Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - Cameron Diaz

Episode Date: December 11, 2024

On this week's episode of Artist Friendly, Joel Madden is joined by Cameron Diaz. Artist Friendly is reaching another huge milestone, celebrating 100 episodes with actor and entrepreneur Cameron Diaz. After becoming a major star, Diaz stepped away from Hollywood in 2014 to “reclaim [her] own life” — which included exploring her passions and spending time with family. Now, a decade later, she will return to the big screen for the aptly titled Back in Action with Jamie Foxx, which premieres on Netflix in January 2025. She also launched the organic wine brand Avaline with Katherine Power in 2020.  ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify.⁠⁠⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up? I'm Joel Madden, and this is artist-friendly, and this week is our 100th episode. I couldn't think of a better way to celebrate it than to talk with a very special guest. She's an actress, she's an entrepreneur, and she's my sister-in-law. Cameron Diaz, let's go. I'm not smoking on gas. I'm smoking out if that's my kind. I don't want no bad times. I don't want to have bad.

I thought just like, what's wrong? I'm like, what, what's the matter? He's like, are you okay? And I'm like, yeah. He's like, you look mad. I'm like, it's my face. Yeah. Well, every.

It's just my face. Well, to be fair. Every husband, every husband, ask their wife, are you mad at me? Are you mad at me? And I'm literally like, no, I'm literally just planning out two children's meals while, how are you going to get up here? That's what I told him. All this shit. And you're in there.

He's like, I feel like. Like every time I say I have to go do this thing, you get upset. I'm like, he's like, you just look at me this way. I was like, let me just let you know. The look that you're seeing is me doing math in my head. It's literally math. I'm just like, okay, that person is there and this and I'm here. Tesla robot.

So that you could go when you say, is it cool if I go? I can say yes or no. Yeah, like you want me to go, yeah, babe. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Of course. Let me just put around and be like in the corner somewhere.

Like it's happening in real time. literally just calculating the gap. Exactly. That you leave when you go do your thing. When you're gone doing that thing. And how I'm going to cover that said gap. Exactly. I get it. That's all.

I do the same thing. I know. Nicole's like, I'm like, are you mad at me? Is it a yes or no? I can't tell. Highly sensitive individuals. It's okay.

Yeah, sensitive to what needs. Intuitive. Yeah. Yes. Pice's. Yes. Also, I think it's a twin. thing too because you guys are so used to like feeding off of each other you got like these little

you know sort of um sensors that you had between the two of you that kind of reads each other there is i think like a deep connection that we are always plugged in and then when we're not together he attaches it to you yeah and he's expecting you to already know how that works yeah and i think it takes like a lifetime yeah that's why i tell me he's like honey I'm not your twin. I'm not Joel. I said, I can't finish your sentence. You can't finish my sentence.

Yeah, no. And don't try. And don't try, bitch. I did not finish. Did I finish speaking? You're like, bitch, I didn't finish saying, it's cute when you do it with Joel. Exactly. But you can't finish my sentence.

No. You don't know what I'm thinking. No. No. Sometimes I watch in slow motion and I'm like, like, what are you doing? You're like, you literally just like to run the car off the road, don't you? And it's like surprising to every time when I'm like, I'm not finished talking.

Did I finish? Am I done? Did I? I was still speaking, right? And he just, I was like, I'm, we don't, you know. It's so funny. It's really funny. It's sweet.

You guys are such a, you guys are such a match. We are. We are a perfect match. And it is like such of fun. funny. It's all the things. It's the whole spectrum. Yeah, it is.

There's like so many different levels of like extremes that are. Extremes. That are you guys. No, it's true. When I think about it, I'm like, if you could describe Cameron as a person, it's not living life in a slow, pace, boring, not interested. La-de-da. No, it's like all the things.

It's fun. It's intense. It's focused. Yeah. You gnaw on the bones. You will eat the chicken all the way down to the bone. I'll take it, strip that bone all right down. And then use the bones in a soup.

Exactly. It's funny. You guys are such a match. Yeah, it's funny. It's the thing that I'm most grateful for in my life is our marriage and our family. Like, period. That's it. It's really, really sweet.

Yeah. And not just sweet. Sweet doesn't cover it, but it's really nice when you see that. in the world. It's hard out there. It's rough. It's rough out there. Yeah, but you and, you and Nicole are, you know, example. You know, you guys are the OGs. You guys are like the, oh, God. You feel like, how have you guys been together for 18 years? I'm like, I don't know. I actually don't know. I really have no idea. We love each other. I guess that's how we want to be together. I guess that's the other reason. But man, it's so funny. It's, but you. But, you.

you guys carved the path. Showed us how it's done. Well, I think that we, for the first half of our marriage, we're surviving together. Like, we found each other in this crazy world. And it was like safety. And then as we started to get momentum and organized and figure, you know, grow up a little bit.

The kids really grow you up. Yeah, they do. And then you can start to like think about your policies and you're like, methods and your all the things like becoming better at doing things but it's 18 years and on thanksgiving it's crazy together 18 but how so benj and i'll be married 10 years yeah this year this january yeah and so we've been together 11 years and you guys so that means you guys yeah i was thinking about the math it was like seven seven years when i first met you guys six years when you first met you guys yeah and then yeah it's so crazy because that was like seven years when i was like seven

That felt like a long time even then. Like I was like, my God, you've guys been married for six years already. Yeah. Like, that's amazing. And we were kind of married from the get. Yeah, you are. We got legally married 14 years ago. Right.

But we were together. Yeah. I think the major reason we got married was because we were already married in our minds. But was like, what do you call her? Call your wife? You don't call her your girlfriend or your baby mama. Baby mom or your fiance. Like, I was just like, she's my wife.

We both thought it. At some point we were like, we have to get married. This isn't anything else. Like, what else is this? My partner, sure, yeah, you're our partner. But like some things marriage only covers it. True. And you don't think it when you're young.

You're like, I don't need to get married. As we thought when we got together, we're like, hey, government and going to tell us what we are. Then you're like, oh, no, legally we need to. And then you're like, legally actually. It was a really good idea. Yes, this is actually a really good idea. government ain't going to tell me what I am.

Don't defy who I am and what I relationship is. They're like, nah, yeah, we should get married. It's funny. It worked out. I'd say it worked out really well for you guys. Yeah, it really did. Well, we just got married because we figured something instinctually told both of us that if we didn't like tie ourselves to one another

and made it really difficult to get away. Like all the legalities that we had to, would have to go through to like end it. Yeah. That we would probably not be together if we didn't like do that. So we just did it right away. And then we just, you know, held on for dear life from there. It's the best thing for me as a brother.

It's the best thing that ever happened to him. Yeah, it is. I mean, I don't say that just because it's me. But you know it. And for me too. It's the best thing that ever happened to me. Like I'm, I mean, I was older than him. So like the fact that I.

I hadn't found him before. You know what I mean? Like I was out there a lot longer than he was. But we've, you know, how much we've grown over the last decade together and how much we've accomplished. You know, it's like we couldn't like, I don't know how we would have done that. Either one of us would have done that without one another. And uniquely to like, you couldn't have done it before each other.

So if you had met 10 years earlier and had the same connection. No, it wouldn't have worked. It would have been the wrong time in your lives. Like, I think that it's like divine timing how like these things work out. Same with me, Nicole. The way we met was really more just like divine intervention or something. And then to look at the last, you know, decade and change of your life and where you're at, here's what I think.

You had this incredible life before when you were kind of solo running through the world, being Cameron, incredible. like amazing highest levels of all experience from success to learning to exploration to all the things that you've done in your life is nothing short of it's been it was pretty cool the greatest version of the greatest version of something right like when you think about if you set your mind out to do something and then go do it well you didn't just do it you took it to the highest limit that you could which is like makes sense to me when I know you so you got to do that and then what that usually costs people is the ability to have.

Definitely. On the other side of the life is, because that's not to say that's not your. There was no balance for that. You know, like the investment that it takes to have what I have now with Benj. It's just as much. The energy I didn't, I didn't put,

that's not where I was putting my energy, right? Like I didn't even know how to do that. I mean, Benj really taught me that, I think. He showed me how, like, He was like, you know, if this is going to work kind of thing, you've got to like, you've got to step up to it. Yeah. I was like used to just being like, I'm a rocket ship.

Get on my tail. Yeah, yeah. Jump on and hold on. Exactly. And then as long as you can hold on, we'll be. If you can hold on. You know. How many more trips around the moon are we going to do?

Exactly. Oh, wait, wait. Trips. Trips. This is like this is. This is how it is. Exactly. Yeah.

And, you know, then. was just sort of like, you know, you got to show up a certain way for this kind of thing, you know. So he really, you know, helped me figure that out. Yeah, you guys balance each other. Yeah, we balance each other. Because you, you also, you guys push each other in different ways. Yeah. It's funny, like, we all have some deficiency, all of us. And hopefully our match, that's not their deficiency. Yeah. And then together we like fill in each other's. It's a puzzle piece that comes together and it makes a complete picture because the complete picture can't just be success. It's also what's what is success to you. Right. Right. I remember like in the very beginning of Benj and I being together. I just said

that to him one day. I was just like, like you have to define your own success. Like you can't look for other people to tell you what your success is and whether or not you're successful. Like you have to define it for yourself. He put that back on me in the same way that was like, how do you define the success and the relative things that we were exploring for ourselves, you know? That's the thing that, you know, we found with each other is that we just get to define our own version of success. Yeah. You know, between the two of us and nobody else matters. It doesn't matter about anything else or any, you know, how any other idea of what success is. We've got it. We've already done it. We've accomplished it and we continue to accomplish it with one another. And you build out

this world that you live in of like your actual everyday family life that is defined by like the life you're building one day at a time. Yeah. I mean, the most dramatic way of looking at it is watching your kids grow and every phase they're in. It's a new phase and it's a new, new level of awareness and a new level of growth. And they're interacting with the world that you're building as you kind of fly it. You're building out this like you constantly decide who you are as a family with each new group of decisions. Right. With the age of your kids, that's usually how it works.

Like, that's the guiding principle of who are we as a family. It's usually organized around the kids as they get older each, each phase, which is super connected. Which is so cool that we get to see that with you and your guys' kids, like your family because we, like, when I met y'all, the kids were so young. Oh, my God, they were babies. They were babies. I think he was still in diaper.

He was like so young. Yeah. And, you know, watching them now, like, where they're at and how much they've, like, how much they've grown, how much they've accomplished and where they're going, what they're doing and, like, how invested you and Nicole have been in every step of the way of getting them there has been, like, so incredible, so beautiful. Like, it brings tears to my eyes because it's just, like, so great. And we feel like we're just holding on. I don't know why I get so dear that way. This is where we get jealous in like the best way. Yeah.

Watching you and Benj see the game a little bit more in slow motion because of where you're at. We're at in life. And what, and you've gotten to watch us on the ride. And who knows what we got right, what we got wrong. Yeah. You just try your best. And then on the other side of it, hopefully we help them sort through their child. That's really sweet that you.

Yeah, no, it's, I don't know why. I'm feeling really nostalgic about that. It's really sweet. Yeah. It makes me feel like sad and happy at the same time too. And those golden years we had of coming to your guys' house and having family dinner. I miss that. That's the hard part of not being down the street from each other.

That's why we're moving. I know. I'm so excited. We can't wait. I can't wait. It's the hardest part of being an hour and a half apart is not being here. You guys. Literally that's it.

I know. So we're so excited to move. because that's literally it's school and Benching Cam and Radian card. I can't wait. And you also, you guys were a part of our, in those formative years of like zero to 12, especially if you didn't have great examples like in either of our families.

Like Nicole's family broken, thank God her in-law, her parents, my in-laws are great. Yeah. But they were a separated family. Like they were, it was, you know, her dad was on tour. Her mom was working through, you know, coming out of that when you get divorced.

I think it takes a decade for someone to like sometimes. Yeah. And I think Nicole was on that from being adopted to being in a family where the parents were divorced to all the rest of it. She didn't have some model of like parents that were connected every day and not her own lived experience. Right. Yeah. And, you know, we didn't. Yeah.

So we were both coming from just a place of like, I just don't want to fuck my kids up and make them feel like I don't care and keep this family together. And that was enough to get us through those first seven, eight, nine years, which are really tough, I think, when you're figuring out how you both do things together. And it takes two people working together to figure that out instead of one just being stuck in their way and the other being stuck in their way. So it's like this back and forth, push and pull. Yeah, but I mean, look, there's in all of that, like, it goes back to like wanting to do it. Yeah. So nobody ever showed. You can't be in a marriage and have a family.

If you don't want it. Everybody's, both people are not 100%. Yeah. Every day. Yeah. Like nobody can be like 99 and the other one be 100. Like even if you're like mad each other, don't want to see each other, like sick of each other, it's still 100% commitment.

to the marriage and to the partnership and getting things in the family. I agree with that. If it's not 100%, it just doesn't work if one person's at a deficit. And then you guys worked really hard at like, you know, look at therapy is a big thing in our family. Big time. We are all like, take me to therapy. I'm like, you talk to your therapist about that.

I don't want to. Honey, I'd really like to talk about this with you on Thursday at 5 p.m. Exactly. Thursday and 5 p.m. Can you, uh, you want to see if he has time beforehand? He's like, no, I don't want to talk about this now. And I'm like, honey, 5 p.m. Thursday. That's our time.

Don't make me do this. That's so true. So therapy is a big thing in all our family. Thank God. It's like what we, we depend on. You know, so you have that like commitment and to work on it. Yeah. You know, to like not just like.

Like, you know, do the same thing over and over again, trying to figure out if it, you know, if doing it again will make it work this time. But going like, why didn't it work? How can I make it work? What's my part? What's the other person's work? Let's, you know, be self-aware and go into the next attempt a little bit more equipped to hopefully come out with a different outcome. Yeah, and either resolve something or create a new understanding or a new process together. Yeah, it's like going in the gym and learning new moves and building on strength,

but then also like learning a new move in martial arts where you can take somebody down. Yeah. Or a dance move together. Yeah, whatever it is. You know, so it depends, right? Yeah, yeah. Sometimes you've got to use a little bit of like a. Trip kick or something.

Yeah, yeah. He comes at you and you're like, that way. Yeah, it's a little bit of like a, like a, you know, a, yeah, like it's a bit of a judo. Yeah, totally. You know, you guys have done really well at it. Yeah. I was thinking about it this morning. I was like, I get to talk to camera today.

The one thing I'll say is you and binge both are like the, and this is separate of each other because when I met you and started getting to know you, a decade and a half ago, however long ago. I thought you were like one of the most fierce in like the best way. Like you're very dependable, reliant and unafraid. And if there's someone that's going to take care of it, Cameron's going to take care of it. She's going to go get it. And so it's a bit of like a warrior, right? And he is too.

Benj is a warrior. The guy, the person in my life that's always been the guy. Yeah. Not afraid of anything. If there was a man in the room that's not afraid of anything in every single way, whether it's physically, like right down to physical, to mentally, to whoever is in the room, like any situation. I've never met a person with no fear in his body around getting it done.

Everything in life. If there was maybe any fear in him at all, it was likely the last final frontier for him was probably his personal relationship with someone that loves him and himself. Yeah. So that's the great frontier from because I've never in my life in the world ever met a guy who's not afraid of anything. Yeah. And that comes from in work or just on the street.

I know. You got great instincts. Yeah. And he's not afraid of anyone. He's not. And then I saw you the same way. And in my life, I'm like, if there was a problem, who would you call? Well, I'd call binge or cam.

And if you were in the room with a bunch of scary people or dangerous, who would you want to be in the room with? Benching Cam. And then if they weren't available, I would call the rock. Convierte your passion in a business with Shopify and bathe records of ventas with the form of pay with a better conversion of the world. Has you heard of being? The best conversion of the world.

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per year on a month in Shopify. dotes bar records. You're right? He might be about handle it.

You know, I just jump on his back and hold on and just like, just run out the door. I'm back here. Like, like there's like a short list

of people that I actually believe physically that like I would be that like safe and not too afraid of stuff but not as I'm afraid as he is. And he's just got great instincts. I always say like if Benj, if I said hey, babe, listen, we're going to have to pack up the entire house right now. And we're going to, we need to carry all of our shit up to the top of that mountain over there. And you're going to have to carry like all of it on your back. And also like every family member is going to have to on your back too and you're going to carry them.

59.3 minutes left. I've just told you in 30 seconds. Now you got 59 minutes and change left. He would figure it out and he would do it. He would just do it. Like he would just put it on his back and he'd get it up the fucking. And he would do it right there. He wouldn't do it and he would just.

He wouldn't. He just gets it. He just like he gets it done. He gets it done. And I've seen him in every different situation growing up together going from where we were from to going through. through the world before we had anything, navigating all different kinds of dangers and people and this and that, all the way to being grown men with kids and wives and great lives.

Yeah. Still the same guy. I know. I'm obsessed with him. I love him so much. He's obsessed with you. I know. I love him.

He's the best guy. He's just the best person. I know. Like he's made it. He's just like, like, he's the best. He's a best dad. He's such an incredible father. Yeah, he's a good dad.

He just shows up. He's a good dad. He's so good. It's the best friend. He's, he's so good. As tough of a guy as he could be, he's a softie. Oh my God. He's like the most sensitive person, I know.

And it's not about, yeah, because for him, it's actually, it's what I would define as, like, true grit. Yeah. And true toughness is that he's not trying to be tough. No. It's a function of his life forced him to be tough. And he's not trying to prove out tough some. guy has no ego around anything other than like he takes care of his family he wants everyone to succeed and be good and in every situation he becomes a bit of a protector.

You know what one of my favorite things about him is is like he will he in within two minutes of talking to someone. Yeah. He will figure out what their their sadness or insecurity is and also their their hopes and dreams are. And he'll just, it's like a. It's like a nuance like he'll just feel it and then he'll just like spend the next 10 minutes if he had 10 minutes or an hour if he had two hours he would just talk to them about how awesome they were and he would wrap up everything like by the end that however they were feeling down about themselves they all of a sudden have all this belief in themselves yeah you know what I mean like he just like lifts people up and he gives them like a healer like a healer and he sees it and he gives them these like visions

of themselves that they can like, then they're like kind of like, wow. Like every time we go somewhere and we take a trip and people don't know him and people spend time with him that they would never. Right. People always come up to me and they look me in the eye and they go, Benji's amazing. Yeah. You're like, oh, you figured it out. I was like, yeah, I know.

I married him. Yeah, what do you think? I married him. That's, yeah. I was like, I was the one that married out. You know, so it's like, you know, and people. are always like highlight it like that was just like one of the highlights of the trip was just getting to he's that guy he's that guy he's he's really that guy he just like people like if you're

lucky enough to stumble into that with him he's not going to go and find you no he's not looking he's just going to hang there and he's going to be there and he's with you and he's like whatever he's a genuine person genuine as fuck yeah there's no like yeah he's like the best guy yeah and obviously you know, like that's how I feel. But I always wonder is, do you guys think you work so well because me and you are so alike? Yes. I think about that. I pretty much just assumed that's why. Do you think about that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Whether we're alike or not, we're on some soul level plane as long as we've known each other. Yes. Of understanding. Totally. It's like a high level. We don't have to say it either. I could look across the room.

And we would not, we could not say a word all night and it could be a nod. Exactly. And we have said, we've talked for an hour in that nod. We know. We know. It's so funny. It's true. We may be different in some ways.

Couple of things. Couple of things. Just nuanced. But those are all just details. That's like jewelry. Yeah, exactly. I think there's a way of being that we're similar. Yeah.

We run on our own time. I agree. That may be sometimes why Bench gets frustrated with me at the same time. I know. That's what I'm saying. Like, that's the... You can't force me to feel a different way. No, you cannot. I'm just an animal. He's going to feel how I feel. Just give me some time to like figure, like, we're okay. And then don't be mad when I come to it on my own and I believe that I did come to it on my own and that you didn't tell me that six months ago. By the way, you didn't, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Like, just relax.

Yeah. I figure, I'm here. Here we are. We've arrived, okay? Are you happy now? Just be grateful if it happened. Yeah. It's funny.

Yeah. I do think something like, you know, he's like, it's just hard. He's a, it's just hard to see something you can't. I'm like, I understand. Believe me. I know how hard it is to see something that you can't. You know what I mean? Yeah.

Like goes both ways. motherfucker. Yeah, it does. And right now, you're just the guy out on the corner talking to himself. And I'm sitting here going, I don't fucking understand what you're saying. Exactly. I was like, I don't know. Can you try a different way to say it? Yeah. Maybe the way that you've been saying it isn't the way you, maybe if you really want me to hear it, just like figure out how to say it. And if you're so, and if you're right, and this is so true, won't I find out later anyways? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. won't it just arrive in front of me and I have at whatever point it becomes relevant yeah yeah I will get there yeah I think we're similar in in some ways like that or whatever whatever it is I think that we've I've always felt

like I saw you even back when we first met I just like we didn't talk a lot we didn't need to well the first time we met we talked for like two hours on a plane no at in London Oh, in London. In London. Yeah. You guys were all together. Yeah. When the girls were all hanging out.

Yeah. Well, Nicole came to work out with Gwyneth. I was staying with Gwyneth. And you. I was there. And there with her. And they went and did that thing that they do, which I wasn't doing. Yeah, like some Pilates or something.

And then you and I just hung and talked for like an hour and a half two hours. Yeah. And then I told you all there. You don't remember maybe that I said Benj and you would be great together. Yeah. And then Gwinneth later said. you know he has a twin brother and I was like yeah I was like great yeah I was like it's like is it because he's already taken that I was like I was like yeah like it was like I was like

no I remember you guys were all standing around talking I was like honey you know you know it would be great but you know Ben should be great for her and she's like who and I was like Cameron and she's like Joel, she's like embarrassed because I said it out loud in front of all you guys. I think I remember at the very end. Joel, stop it. Yeah, I was like, all right. Yeah. And then like a year later, year or two, whatever, however long.

Yeah, a year and a half, year later. And then remember we were on a plane together? From Australia. From Australia. You guys were promoting. The other woman. The other woman. Because it was with Leslie and Kate.

Yeah. You guys were all on my flight. Uh-huh. And I was like, great. You're going out with you guys. You're all right. Yeah. It was great. And then you told Benj, forget it, dude.

She is not into you. It never going to happen. I got off that flight. It was a great hang. Yeah. It was the best. We hung out for like three hours on that like 13 hour flight. Yeah.

And it was like it killed that like. Yeah, that time that you're not sleeping. Before bed where you're like just hanging out. Yeah. And I'll just jaw away. I'll just talk all, you know. Yeah. Rumble on forever.

We just talked. Just talked and talked. But then when I got home, I was like, so here. Here's the deal, dude. She's great. Fucking amazing. As I knew, you guys are going to be great friends. You guys are going to be very good friends. And you'll be lucky to know each other as friends because you're both amazing. It's never going to happen. You know what he did with that? He took that as a fucking challenge is what he did. He was never going to happen. Turn that shit up. He was like, let me turn on the he was like, never going to happen.

my favorite kind of happened. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, is that a challenge? He's like, really? Uh, zero fear. So it looks like it. And then I think like maybe seven months later we were married. Yeah. We were engaged. Yeah. But maybe that's what you both needed. You needed, you needed someone with that kind of determination. Literal fearlessness and determination. Don't give a fuck about what you say. she thinks, I have a feeling and I'm going to get after it and see if I'm right. Yeah. And you are exactly what he needed to aspire to. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like you both needed that. How could you imagine any other story for Cameron and Benj than that? Yeah. I can imagine it wouldn't make sense to me for it to be a, like I'm not saying anyone else's story is boring. I mean, I love me and Nicole story. Yeah.

it's us, it's different. You guys are like the two strongest people I know. Pretty headstrong to both of us. And literally physically strong too, but also, like you could beat people up. Like you could beat people up if you wanted to. You're humble. But you've, you've like trained and done all kinds of crazy stuff throughout your career to prepare yourself.

And you, that's not the reason I can whip ass. And you also have, you're also from Long Beach. And you're like, I'm from these streets. I will fucking shut. Yeah, I'm not a, but in a very refined way, you know. Yeah, refined. That's how people talk about. In a very classy and refined way.

That's how people, you know, describe me that know me is refined. Well, I think, so here's what I think. I think that genuine people who are themselves are classically cool. classically beautiful and always in style no matter what because it's the most sustainable thing you can be is yourself sure and you're authentically you as long as I've known you it's the through line as long as I've known you I've always just known you yeah because you're just being yourself and that's that's bench too yeah that's Nicole for sure she's got layers you got to get to know which version of Nicole Nicole is just she's it she's she's

She is her, she's like, ignigmatic. You know what I mean? Like she's just like her own. She's so unique. She's a cat. She's a cat. She's such a cat. Definitely not coming in if you call.

No, no. No. Yeah. You know? But couldn't live without her. Yeah. She couldn't live without her. And she's authentically herself in all of that.

Are you kidding? In all the different things she is, that's her. Yeah. And so I think that's probably what. When you say, what is it about that person? I always kind of get to the same thing every time. They're being themselves. And that's the hardest thing to learn how to be most of the time for people.

Now, Nicole has is authentic to herself no matter what. Like she does not betray herself at all. There's not a moment where she is in a room, doesn't matter who's around. She's not beholding to anything. Like nothing. It's just like it is her. Doesn't matter. it doesn't, she will come through authentic to herself every single time.

I learned very quickly that like bringing my wife to something when they're like, oh yeah, bring your wife and we'll all, we'll all hang out and, you know, get to know each other. And I'm like, it could go really well because she's lovely. But if she doesn't connect with anyone and she's, she could also have everybody on like a literally a party train like through like cha, cha, cha, chat, yeah, like around the entire. like restaurant. It could go really well and she's the life of the party or like it's a Virgo dude. Yeah. She's a Virgo. We like I'm the same we're the same way and she's the best. We're not going to suffer any fools if we fucking smell a fool. You know, you should. I can't,

I cannot pretend. No. You're like, uh-oh. I can't pretend. That's my problem. No, I know that. Every every once in a while you're like, Nicole does not pretend. Every once. while you're in a room of, you know, somebody's and you'll be like, uh-oh. Someone rubbed Cameron the wrong way. Like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Let's go over here. Back it down, back it down.

But it's, it's, it's, it's fun. You guys are yourselves. Yeah. And that's what you have to be. And we're both, the funny thing is we're both Virgos. You're both Virgos. And you guys are Pisces. Which are good.

Yeah. It's a very good, good balance. Yeah. Yeah, Virgo season is a real, is a real time. One of the things that I think we have to talk about is back in action. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I tell you, like, tell it, I'll talk about it.

Because it's going to be coming out. It's coming out. And you worked very hard on it. Well, it's, you know, it's been a long journey. It feels like, well, it's been two years. Yeah. Since you made it. Yeah.

Lots happened. But that's not the thing that's important about it. Yes. Yeah, but is it weird when you make a movie and then you have to wait two years for it to come out? It's first time it's ever happened. Oh, wow. Does it usually come out like a year later or like how's that work?

Yeah. We just had, you know, unfortunate circumstances. Yeah. We had to stop filming at the end. Like we got two weeks short because Jamie had a stroke. Yeah. Which was crazy. And, you know, thank God he's okay.

And he's about, you know, he'll have a special that comes out. in the beginning of December. Like sharing the journey? Sharing the journey. Wow. Which is really incredible. And then he miraculously, like, recovered and is better than ever. But we then, once he recovered, then the strike happened.

Oh, yeah. There was a writer strike and an actor strike. And so we, like, the whole year was taken up. We couldn't film. Right. So we had to wait to, because we still owed some film. some primary, you know, like just to finish off the filming. And once we were able to do that, then was another, it's been another year, basically, when it comes out.

It's really funny, the stuff, the trailer that I saw is awesome. Yeah, it's fun. It's really nice to see you on screen, even in the trailer. Thanks. It is so good. It's so gratifying. Oh, thanks. Yeah, it's cool.

I mean, you do something on. screen that's just it's you when you see you on screen you're like oh shit you smile you do a lot you do something on screen that makes everybody feel great that's nice at you it's the truth thanks it's just you i don't know i just somebody said hey you want to act and i was like okay and that's what i do i just kind of like get in there and do it it's incredible that you you weren't going after it yeah it found you it found me for sure It's interesting. Yeah.

Just the way things are meant to do. And you're like one of the great. You're like one of the greats. It's just the, it suits. You know what? Making movies suits me because I'm my brain. Like I'm a storyteller by nature. I'm also, you know, whether people like it or that.

I'm. What are you? I'm always like, hmm. The Virgo brain goes, let's think about that. Does that make sense? Yes. You know what I mean? Yeah, you do.

I'm like, oh, let's piece this together. Yeah. You know, and there's. And, you know, in movie making and storytelling when you're collaborating and you're with like a group of people who all have an opinion. Yeah. And we're just trying to get things done and things are meant to. I'm always sort of the voice of like logic.

Yeah. You know? Of like, huh. Guys. Are we really going to ask people to like. believe this shit. You know what you mean? So I'm kind of like that my brain is always like trying to figure out how everything gets

put together. The pieces get put together and whether or not it's what the story. It makes sense. And you're happiest when you feel like it comes together and it does. Yes. Yeah. It calms your OCD. It can.

It soothes that deep, deep rooted need for shit to make sense. Yes. You need to make, shit needs to make sense. Yeah, it does. The director, Seth, who's awesome and really, you know, was grinding on this movie just to, this is a big action movie. I mean, like really. Lots of action.

Yeah. We had like a lot of so many fight scenes. Yeah. And, you know, it's funny. There's humor in it, of course. But it's, you know, we just, we're doing a lot of stunts. So, you know, in that, you know, there's a lot of, you can serve one thing or the other. Yeah.

Like what's serving what? Like the story points to the action, the action to the story points. Like, you know, every script, it's like, you know, you start off with something and then you start to make it. Yeah, yeah. And then all of a sudden it's like you're in a car and you're like, the road starts off like, you know, the tires are nice and tacky and, you know, it's sticking good and everything. of a sudden you find that you're kind of getting into a little weather. Yeah. And you got to adjust.

Yeah, you got to adjust. You're like, oh, wait a second, you know, like, this is getting a little slippery here. Now we're on fucking ice and we're about to spin out. Right. You know, and like how do we just make all the pieces, keep the, the, stay on the road, basically, you know, if I'm going to keep with this fucking analogy that I started. Well, it's a good, well, it's kind of like, if you think. Think about like theater, right? Like on on stage. I was in a production of what?

Of Hans Christian Anderson. Oh, I thought you were to say newsies. Well, newsies was was what I was. Oh, that you guys were newsies. We were newsies in the Port Tobacco Players. Yes. Production in 1991 of Hans Christian Anderson. And I was paper boy news newsie number one and Benj was newsie number two. Right. And my line was morning news and his was times. What I learned in that. That moment. What I learned in that moment that I'm just relating to your analogy of this very expensive action movie that you made. Those two relate.

They should. Performance, baby. Performance is all. On stage, there's a living, breathing thing that people are watching and the timing is everything. So every night the timing. is going to be subtly different. The crowd will be subtly different. But you're making... That you can relate to what you guys have done for decades.

On stage. Yeah, on stage. And it ebbs and flows. And then if you did a good job and the whole show is complete, you rode that wave a little bit. But the construction of the scene, the words, the sequence is there. But then you have to actually live it and breathe it on camera and bring it together. So of course you're going to...

Over a long period of time. Right. And so of course you're going to let go. Like, this don't feel right. We need to move it over here a little. Well, also, what's very unique to filmmaking is that we make it completely backwards a lot of times. Shoot from the end to the beginning? Yeah.

I mean, this movie, particularly, we literally shot the ending of this movie the first two weeks of the movie of shooting. Because that'll take the most to edit or something? Because it all has to... No, no. Budget? No. No. No.

It has to do with local. Locations. Locations. Locations. Locations. How many days do we need to be in a location? How much do we have to film there? What part of the scene, what part of the script is being filmed? And when can we get that location? Well, that location that we needed could only be at the very beginning of filming. So we're shooting literally the end of a major, like all this stuff, I mean, literally, probably two, three scenes from the end of the movie. But it's like, where we've basically, we've taken the whole journey.

And this is where we arrive. Yeah. I don't know what I'll not feel like. Yeah. I haven't shot the movie yet. Yeah. You know what I mean? I don't actually, I haven't not had this experience with these other actors.

We haven't gone through it yet. We don't know. And here we are. So, you know, as an actor, your job is to tap in, tap into what it might feel like, but then you have the lived experience of doing that. And everybody, you know, and you're, you're also making, you're doing these scenes. Some scenes take days to do. Not like that, you're doing the emotion of that scene over 10 hour days. A bunch of days in a row. How do you know how you're going to feel on Tuesday? Exactly. And then some, and everybody else is doing it too. So everybody's showing up

every day. Something might have happened, this or that. You don't know, when somebody, this and family life and real life and sleep and no sleep and all these things. And then you show up and you're just kind of like delivering as much as you can give in this moment to this moment that is completely, you know. Imagine. Yeah, imagined. But it's also like separate from everything else. Like it hasn't really, it's isolated. Right. Because you haven't done the beginning. You haven't done it. And that's every scene. So we're, we're shooting the beginning, the end at the beginning. the middle right after that. The very beginning, like, you know, so depending on locations,

all of the beginning of the movie takes place, took place in Atlanta. And the quarter in to the end of the movie, and then back at the very end back to Atlanta, that big chunk in the middle takes place in England. Yeah. We went to England first. I remember that. So we never shot any of the stuff other than what's on stage for Atlanta,

for the beginning of the movie on stage. But still, just because it was on stage, doesn't mean that it got shot in sequence. Right. It didn't. Yeah. You know? So we're like, you're all over the place.

You're jumping through, you know, 120 page script, you know, four pages at a time, completely out of sequence. That's what movies. So this is where this brain, the logic brain, the connective brain, the brain that's like,

hey, guys, we didn't shoot that, but that happened. So how are we getting here from there? And it's like, but if we're, but if we're going to be from here, like I know we haven't shot it yet, but so then when we're going to shoot that thing that we didn't shoot yet,

but we've already got the, we're coming into it. I was like, okay, so where did we really end up? Right. So now we have to do the performance that leads into it connected to the end result rather than the end result being from the beginning of what we experienced.

That's why you got to know your shit. You got to know the script. You got to really study. You got to know. You got to do your homework. You got to know where you're at. I really relate to that from my time in the theater. I'm just saying.

Everything you're saying is making sense to me. You're just making sense. Totally making sense. I can feel it in my own experience. Yep. I always wanted to be an actor. Still can, Joel. You know, I realized that it's either it's either.

I'm not an actor. I think I am very now comfortable in my own work that I do. Yeah, you do great at like the podcast. Yeah. Do a band thing. Hosting. Host the show. Yeah.

And I'm happy in it. I feel like it's an honest day's work. Yeah. In a very like easy business in my opinion. Like I know people work hard in this business. I'm not saying the hours aren't long. The work isn't hard. But coming from a world where everyone worked,

manual labor. Yeah. And you know this, right? Like, our father's worked really hard. Yeah. And so when you work in entertainment, it's hard work for the hours and the mental strain on some things. But at the end of the day, I think we're all at our very baseline core. We all think this is easy compared to construction and the slaughterhouse and this. Like, our dad's work hard. Their hands were. My dad would stand in the middle of a street all day long on the pavement with cars zooming past him. That's why every time I see guys working, you know, in the street, I'm always like, because my dad would come home, be like, so angry that he almost was killed five times. Because people are rude. Because people are rude and they don't be attention and they are distracted and they're. And somehow

people doing jobs that are hard or they're not sexy. Somehow, culturally, we continue to evolve to look down on them more and more and more. And you're like, wait a minute, I'm like you. I see a guy working hard out in the sun. doing some hard job. And I feel grateful. Absolutely. And I always try my best to be, if I don't have an interaction with the person, I at least try to be considerate and, you know, not be an asshole. Yeah. They're so funny because like all that construction that's on the 101. You know, I'm literally like, it's 55, y'all. Drive 55. Just drive 55. Just drive 55 for eight miles. Okay. You see guys, drive slow. Just, you know, and I'll just be in the 55 and cars be coming up. behind me, they'd be so mad. I'm like, go around.

Nope. Go around. Just go around. You know what I mean? If you have a problem. But, but sometimes I really like going like this pointing at the sign. 55. That's so. Instruction. 55 construction. Do they ever pull up next to you and go, hey. Hey. Hey. Camman. And then they're like, you have this, you have an effect. The Cameron effect. The Cameron effect. You see Cameron, you're like, Cameron, big smile. It's a little weird. I'm like, oh, yeah, I forgot.

It's a product of your spirit, though. What time? I remember I was back in, I was in Long Beach. I was in Long Beach. This is a while ago. And I was pulling out of a parking lot and this girl was pulling in and she like, she was like, she was like, she gave me this stare and I was like, what? Yeah. I was like, what bitch?

Yeah, what? What? I was like, what are you looking at? Like, I was like, like, can you have to get it? And then she was like, and then I was like, oh, I forget. You forget. I forget. You forget.

Oh, she recognized me. I thought she was giving me some stink eye, some mad eye. Like, I was like, what's going? Yeah. What? Yeah, that happens. Yeah. And now I'm like, because you're a real person.

You know. It's funny, too, because. taking time off from making movies doesn't mean taking time off. No. Right? So it's like, it's funny how the world has to like label things to make sense. What is she doing? Mm-hmm.

She's retired. Retire. What is that mean? Right? I'm just like, but somebody's feeding me great. Yeah. You got a whole ass wine like literally top wine company in the world. Avalene.

Yeah. That's, yeah. That was easy. That was simple. Yeah. But that's the thing is like people don't. realize that the storylines and narratives that, let's say, people have to write to serve whatever story they want to tell or how to describe you or whatever, they do that to us. They're going to

come up with a narrative that they feel like they can describe us how they want to fit into their narrative. Their narrative. And that's like media in general these days. And always has been. But taking time away from making movies, which is something you did for a long time. And going to life, building a family, building a big ass wine company, doing a bunch of shit that is in itself. If that's all you did, take all the movies away. If you just built Avaline and built a family, that's a huge accomplishment and undertaking and a life in itself.

If you literally just wanted to run your wine company and be in your family, that would be a life that was accomplished. amongst all the other stuff you do because you design and you you know you you have real estate projects all the time and you always have stuff going on that's inspiration is like making things yeah do you think that going to other things that inspire you and then succeeding at them brings you back to making films in any different way like do you feel like you have insights or do you just go i just enjoy it and i'm i mean so making movies movies as a mother and a wife is completely different for sure. I mean, it's what you were talking

about before where it's like I was doing something just on my own. My energy now when I'm on set is completely, you know, it's not just about me, you know, I have my family and I'm a mom first. Yeah, your kids don't give a fuck. No, they don't care. I have no idea. You got to focus and get ready for something. They're like, I don't give a buck. Yeah, no, completely. So, you know, having that is completely different having Avaline which is you know something as you know that came about from with our shared friend Catherine power our dear friend KP i met through you guys through Nicole her and Nicole were such close friends for so long yeah you know that that came from our our family really so this to us is like we always talk about that Nicole is the root of our vines if Nicole was a

wine bottle, she would be that white bottle of the white. Which one? The, yeah, the mixed, the, the, she would be the, the white blend, the, the green one, right? Yeah, that would be her. Yeah, she is. That's her as a wine. Which is our core wine. Yeah. One of our first wines. Yeah. So she, yeah, I mean, she's without her, Avaline would not be here. She was our, the roots to our vines. And she's your number one customer. Yeah. Could be. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She inspired the screw cap. Yeah.

She's like, can you make this easier for me? I needed to get in faster. You got to be able to. So I don't want to have to ask Joel. Open the damn wine bottle and get out the thing. Just make it easy. It was self-serving for sure for all of us. Can you pour it in my mouth now?

So glad she's enjoying it. Yeah, yeah. It's sweet. But yeah, so Avalene, just, you know, the fact that we, Catherine and I were able to kind of like pull this off. And I mean, it doesn't surprise me with Catherine because she's such a badass entrepreneur. Like she just knows how to do this. And I've just had a master class in it, you know, how to build a business alongside her.

But we are really great partners for all the reasons that, you know, you were talking about before our strengths and are, you know, that we really are compatible. And we, you know, compliment one another in our strengths and what we have to offer. and so we've really had a great time. We're like, I think we're at like 113 in wine brands in the whole country in the world. Yeah. The witches, I think. It's a serious. It's a serious.

I'm just saying. No, it's a serious. It's a serious friend. It's a serious brand. And what I think is when you think about you and Catherine, Nicole and all your friends, right, are these diverse group of women who are all rich in experience, right? So they have all kinds of experience in living and building families and working and traveling and doing things and all share the same experience.

You know, when you guys all get together, you would drink wine. And who's going to think what are we putting in our body, Cameron? I'm going to go, okay, wait a minute. What are we drinking? What is in this? And then you end up creating this amazing product that I wouldn't say that only women drink it. Everyone, you know, that likes wine can drink. But women love it.

Yeah. Well, consumers like us, consumers who do care. Right. You know, who were like, wait, I never thought of that. More conscious. Yeah. Like, I never questioned what was in the wild. It's not that complicated. You can choose that one or that one. Yeah. And we're going to always choose one that's better for us. And transparency. If it's an option. It's just about transparency. Yeah. We all the transparent. So who better to do it than a group of women who actually love what they're making and care about it. And it actually isn't about the money. and about the, it's actually about the product that other people get to enjoy and that experience and how does it look and how does it feel and what are we saying about it? And I think that you're still in the lifespan of a brand. You're still in the early stage. Yeah, we're four years old. Right. Four years old. So in another four years, it'll likely be, you know, one of the biggest period.

And that's because the product actually is made by people who care. And it's not an end game. The end game isn't let's make money. The end game is let's make something that's better for people. That's how I think all products should be developed, all brands should be developed from a place of love, shared love, inspiration, and actually like some purpose behind it. And so when I think about what happens a lot all over the world,

when we get together, they watch a show, they drink wine, they share and they have these experiences together that are more than just watching a show or drinking wine they're healing they're sharing they're gathering information they're comparing notes doing all kinds of things around these bottles of wine it had to be created by women that are doing that together yeah and then shared first by their community and then it grows out from there and that's kind of been obelene yeah yeah completely and that's uh that's why it's unstoppable it's just something that people need and there has to be a good product out there for people that doesn't have that option have toxic shit in it yeah and that's the thing is that unless it's on the bottle there's no way to know

right you know like you don't know what you're drinking if it's not if it's not listed on the bottle you know as an ingredient list we put exactly what's in the bottle on the bottle so that's our you know, for us that's, I think that's, we're unique in that. Yeah, God only knows what's in what I'm drinking. Probably some lighter fluid. Yeah, probably, honestly. Bleach. Quite possibly. Whatever leaked in from the machine. You know. And for us, it's just like, you know, we're just saying what we do. Right. And then it's an invitation to everybody else. To look at what they're doing. If they want to put it on theirs, you know, that's kind of. me what's in yours.

Yeah. It ain't so bad. This is what's in ours. This is what's in ours. Do you enjoy it? I love it. Yeah, I can tell. It's the best.

So much fun. Yeah. I love it. It's also just a great product. Yeah. You know, it's just delicious. Yeah. You know, it's the wine I want to drink.

Yeah. You know, and I enjoy wine. Like, I don't, not trying to go get smashed. Yeah. If I, if I drink other wine, I inevitably end up in a position I don't want to be in. Like, I've said something I don't want to say. You know what I mean? Because there's all this stuff that's like influenced me unknowingly. Like I'm like, whoa.

Yeah, that's me. I'm swirling and I don't know what's happened to me. For me, I am very comfortable knowing exactly what I'm going to get when I drink my wine. For me, like I can have a glass of wine and know that I'm how it's going to make me feel. Yeah. You know? And even when I know, like, I don't know why I'll do it again and again and again if I drink that fireball, whiskey. Oh, my God. What are you doing?

I'm going to. What are you doing? Frank the tank's back. But you know what you're going to get. But when I drink gobbling, I am a classy. You have a classy knight. Smart gentlemen with a lot of things to say that are, you know, thoughtful and measured. Yeah. Two extremes.

Yes. It's like Russian roulette with the other stuff. It's true. It's been fun to watch. you guys built this. It's amazing. I mean, it's amazing. Yeah. The best one. It is. It's all we have in our house. I'm so glad. It's great. And then you go back to making movies and I have to believe that like, there was probably some part of you that was like, you know how to make movies. So you're going back, but you're like, what's this going to be like? Because I have, I got to go home at the end of the

day and take care of these kids and check in with my husband and then find time to sleep and get back up and do this like very supposed to find time to sleep yeah so I went maybe there was I missed that note yeah because you like to sleep I love to sleep I don't think you sleep a lot I don't sleep like you used to I don't like I don't and it's really I mean it's the challenge of my life but I'm also so grateful because the reasons why I'm not sleeping are just amazing amazing so yeah like you have a hurt shoulder right now from carrying around yeah maybe the largest baby ever I've ever ever seen in my life. If only I was as tall as your son. I used to make, I used to make, shut up. I used to make fun of mom. I, before I was a mom, I'd be like, oh my God, that's mom arms.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm getting mom arms. Now I know, you don't want to mess with mom arms. Yeah, no. Mom arms are the strongest arms there are. Those biceps. You are not, you're like, do not let a mom get hold of you. They, yeah. Because mom arms are for real, you know. You're working out all day long. All day. It's really sweet. And it's, it's all the things because you're like, yeah, you're not sleeping. No. With little kids, you're not sleeping. But it's the best reason. The best reason. But the tired is real. Like you get into moments where you're like, we've had to get into a dialogue around those tired moments where we're like, we haven't slept on. Yeah. We're fighting right now because we're tired. Yeah, yeah. We're both tired. We can't come to a decision because we're tired or

can't pick a place to fucking eat. By the way, let me just tell you as you walk into the kitchen. first thing in the morning, I did not sleep. Yeah. So whatever happens right now, don't take it person. It's in context. It's like I'm just underwater. Yeah. Every parent. Yeah. Like I don't, like, so just, it's nothing personal. Like, I just am half dead. But then taking that back to work, don't you feel like it's built your capacity, stamina, and in a whole new different way that ever got challenged? Sure. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, look at, like, Like going back to work, it really is sort of like riding a bike. Yeah.

It's like something my body, it's just something I know how to do, right? The sort of technicality of making a movie. Right. People don't really know how technical making movies are. Right. You see the end product. You don't really realize that like the way I'm standing in front, what it took to like step in front of the camera.

Right. Right. And there's some people, when you know, when actors first, you know, there's lots of learning how to be a theater actor. Actor. Yeah. There's theater acting. Yeah. Right.

And theater acting, there's very specific things that you have to do, the upstage, downstage. I know that stuff. You know the technical terms. From Hans Christian Anderson. Stage right, stage left. You know, all that. Well, in front of a camera, there's things that you have to kind of do as an actor to get in front of the camera properly. Yeah.

it's a second nature when you, you know, you do it as, you know, you just kind of like end up where you're supposed to end up. But there's people who, how do I get there, you know? Right. Like before you learn how to, before you can second nature, it's like, how am I going to get there? Right. Right. So I don't, I skip that part. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Because I'm already there. Like, I know how to, I know how to do that. I know how to, I know how to do all these things, you know? I know what's needed. I know the questions I have to ask the camera, the camera guys. and, you know, the grips and, like, I, you know, the other actors and the director, like, I know all the questions.

Yeah, like, if you don't learn that stuff in the first, the language of the, if you don't learn that stuff in the first 10 years, even, like, being generous, then what are you doing if you haven't learned that? Yeah, I mean, well, if you have. Some people maybe don't, but. Well, you haven't learned, you have to learn it pretty much, like, in your first film. Right. Because by the second film, if you don't, you got to keep up, you know.

Right. But when I'm saying, like, my just walking into, like, it's in. It's in my body, you know? It's like a second nature. So it is kind of like that. That part of it is very, it takes no energy for me. And then just like the acting part of it is like, you know, I don't know. You just get it that.

I don't know. Like, I don't know. People might think I'm terrible at it in this movie. I don't know. Like, I literally have no idea. I saw the trailer. I just going to. Yeah, I know.

The trailer's really, they did a great job on the toilet. There she is. Yeah, they did a great job on the trailer. It feels really good. I think it's going to be a really fun movie for people. It looks like it's fun. I saw the trailer and I was like, there she is.

Yeah, it's cool. It's a family action movie. I think most kids can see it. We don't have any like it's not. It's not like gory or bloody or, you know what I mean? We're not like, it's not like a slaughter situation. It's like we fight people. We don't like we're not killing people.

Right. You're not blowing their brains out. Only one person, but I didn't do it. Right. Yeah. So. Yeah. It's like the villain dies.

It was necessary, of course, so that we could, you know, the trajectory of story had to get us there. Do you think going forward that the kind of movies you want to make has changed it all? Or do you feel like it's this evolving thing that you just look out at the landscape and you look at things and you decide what you want to work on based on probably a bunch of different factors, right? Like what works for your life, probably? Yeah. I mean, that's the first thing. For now, like, before I just was like, yeah, it sounds fun. Yeah.

It sounds like a good time. Yeah. Yeah, that sounds like a fun thing to do for three months. Right. You know? Yeah, that's cool. I like that. Yeah, yeah, I like that.

It's a vibe. I like that sounds fun. Yeah, yeah, that's a vibe. I'm done for that. Like, oh, yeah, that person. That's kind of how I can. That director. Yeah.

Like, I'd be like, that's cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I can do that for three months. Sure. Yeah. Now I'm like, there's a lot of things that's got to be for me to say yes. Right.

And first and foremost, it has to be right for my family, period. Like, what is the, what are all the things that I can put in place for it to, to work for my family to be able to, for me to be able to do it? Yeah, like, what does this entail? And then what does that entail to do this? Yeah, it's like, oh, where are we going to be? Right. What's schedule going to be? Because mom can't work 12 hour days anymore.

Right. That's just not, I'm not going to spend 12 hours on a set anymore. Right. Like, that's what was so great about London. It's a European workday. Work day. So it's 10 hours. Right.

And it makes all the difference in the world. Including a siesta. Yeah. Actually, it's a walking lunch. It's how they can do a 10 hour. Yeah. But if you're in Spain, you get a siesta. Yeah.

Yeah. In France a little bit, but mostly Spain. The French have. Yeah. The French is a walking lunch is what the French figured out. They were like, you know, yeah. You just see. You know.

Actually, I did a movie in France and it was so great because, I mean, this was, I was 28, maybe. Which movie was it? It's called Invisible Circus. Okay. Old, old, long time ago. And the great thing about that is every day, the food was delicious. We would sit down at a table that had a linen.

Yeah. Tablecloth. There was wine on the table. Just have a glass of wine at lunch. Very, very, like, civilized. You know, everybody knows how to, like, behave just because there's wine involved is not a party. It's like you have a glass of wine with your meal.

Avalene. Well, Avaline. That's it. Yeah. And so we would just, that was really great. I put Avaline on my lucky charms, to be honest. I can love Avaline. I would love.

That's a great campaign. Avaline, it's great on everything. Drink it for dinner. Drink it for lunch. Put it on your lucky charms. Perfect. You know, every time Bench comes over, he eats my bad cereal. Does he?

I laugh. Oh. I actually think he comes over for the cereal. He's like, so I'll just meet you at your house and we'll drive there from your house? And I'm like, yeah, sure, whatever. We can meet there too. And he's like, no, we could ride together. And he'll come in and, like, sure enough, he's got like a little bowl or a cup even.

Like, he'll just take a fucking glass, like a coffee mug. I'm like Ben, you should just get a bowl. You're going to have four cups. And he'll get a coffee mug. I always keep terrible cereal in my house. It's bad. That's hilarious. It's terrible.

I don't always eat it. But I always keep it. There. I like to look at it. There. I like look at it on the shelf. Yeah. And I go, there's my cereal.

I have like four boxes at all times. And he comes in and he looks. He goes, what kind of cereal you got? And I was like, it's always some special box I found. I always look for like some like collab cereal or special box of like rice Krispies with marshmallows every now and then they'll drop them. And then you can't find them anywhere. So like I'll always stock up and then he'll get a coffee mug. We'll pour some in.

You guys love your limited editions. Yeah. And I'll like sit there with the cereal. We'll be eating it. And I'm like, oh, you found the cereal. And he goes, yeah. And then I'm like, you should just get a bowl. You're going to refill that cup.

That's so funny. Every time. Every time. That's so cute. It's funny. Um, that's so funny. I can totally see it. I think like I see a version of your life where you're picking,

because I think everybody loves to see you in movies. That's so nice. What you do is you and on in a movie. It's fun and it's captivating and it's sweet and it's special and it's all the things that you are. If you acknowledge that as like, I'm just really fucking good at that. You don't have to do it. And you certainly have things you can.

care about as much as the things you like to do or that you can do really well, even if you don't always like it. I would say you probably get more out of your real life, like living life and being in a place you like and raising kids and having friends and... You know, we have like our community, we have our family. Yeah. That's real life. And that's where we get the most actually. That's where I think people miss the whole point of life is like everything that you are going to get the very most out of life is going to be with the people you love. And then, the experiences you have when you try to do something and you accomplish it are really important. So if you say, I want to go climb that mountain and you go and climb it, it's important.

You accomplish something. You saw if you could do it. But there's a balance, right? I just see you making movies in a way that it's you picking things that you think will be fun. And stories maybe you want to tell or finding, but like you said, in relationship to your real life. Yeah. It has to make sense for my family. I'm not going to work more than 10-hour days.

That's my thing because I got to get home. I have to either wake up with my kids or go to put my kids to bed, one of the two. You know, location, location, location. Yeah. That's how I feel. Duration. Duration.

It's the only reason I'm not on Broadway. Right. Clearly. It's a hard life. You know, the kids are going to, like, in a few years, empty nesters, I can really see you guys really like. Who is your dad? He's in New York.

He's like on Broadway. He's on Broadway. Doing a musical. Yeah. Yeah, I can see that. That's the funny thing about where Benj and I are at with having a young family, like all of my girlfriends, because I'm 52 years old and all my girlfriends are my age, all their kids are like either in their last years of high school or going off to college.

Yeah. And it was so funny because when I was, when their kids were young, when their kids were my kid's age, I would be like, okay, guys, well, just, you know what? I'll call you when I wake up. Yeah. Oh, yes. You guys, oh, you guys went to sleep at eight? Gosh.

I just, yeah, I went to bed. I don't know. You're like, all my friends are so flaky. They say they're going to have dinner and then they bail on me. We have to go home and take care of, like, do bedtime. Yeah. You know, and now, like, it's the other way around.

Like, all my girlfriends are like empty nesters and like, where are you? Like, oh, we're in New York. What are you doing in New York? Oh, we're going to be here for the fall. What do you mean you're there for the fall? Well, the kids are in college. I'm like, ugh. It's like, okay.

You guys probably spend more time with your kids than maybe any parents. I think about it. I spent a lot of time with my kids. But I was in a different place in my life. So I was still kind of running and gunning and dadding. I definitely miss some stuff. And I always tell Ben's like, I'm jealous that he gets to kind of decide. his schedule so he could be there.

Because, and I think it's, I think you guys are great. He has so much going on as you know. It's crazy. It's crazy. Insane. Like I'm literally like,

how do you even have time for us? And he just figures it out. He just makes it happen. And he never, you never know it. Yeah, he contains it. He just contains it. He doesn't make you,

like I have no idea that his phone is just like blowing up because he'll put it in his pocket and he'll be present with the kids. And a lot of it is like crisis management. Yeah, that he's in like, you know, running three companies. Yeah. And everybody needs him. And he's just like taking that moment to like be with his kids. But again, that's the, that is the thing about you guys.

That's amazing is if you knew you guys and what you guys were doing, raising kids, building companies and doing all the things you're doing and how calm. I'm sure your life feels chaotic in the center of it. It's very calm. Yes. I mean, we're mature. we have a lot, we have a grasp on things. We know how, like, and also I've already done all my shit.

Right. I don't, I'm not going like, oh, what would it be like if I went and did that instead of being home with my family? I was like, I literally know what it is and I don't want to do it. Yeah. I already did. And I'm done. You know what I mean?

I want to just be here. That's the benefit of it. You know, there's like I have, there's nothing that I want to be doing other than this. Like, and I know that because I've already done it all. Right. And you also, because you've done so much in your life, you can handle a partner who's also running all these companies and doing all these things. And you know what it means to support on the fly where something comes up and he's got to go.

Yeah. And if something comes up and you got to go, you guys have both been working in the world for long enough to know. We know. Like you guys have that dance down. Totally. It's the benefit of having, being older parents. if I had had kids in my 20s, they wouldn't even be talking to me right now.

Yeah. They'd be like, that bitch is crazy. Yeah. Like, we, like, peace out, lady. Like, we knew you when we were young. Okay. Mom. Okay.

I know, we knew you when we were, when we had to be there. Yeah. Because you had us trapped. Yeah. But now we're gone. We're good. See you later. You're cool mom.

You and Nicole are cool moms, though. Yeah. Is it cool? We're okay, I think. I always, my fun, I'm always telling Kate, Sparrow like, no, but your mom is like literally one of the funniest people on the face of the planet. She's so funny. She's so talented. She's so cool. She's like a like a like tastemaker style like icon and they're literally like, okay. Okay, whatever. My mom, right. You know what I mean?

Like that's how kids are, right? They just like, they're like embarrassed by their parents no matter what. I'm like, your mother is Nicole Richie. Do you understand? You know? It's like. It's just how it always is with my kids and they're like they think something's cool and I don't think it's that cool. And if I say how I feel, it'll hurt their feelings. But aren't I supposed to hate everything they like? Isn't that what dads are like supposed to be like what? What's that? But I found the way to for the most part like every once in a while I'll say that's whack. I think that's whack. But most of the time I'm like, that's pretty cool. Is that the words they use now? Wack? No, no, that's old. Yeah, I was just going to say I wanted to, I just wanted to confirm is that,

What they use? A few decades. Yeah. You say that and they go, what is whack? Yeah. Yeah. They're like, so it's not that bad. Yeah.

But that's just the way it is. Yeah. They don't think we're that cool. Yeah, I know. We get along, though. They think we're cool enough. I remember when Benj and I first started dating, I would say Culeo. Yeah.

Cooleo. Cooleo. And Benj is like, oh, my God, cringe. You'd be like, that's cute. And you say Cooleo. I was like, don't look at. What do you want? What do you want?

That's what I know. That's what I say. That's what I say. Yeah. Cool you. Can we start using one of your words? Yeah. I'm excited to see the movie.

I'm just keep it looking at Benj up there with his. With his spikes? Spikes. Yeah. I'm like, ooh, dade. Yeah. I feel like he hates that, that era. But like I think it's a part of him that's really sweet and lovable.

And just see that kid trying to like. be so tough. Yeah. And he was trying to make it. And we were just kids from nowhere that didn't know anything. And we came into the world with an optimistic and honest perspective and like attitude. And then we got our asses handed to us. And it took us meeting our wives, building our lives to get back to, I think the optimistic, honest kids who just want to do stuff. Yeah. And be friends with most people. And we're curious. but we've learned enough to know what's what. Yeah.

And then we have these like badass wives who also poke us and go, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, that's, they're no good. Oh, yeah. They look out for us. Yeah, no, we, by the way, I mean, look at, there's plenty of times I've said to him, yeah, dude, no, that he's like, took a long time to figure out. Yeah. You know, those things.

But it's everybody's journey, right? We're on our own. Yeah. But I think where he's at now with a. everything and especially like just what you all building and what he works on every day and the vision is like epic yeah it's big it's a big idea and it means a lot because i think that the the just like avaline core of it is true it's not a lie and so however long it takes everyone else to understand what we're trying to do that's fine that's how i feel about avalien if

you start with the truth, like be true, you can't go wrong and let everybody else figure it out when they do. It's like bench. Take people years to figure out that that guy is the baddest motherfucker in the room because he's not going to tell you he is. He's going to stand in the corner. He's going to hold his wife's bag if he has to. He's going to be helpful. He's going to be of service. He's going to help the fucking guy waiting the tables if he has to because he's that guy. Yeah. And then when you figure out who you're actually talking to, you go, oh, shit. Yeah. like he's the baddest motherfucker in the room. Yeah.

Because not only can he concept an idea, which some people can do, he can build it, which some people can do. But a lot, very people can do both. He can do both. Yeah. And also whoop your ass. Yeah. If he had to.

I know the other day, he finally after, I don't know, a decade, he told me how many people you knocked out. He's knocked out a lot of people. And I was like, what? I was like, he was like, I don't know. just like this thing. He's like, I just can do it. He's got heavy hands.

Yeah, he's like, I got heavy hands. He's like, I can just do it. He can knock people out. Yeah. One hit or quitter. Yeah. Every single time. Huh.

I kind of, I already knew that. I knew that. Growing up, I saw it enough. I saw it so many times where, and I always knew my brother was like, he could just hit, like, knocked people out. And I couldn't, by the way. Right. Right.

I know. I couldn't. That's why he was. Yeah. So we work well as a team, though. I'm all over the place. I'm distracting you. Boom.

But I always say to him, like, it must feel so good to be so competent with your hands. You know, like you just, no worries, right? But he's always naturally been good at that and fearless enough to know when. Right. Because if you miss your moment. Yeah. Things could go really bad. Really bad.

You either have to leave or if something's about to go down, he's usually he's going to throw one punch and it's over. He's an intuitive man. Yeah, he is. He's intuitive. But now, flash forward to adult life where he doesn't go around punching people. No, by the way, he's ever been in a fight since I've known. Right. He's evolved to.

It's behind him. Right. He's evolved to a place where he knows he doesn't need to do that and it's likely not going to be a productive thing to do anyways. Yeah. But there's a confidence there that. I think every man should have in some way. And then that translates into his work where he is incredible at what he does. He's a great leader and he works hard, harder than anyone I know.

And the both of you together, it's like you both work your asses off and you get at what you do. And to know you, to really know you guys is to understand why you're so important as a couple. Well, I was just thinking about like how, I think what our superpower is is like, you know how we're always like our family. Yeah. You know, like we're, it's like we're stronger together. We're all together. We're all together. Like our families are like everything.

Like, you know, the Maddens. Oh, if we gang up. Like, you know what I mean? Like we have this. We know like we know like we have this on lock, you know. Yeah. It's a gang. Yeah, it's a gang.

You know, so it's like, we're always like, we just, this is like, our strength is our, the fact that we all have each other, you know? Yeah, I feel like if there was some like dramatic game, like squid games or anything like that where if you were like the four of you. Or family feud. Yeah, yeah. Or wheel of fortune. Yeah, baby.

Because you know I win that shit. I'll be the word guy. You can do the obstacle course. Ben, you can go and fight people. What will Nicole do? She'll make everybody laugh. But I feel like if I was going to pick my team, that's my family. I'd be like, okay, let's huddle up.

What are we all doing? And then you and Benj are likely handing out the jobs and we're like, okay. And then we just all go. And we'll probably win that shit. Yeah, we win. That's life. That is. It's the best.

You guys are the best. Thanks for coming and doing this. I was just like, I'm so excited. I get to go talk to my brother. Yeah. You know, I just get to sit here and talk, you know, talk with you, which is awesome. Thanks, Cam. Thanks, Joel.

See you next time. I hope you enjoyed today's episode of Artist Friendly. If you really liked it, you can follow, like, subscribe to the show anywhere you listen to podcasts, Spotify, Apple, Amazon. We appreciate your support and we'll see you next time. I'm Anna Mena. And, like my music, my my hair can be able to be able to to be able to continue my rhythm.

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