American Presidents: Totalus Rankium - 7.1 Andrew Jackson

Episode Date: August 18, 2018

  We now arrive at one of the more controversial presidents in US history: Jackson has a bit of a, shall we say, reputation. In this episode we explore his early life and his rise up to the battle that made him famous. Was he a controversial man before he became president? Find out! 

Welcome to Totalus Rankium. This week, Andrew Jackson Part 1. Hello and welcome to American Presidents Total's Rankium. I am Jamie. And I'm Rob, ranking all of the presidents from Washington to Trump. Now we are on Andrew Jackson. Ah, now whenever you draw him, you always draw him with guns. Yeah, yeah, well you'll see why that is in this episode. Is he very gunny? He's a bit gunny. You've heard of him before

though haven't you? Yeah. He's one of the bigger names in presidential history. I say so. Do you know anything about him apart from his name? I don't know whether he's infamous. Yeah or famous. Yeah. Right okay well you can decide whether to include the in at the end of the next episode. Okay. But for now, we've got a lot to cover, so let's jump into the life of Andrew Jackson. So, we open on a farm. Oh.

Meh. Yeah. Oink, oink. It's good. I don't know how much farm we had animals, probably more just fields that needed clearing. It's a starting up farm. It's not done much yet. Yeah, but you've got that needed clearing it's a it's a starting up farm it's not it's not done much yet yeah you gotta have a chicken okay i'll give you a chicken

that that's a chicken a chicken a sad chicken okay we're not sure where this farm is uh us yes it is well it's not the united states yet. Ah. It's in the British colonies in America. It's on the border of North and South Carolina, but the borders haven't really been defined in this area yet, so it's hard to be sure. A shade of grey. Yeah, exactly. The year is 1767, and there is a man in a field

on this small farm with one certain chicken. He is thinking of his pregnant wife and his two sons. Oh. Yeah. Perhaps thinking about them a bit too hard. Because he's working hard to provide for his family. Yeah. He's clearing the logs off the land and the tree roots so it can be farmed.

And some sort of accident happens. Oh. Don't have the details. So I'll leave that up to you. Chicken. The chicken was involved. Almost like a comedy scene. He's pecking away at the bottom of a tree, tree trunk,

while the farmer's on the other side bending over something. Yeah. Chicken pecks a bit too hard. Oh, no. Eventually caves it. It's been happening for months, though. He's been gradually pecking away. Yeah.

Not intentionally. No. Then one sad day, you hear a few cracks. The farmer turns around the trees just falling slowly towards him yeah so uh he died a couple of days later that's sad it's a shame his funeral was a very sad one the two children and the pregnant wife led the way so the coffin was on a carriage and it trundled off towards the graveyard when the family got to the graveyard. When the family got to the graveyard, the procession realised that the coffin wasn't on the wagon anymore. Oh. Roads were bumpy back then. How long did they tend to notice?

Apparently they got all the way to the graveyard before they noticed. Just the guy pulling it, like this guy, that light all of a sudden, stronger than I thought. Oh. Yeah, so the mother and the two sons then had a lovely little field trip to go and hunt Daddy down. Just a tilted coffin slightly ajar with a white withered hand sticking out. Yeah. Oh. The flies had taken hold by then. Oh.

Is that one Daddy, Mummy? Yes. Yes, it is. I miss daddy. Look, he's waving. Yeah, so that was the funeral. Three weeks after that, the son of this dead father was born. And that is Andrew Jackson.

Yes. Also, yeah, she's pregnant, wasn't she? Yes, exactly. Oh, that's sad. It's very sad, isn't it? He never knew his daddy. Never knew his dad. You think that's sad?

Oh. Oh, just wait. Right, OK, so the family then moved in with some relatives. I mean, you didn't want to be a parent on your own at this age. You needed people around who could help. Yeah. So Andrew soon grew and was clearly a very bright boy. Arguably the brightest of the three children, but he was also the wildest, apparently.

When he was smaller, apparently, he hung around with the elder boys of the area. And to make up for his small, skinny frame, he was quick to fight and soon gained a reputation. Oh, did that carry through to his adulthood? It might well do, yes. As he got older, the younger boys started hanging around as well and he was soon accused of bullying behaviour. Yeah. Andrew's picky on me, sir. Andrew's picky on me.

He's three and a half. You're 18. You throw things. Yeah, so turbulent childhood, shall we say. Still, he was not immune to pranks himself. The other boys would occasionally play tricks on him. One day he was persuaded by the other boys to fire a rifle. That, unknown to Jackson, was overloaded with powder.

So that's going to make quite a bang. Yeah, that really would. Was it comedy black in the face sort of thing? Yes. Yeah, sticking up hair. Yeah. No eyebrows. The blast completely knocked little Andrew onto the floor.

He jumped up onto his feet immediately and proclaimed, and I quote, By God, if one of you laughs, I'll kill him. I'd believe that. Yeah, no one laughed. So he was barely 10 when the war broke out. Oh, wow.

Yeah. Hugh, his eldest brother, signed up straight away. So his eldest brother went off to fight. And over the next few years, the war raged on. The colonial Americans, loyal to the British cause, caused a lot of damage in the region. Houses and farms were burnt down. Generally, trouble was had. And then word reached the family that Hugh had been killed. Oh. Yes, older brother's dead. A furious 13-year-old Andrew and his other brother, Robert, signed up to become couriers for the rebel army.

Are they trying to avenge, you think? He's only 13, though. That's very young. Well, yeah, they're not signing up to be fighters. They're signing up to be couriers at this point. Postman. Yeah, but Danger Postman. Oh. Yeah.

Danger's my middle name. Andrew Danger Jackson. Yes, no, it was, actually, yeah. But, yeah, as you can imagine, young boys signing up to be couriers soon were getting involved in actual skirmishes. Yeah. Yeah.

In one of these skirmishes, Andrew watched his cousin die. Oh. Then one day, attempting to escape British forces, the two brothers ran back to their auntie's house where they were staying. And to their horror, the British had managed to follow them. The British troops ripped the house apart in front of their eyes. Then the British officer pointed at Andrew with his sword and demanded that the boy clean his shoes. Oh that's insulting. Yeah. You told me to do that to you once didn't you? I did. I was really insulted. You were I mean

you still did it but. Well yeah I had to. Andrew however burning with fury refused. Oh. You were. I mean, you still did it, but... Well, yeah, I had to. Andrew, however, burning with fury, refused. Ooh. Oh, yes. The officer raised his sword and struck a blow at the insolent boy. It was a light blow, to be fair. It wasn't designed to kill him, but it was enough to give Andrew a very nasty gash on his hand that he'd put up to protect himself and his head. Andrew and

Robert were then taken prisoner. Andrew, still bleeding heavily, was thrown into a prison camp, which was, as you can imagine, a grim place with no beds, no warm clothing, very little food, water, but plenty of smallpox. Ah, brilliant. They could spread that around all they wanted. of smallpox. Ah, brilliant. They could spread that around all they wanted. Yeah. It's our gift to you.

The two brothers spent several months there, with their health deteriorating by the day. And then one day, the cell door opened and Andrew and Robert were hurled out. To their surprise and amazement, it was their mother. She had not been idle and had managed to arrange that her boys were part of a prisoner exchange. Oh, nice. Yeah. Robert, by this point, was their mother. She had not been idle and had managed to arrange that her boys were part of a prisoner exchange. Oh, nice. Yeah. Robert, by this point, was a mess. He could barely walk. So he went on the horse with Andrew and his mother walking barefoot in winter. The journey

was a very hard one and Robert was in a very bad state by the time they got home and he died the next day. Not been a great start has it for poor Jackson? It's really not no. Andrew despairing then realised that he had contracted smallpox. Ah brilliant. The evil bubble wrap disease confined him to bed for several months. His mother however could not stop. She'd saved her boys just for one of them to die, but she still had other family in need. Her nephews, who had been raised almost as if they were her sons, were still in a prison ship in Charleston. So she travelled 160 miles across war-torn America to see if she could reach them. Once there, to gain entry to the ship, she volunteered to help the prisoners suffering from cholera, which she did until she contracted cholera

herself and then died. Yeah. Andrew had just about recovered, received the news along with a bundle of her clothes. His mother and two older brothers were dead and the British were to blame. Might put a bit of a chip

on your shoulder. Might do. I'll say chip more of a canyon. Yeah it's it's not the most cheery of starts is it? It's not no. No. So if he's absolutely mental when he's older I get why it's a lot of death to see isn't it? It is it's a lot of death to see but life must go on. So he went and lived with his uncle and shortly afterwards something happened that could change his fortune forever. His grandfather, in Scotland, had died. Yeah! But there was a bit of a silver lining to this one.

Money? Because he had left him the equivalent of $40,000 in today's money. That's a good amount. It is. I mean, it's not going to keep him for the rest of his life, but it's still far, far more money than he hoped he would have access to. For him, this is a fortune. So he traveled to Charleston where he needed to collect this money and he went into the city. He was becoming a young man by this point and he was introduced to the many fun things that city life can hold, including

dice and horse racing. That's what we did at university. Oh yes, yeah. The money was gone within weeks. That's really funny. Yeah. I'm sure he saw the funny side as well. I bet he did.

When he woke up splitting headache the next day oh it's all gone still approaching adulthood by now he realized he needed to decide what he wanted to do with the rest of his life apart from hate the british so he spent a short time being a teacher he had had a bit of an education. He thought, well, maybe I could become a teacher. That's easy. He soon realised that was a mugs game, however. So instead, he decided to become a lawyer. That seems to be the presidential way, doesn't it? Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, becoming a lawyer in certain areas of this brand new country was not necessarily the most intense thing to do, should we say. Quite lucrative. It could be, yes, but not necessarily.

And in some areas it was harder to become a lawyer than others. Generally, the closer to the frontier you were, the easier it was to become a lawyer. Now, Andrew could talk, and he was bright. That was enough to get him an apprenticeship. He had a bit of a gift for the gab, so he was able to talk his way into an apprenticeship. Jackson and some other apprentices at the time spent their time drinking, gambling, and getting to know,

and I quote, the Scarlet Women. Ooh. Yeah, no idea what they are. Must be something in America. One evening, his group of friends had a toast to something. Ladies of the night. Maybe to the ladies of the night. Not vampires.

No. Don't worry. Maybe to vampires. They had a toast anyway. Yeah. And then they all threw their glasses into the fire. What a waste. Well, it wasn't a common thing to do because, yeah, it's a bit of a waste of your

glass, but it wasn't uncommon either. The idea is that you've just had a toast and you don't want to sully the glasses that you've toasted with by carrying on drinking with them. So you destroy them. And destroy your toast. Yeah, it's a bit silly, but it's

the kind of thing that young men got up to. However, it was fun, wasn't it, throwing those glasses into the fire? Oh, no. Yeah. And we don't want to sully the glasses because we've just had a toast. And also, what if someone else were to sit in these chairs we're sat in when we made the toast? So the chairs were smashed up and thrown into the fire. Right. As was the table they were sat at. Right. The entire building almost burnt down.

Yeah, they were essentially made of pyre. Yeah. Andrew was gaining a bit of a reputation, shall we say. A bit of a reprobate. Hmm, yeah. Still, he passed the bar. He did. He went to the interview, which may or may not have stretched him.

And he became a lawyer. One of the first times he was in court, however, was not when he was representing a case, but when he was charged with trespassing and destruction of property. Excellent. Yeah. We don't really have the details on that one, but the charges speak for themselves, really.

Yeah. Yeah. Did he get fined? Well, no, the matter was settled before going to trial which was a good job because if he had been charged and found guilty he would have been disbarred yeah so he uh he was relieved with that one still he's very poor he's desperate for funds so he started offering no and no fee deals with his clients like Like you get on TV now. Yes, I'd like to think he had really horrible jingling adverts to go with it.

Andrew Jackson no win, no fee. You just kept singing that to people. So I mean this tidied him over for a bit but the going was tough. So Andrew fell to the pull that many Americans did. Go West.

Just like the band. You could make a new life in the west. You could find your fortune. Yeah. Now, Tennessee was not actually a state yet. It was an area that was part of North Carolina. But it's to that region that Andrew heads. Through connections that he had, Andrew managed to secure a job as a prosecutor in this territory.

So he sets off. On the way, he stops in Jonesborough. Perhaps he was looking to make a name for himself. Maybe he was just feeling very touchy at the time. But he found himself in an argument with a man named Avery. Now, Avery was a well-known prosecutor in the region. He was at the top of his game. He was the dean of the North Carolina Bar. And this was a prestigious man. And Avery and Jackson found

themselves on opposite sides in a court case one day. And Avery made Jackson look a little bit foolish. Yeah. He wiped the floor with him, essentially, with his legal knowledge. I mean, Andrew just was no match. He's bluffing it. Yeah. Andrew was not happy. Not happy at all. So he demanded satisfaction. Did he go back to the Scarlet Ladies? No, no.

Different type of satisfaction. Okay. He challenged Avery to a duel. Because he lost. Yeah, but he'd lost and Avery had made a fallout of him. Ah, fair enough. Yeah. Avery just ignored this. I mean, who is this young upstart?

I'm not going to duel with every young lawyer who comes my way and I defeat. So then Andrew wrote to him the next day, again demanding satisfaction, but this time letting everyone else in the town know that Avery was a coward. Avery finally decided he would accept the duel. They said.

The two met at sunset. But by that point, they're seconds, because when you're dueling, you had your second with you to hold your pistols and stuff. Well, one of the jobs of the second was to try and negotiate a peace beforehand. And they succeeded. Oh, okay.

Yeah, they came to an accord, as they say. And Andrew and Avery both aimed their pistols at the sky and fired. They were both satisfied that the argument was over. It didn't need to come to actual fighting. Unfortunately, Avery was quite a good aim. He shot directly up. Bullet came directly down. Ooh, nasty.

Or just hit a passing bird and then spiralled into Jackson. Ow! It's a big gun, man. Yeah. So that's duel number one. Oh. Yeah. Brilliant.

After a while, Andrew continued. He decided he wouldn't stay in Jonesbrook for too long. And in 1788, at the age of 21, he arrived in Nashville. At this time, Nashville was a frontier town with a handful of stores, a single distillery, and more than a little threat of violence in the air. Ah, good. Yeah. Very soon in Nashville, about 100 years after this,

they'll start building the Gibson factory. Yes. Start making banjos all UKs, I think. That's what Andrew was looking forward to. That's why he headed there. It was a bit early, but he was keen. Yeah. Keen.

Getting around first. Yeah, the violence was mainly coming from not just the people who lived there, but there was a very real threat from Native American tribes who were resisting the never-ending swell of immigrants coming into their land. Fair enough. Yeah, it was a dangerous place to live. You didn't walk around on your own.

All right. Yeah, you made sure the children were supervised, that kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. When he arrived, he boarded with a widow. Having a young man around the house was very sensible in those times. So he boarded with this widow, and it was here that he met Rachel. Rachel was the daughter of the widow, who was married to a man named Lewis Roberts. Why do I get the impression there's a second jewel coming up?

Roberts. Why do we get the impression there's a second duel coming up? Well, you'll find out. Rachel and Lewis had an unpleasant relationship. We don't have the details, but we know it was not a happy marriage. Rachel one day came back to live with her mother for a while. So Lewis and Rachel were separated. And this is when Andrew and Rachel meet for the first time. Then Lewis arrived one day. Wanting to make up, we shouldn't be separated anymore. So Rachel moved out again and the two moved to a house nearby. By this point though, Andrew and Rachel had got to know each other. I don't know how much they've got to know each other.

No one really knows. Probably just conversational at this point. I don't know. No? Are you suspicious? I think they knew each other very well. You think so? Yes. Right, well, Lewis agrees with you,

because Lewis suddenly got very, very jealous of this Andrew, who was hanging around a little bit too much for his liking. Things quickly became quite bad between the two men, and Andrew challenged Lewis to a duel. Yeah, there we go. Which Lewis refused. Instead, Lewis claimed that he would seek divorce and left. Ah, wimp. Yeah, the challenge was enough to send him off.

So Andrew and Rachel, realising that scandal would break out if they got together in Nashville, headed off to a place called Natchez, if I'm pronouncing that correctly, which is a town on the Mississippi not too far from New Orleans. So they went quite a distance away. That would have taken like a week or so to get there as well, wouldn't it? Oh, longer than that. At least two weeks.

Yeah, possibly closer to a month. Really? Yeah. I forget how big the US is. Yeah, and there were no roads in the region. You'd be travelling by river to get there. Ooh. Yeah.

No speedboats either. Yeah, very few speedboats. Yeah, we really are on the frontier here. There's no infrastructure around at all. Yeah. So anyway, they spend about a year in the Ches. And then, after a year, they return to Nashville as man and wife. Yeah. So anyway, they spend about a year in the Ches and then after a year they return to Nashville as man and wife. Now Andrew, as you've probably picked up on, was a bit of a fiery,

bad-tempered man in many cases. Quick on the trigger. Yeah, but by all reports Rachel maintained a bit of a soft place in his heart. She was the person who could calm him. Rubbed his belly. Quite possibly. But equally, you did not want to insult Rachel. No. No, because if there was one thing that would guarantee to provoke anger in Andrew, it was to insult Rachel and mention the fact that they had gone off and lived in sin for a while,

as it really wasn't clear whether Lewis had actually filed for divorce or not. Ooh. Yeah. Now, they found out later that Lewis hadn't filed for divorce. Bigamy! Yeah. This comes back to haunt him a bit later. Still, they probably didn't care at the time.

Lewis had gone and they were in love and they were together. They settled down and Andrew realised that he needed to make something of himself. He'd got a wife now. So, like many in the West, he got into the land business. Quite simple. Buy up land nice and cheap and sell it off when more people arrived for more money. Admittedly, sometimes it was debatable who actually owned the land that you were selling but yeah details yeah yeah he also carried on with his law work although this involved a lot of traveling which jackson really didn't enjoy uh sometimes the rough and ready atmosphere of the west came out as well this this wasn't sitting in an office doing law work this was traveling around areas that were quite lawless in many respects, trying to uphold the law. Oh dear. Andrew got into more than a couple of fights.

There was one story at this point of how he wrenched the top rail off a fence and thrust it into the belly of a man he was fighting. Oh. Yeah. Loudly exclaiming, and I quote, Gentlemen, stand back, give me room and I'll manage him.

Oh, as he stood over the body of a man holding a fence rail in his hand. He's not afraid to get into a scrap or two. Another way he was making money was to invest into a store, but this really did not go too well. Yeah, it was hard to make money through commerce. I guess so, yeah. Well, I say through commerce. There was one easier way to make money.

Depends what you're buying and selling. What did you buy and sell? Slaves. Yeah! Yeah. Andrew had acquired a slave in lieu of payment on his way west. That was his first slave. How nice. in lieu of payment on his way west. That was his first slave.

How nice. This human being was given to Jackson because her owner could not pay the legal fees. So there you go. Have this woman instead. Yeah. Soon after their marriage, Andrew and Rachel inherited two more slaves. So they've got three now.

This slave ownership obviously was common, as we've seen it many times before. What we've seen less of is someone trying to make a profit from buying and selling slaves, which Jackson then starts getting into. Now, it's debatable how much he was into the slave trade rather than just slave ownership, but he was obviously making some money this way. That's a bit of a red cross next to his name, isn't it? It's not great. No. No it's not. Anyway over the next few years he acquired several slaves and now had a fair amount of land but as most people were in the west he was very cash poor. It's just

a it's an investment for the future is not so you can cash in now. Yeah exactly. Now it's during this time he met a man named Blount, a man who was not only big into land speculation, but also had connections. And it was through him that he became more interested in politics. So when a constitutional convention was called in Knoxville to discuss the formation of the new state, he attended. He was, after all, a trained lawyer. Yeah, why not go on? go along? See what this is all about. Get your two cents in. Yeah. The discussion over the formation of the new state started, and Andrew got involved. Had a thing or two to say about this.

One thing he was keen on discussing was the name of this new state. He argued that too many states were named after rich people, especially British rich people. Like Georgia. Oh, yeah. North and South Carolina. Virginia. named after rich people especially british rich people like georgia oh yeah north and south carolina virginia well carolina's after james isn't king james yeah yeah virginia was after elizabeth new york duke of york yeah so most of them were named after the british aristocracy yeah so um andrew didn't want another state named after a rich person even if it is an american rich person this time what should we name it and jackson like panicking fumbled his pocketball

ten dollar note ten dollars there so i've got a tenner um see yeah tennessee i've got tennessee i've got it um yeah that was exactly i mean the river that ran through what would become Tennessee being called Tennessee was just a coincidence. That is a massive coincidence. Yes, that is a massive coincidence. Yeah. There's no record that Jackson was the man who named the state, but he certainly supported the name of the state being Tennessee.

Yeah. Distinguish itself, be more... One new world, I guess. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, Andrew made an impression during the convention, enough that after the region achieved statehood, Andrew was voted to represent the state in the House of Representatives. Nice.

So he travelled off to Philadelphia, just in time to hear Washington's farewell address. So Washington's stepping down by this point. As president. As president, yeah. That's where we've reached to. Andrew refused to stand for this speech from Washington. Did he see it as a monocle thing?

Not like a single glass thing, but something to do with a monarch. Yeah, he saw the outgoing president as far too federalist. Yeah, Jackson was very much identifying himself as a Republican. Anyway, he was in the House of Representatives for a while, and then a while later was voted to become a Senator, so moved to that wing of Congress. However, the political life was just not for Andrew. He did not enjoy it being in Philadelphia,

and then he just suddenly quit after a year and rode home with no explanation. All right. Yes. He said around this time, and I quote, sticks and spittle are substituted by the eastern representatives in place of pistols. He just was fed up with everyone discussing things all the time. He used to shoot people to get what he wanted. Exactly.

Yeah. Yeah. However, he had done enough in the capital to find his popularity had grown at home, and he was elected to the Tennessee Supreme Court. So he became a judge. Andrew proved to be a mainly popular judge. He did the job alright,

according to most people. Although he was not necessarily a strict follower of the law. Yeah. One historian put it, and I quote here, if justice pointed one way and the law another, the law would surely lose. Yeah. So Jackson would dish out what he saw as justice

rather than follow the letter of the law. More the spirit of the law he was into rather than... Yes. There's one story of him being a judge. He was in a town presiding over a trial and all of a sudden a ruckus, I'm going to use the word ruckus, was heard outside. Andrew wanted to know what was going on and called the local sheriff. Well, what's going on out there? Well, it turned out a local drunk man was causing problems just outside the building. Shouting

things. Yeah, staggering around the place, refusing to be quiet. Okay. And this was disturbing the trial. Oh no. Jackson, annoyed, told the sheriff, just sort the man out, would you? Just go and sort him out. So the sheriff left.

There was more shouting. More shouting. The sheriff came back in. Turned out the man was too angry and violent, according to the sheriff, to be detained. Right. Yeah. So Jackson ordered the sheriff to raise a posse. Again?

Yeah. Just, look, grab some men and sort him out, would you? So the sheriff left again. There was some shouting and some more shouting, and the sheriff came back in. Apparently the man was so angry and violent that even the posse could not get him to be quiet. Jackson then ordered the sheriff to formally include him in the posse. The sheriff, little unsure, I mean, yeah, this is a judge. Can I put a judge in my posse? But still, Jackson had a look about him so of course the sheriff said yes of course Jackson stood up put on his robe picked up his pistol and strode outside just just the scene from the

inside of the court the lawyers just sitting there still hearing the shouting there's some shouting stops it was jackson anyway well not not quite what happened is that jackson strode outside pointed his gun straight at the man who was causing a ruckus and said surrender, Surrender, you infernal villain, or I'll blow you through. The man gave up immediately. Later, when asked why he'd calmed down for Jackson, no one else replied, and I quote, Why? When he came up, I looked him in the eye, and I saw shoot. So I says to myself, Hoss, it's about time to sing small.

So I did. I love the fact his name's Hoss. That's quite nice. Yeah. So that was an exciting day of being a judge. But generally, Jackson wasn't really enjoying this. It wasn't really his thing. He wanted to do something better.

And the best job in the frontier state, according to Jackson, was the head of the militia. He gets to kill things. You get respect and a shiny uniform. And a gun. Yes. So Jackson went for it. However, he was up against the current governor of Tennessee, a man who you'd be amazed, but he'd fallen out with this man before.

I think. Yeah, yeah. This was a man named Sevier. Sevier was a Revolutionary War veteran. He had a huge reputation. So it was a very close race. But it was so close that when the votes came in, it was a draw. Fine, according to the state constitution, if there was a draw for a position like the leader of the militia, it's quite simple. The governor would choose. Yeah. That's handy. Yeah.

Who did he go for? Ah, well, unfortunately for Sevier, the reason why he was going for the militia job was because his term had just ran out. Oh. Yes, and a new governor had just started, and the new governor happened to be friends with Jackson. That helps. Yeah, so Jackson got the job, and this begins the feud between Jackson and Sevier. Because Jackson, to return the favour to his friend, now the governor, attempted to help this new governor to keep his seat the following year. He uncovered some evidence of fraud on Sevier's part and spread it about a bit. Sevier, not too happy about this, and also won the election,

so he became the governor again. Sevier's now the governor. Yeah. Yeah, we're a year later now. Oh dear. And the two men now despise each other. One day, when Jackson was in Knoxville, he and some friends happened to pass Sevier in the street.

Yeah, Sevier was with some of his associates as well. Words were exchanged. You smell. Your face smells. Sevier challenged Jackson to draw arms. Jackson only had his cane with him. You're imagining him drawing an arm, aren't you? Yeah, where's my sketchbook?

Quick! But no, not only did he not have his sketchbook with him, but he didn't have his pistols with him. He only had his cane. Now, Seveus, seeing this as cowardness, mentioned, yeah, you don't dare fight me. I suppose Jackson could have borrowed a pistol from someone else. Oh, Seveus, excuse me, do you have a pistol I could borrow?

Wonderful. Ha, you coward. You don't have one. Then Seve says back to Jackson, Jackson, do you have a pistol I could borrow? Yes, of course, why this one? Back and forward all day. Yeah, that could have happened.

But no, Jackson just refused to fight. Seve, seeing this as cowardness, mentioned Jackson's lack of military service. You're a coward, man, and you've never fought for this country. Jackson replied that he'd served the state in other ways. Sevier replied, and I quote, "'Service?

"'I know of no great service you rendered for the country, "'except taking a trip to Nechaz with another man's wife.'" Whoa! Oh yeah, the mic was dropped. Silence descended upon the crowd. Jackson replied, and I quote, Great God, do you mention her sacred name? To which the surveyor said,

I didn't say, didn't say Rachel. Oh, damn it. Yeah, a brawl started. A couple of shots were fired Although no one was seriously hurt The expression Great God became quite popular In Knoxville after this apparently

Really? Yeah The next day, Andrew wrote to Xavier Demanding a duel And I'll read you the letter he sent I request an interview My friend who will hand you this Will point to the time and place when and where I expect to see you with your friend and no other person. My friend and I will be armed with pistols. You cannot mistake me or my meaning.

P.S. I'm talking about a jewel, by the way, a jewel. Yes, P.S. I'll shoot you in the face. Yeah. Yeah, so tensions ratcheting up. However, in the end, the two did not meet in a duel. After several arguments as to when and where the duel would take place, they happened to meet on the road to the dueling spot. Oh, that was awkward.

Yeah, the two groups drew pistols and kind of rode around each other, cursing at each other. Then both men rode off shouting that the other group were cowards and poltroons. You put that on your little picture, didn't you? Yeah, poltroon is a great word that I had to look up. I gathered it from context, but yeah, it does mean a coward, essentially. So it's a shame no one uses it anymore. So no duel took place. Both sides accused each other of being potrons.

He hasn't had a duel yet, has he? The closest he got was the one where he hasn't actually had a duel. There's been no duel where he's actually aimed the gun and fired at someone. No. No, not yet. Coward. Oh, not yet. Yeah, we'll get to that. And also, this isn't the only controversy that he's getting into around this time,

because the former vice president happened to be coming through Nashville. Alan Burr, the man who had recently shot the arch-federalist Alexander Hamilton. Who wrote that musical. Who wrote that musical, yeah. Now, this made Burr a bit of a hero in the West. I mean, he'd shot Hamilton the horrible Federalist. No one was shedding a tear over Hamilton in

Tennessee. So when he arrived in Tennessee, Burr and Jackson met up and Burr stayed with Jackson for a few days. They had a few conversations. And Burr sounded Jackson out on the idea that there should be a push to drive the Spanish out of the Texas area. Yeah, something that sounded very interesting to Jackson.

More land meant the possibility of making money, after all. So Jackson agreed that the Tennessee militia would be able to help such a push, and Burr headed on his way with a sort of a nod and a wink agreement of, yeah, I'm interested. Just imagine Burr getting a map, putting it down for Jackson. Two pistols out, going, shooty, shooty. Do you fancy it? Yeah, however, not long afterwards, a messenger came through the town and reported of treasonous activity down south.

Oh, yeah? Who's committing treason? Aaron Burr, sir. Oh. Yeah, it turned out that Burr was not looking to make more land for the US, but actually carve out a new country for himself, including the newly acquired New Orleans. Yeah, Jackson rushed to distance himself from Burr, sending a letter to the president informing him of Burr's treason, despite the fact that Jefferson already knew about this. Yeah. That was clearly him just trying to cover his own back.

Yeah. Yeah. I was shocked when I found out. I'd never liked the man. Yes. There's certainly no deal about militias sorting out Spanish people. No, certainly not. P.S. Honest.

So, with that scandal averted, Jackson went back to being part-time militia leader, part-time judge, part-time slave trader. He was also getting into horses and horse racing. Yeah. Yeah. The owner of a famous racehorse at the time happened to come by one day in financial trouble and sold his horse to Andrew. So now the owner of a famous racehorse,

well, let's get into horse racing, he thought. Yeah. So what do horses eat? As you can imagine, horse racing on the Western Frontier was hardly the most regulated of activities. And there was often disputes. Oh, with Jackson. Well, Jackson did get into one or two disputes, yeah. One of which was with a man named Swan.

Now, Andrew, by this point, was becoming more and more respected in Tennessee community and had very little to gain with accepting any challenges from young upstarts such as Swan. So when Swan accused Jackson of defrauding him, Jackson refused to get involved, stating that Swan was only worthy of a beating, not of a duel. Nice. Swan, outraged by this, confronted Jackson in a tavern where Jackson stood up and started beating the younger man with his cane until onlookers pulled them apart.

Nice. But that was not the end of it because Swan had a friend who was also unhappy with Jackson for various reasons, linked to horse racing and various payments not being made. And this was a man named Dickinson. Now, Dickinson was famous in the state for being a crack shot with pistols. Yes, he was quite the marksman, was Dickinson, apparently. Now, in the end, Jackson got fed up of yet another young upstart

accusing him of being a poltroon and was tempted to do something about it. However, it was only when Dickinson committed the biggest sin that Jackson actually replied. Is that something about Rachel? Yes. He started bad-mouthing Rachel. Jackson quickly scrawled a note saying,

Your conduct of late have been so insulting that it requires and shall have my notice. that it requires and shall have my notice oh yeah you have my attention now yeah exactly jackson offered a jewel dickinson accepted i'm going to read out the uh the letters that were exchanged arranging this here on friday the 30th we agreed to meet at har's Mill over Red River in Logan County, state of Kentucky for the purpose of settling the affair of honour between

General Jackson and Charles Dickinson, Esquire. Further arrangements to be made. It is understood that the meeting will be at the hour of seven in the morning. It's all very formal. Yeah.

Then the further arrangements were made. It is agreed that the distance shall be 24 feet, the parties to stand facing each other with their pistols down perpendicularly. Then, when they are ready, the single word fire is to be given, at which they are to fire as soon as they please. Should either fire before the word is given, we pledge they are to fire as soon as they please. Should either fire before the word is given, we pledge ourselves to shoot him down instantly. So, no cheating. Yeah. Yeah. So, a few days later, the party set out for Kentucky, where the laws were more lax on duelling than they were in Tennessee. Dickinson was apparently in high spirits. He was apparently able to, and I quote here,

place four balls within the space of a dollar coin at 24 feet. Ooh. Now do you see it means musket balls? Yeah. Bloody hope so. Yes. That's quite the party trick. So many questions. Four? I suppose he's got a second. They're very close. Have to be. Yeah, this is to say, Dickinson is fully favourite to win this duel.

Yeah. He's a crack shot. However, dueling at this time was not like you see in the films in the Wild West. It wasn't walk away from each other, spin, and try and get the first shot off. No. No. That's ridiculous. Yeah, the two duelists would not race to shoot first.

Instead, they weighed up the pros and cons. Because the person could miss. Yeah. The accuracy at the time is terrible. There's no rifling. So your ball could go anywhere. Exactly. Unless you're Dickinson.

Unless you're Dickinson, yeah. He knows where to put his balls. Oh, yes, he does. Well, yeah, like you say, if you shoot first, you risked your aim because you were rushing. Yeah. Whereas if you shot second, you could take your time. Yeah, so there was an advantage to waiting to second. Providing you don't get hit first.

Well, yes, of course. If you wait to shoot second, there's always the risk that you'd have a bullet inside you, which would affect you. That said, however, bullets could obviously be lethal. But unless they hit you directly in the heart or the head, you'd probably still be able to get a shot off. Yeah. Yeah.

Bullets at this time wouldn't knock you off your feet. They still wouldn't. No. That's a fallacy. Yeah, exactly. You're not going to be blown away. Newton's second law, damn it. Yeah.

So it's going to be painful. But unless you're hit right in the heart or in the face, you're going to be all right. And jawless wouldn't usually aim for heavs. It's a small target. Yeah, stomach and... Because you can get a shot in the stomach that will kill you over hours or days or weeks. Yeah, because you can get a shot in the stomach that will kill you over

hours or days or weeks. Yeah, exactly. Infection and stuff. So, Jackson realising that he was up against someone who was a crack shot, came up with a plan. He would let Dickinson shoot first, take the bullet, and then take his time shooting back.

This was his plan. That's quite ballsy. So the two men met at 7am on the field. In the shade of the trees. The two seconds both drew straws. Dickinson's second got to choose the positions of the men. Whereas Jackson's second won the right to shout the fire command. To Jackson.

Fire. Then fire! Fire. Now, now, now. Yeah. 24 feet was measured, and the two men stood facing each other across the field. This is quite exciting. It is.

The command to fire was given. Fire! Dickinson smoothly rose his pistol in one experienced movement and shot. The crack rang out and there was a pause. Dickinson, then amazed, watched as Jackson simply stood there. Nothing had happened. Then Jackson rose his his pistol able to take his time Jackson pulled the trigger and nothing happened Jackson checked his gun and realized that he'd not cocked it properly so he said laugh about that yeah so he So he set up his pistol correctly and took aim once more. Again, the shot rang out and Jackson's bullet ripped through Dickinson's abdomen.

Dickinson slumped to the floor. Only then did Jackson move and stumbled a bit because he had indeed been shot. Dickinson's bullet had hit him one inch from his heart, but it embedded itself into one of his ribs. It was a wound that would remain painful for his entire life, but it was not fatal. Because he was wearing a big, large coat, Dickinson had misjudged his aim ever so slightly.

And it wasn't even obvious that Jackson had been shot, apparently, until afterwards. No, he just stood there. That's a poker face and a half. It really is. Yeah. Now, Jackson's wound may not have been fatal, but Dickinson's was.

He died several hours later. Much to Jackson's annoyance, his victory on the duelling field did not go down well in the higher society of Tennessee. Many saw this kind of behaviour as beneath a man that Jackson by this point proposed to be. He was outcast by many. Still, fortunately for Jackson, something was coming to distract everyone. War. Oh yes, it was fast approaching 1812 and war was in the air. However, in the Jackson household, which by this point was a farm with enough slaves for Jackson to be considered a member of the planter class, there was a new addition.

Rachel's sister-in-law had given birth to twins, and one of the children was given to the Jacksons. Uh-oh. Yeah, now it's not clear why this happened exactly. Probably financial reasons. Bringing up a child was expensive too doubly so so uh give one of the children to the jacksons well i guess he's used to buying people it's a good point uh it has led to suggestions by historians that jackson was unable to have children perhaps that bout of smallpox when he was younger coming back to haunt him but yeah we

don't really know why this happened but there's a little child in the house now. So it was as little Andrew, obviously his name was Andrew, was growing up that Madison was taking the case for war against Britain to Congress. Jackson, who hated the British for obvious reasons, was very much in the pro-war camp and could hardly contain himself with the prospect of leading a militia into battle against the Redcoats. Oh, he's so excited. However, as the war started and bad news started filtering through

of progress in Canada, Jackson was very frustrated that he'd been given no orders to move. Eventually, the order does come through. They were to travel to New Orleans to help protect it from native attacks. The Native American tribes were unifying and many were siding with the British. As you would. So Jackson set off with 2,000 of his men. Okay, I mean, they mostly didn't have any weapons yet, but that'll be fine, thought Jackson. We'll just head off and the promised

supply chain will catch up with us. Yeah. Yeah, it'll be fine. Now, this is the winter of the start of 1813, by the time they set off. The plan was to travel down the Great Mississippi. Now, this is the quickest way to get to New Orleans, but it was full of danger. There was a couple of accidents occurred with boats going under the water, one of which was when a service was being held

on one of the boats, and it became overloaded with men and began to sink. That's just stupid. Yeah. We read the capacity label. Exactly. I'd like to think that the vicar at the front, though, just carried on diligently. Water come up to his neck.

Eventually the men got to Neches, where Andrew found a letter waiting for him. Give all of your supplies to the general of the regular army in New Orleans and disband your men. Thank you for your contribution to the war. Hmm. Yeah. Jackson, swallowing his fury, refused to disband the men, abandoning them hundreds of miles from home,

and announced that, yes, he would give up his arms to the regular army, but he would march his men back home, and he would pay for them to do so himself. Aww. Yeah. This won the hearts of the men, who started calling him a nickname. Their general was tough and thin, like a hickory branch. So he became known as Old Hickory. Hickory sticks. Yeah, they're known as quite tough.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Hickory sticks. Yeah, they're known as quite tough. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Fortunately for Jackson, he does get the money back that he put in for this eventually, because that would have bankrupted him otherwise. However, despite the admiration he had gained from his men, once he was back home, he soon was embroiled in his old tricks. Shooting.

Yeah, well, that summer he had agreed to be the second in a duel for one of his junior officers. In the duel, both men took bullets, but neither were fatal. Jackson's junior officer was shot in the hand, whereas the other man, a man named Jesse Benton, was shot in the buttocks. How? Well, this is a humiliation because it proved that benton tried to dodge the bullet yeah so you don't want to be shot in the bum in a jewel you just don't one it's hilarious yeah and two yeah yeah coward exactly poltroon poltroon that's his poltroon yeah now jesse benton's brother a man named thomas once he heard about this duel, was furious for Jackson being involved.

You're meant to be better than this, and you seconded in this duel. This is all your fault. You're the superior officer here. Letters and words were exchanged between the Bentons and Jackson. A feud begins. Then one day, Jackson and a friend of his were walking to the post office and past the Bentons who were staying at a hotel nearby. A few minutes later, Jackson calmly walked back, probably staring at the two brothers. As you can imagine, the midden hits the windmill.

Someone drew their pistols. Afterwards, both sides blame each other. Yeah, you would. So we don't know who, but someone drew a pistol, and then everyone drew their pistols. And shooting starts. Andrew was shot in the shoulder, shattering a bone and severing

an artery. Then another bullet hit him in the arm, and a third whistled past his head. Knives were then drawn, and the fighting continued. One of Rachel's nephews happened to be walking nearby, so joined in the freight to help his uncle. The nephew dived on Jesse Benton, slashed him with his knife.

Jesse then turned and pressed his pistol against the nephew's heart and pulled the trigger. The gun misfired. That's funny, he went just like... Yes. Okay. Eventually, the brawl was stopped by onlookers. The only person seriously injured was Jackson,

who was laying in an increasing pool of blood. I feel spurting out a lot tonight. Yeah, not nice. He was dragged to the doctor, who, seeing the damage, informed Jackson that he would have to amputate the arm. No. Jackson had just about enough energy to refuse the process.

You are not taking my arm off me. Fortunately for Jackson, the bleeding stopped without the arm needing to be chopped off. I'm guessing the doctor was able to... Cover it with something. Yeah. But this was a serious injury. He was bedridden for weeks and the wound stayed with him for the rest of his life. The bullet could not be removed. So it was just kept in there. So he's got two in him now. Yeah. Therefore the metal detectors.

Yeah. Still, Jackson was unable to spend as long as he needed resting because there was a war on, and all of a sudden there was a need to fight. Worked to come through with a massacre in the south at a place called Fort Mim. Now, there's not enough time, unfortunately, to go into detail of what would become known as the First Creek War, but this is a simplified summary here. The Creeks, or the Muscogee, were a Native American nation that currently lived in modern-day Alabama and the Gulf Coast, so we're south of Tennessee here. Now, as is usual, different factions within this nation had different ideas of how to deal with this huge influx of foreign settlers on their lands. Some saw it as an opportunity to trade, some saw it as futile to resist. Some grudgingly accepted it, and others swore to fight back.

Now, this hardline faction of the Greeks became known as the Red Sticks. The Red Sticks, after the war broke out, rose in popularity as it became increasingly obvious that the United States were planning on nothing short of complete invasion of their land. So with the breakout of the war, the nation was mainly split between those that wanted to use the war to aid their fight against the US, an ally with the British and the Spanish who held Florida, and then those who saw these actions as the actions of war hawks. And I think we all just need to calm down a bit here. This group sided with the US, believing that it was more than possible for the United States to expand and for them to live side by side.

Yeah. We'll see how that goes. So the massacre that I just referred to was an attack on a US fort, Fort Mim, by this hardline faction, the Red Sticks. And this is the opening to the Creek War section of the War of 1812. Over 500 men, women, and children were killed, some in very brutal fashions. All killed were scalped, and rumours came through of pregnant women having babies ripped out of them.

Nasty stories. It's a bit brutal. A little bit brutal, yeah. Now Jackson, still injured, set out to put an end to this new threat. Heading south, Jackson sent out messengers and scouts to make contact with those Creeks who were friendly with the US. And to Jackson's relief, he soon got word back indicating that the Red Stick faction was still a minority, albeit a large one, and a majority of the Creeks were going to side with the US in this war. So the war that followed was mainly Jackson tracking down the Red Sticks,

burning villages of anyone he thought was hiding anything. At one time, Jackson ordered the taking of a Creek town called Talachachi, if I'm pronouncing that correctly. A battle took place, one of the young militia men being Davy Crockett. Davy Crockett. Yeah. Davy, Davy Crockett. That's a nice song.

It's a Disney one, I think. Is it? Yeah. Yeah, he's in this fight. No way. Yeah. The US forces won this. After Jackson wrote that his orders had been followed, and I quote,

in elegant style, leaving on the field 176 and taking 80 prisoners, I send on a little Indian boy for Andrew. All his family are destroyed. Yeah. Oh. Now, this is actually the second boy that Jackson had taken and then sent home to be friends with his adopted son. The first was called Theodore, but it's been lost to history where Theodore came from. Jackson possibly thought he was being kind giving this orphan a home, but it's just horrible. Yeah. He is just kidnapping children now and sending them to his wife. Yeah. I another one my dear i suppose if you're dealing with slaves then this possibly just seems normal spoils of war dehumanizing yeah as soon as

you dehumanize once you can dehumanize anything exactly says the great captain picard really is that the card quite is that no no i like it anyway fighting continues skirmishes continue and then winter hits supplies became the biggest problem for jackson as did the fact that the militia men's contracts were starting to run out it had now been a year since uh they signed up so men started talking about going home to to resupply of course we're not cowards yeah we're not paltruns we just want to resupply get some warm clothes we We all rushed off without packing our hats and our gloves. And poor Gerald there, he's just in swimming gear. Yeah, and Hawaiian shirts.

I mean, come on. What were you thinking, Gerald? Midwinter, man. Jackson was furious that his men would be openly talking about disobeying orders and returning home. So he went to talk to some of the ringleaders. Yeah, nice little polite conversation, yeah? Yeah, it was a nice polite conversation. You look nervous. Well, if we can believe the story, he told the ringleaders that if they wanted to leave, they would have to do so over his dead body. He then pointed out that he

had a cannon pointed at all of them, including himself, and that he would order that they all die there and then unless the mutinous talk stopped. I'd like to think he was holding a pack of matches ready to give to the person to light the cannon. Flame going

down. I think sensible Samuel was there just kind of trying to whisper into jackson's ear sir their contracts have run out it's not mutinous anymore yeah this yeah it was um a bit of a sticking point this was yeah ah technicality the men backed down well you would you really would now whether this really happened or not it's hard to say this might be an embellished story after the fact but uh what we do know is that talk of mutiny stopped. Jackson was able to hold his men together. The campaign came to an end in a battle called the Battle of Horseshoe

Bend. Jackson tracked down about a thousand Red Stick fighters, whilst leading around three thousand himself. The battle was more of a massacre than a battle. Yeah. Jackson's forces were able to surround the Red Sticks, and almost all of them died. Aw. Yeah, only about 50 on the US side died. That's probably mis-siring guns.

Yes, quite likely. It's holding the gun the wrong way around, that sort of thing. Yeah, the US soldiers were elated at their revenge for the Fort Mim massacre. And rumours of the aftermath here were just as gruesome as the rumours from Fort Mim. We have tales of US soldiers skinning their enemies to make horse bridles out of them. Oh. Yeah. Things were nasty.

Yeah. In this war. You can't just kill someone and that be it. It's sort of, you know, let's kill them then. Humiliate them. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, this victory shot Jackson's name to a national level. This was actually some good news for the US in a war where they had very little to celebrate.

Look, we've got a victory. The defeat of the British Allied Indians was welcomed by most. Madison and his Secretary of State Monroe embraced the General and the news of the victory, and the Secretary of War proposed a promotion for this new war hero. Soon enough, Jackson was offered the position of Major General in the regular army, not the militia. Ooh, yeah. This offer was too good to pass, and Jackson became one of the leading generals in the United States. His first job was to talk to the Creek Nation.

After all, a majority of them had just aided the US with supplies and with troops. There were some Creek fighters fighting for the US in that final battle. So his job was to not quite thank them, but to sort of, you know, buoy their spirits a bit and... Oh. What's he say well just bear in mind this is all with the backing from from madison the president here yeah uh but yeah jackson meets up with the leaders of the creek nation and inform them that they had failed to protect the u.s citizens within their land and i quote here the truth is

the great body of the Creek chiefs and warriors do not respect the United States. He then blamed them for not doing more to suppress the anti-US movements within their nation. I'll quote again, if my enemy goes to the house of my friend and tells my friend he means to kill me, my friend becomes my enemy if he does not tell me that I am to be killed. Outraged, the leaders of the Creek Nation protested that, what do you mean? We helped you in this war. We told you. Yeah. Yeah. You are now lumping all of us together. We don't have red, we have green sticks. Yes, our sticks are completely different colours. Yeah, this was just ignored by Jackson,

who then put forth a treaty. The Creek Nation would cede all of their land to the United States. And I'll quote again. Our friends will sign this treaty. Those that did not sign would become the enemy. They shall have provisions to carry them away. We do not want them. the enemy. They shall have provisions to carry them away. We do not want them. We wish them

to join their friends so they may be destroyed together. Unrelenting, isn't it? Yeah. Too late did the moderate factions realise that the Red Sticks were correct in their assertions all along. The United States were not going

to let the Creeks stay in their land. So they just stole the land off these people who had helped them. Still, Jackson had done his job. Yeah. Yeah. After this, he was given command in the south, where it was word that the British would take New Orleans and control the Mississippi. So we need to go and defend that area.

To begin with, Jackson spent most of his time trying to convince the War Department that taking on Spanish Florida would actually be the best course of action, and he fought and won a skirmish against some Spanish and some British troops. However, it was not long before he realised that New Orleans was where his attention needed to be. New Orleans was, by this point in history, a very unusual city. Not just in the US, but in the whole world. It had, until very recently, recently been Spanish and then French, and now it was part of America.

It still retains what it's French, the Caucasian. Oh, yeah, yeah. Today it does. Back then, I mean, it was more French and Spanish than it was allied to the US. It was by bread, it was by baguettes. Exactly. Bullfrogs.

But also straw donkeys. Yes. Because there's a huge Spanish influence as well. That's true. Well, its population was a huge mixture of people. The political factions for the rest of the US were simply not relevant in New Orleans. Instead, there was a large French faction who wanted France to come along and take over again. You had a large Spanish faction who wanted the Spanish to come back and take over again.

You also had a very large free black population, far larger than any other city in the United States, because a lot of freed slaves and runaway slaves had migrated to New Orleans, because it wasn't part of America back then. Oh, brilliant. Yeah, so you've also got that. You also have a massive slave population, because the plantations down in that area were huge. It meant in rural

areas, the slave population was 25 times larger than the white population. Wow. Yeah. So, and then on top of this, you also had the non-French and Spanish white population, who were split between Republican factions, Federalist factions, and those that just wanted to be a new independent nation faction. In other words, it was a real melting pot of different people with very different opinions. And then you have the pirates. Yarrr! Yeah, yeah.

A pirate economy was practically keeping the city afloat. Fudum-tsh. Yeah, the illegal slave trade that went through the city was rife so yeah this is about i don't know 80 years after pirates of the ibeans set isn't it yeah yeah that's george iii yeah yeah exactly victorian yet but we're getting there aren't we we are getting there so yeah you you had um pirate leaders who who are ruling sections of the city. Why is the rum always gone? Yeah. They were dressed like that style of pirate as well.

Really? Well, not really. No, they were. Yes, they were. They were. Hooks, eye patches, parrots. You couldn't move for parrots in New Orleans. Oh.

Yeah. And of course, the city was a democracy as well. A what? Yeah. It was run by a committee of safety. Oh. Yeah, who wrote to Jackson asking for help. It was becoming increasingly obvious that the British were indeed coming,

so can you come and help us out here? So Jackson wrote back and said, yep, don't worry, I'll be there. In the meantime, raise the militia. Get anyone who could fight to start training. I'm on my way. Jackson received another letter. The committee were hesitating. Well, when you say all the people, does that mean, you know, like black people? Because that might be a bad idea. And the French are here as well. And the Spanish. Do you want to give them guns? In fact,

now we think about this, I don't think the militia's a good idea, Mr Jackson, sir. I really don't think we should have a militia here. Jackson was undeterred, however. Despite the very real fear of the slave uprising, he made it very clear that the free black population of the city were encouraged to join the militia, and would be paid the same amount as their white counterparts. He wrote to the black men in particular, and I quote here, You have hitherto been deprived of participation in the glorious struggle for nation rights in which our country is engaged. As sons of freedom, you are now called upon to defend our most esteemable

blessing. You will not be exposed to improper comparisons or sarcasm. Now, I'm not a black man from New Orleans in this period, but I imagine if I were, I'd have had a few choice words to say back to that. I think so, yeah.

Yeah. First one being, oi. Still, a paycheck's a yeah. Yeah. First one being oi. Still, a paycheck's a paycheck. Yeah. So people started signing up. The committee responded that, OK, well, we are open to this, but if any black men do sign up to the militia, can you guarantee that they will be relocated somewhere else in the country

after the war's over? Ooh. Yeah. I guess in their minds, they're now trained and dangerous. And have guns, yeah. So they can fight and die for our city, but once all this is over, could you just make them go away, please, Jackson? Oh.

So that happened. Anyway, Jackson arrives, and he soon realised that the committee had reason to fear. This clearly was not a city that was fully behind the United States. It was in no way unified whatsoever. It was a bit of a mess.

So he decides to put the city under martial law. Curfews were introduced. You could not leave or enter the city under any condition without going through his men. He then went out to go and view the militia that had been created. He was less than impressed. Ah.

Yes. It was very much more a large group of very different people with very different beliefs rather than a single unified fighting force. Still, he had one thing going for him. The people due to attack the city were British. So well trained and organised? Yes, but on the bright side, if the city was full of people with very different views on very different things, most could get behind one simple idea. The British were awful. To the immigrants from the rest of the United States, he talked about the Revolutionary War.

To the Spanish and the French, he talked about European wars. To the newly recruited black men in the militia, he talked about the slave trade. And this unified the city just about enough. One thing they could agree on is we hate the British. The absolute hypocrisy there of, yes, I hate the slave trade. It's absolutely awful whilst at the same time one slave bringing up a drink for half of his speech. Yeah, there was that.

It's all the British people's fault you have all these... No, didn't say thank you. Gives the slave a slap as he walks away. Yeah, you can argue there's some hypocrisy there. But if there was one thing that people hated more than hypocrisy, it was the British. It's unified the militia just in time because news then came through that the british were indeed here sightings of the british had been had on the orange grove south of the city jackson unsure on how many there were whether this was a flanking maneuver or the main force decided to strike quickly to catch the british off guard

now the british to the south might be a diversionary tactic, in which case if he struck quickly and then retreated back to the city, he could get back in time. Or maybe this was the spearhead of the whole army, in which case he'd go and slow down their advance. But yeah, he didn't waste time. He set off straight away. The British were caught off guard. They weren't expecting this move, and a skirmish was had, which was pretty much a draw. It turned out that this was the start of the main invasion, so the British were held back long enough for Jackson

to figure out what was going on and put together a real plan. Now, the British had more men. The men were better trained, and they all had some damn nice uniforms. Yeah, look at those guns. Yeah. They all have one. Desperate, the leaders of the city turned to Jackson and pointed out that,

look, we have our militia now and we've got your troops, but there's still a large number of fighting men in the city that we're not using. I really think we need to ask them for help. Jackson was not sure. You figure out who these fighting men were? The pirates. They'd be great at fighting. Exactly.

They love to fight. They love to fight. I mean, not many chandeliers for them to swing off. No, that's true. On the battlefield. But great swords, though. And they couldn't, like, swing from the masts. No, that'd slow them down.

Yeah. They could send their first parrot, that would slow them down. Yeah. They could send their first parrot wave, though. They could, yeah, exactly. Just walking into the eyes of the British and slashing the heck out of them while they get shot down. Yeah, exactly. Well, Jackson wasn't very happy about going to one of the lead pirates and saying, can you help out? But he did see that this was perhaps a sensible idea. Yeah, the prisons were full of men able to fight.

So they were released. Jackson then agreed to meet up with Jean Lafitte, who was the leading pirate in the area. So give him the patch and the hat. Ah, mon ami, bonjour. Yeah, he was French or Spanish, depending on who he was talking to. French to me.

Yeah, no one really knew where he came from. He just makes stuff up. All right. Yeah. Bonjour, monsieur. Oui, I am from Espanol. Yeah, so Jackson met up with Lafitte and incorporated the pirates into his army, which is cool. He's got a pirate army. He's got a pirate army.

He's got a pirate army. Anyway, the main battle was prepared for. Now, imagine this on a map. On the left-hand side of your map, you've got the river, the Mississippi running. Yeah. On the right side of the map, you've got an impassable swampland. And then you've got the land in the middle. And then, to the north, so at the top of the map, draw a canal that stretches from the river to the middle and then to the north so at the top of the map draw a canal

that stretches from the river to the swamp so going across the map yeah it was behind this canal that jackson positioned himself and ordered that a rampart be built like a bridge no like a wall oh behind so the british would have to advance with the river on their left, the swamp to their right, towards this canal, get over the canal, then get over this makeshift wall. To make it as tricky as possible. Yeah, exactly. So that's what the British need to do. The British saw all this and put together their plan.

It was quite a simple plan. They'd rampart with cannons. Partly, yeah. Also, send some men over the river to skirt around this whole earthworks and the canal, take over some of the American cannons that were over there, point them towards the American line, and start firing from the side. Yeah, so that was going to happen as well. In the meantime, the British army would just advance on the fortified position.

After all, this British army was the army that had defeated Napoleon. I mean, this scrappy force was hardly going to be able to do anything. They'd turn and flee as soon as the might of the British army descended upon them. The British outnumbered the Americans here. Yeah, they'd be wall of red. Yeah, exactly. So they all set up. Everyone was looking very prim and proper. Everyone had a cup of tea and a couple of crumpets that morning yeah they all

lined up it was a bit foggy that morning not to worry though i'll hide our advance it's a good thing yeah yeah what's that well oh we don't have any ladders to to scale the ramparts yeah yeah that's a bit of an overtax. Not to worry, though. The Americans will just run, won't they? Tally-ho. Tis the British way. Yes.

We'll figure it out once we get there. So the battle starts. The British march forward. And disciplined as they were, they shocked the American troops as they simply shrugged off the cannon fire. So picture all these British troops marching steadily towards the canal and the wall, being fired upon by cannons. Huge holes were being ripped through their lines. The disciplined British soldiers simply filled the gaps up again and carried on marching.

Sort of stepping over there, you know, brothers, friends. Yeah, exactly. Crunch. Stiff upper lip and all that. What, what? He was a good man. So yeah, the US forces were getting a bit unnerved by this. They're like zombies, sir.

Right zombies. Polite zombies. One of them's carrying a china cup. Oh, we shot him. There's another one. Take his place. However, things then start to change. The fog suddenly lifted and it soon became clear that the men who had been sent to cross the river and take the large guns were late and had not done so. So they'd not got their supporting fire from across the river. I'm not surprised they're trying

to sneak attack up the side of the river wearing bright red uniforms. They do get there eventually and they do take the guns, but they're later than they should have been. Also, the British got quite unlucky as a couple of their generals were killed very early on by sharpshooters on the US side. The US militia was not full of trained soldiers, but it was full of hunters who knew how to shoot. Yeah, that's true. They can shoot a squirrel, they can shoot an army soldier. Exactly. A lot of the US forces were able to place their balls in very precise places.

Yeah. Yeah, it was handy. But the real problem, the main reason why things start to go badly, is because they have no real way to get over the canal and over the wall. The lack of ladders really does become a problem quite quickly. So you just sit there awkwardly, fucking sure as I am. I thought you'd brought the ladder. No. Well, they try and give each other a leg up and a bump up. They climb onto each other's backs.

But all the while, the US troops are literally pointing their guns over the wall, not fully looking, just putting their hand over and firing blindly into this ever-increasing crowd of redcoats. But the more soldiers you kill, you get more of a ramp then. That's true. Maybe that's the idea. Maybe that is the idea. Yeah, in typical British imperial overconfidence, the British simply assumed that the US would mount away under a display of superiority of numbers and discipline. Their main battle plan was to scare the US forces away. And it doesn't work.

Well, it didn't work at Helms Deep. It's not going to work now. Exactly. It just turns into a massacre. The US troops keep firing blindly into the crowd and more and more British fall. Eventually they were forced to fall back. A ceasefire was arranged

to collect the dead. A British man recounted what he saw, and I will quote, Within the narrow compass of a few hundred yards were gathered nearly a thousand bodies, all of them marred in British uniforms. and I will quote, Wow. Yeah, I love the fact there's an American officer with a cigar. You just know he's a prototype, typical World War II general with the big moustache and cigar. Stars on his helmet.

Oh, yeah. See that hair, guys? No, the results were not quite that extreme, but it's not far off. The British had 300 dead and over 1,300 wounded, compared to the 13 dead and 30 wounded on the American side. Wow. Yeah. This stunning victory would cement Jackson's legacy and set him up on the road to becoming the President of the United States.

Of course, it was only later that everyone found out that the war was already over. Whoops. Yeah. John Quincy in ghent at this time had already signed the peace deal oh yeah oops that's certainly only people there you go we're gonna stop there the uh the victory of new orleans so uh thoughts on him so far interesting guy um you can kind of see well you sort of get the idea why he's so, yeah, massive chip on his shoulder. He wants to fight because he sees that probably is the only way of winning, of doing stuff.

He's not a talker, he's a doer. If he's a talker, he's a very aggressive talker. I think he so far embodies what it must have been like to be in America at the frontier at that time, probably in a far more exaggerated way than most people. But you follow his life and you see actual misery that would have occurred during the war, the Revolutionary War. Then you see how lawless the frontier was in America, but equally how they're trying to create law in America. You then see how one person can be raised up due to his sheer willpower as a hero.

And he's also quite clearly an unpleasantly nasty man. Yeah. He's interesting. He's always very interesting. I think he possibly belongs more in our other podcast than this one. He's coming across more like a Roman emperor so far than an American president. Yeah, certainly with his, I don't want to call it a fetish, but certainly a violent desire.

Yeah, yeah. That's probably a bit too cruel. It's probably not a violent desire, it's more of a wants to fight. He does have a streak of violence within him though, doesn't he's like flaying the native americans yeah how do you think he'll fare next week i think he's a very uncompromising president yeah he's not going to want to talk i think he's what to do he's a doer yeah yeah i think you want to expand and be quite relentless with that but i don't know what's really interesting though as a point is talking about like we spent past couple of episodes in europe yeah it's nice to see what's sort of on the other side of that yeah he is so the opposite of john quincy isn't

he is yeah you've got john quincy the european educated diplomat yeah who loves to translate tacitus in his spare time yeah and at the same time as he's doing that, you've got Jackson on the Western frontier shooting people and being shot. Yeah. Yeah. There are two very different sides of America. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, it'll be interesting when we come to rate him. I get the feeling he's going to score a lot of points, both positive and negative. Yeah. Yeah. But that will have to wait till and negative. Yeah. But, we'll have to wait until next time. Before we go, though, next time might not be

when it usually is. Because you're going on holiday. Tomorrow. You're leaving tomorrow. And, yeah, so we might, no, in fact, we definitely won't be able to release another one two weeks' time, I don't think. So we might need to wait a bit i'm not

sure how it's going to happen exactly but if you're up to date and you're listening to us as we release these i will put on facebook and twitter a release schedule for the podcast and you can find out what's going on then if you listen to this in the future this doesn't affect you yeah the next episode's about to come on anyway so it's all good right okay then don't forget please follow us on twitter and facebook and you can dial us from Poppy, iTunes and Stitcher. Yeah, okay. And all that needs to be said then is... Goodbye. Goodbye.

And on my word, you may fire! Oh, seriously, Cecil. I can't believe I'm here again. This is... I don't mind being his second, but this is becoming a full-time job. It's four times in as many weeks. Four times in four weeks? Yes. It's quite tiring. Wow. This is only

my third time of being second this year. Really? Yes. I mean, I can't imagine how hard it is for you. Oh, it's just exhausting. You've got to get up early. Oh, yes. You've got to deal with all the stress. Are his pistols cocked?

Has he got his full set of balls? It's just... And the nagging. Have I washed the blood out of his coat from last time? Oh, and trust me, sewing up the holes from the balls, it's the worst thing. Oh, oh, oh. He insists on...

Ooh. Ooh, good shot, sir. I think he hit him there, didn't he? Yes, right in the... Yes, I can... There was a wince there. No, I think that made an impact. Anyway, as you were saying...

Oh, yeah, sewing up the holes, that's a full-time job for me as well. Yeah, no. Because I'll be honest, my client is a large man. He's a big target. No, he is. I mean, even standing sideways,

it doesn't offer much help, really, does it? No. But anyway, holes... Clothes full of holes. I have to sew them up. He insists I'll wear his lucky red jacket every single time. I just wish people would just settle things, I don't know, with a thumb ball or something. Oh, he's about to fire. Oh, yes, yes. Ooh!

That's going to hurt in the morning. That really is. Right, well, I suppose I should go and check if my man's all right. Yeah, well, mine's doubled over. Yes, that's a lot of blood there. That is. Oh, I think it's hidden artery. Ugh.

Seriously, people need to learn. They just need to stop mentioning Rachel's name, and then we could just avoid all of this. I know. I mean, everyone knows the rumor. Oh, yes. I mean, he obviously did it. I mean, they lived in sin for... Why do you look so worried?

Um... Oh, my God, he's behind me, isn't he?