham went back to fanning trees in no time. Goodness me. Yeah, but I mean, that was touch and go. He almost died when a horse kicked him in the face. History would have been very different.

It really would, just based on that one horse. Makes you think, though, like, the history we're living in now, how different it would have been if certain people had been alive and died, you know, young or... Jeff. Yeah. Got kicked in the head by a horse. He deserved it, though.

Yeah. But, yeah. You shouldn't be tickling that horse. Be on Mars by now. Yes. Yeah. Got kicked in the head by a horse. He deserved it, though, to be fair. But, yeah. You shouldn't be tickling that horse. He'll be on Mars by now. Yes. Yeah. But, yeah, he recovers. It does take him a while, but he does recover.

He regains his strength back, and he goes back to cutting wood. According to a neighbour, he sounded as if three men were working whenever he was chopping trees. He was that good at it. Chop, chop, chop, chop, chop, chop, chop, chop, chop. Or he always made sure he was chopping down trees in a cave, so his chops echoed. That's correct, yes.

You do get a lot of cave trees. Not anymore. Lincoln chopped them all down. Yes, he did. So, on top of this, he did go to school intermittently. He learned to read, obviously, but also write and cipher the basics. Nothing in detail. He certainly wasn't off learning Latin and Greek at this time.

He was tall. He was gangly. He was awkward around girls. He was apparently not a looker. He's not, though, is he? He's not. I don't want to be mean to him, but he's dead, so he won't know. But no, he wasn't a looker.

And he kind of knew it. Yeah. And unfortunately, those around him knew it, and they made fun of him. Aw. Yeah, it's a shame. It is. Probably not too much when he was holding the axe, but when he put the axe down. Yeah.

Laugh at him, laugh at him. Then at the age of 17, he decided to go and get a different job. So he went to work on a ferry, carting people over a river. Nice. He was enjoying that when some sad news came through. Tom. No, his sister. Oh. Died in a river. Nice. He was enjoying that when some sad news came through. Tom? No, his sister. Oh. Died in childbirth.

Oh! And the child died as well. Oh no. Yeah, not great. He was close to his sister and he was very upset about this. So to get away from the misery, he got a job transporting goods down the Mississippi with another young lad that he knew,

who was the son of the owner of the goods. The two of them travelled the 1,200 miles slowly down the Mississippi with their goods. Oh, you get to know someone really well then, wouldn't you? You really would. Especially on those lonely nights. Yes. As you can imagine, this is dull, slow, tedious down the Mississippi. Until one night, a group of slaves attacked the barge trying to steal the goods. Oh, wow. Yeah. Abraham and Alan had to fight them off. No one was killed, which is good, and

Lincoln did manage to fight people off, and the goods were saved. That was one of Lincoln's first experiences with slavery, because obviously he comes from an area with no slaves. Of course, yeah. So they arrive eventually in New Orleans. Abraham was amazed by the bustle of the city, but also could not help but see the horror of the slave markets there.

It would be surprising, because you'd gone from somewhere where human beings were human beings, admittedly not many people that were black, and then coming to see those other human beings being bought, sold, beaten and... Yeah, yeah. Ooh, that'd be shocking. Yeah, and he found it shocking, as did many in the North who, when they were actually faced with the realities of slavery, were having it being this abstract thing.

So, they spend a while in New Orleans and then they spend three months getting back up the Mississippi. Lincoln picking up his $25 pay when he finally returns. Probably worth more back then than it is now. Oh, yeah, yeah, definitely.

Probably a couple hundred quid. That's a lot. That's several months he spent doing this. Oh, wow. Yeah, yeah. And obviously his pay went straight to his father. Oh. Thomas, by this time, had decided to move again.

He'd remarried and wanted to start life afresh. Lincoln, who's 21, decides to go with him to Illinois. But it was not long before Lincoln decided to go it alone. He never really got on with his father. His sister and his mum's dead. There's nothing keeping him there anymore. So he's going to go and make something of himself. He packs up his belongings in a handkerchief,

puts it over his stick and sets out. One day Daddy Young will be a president! He said. Just constantly followed by turkeys. Yeah. You can hear the sound he looks around. There's nothing there. No.

They're hiding in bushes. They do that. The turkeys aren't just going to let him go. Oh no. He's been hunted for life. Yes. So he sets off, and what can he do? He knows how to wield an axe, and he knows how to get down the Mississippi.

It's quite bright, though. So he might want to go to education, see if he can... There's not really any opportunities, unfortunately. Yes, he does want to do that. What, does he want to do what everyone does and become like a lawyer? He hasn't got the education, so he can't do that. So he falls back on what he does know. He decides to go and see if he can take another flatbed down to New Orleans.

Yeah. Yeah, it worked before. Let's go and do that. However, he and his current friends, he was with a couple of people at this point, they hit a problem. They found someone with cargo to shift, but he had no boat. Ah. He was just sat in a tavern, apparently drinking whiskeys, and said,

yeah, you can take my stuff, but I've got no boat. I've got whiskey. Um... But it's fine, because this man said, look, if you can build a boat, then you can take my cargo down the river. Oh, well, I'm quite the woodsman. Well, exactly. Abraham right there, and then whips his axe out.

Let's get to it. Strolls to the nearest tree. One knock, and it's down. Nice. Maybe. Something like that. Yeah. It's just a really small tree. Yeah. More of a branch. Yes. Um, yeah. So, Yeah. It's just a really small tree. Yeah. More of a branch. Yes. Yeah, so he and his friends make a boat from scratch.

They pick up the owner of the cargo and load up all the cargo and set off. Nice. Nice. It's quite a bohemian life style he's got at the moment. Yeah. Yeah, it's very different to anything we've seen so far, isn't it? Yeah. He's just making his way, seeing what opportunities come up and just...

Yeah. Just making his way, seeing what opportunities come up and just... Yeah. I think the closest is Fillmore, in the sense that he didn't have anything and ended up working in a factory. Yeah. No factories with this one, but yeah, it's that poor beginnings. Yeah. You get to see what it was like for just the average person.

That's quite nice, actually. Yeah, yeah. So, Lincoln and his new boss and a couple of others set off off downriver heading towards New Orleans. However, they soon hit a problem. Sharks. Have I got past the sharks easily enough? That's right. Lincoln's axe.

Oh, yeah. No, it was in fact a small mill dam. So not a huge big dam, just a small little... One you probably can't get through sort of thing. Yeah, so it's just sticking out the water kind of dam. Yeah, it's more to funnel the water in the right direction, but it is stopping the boat from getting past. It's fine, I think.

We'll just run the dam. We'll approach it at speed. It's not that high. The boat will sort of skid over it a bit, and then we can carry on. This sounds like a great idea after a few whiskies. If I would just go really fast, get right over it,

it would be absolutely fine. Tell the owner's still really drunk. It's like, it's fine, we've done this many times before. You just hit it. Go straight. It'll be fine.

It will be fine. Then they all died. Now, this mill is on the edge of a village called New Salem and Some people have come to watch by this point not much going on in this village And a lot of these idiots are trying to get over the dam. Weee! See what they do. So they're all watching they they back up the river They back up and then they row and they row and they row they build up speed. They're going two, three miles an hour. Really, really fast.

I don't know how fast you can get on one of these barges. I'm guessing not very fast. Anyway, towards the dam they go. They hit it. The boat juts up, slides over the dam, and then stops. So they basically crotch themselves on the... Yeah, the front of the boat is sticking up in the air. Oh, wonderful.

The back of the boat, therefore, is pushed down and starts taking on water. Oh dear. That's unfortunate. Not great. No. So, they have a bit of a huddle. They have a business meeting. Yeah, right. Anyone got any ideas? Meanwhile, people in New Salem

are still standing around watching. Some of them getting deck chairs out and stuff. This is brilliant. It's why they built the dam in the first place. Yeah. We don't even need it. No. Literally, the mill's not being used.

It's an abandoned mill. Oh, wonderful. Even better. So Lincoln and his group start to suggest some ideas. No one really knows what to do, though. Like a big stick wedge. Like a big log. A big tree log.

Okay. And sort of have some sort of fulcrum in the middle and sort of just lift it up that way. If you put the fulcrum in the right place, you could have quite easily probably... But you'd have to put that under water, though, wouldn't you? Yeah, but you'd have something on the bank. No need of the fulcrum.

No need of the fulcrum near to the boat, wouldn't on the bank no need for the fulcrum no need for come near to the boat wouldn't you use the wall as the fulcrum and then like okay right here's here's the wall there's the boat yeah right there's the river on that side yeah then you get um you'd use that as a so you get your log if you're listening to the boat that way if you're listening just imagine a doodle and uh that's it it needs to be on your side, so you've got more energy to lift that end there, and you'd lift that end, and you might be able to just tip it into the water. Levers, basically.

A lever, yeah. To be really succinct and clever. At that point, Lincoln just does a little cough. He's got an idea. First of all... The turkeys are whispering to him in the bushes on the side of the river. They don't like Lincoln, but they don't want to see him embarrassed.

No. We're going to sort you out later. You've got to get through this. He'll go down, but you'll go down our way. So Lincoln suggests that they move all of the cargo to the front of the boat. Oh. And everyone went, oh yeah. Could do that. Okay, let's do that.

So they do that. They move all the cargo to the front of the boat. Do you think Alan's really annoyed? Because like, oh, I want to use my big pole idea. Do you have a big pole? No. Oh, we're not doing that then, are we? Yeah. They move all the cargo to the front, and sure enough, the boat tips. So it's now

resting evenly on top of the dam, completely out of the water. They can get to the front. Oh enough the boat tips so it's now resting evenly on top of the dam completely out the water they can get to the front oh no they've done that it's still not quite working what's in the boat now all the stuff and people and oh water a lot of water oh but it's fine says lincoln tip it out how would you do that buckets no no it's better idea put a hole in the back of oh yes oh? He shouts to the side, anyone got a drill? A couple of people make some innuendos, but they were not. That's silly.

So he gets a drill. Has anyone got any wood? No! Goes to the back of the boat, drills a hole on the boat. It's like, I've got an idea. Bear with me. He drills the hole in the boat. All the water seeps out.

And because the boat is now front heavy instead of the water mainly pooling at the back, the boat tips even more and slides into the water. They quickly plug the hole. I was going to say, yeah, that'd be a massive floor. They're not high-fiving and celebrating the ingenuity of Lincoln. Hang on. My feet are wet again. So, there you go.

Everyone on the side cheers. The turkeys gobble. And, yeah, there you go. Meanwhile, the owner of the car goes on the side, probably sipping whiskey. He's looking at this mill. He's like, you know what? I think I can make something of this.

And that Lincoln fella there, he's got some brains in him. So he says to Lincoln, how about if I rent this mill and we open a shop, you work as a clerk for me. We'll take the goods down to Mississippi, but then we'll come back here. Lincoln accepts. Yeah, why not? Yeah. Sounds good to me.

So a few months later, Lincoln is back in his new job. And he gets to know everyone in the village. He doesn't fit in with them immediately. And there were some youths around about his age. And who's this gangly person coming in? Why does he keep carrying an axe? And why are those turkeys following him?

Yeah. So they challenge him to a wrestle. Oh. Yeah, he was a wrestler, wasn't he? For a while. Well, he won this match or something. Yeah. If you're picturing him in, like, spandex.

No. Yeah, this is Jack Armstrong. He was the ringleader of the youths in the village. And he challenged Abraham to a wrestle. Abraham accepts. Well, he'd been saying his prayers, eating his vitamins, and taking steroids. Well, apparently Abraham was able to hold his axe out,

outstretched arm, completely straight, with his axe in his hand and hold it there for an impressive amount of time. He's tall and gangly, but he's wiry-muscled at this point, with all the axe swinging. But also taller people generally are stronger,

so longer muscles. So, ooh. Yeah. Anyway, the wrestle starts. Ding, ding, ding. Homo erotism is flying through the air. All sort of oiled up. Yeah.

It's essentially the volleyball scene from Top Gun, just without the balls. So, yeah. Anyway, they wrestle for a while. Lincoln's doing a good job. So much so that it looks like Jack Armstrong's going to lose. So some of Jack's friends jump forward

and start helping out. Oh dear. Yeah. Lincoln gets very angry at this and starts shouting things along the lines of Fine, I'll take you all on one at a time. I'll just start hulking up. You don't know what I mean, do you?

Painting himself green and looking angry? Yes! No, just a part of hulk hogan's gimmick oh hulk hogan yeah where he'd suddenly stand up and go like full of dream like ah then they start hitting him he just wouldn't react to it at all then he points them and go you and just start hitting them big hits then do a big kick it It was the 80s. You should definitely comment on wrestling matches. That's great. Now he's doing a big hit. As in big, big, big forearms, big forearms, and it's called a big boot.

Then the person would fall, that's what it was called. Then they would fall to the ground, and Hogan would do a leg drop on them, where he would jump up, leg outstretched and land on their neck stroke chest. And it looked like he was smashing them. You still watch wrestling, don't you? I do still watch wrestling. Yes, you do. I haven't seen Money in the Bank yet.

I have no idea what that means. And it was on Sunday. Don't ruin it for me. Although I know who got the damn briefcase. It's ridiculous. I'm sure it is. It is. It's ridiculous. I'm sure it is. It is. It's ridiculous.

It really is. Anyway, Jack Armstrong and his crew, if that's what they were known as, were so impressed with Lincoln's attitude that they kind of shake his hand, slap him on the back a bit. Oh, Lincoln, eh? He's one of us.

The only reason you do that is because you know you're about to lose. Yeah. No respect there at all. Sort of, okay, he's going to kill us. Okay only reason you do that is because you know you're about to lose. Yeah. No respect there at all. Sort of, okay, he's going to kill us. Okay, we're all friends here. I'm just unnerved by all these little eyes in the bushes. What's going on?

Yeah. Anyway, so he's ingratiated himself into the village. And he carries on with his work. Working in the shop, reading all the newspapers he could get his hands on. He's becoming a bit of a news junkie. And what he wanted to do more than anything else was educate himself. So he spent a lot of time arguing politics with those in the store. His personal hero was Henry Clay.

And many of his new friends started saying, you know what, Lincoln, you should get into politics. You should be president. I think your name will be remembered 20 years from now, I'd say. And then the Black Hawk War broke out. Oh, yeah. Which we have briefly covered in Taylor's episode. As we saw in that, it wasn't really a war. It was more of a skirmish slash massacre.

Yeah. Yeah. All Lincoln and his friends knew was that the governor needed volunteers to fight an Indian uprising. So he sets off with some of his new friends. They join up. And much to his surprise, Lincoln is elected as the company captain. But I have literally no experience.

Nor does anyone else. So let's go. What followed was several weeks of marching, camping, marching, camping, marching, camping. Sounds wonderful. Yep. The closest Lincoln ever got to combat was coming across a group of recently scalped men, which disturbed him somewhat. Oh, yeah.

As it would. Yeah. He did not take naturally to military command, shall we say. One story he later recounted was when he led his troop of 20 men over a field, and they came across a narrow gate. And I'll let him take over from here, so I'm quoting. I could not for the life of me remember the proper word of command for

getting my company end-wise. Finally, as we came near, I shouted, this company is dismissed for two minutes, when it will fall in again on the other side of this gate. That's wonderful. That's good initiative. Yes, it is.

Imagine the confused faces. What? Can we just do it on for two minutes? Yeah. Lincoln would also later recount his war stories, talking about how he battled mosquitoes and onion patches. But this is what I mean by him being a storyteller. He'd constantly be telling stories,

stories he'd heard, but also stories about himself. Humorous stories, almost always. Quite self-deprecating. Oh, yes, very much so. That's quite refreshing. Yeah. So, not the best of times. Still, he got paid for it, and soon he was back home.

Once there, he decided he would, you know what? He would run for office. He's going to get into politics. He's going to run for the Illinois General Assembly. Although by this time he was considered a passionate speaker, however, the lack of funds, education, and let's face it,

most importantly, a famous name, meant that he lost. Yeah. Yeah. So instead, he opened up another store with a new partner. Unfortunately, this was someone who drank most of the stock. Ah. Yeah. Lincoln himself, teetotaler, never really touched new partner. Unfortunately, this was someone who drank most of the stock. Ah. Yeah.

Lincoln himself, teetotaler, never really touched the stuff. Didn't object to people drinking, just never really went in for it himself. Is that Donald Trump? Yeah, actually. Parallels. It's uncanny, isn't it? Uncanny.

Yeah, so... See, that's why we can open, like, a craft beer shop or something, or a pub, drink, like, all the profits. Yeah, it would not go well. Imagine if we had a whiskey distillery. Oh, my goodness. Be dead in a week. But happy.

Crawling out of our own vomit as our livers fail. Smile on our faces. But, yeah, so the store failed. Yeah. Yeah, it so the store failed. Yeah, it didn't go well. But then Lincoln managed to become the postmaster of New Salem, a political position. Yeah, it's a lowly political position, but this is a political position.

And it meant that he could read all the newspapers he wanted. He did enjoy reading the newspapers. Determined to better himself, he also used any spare time to start reading law books. Now, this was great, but Lincoln by now was in a lot of debt. That last foray into being a store owner really didn't work. Then it got worse. His previous business owner that drank all the stock died. So that debt now all belonged to him instead of being shared with him.

Still, he's determined to carry on. So again, he tries to be elected to the General Assembly. And at the age of 25, he wins a seat. Oh, brilliant. Yes. Still following menacingly. And he just turns around and, oh, where are they? Where are they?

He borrows another $200 to buy himself suitable clothes and then heads to the capital of the state. When he got there, he rented some rooms with some other wigs and they got to work. He served on 12 committees and generally did a very good job. He was young and he was dedicated. That's good. He impressed a few people.

He was also, however, a bit of a country bumpkin and a self-made man, so he was also looked down upon by a lot of people. You can certainly imagine. I imagine he's got an accent that doesn't... Yes, very much so. Yeah. Well, what you got here, boy?

My name's Abe Lincoln. Yeah, that's... Didn't call himself Abe, though. He hated that. Abraham Lincoln. Yes. You don't know calling me Abe. You got that, son?

So can he. It's like Daniel Day-Lewis is in the room with us. Tell me about it. Yeah. Anyway, the term expired. Lincoln received $258, which is quite nice. I mean, he spent $200 on, like, clothes and bits to get there and rent his room. So he only really made $58.

But, eh, never mind. That's good money. It's fine. It's experience. Yeah. So he goes home and he continues to read law books. In 1836, he was registered by the county court as a man of good character. I wish we did that now.

Yeah. It would be good. I've decided I want to be a man of good character. I might apply. You can check my internet history and everything. Just give me some time. Sort a couple of things out. Not that browser.

Application denied. Yeah. No, obviously this is the start of him attempting to become a lawyer. He spent a long time self-teaching. And yeah, he decides to go for it. He attends the oral exam. Way. Which we've seen several times before.

Yeah. However, Lincoln has no family name. Apart from Lincoln, obviously. You seen several times before. Yeah. However, Lincoln has no family name, apart from Lincoln, obviously. You know what I mean. Yeah. But also, what we've never seen before is he didn't even have a mentor training him. That's a really good point. No school. Yeah, he's literally just rocked up and said, I think I can be a lawyer. Everyone stared at him. I've got an axe. That's how he wrote his name on the form. Lincoln obviously was nervous, but he passed the exam with no mistakes. Wow. And soon enough was buying his examiner's dinner, which, as we've seen before, is the tradition.

So you quite likely just passed depending on how hungry the examiner's been that day. Then out of the blue, a friend of his named Mrs. Bennet sent him a letter. Mrs. Bennet's got a sister and she was in need of a husband. Are you interested? Not like, oh, you know, had her eyes on you for a while. No, no, no. Just fancy, you know. Well, I've got a sister of a spare.

Fancy it? Fancy a bit. Probably not that. But yeah. To be fair, Lincoln had met Mary Owens a few years before. Wasn't a complete stranger. So he replied, OK, if you bring your sister to New Salem,

then we'll see. We'll see. See sparks fly. Yeah, say. Mary Owens turns up. Things, however, did not get off to the best of starts. Lincoln, Mary and friends went horse riding. They came to a river that needed to be forded

and all the men jumped off and they helped the women folk to cross, like the chivalrous men they were. Apart from Lincoln, he was already off. Yeah. Mary was just left behind looking a bit frustrated so i guess if he's not used this circumstance not used as the social yeah guidelines yeah he just and he's just not very good around women he's just a bit awkward yeah so he doesn't impress ah mary your eyes look like the setting sun your your hair reminds me of the golden sunlight

on a crisp autumn morning. Raise it in the river! Go, go, go! Despite this, however, apparently, plans to wed were indeed set up. Then, Lincoln heads back to the capital to take up his seat once more, and that's terms and session. So, he promises Mary that he would write. Now, one of the hot topics in the legislature at this time was the capital itself. Many wanted to move the capital to the more convenient and lively Springfield. Springfield, Illinois. Yeah. The decision was made.

It was like, we could all stay in this backwater that's got nothing in it, or we could move to Springfield where, like, there's actually stuff going on. Nice buildings and no bloody mosquitoes. All in favour say aye. Aye. Aye. There we go. So, and no bloody mosquitoes. All in favour say aye. Aye. There we go. So, decision was made. This political term came to the end and a colleague and a friend of Lincoln named

John Stewart came up to him with an idea. Lincoln had just been enrolled on the Illinois Supreme Court as a lawyer. So why not move to Springfield with me and we'll set up a law firm? Oh, that's great. Lincoln thought about this.

And said yes. Yeah, a small village backwater, or the most lively city around, where all his fellow political friends lived. Yeah, I think I'll move. I'll come with you, he says. So he moves. However, actually, when he gets to Springfield, I mean, what are you imagining? So I'm imagining I've got, like, Washington. I have, like, white buildings and stone. It's really not. No. It's better than New Salem, definitely.

But the streets aren't even paved. It wasn't quite the city of culture that Lincoln hoped it would be. It has a population of around 2,000. It's a bit rough around the edges still. I mean, they're still very much in the West here. It's a bit rough around the edges still. I mean, they're still very much in the West here. It's a bit like Deadwood. Yeah. In fact, Lincoln wrote that he found the place quite dull.

Writing to Mary Owens, he said, and I quote, I'm quite as lonely here as ever was anywhere in my life. Aww. Yeah. This is where we see another side of Lincoln that we're going to see a lot of. There's the side where he's the humorous storyteller, constantly cracking jokes and telling stories.

But then there's also the fact that he is quite depressed most of his life. Really? And it really starts showing here. Yeah, he struggles with depression all his life, fighting against bleak thoughts, feelings of mortality, just pressing down on him, thinking everything is useless

and there's no point in going on. Aw. Yeah. Aw. It was the turkeys whispering. Yeah. Anyway, perhaps it was in the throes of one of these depressions

that he wrote to Mary, stating that in his opinion she would be far better off without him. And I'll quote here, nothing would make me more miserable than believing you to be miserable. Nothing more happy than to know you were so. If it suits you best to not answer this,

then farewell. Mary never replies. Oh. Yeah. That's sad. It is. Still, he's in Springfield now with Stuart and they're going to set up their law firm.

Lincoln's first victory was a murder case, where he got the man off for self-defense. So, there you go, he's in the courts, he's starting to be a lawyer. However, before this, he needs a place to stay, obviously. So he saw a room advertised in Speed's General Store. He entered, he saw Speed there, and in the words of Speed, and I'll quote here, "'I never saw so gloomy and melancholy a face in my life. Lincoln asked if there was perhaps a room there he could rent. Speed replied that all he had was a double bed to share.

Lincoln immediately dropped his bag to the floor, grinned ear to ear, and said, and I quote, well, Speed, I moved. That's brilliant. Which is a brilliant way to introduce yourself to someone. Yeah, that's quite funny. Brilliant. I'm home. Speed and Lincoln soon became close friends.

I mean, it'd have to be if you're sharing a bed. This has led to some speculation that they were more than just friends, which is certainly possible, but there's no real evidence for this. As far as we can tell, this all comes from this double bed story. And as many historians have pointed out, professional men sharing bed space was actually fairly common in this time. Yeah, well, they had limited stuff. Limited beds, limited money.

So, yeah, it was convenient and fairly typical of the time so at this time Lincoln gets into Shakespeare he gets into

Byron he's really starting to read things Byron Byron yeah he called it

Byron because he's American Byron yeah he spent his evenings reading

but more than anything obviously he read newspapers newspapers being incredibly partisan back then

he would read because they're not now. Oh, no. He would read everything just to try and get a full picture. That's good. Yes. Because that's the problem with the world now. You put your own little bubble, you don't listen to what the opposition say,

and it causes massive problems. I disagree, so I'm not going to listen to you. So, over time, he rose in the Springfield Whig Party and soon was a leading member of a faction of young Whig lawyers. Their rivals were the rival faction of Democratic young lawyers. Yeah, I'm thinking full-on West Side Story here. Oh, wonderful. Yeah, I think they've all got...

Own t-shirts. Yeah, matching jackets. Yeah, lots of clicking, walking backwards down the street at each other. Yeah. Yeah, the two groups would smear each other constantly in the papers under pseudonyms, Lincoln's best being John Blubberhead. That's wonderful. Yeah.

In 1838, Lincoln was re-elected. His friend Stuart had just defeated Douglas. Douglas was the leader rival faction, and we've come across him before. This is the Douglas that we were talking about in Buchanan's episode. Oh, wow. Yeah, but he's obviously much younger here. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So, when Stuart defeated Douglas in this election, an actual fight broke out between Stuart and Douglas. Fantastic. Yeah, Stuart dragged Douglas around the market square in a headlock, and Douglas bit Stuart's thumb so hard that it left a scar.

That's amazing stuff. This is the kind of politics that Lincoln was getting involved in. Wow. Yeah. I've been thinking recently how politics can't get kind of more worse than it is now and all the slandering and stuff going on. Yeah, yeah. But actually, it's way worse back then.

Oh, yeah, definitely. Maybe you wouldn't see Theresa May with Corbyn in a headlock, would you? You know what? The way things are going... Why not? Why not? Anyway, all this is going on in the election of 1840. Remember, this is the log cabin hard cider drinking election for Harrison,

the one that went off the rails. Yeah, yeah. So they're having a great time basically campaigning for their relative parties. The Democrats and Whigs did not play nicely in Springfield. Lincoln upset many when he imitated a rival using

facial expressions and an accent, just basically taking the mick. Papers that were behind Douglas and Lincoln also exchanged racial slurs at each other, accusing each other of being Africa's sons. Yeah. Oh.

Don't forget, just anti-slavery does not mean nice. No. No. It was around this time that Lincoln met another Mary. This one was Mary Todd. They met at a reception. She was around 10 years younger than Lincoln, so about 21. And she'd briefly courted, not seriously, but Douglas.

Oh. Yeah. Along with a few others. Ménage à trois. You could definitely make a musical of this. Yeah, yeah. You definitely could. Who do I love?

Lincoln or Douglas? Who do you love? Is it me? Or me? Surprisingly high-pitched voice has Douglas? Was I Douglas though? Yeah, I was his spouse. Yeah, okay.

Yeah, Douglas Faye Short, by the way. He's known as the little giant because he gets very loud and angry, but he's also Faye Short. I like that. Yeah. Anyway, Lincoln and Mary were soon off and found together. Mary admired Lincoln's mind and his constant stories and his humour. That would only last so long, though, I feel.

Well, the stories and the humour often disappeared when he was talking to women, but slowly but surely he was able to show that lighter side to Mary. And, yeah, she enjoyed it. Lincoln, on the other hand, was very self-conscious of his humble beginnings, and his worries were well-founded, because it soon became very clear that the Todd family did not approve of this country bumpkin lawyer, and nor did Mary's friends. What on earth are you doing with this man? He's an idiot. Aww.

He's got a stupid accent and he's tall and ugly. Lincoln fell into another deep depression. He accepted the engagement was off. It did not help that Speed had just moved out of the city, so he'd lost his good friend as well. Things got so bad that Lincoln sought out a doctor who diagnosed Lincoln with hypochondria. Oh. Yeah, so his depression at the time was known as his hypo. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, this didn't help anything. No. No. And those around Lincoln really started to worry about him. Lincoln himself got to the point where he felt he could no longer carry on. No. And those around Lincoln really started to worry about him. Lincoln himself got to the point where he felt he could no longer carry on. Wow. And he wrote, I must either die or get better. You can't continue like this.

Oh dear. However, he still had his work, so he threw himself into that. At 32, and after four terms, he stepped down from his seat in the Assembly and concentrated on his new law firm. Oh, that's ridiculous. He's 32 and he's in all this. Yeah. I'm 32. I've done nothing. No. We should do you as an episode one day. Oh, no.

Be interesting. Anyway, Stuart and Lincoln had dissolved their firm and Lincoln went into business with a man named Logan, a small man with a shrill voice who spent all day whittling wood, apparently. Constantly whittling away. Whittling man. Yeah, things

finally started looking up for Lincoln when his friend Speed announced that he was getting engaged. Now, encouraged by his friend, who was on a high, Speed told Lincoln, come on, you need to sort this out. You and Mary like each other. Go for it. Ignore the naysayers. To hell with the families.

Yeah. So Lincoln started seeing Mary secretly so her family wouldn't find out. And the two got together really well. They became closer. They discussed politics and how horrible the Democrats were. Mary, a friend of hers, and Lincoln then decided

to write anonymously to a paper about a Democratic politician named Shields. Mary in particular called out Shields as a coward and unmanly. Just a bit of fun, really. The kind of stuff they'd been doing for a while. Political banter as it was back then. Shields, however, did not see the funny side in this. This was too far.

I do not have an incredibly small... And vantage. Yes, he was outraged, and he soon figured out that it must be Lincoln who was behind this, so he stormed into Lincoln's office and demanded an explanation. Damn it. Moi. Lincoln, wanting to keep Mary out of all this, accepted

the full blame. Yep, it was all me. Shields demanded that Lincoln publicly apologise or face the consequences. A duel. And then he stormed out. Oh, rest in match. Well, Lincoln wrote back to him, and I think you'll like this.

He wrote him a letter saying that he would confess to one letter, none of the others, because after all, he hadn't written any of the others, and he would state that the letter was political and not intended to defame Shields' character. But that's all he would do. If this was not acceptable, he would indeed duel, and he proposed an eight-foot circle to be drawn, and the two would fight using broadswords.

Oh! Which is brilliant. That's fantastic. It's like, I call your bluff. You want to duel, jewel then fine that's brilliant as an avid axe swinger oh that's a good point yeah see historians have assumed this is him trying to point out how ridiculous it all was but maybe lincoln was just thinking no play to my strengths here call him out i can out, eh? I can swing a mean... If I can swing an axe like that, I don't know what I'm going to do with a sword.

Things don't de-escalate, and a duelling round was in fact selected. Oh, fantastic. Don't know if they got as far as getting the swords. But eventually their seconds managed to calm the situation down. So, yeah, everything de-escalated. That's brilliant. Meanwhile, Lincoln and Mary had decided to wed.

Mary told her parents about the wedding on the morning of the wedding. Comes downstairs, white wedding dress, bouquet in hand, followed by three bridesmaids. Sits down to her cornflakes, everyone staring at her. Mary? Is there anything you would like to tell us? Oh, oh yes. Yes, I'm just popping to the shop soon, anyone want anything? Just popping to

church. Yeah, parents not happy at all, but if the wedding was going to happen, it must happen in their house. They weren't going to see their daughter run off in a loop. So the wedding took place but you can imagine Lincoln at the front there, turns around, just a

sea of angry in-laws and right at the turns around just a sea of angry in-laws and right at the back just a row of angry turkeys. Yeah, so I can't imagine that was the nicest wedding. Worst thing about roast turkey is their wedding breakfast as well. Ooh. Yeah, just rubbing salt into that breast. Yeah. Now, a couple of months later, Mary was pregnant.

And soon afterwards, a couple of months later, Mary was pregnant. And soon afterwards, probably about nine months, gave birth to a son, Robert Todd. The Lincolns settled into married life. Mary found the transition quite tricky.

I mean, she came from aristocracy. She was moneyed. And suddenly she wasn't. So she found this quite difficult. But she threw herself into it. Lincoln, meanwhile, spent his time building up his law firm. When they were together, Mary soon discovered that Lincoln wasn't all funny stories and cracking jokes.

He also went into long periods of depression and they were not necessarily situational. They'd just appear from nowhere. Oh, that's the worst. Yeah, he'd occasionally just sit and stare at nothing for long periods of time. So much so that one day he did not even notice that his son had

fallen off the wagon because he was so wrapped up in his own head. Oh. Yeah. You're really sorry for him. Yeah. This led to Mary and Lincoln rowing fairly often. Yeah. Married life wasn't ideal. Mary was fed up with the strain of living her non-aristocratic life with a husband who quite often was not there physically or mentally.

Still, Lincoln decides to start thinking about politics again. And this time, he's got his sights on national politics. A seat in the House of Representatives. Now, it would be tough, because he was racing against two other Whigs to get the seat. One was a cousin of Mary, who was also the son of a senator. All right. So he had ties.

Yeah. Yeah, he was favourite to win. You're gonna be, aren't you? Yeah. The rich, wealthy one that knows everyone, or you? Or the third one. Or? This was a friend of Lincoln,

who had trained an eagle to help him out on campaigns. An the third one. Or? This was a friend of Lincoln who had trained an eagle to help him out on campaigns. An eagle? Yeah. That is fantastic. When Lincoln's friend talked about the Democrats, the eagle would droop and lower its wings. When he talked about the wigs, the eagle would rise, stretch

out its wings and soar. That is fantastic. Yes, it is. You can imagine Lincoln talking to his friend. Yeah, I'm thinking of running. You don't mind, do you? Not at all, Lincoln. Bring out Barry. Rawr!

Did you think Lincoln tried to convince a turkey to join him? And blah, blah, blah. Oh, please, come on. Turkey just stares. It's like the equivalent of a modern-day GIF file, isn't it? Yes. On a meme. Now, Lincoln found this election hard.

Many were against him, as he was not a church-going man, and he'd even talked about having a duel, the barbaric monster, with swords. Yeah. In the end, Lincoln lost. However, internal talking within the Whigs agreed that a rotation system would be put in place to stop splitting the votes in future

so they'd be better at fighting the Democrats. That's a good idea. So although Mary's cousin won this time, he'd serve one term and Lincoln would get in next time. It's all been sorted, Lincoln, don't worry. Nice. So did the guy with the eagle win or? No, he just went off with his eagle. I'm going for

adventures! Yes. And the musical started. It's got a couple of years to kill, has Lincoln, therefore, so he starts up a new law firm. This time with a man named William Herndon. Herndon had met Lincoln while working as a clerk in Speed's store, so they knew each other for a while. He read

books in the same way that Lincoln read newspapers. And when he wasn't reading, he was drinking. Wonderful. Yeah. My kind of person. Yes. He was more than happy to become Lincoln's junior partner, and the two rented a floor of a building. Now, neither being particularly tidy men,

the office soon filled with dust. Apparently fruit seeds littered the floor because Lincoln would often eat fruit and then just throw the seeds on the floor. Let me guess, they started growing. Yes, apparently, according to legend, they started to... Yeah, it's one of these things that clearly isn't true. But yeah, you do get the impression how in disarray their office was, however. Yeah, but they say the more disarray you are in, the more creative you are. Yeah.

And I keep telling Becky that, but... You still need to tidy your room. It's relatively tidier than I am. Yeah, it's not bad, it's not bad. So yeah, piles of paperwork grew in their office. Anything really important was thrown on the really important pile, which is something I really recognise within myself. I have a drawer at work. It's like,

if I know it's really important, I just put it in that drawer. Everything else just gets scattered. Yeah. It's the diffuser situation. Yes. Yeah. Lincoln would spend his mornings laying on the sofa reading newspapers out loud, which really annoyed Herndon, as you can imagine. Meanwhile, Mary gave birth to their second son, Edward. Relationship could have been that bad then. Something's happening, yeah. Then the next elections were up, and Lincoln was indeed elected.

So the Lincolns leave Springfield, and they head to Washington, just in time for Polk to start arguing that the United States needed to defend itself against Mexico by invading Mexico. Yay. One of Lincoln's first moves as a representative was to demand to see the exact spot that Mexico had spilt American blood.

You say Mexico attacked us. Where? That's disputed land. We're saying it's our land, but the Mexicans say it's theirs. So is that really American soil? See, there's that kind of logic and thinking that a lot of people don't have. Yeah. This attack on the president led to a lot of newspapers turning on him back home.

Yeah. He was called the next Benedict Arnold. The traitor Benedict Arnold. The misunderstood Benedict Arnold. One day we'll do an episode on him and we'll realise how misunderstood he was. Yeah. He just realised it was inevitable that America would eventually come back. Benedict Arnold. One day we'll do an episode on him and we'll realise how misunderstood he was. He just realised it was inevitable that America would

eventually come back. Anyway, even his partner Herndon wrote to say that he thought Lincoln was backing the wrong horse here and that Polk had the right to start a war if he was defending the United States. Depression kicked back him. Lincoln at a low, but he wrote back

saying, if this is true, any president could declare war at will. And then it's not. You've lost the checks and balances, haven't you? Yeah, exactly. Still, as we've seen, the war played out, and then Lincoln worked on getting General Taylor elected. He travelled to New England to campaign on behalf of the Whig general.

Once Taylor won, Lincoln hoped for a cabinet post. A small one, admittedly, but yeah, it's like I've been doing a lot of campaigning here. No one else from Illinois is around. I think maybe I've got a chance. But he was overlooked. Aww. Yeah. And that's it.

His term ended. So he headed home. Once again, feeling quite depressed. Feeling like he hadn't really achieved what he wanted to achieve. It did not help anything when four-year-old Edward fell ill and died. No. Mary collapsed and spent weeks in her room not eating. Death was in the air.

News came through of President Taylor's death. However, slowly, things get slightly better. The tragic event seems to have brought Lincoln and Mary closer in their relationship rather than driving them apart. And about a year afterwards, Mary gives birth to another son, William. And then three years later on,

another son, Thomas. But they call him Tad, because apparently he looked like a tadpole when he came out. Had a big head and was a wiry blind. That's quite funny. Yeah. My gosh, Mary, he looks like a giant tadpole.

I shall call him Tad. Can we please call him Thomas? Fine. You can. Yeah. During this time, Lincoln was making a name for himself as a lawyer. His mood started to violently swing. Sometimes he was up, sometimes he was down.

One story is when he walked into a court, he spotted a clerk that he knew working. He leaned over the desk and he told the clerk one of his many stories. The clerk burst out laughing, loud enough that the judge was interrupted. And I quote here... Halfway through a court case. Yeah. The judge said said this must be

stopped mr lincoln you are constantly disturbing this court with your stories well that reminds me of it then the judge fined the clerk five dollars because he was the one working um and then carried on however once the current hearing was over the judge called the clerk to him and said, What was that story? The clerk retold the story to the judge. The judge burst out laughing and cancelled the fine. No, that's good. Yeah.

Bet it was a really dirty joke. Bet it was. I tried to find out what the story was and I couldn't, which is a shame. So yeah, that was the ups at the time. But at the same time, visitors would often go to his office to find him staring out of his messy office window, muttering about mortality. Yeah.

One friend said that his constant humour was a device to, and I quote, to whistle down the sadness. That's really sad. Yeah. Now, Lincoln himself was throwing himself into his work like never before. He spent six months of the year on the circuit, taking the law courts to those in remote areas.

In this time, he became a very popular member of the law community with judges and other lawyers alike, who just liked being around his humorous stories, basically. When he wasn't doing this, he was developing a name specialising in railroad law, an area rapidly expanding as the railroad started cutting through the country. Yeah, like metal iron veins. Carrying the blood. The lifeblood of democracy.

Freedom of freedom. Oh, so poetic. Yeah. With the Fugitive Slavery Act that had just come into effect, Lincoln found himself on both sides of the debate. He both prosecuted and defended fugitive slaves. Lincoln by this time had made his views clear,

both on slavery and the rapidly rising anti-Catholicism feeling. Right. He wrote to Speed, and I quote, I am not a know-nothing, that is certain. How could I be? How could anyone who abhors the oppression of the Negroes be in favour of degrading classes of white people? He wrote that he would rather live under a despot in Russia

than live under the know-nothings, who would turn, and I quote, all men are created equal into all men are created equal apart from Negroes and foreigners and Catholics. Fair point. However, Lincoln was a lawyer, and he would represent the cases that were brought to him, personal feelings aside.

No big political stand for him in regards to the Fugitive Slave Act. He didn't like it, but he wasn't about to put his career on the line. He's got a wife and children. Yeah, of course. Yeah, so he's no idealist. In fact, he felt the abolitionists were dangerous, a threat to the Union that's going to tear the country apart. And that went also for the lawyers who were taking the abolitionist cases pro bono.

He just thought, no, too far, no. The better way he thought to deal with slavery was to contain it in the South. Let industrialisation remove the need for slaves in the economy. So eventually they will naturally move with the times. Yeah. Lincoln was convinced that this is what the founding fathers wanted. It's amazing how many Americans suggest this is what the founding fathers would have wanted. Yeah.

It's a lot, isn't it? As we have seen, the founding fathers kind of just brush over slavery because it's a bit of an embarrassment. Yeah. It's very hard to say what the founding fathers really wanted in regards to slavery yeah but this is what lincoln's decided that they wanted it to be contained and to die out naturally yeah i mean that's i i think that would probably be the natural process anyway eventually but it would take them another hundred years to do it's like a slow burner approach. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It's still not comfortable, but

there's a logic behind it. Anything else might lead to civil war. That's true. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you can see why many people thought this. But there were many people in the country who probably thought things along the lines of, I don't want to be a slave anymore. Can I please

be free? So, yeah.'t want to be a slave anymore, can I please be free? Anyway, Lincoln was dismayed, as many were in the North, when the Nebraska-Kansas Act came through. None other than Douglas, his old rival, had pushed the bill through, allowing the population of each territory to choose free or slave, as we have seen. Now, the strong feelings of those in Springfield pulled Lincoln back into the world of politics. However, there was a problem. His party, the Whigs, were essentially dead. Bugger. Yeah, he didn't really know where to go.

He wanted nothing to do with the Know-Nothings. They were a bunch of intolerant idiots. The emerging Republicans were a bit too close to the abolitionists for Lincoln's liking. Weren't abolitionists, but it's a bit dangerous. Where is this Republican Party going? Are they going to do something crazy like call for freedom for all slaves? Yeah.

Perhaps the Whigs could turn it round, he thought. And I'll quote him here. I think I am a Whig, but others say that there are no Whigs and that I'm an abolitionist. But I do no more than oppose the extension of slavery. So he's making it very clear. He just wants to stop the spread. Yeah.

So Lincoln is determined to fight Douglas politically here. Lincoln attended Douglas's speeches and offered to debate his old rival. Lincoln refused. I mean, he's busy. He's up in the high echelons of national government, and here's Lincoln just going, Remember me? I want to debate you.

Yeah. After one of Douglas's speech, Lincoln stood on a table and declared that the next day he would be here to counter Douglas's speech in full. And I will quote part of that speech. Nearly 80 years ago, we began by declaring that all men are created equal. But now, from that beginning, we have run down to the other declaration

that for some men to enslave others is a sacred right of self-government. So this speech, and a couple of others in the following weeks, led to the leaders of the ever-growing Republican Party noticing Lincoln. Here's a man who was drawing crowds. He was a good speaker. Here's a man who was drawing crowds.

He was a good speaker. He's pestering Douglas. We like that. In fact, if you listen to what he's saying, he's saying almost word for word what our party believes in. Can anyone tell me why he's not a Republican? Can we get him on our side? Lincoln, however, refused to join up to this new party.

He was a Whig. He'd always been a Whig. However, as their beliefs at this present moment aligned, he was willing to work with them. He just wasn't one of them. Yeah, fair point. Meanwhile, he decided he was going to run for the Senate. He was going to go and get the power that Douglas had. None other than Shields. Remember the duel with the Brossels?

Oh, yeah. He was up for re-election. Oh. Backed by Douglas. Lincoln was going to go for Brussels. Yeah. He was up for re-election. Oh. Backed by Douglas. Lincoln was going to go for it. Yeah. At this time, the state legislature still voted for the senators. So, the round of voting began.

Now, despite leading the first six rounds, Lincoln could not get a majority. He was six votes short. Oh. He was so close to winning this. Then the Democrats suddenly backed another man, someone more popular than Shields, who basically have the same beliefs. So it looked like he was going to win. So to stop a pro-slavery Democratic victory,

Lincoln withdrew his name and suggested to his followers that they vote for the anti-slavery Democratic candidate. Yes, it's a Democrat, but it's an anti-slavery Democrat, so... See, that's good. That's him showing bipartisanship. It's him realising that if I keep pushing, I'll lose more.

Yes. He'd take the money, and who wants to be a millionaire? Yeah, and £1,000. Yes. First question right. That'll do. £100 for me. Booyah.

So yeah, Lincoln had lost. He took some satisfaction in the fact that he happened to defeat the pro-slavery faction, but apart from that Lincoln fell into another attack of depression, spending a lot of time alone in his office. Soon enough though, the racing politics of the day drew him out yet again. People were talking of a coalition of anti-Nebraska act parties. Some of Lincoln's fellow Whigs were starting to be very tempted by these Republicans. They were saying all the right things

about the spread of slavery, and they were not tainted by the Know-Nothings, something that the Whig Party was starting to embrace. Yeah. As we saw with Fillmore. Yes. Yes. And then the Know-Nothings themselves

started to fracture over the slavery issue, just as the Democrats and the Whigs had. They weren't immune to this, and they were starting to split North and South as well. Now, many Know-Nothing supporters in the North were actually Know-Nothing supporters because the Know-Nothings seem to be the most likely party to stop the spread of slavery.

So they were thinking, I don't want slavery to spread. Yeah. The Know-Nothings are the most powerful party who are saying that. So I will give my vote to them. That makes sense. Yeah. We're put up with the anti-Catholic feeling.

I don't particularly agree with that part, but it means to an end I don't want the slavery to spread. Someone will come along and take my job. This was generally the thought of a lot of know-nothing voters. So when the know-nothings split, they started thinking, well, actually, they're no longer the most popular party, we might as well join the Republicans, because they don't have all this anti-Catholic feeling,

and they want to stop spreading slavery as well. Yeah. So you saw the Republicans suddenly surge in popularity. So the tide was turning. Eventually Lincoln himself caves, and he abandons his lifelong party. He attended, and he spoke spoke at the Bloomington Convention, which created the Illinois Republican Party. Now, the 1856 elections were approaching and the Republicans were about to put forward Fremont. Fremont. Yeah, with his little accent, to run against Buchanan. Right. So Lincoln started to campaign for the Republican nominee,

giving over 50 speeches. Working hard on this. However, things were tense back at home. Do you think it was the same speech, though? Just said 50 times. It would have been very similar, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it didn't work that hard, then.

That's a good point. Sorry. However, things were tense back at home. Mary didn't like this Vermont. She much preferred Fillmore, who was being put forward for the know-nothings. This is the election where Fillmore suddenly comes back. Yeah. Yeah.

Mary felt that Fillmore knew how to keep foreigners, and I quote here, within bounds. Wonderful. And she wrote to a friend in Kentucky that if her friend had to contain with, and again I quote, the wild Irish,

then she too would vote for Fillmore. Wonderful. Well done, Mary. So quote, the wild Irish, then she too would vote for Fillmore. Well done, Mary. So anyway, election day comes, and both Lincoln and Mary were to be disappointed, because it was neither Fremont or Fillmore who won, but as we have seen, Buchanan. Lucky America. Thank goodness.

Still, there was something to cheer about, or at least for Lincoln. The Republicans had done far better than the Know-Nothings. Like, far better. For a brand new party, they had come a very respectable second. That's good. So, taking something from this, Lincoln made a decision. He would challenge none other

than Douglas for the Senate in two years' time. He's going up against the D-Man. The big D. That's what he said. Yeah. To begin with, however, Lincoln went back to his law firm. His politics had taken time off his firm for quite a while and he needed

to make some more money. It was then that the Dred Scott verdict was announced. Oh, yes. This sent shockwaves through the Republican Party. The whole party was based around limiting the spread of slavery. And the Democrats had just made it illegal to do exactly that.

The Republicans could now be painted as radicals who wanted to ignore the Supreme Court. Oh dear. As we've seen, it wasn't just the Republicans who were not happy. Many Democrats, such as Douglas, were outraged. He had been arguing that all territories could choose free or slave. Now the Dred Scott verdict said that states could not stop slavery. I've forgotten how bad that was.

It was awful. It really was. However, Douglas soon managed to twist his thinking to declare, actually, now I've really thought about it, Dred Scott actually supports his views. Territories and states could still be free if they wanted to. After all, if no one wanted slavery, there would be no slaves.

Laws or no. Yeah. Wow. Wow. I hope Lincoln kicks his arse. If you all just close your eyes and believe hard enough, slavery will go away. Oh my goodness.

Yeah. The Senate election was drawing closer and Douglas started accusing Republicans, and Lincoln in particular, of wanting a land where all blacks were free to intermingle with the whites until the two races were amalgamated. Oh, the humanity. Now, many in Illinois, maybe anti-slavery, but just as many, if not far more, were also very racist. And this line of attack was a very damaging one to Lincoln.

Seeing this, Douglas doubled down on it. This is working quite well. So he stated quite often that a vote for a Republican was a vote to, and I quote, eat, sleep and marry Negroes. It's very similar to rhetoric we've heard recently as well. It's doubling down on a rhetoric that's not true. Yeah, it's that fear-mongering they want open borders they want this yeah when no yeah same with the gun control debates as well yeah they want to take all your guns when no

one's actually saying that no yeah it's um this type of attack and type of hyperbole has not gone away in modern politics. They're all coming into our country. Yeah, yeah. Turkey will join the EU. It's fear-mongering, completely. Yeah, yeah. Lincoln, meanwhile, was getting very annoyed by this line of attack, as you can imagine.

Now, I'll quote here. Now, I protest against that counterfeit logic, which concludes that because I do not want a black woman for a slave, I must necessarily want her for a wife. I need not have her for either. I can just leave her alone. In some respects, she certainly is not my equal, but in her natural right to eat the bread that she earns

with her own hands without asking leave of anyone else, she is my equal, and the equal of all of us. That's surprisingly liberal. Yeah, I mean, still a bit racist. Yeah, it's of the time, but for the time, yes. Yeah, Lincoln pointed out that yes, most whites were disgusted by the amalgamation of the races, but then he also points out, is it not the southern slave women who were constantly being impregnated after being raped by their masters that was merging the races quicker than anything else? Oh, that's hitting a certain nail with a massive hammer, isn't it?

Yeah. He then went on to argue that if the Declaration of Independence did not mean to include black people, i.e. Dred Scott, then it may as well have said that all white men currently fighting the British for independence are created equal. Again, I'll quote here, I had thought the Declaration contemplated the progressive improvement in the condition of all men everywhere, but no, it merely was adopted for the purpose of justifying the colonists in the eyes of the civilised world in withdrawing their allegiance from the British crown

and dissolving their connection with the mother country. Why? That object having been affected some 80 years ago, the Declaration is of no practical use now, mere rubbish, old wadding left to rot on the battlefield after the victory is won. So in other words, look, if we're not going to use the Declaration of Independence

to better all mankind, we might as well throw it away. Very good and fair point. Yeah. The Democrats, he said, denied that black people were people. The Republicans, he announced, saw that black people were people and that their bondage was wrong. So these are pretty much the lines of debate. Yeah. You've got Douglas fear-mongering and you've got Lincoln trying to fight back against

that with his, for the time, quite progressive views but still disturbingly racist views. But also logical views. Like, yeah. Saying, well, if you apply your logic to this situation, can you see how ridiculous it is? Yeah, exactly. Which is a great arguing tactic. Yeah. So the campaign heated up after this. Douglas had his own private train car with a huge banner of his name on the side of it. Very modern.

Yeah, yeah. Lincoln, meanwhile, sat on the same train further back in a public carriage. Oh, that's fantastic. Just following him. Public train as well. Train further back. Had the turkeys in it.

But that aspect, he's with the public. Yeah. Yeah, Lincoln was determined to speak wherever Douglas spoke. Douglas got very annoyed by this. Stop following me! Yeah. You and your bloody turkeys! Yeah, he proclaimed that Lincoln kept following him around

because Lincoln could not draw crowds of his own. Petty. Which is, to be fair, quite a nice attack. Yeah. Then, after some backroom talks, it was agreed that Douglas and Lincoln would have seven formal debates. Seven? Yeah.

Wow. Because the presidential is now just three, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. No, this was a big event. The debate soon irked lincoln however who became very annoyed that douglas would constantly use race baiting to stir up the crowd rather than talk about policies or where to go with the country lincoln found himself having to defend the accusations that douglas kept throwing at him that sort of see you think

that's quite a modernistic approach, but it's obviously not. Yeah. Lincoln, according to Douglas, wanted black people to be driven around in carriages driven by whites. Another line was that Lincoln may well be equal to the black man, but Douglas certainly wasn't. And that also Lincoln, and this was the main one,

wanted to abolish slavery. This one particularly irked Lincoln. That's not what I said! Because he did not want to abolish slavery. So a frustrated Lincoln, in return, would reiterate that he just wants to stop the spread of slavery, not take slaves away from everyone. And in fact, Douglas, if anything, was trying to force slavery into the free states. At this point, Douglas apparently jumped up and screamed,

that is a lie. So Lincoln wasn't completely above this, because Douglas wasn't trying to do that at the time, to be fair. But a frustrated Lincoln starts throwing mud back. Because he gets a crowd reaction. Yeah. Then news came through that Kansas had just voted against the Lecompton Constitution.

Remember all the bribery that Buchanan put into place to get that through and then it fell apart anyway? That just happened. Therefore, Kansas would be a free state when it joined. The campaign continued. Lincoln and Douglas carried on debating. Even out of public view, notes were exchanged between them on the train rides. So you really get the feeling these debates were quite intense between them. So they were still sending snarky little notes to each other.

Yeah. I hate you, you smell. You are a complete and utter PTO. Oh. Douglas turning the paper over in trepidation. What's it going to say? Oh, good God. Oh.

Cutting. It just says, blah. Yeah. Well, Douglas wrote to Lincoln saying that the black man was naturally inferior to the white man in gifts of nature. Lincoln wrote back saying, suppose that is true, then surely as a Christian, you should give to the disadvantaged, not take from them. Oh, wonderful. Which is a nice argument back. That is wonderful, yeah.

Yeah. Eventually, election day was upon them. A rainy day in November. So people were voting for the legislature. So how this was happening, people were voting for people to take a seat. And then those seats would choose the senator. So it wasn't a straight up vote. More Republican votes were cast that day,

but more Democratic seats were won. With more Democrats than Republicans, there was no way Lincoln would be nominated to the Senate. He had lost. And I'll quote here, I feel like the boy who stomped his toe. I am too big to cry, but too badly hurt to laugh. However, it soon became clear

that pushing the nationally known Douglas so hard in the race, Lincoln had actually become known to Republicans all around the North. Some started to talk to Lincoln about the possibility of putting his name forward for president. He'd really impressed in these debates. Wow. Yeah. So if he could repeat what he'd done nationally, then who knows?

Lincoln wasn't convinced. There were some big names in the Republican Party, despite it being new. The biggest at the time being Seward, who we've come across before. Remember in Fillmore's episode, the New York Whig, who was very, very anti-slavery. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And also anti-know-nothing and fought with Thurlow Weed against Fillmore a lot. Very much like Lincoln in some respects.

Similar views, but not quite the same as we will see, but yes. Seward was seen more as a radical. He was very anti-slavery. Lincoln was a bit anti-slavery. So Lincoln was convinced that the likes of Seward would be better placed for the top job. They were career politicians.

Name up their higher echelons of Whig politics, and that Republican politics. Others pointed out to Lincoln, however, that Seward had made a name for himself as being a bit of a radical. And maybe that's not what they need. Even so, he decided to turn this idea down. He was going to wait and challenge Douglas again next time he was up for the Senate.

News then came through of a pro-abolitionist raid on Harper's Ferry in Virginia. For two days, a group of young abolitionists and slaves fought the local militia. Panic of the slave uprising spread in the South, and anger at the Republicans grew. After

all, the slaves were fine before, and now with all this Republican talk, the slaves were getting ideas. They were all militant. Yeah. Organised. The leader of the revolt, John Brown, was hanged. Lincoln announced the following day that this was the right thing to do.

Even if John Brown agreed with the Republicans that slavery is wrong, violence is not the answer. John Brown was hanged in accordance to the law, according to Lincoln, but then he addressed those who were attacking the Republicans. And he said, and I quote, If constitutionally we elect a president, and therefore you undertake to destroy the Union, it will be our duty to deal with you, as old John Brown has been doubt with. Ooh.

Yeah, which is quite a severe line there. That's quite cutting, yeah. Yeah. You can tell this anger to Lincoln. Yeah. Anyway, by this time, some of Lincoln's friends had been working on him, and he finally caved. Fine, put my name forward in the next Republican convention.

He headed to New York, and he gave a speech to the Republican Party there that went down very well indeed. And soon, the anti-seward faction of the party were firmly behind him. So the more moderate Republicans. Yeah. Yeah. Lincoln then went on tour of New England, gave several more speeches. However, Seward remained by far the most popular of the potential candidates,

with Thurlow Weed still in the background pulling the strings. Remember, Weed's very much behind-the-scenes kind of guy, just making things happen behind closed doors. Yeah. Anyway, the Republican National Convention met in May of 1860. The Democrats had recently abandoned their convention without a winner, leading many Republicans to speculate that they were about to split into a North and South Democratic Party. Well, if that happened, the Republicans had a very real chance

of winning the next election. Holy moly. Yeah. So whoever wins this convention really could be the president. Oh. Oh, yes. Those leading the Lincoln campaign were hoping that if Seward did not get the majority outright in the first ballot, then those supporting other candidates would see that Lincoln stood a good chance of winning and swing behind him. And this is exactly what happened.

Lincoln, waiting nervously in his office with a few others, received the news. Seward won the first round with 173 and a half votes. Half? Someone's just very unsure. Lincoln was second with a healthy 102. No one else had even

half of that. Lincoln's done really well here. The next vote came in. Seward, 184 and a half votes. That person done really well here. The next vote came in, Seward 184 and a half votes, and that person still hadn't decided. Lincoln, 181. Oh, wow. Yeah. A while later, another telegram arrived. It was handed to Lincoln. He stared at it for a full two minutes, apparently. Then he looked up and said the words, Well, we got it. Oh.

Yeah? So he is now the nominee for the presidential election. Do you think he'll get it? I don't know. Let's find out. The presidential campaign started, and great news reached Lincoln. The rumours were correct. The Democrats had split.

South were backing Breckinridge, the current vice president, and the North had nominated Douglas. Oh! Oh, yes. Round three. And this time it's personal! Lincoln did not campaign himself. We're still very much in that age. Yeah.

Nor did any of the others. Thurlow Weed came to visit Lincoln to assure him that the New York pro-seward faction were definitely behind Lincoln. All we want is fairness when you're president, but we're not going to fight against you here. You won fair and square. Nice. Yeah, but we want fairness.

But we're not against you, but we want fairness. Lincoln eventually has to ask Weed to stop winking. I don't know what you mean anymore. Lincoln assured Weed that he would take no sides and factions within the party whatsoever. He'd been saying for a while in his speeches

recently that a house divided cannot stand. And that applied to the Republican Party. I'm going to split this. So the elections heat up. In the north rallies were held, bands were playing, cannons were fired. A whole carnival atmosphere started up. Let's get campaigning. The local paper for one large rally had a political cartoon of an elephant holding a banner saying, we are coming. This is the first recorded use of an elephant being linked to the Republican Party. Oh, really? Yes.

Although it is just a single man in 1874 who would solidify the donkey and the elephant as the two symbols in one cartoon. Oh, really? Yeah. But we'll get to that when we get to that. That's interesting. Yeah. Anyway, in the South, the anti-Republican message was being hit hard. Perhaps harder than those in the North really realised.

Word was being spread the Republicans want to abolish slavery. If Lincoln wins, he will free all the slaves using Northern troops pointing guns straight at you. If that happens, nothing will stop the slaves from rampaging the states. They will go for your women and your children. And I will quote, Robberies, rapes and murders of the poorer whites by the emancipated blacks would disfigure this land. They go hard in the South, painting Lincoln to be a monster who wants to abolish

slavery. Yeah. People in the South start talking about secession from the Union if Lincoln wins. Lincoln himself dismissed this as hyperbole. It's bluster. There's always some crazy people in the South talking about secession. They were doing it under Calhoun. Yeah, it'll be fine. There's always enough sensible people in the South to realise that he wasn't an abolitionist.

He's constantly saying this. It'll be fine. Yeah. On November the 6th, hopes were high. And they should have been. Because Lincoln won 180 electoral college votes. Beckenridge won 72. Bell, who was a fourth candidate that I'm not really talked about, won 39.

And Douglas won 12. Oh! That is a massive win. Yes. Lincoln said to Douglas afterwards, and I quote, suck on it. Something like that. Something along those lines.

Yeah. The popular vote told a very different picture, however. Oh. 39.8% went to Lincoln, giving him a firm lead of about 10 percentage points. But Douglas came second with 29.5%. Ooh. Yeah, so the popular vote in the Electoral College didn't line up at all. Apart from the fact Lincoln clearly won both.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. But Douglas came second in the popular vote. Oh, see, that's sort of weird, sort of. It's a weird antiquated system. And you can understand why, because I guess the distances back then... I can see why they set it up, but I think if you

try to justify the Electoral College nowadays, it is almost impossible, because there was no reason to keep it. It is ridiculous. It doesn't reflect the views of the population. No. It's really it reflects the views of that one person as your representative. The electoral college at the time was set up to

stop populist candidates just sweeping in and taking over even though they don't have a clue what they're doing. It's clearly a failed system. Anyway, never mind. Let's face it, our system's not much better. Anyway, Lincoln... I'll first pass the post.

Yeah. Anyway, Lincoln was I first passed the post. Anyway, Lincoln was the clear winner. Well, boys, he quoted to some reporters later that day, your troubles are over now. Mine have just begun. Lightning bolts in the background. Thunder. Slight gobble. But outwardly, at least, Lincoln

was optimistic. He told a reporter from Philadelphia that he thought that this would be seen as a low point in the South, and things were soon going to get much better. Oh dear. Yeah. People will look back at this moment and think, oh, the South, eh? They almost went to civil war. So, Lincoln then starts putting his cabinet together.

He made Seward his Secretary of State. He was a very experienced politician. But shortly afterwards, the stunning news reached him. South Carolina has announced that they were going to leave the Union. Oh. They weren't bluffing. Bugger. Yeah.

Weed came to visit, probably looking a bit disheveled. Lincoln must immediately make assurances on slavery. You must be seen to be able to compromise. If we don't bend on this, they're going to leave. So you've got to back away from some of the things you've been saying about slavery. Yeah. Perhaps maybe, maybe there can be some new slave states. Maybe Dred Scott isn't so bad.

Lincoln was angered. They'd just won an election on a clear manifesto of not spreading slavery. He was not about to compromise on that before he'd even started. At that point, yeah. The news then came through of Buchanan's handling of the forts in South Carolina and his talks with the delegations from the seceding state. There was rumour that he wanted to essentially give up the forts. If that is true, said Lincoln, they ought to hang him.

Ooh. Yeah. As we saw last episode, Buchanan was forced to back down on this. Then, again, as we saw, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, and then Texas all leave the union. Lincoln did not say anything publicly on the issue. He's not president yet, but he did write to Seward who was telling Lincoln that he had to compromise with these states, that he was inflexible when it came to the issue of slavery. Just that letter saying WTF. Lincoln was willing to reassure the

South that they can keep their slaves, I've said that all along, they can even keep the Fugitive Slave Act. But the spread of slavery is going to stop. Seward was instrumental in the peace convention that then started up. This was a gathering of those left in the Union to talk about what to do to keep the peace. But mainly,

it was trying to keep those slave states who were still in the Union, in the Union. Namely, Virginia and Maryland. There you go, you've lost the capital. Because Washington's in the union in the union. Yeah. Namely, Virginia and Maryland. Right. They go, you've lost the capital. Because Washington's in the middle of those two states. Yeah.

Yeah. It's like a weird buffer area, isn't it? Yeah. And Virginia is also still very much a very rich and prosperous state. Very tobacco-y state. Yeah. You lose Virginia, you're going to be in a bit of trouble. Lincoln did not like this peace convention at

all. He did not want it to happen. He refused to go. He saw it as various states asking the Republicans to buy their right to have a president. No, we've won the election fair and square. I'm conceding nothing to go and be the president. And that makes a lot of sense. We were voted in

on these policies. Yeah. Soon enough, it was time to head to Washington. On the way, they stopped in Westfield, Newark, where Lincoln met a little girl who had written to him not long before, suggesting that he grow a beard, because she thought it would make him look better. Yeah, she did. And he did.

Oh, wonderful. Lincoln was able to show this little girl his new beard that he'd grown, that she'd asked him to do. Did she then just burst out laughing? That's ridiculous. Who would have a beard like that'd grown that she'd asked him to do. Did she then just burst out laughing? That's ridiculous! Who would have a beard like that? He forgot the moustache! Yeah. Anyway, after a few more stops,

they arrive in Philadelphia. When he was there, he was led into a room where he met secretly with a man named Alan Pinkerton. Pinkertons? Oh yeah. I know that name, but I don't know what, who they are. Well, Alan Pinkerton was a private detective who worked for railroad companies

and also had big ideas about building a detective company. His detectives had uncovered a plot to kill Lincoln in Baltimore, which was Lincoln's next stop. Wow. They told him, you have to skip the city. Go to Washington. It's not safe in Baltimore. Lincoln hated next stop. They told him, you have to skip the city. Go to Washington. It's not safe in Baltimore. Lincoln hated this idea.

But I said I'd be there. And Lincoln also didn't want to believe that the country was so split they were starting to think about assassinating presidents. Would you have at that time sent a message, a very public message, saying, I'm not stopping here because someone's trying to kill me? He'd still look weak then, though, wouldn't he? That would be saying, I'm too scared to go to Baltimore. But eventually, however, Lincoln was persuaded.

It just was not safe. He got reports from various other sources that, yeah, this is a real plot. Someone is out to kill you. Go to Washington. Bloody hell, so they have bazookas loaded with turkeys. So Lincoln boards a train in secret with a bodyguard who was holding on to four guns and two knives. They arrived in Baltimore at night

because it was the only way to get to Washington, was through Baltimore. They sneakily get onto a different train where Lincoln pretends to be the brother of a Pinkerton agent. Yeah. So under the cover of darkness, the train leaves Baltimore and heads to Washington. Lincoln lies down and stares at the ceiling.

Meanwhile, the presidential train with his family headed to Baltimore. Hey. Off you go, Mary. You're fine. Take the children. Big banner on the side. Abraham Lincoln. President carriage.

Yeah. Open to all visitors. Man of the people. Lincoln arrives in Washington, sneaking into his own capital city. He arrives at the hotel only to find a death threat waiting for him in his room. And another letter that said, and I quote, threat waiting for him in his room. And another letter that said, and I quote,

if you do not resign, we are going to put a spider in your dumpling and play the devil with you. That sounds quite fair. I don't like practical jokes. A spider in my... I mean, those guys back in Baltimore were going to kill me. I can deal with the spiders. That's fine, yeah. I don't like them,

but... Still, Lincoln was shortly met by his family, and Inauguration Day approached. On the 4th of March, 1861, on an overcast day, Lincoln set out for his inaugural speech. There we go. That is the end of Lincoln, part one. Interesting. Yeah? A lot of stuff he's having to mop up he's uh very resilient and very um determined to follow his own policies yeah which i think at the end of the day may not help him it's a dangerous path

yeah it all depends on the outcome really doesn't it what do you think of his life i feel very very sorry for him he's obviously a someone that's suffering um with mental health issues and you know it's affected his marriage. Was it what you were expecting from Lincoln? No, I didn't really know what to expect. I don't know anything about his early life at all or really about his presidency other than he won the Civil War. Oh, sorry, spoiler.

He wins the Civil War. Or the North does. But I'm not even sure if it's in his time or not. Oh, really? Do you not? Yeah, it's very different, isn't it? Yes. It's a different look. I like the fact that to begin with, it was just a normal person.

It wasn't the story we've seen of going to college, becoming a lawyer. I mean, he does become a lawyer, but he does it differently. I mean, he's the woodcutter's son. He's the turkey murderer of 18-0. Yeah. Right. I must admit, I think Silver screen is looking quite good yes yeah um but we will see won't we next time because next time we get to see what happens in in his presidency yes yeah i've got to get my head around the civil war but like you said they were not focusing on the civil war per se it's only context it will be the broad

strokes of the Civil War. Yeah. I'm certainly not going to go into details of battles. But it's his life. It's the President's life we're focusing on. Yeah. Washington, we have some details of battles because Washington was leading them.

Lincoln doesn't, so he will get reports of battles. That's what will happen. Yeah. Anyway, right. Thank you very much for listening to Lincoln Part 1. Please leave reviews. Do other things that are fun. Send us messages as well. We like your messages. Yeah, do that.

And thank you for all the response to Buchanan's episodes. There was a lot of response to Buchanan's episodes. Yes. A lot of people going, wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Oh, and how you pronounce certain things as well. Oh, yes. Yeah. No, two things I need to apologise. Sad music. Right, sad music things as well. Oh, yes. Yeah. No, two things.

I need to apologise. Sad music. Right, sad music. It's Topeka, not Topeka. Okay. Topeka. And also, apparently another time, I didn't notice when I said it and I didn't notice when I was editing it, I kept saying that the Mormons headed east instead of west.

Oh. But I looked into it. They did go east through the sea over Europe through Russia jumped over Japan across the sea again and then hit America

and then that's how they got to the Salt Lake. Yeah. Little known fact. Roman emperor listeners will know that I constantly mix up east and west.

That's not important. Yeah. It's not important. You're not a general. It's fine. Yeah, it's fine. Anyway, right, thank you very much for listening, and until next time. Blah! Goodbye.

Blah! Right, Hickory, I've got an idea to move the boat. I've got an idea as well. I'm thinking we get a piece of rope, hang it over the bow, tie it to the front of the boat, I'll send it to the back, pull it and we'll lift up and over. Right. So you'll pull hard whilst you're on the boat.

Yes. And you've tied it to the... Exactly. It'll lift the boat clean up and we'll fly right over. Physics man! We'll call that option D, but I have actually already got an idea. How about we use a massive lever?

I'll use my massive pole, shove it into the boat, use the dam as a fulcrum, bounce upon the end like a kangaroo or whatever that is, and then it'll pop the boat up into the other side and splash, you'll be home free. Okay.

Better with the physics. Yes. One question. Yes? Do you have a massive pole? Well, my wife says... No, no, no. Right.

I've got an idea. Or set the back of the boat on fire. How's that going to help? They do it with dynamite. You spark the end and the boat will fly forward like a... No, no, that's clearly nonsense. The whole thing will go up. So you don't like that idea then?

No, it's clearly ridiculous. I best go and put the flames out there, excuse me. Right, can I share my ideas now? Or cut the boat in half. What? How is that going to help? The front part will fall in the water. The back part, with you in, will fall backwards.

And I can travel on to New Orleans. Very helpful. Actually, yes. What? Let's do that. Cut the boat in half? Yeah. Yeah, let's do it.

Obviously, you'll want all the goods at the front. Yes. Yeah. Right. So let's all the goods at the front. Yes, yeah. Right, so let's move the goods to the front, shall we? Okay, well, I'm glad you're coming round to my way of thinking, Lincoln. Why have you got a drill? It's a big one. We're finally here. Thank you, but who's the president? Oh, you've got to find out more about him today.

Okay, all right. And hopefully, fingers crossed, you can hear an improvement in sound. We're using microphones today. Yes, instead of a trained monkey just to impersonate us. Yeah, which was working fairly well. Yeah, it did well. But he's dead now. So we had to upgrade.

So, yeah, let us know what you think, see if it sounds better. And if it sounds the same, that means Rob's had to use the old microphone yet again I hope this sounds better sure it does