Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - Brandon Saller of Atreyu

Episode Date: November 13, 2024

On this week's episode of Artist Friendly, Joel Madden is joined by Brandon Saller of Atreyu. Over the past year, the Orange County metalcore vets have stayed furiously busy. In 2022, they put out an EP trilogy that began with The Hope of a Spark and continued with The Moment You Find Your Flame and A Torch In The Dark. Those releases culminated in the band’s heavy but reflective ninth studio album, The Beautiful Dark of Life. Then, earlier this year, Atreyu unleashed The Pronoia Sessions — a 10-song collection that takes eight of their hits “to a whole new place” and features a pair of covers (Audioslave and Tom Petty). ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify.⁠⁠⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up everybody. It's Joel. Thank you for listening to Artist Friendly. And you may or may not know, I host a TV competition called Inkmaster, and Inkmaster is back. A new season is now streaming. The OGs and Young Guns are going tat to tat in this epic battle, now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus. Go to Paramount Plus.com to try it for free. Hey, what's up? I'm Joel Madden, and this is Artist Friendly on this episode, I'm talking with musician, singer, songwriter, and manager, and the lead vocalist of the band, Atreou, Brandon Saylor. Let's go.

I don't want to bed times. I don't want to have bad. I'm great. I'm super good. It's good to see you. You too, man. I'm stoked you're here. Me too.

What do you want to start? Whatever. We could start with work stuff, like the reimagined stuff. you guys did. We could start with that. Sure. Yeah. Where did that come from? Just, you love songs you wanted to do. Yeah. I always kind of wanted to do that too. It started kind of during COVID.

Okay. Where we had never done acoustic anything in our band. It was just kind of like not something we ever touched. Right. And then during COVID it was like, we're putting our record. So how do we like try to promote the record, do some live stream stuff or whatever? And the most sort of accessible way to do that was acoustic. It was like, you know, not as hard to get everything together and like this and that. So we started doing some acoustic

stuff and the response was just better than we thought. Coming from our background, you don't kind of expect our fans to be into that, you know, maybe, but it was like, why haven't you done this ever in your career? So spawned from that and then we sort of realized that we just have like full on multiple personalities, I think,

within our band. So it was like, why don't we just actually shine a light on that? Yeah. Instead of just having it be like a little performance here or a thing, like why don't we just actually dive into that, you know? So I think what started as like an acoustic project turned into like a full, why don't we give these songs a whole new life and give them an opportunity to be songs that people that have never even heard our band or like our band might be into.

You know what I mean? Because a lot of them are polar opposite of the originals, you know? Yeah, but they're cool. It's fun. Yeah. I liked it. Turn out fun. Yeah.

Do you think that like bands from, I don't want to categorize them, but like, let's say bands that come from like subculture, subculture, sub. genre, heavy music, punk, hardcore. The whole world of sub, right? Of these kind of like these, scenes and genres that are like, do you think that we or they or all of us or any of us? I'm including myself in the group with you, so I feel cool. Limit ourselves to what we think we can do, should do, will be accepted from us versus what we imagine. and just do if we were kids in a garage playing, creating, throwing paint against the wall, building things.

Do you think that we limit ourselves to like what's possible for heavy bands or punk bands or this band or, you know, things that are really defined by like an edginess to them, whether it's how we dress, how we look, how we sound, who we associate with? Do you think that there's some kind of like deeper self-esteem thing or like limit we put on ourselves to what we can create. And like, you guys just went and did this beautiful music. And in my mind, I'm just like, this is fucking great. Yeah. I don't think twice about it. Yeah. I'm not limiting you at all. I'm just going like, this is a great fucking version of Mary Jane's last dance. Like, I fucking love it. Oh, yeah. So it's interesting. It's like, I wouldn't even think that a band

would have to think about that. But then I go, well, in my band, we would too. We would go, can we do this? Like, what do you think that is? I don't think the majority, of, because like you said, it's like at our core, every band is just those kids that were in a room making music, like that piss their parents and their neighbors off. I don't think it's the majority.

I don't think it's bands that put those limitations on themselves. I think it's people on the outside that project those limitations. Because I think that once music leaves the four, three, four, five dudes in the band, you know this too. It's like it's almost no longer yours. It's theirs. Yeah, yeah. It's not

yours anymore. And whatever they say about, it becomes the truth. And I think those are the things that make bands worry about what they can and can't do. I think that we specifically kind of made a very conscious effort to like break that give a fuck button. Yeah, to press against it. Yeah. And I think it came from the fact that just everyone in the band liked so much different

shit that we sounded different. We wanted to all kind of incorporate our own influence, which turned into something that sounded kind of different. But I think that if most bands didn't listen to the outside, if, you know, like, then they might not care as much about that concern, you know, which I think that's how art should be. It's like it's the Rick Rubin thing. Like, as much as it pisses off a fan of music, like the fan has to be last.

Right. Because if not, art doesn't exist. It just you're something's creating something that they've thought you would like, which isn't real. Yeah, it's like going into an amazing show. and trying to tell him how to cook what to make. Yeah. Instead of going and being delighted by the thing he created that you had no idea.

Well, and this is the beautiful thing is if you don't like that chef, you don't have to go to that restaurant. Yeah, you can go to another one. You can go to another one. You keep trying. Yeah. But in our, in today's kind of world, if you don't, if someone doesn't like your flavor, they'll make damn sure they tell you about it. Yeah, we'll have a lot of options.

Yeah, exactly. You can just go to the other one. Yeah. You know, like other great. But they can also, like, they have a lot of options how to tell you. Yeah, exactly. And they can just like, they can really go get after it if they make it their mission to. We always joke off.

We always say, fucking off is an option. Let's not forget. Yeah, it is. You could always fuck off. Yeah. Well, you guys strike me as the kind of people that I would tell someone to fuck off, which I like. Because we need our heroes to be a little bit like not give a fuck in the right ways. and give a fuck in the right ways, right?

Like, I think we give a fuck about what, I think you should give a fuck about what you do and try your hardest not to give a fuck about what people think about. Yeah. Because as much as, like, success is a big part of being an artist. Right. I mean, like, I would rather live comfortably and to tour comfortably and have recognition,

but at the same time, like, it's about doing what you want in the first place. Not at any cost. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. I feel the same way. I feel like it took me 20 years and make sense of that to go, No, I do give a fuck about the right things and I don't give a fuck about the wrong things. I always try to encourage people to want success.

Yeah. To want to succeed at whatever it is, whether it's your something personal or if it's a dream or if it's a job, whatever it is you do. If you don't want success at that, take a stop and look at it and go, maybe I'm not working the right job. Yeah. Because if you find something that even just captures your attention, your imagination.

It inspires you. A lot of people find their ways into jobs they didn't even think about. And then they discover they like it. It makes them feel good about themselves. Of course. And then they should want to be the best, right, for themselves. I think a lot of people fall into things

that they like the outcome. If it's just a job, it's like, well, I don't know I wanted to do that, but I like how I can live and how my life is when I do that. But exactly, I don't think anyone, most people don't strive for the middle. Yeah, they should strive. for the top.

Yeah, at least it shouldn't. To try to be great. Yeah. And everyone deserves that, I think. Everyone deserves to like, to be able to say, I want to achieve this. I want to do this. And if you're in and around any group of people that doesn't allow you to or doesn't make you feel like that's okay, I would stop and look at where I'm hanging because I try

to surround myself because I need it. My self-esteem needs it. Yeah. Like, if I don't watch out. out for my low self-esteem, it will rear its head and I will make some low self-esteem-assed decisions. Yeah. So I need people around that are encouragers that are also trying to achieve their own dream or thing

or life. And I think that it's a certain mentality that you can find. And then there's the other mentality of like, well, there's no point to any of it. It's hopeless. And why would you even say you want to achieve this or you want to make this much money or you want to do this? It took me a long time and I got to a place where I'm like, no, no, I don't want to be around that. It's dreamers. Yeah.

I like to surround myself with dreamers. Dreamers. Yeah, that's it. I despise. I'm like a, I'm not a yes person. I'm a yes person in the sense of if something is presented to me, the first thing I think of isn't, why wouldn't this work? Right. The first thing I think of is, well, how could I make this work?

Yeah. I think that's the dreamer mentality. I think that like people that don't, that think the other way where it's like, you know, why would you think you could make that much money? Why would you think you could do this? Have never felt what that feels like to conquer that

or to like actually succeed there. Yeah. Because I think once you feel that, once you actually go for something and it works, it's like contagious. You want more of that. Like that's the hit, you know? Yeah.

Because you pulled something out of thin air and it exists. You're like, oh, I can do that. Well, I can do it again and again and again. and again climb a mountain there's always a taller mountain you know it's like so it's like where people that I think are in that mind frame have just never felt what that feels like which is unfortunate because I think that the entire world would be a lot happier place if people actually just knew that you could do whatever the fuck you wanted or they might actually have experienced it

in other categories like like they may be a really like fit person they've just achieved the top level of like you're just like that guy oh my god yeah he's so fit but he's not winning a over here, I do think there's like a, there's categories in our life, relationships. Some people are like, oh my God, they're just, they just been in a great relationship. They're, it's amazing. And some people is like, I can't figure it out. Why can't I figure the relationship thing out? Yeah, yeah. I don't know why I think it's something to look at and try to look for the patterns that you're doing or the, or whatever, and figure out what's the repeat happening, right? And you can do that in like a bunch of categories in life. I think there's probably like

five or six major categories. Finances is another thing. It's like, people that struggle with that, you're like, well, okay, like, I think you should stop and look at where are you winning. Why are you winning? And why are you like usually? The fit guy? The fit guy, why is the guy fit?

He goes every day and he does it. And if he's not happy with his job or his relationship, what is he not doing there? He's just not doing the same thing. He's not paying attention. He's not committing. He's not being as consistent. And is mindful of it. And it's simple and complicated.

Because the simple idea is just like, repeat what you're doing there, there. Yes. Easier said than done. Because then you have to actually become conscious of your actions, your patterns, your decisions. And that part's kind of hard because it's harder when it's internal. And it can be painful. Yeah. It's easier to go, if I go lift this thing every day.

It's simple. For this much time, easy. But when you have to actually go internal. And go like, what am I? And that's where I think people run away from their weak spot. towards their strengths. So they're super career successful, but not relationship successful.

Okay, I'm not saying you have to be relationship successful, but if it's something you want, which a lot of people do, you got to stop and try to unpack it slowly. It takes time and do some kind of plan towards visualizing what you want. A lot of people don't even do that. They haven't even stopped to go,

like what kind of relationship, would I like to have. Yeah. And start dreaming it. You got to dream first, right? So it's like, what kind of job would I like to have? Well, you got to start dreaming it. And then it starts to take on, you know?

We put yourself in a mindset to be somewhere. And all of a sudden, I mean, it's like, I'm not a super like hippie-dippy, like manifestation guy. I believe in all of that. But I'm not like a. There's something to it. There is, I'm not that guy. You're not every day.

What I'm about to say is going to make me appear that I'm that guy. Okay. I like it. It's one of those things where like if you imagine yourself somewhere as if it's a possibility or even as if it's fact, the world will open doors that it would not open if you did not have that mindset. I agree with that. 100%. You will see things you wouldn't have seen otherwise. You will have interactions with people that you would not have paid attention to otherwise because your brain and your energy is going to that specific thing. Where if you're not on that kind of wavelength, it won't happen. If you're not in the right place, if you're not in the right head,

space, a lot of things will just not open for you. No. Maybe this will make sense. Maybe it won't because we're just riffing here. But it's important because everyone listening deserves to have the best version of their life possible. That's what I believe. Yeah.

And I think somewhere in parenthood or something, you realize everybody deserves to be loved to have someone support them. Yeah. And to have like to see how far they can take this thing. Yeah, right? This avatar they're in. How far can we go? Yeah.

What can we do? And so I try to like always, like I'm sitting here with you and I'm like, how can we talk about the success you've had so that people listening, not only the fans of your music, but everybody listening can kind of take something away and it can live in their mind and their consciousness because they heard you say it and then they carry it with them. And that's kind of how we evolve together, right? We share information. we share ideas.

So to dream and visualize and manifest, whatever you want to call it, because I believe it's all, I agree with you. Like, it's not what I get up and think every single day, but it's something that I believe deeply in. It's real.

Yeah. And I have proof of it, like over and over again. Yeah. Right. But to do that, you have to be bold enough and humble enough.

Yeah. Because on one side, everyone's like, you're crazy. On the other side, you have to be humble enough to say it out, in front of people who are going to think,

you are crazy. You have to go. Yeah, maybe. There's a lot of humility in that. It's not a delusion. No. I'm not saying... I'm not saying...

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What are you talking about? Like that's not going to happen. That shit can start to sink in It can start to change. Yeah, you're like, okay. Maybe I am crazy, you know what I mean? Yeah. Especially in music.

I mean, that's an endless an endless fucking uphill thing to like figure it out yeah you know yeah but when there's nothing else in my head there's always been nothing else me too i'm a musician and i'll do other things but i'm i write songs i play music i play shows and that's it there's not a what if i didn't what would i do that's it so i have to make the only option work right yeah you know how long's a treu in a man 25 years. That's crazy. Bonkers.

Absolute bonkers. Same. I think that's the, I think that's around the same good Charlotte got started in 96. So you're 27? 27? Yeah. Yeah.

Same amount of time pretty much. It's wild. It's crazy. Like a majority of our lives, you know? More of our lives than it hasn't been. Yeah. It's crazy. That's true.

Yeah. But I mean, as as kids in a fucking living room, pissing off our parents, we wanted it to go this long, but you never said in 25. years when we're celebrating our 25-year anniversary. Yeah, it's a career. Yeah, you know. Like a career.

I think the only reason why we're still here is because we all have that same mentality that I'm talking about. Yeah. You know? What was the kind of music that first, like, captured your heart, your imagination, your, like, love for music? Kind of went in, like, phases. There was, like, early youth was, like, my dad playing, like, Tom Petty and, like, the Travel Moorberries and Roy Orbison and, like, stuff like that. Right. And it was like, oh, this stuff's cool. These are good songs, right? Yeah. And then randomly, the first band that made me, like, want to start playing music was Weezer.

Yeah. I thought, like, I loved Weezer too. I thought the Buddy Holly video was, like, cool. I was like, oh, that's cool. Like, and I wanted to start playing drums. That was the first song I ever learned on drums was say it ain't so. And then, uh, so started like getting into, got into Weaser, got into, like, punk rock music. And then what really made me want to, like, be in a band was, like, the hardcore scene.

Right. So, like, growing up in Orange County, like, you go to hardcore. and it was just complete and utter chaos. Right, it was like a, it was your version of like a party. Yes, people are on stage. There's no rules. Teenagers want to go somewhere and be around other kids and feel like they're doing something that they chose to be doing

versus like what their parents wanted to do. Exactly. And everyone there is a party or it's a hardcore show or it's whatever. Yeah. A hardcore show to me is a much, I like the idea of that better than like some other stuff, I guess, because you can certainly find a lot of trouble. You'll find trouble there too.

Yeah. But it's music and it's a show. Back then it was like all kinds of fights. And that's, you with there. It was scary. Yeah. Yeah. But that was also the allure.

Yeah. And it was that thing where it was like, these dudes on stage are making this entire room explode. Yeah. Like, I want to do that. I want to like, you know what I mean? Like we would watch like, you know, a video video or something of like hate breed. Right.

Or like old like festival footage of like sepeltura. or like these, you know, big metal bands. And it was like, whoa, like, they're making thousands of people lose their mind. Right. Like, if you could fucking feel that, you know, that's what maybe we want to start doing, like actually being in a band. Yeah. Yeah, that's cool.

Yeah. What was your first, like, few shows that really blew your mind? My first ever show, I went and saw the voodoo glow skulls. Oh, wow. And, like, a skate park in Riverside, California. Oh, wow. And then from there, damn. I think it was like a warp tour.

maybe. Yeah. But yeah, just like, and then just started going to like punk shows locally. Right. Like we were in a, a true use origin, really, we were into like a punk band called Retribution. And like it was me and our guitar player Dan and our old singer Alex and it was just and we were like literally children. So we were, you know, 14 year old kids playing like with every punk band that would come through. And then it was actually kind of working. But like it was just weird because we were like children playing with like total chaos. And like, bigger like punk bands. That's crazy.

You played with total chaos? Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah. Like casualties and like all the stuff. And we were like children. Yeah. So it all started with that just like going to shows, you know, and going to like local

punk shows. That's cool. Yeah. A wild start when you look back on it. Kind of like thrown to the wolves a bit. Yeah. Yeah. That's really wild and kind of crazy because you, you probably saw things.

And I really do think we all start like as like as like sweet kids who want to do something that they like. And for me, I, like, gravitated towards, like, heavy music, angry music, because it really did feel like someone was saying something I didn't have the power to say. Yeah. I didn't know how to say it. Now, with that, the bigger the bands get, the bigger the scene got, the more rules there were, and people were starting to, like, there was a hierarchy of things in a weird way.

And you start to feel, like, suddenly, like, it could really, like, make you feel a bit. you could fall into that and become a little bit bitter. Yeah. And like start following those rules and not be as sweet of a kid as you were when you were just in your garage. Yeah. And like trying to make music that you thought was cool. Yeah.

And the good, I always feel like the good people always find their way out of it. We all have, you navigate it. And then you get old enough and you're like, oh, no, no, no, I don't fucking care how heavy or punk someone is. No.

Like, if I meet them and they're cool. And then I might meet someone who's music's amazing. And I don't think that was cool. I don't know. Like, people are people. It's my adult joke, because when you become an adult and you start being friends with people whose bands you don't like. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Yeah. Because you know what I mean? It'd be like, oh, like, his band's cool. That's why I ended up talking to him or we linked up because I thought it was like cool. And then whatever, it's like, I have friends now that I'm like, I love this dude. I don't really fuck with what you do, but like, I love you, dude. You're a good guy.

Like, not you personally. No, no. But I'd be okay with that. I usually end up even liking the stuff they do. Yes. Because I'm just like, I fucking love this guy. Yeah. But also, I am less critical in general, the older I get.

So I kind of see kids making this kind of pop or this or that. And I kind of just go, good for you, kid. Like, keep. I didn't even really hear the music as much as I used to. Yeah. And I think it's something like a defense or like a critical thing that was. But I do think that like, yeah, the older you get, the veil drops. Yeah.

You're not as disillusioned. You grow up. Yeah, you kind of grow up and you go like, oh, none of it actually matters. Are you happy? Mm-hmm. It looks like you're having fun. I actually believe you. Yes.

Most important. You know, like, it doesn't feel evil. You don't feel like you have a plot. No. Behind that. And that's kind of where you start to kind of measure things in a feeling. Mm-hmm. And yeah, you're like, yeah, I don't even know what kind of music I like anymore.

I just like music. I still listen to music every day. Don't you love that question? What kind of music you listen to? It's like, everything. Yeah, I can't answer that question. I have kids, so trust me. I listen to everything, everything.

Whether I want to or not. Yeah, and I find myself, like, bopping along with sometimes. I'm like, you know what I mean? I'm in that phase, and I got a six and an eight-year-old, almost eight-year-old, and it's like, you know, the little kid shit and, like the kid shows and stuff. Every now and then when one has good music, you're like, okay. And how can you not love it when they love it? Yeah.

Because it's joy. It's the whole point. Yeah. Bring people together and have a happy, experience. How does kids, how is kids, I mean, this is not a simple question, but it comes across simple. How has kids change your perspective on what you do? I mean, there's obviously the greater purpose thing. Yeah. You know what I mean? Um, but I think that just kind of like child energy again almost brings you back to the headspace of like the kind of bit of like wonder.

Yeah. That you lose as you get older and like, I see my daughter's firsthand kind of have that just like unaltered sparkle in their eye about the world. And you're like, oh, I remember that. And you see them do it. And you're like, you can do that as an adult. Yeah. You know, like, I can still live and like, and find joy in like the smallest things and just find like wonder in the smallest things. Yeah, I agree.

So I think that that affects it a lot. You know what I mean? And my kids like what I do. Yeah. And it's funny because like it's a weird gauge where they're like, oh, like, they'll want to listen to one song way more than another song. Yeah, yeah.

Or, you know, one song will hit my oldest daughter and a different song will hit my youngest. And it's like, oh, but why? Seeing them like hear music and you can see them feel something.

You know what I mean? Yep. It's honest. It's cool as hell. And it brings back, it makes me as an adult want to tap back into that, you can't tap back into youth

once it's gone, but it's like you can tap into that energy. You can tap into that. I can put myself back in that mind state and just let things kind of exist for no other reason than they just exist. You know, and like feel whatever is going on.

It's like that part of kids is awesome to me. Yeah, it's amazing. It's almost like a wavelength they're on. They're honest. Well, I feel like you get back, you can get back a bit of that feeling. Like, you can. You can reset your sort of brain

and rewind your brain a bit and kind of live in that space because they're living in that space, you know? At the same time, you have to be a responsible parent and whatever. Yeah. be an adult, but like it's cool to kind of like be it, try to be on the same wavelength as your kids. I think artists though as parents are more inclined to play and imagine and like I do think that I have like the relationship I have with my kids. I am their dad in some, especially as teenagers,

it gets more and more like you have to be sometimes. But like for the most part, we have always been playing games and everything has been about imagination and fun with me. Yeah. That's just how I see the world as an artist. Whereas I think some people don't have those, those muscles aren't as developed. So they look at the world in a different way. And I've always been like, where's the fun? Where's the game?

Yeah. Where's the thing that we can create? Yeah. And so I think there's a, there's a, it's like we're kind of like kids. Mm-hmm. And a lot of times we, we look at things in a similar way. And I think there's an aspect of having like an artist parent that probably has an upside.

But there's probably some weaknesses to it as well. I think there's more ups than than weak. There's no more strengths than weakness. I agree. I think that it goes back to the dreamers thing. Kids are dreamers until the kind of world starts to take that away from you. If you have parents that are also there, then that kind of glimmer stays longer. And I think that kids like you grow into a.

much more well-rounded person because you didn't get, like, you weren't slapped with reality. You weren't slap with that. Yeah, or fear of what might come. Yes. Don't get too excited. I'm like, that's not my style at all. Yeah. I'm like, let's get excited. And it's not to try to protect them from the disappointment of if it doesn't work out. I always say, like, we'll figure it out. Yeah. We don't even need to talk about that. That doesn't need to be said. Yeah. Because that's life. We'll figure it out. Yeah. But we get excited. And certainly we have some disappointment. Of course. But we figure it out.

All right, we'll be right back. We have a commercial. Hey, what's up? Artist-friendly listeners. As you know, or maybe you don't know, I host a TV competition called Inkmaster, and a new season is now streaming. The OGs and young guns are going tat to tat

in this epic battle now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus. Go to paramountplus.com to try it for free. Yeah. Can I have one of those? Oh yeah. Here. I hope yourself with a little Zen. I've been staring at him for the last five minutes.

Are you about that Zen life? Yeah. Here's the Freshie. Stack of Zins. My gift to you. Love. Lovely. Keep them around.

Highly addicted to nicotine. Dude, I hadn't smoked. I haven't smoked in years. Yeah, me too. Hate a cigarette. Yeah, yeah. Fuck a cigarette. But just a little...

Nicorette and Zen. I'll chew Nicorette all that. Daymaker. Yeah. went to this brain doctor, he hates nicotine. Really? Yeah. Yeah.

So there's a lot of guys. Well, the opposite. Yeah, there's a lot of guys in like in business and tech and all these. You hear about it now, like they all are on nicotine. Because it gets you focused. Yeah. It really does work. Absolutely.

The brain doctor and this guy is like the one of the guys. I just went there on like a curious journey. Yeah. Because they do these brain scans and then they tell you about your brain. Yeah. They can see trauma. They can see. Praise.

They can kind of track, like they can tell if you have like ADHD, ADD, which I am highly high, high, high ADHD. And then they give you kind of this overview of your brain and how you could get it to the most optimal condition possible. Interesting. And it's like this new kind of like field of brain science. It's kind of, it's really only emerged in the last like decade of like these hyper-focused, like brain doctors who are like, you can improve your brain to function even better.

Yeah. And there's supplements you can take, which is pretty straightforward. Fish oils. Was there anything that was shocking that you found? Yeah. Yeah. There was definitely trauma, like physical trauma, head trauma. But that had looked like it had healed for the most part, which is great.

Yeah. They were like, that's really great. the part of my brain that's supposed to be resting, and I forget the name of the part, but it's like an ADHD thing, but they said that that part of my brain is never resting. Wow. So it's always going.

So they do these different tests. So when the brain is supposed to be the most firing off when you're doing like a test, so they have this like computer test where you're like tapping a button every time you see a thing. And it's like a little like test to see what your brain. and soon when you're focused. Yeah.

When it's supposed to be firing crazy, it's actually calm, calmer. Huh. And when it's not, when it's supposed to be calm, it's firing off more. And that's like a, I think that's like an ADD, ADHD thing. But optimally, you would calm it enough for it to like be more optimal without losing your ability to like multitask and be creative and dynamic. Because that was my thing. was like, well, why would I want to change that?

Yeah. Because I can do a lot of different things. I mean, well, that wouldn't change. It's just calming you down when it's supposed to do. In some spots where I can actually rest and, you know, can be optimal. And then they kind of just put you on a regimen of like supplements. Yeah. It's like it's, and it's all pretty straightforward.

One I'll say that I actually feel a difference with is saffron. Really? Yeah, it's called happy saffron. You can get it on Amazon. Yeah. I would highly suggest you look into it and take. I would tell anyone. Just for like,

take three a day? Or just for a mood? Mood, clarity, all kinds. Yeah, it feels like it does a bunch. It feels like it checks a big broad box. Oh. Of like overall general mood and drive. Okay.

You know where I struggle is like, I know I want to go to the gym? Because that's, again, one of the number one things you can do for your brain is physical. Yeah. Right? So it's like lifting weights or paddle sports. They say like tennis or

ball or whatever. So I know I want to go be active and move my body because I also know that's going to affect my mood, my focus, my general, and it's good for your health. But there's some morning lull that I have to work out of to become my happy driven self. And I think it was because it does go back to like your experience in the morning as a kid maybe. Some of that might go, it was terrible mornings. Like it was just a really bad place to be. But I think I think I think a lot of us probably have that experience, and certainly there's people that grew up in homes that were, like, less happy. Yeah.

So you didn't wake up to sunshine every day. For sure. That is a great supplement. And I think the fish oils is a real thing. Yeah. And there was a couple other, there's a, there's a packet of supplements. And it's on Amazon. Like they have their own brand.

Oh, okay. This doctor's office. It's in Encino. But it's like a globally kind of recognized brain doctor. And he's got like a line of supplements that. that you can get on Amazon, almond clinics. So it's AMA-E-N clinics. If you look on Amazon,

there's a bunch of different supplements. Yeah. The ones they put me on, I feel a major shift, not just a little shift, like a big... See, I'm about that. I'm like,

I'm not self-aware enough to where I notice certain things, like, like, foods or things like that that actually affect me. I just kind of like, I don't pay attention that much of them.

It has to really change and be like, who that made me feel great or that made me feel fucking awful. But so like, when you're saying, I can I really notice things. Like that's stuff that I'm interested. Yeah, I'll tell you why.

This is what I think. We're creative, so we're very heady. So we're less in our body most of the time. Yeah. We're thinking. Yeah. Instead of feeling. A lot of people are in their body and they can feel things.

They have a feel of pain. They feel like that's probably why like substances aren't great for us. Yeah. It doesn't mean we don't, but we're likely not to know our limit with drinking or something because we're not as in our body as someone else. So if I drink too much, I might track it.

I might not on the wrong night if I'm in my head. And then I end up drinking too much. And then that's a disaster, right? So that's where artists and creatives and heady thinkers have to like become aware of when I'm in my head

and when I'm in my body. That's why the gym is good for me. Yeah. Because if I go every day or every other day, if I'm really disciplined, because it's really hard for me. Yeah.

Like for whatever reason, maybe it was like being like a little like back in the 90s, there was like really a thing with jocks and like not jocks. And I was like not a jock. Yeah. So I got picked on a little bit and it made my kind of like physical self-esteem lower, I think. Yeah.

So the gym wasn't a place, a guy like me. Not comfortable. Yeah. You don't feel like if someone's yelling at me like two more. That doesn't go well. I'm like. Start out flashbacks. Until finally I'm like, fuck you.

I don't want to do this anymore. I quit. Right? So as corny as that sounds like, I have to be mindful of how I feel and encourage myself the whole way and then keep trying. Even if I fall off for six months,

I have to just try to go back. And I've found over the last like five years because I actually talk about in therapy a lot, as long as I keep going back and I track the time in between, it gets shorter and shorter and shorter and shorter. And now it's, it went from two years to one year to nine months to six months in between my last like workout try.

Yeah. Of like doing it for a few weeks to three months. Yeah. To now it's like never more than like two weeks. Yeah. And then I'm back in it and I'm going every other day. And then I might fall off for two weeks. Yeah.

And then I'll go back. And that's taking me a decade of trying for sure and getting back up. Yeah. But the brain thing was interesting because it gives you some insight. And then like the supplements, they really do kind of like there is, it does kind of, you feel a shift. Yeah. It's subtle, but not so subtle.

For sure. It's pretty cool. That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah, I've done the same thing I've done my whole life. I've struggled with my weight my whole life. So it's like, and it's the same thing too, where the distance of time where I'll completely fall off.

Shortens and shortens and shortens and shortens where it's like, okay. If I can just, same thing. Keep that window small. I won't fully go off the deep end and be in that place from like, how did I get here? And at the same time, not be mean to myself and just keep encouraging and keep like, because I've struggled with it my whole life. Dude, tour is my, is the best thing too for. Tour is great.

Because our whole band, literally our entire band goes to the gym every day. That's very healthy. And it's like, and it's one of those things where one, you don't want to be the dude, the one guy that you're like, I'm not going. Every now and then you're like, maybe I'm hung over. maybe I'm tired. I'm not going today. But it's like everyone wakes up.

And the first thing, you know, you walk in front of the bus and Dan or Porter or someone's like, gym, like gym boys? Like, yep, put on my shorts and go. You know, it's like, it's just one of those things that just, it's just part of the day. Yeah. I think when you get on tour routine is so much more,

this is so much more consistent. It's easier, yeah. So it's like, home is a little tougher. Yeah, it's like, this is just something I do. Yeah. But like, you can implement those things at home, but when on tour you have nothing else to do. So I see your videos sometimes on Instagram,

and I always makes me happy. Every now and then you guys will post something working out or something. Yeah. It makes me happy because it encourages me for sure when people share. Yeah. It's that accountability thing too. You know what I mean? It's like, I see people working out.

I'm like, okay, I should probably go do that. Yeah. It's same thing. I wake up in the morning. And if everyone in my bus is like, we're working out. It's like, I'm going to working out. Yeah. And then at the end, afterwards you feel better.

Everyone's in a good mood because they worked out. Everyone's got energy for the show. everyone you know what I mean like no one's slack and everyone feels good for the whole tour people aren't getting as sick you know so it ends up working out yeah I think I've dropped in the last two years it goes up and down and up and down um but I think overall I've dropped 30 pounds and I put on about 10 pounds of muscle it's awesome and so I'm just on that like okay now what am I going to do the next two years instead of like the next six months I literally like last month had this thing where I've always had a thing that wasn't that far away that I needed to lose weight for.

Yeah. A show, a big thing. Me too. Same. Yeah. So it's like, and then in the last year, same thing. Like the last year I've been trying to focus and say it's been like 40 pounds in the last year. I have.

It's great. Long way to go from where I want to be. But I'm not literally like a month ago. I was like, because, you know, we're playing when we're young. Are you excited for it? Yeah. It's going to be cool. It's going to be great.

It's different for us. We're doing like, you know, our album, The Curse, front to back. So it's like, we've never done that before. That's sick. It's like a whole thing to where we have to like show people that we can still do that record. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Especially in like slightly, you know, lineup change. And it's like, okay, a bit of proving ground.

But it's exciting because you, you know, you get to rewind for a bit and go back to that headspace of making that record and this and that. But I'm like, it's when we were young. Like, I don't want to be this old fucking out of shape, you know, shit bag on stage. Yeah. It's just like, huffing through the show. Yeah. So it's like, oh, I wanted to look good when we're young. And it's like, cool.

But like, also. fuck that show. Think about your life. Yeah. Like, how about for me? Yeah, like, I'll just keep doing this and so long as I'm making progress. Like, that's the only goal. Yeah.

Like, just baby steps until you get to where you want to be and then you stay there. You look good. Thank you. Thank you. It's just all, it's exactly that. It's just progress. Yeah. Not perfection.

Exactly. It's just progress. And then it's like, I'll throw in once I can hold something long enough, going from two workouts a week to three to three. Yeah. I don't move to three until I'm holding. two long enough that it doesn't seem like it's enough. Yeah.

Then I go to three. Then I was like doing that and now I'm at four. Then I'll throw something else in, started doing like sonnas. For sure. And then I threw in cold plunges. Yeah, plunges are huge. Cold plunges changed my life in the way of doing difficult things and forcing myself to not run.

Cold plunges? I love them, especially in the winter. Like we live in Nashville now. So in the winter, it's fucking cold. Oh, you live in Nashville? Yeah. Amazing. Yeah.

You know Josh lives there, my brother. Oh, yeah. Yeah. When I first moved there, we were texting to each other. But he's like, because dude, everyone fucking lives there now. It's amazing. The best place ever. It's awesome. I love it. I live in California in my entire life and just jumped out. I was like, well, let's jump off a cliff and move to another state.

Yeah, you're getting a little, loved it. A little east coast. Yeah, it's awesome. Country. It's cold in the winter. So we have to plunge outside. And it's like, and it's like, it's not, oh, it's set to a temperature. It's, oh, it's 28 degrees outside.

It's not fun. So I love them. But my wife, it had like completely changed her life. Yeah. Like she was like every day without fail and it changed her mental. It changed everything. Like you could see it was the catalyst for a huge shift for her, I think too, like mentally and physically. I think cold plunges obviously there's physical value. There's that you do get something physical, but it's mental. It's some people. It's doing that hard thing. Yes. Fight or flight. Yes. Some of us need more fight. I was someone who needed more fight. Even though you would say maybe maybe, maybe. People would say, oh, like, you've done hard things. I have my brother. He's always been the fight and I've been the flight. There's no lean, you're not leaning on anyone.

And sometimes flight is a good thing. Like you have to get out of somewhere. Yeah. But for the most part, fight is a more important muscle to have. Yeah. And the cold plunge forces you to do something that's really fucking hard and uncomfortable. Yeah. And it does something to you.

Like, I think like physiologically changes your. and you feel like a fucking yeah you feel like a Viking we were doing them on tour and we did like we did a handful shows with Iron Maiden last year and like it's funny

you know you get that you have your writer and shit whatever you know old British dude comes in the room he's like oh these things you're like I see here you want 60 pounds of ice 20 minutes after you show

we're like yeah it's like for drinks we're like no no for a coal plunge it's like cold what it's like oh here come look at this thing we put cold water and we fill with ice and then we get in it after the show.

And he's just like, you're fucking nuts. Like, what are you talking about? But it's, I bet it's amazing after a show. I've never done after a show. Because you're all, you're all freaking, you're jacked up after the show anyways. And then you're just cold, just like, we're not like meathead dudes in our band.

But it brings your nervous system down. It does, yeah. Because sometimes that adrenaline after shows, it can be a problem. Yeah. It can really be a good or a bad thing. The plunge post show helps with the dump, with the adrenaline dump.

Right. It's like you get, it's almost like you get that extra punch. But then after it, it's like, it's your brain gets the button. And it's like, yeah, now we're done. It's like, grounds you. Yeah. That's fucking awesome.

I love that shit. Did you think when you started 25 years ago that you'd be here now? In this room right now. No. Yeah, like in your life where you're at. I wanted to be, but I didn't ever. I think that my goals and my dreams when I was younger were smaller than they are now. And I've gotten to a place, it's a two-sided thing.

I've gotten to a place now at 41, doing, being an artist for 25 years that I never could have even fathomed. Right. But still, I also have the other side where it's like, but also there's so much more. So much more. Yeah. But I mean, no. Why? Because it's, when you're young, too, it's a, it's the why me?

Why would it be me that did this? Why would it be our band? Why not? So I, I, I never, I never thought I would be where I'm, Matt. Yeah, it's funny. I feel like you guys are entering a new era of really being able to do whatever the fuck you want, which is like the possibilities there are broader. Yeah. Well, I think it just comes with years and decades of experience and doing a bunch of things wrong and a lot of things right. But we are, we're very much in like the, we call it's our take the power back era.

Yeah. Like we're doing things exactly how we want to do them as a, as, as, as, collectively within the five of us. And that's it. Right. To the extent of like, you know, like just looking into like ownership and rights and like we, we manage ourselves. And like, and like we just like doing things where it's like no one's, no one's going to know what's right like we are and no one's going to work as hard as we are.

Right. For what we want to do. So why don't we just take that with both hands? That's the true. Life. Yeah. It does feel like a sort of like uptick in momentum and just like mental strength within our band because there's no, the only reason why we won't do anything is because we didn't do it. Right.

So it's like we all just are in that same headspace of just trying to just do everything we want to do. And we only do it if it's fun. We only do it if we're enjoying ourselves, even the way we make records. Like we made a reimagined record for no. the reason, then we told the label we were going to do it. Yeah. We're like, hey, we're going to, we want to do this. They're like, sounds good. Then we're writing new music. And it's like, cool. We're not going to do a studio. We're going to Matt, Pauling, who you know.

Yeah. He's producing our new album. Awesome. We went to Tokyo for a week, rented an Airbnb and wrote music. Amazing. We went to an island off the coast of Washington last month for a week, stayed in this beautiful house, wrote music. Like, just like, is it fun? Yes. Are we enjoying ourselves? Yes. That's all it matters. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's like, and do it the way we want to do it? Because that's how we want to do it.

That's how we feel. And if you just follow that. That's what every artist needs to hear. Yeah. Whether you succeed or fail, at least you did something you enjoyed and you did what you want to do. You likely succeed, especially if you've succeeded before.

Yeah. And you understand now that it wasn't a fairy godmother. No. That it was actually, there was a work, there's a process. There's a way this works. You work. You go forward. Yeah.

And you do work. And then you results come back. You refine. you go again. It's not complicated in the process. The complicated part is all the variables and making sense of the results and stuff. But I always say we stay out of the results.

We just look at them and try to refine things to keep going forward. And likely you go up, especially if you're aiming up. What it's funny, like you say, you said, you know, it's like looking back, would you think you'd be here in 25 years? Meas, kid me? never I want to look at myself in 10 15 20 years from now and be like did you ever think you'd be there

but the mindset is like absolutely absolutely yeah like 100% I thought it'd be there yeah it's funny you said you guys are managing yourself I was just about to ask you have you ever thought about managing because I think you'd be a great manager I've heard that from the dudes in my like since we started doing managing ourselves they're like you should do this maybe like I've been other friends up and it's It's something I've thought of, but I don't know if I'd ever want to take away. My bandwidth is limited. I thought the same thing with like having, like with kids. Me and my wife sat down.

It was like, we have two kids. And it was like, that's as many kids as I can have because there's one for each of us. My bandwidth can handle both of these kids. Yeah. If we have more kids, my work's going to suffer, which I don't want to happen. Right. Our marriage is going to suffer, which I won't let happen. Or I'm going to suffer as a father, which I won't let happen.

Right. So it's like, my bandwidth is only there. So it's like, I would love to dig into that, but it's like if I was focusing too much on that, I don't know that I would put the right time into being in my band and writing songs and all these, the other things that I know I already am supposed to be doing.

Right. You know what I mean? Yeah, I agree with that. I feel like we made the same kind of measured decision as well. We have two kids. It's going really well. I don't want to temp fate because I got all the time in the world for my kids. I'm working on things I love.

you know, it's not that it's easy, it's that we find the time and it all works, right at the limit of what we can handle. When you shift, you guys shifted as well too, where like now you're doing this, you have your family, you have the company.

Yeah. But at the same time, the band isn't as, GC's not as full time as it was. Not at all. So it's like you, you were able to shift to pivot. But that did have to,

that was a conscious decision because GC will never be at a place where we're doing 150 shows, 200 shows a year, we may go out and do 30, that's different. But it also goes back to that's what makes you guys happy. But that's what makes us happy. Yeah.

Yeah. The ultimate goal, though, isn't necessarily what I want. I don't actually know what I want. I just want my family to be good. Yeah. Yeah. And when they're happy, that's the gold. 100%.

That is like, I feel like the richest guy in the world. Yeah. When my family is good. Yeah. It's interesting. Even with like your own. personal like work endeavors yeah my seven-year-old will be stoked on a song and that will hit me harder than a thousand of my fans saying this song is dope yeah or it's streaming or whatever it's

like the seven-year-old's like going i like this one daddy yeah yeah both my kids are like learning how to read right well they're already there but they're still learning how to read yeah and it was like okay i wrote a kid's book just because i was like well i wonder if i write something and i put their names in it. Yeah. Like, will they think it's cool enough and want to read more? And it was, I was so nervous to show them both the book for the last time. Yeah, you're like, do you like it? Like, hey, I wrote a book and like you're in it. What's it called? Punk Rock Zoo. Nice. But it's not out, but it's like, but it was like, when's it coming out? Uh, end of the year. Oh, great. Yeah. But, dude, that's great. Yeah, it's fun. But like, it was nerve-wracking to be like,

okay, I sat and like, you know, voice shaking, reading this, you know, version of the book and showing them the pictures and seeing it, they like their character, all the stuff. But it's like, that's what makes me the most happy. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's the same thing as if your wife, like making your wife happy. Like, that's the stuff that to me matters way more. Do you have any, like, I'm going to guess the answer to this is that everything that you like to do is work. Do you have any hobbies or anything you collect or anything that's like? Not really. My wife jokes. She's like, You have not a one hobby.

Right. I cook. I like to cook. Okay. Like, if I get in the kitchen, have friends over and I cook, that's like, I'm in a zone. Right. It's like you said before, like, I fucking love what I do. Right.

I love being in a band. It feels like a hobby. I love the accomplishments of, like, getting shit done for the band. I love playing shows. So it's like, I love writing songs. So that's like my happy place. Like I don't, instead of like golf or, you know, pickleball or model airplanes. Right.

It's just like, I'm never like. like, oh, like burnt out on work. Like, it makes me the most happy to like, because I just like doing this thing. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I enjoy this today. Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean?

Me too. Like, I enjoy, like, we're, we have a week of rehearsals. Like, I enjoy hanging out with my friends and having band practice. And like, you know what I mean? It's like, none of it's stressful to me. Yeah. Yeah. Every, every, every, everything that I enjoy doing is, it becomes my work.

Mm-hmm. Because it's just, oh, I wonder if I could do it again and better. I wonder if I could do it. do it bigger. I wonder if I could make this, like this show started as a hobby that I really enjoyed. And now it's a job I really enjoy. Well, and it's the hack. You do something you like, and then people give you money for it. And you're like, I do it for free, but I don't want to tell you that. All right. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, okay, that works. You know, like, yeah. So that's the, that's the ultimate life hack. Yeah, that's great. Yeah, that's fun. I'm happy for you guys. Thank you. Thanks for coming and

doing this. Always, man. So great. Stoked to hang. Yeah. Thanks, man. For sure. All right. I hope you enjoyed today's episode of artist friendly. If you really liked it, you can follow, like, subscribe to the show, anywhere you listen to podcasts, Spotify, Apple, Amazon. We appreciate your support, and we'll see you next time.