Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - Brent Smith of Shinedown

Episode Date: February 19, 2025

On this week's episode of Artist Friendly, Joel Madden is joined by Brent Smith of Shinedown. For the past couple of decades, Shinedown have been relentless in their mission, channeling pain, addiction, and the power to overcome into seven studio albums and countless shows. During the pandemic, they cracked the mainstream, subverting their hard-rock roots with the viral piano ballad “A Symptom of Being Human” and inviting Jelly Roll onstage for “Simple Man” at Blue Ridge Rock Fest in 2021. As Shinedown prepare for a busy year, Smith connected with Madden about his diverse musical influences, the journey of building the band’s 20-plus-year career, and their highly anticipated headlining tour with Bush and Beartooth. ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify.⁠⁠⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up? I'm Joel Madden, and this is artist-friendly. On this episode, I'm talking to the lead singer of the multi-platinum rock band Shinedown, Brent Smith. Let's go. I'm not smoking on gas and smoking out piff. That's my kind. I don't want no bad times. I don't want to have bad.

So I grew up in Knoxville, Tennessee, so to watch Nashville in the last decade, it's been interesting. I grew up in the 90s when I was in high school, so like 1991 to 1996. Yeah. Yeah. So like when I got a car, I was either on the weekends, I was either in Atlanta or I was in Nashville. Right. So it's just, it's- That's where it was happening. It's remarkable to see, like, what Nashville has done in like a decade.

It's amazing. There's a running joke in Nashville where the state bird is the crane. Right. Because there's just so many cranes. Yeah. Everything's just like, you know, they're just building out. But no, like Nashville's, I know why a lot of people started to move there. it definitely has a very unique vibe.

That makes a, I didn't know you were from Tennessee. I formed the band in Florida, but I was born and raised in Knoxville, Tennessee. Well, Florida's not too far. Not really, no. Why did you go to Florida? I mean, it was kind of a little bit Shakespearean because I got signed to Atlantic Records with a band from Knoxville, dropped after nine months, re-signed by the A&R, which was a gentleman by the name of Steve Robert.

He went by Steve O in the industry, gave me a development deal, and it led me to Florida. Limp biscuit. Limp biscuit, Leonard Skinnerd, you know, Yellowcard. Oh, right. Yeah, Susan Dadeski, Derek Trucks. I always think a limp biscuit. I love limp biscuit, by the way. They definitely, you know, they're coming back with a resurgence, definitely.

That's kind of been happening, though. Yeah, yeah. But I didn't know you're from Tennessee, which makes sense because I hear a lot of, and I'm from Maryland, which I don't know if you know a lot about Maryland. Probably not. Some small. Some. But I grew up all my life with a lot of country music. Okay. And then when I was a teenager, I obviously rebel against everything around me and go into like the opposite and make like punk, pop punk garage rock, all that. And but I, I've always had a, an affinity to southern like rock. Yeah. And country music. So I love country music. Yeah. And to this day.

And I've always heard a nice, like, country, southern rock in your music. Yeah, I think that it evolved, you know, over time. It's interesting because the band, I think even more so now, there have been comments that were kind of chameleons. You know, we are this rock band, but I've always played in a very, very big sandbox when it comes to music. I have a pretty vast palette. But, you know, just being from Tennessee, that southern draw kind of comes out.

some of the modern aspects of what we do, like in the last two records, you know, because there's certain people that are of the mindset of the shine down that is now is not the shine down of like the first two records. But there's an evolution in that. Like I can't make the same record over and over again and I do my best, or we, I should say, we do our best not to write the same song twice. Right. But that Southern draw is something that is just a part of me.

It's just who you are. Yeah. Like it only takes me about 15 minutes going into Knoxville because my parents still live there. You start talking. There's a, there's a draw, like, there's definitely a Knoxville accent, too. There's, like, a southern aspect of that. Because it's a college town, you know, University of Tennessee, Tennessee balls. But so, like, there's, you know, there's a lot of transplants to do. You know what I mean? But, like, when you kind of enter Knoxville, all of a sudden, you start, like, bleeding orange and white. It's really, like, it just kind of takes over, but there's

this real southern line of communication. It's kind of. I like this slow, it's endearing in a lot of ways. It's great. It's like in Maryland we have, have you ever heard the Tidewater accent? No. Oh, it's, what is this? It's terrible. Oh, God.

But it's so great. Okay. And if you grew up in Maryland, you hear words as a draw. Okay. So, but it's not, it's a bit, it's so it is Southern in a way. Anybody from Maryland that's listening would know exactly what I'm talking about. Okay. Because we all have an aunt that.

talks like with a heavy Maryland accent or an uncle with a heavy Maryland accent where they say words like home, bone, boat, worder, Danair, hon, as. Now is Maryland, like, do you consider that north? It's, so that's the thing is like it's one of those states that's the southern part of the state. It actually back in like the, um, the, what is it, the civil war? Uh-huh. It was divided. Right. The Mason Dixon line. You know, they say the Mason Dixon line.

Like that actually runs through Maryland and a couple of states, I think. Okay. So, Maryland, there's Southern Maryland. So there's like a whole part of the state that is like would consider itself like a Southern state. So if I say sweet tea to you, do you know what I mean? Of course. Okay. Yeah.

Because that Mason Dixon line, sometimes people get that, like if you're past it or forward. Yeah, yeah. It depends on if you understand like what sweet tea is, which is where when you stir it, the spoon should be able to stand up. Yeah. You know, and then other times people are like, what do you mean sweet tea? It's like, well, you boil the sugar into the steep.

Yeah. Yeah. Some people go like, what the hell? And then when they taste it for the first time. It's sugar water. It's sugar. Like, when your mom made tea, it was just sugar in a big mason jar. Yeah, with brown, you know, food coloring.

Brown, like, I think that's tea because it's just sugar. That draw all happens in Knoxville, too, just to give an example. Like, my mom cannot say wash. Like, she cannot say, like, I'm going to go wash your clothes or I'm going to go wash my clothes. She has to say, warsh. Warsh. Everything is Warsh.

Worse. Yeah. So it's a very, everyone in Maryland, like, we laugh about it, but we also love it. Right. And like, we understand it in a way that's like, it's endearing. And it's embarrassing if you're in the real world and you're like, I remember when I, I had little things that I had to work on, like words that I would say, I would sneak out. Okay.

And I had this from when I was a kid. Right. Because we were kind of like a little bit, a little hayseed. We were down in the country. Yeah. Like real kind of far down there. And so, and it was Maryland. Like it was like every, there's crabbers everywhere.

There's water everywhere. So my wife, though, will always catch little things, especially if we go home and visit. She'd call you out on it. She'd be like, what did you say? Does she find it like cute though? Yeah, yeah, yeah. She likes it. It's just funny.

Or is she just looking at you like, what did you just say? No, no, she likes it. like what's happening yeah and she she definitely will meet some maryland folks and be like what his accent is crazy he like i can't understand totally what now where's she from Nicole is originally from oakland okay born in oakland and then moved down here at a young age and grew up in beverly hills cool beverly hills so most of her life in beverly hills that's got be interesting growing up in beverly hill yeah i always asked that yeah and you live in beverly hills. Yeah. I think we're all not so different than we think we are, even if you could say,

well, they grew up rich and I grew up poor. Absolutely. You're growing up with a different set of problems, and we could argue like, yeah, but those are better problems. I'm like, I don't know if they are better problems. Yeah, I think it depends. I mean, I grew up with no money. You know, my mom, you know, worked for a, you know, pretty big corporation, you know, in the banking system. My dad was a teacher for 40 years. Yeah. Yeah. They worked hard. And they didn't. make a lot. They didn't. That's kind of like the average, like mine too. Like my parents worked really hard. Didn't make a lot. We didn't have much. Yeah. But I mean, in all reality, but what we did have, what we were rich in was like love and affection and respect. And, you know, I was raised in a lot

of ways by really, my dad is such a huge part of my life. But, you know, two strongest women in my life where my granny and my mom, which is my mom's mother, you know, so the work ethic was always instilled at a super young age. Like I, like there was, when I was 13 in the state of Tennessee, you had to write a letter to the governor, like the parent, you know, and the child, you know, but if you wrote a letter to the governor and it went through the office and this and that, you know, you could go to work at 13 as long as you had your parents' permission. So like as soon as I could swing a hammer or, you know, bad groceries or whatever, I wanted to make my own money. So the work ethic was always instilled.

That's funny, isn't it? Because I was the same way. I got a job at 14 and worked probably 40 hours a week from the first. What did you do? What was your first job? First official job. So before I could get, before we could get jobs at 14, we were working on our own. We sold candy at school, which was actually not such a joke. Like, we made a lot of money. I would say so. Like we made hundreds of dollars a week selling candy and then we got caught and we got expelled. As we got caught a couple times and then it was a whole thing.

We got back in to school. It was fine. But it was the first time I had ever had money. Did you have to pay somebody off of candy? No. They took, it was really not cool. Like if you'd think like if someone's being entrepreneurial, you'd like encourage it. Yeah.

You'd be like let's like formalize this and make it a way for you to do it. Right. And there was just no having it. And especially like kind of like poor kids selling candy, like you think, what do you want to do, sell drugs? Exactly. You know, I don't know if we even knew how to sell drugs. But candy was like such a quick turnover. We were just going every week.

We'd go to the, we'd go to this like store that had like bulk candy and we'd buy like jawbreakers, jolly ranchers, this, that. And we'd have like a different variety every week. And we'd just like, kill it. Then we got stopped at. We were mowing grass and washing cars. Yeah. That's, doing that will humble you. Yeah.

Like the grass mowing, the car washing, any kind of like manual labor. For nothing. For nothing. They were like, I'll give you five bucks, ten bucks, like max back then. So then when we were 14, you'd get a job. You could get a minimum wage job. We worked at a pizza place. And he definitely got his money worth out of us for $4.25 an hour.

Just grind us. My thing too is like I turned 16 and like back in the day. So I worked in the back of the house and restaurants. I've worked at the front of the house. But like I started in the front of the house like at 16. I somehow was able to obtain an ABC license at 16 to be able to sell alcohol. That's great. You know, so I was like, you know, this was my sophomore year, I think, in regards to, yeah, I would have been sophomore year.

But man, like my parents on, you know, Friday, Saturday and not all the time on Sundays, but like I worked at a pizzeria too. It was called Best Italian was the name of the place. And, you know, I'm 16 years old. hanging out in a college town. But on a Friday and Saturday night, you know, I could pull 500 bucks if I worked hard. Yeah. You know, so 16 years old back in the day, you know, in the 90s. You know, I could make like a thousand bucks in a weekend sometimes, which was, and then I just spin it on music and like music equipment. Yeah, that's kind of like, we started good Charlotte when we were 16. We worked jobs. Um, I went from the pizza place to like, I worked at Food Lion.

I was a bag boy and then a, and then a cashier. I worked at Golden Corral. We're very similar, like, the timeline. Like, I did the same thing. Yeah, in the 90s. Yeah. Very similar. Alternative rock radio.

I grew up on alternative rock radio, like Allison Chains. I listened to the radio. College radio, too. Yeah, college radio. And then that's how we started our band. We just listened to the radio. We didn't have access to, like, even cable TV until we were older. Like, growing up, we never had cable.

and like so we'd be at our friend's house watching MTV if we got to watch MTV. My parents blocked it in our house. Yeah, yeah. But my granny only lived two streets over and she didn't care. So I just go to her house and watch it. That's funny. Yeah, my mom was super afraid of she's very religious. So she was afraid of us getting too much secular music in our minds.

But we would find it by Rolling Stone magazines or by this. and we were just like... Remember metal edge? Yeah. Like, back in the day? That was like my favorite magazine. Oh, you like metal edge? I just loved it.

I loved it. How wild it was. I go back to that. Like, everything is like, it's too easy now. Like, back in the day, and I'm not trying to like, you know, age us or anything. But like back in the day, man, you couldn't, it wasn't at your fingertips. You had to go hunt for it. Yeah.

And there was a lot of discovery. Yeah. That's dope, dude. Yeah. That's one of our magazines. Oh, really? Yeah. That's awesome, man.

I love that. Yeah, dude. I love metal edge. Yeah. music magazines, I would buy them and just discover any band. What were the other ones? There was like Hit Parader. Yeah, Hit Parader. Revolver. AP still around. AP still around. Alternative Press. Alternative press. Yeah. What are some of the other ones? I'm like, I'm trying to think of some of the obscure ones that were. Circus. Circus. Yeah. Like Hit Parator Circus were like,

yeah. I'm trying to think like Guitar World. I like that too. Yeah. Guitar World's still there. Yeah, that's still there. Yeah. But I just think back. And then when you go. and you find out like bootlegs and different things of that nature and like these different, especially coming out of Europe and the UK, all these different magazines like Kerrang and all that, which is still around. Which I love too. There's Roxanne Kerrang and Emmy. Those were like the ones in the UK.

Yeah. Metal hammers in the UK. What is the, because I know that you've said that like for the band that Australia is like your second home. Yeah. Like what is the publication in Australia, like for music? Australia does like Australia. Australian Rolling Stone. That's the big one. There's not a lot of big music publications in Australia. They have some websites that do pretty well there. But like Australian Rolling Stone is probably like the big music. You guys probably do good in Australia. No, the thing is about that is we've been working on that for like years, it seems like, because we've only been one time. And it was like 14 years ago. Really? Yeah. Because right now, honestly, what I'm trying to do is the band that I'm in is a bit of a, I mean, some of the people in the industry have, I've called it, we're kind of like a unicorn because there's a lot of like United States-based

stuff that we do, you know, getting a bit more familiar in Canada. UK is probably the second market for us and what have you, Europe. But like there's all these places that I really, really want the band to go to that people are sometimes surprised that we've never really been to. Like we've only been to South America once and it was only for two festival shows. And then we've only been to Australia at one time, never been to India, been to Asia, like once. And so 2026 moving into next year, like my goal is to play all seven continents.

To just be like, hey, man, like, we've been doing this for a minute. I really, we've never even played Mexico. Really? Yeah, it's very, it's very strange. It's harder to find tours than you would think. And then also, too, it's just the financial side of things. It's hard to go. People don't realize how expensive it is to move the show.

I mean, what do they want you to do? Like, you can't just show up with four of you. I need you guys to go do a tour in Australia and take us with you. Come with us. With, we would, in a heartbeat, we'd love it. Done. Dude, let's go, man. That would be dope.

I would do that. I lose my mind. Because we would definitely, we're definitely going to tour Australia, not this year, but probably next year. I'd love for you to keep us in mind, man. We're warming up. We're warming it up this year. We're going to do like 10 shows. That's awesome.

But that's the other thing, too. Like, in Australia, people talk about, like, there's only so many places you can play. But at the same time. Five. Yeah. Okay. You do. Because you can't really bus anywhere. It's so the, the landmass is so, you gotta fly. You gotta fly everywhere. You fly. You truck everything and then you fly. You would do Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Adelaide, Perth. Got it. 5. Yeah. You could do other. Do you know the other ones that are like in the, is there anywhere like in the bush to play?

Like cities that you wouldn't know about. Okay. Have you ever done Tasmania? No. Okay. Do you want to do Tasmania? I would do it just. I would do it just. just to see Tasmania. So would I. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's cool. Okay.

Australia is fucking dope. But like I would say we have an affinity personally for shows outside of America. Tell me where? Everywhere. Everywhere. Like we do great in South America. Okay. We do great in Mexico.

Like Mexico's great in Europe. We do, we love it there and the shows are great. It's not that we don't love America. We love America. I think being that we didn't get to travel, like, growing up. Like, I didn't get on a plane until I was 19. Really? So.

I didn't get on a plane until I was 21. But there you go. Yeah. I also didn't listen to the Beatles White record until I was 24, so. Probably same. Yeah. And I love the Beatles, but didn't really, I wasn't a music, a fictional, until I was older.

Yeah. I didn't want to be told what I was supposed to like from someone else's opinion. So I think that I appreciate it. appreciated it more as I got older. Some of the records that are like ingrained in not only pop culture, but just musical history. Like these are the greatest records ever. And I'm like, well, let me, I don't know. I'll be the judge of that.

Yeah, let me at least have my opinion. Then you hear it. And then you're like, I understand why that is. I agree. Totally. I think no one wants to admit it. I will admit it wholeheartedly. Like I was at a chip on my shoulder for a long time on like what music I was supposed.

to listen to or what music was great. I think also we came out at a young age and the music critics were so mean to us that we became very anti, like, if that's what you guys... Yeah, but your fan base is extraordinary. Our fan base is amazing. And then as I got older,

I started to really appreciate why people like these certain bands and these, especially the older bands. Yeah. But even like some of the bands that I may not have appreciated when I was, you know, in my early 20s,

I can just listen to a record now with like no, no emotional attachment to like, am I supposed to like it or not and make my own judgment on it, which I don't know if I could always do it from being honest. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think about it also, too. Like when I was, my dad completely changed my life when I was 14, 15 years old because, like, I was heavily influenced in like British punk rock, thrash metal, you know, really, really heavy stuff when I was like 14, 15 years old. Like I had a whole, like half of, and this was like back in the day, but like when I was 14, I just tried to grab.

everything that I could from like G.G. Allen. Yeah. Just because it was like, yeah, like the wilder it was the better. You just went like the, I'm going to find the wildest one. Yeah, I want to find the wildest stuff. But then like, you know, Operation Ivy, the exploited. Oh my God. The dwarves, you know, Fugazi, all that stuff, you know. I remember my dad coming into my room one day and it's kind of silly out, like, almost like out of a movie, you know, music's blasting. I'm just doing my thing. My dad's like, Brent, Brent, Brent. And I'm like, what? And he's like, he's like, I don't understand why these people are so mad.

Like talking about the music. Even like on the female tip, too, man, I'm a huge Wendy O. Williams fan. Yeah. You know, and, but he was just like this angst. And so he said, I got you something. I do want you to listen to something different. And I just didn't want to hear it.

And so he gave me this tape. And he's like, well, you just put this in at some point in time. I'm like, whatever. And so he leaves the room. I throw it in the corner. A couple weeks go by. I'm like cleaning stuff up in my room. and I find this tape that my dad gave me.

And it was an anthology of a guy named Otis Redding. Oh, my God. My dad loved Otis Redding. That's how I heard Otis Redding. So I put it in, and the only thing that I can equate this to is when, and the first song I ever heard was Love Man. Yeah. And it was literally like, it was like tasting chocolate cake for the first time.

Yeah. I didn't even realize, like, that the voice could truly be used as an instrument because Otis Redding got me to Sam Cook, which got me to, you know, Marvin Gay and Al Green, and then Percy Sledge got me to Ella Fitzgerald, Billy Holiday, Nina Simone, and it just opened up this different world of, like, R&B and Motown, and rhythm and blues and learning, like, the core of, like, rock and roll.

Then I started to find out about the Jackson 5. And then, oddly enough, the Jackson 5 kind of led me to Led Zeppelin, which led me to Black Sabbath, and then it just started growing from there. But I was so centered in, like, heavy guitars. big drums, scream, you know, because I was an angsty kid, you know, but all of a sudden I started to figure out, oh, wait a minute, you could use your voice as an actual instrument. Yeah, and it's interesting. That makes sense to me. Also, there's, it's soul. Totally. There's soul music. So I

don't even put that music in a category of something that I even critique. Like, it's hard to explain, but like my dad loved that music too. Yeah. So everything you just named, I grew up on. when my dad was around. Then he left when I was a little older from zero to 10. All I heard was soul, right? And that to me is weird. It's like I don't even think about it,

but foundationally, I would say that's probably like the musical foundation of my life was something like gospel and soul. My parents went to church. There was a lot of church music. And my dad listened to soul music, R&B, you know, Stevie Wonder,

all the Motown. It's in our DNA. Yeah. Like that music is really, it's embedded in like just human beings in general. It's hard to explain because it doesn't even, like I still listen to that music sometimes. It's weird.

Like I put it on in the background at home. Like I'll put it on in the house. It's not the same experience as listening to a record. Like when I listen to a band, like, oh, so they just made a new record. Right. I put it on or all in the car or whatever. I listen to it.

And it's like a more critical listening experience for me. Yeah. Like I'm listening to the words. I'm listening to how did they do that? What do they do? So I would say it's a critical listening. And you might be listening to something that like you're a cat, like the category or the genre is a little bit more what you do.

Right. Like I listen to what are they doing? Dude. Yeah. I listen to architects when I work out. And I just listen to them or I listen to bad omens when I drive. Right. And I listen to the records and I listen to the songs, but with the soul music, with Motown,

with Sam Cook, Otis Redding, Stevie Wonder. It's hard to explain. Like I don't, yeah, Marvin Gay, Lionel Richie. I don't listen to that music with any critical. It's more like a soothing. It's almost like a comfort. Yeah. You know, it's like a part of like.

Like a blanket almost. You just feel secure like when it's on. It's less listening, more feeling. Like it is exactly what you said. It's like, putting a blanket on when you're cold. It's like when you're on your couch, it's cold. Your wife is like, honey, will you get me that blanket? It's something like that. It's like, I put it on maybe when I don't, and I've never thought about this. This is the first time

I've ever talked about it. It's like, you don't even know when you turn it on. You just know, like, very often, I must feel that the house needs something. Yeah. And I turn it on and it's the same playlist with the same 30 artists, same 50 songs. It just goes on a loop. And it's like a blanket. That era too. Yeah. And that era also like I think about Henry Rollins talking about Billy Holliday. There's a really cool interview with him about jazz and soul where Henry Rollins says, when I put on Billy Holiday, I feel like she's just singing to me. Yeah. And there's this kind of dynamic in that that I think like jazz. And then if, you know, modern day and God rest their soul, like the more current of this like again, somebody that used their voice of an instrument and

unfortunately we lost her way too soon was amy winehouse oh yeah like for the short time she was here it's astonishing you know how transformative that voice was and how it just was so compelling to a lot of people those voices don't come along that they don't they're very rare Chris Cornell same thing you know they when he passed away everybody was like you know no one sings like you anymore which is true yeah that's funny we have very similar backgrounds yeah like this is the first time we've met one another but like again i'm a huge fan So, you know, and I think that I've just always tried to, in what we do and, and I think the era that we came up in and where we are now, I'm always trying to kind of take a step back. And I think that bands, especially we're talking about kind of the bands that, you know, when you're in a certain genre or a certain style, the last couple of years, I've felt like everybody is in so much competition with each other. And I'm like, I'd rather work with you than be competitive. Same with you. Like, the thing is for me is like, I have. actually genuine, I try to genuinely champion other band success when I see it and like let people

know if they don't know who they are like, yo should you check this band out? And, you know, if I have a platform to open up some minds and some ears, I, I want to do that. And people do it for us too, but I do see here recently, like there is becoming a bit more of a camaraderie with that, especially because the touring industry and what have you, everyone is touring. Like it's not, you can't put the genie back in the box. No. Like, you know, it's everybody is out there. And there's like nine billion people on the planet too.

So, I mean, you see a lot more stadium tours. You see a lot more, like, larger festivals and what have you. But at the same time, I think that we should all be working together. And the other side of that, too, is, you know, the band that I'm in, and I'm sure you're the same way, like, you go into a writing session, you know, when you're making a record or what have you. I don't think any of us walk in there and write the songs because we won a trophy. I think we're writing it because we have something to say.

And as long as you don't lose that mentality, I think you're going to be good. Because the audience is the boss. Yeah. We've always said that. We got one boss. It's everyone in the audience. And they know if you're not being authentic.

I always say this to bands. I'm on the older side of a rock and roll career, right? I'm not saying I'm old. But this generation, though, man, you're current also. Because this new, like my son, 17 and like for the longest time. And I kept him away from a lot. lot of this. Like I never made it about me from the day he was born. Me too. But his friends in the recent like year or two have been like, yo lyric, my son's name is Lyric. And they're like,

yo, Lyric, your dad's stuff is pretty good, man. Yeah. You know, like he's not admitting it to me. Yeah. You know, but, but the unique thing about that is now he's kind of like branched out where like he's, he wasn't really into music and now he's into system of a down. Now he's into like Pantara and now he's into like, you know, Nirvana. Yeah. Like his generation, it's actually kind of the 90s era stuff that they're really into early 2000s. But the cool thing about the way the music industry is now is you have these younger

generations that, you know, Limbiscuit, for example, remember when Biscuit got all that kind of heat on them because of certain things and it was like oversaturated or however you want to look at it. Fred was, you know, man, maybe because he didn't have a choice, but he just kind of left the scene for a minute. Yeah. You know what I mean? And but now it's like

they're being propelled back up. Same thing with Creed, man. And I know people have a lot of opinions about Creed and what have you. Back in 2010. I fucking love Creed. I do too. Like, but I mean,

going back to 2010 when they tried to do that kind of reunion, it was just a little early, I think. And they just finished, I think it was like 64 shows with last year alone. Dude, they were only 100,000 shy of a million tickets. Like every show they did was like sold out. So there's this interesting Renaissance.

They have great songs. Yeah, definitely. And everybody fucking loves Limp Biscuit because they have great songs. Yeah. And everybody likes you guys. Wes is a monster, man. Wes is a, Fred's a genius. West is a genius. They were ahead of their time. They were- Sam completely underrated bass player. Absolutely. And they're nice guys. And they're a big fucking rock band. And what do you want from a big rock band? Do you want them to be? be everything to everyone? Or do you want them to be themselves? Which means the thing I always tell bands is no one listens to one artist only. Right. Go in their Spotify or their record collection and there's hundreds. Yeah. So just remember that this is a friendly business we're in where we share

and we look after each other's fans. If your fan is at a good Charlotte show, am I doing my communal good by talking shit about your band or that band or that band? No, it doesn't make sense to me because now the band that can't stand the idea than anyone is going to be bigger than them or anyone's going to like anyone else. I think it's just this like defected, like damaged artist that got hurt somewhere. Yeah. And became like some kind of like a broken narcissistic like damaged egomaniac and so I'm not saying

it's okay and I'm also not saying I hate the guy I'm saying like something happened to you where you got fucked up because the truth of the matter is is that everyone

doesn't just eat at one restaurant they don't just listen to one band they don't just read one magazine no everybody does everything so it serves bands to understand that like if we share whatever that means

then it's better for all of us. Absolutely. And bands get pinned against each other by lots of different things. Yeah. I think that it's a really, really hard business to be in, this thing that we call the music business. I often will tell people, like there's a younger generation that will ask my opinions at times about this, because I've been in the industry for going on 25 years. And what I try to explain to him is this, listen, it has to be the music first and the songs and the message. But the reality is that it's called the music business for a reason. Business is in the title. It's a job. As soon as you understand that you're only as good as your last trick and are you

making the label money. Like that's part of it. And then, you know, to serve it differently now because there's a lot more artists, there's a lot more style. There's a lot more bands. But I also see the younger generation too, like Sabrina Carpenter and Chapel Rohner, everyone like best new artists. Like they've been grinding at it for 10 years. Yeah, they're actually not new. They're not necessarily new. They're young, but they're not necessarily new. Benson Boone, Teddy Swims. Like, you know, there's a very broad way of looking at things. And I think, though, in present day, that what I'll often tell, and I have to kind of remind, you know, people like me and you, too, like myself, I have to remind it. It's like, I tell my son, I'm like, listen, that device,

make sure you're in control of the device. The device doesn't need to be in control of you. Yeah. So you have to, because you can use it as a tool. for really good things or you can it could be just a you know a messenger of chaos yeah it's the black hole yeah and so when you have a platform or you have a sounding board or you have you know quote unquote the audience is listening do you want to build confidence and show camaraderie or are you just trying to pick at someone yeah and what's actually going on with you that you would want to kind of you know stab at somebody so obviously we're all artists and You know, the cool thing is, is that it's funny, man, my son, when he was in elementary school, like, career day, all the kids kind of were talking about what their parents did and what have you. I wasn't there, unfortunately, because I was on tour. Yeah.

But, like, he's real. Yeah. And this was video, though. Yeah. And he got up and they were like, well, what does your dad do? And he's like, he makes stuff up for a living. Yeah. And I was like, this is the greatest thing I've ever seen. Because, like, you know, it's like, you take it something out of nothing. We call it staring down the beast. You know, so staring down the beast is like a journal that you just bought at Walgreens or whatever, just, you know, and it's empty. Yeah. Because you got to fill it up. Same thing with a session or whatever. Right in a song. Comes from nowhere. Comes from nowhere.

But it's also utilizing you that energy around you. You're being utilized as a vessel because there's something that you're writing down and then you're recording it. And it can mean a certain thing for you. But to the public, it can mean so many different things. And so, you know, we're all really stressed, I think sometimes because we really, really want people to dig what we do. We want the people that are working with us to be proud of what we're doing. So there's always a constant level of like keeping your mental health in check. Yeah, this is a good opportunity, though, for me, because I want to talk about what you've done.

So to make a living touring is very hard. Yeah. You have to do. You have to make a decision. If there's so many shows or so many tickets. Yeah. at one or the other. So to do that, to have the number ones you guys have,

to still be a band, still be releasing music, still fucking achieving radio success, tour success, band success. You could like say which one's more important. Me and you would probably argue fans. If the fans are happy and they're still coming around and they still like what we're doing and they're still... Is it growing still?

Is it growing? Do we feel the energy? Like, do I still want to go on stage? Yeah. But to have a... achieved all that at a young age, right? Why would I care about what anyone thinks? I care more now than ever.

That's interesting. What everybody thinks. Well, why? Because I want to believe that we bring value to people's lives because they bring value to our lives because they're allowing us to be ourselves. Because you care. Because they care. Yeah.

And, you know, look, the thing is, I have to say this. Like, I have had and still have. some extraordinary teachers along the way. I've been very, very fortunate, too. We've been with the same management company for over 20 years, Indigood Entertainment. Yeah. Allison Shepard, who's our manager along with Bill McAathy, she's right over there. Yeah. Bill McGrathy, who's a legend. Love Bill. You know, in the industry. You know, and Atlantic Records, that what a lot of people don't realize about us is that we've been with the same record label. And I was signed to Atlantic and drop by Atlantic and then re-sign,

and it took me on a three-year journey to create and find what would become Shinedown. So I'm the example of artist development. Working on our eighth studio record right now, you have to keep your eyes and your ears open at all times because it evolves and it changes. And there's a lot of people, you know, with the music industry, it's changed drastically in the last decade, more so than not.

But one of the things early on for us that really helped us was the fact that we had some amazing teachers talked to us about the importance in North America of radio. Yeah. And in streaming and the way that people consume music now, there's a lot of vast majority that can get it from different places. But I think that's something that's important for anybody that would be watching this or listening to it that wants to be a songwriter or be a musician or be a performer in North America. And granted, it's a big world, you know, but in the U.S., we just made a decision that we were going to do everything for radio, that we were never going to say no, and that we were going to position ourselves with understanding that there's 50 states. Inside those 50 states, there are multiple cities, and they all have kind of a fundamental thing that's their city. It's their culture. It's who they are. And in America, man, you can have all of these different formats. We're a rare, band because we're looked at as a rock band, but we cross genres because we're played on rock radio, alternative radio, mainstream rock radio, top 40, hot AC, AC, AAA. And so there's a lot of ground you can cover in these cities. And radio was very, very important. And the streaming aspect of

things, I think, is part of culture now. And it can obviously get your music out there. But what is it? 140,000 songs, you know, uploaded a day or something. It's noisy. It's really, really noisy. I think it's a million. Probably at this point. Yeah. But the fundamental thing also, too, for us was we also started out and, man, we just toured with any tour we could get.

Right. You know, anywhere we could play. Same. Even if it was for, like, you're only going to get 15 minutes. I'll take it. Yeah, we were the same. Like, you just, you have to understand that there's a work ethic involved in it. And I mean, look, I mean, also, I think the biggest thing, like how I look at things now, too, is I really want to look at what is the future for Shinedown internationally.

Like, there's always some other thing to get to because it's a big world. But, you know, the number ones and those charts, that means a great, great deal to us because there were a lot of program directors and a lot of people behind the scenes where when we started out, man, there were people that were in journalism and in the record. industry. And I'm just being honest about it. They were like, this band will be lucky to sell five records. Yeah, yeah. You know, and they just did not like us. Yeah. That's not a good feeling. But radio did. Yeah. And like all of a sudden it was just like, well, these outlets don't like us and this is kind of the mainstream and this is kind of the, you know, these gatekeepers are, you're either getting in here or you're not. Well, they wouldn't let us in. Right. But radio did. And then we just decided to like pound the pavement. And that's the thing I, I, I,

I'm glad you said it because a lot of people listening don't actually understand what it takes to have successor radio, the work that goes into. Where likely you had to self-start a lot of the radio because when someone says it's not working and you're like, well, what can I do? I'm like, well, you can go see them. And you're like, okay, I'll fucking drive. I remember when we had a song, we had put our fourth record out. Promotion tour, man. Here we go. We always did that.

but we had a song that we put out and it was at a time when radio was like you either do rock or you do pop and we were a band that did pop and rock so we would have a rock song and then we had a song that go straight to pop and it was a very controversial at the time now no one cares like playlisting

but like at the time so we had a song that we came on our fourth record The River with Avenge Sevenfold by the way those guys always say really nice things about you guys they love you guys Those guys took us out on their tour when, man, there's not enough time that we have today to just talk about how great they are. How wonderful. Those guys are wonderful people.

They're the realest. Anybody that's listening. And the most ridiculously awesome fan base on the planet. Like just mad numbers. Sick man, too. Like musician-wise, all the way to just as people. And not afraid to take chances. No, not at all.

And don't give a fuck. They just do what they want. If you're listening and you like events sevenfold, Matt was on the show, but they are the real deal. When you meet like people where you're like, God damn, those are good guys. It's always when I meet bands, even sitting here talking to you, and why I do this show is I meet artists and I go, yes, another fucking real person who's just trying their best and yes, have achieved. But there's something about staying on the ground and trying to keep doing. something that feels like it matters. Yeah.

Instead of walking around, like, maybe like, I just know I matter and nothing else matters that. I don't know how to articulate it, but. I wouldn't even be able to know how to digest that mentality. Right. I'm always trying to out do what I've already done. Yeah. It's always like day one.

It's always like I'm back at work, like my pizza shop job. Here's the thing, man, when you have something that you care about, when you have something that you think is important. I'll give an example. Like, we had a song on our last record, and it was. the fourth single off of the record. And I remember going into Atlantic and talking to the Powers at B

about the fact that I said, listen, you got to do me a favor. I'm going to take this song called Dead Don't Die, and I'm going to give it to rock radio and make sure that the bases are covered here. But you've got to let me take this song a symptom of being human, and I want to work it at hot AC.

And then there was a big question mark of like, well, why would you want to do that? How are we going to do that? You know, and I'm like, you just got to understand. Why would you want to take that song to Hot AC first? And I'm like, because it's the hardest chart to get momentum on. And if I can get momentum there, then I might be able to get momentum at alternative. And if I can get momentum on alternative, I may be able to see if it has a shot on active or the mainstream.

And if it has a shot there, I might be able to even get a conversation started to take it to top 40. I had a vision for this song two years before it began its journey. The life of that song, we started at Hot AC, it broke the top 15, then we took it to alternative, it broke the top 10. I was told that it would never go on active. It just wasn't going to work on that chart. It spent four weeks at number one, and we took it all the way to number 18 on top 40, and we worked the hell out of it, and we went into these stations, and we met new people.

And at the same time, the rock community, and a lot of these guys and girls know who they are, I spoke with them about what we were doing. I told them ahead of time. I said, you've got to understand something. I have to be able to grow the audience. I can't just put it in one lane. I think there's other people on the planet

that will like our music. They're just not aware of us. So please respect us in the dynamic, too, of yes, now you may have other stations in your city because they're different formats playing this song, but I want you to play it too. That's going to make people know what your station is about. And you can work with this program director

and this program director, and you can start to actually work together. And that's what it's more about, like in that radio world. And again, too, this is a very, for whatever reason, this is a controversial kind of way of looking at things because of streaming. It's like, well, radio doesn't really have, you know, the pool that it once did.

Yes, it does. That's somebody that doesn't know what they're talking about. Yeah. Like, because they're not going into these cities and grinding it out. Yeah. Like, I give you an example. When you look at the arenas in North America, and I know you've probably played a lot of them.

Yeah. You played, you know, arenas in Australia and South America. Like, it's a big planet, you know, big world. Yep. But, like, we'll just, for the sake, Canada, the whole nine. For the sake of just talking about everything in the U.S., like the building that's in Iowa, like Des Moines, Iowa, and then Madison Square Garden. Okay. Yes, Madison Square Garden is a bigger market.

More people. It's sexy. It's like Madison Square Gardens. When you sell that out, it feels more like an accomplishment. But actually, you would argue. But the thing about the Des Moines and the building in Iowa, it's the same capacity. And it's harder to fill. It's harder to fill.

So like you got 18,000 of Madison. Madison Square Garden, but can you fill 18,000 in Des Moines, Iowa? Because the buildings are both the same size. Yes, and the accomplishment is Iowa. Listen, New York, when you do a sold-out show in New York, it's fucking insane. It's harder to get that ticket. The crowd is crazy. But it's a area with 20 million people, right?

So I'm not saying it's not hard to sell out Madison and Garden. It's a huge accomplishment. Yeah. But when you sell out Iowa, or when you sell out Indiana. Little Rock, you know. Because the buildings are the same size. The Kia Forum, same size in Peoria. That's actually like a good Charlotte as like a band.

I mean, we love every fucking sold out show is fun. But when you sell out a place that's typically like harder to sell out, Omaha, Nebraska, or, you know, these markets where you, we always took pride in the markets that loved us. Because we did really well in the Midwest. We did really well in the South. We did really well around in like B and C markets. Yeah. We did well in New York.

But we'll play New York anytime. Mm-hmm. We'll play New York anytime. Yeah. But when you get to a place where you're selling out an arena in the middle of the country where number one, people don't have the expendable income as much as, you know, they could just, there's a lot of factors. A hundred thousand factors.

Just population, everything. It means so much. It means something. I can't explain it. It's the same when you go. to South America. Yeah. And or when you go to like Hungary or you go to these countries where you're like,

holy shit, 30,000 people came. Yeah. And you're like. And you're like, that's for us. And they speak a different language. And they know every word to every song. Yeah. So we always found that they're further away from where we were from, the more excited we got.

That's probably why we toured so much out of the U.S. We love the U.S. I mean, we love America. but we always found like there were so many options here there were so many tours so like we would tour the rest of the world and like it was like this exciting adventure always so we spent a lot of time tour in the world but to the radio thing and i think in general what i was thinking about when i asked you why do you care it's to say that anyone that is doing anything they care about there's going to be pain. Because you care so much about what you're doing. And if you don't, you should stop. Like, that's where I'm at

my life. I'm not doing it if I don't fucking care. So, I'm not doing it if I don't fucking care. So yeah, and like my music, my babyo and has to be able to continue my rhythm. For that Potion 9, of Sebastian Professional, has all what my cabo needs.

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on Shopify. At work, a lot of times the stop doesn't mean you're stopping forever, but you got reset.

You got to reset and figure out like, what do I care about? Because I want to be honest. I want to like, want people to feel that I'm doing something

that I care about so that they can enjoy it. In my mind, they're not going to enjoy a meal that you don't cook like with love. You just throw it on a plate and toss it at them. You know what I mean?

So when I hear you talk about your whole career, including radio, including the latest record, including everything you're doing. I mean, we just released two brand new songs like 14 days ago. So like the cycle starts. But it's the first time everybody's used to us announcing an album. We put two songs out and announced a tour. And everyone's like, where's the album? What are they doing?

What are they doing different? And I'm like, exactly, we're going to do something different. looking at the bigger picture, it can't always be when it's convenient for you. At the same time, it's having enough knowledge and wisdom to know when to stop and reset, which is what you've been doing. Exactly. You're actually being pretty smart about it all. And family does that for you. Yeah. They reset you and you're in a real life with someone who it's focused on them. So it ain't about my day, what I'm doing. Right. And then when I do have to go away or work or something, works together and we pitch in and like it's a functional group but like and they're cheering you on yeah

and they and and and i think a lot like your son my son my kids are just kind of discovering what my past was and like what the band even is yeah and they think it's cool but but your dad yeah you know they keep you grounded they'll humble you your kids will totally humble you straight up they will humble you in every way um but i think that is to be healthy right so you you've obviously, whatever you went through in the past with drugs and alcohol, that's not the guy I'm sitting in front of. No. This is amazing.

That's success. Yeah, I think so. It's a day. That's a daily thing. Day, day, yeah, one day at a time, always with everything that's, like, hard for us. But the one thing that helped me out with that, like, because I don't really talk about my sobriety a lot, you know, but I said a really, you know, good friend of mine once tell me, and it just kind of hit me pretty hard.

It made sense to me. It was like, listen, if you want me to be real with you, this other dude in you is trying to kill you. He doesn't want to have a good time with you. He's trying to end you. And if you will figure out a way to control him, it was weird. It was like a light bulb moment for me.

And maybe I needed the statement had to be as edgy as it was. I don't even think they realized how they said it to me, but it did like it opened up another part of my brain that I didn't know existed. And they said, you're way more dangerous when you're sober. Yeah. When you're clear-headed and focused, that's when you're the most dangerous. Absolutely. I tell artists when I talk to them about drugs, especially because we're around it.

We work with bands. There's drugs. It's just weirdly the... Yeah, it's in the DNA. It's just what all of us have had to come to terms with, in some way, shape, or form some kind of addiction, some kind of addiction of some kind, right? And most of the time it's drugs, but it can be lots of things. When I talk to someone, I have no judgment.

But I'm like, listen, on the other side of... of your addiction. No one's going to want to fuck with you or hang out with you. So however long it takes you to get to be that guy, I don't know. Maybe if you're lucky 10 years, 15 years, 20 years. Do you ever watch, I can't remember the guy's name, the soft white underbelly? Oh yeah, those interviews. Basically just goes down to skid row and has like all the like real people. Dive into it, man, because like if you want to know what it's like, that guy will show you on that. It's not pretty.

It's gnarly and it and it's not like I'm sitting here criticizing those people. That is the result of a life of addiction. Yeah. And that they couldn't get away from. Yeah. And when I tell artists that are at the top of their game that are struggling with addiction, that it's like I just want them to get it. Like I saw people die.

So many people. Me too. Over the last 25 years. This generation too, I've said it to a, you know, A couple of people also, you know, and not to make light out of light about it, it's not funny, but like in the modern day era, anything that's a drug that's in a white powder form, now you have to test it to see what the hell it is. If you've got to test the drugs that you just bought, maybe stop doing drugs.

Maybe don't do drugs. You know what I mean? Because you think that you bought cocaine and it's fentanyl and like, and oh well, you're dead. Yeah. Like just, it's probably not a good idea. Yeah. I got stop while you're ahead. It's terrible.

Yeah. So, but that's just the reality. I don't have any judgment. I just don't think it makes sense to do drugs. And I just, I've seen too many people lose number one their life, number two, everything they work for. And number three, everyone that loves them. So it's just for me, anyone that I see sitting in like where you're sitting today where you're like, I'm like, oh, you had a problem? God damn, good job.

because you do not come across like you've got like you've had to you know slay that i also had to like learn like the other thing too is like back in the day from like 2010 to 2011 i went on a fitness journey that i've been on ever since then but i lost 70 pounds oh wow i had to learn how to like exercise eat right like fitness just overall physically and mentally completely transformed the way i look at the world yeah like so i encourage people that, you know, if you're depressed or things are rough or you're in a bad mood, go work out. Physical first. Go work out. I'm learning that. I'm on a 60-day challenge right now. What are you doing? Work out every day and meal delivery, so I'm only eating what is on my...

Once you cut out, I'll tell you right now, man. If you can cut out, you know, you don't have to eliminate it all, man, but lower that sodium, lower that sugar. Try to eat as farmed a table as possible. You know, get 30 minutes of cardio. Make sure you stretch every single day. I use a flow state of mind, which a flow state of mind is like, don't kill yourself six days a week and then rest on Sunday. Like, you don't have to work out for two hours every day, but do something physical for at least 30 minutes a day. And, you know, remember that Rome wasn't built in a day. If you're starting a fitness journey, like, don't think that you're going to start working out on Monday and by Sunday, you're going to do a Spartan race.

A hundred percent. You got to like just ease into it. Yeah, because you want to make it a part of your life. And build your capacity. So if you can, you're going to do it. You're going to, you can do five minutes today. Yeah. And you can only do five minutes every day and then it turns into 10 minutes and then it turns into 15 minutes. So I'm on the other side of like two years. Okay. Of like three. It started two days a week. Last year it bumped up three to four, three or four days a week working out with no diet. Then I threw in some diet changes. Now I'm at a place where I'm, uh, I'm now going, I, I feel ready because I want more. So I was like, I'm going to do a 60 day challenge. I'm going to work out five days a week. So Monday, Tuesday, Thursday,

Friday, Saturday. So I get Wednesdays and Sundays off. I, I, I organize that way. Um, and I'm going to stick to a very tailored eating. You work it with a nutritionist or anyone? A nutritionist, yeah. Have they talked to you about supplementation? Uh, yeah. Okay. There's some supplements and some stuff like that. I'll tell you right now, man, a multi, there's four, the ones that I've learned. Yeah, tell me. Yeah. Get a really, really great multivitamin. At least, you know, you do your research on NAD, but it's a really, really, it's a cell regenerator. Yep. Just do your homework on that. You do glutathione. Yeah, yeah. I mean, and you can, you can kind of build those out, you know, cell regeneration and you have to be kind of specific on these things. But, you know, as you age,

especially when you hit 40, 45, everything just starts to change. But a great multivitamin, N-A-D, really vitamin D3, and reversible at all. Those are like, now that's a palette. Reversetol is like basically it's an antioxidant formulation of basically coming from grapes. Okay. And so if you do your studies on it, it's good for your skin, your hair. Again, it's kind of a longevity type of supplementation. What people don't understand now and like when they hear all the supplementation,

because you see AG1 and all these, like Instagram is like an infomercial for like all these health things and what have you. There's a couple of basic things and I kind of take a pallet of supplements. Do you do AG1? I don't. I do green vibrance is the one that I use as for like my superfood greens. It's just got the same. It's just got more, it's just got a little bit more clinical research behind it and like human trials and things where they weren't using animals and things like that because the DNA is different. Right. You know, but the dynamic of why the supplementation, and granted, here's the other thing, peptide therapy, injectable, that's something you have to kind of look at, but that's another thing. TRT is a question mark for a lot of people with testosterone therapy because it could be good,

it can be bad. But the fact of the matter is, is, you know, now when you look at the nutrient density of the food, especially in North America, in the soil, we just don't have nutrient-dense food anymore growing. So like this supplementation, and why you see this, rise, it's because like we're not getting as much as we actually need. Right. So there'll be supplement, because sometimes people look at me and be like, man, Brent, you spend a lot of money on this stuff and like, is it all like getting into your bloodstream?

You have to research that. Some stuff you need injectable things. Some stuff like your stomach acids are going to kind of process it and then it's going through kidneys and then liver and all these different types of things. So you've got to look and see what works. Another thing, too, is getting a good detox every month for like, you know, there's some really, really good supplements. and some good companies that make things

to help you like to water fast and things like that. It's an overload. I know I kind of sound like there's a lot going on here, but it was something that I had to learn because- So you do a water fast every month? I try to do at least a three-day water fast every month. Okay. It's hard.

I've heard it's good though. It's really hard. Well, what it does is it gets rid of what's called your zombie cells. Right. So, you know, and again, too, man, the lifeblood of people is water. Like if you wanna drink a Diet Coke or something like, that go for it if you want i tell people this too i'm like dude if you want a cheeseburger eat a cheeseburger

just don't eat it every day right if you want you know a cookie or something like i have the cookie just don't eat it every day everything is in moderation but i promise you like once i started to learn how to eat right and like you know getting an executive physical when you can every year or just getting your blood panel every year what people don't practice in this country and i think certain people are doing better about it is they don't practice preventative medicine yeah Yeah, yeah. Which is like, instead of getting on these medications, go to a doctor that you trust or go to a longevity specialist. Yeah, longevity doctor.

Yeah. And let them do, you know, really get really thorough blood work, you know, look at a body scan, check everything about you, you know, make sure you're doing, you know, the screenings that you need to be doing at your age, you know, getting a colonoscopy when you have to, you know, making sure that you're checking your heart. Go get, you know, these things are important. And like if you- It's actually an app now that does the blood work. Yeah, I'm sure.

I think it's called path maybe. Yeah. And I looked into it. I've never heard of that. I think Huberman's into it or something. Andrew Huberman is a, Gary Brecker is a great one too. There's so many good resources of like information things for people to go and find out like

more information on things. But like. Even Brian Johnson, the blood work is everything. Like every guy in his 40s should be having his blood done. at least every year. Absolutely. But this app,

it's like, I think it's like $500 a year or something. And you can go to, um, these like quest locations where they do your blood. And they take like a very extensive blood panel. And then you're in the app and it has your blood. Right.

And you can start looking at like, it helps you find wherever you're at in each marker. Mm-hmm. Finding solutions for like, like real supplements and things for people to like kind of get, like what you're saying, get better. And especially like doing this job and, you know, like if you're touring a lot or, you know, and you don't have to be a musician to tour.

Like there's a lot of people that have to travel for work. And when you're in a different environment, different time zones, different weather, all those types of things. Like the big thing that I've always tried to be an advocate for because it's worked for me is that preventative medicine should be practiced much more. But the individual has that power to do that. Yeah. And it's just you got to like know where your starting line is. Yeah. That's probably why you can still tour, bro.

You mentioned jelly roll. You guys just played with him. Yeah, the Rose Bowl. Once again, my man is making sure everybody is taking care of. He is the greatest. He is one of the most fascinating, wonderful people. He is a gift to this planet. Yeah, he is.

I fucking love him, man. I don't know him at all. He's amazing. My brother met him. But I always talk about how much I love jelly roll because I like what I see. Old friend of mine, Jack, his guitar. player old friend of mine. He was in sleeping with sirens and like we've known each other a long time. So I know the people he's around. Yeah. And I just know like how he rolls. So I already know I like

him. And I've obviously only heard good things, but we've never hung out. But I fucking am such a huge fan. Because I just like how he is in the world. Yeah. I mean, I think that one of the, he has a lot of different superpowers. Right. That he's been training for this moment, you know, for the world to know, you know, who Jason D. Ford is. Yeah. You know.

And he's just one of the most remarkable people I know. But it's all real. It's all authentic. There are some people that kind of feel like this happened overnight. And I'm like, no, it didn't, man. Yeah, no, I can tell. This is a long. He's been on a long road.

Long road, man. and he's ready for it. Yeah. You know what I mean? But his success could not be happening to a more, I can say this about him, to a more deserving individual. That's nice.

Dude, he is, he is one of the, he is, you know what he is, man? He is necessary. Yeah. That he's just,

he's great. Yeah. He is necessary. To me, like, it's funny because he's such a, he's just like, this rock and roll guy who lived,

who has, I know he's told some of his stories, but there's so many more, I'm sure, like the depth of that guy and what he's lived through. And his relationship with his wife, his kids and all of it, and how he, you know, has gone into, you know, really trying to reform the, you know, the way that people that are incarcerated

or looked at, you know, and getting a second chance, you know, because he has a past, you know, and what have you. But, like, there's a broader reach and he's doing it all through music. And, you know, he's... How did you guys meet?

We met at Blue Ridge, at the Blue Ridge Festival back in 2021. And I knew of him because I was probably one of the first people, like in that first 50,000 views of the song Save Me. Yeah. I just watched this guy, you know, open his mouth and this voice came. I was like, what in the world? And was really compelled by that. And so he was playing, same day we were in 2021 on Blue Ridge Festival.

He played in the afternoon, and then I met him. I said, come up and do, we do a version of Leonard Skinner and Simple Man. And I was like, come up and do Simple Man with us. And he was like, really? I'm like, yeah. So, you know, he, so we got everything locked in and what have you. And, man, he came on stage and there was just this thing about him. Yeah, he's got charisma.

Yeah. And like, as soon as we did that as we followed into 2022, I went to. to my team and the label and our bookend agents and whatever. We knew that we were going to be doing a tour in amphitheaters that year, late June, July, August, like during the season and what have you. And I basically just said to everybody, I go, we're going to bring, I called, I had Jelly's number. I called him and was like, I'd really like you to be main support for this tour.

And he accepted. And when I told everybody, like, what we were going to do and who were going to do it with, at the time, everybody was kind of, I like, who? And I think some people didn't necessarily understand it, but I saw something in it. And the whole band did, you know, myself, Barry, Eric, and Zach, we could all just see it. Artists see the future. Yeah. And you got the intuition. Yeah, but it was a thing where it was like, we better ask him to do this now because we're going to be able to ask him in a minute. And so I just saw him climb into that rocket ship. Yeah. You know, and rest is history. And he came out.

We had the most fun on that tour. And he would sing Simple Man with me and Zach every night on stage. We'd have like our little, you know, the guys would do kind of like a little banter of songs and this and that. I'd go off to the side. We'd have like our moments on the side of the stage. We'd talk about things. He'd ask me questions.

I'd ask him questions about things. We'd just stayed in contact. And just watching his rise has been an absolute pleasure because I was always just, you know, I was a fan of who he was. but of the two decades plus that I've been in this industry, I can only really tell you that he was the first where I was like kind of saw it early on, like, man, this guy is going to change the world for the better.

And couldn't happen to a better guy. Could not happen to a better person. Yeah, that's nice. He's one of a kind. Yeah, he's one of a kind. That's great. I love that. That makes me happy.

And now my next dream is to do an international tour with Good Charlotte. So whenever you want to call and let us rock and roll, man. Let's do Australia. Like, let's go. Let's go. I'm serious. I'll tell the guys like, hey, what are we doing? With bells on, dude. We will, like, let's go. That'd be great. That'd be the best. At least Australia would be great. Because I know we could do it. I know we could go, Celsen marinas out and have a really fun time. And like, the shows are really great. And I think you guys probably do really well in Australia. Well, honestly, man, with that, like, you know, we have this.

that we know of in the in honestly in like a lot of different countries but no doubt Australia specifically like what we're being told is like just come here yeah like we're like we're ready but like we will not have a bad time we would just really want to do it with some people that we want to have some fun with all right plus the universe is real man I popped in here today thank you for having me on thanks for coming yeah this means a lot to me no it means a lot to me too I'm a massive fan like I literally I did pretty good I kept my composure for the most part I'm I'm I'm kind of great. This is like,

by the way, it was very long. I appreciate it. But like, hopefully it wasn't boring. No. It, it,

so for me, it just any time that somebody takes the time to bring their story, but also like your fucking band is important. And what you've done is important. And you have, oh my God,

thank you. You have better things to do than go anywhere and talk to anyone. Unless you care about what you're talking about and they care about what you have to say. And most of the time when you're out in the world trying to connect with your fans

and you're trying to connect with music fans, you have to jump through a lot of weird hoops that don't feel authentic, that don't feel like the person on the other side gives a fuck about what you're saying. Right. And respects what you had to fucking do to get here and then that you're actually here

on your own time to, share your audience as well. Oh my God, when they told me that I had an opportunity to come here and talk to you, I've lost my mind. Man, I was so excited because, but also like the validation that we give each other is important, but more importantly, the validation that your fans give everyone that you decide whatever stage you're on, whatever interview you do, you're bringing your fans and you're validating that as a source for them to do. trust. And where we get lost in like media and content is that there's not a respect for the fan. These platforms that have artists come on and do the interviews, whatever, they act like they're

blessing the artist. That's not true. The artist is blessing them because the artist fan is the number one best fucking customer. We see it. The number one person that you want interacting with anything is a musician or artist, music artists. They're fans. But I'll say this though, too, and to have a very broad peripheral of music with a lot of different styles and what have you, I've always said this. Rock and roll isn't just a genre of music. Rock and roll is a way of life. I love the fact that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, the year that NWA got inducted, there were all these question marks about that. And Ice Cube got up there and was like, man, rock and roll is a spirit.

It's a connection more than anything. And so when I think about it, like the type of music that we do, and there's always a broad approach to it, you know, I've said it before. Like, I don't think there'll ever be anything that takes the place of drums, bass, guitar, badass vocals, and a killer song. And a live fucking hearing it live. Right. But in that world, the audiences, like that rock and roll community is, you talk about inclusive. They're like, anyone from anywhere at any time is welcomed. whenever and everywhere.

Like that whole community is like, come into this and let's celebrate and have a great time. There's not this, because sometimes it happens in media, like there's an idea in rock media where it can be a little cold and very to the, like you're trying to figure out,

just take it down a little bit, okay? Like it's supposed to be, we're supposed to support each other and you can have big criticism and all that. Sure. But the audience, like metal, festivals, rock festivals are some of the most incredible experiences in the world. And when people

that have never gone to them, go to them for the first time, they're like, I'm doing this every weekend now. Like this was the greatest thing ever. Because people come in, they walk in and then they float out. And that is actually like what my experience has been the last, you know, 10, 15 years. And I would say country music is a lot like that too. Yeah. Is it's like a rock and roll show. And you go and you don't feel like, I don't have to think about what I'm wearing. I don't have to think about anything but being there and listening to a band or seeing like I feel welcome. It's a big mixed up crowd of everything. Yeah. You know, you go online and you see these political conversations happening where everyone's so divided. Go to a rock and roll show, go to a country

show and hang out and experience music with other people and realize that it's all kind of bullshit and no one actually cares about anything other than being together. Yeah. And if someone fell down, they'd help them up. If somebody, like people being together is actually what music and especially rock music and rock and roll as a like a greater genre of all the genre. You could divide it up a bunch of different ways. But the live music or rock music, like go to those festivals, go to those concerts and

you'll see how you're treated. And it's the happiest place. and it does feel like you can be yourself. It's better than Disneyland. Absolutely. And it does feel like it's all about like the people who go to those shows. And someone is going to a shine down show or an Avenge Sevenfold show or a Good Charlotte show or a Bad Omen show or a falling in reverse show.

And they're going to. Or Jelly Roll show. Jelly Roll. They're likely going to a bunch of the same festivals and shows and we're likely all these circles all cross each other. somewhere. And so I do think that bands and the culture, like, and I do think, like you said earlier, it's going there to be friendly, to be supportive, to be cool with each other. Encouraging. Like really, really genuinely be happy for someone's success. And I think it's happening.

Like I thought the thing, did you see the thing at the Grammys where they thought that Courtney was poppy? Dude, I know her very well. And like, when she did that, that just elevated her to another level. But it was good for everyone. Yeah. Like, Poppy loves her. Yeah. They all, everyone has respect for each other.

Yeah. So there wasn't any contention. Yeah. It was just a funny moment. It was like an inside joke for metal fans and rock fans that, like, knew that the interviewer just didn't know a lot about rock music and heavy music. And the interviewer made a mistake. Yeah.

And she didn't like, she wasn't mean. She wasn't mean. She was like, she was like, she was like, Lovely. She like just rolled with it. She was lovely. Yeah. And like it was she's a beast by the way. She's a beast and it just shows you where rock music is today. Like it does feel like there is a bit of a community happening. I didn't feel an ounce of competitiveness in that moment from anyone. Yeah. It felt like everyone just was smiling big and laughing because it was just like one of the biggest moments at the Grammys actually was that. And so I thought that was like a real tell of like where the culture is now. It's interesting that you bring up the Grammys because I watched it all this year. And, you know, there was one thing that I thought to myself. And I've met Harvey, you know, the president of the Grammys a couple of times. We did quite a few things last year for the Grammys. One thing at the Grammy Museum, me and Zach, we did Stairway to Heaven for a celebration for Atlantic Records. And then the Grammys hosted me and Zach to kind of do a behind the song type of event with us and what have you. But I noticed it this year or two. And it's something that, I thought more and more about over the last couple of years. Like, you know, I woke up and looked at the news media the next day that, you know, was not just rock publication making a comment about like once again the Grammys don't show

or televise the hard rock, rock category, or the heavy metal. And it's funny because I started to think about that. And I'm like, you know, and Harvey right before the weekend played, you know, the weekend didn't play before because of the diversity and the lack thereof. And I understand why he was doing that. And he's an artist and he has a platform to, you know, broaden that conversation. Sure.

And then he played the Grammys. Yeah. But I'm like, you know, I think that the committee should also really, really look at, you know, and I've just got to say it, like, don't alienate a community of people and listeners. That is massive. Yeah, yeah. Rock music. Like, I can't remember the last time there was like a rock and roll performance.

at the Grammys. And I think it's time. I think it's time that the Grammys take an initiative to let rock and roll present itself again because, you know, they look at ratings and they look at how many people watched and how many people are tuning in. It's like you would have so many more people watching the Grammys as well with all of these different categories. Now, you've only got so much time to televise everything. But man, again, rock and roll, it ain't just a genre, man. That's a way of life. Yeah. And I really hope that, you know, in the future that they, they start to broadcast, you know, a bit more rock and let, let artists come in there that, you know, can throw down. I agree. Yeah, I totally agree. Like, I don't know why there's not an active rock Grammy. I don't know why there's not

a couple, I think there could be like five more rock categories. Yeah. Because there's so many genres and subgenres in rock. Like, I mean, even Sierra Farrell, you know, who was, like, she's just wild and interesting and unique between the country and the bluegrass and everything else. Like, I didn't even realize she was up for nominations. I got up, looked at, she's holding four Grammys. But none of it was televised. And I was like, that's freaking nuts. But I know they've only got so much time and everybody looks at it on their phone but yeah i just think about you know really looking at the broad scope like rock and roll is just really really important there's a lot of ways to view it and there's a lot of ways to be introduced to it a bunch of people that are listening to this not only

want to hear what we both think about this and that but also like your tour okay tell me about the tour so yeah the tour is two legs and it's called the dance get dance tour the first leg is we're bringing our friends in Bear Tooth out with us. And then who another artist who I just think from a female side is, I just think she's on another level. Her name's Morgan Wade. And she's just outlaw country. But like in the truest sense, she's just a brilliant songwriter.

And then the second leg of the tour, it's wild, man. Like we're playing Madison Square Garden in the second leg for the first time ever as a headliner playing the Kia Forum. You know, first time as a headliner. Congrats. That's a thank you. We're bringing our friends Gavin and Bush are coming out with us. And they've got, the cool thing about that is like they're celebrating the 30 years of 16 stones and like the 20 years of Razor Blade suitcase. They got a brand new record coming out too with the same kind of time frame. And then Morgan Wade is going to do the second half of that with us too. But it's, you know, we're definitely pushing the envelope on the production on this. And how we're doing, you know, how we're going to do. We're just really, really stoked about it. Don't have a kind of exclusive just yet on like when the album's going to come out.

But if I was a betting man, I would say August. Okay. I would, you heard it here first. So I don't have a date per se, but I'm hoping August. We have two brand new songs out right now that are working in multiple formats. One song called 365. The other track is called Dance Kid Dance. Yeah.

No, but that's the only thing that we have a couple of festivals that we're doing to this year. but we're kind of like being strategic about certain things and how we kind of want to do what we want to do again the international is a big deal for us looking into next year and how we want to kind of curate that but yeah there's a lot going on we just want it to be about it's not about the quantity it's about the quality i feel that that's how i feel yeah these days and then also too I'm going to wish upon a star every single night that Good Charlotte will take us out on tour with them to Australia. I'm going to ask me.

It's not a bad idea. I may know somebody now that I didn't know before to ask about that. It's a really good idea. I'm just going to hope upon hope. We're going to find out as soon as this airs if it's a good idea because promoters will fucking call. Yeah. Because I'm excited about the prospect.

Fans will be like, come to, Argentina and I'm like, tell the promoter to send us an offer. We're going after all that. Like, we're trying to figure it out right now, like how to really. Because again, man, it's, you got to look at, yeah, there's a financial aspect to it. But then again, sometimes it's like, just go. Just go. You just got to go, man.

And I think that carries into like our shows. Like, I just want people to come and feel important and feel like we put every dollar that we could into that show. So, Brent, thanks for coming, man. It's my absolute pleasure, bro. awesome bro i appreciate it thank you for listening to artist friendly we really appreciate it if you like the show you can also follow us on spotify you can follow us on instagram at artist dot friendly and you can watch us on youtube and veeps leave comments i always read them see you next time