Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - Gabe Saporta

Episode Date: April 26, 2023

Join us on Artist Friendly as Joel Madden is joined by Gabe Saporta of Cobra Starship and Midtown. Saporta made a huge mark in the 2000s. After getting his start in the New Brunswick pop-punk outfit Midtown, he went on to form Cobra Starship. That band covered the decade in a neon glow, putting out four studio albums before calling it quits in 2015.  In the episode, the duo discuss Saporta’s favorite era of his decades-long career, making it as an immigrant from Uruguay, and helping teenagers understand the world through music. ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠Spotify.⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up? I'm Joel Madden. This is artist friendly from alternative press. And today, I'm talking to Gabe supporter from Midtown and Cobra Starship. What's up, Gabe? Good to see you. Thanks for coming. Thanks for having me. How's it going? It's going pretty good, I think, yeah. Yeah. What's going on? What's the, I was driving over and I was thinking about like, what do I really want to talk to Gabe about? We get to like catch up. every now and then it always feels like every couple years yeah like we'll always see each other like somewhere and we always have really nice catch-ups but we've known each other now for 23 years I met you in 2000 early 2000 yeah we're kids and yeah we were kids you were in midtown and you

were cool it was cool you were around the scene up there and where are you from Jersey. Okay. That's, New York Jersey. There was a, it was a very blossoming punk, emo, hardcore, all that up there. It always seems so cool to me. I always always thought that the guys up there were like, somehow they knew more or whatever.

I mean, we were like from like podunk, Maryland, but like. We're outside of Baltimore? Baltimore, Baltimore proper? No, like down south from D.C. So, like, down in the sticks for the, for my, for my formative years. And then we left home right before 18. We turned 18. And then we went to Baltimore, Annapolis, D.C.

I lived all over there. And was there a scene there? There was. So in Baltimore there was a scene. In Annapolis, there was like a scene. It was like a real artsy kind of like scene. And that's where I think I got a lot of my. I think I really, like, developed leaving home and going into the world that little place.

There was a band in Annapolis, like Jimmy's Chicken Jack and people there that, like, we really, like, that really, I feel like, fostered us. And then Baltimore was its own thing. And then D.C. was its own thing. And D.C. felt, I mean, it was really cool. It just felt a little bit like you were on the outside of it if you weren't on the inside of it, even as a band. What was the insect? Because, like, my favorite, like, minor threat is, like, that whole scene that came out of the discord scene. That scene, it didn't exist when you guys were coming up anymore, right?

It was kind of not a thriving like it was. So it was, but it was still legendary, and they were all, they were still around. And DC had that, like, that kind of, it, it had that vibe to it. Like, there was, so there was definitely a DC scene. Now, the people that go to the shows in DC, Baltimore, more. They go all around. We're great. Not to say the bands weren't great, but it was like, I don't know that we ever got on the inside of it, you know, so I didn't really get to experience it like from a band. As a fan I got to a little bit, go to shows and stuff. But anyways,

I always would come up when we started touring up the East Coast. I would see bands like yours and I'd see this like kind of scene growing with all you guys and it just seemed so cool. But anyways, we met back then 2000. And then when I think about your career, you go Midtown, then you go Cobra Starship. And now you have a music company. Behind the scenes. Yeah. But like.

Once in a while, I'll come out to do an interview. Once in a while. Yeah. By the way, me too. I feel like I'm behind the scenes, but I'm not because I do stuff. Like I host the TV show and I do this show and I like do stuff. But for all intense purposes, how we spend our time, we are behind the scenes. We're working with artists.

Right. We're discovering artists. We're helping artists. We're trying to help artists, like, get their start or maybe they had a false start and they're trying to, like, figure out how this all works. So you're probably having a similar experience to me, you know, with MDDN over the last, like, nine years. Probably having a very similar experience. It's been nine years? Yeah, eight, nine years, yeah.

Congrats, bro. Thank you. Thank you. So when I look at your career and think about it, and I've gotten the, I've gotten to kind of see you all along the way. And your answer is probably the same as mine, but like, what's your favorite era of your career? Oh, shit.

My favorite era of my career. I'd say like the bookends, you know, I think like the beginning when you just don't know anything and you're just like, wow, I'm just doing shit with my friends. It's naive and yelling for it. And you're like, wow, I'm just like, I bought up. van for $2,700 and just going down the coast and playing like house shows and it's sick

and you know, there's like 12 people there and it's just like super pure, right? It's just like you're just there for the music to like do shows with your friends and you're just like, it's just like a project. It's like a school project. It's like, I mean, that's how it started. It's like an extracurricular at school.

Like I don't want to play on the sports teams. I don't want to like do anything. I just want to make music with my friends. And so like that beginning was like really special. Like I remember turning 21 on the road And there was like, you know, 12 people in like some small town in Florida. And I'm like, that's awesome. You know, that was my 21st birthday.

You know, I didn't go to like a big club or anything, you know. I had my 21st birthday with MXPX. That's awesome. In Oklahoma. That's awesome. So, you know, I remember that very fondly. And then the other end of that, which was just like the full on crossing into mainstream, doing the whole thing, like the stuff that you never thought you would do, like award shows,

that kind of stuff. You know, like, wow, we're just like, you really just. It's the ride. Yeah, the ride. Got on the ride. It's like, we really just did it, you know? Like, it's funny. When I got into music, like you, you know, I didn't come, I didn't know anyone in the music

business. I'm an immigrant, you know, my parents are not like very artistic. Oh, so you're an immigrant from where? So I was born in Uruguay, a country called, in a country called Uruguay. A lot of people don't know where it is. They're like, oh, Paraguay. I'm like, no, it's not even near Paraguay. It's between Argentina and Brazil on the coast.

It was, it's like, it's kind of like the DMZ of South America. Right. When the Portuguese empire was fighting the Spanish empire, they had like this little wedge of a country between them. That was your way. And so the Spanish I speak has like influences from Portuguese as well. But it's far. It's really far south. And I came here when I was four and I grew up in Queens and I came here like on a tourist

reason, we just never left. Right. So like we were illegal for like four years. And my dad finally got. I've got a job. I'm going to, I've told my story a bunch done, so I won't rehash the whole thing. But yeah, I don't know shit. I don't know music could be a business. I don't know music was like a, you know. A real job. Yeah. And especially not for someone that's not doing pop, right? Like, you know, I think the first time that I felt like, oh, I could actually do this was when Nirvana came out,

you know, because before that, even if you liked rock, it was like, it was still very theatrical, it was very big. It didn't feel like something you could do yourself. It feels like, oh, this is like, you know, some kind of institution that you have to like be a part of it be in it. But, you know, Nirvana was like, no, we're a garage band. We just did this in our garage with our friends. We're not like dressed up. We don't even wash our hair, you know? So I felt like that and I remember seeing them for the first time on TV when I was 11 years old and I was just like, wow. And I think that put me on a trajectory to being like, okay, I don't have to know the music business. I don't have to know anyone in the music business. I don't even have to be a great

musician. I just have to love music. And I always love music. And then that inspired me for like I could do it too. It's funny because like when you say that, I hear it and I go, same. Didn't think it was a job. I was told it wasn't a job actually when I was in high school when we started our band. It was that when they're, you know, in the civics class or whatever, they had these aptitude tests we had to take. And my, I did terrible on tests always historically, like just terrible grades.

Not for not trying. Just just really bad. at that kind of work. Different brain. Yeah, different brain. Where we were from, it wasn't a job. And we, but we always wanted to get out with the band. We wanted to go places with it.

So I think we were always ambitious. But we were naive enough to think we could do it. So we just left home and we started trying. And if you showed me all of the things that we'd have to do and all of the hoops we'd have to jump through and all of the twists and turns we'd have to go. on to get into our career, through our career, past chapter one, chapter two, chapter three, and through each kind of thing, I think if you showed, if you put that all in front of me now,

I'd go, and I'm not doing that again. That's fucking too much work. But because you're young and you don't know any better and you're naive enough to believe you can do it, you can do it. And you can like be, it can be new and exciting the whole time. I always think about like, how do you encourage people to take a chance and do something that they really want to do versus what they're told they should do, what they think they should probably do because the statistics say X, Y, Z. All of the kind of norms are what kind of keep us from going off on our own path and trying to do what we really want to do, I think, sometimes. And we were just naive enough to think that it would work out, that we could do it. But now when I look back at all,

all of the work and especially getting to this stage in my life where I've gone through but probably like two iterations of our career and now I'm in this other chapter. I kind of like this next act of what we're trying to do in the world. I think we're equally naive in this act because it's a different space than we're just making records, putting records out, touring, promoting those records and doing the things around that. I think being naive is sometimes the greatest strength we have when we're trying to succeed because it allows us to go forward without knowing how hard it's going to be. And as long as you have the resilience and the will to go forward, you can keep going forward. I think kids today

might be up against more because there's more information. So even though there's more access and they can share their music and you could say social media makes it easier and this and that, they can make music on their computers, that makes it easier. There's also a bunch of information telling them it's really hard. And you could say it's harder in that respect. And you could also argue it's easier for people to get it out. But then sometimes things get big too soon and they don't get to grow the right way. So like, I think we have a unique perspective coming from the era we did being in now trying

to help people go through the same experience. I think we have some perspective that might help. I do think the beginning of my career, I feel the same way. The beginning was my favorite. And then this part is my favorite because I have a family. And, you know, like you, we, I think we're actually choosing a lifestyle. Yeah. Over a bunch of other things.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I think a lot of ways that it's so true. I think, you know, in terms of how to get kids today who are starting, yeah, you know, so much information sometimes can actually overwhelm you and stifle you. Same thing like when you're writing a song. If you, like, are thinking too much about, like, what the song is going to sound like when it's finished, you're never going to be able to write it. You're going to get writers block, right?

Same thing when you're doing a career, right? If you're always thinking about what the result is going to be, you are not maybe going to take the chances that you would have had you not even known about the possibilities of the results. So, and then I think that really just goes back. I just try to approach everything from like a fundamentals point of view, from the principles, right? So especially when you're doing art or anything creative, I always believe that it has to be about the journey, right? The means are the end within themselves.

So when you're starting playing music, when you're doing shows, if you're doing it just because you say, I want people like me, I want to be big, I want to go. Like, it's cool to have goals, but if that's your focus every day, you're not going to be connecting in the moment that you're at right there. So I think it's really just about being in the present moment at all times when you're writing a song, when you're playing a show, when you're embarking on whatever you want to do for a living. Like, you have to do it. You have to be just led by the passion and do it because you love it. And if something works out, great.

Awesome. You know, and if it doesn't, you have an amazing journey and it'll take you. You don't know where that road is going to take you. Right. So, yeah, it's, you know, it's not so much naivete because I don't think, I mean, I've known you since you were young. You've never been naive. You're always very smart, you know, and.

In some ways for sure. Yeah. Yeah. But you were focused. on the inputs, not the outputs, right? And I think that's super important. And that's something that I try to remind artists of all the time when I talk to him. It's like, don't worry about what's going to happen.

You don't know. You can't plan for it. The only thing you can control is like what you're doing. And right now, are you present in what you're doing? Are you fully invested in what you're doing? That's what you've got to ask yourself. Are your parents artistic? No, not even a little bit.

No. What do they think about what you've done with your life? You know, I mean, anyone who has immigrant parents, they know that they're just like, oh, you got to get a job. You got to be a doctor. You got to go to school, you know, like, doctor, lawyer, engineer. My dad was always like that, you know, because, like, his dad was an immigrant, too, in Uruguay. Like, escaped the war and, like, got there in the 30s.

And, you know, and I think that it was just like, oh, you have to just like make sure that no matter why you have some kind of skill that if there's a war, they're still going to need you. Like a doctor is still going to be needed in a war, you know? So that's what my dad is. My dad's a doctor. My dad was a doctor in South America and came here and had to do medical school all over again. So he's very resilient, you know, so I get a lot of inspiration for my dad in that way. But, yeah, they didn't believe in that. They didn't understand.

They didn't believe in that. They thought I was wasting time. I remember when I left school, it's funny, I did really poorly in high school. And then I got to college. And in college, it's like, you can be in a class of 400 kids. It doesn't matter if you look weird. Like, you don't get judge for, like, some of the small things you get judged for in high school. You'll actually get dinged for grades and kind of can impede you.

So I did really well in college. Like, I was there for three semesters, and then I left, you know, so my dad went on a roller coaster right of like, always being disappointed in me throughout all of high school. I get to college. I'm finally doing well. And then I'm like, peace him out. He's like, he's like, dude, I don't know what you're doing. He's like, you can always just like have a place to stay at my house and take anything

you want from the fridge, but you're done. So you cut me off, you know? Right. And I was like, oh, yeah, cool, you know. And I just went and did it. So I think for many years, he was just like kind of like on the side, skeptically. and then I think when I bought my first house, then he was like, okay, you're like, this is like a business. You made a life for yourself. Yeah, parents just want their kids to be okay. He's not trying

to live. He doesn't care. And he doesn't really understand the music business or whatever. Like, I remember when I started Cobra Starship versus Midtown, like, you know, he liked that I was doing music. He liked that people coming to shows, but he didn't understand the music. It was like loud and aggressive, you know, especially for Helix. But Cobras was like, you know, more dance-based, right? So it was like more rhythmic. My dad is. like into like South American like like congos and like that kind of shit like percussive stuff right like jazz infused percussion so he's like he's like he's like man he's like the bongos in this song the rhythms is so great man the rhythms is great I really

feel like this could break out if you just you know you just if you just get on Leno J. Leno you play this this is a book go huge if you just go on J. Lennon so it's like his conception of like what it means to be huge just get on Jay Leno and you just get on Jay Leno and you You probably did play on Leno. Well, that's the funny thing. One day, like years later, this was when we first started here at the music, and that was his response, you know, and then years later, we ended up playing on Jay Leno, and Jay Leno comes backstage before the show to say hi and everything.

And I tell him the story. And he's like, oh, really? That's hilarious. Let's call your dad right now. I'm like, really? I'm like, here. So I give him my phone. He calls my dad's office.

And he's like, hi, is Dr. supporter there? And it's like, who's this? This is Jay Leno. They hang up on him. That's great. Crazy. Jay Leno's a nice guy. Super nice guy. So I called back. I'm like, oh, hey, it's Gabe. Is my dad there? I'm like, Dad, that really was Jay Leno. He's like Jay Leno because I'm like, Dr. Supporter, you're harder to get to than the president.

Dude, Jay Leno is cool, man. He's, you know how he's really into old cars? Yeah. I was driving down the road. I was on my way home one day. I was going up cold water. I live off Mulholland. And I'm pulling around cold water and like there's, I'm driving around. this corner and then there's like a little stretch and I see this like old car this really beautiful looking old car on the side of the road and I'm like oh that's beautiful cars you're always going to end up on the side of the road in old cars I love old cars I have up a couple but like you know if you're going to drive it you have to like build in the time for you might end up in a parking lot somewhere because they just have these random problems all the time right right and I as I get closer to the car, I'm like focused on the car kind of trying to figure out what year is it, what model is it as an old car lover.

And then I see the guy next to it. I'm like, is that Jay Leno? And it was Jay Leno. And I pulled over and then another car had pulled over right in front of me. And at the same time, just got out and we were like, hey, do you need help? And he was like, yeah, if you guys can just push me, I can turn it around and I can coast down because it's an upward hill the whole way. He's like, I can just coast down to the bottom of the hill and someone can pick me up.

And we just pushed the car. He jumped in, Zoom. And like, he was like, thanks guys. As he like rolled away. Horridged. Did he know who you were? We didn't even exchange. We didn't even exchange.

Did you play Jay Leno River? We did. Yeah. It's so funny. But like, it was such a quick interaction because it wasn't the safest spot to be pulled over in this little part of the road and it was a busy time. And it was more just like, I think car guy, like you help the guy. You just know to do it if there's an old car and you see a spot someone's in. Anyways, it was really quick. It was just like, we didn't even think to chit-chat. I was just

like, you need help. And he's like, yeah, I got to try to make a U-turn here and coast down the hill. And like, he was really nice. He was like, thanks a lot, guys, as he like cussed away. And I was like, If there was any Jay Leno story I want to have, that's it. It's something with old cars. And he was like, exactly what you'd hope Jay Leno would be. I mean, I met him before we played the show. And that was really cool. But this was just a cool little like on a Tuesday afternoon.

That's awesome. You know what I mean? So, yeah, it's funny. Like being out here in L.A. And like being a dad now, I'm definitely getting into like guy stuff in a way that I've never been in before. like my lawn, old car. Take care of your stuff.

Real dad stuff, you know. And you kind of grumble and complain the same way you hear your dad or any dad growing up. If I was around my friend's dad's, I can't have nothing. You know, like, like. You kids always break stuff. Just like you don't take care of anything. You're always trying to teach your kids about the lessons of taking care of things.

You're like, we've paid a lot of money for this. You've got to take care of it. I just went down a little bit. It's always like, I always think about like how I sound to my kids. I sound like every dad I knew growing up, growing up. It's just like a grumpy. It feels grumpy, but it's not. It's actually just a mindful caring about the things that we have that we take care of them

because there's something in caring for something and making it, keeping it in, you know, good condition over time. there's a real quality to that that like is important in life I think as a characteristic is a is a is a really good trade I think to be able to take care of things and not just you know leave it out or you know and my you know I get made fun of all the time by my wife and kids because I'm grumbling about something that's like kind of important yeah it's funny I try to like find the balance in that because you know I didn't grow up like I grew up pretty pretty poor so I didn't have a lot of stuff and my dad was very much like, you know, here's your one pair of pants. This is how you hang

them, you know, like take care of it. Yes. Like that vibe. And, and, you know, with my kids, like, I don't want them to feel lack, right? Me too. At the same time, I don't want them to be spoiled either, you know, and it's, I don't know. I haven't figured out exactly how to, how to, how to walk that line yet. Um, I agree. Yeah, I feel the same way. I grew up with, with not a lot and I don't want my kids. And I struggle. And I struggle. with a kind of early on and to this day I think I struggle with some of the poverty mind. Right. You know, this is the only one I'll ever have.

There's some things about that that I think there's some qualities about that that I think are really good in some ways, but to a degree. But it can also hold us back from receiving what I think we all deserve. And I think it's a mindset of can I have or can I have not. Yeah, the abundance mindset. Yeah. Yeah. I believe in that.

You too. And in order to have things and receive things, you have to believe you deserve it and you have to be comfortable to receive it. And you have to not struggle with the idea that it's too good for you. There's something about someone who is willing to sacrifice, like you said, leave money on the table, like literally, and go into a field that is like, service. And of course, in success, it can be really great, but it's not personal. It's really a team success. And I just think it's interesting. It's an interesting choice because like you said,

I think we're the only two that I know of, our company, your company, and I try to think of other companies. Maybe we're wrong. Maybe there's probably, maybe there's one or more out there, but like of artists who literally were succeeding and succeeded and decided to take this other direction where we're actually working every single day in the music business doing management of you know whether it's artist management or with you it's the label we have a label too with it's it's all the things that we have going on it really is like a service industry you're being of service to people every day and you're helping them yeah it's funny like when you're talking three things just came into my mind that, you know, especially when we're talking about, where, where did

these ideas come from? Like, where does mentality come from? You know, and I just remembered three things a young age that weren't printed to me. One is my grandfather before he passed away. He told me, like, he's like, the purpose of life is this, you know? And he said it in Spanish, and I didn't understand it, like for a long time. He said, he said, ser util at proximo, which is like, if you translate literally, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, has utility to the person next to you or something to the proximate person. I don't know. I don't know.

I don't understand it, you know. But then what it really means is to be of service of others. Yeah, to be useful to other people. Yeah. Yeah. To be of service, right. Yeah. What you're saying, right?

Like, because at the end of the day, when, you know, you see what happens when people get older, they either become grumpy and people are just like, oh, get this guy away from us, you know, and like. Ditter. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or they become like these like wise sages that everybody wants to go to their fountain to drink from their wisdom, right?

Fine wine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like, and, and, you know, the way you become that is by adding value in people's lives. So if you, if you don't sacrifice what you want personally for yourself or what's perfect for you, you're going to become bitter because you're never going to be happy. It's like endless, it's like an endless, bottomless pit of like, I want, I want, I want, I want, right? And especially when you're an artist, that quality is reinforced all the time. Oh,

what do you want? We'll get it. We'll get it. You're not happy with this. We'll fix it for you, you know? And it's like, you just become a big baby, you know, and then you become a big old baby. So, and nobody likes that. So if you just want to have friends when you get older, if you want to be surrounded by people that care about you, you have to be adding value to their lives, right? So I think having that mentality with working with young artists is like the most important thing, I think, you know, and we always talk about that internal, it's like, listen, we can't force an artist. If an artist wants to disappear for two years, like, okay, we had a schedule. Yeah, we had this delivery. We're not going to do it. Like the artists then, they're the ones that need to be excited about

the project. They're the ones that are going to have to go on tour. If they're not excited about what they're doing, like, let's not force it. Let's give them the time they need to get excited, right? And you can't force that. You can just be there for a person and add value, you know? And then, you know, I thought of two other things. When I was younger, I had a I saw this Guns and Roses performance, and he was wearing a kill your idol shirt. And I even know there was a band called Kill Your Idols back then. I just saw Kill Your Idols. And it was the picture of Jesus and just like, kill your idols.

I'm just like, what does that mean? Any idols? Kill your idols. Yeah. So that was like a hardcore band, I think. That's what he's wearing? But I'm just like, what does Kill Your Idals mean? And that just like always was like in my head.

And what you're saying is exactly right that like people want to see you be successful in order to then tear you down. Yeah. There's something in our innate nature. I don't know if it's like Jungian or like whatever it is. They want, they want, people love to see someone rise and then they want to see them torn down too, you know? Same. It's like this weird dichotomy.

It's almost diabolical, right? But it's real. And when you feel that as an artist, you're just like, what's happening, right? It's Lord of the Flies. It's that oldest tale. It's like all the way back to like Adam and Eve. It's that, it's the decision we get to make to, to help or hurt each other.

And I think it's the ultimate, this is just my perspective, because I've thought about this before. Because I think it's like a global movement or it can be. And I think it's like, but it's an individual choice. Every day it's a choice. Do we hurt one another?

Do we help each other? And that highest evolved person helps. It's that idea, right? It's that love your neighbor idea. The highest evolution of a person is love is to do an act of love. The lowest evolution is killing someone. So you're reverting to an animal when you kill someone.

And certainly... Or assassinate their character. Or assassinate their character. So yeah. So what I'm saying emotionally, energetically, is we're evolving. And we have to evolve. I think we have to evolve as a species emotionally. And I think we have to make...

The modern world is... is information, the exchange of information. That's the energy exchange now as a mass. We used to be analog. We used to be physical. We used to now where the world is at this point in time. It's digital. But it's still energy.

The mind is the flow of energy through us. And information is energy. And so we are the same way, if I punch you physically, if I fire my words at you or my intentions at you, I'm still sending energy at you, and it's either to hurt you to help you. Right. And so we actually have to become conscious, I think, right? This is just my little musing.

I think we have to be conscious of what our intentions are every step of the way. And is my intention to hurt this person, and it could be big things like someone I know over a long period of time, or could be little things like the guy I see in the store or in traffic. There's, you know, the size of the interaction. I actually think there's a through line. And so what you said, be of service is the fastest cure for that. If your first instinct or inclination is to hurt someone because you're hurting inside and you're just not feeling great that day and you're feeling insecure or, you know,

first thing I always do when I'm angry at someone is checking with myself. Right. And that goes back to the question. That is not common. That is very rare. And what you're talking about, you know, in terms of like we all got to get to the state that we're like, you know, operating out of love and wanting to help there. You know, I love that idea, but it just seems like the world is going the opposite direction.

You know, people are much more reactive. They're much quicker to point to blame at someone else. So, you know, what I'm trying to figure out is like, how do we inspire people to want to check in with themselves, to want to really be motivated to share, to give, to operate out of love. And that's hard, especially when, you know, it's very easy to feel angry and bitter with everything in the world. It's hard in its application for sure all the time, you know, day to day moment to moment. My sense is always kind of like, if I can get 80% right, I'll leave room for me to be 20% like wrong. No one has a perfect self-esteem. And some people, we can inflate

them, we can make them. But like, we are all dealing with the same stuff in different versions of it. And I think to find connectivity through these conversations, it's really good for people out there that need to hear it. And even if it's just one person every week that you're helping, you know, not hurt themselves or I don't know, like just helping them in some way, I think there's a huge effect that it has in the world. Yeah. I mean, I love what you said about music because I agree with you. I mean, I think that's why I'm in it. I think you get to a certain point with, like, everyone who is in music a little bit, they get to a certain point where they decide, are they a lifer or not, you know?

And I think the person who becomes a lifer is a person who really believes in the power of music, right? Like what you're saying? Right. So what's a special about music? I mean, there's a lot of art. But music is like the most democratic of all arts, right? Think about it. You have an idea in your head.

It's almost like synesthesia, right? You hear these things in your head. You record it. You don't even, you're not even. recording on the tape anymore. You're recording into digital ones and zeros right away. It goes ones and zeros into like you're someone else's phone across the whole world. Anyone can listen to it. In an instant, you know, crosses all geographic boundaries, all economic spheres, like, and it just connects people, right? And I think that's the amazing thing about art in general, but musicians

in specific is that, you know, where you're talking about bringing people back and bringing the organism of humanity back as a whole and us realizing that we're all brothers and assistant. and having love and treating each other as if we're all family. The reason why that doesn't happen is because you have society and then you have outcasts. You have people who feel like they don't fit in. And then people come to be at war with their neighbors because they feel like they're not understood by their neighbors or slighter to this. That's like literally since the beginning of time.

And where do artists fit into that? They stand at the perimeter of that. They stand on the border between society and outcasts, right? They can speak to both sides and they can hopefully bring peace between everybody. And think about this. You had a song and you put it out years ago and somewhere really, really far away in like some little town in the middle of Russia. This kid listened to that song probably like a thousand times. Just became his mantra.

Something about it really just like hit him. really poor kid in a village somewhere. He's like, I make them good girls go. It wasn't even that song. It was some B-side. Some B-side song that you didn't even care. You didn't even think about. I love the B-sides.

The deep cuts are the ones who are really more honest. Or it's off a record that you were like, I don't even know how I feel about that record. But that one song makes it all the way over to this little far-reaching corner of the earth. And his kid's listening to it for thousands of times. And he ends up that mantra, he takes that and he holds on to it and he starts to apply it in these other places in his life

and then he works his way through college he becomes this this doctor he becomes a very very talented the brain surgeon and he's now performing brain surgery and saving people's lives and the song is a memory he maybe will hear it from time to time and go yeah I remember that song. That was my song, man. That was my flag. I used to wave it. Like, that was the thing that always motivated me.

And now he's saving people's lives. To think that you powered and were a part of someone's mental capacity to go forward in the world and achieve to me is the most important aspect of why you even released that one song that's now became part of the DNA of someone who is now in the world saving hundreds of lives. Yeah. And I mean, I love that. Now let's go deeper.

The hundreds of lives he saved are people that are now going to invent things that are going to change the world for your kids and your kids' kids. That's what I think the power of music is when we really try to like zoom out and go like, what are we really doing? Right. Some shit is crazy shit. I agree. And I think the amazing thing is that I know this is true for you too, but you and I were

both that kid. Yeah. You know? We needed the songs. I was that kid. I needed that song, some song from an artist that I never would meet, never even, maybe even say play live, right? But that music meant a lot to me.

And records that words. People would dismiss. Right. Like if you put that record or that Good Charlotte record or Midtown record or Cobra Starship or a bunch of other bands we know and love, if you took the music and you put it in front of any educated or serious. or serious music person. Right?

They would dismiss it as not important, but they don't understand the critical part of life that this music speaks to. And that to me is why our genre and world we come from is the most underrated, overlooked genre of music because it's wrapped up in a label of like young or whatever.

It's actually super important in the development of people's. I'm only interested in working in music for young people. I don't want to make music for 30-year-olds. Yeah. You know, it's like I want to impact a person when they're still impressionable and they need it. They need music to help them understand the world. Like that's how you're helping people. When it's like a fashion show, like I don't want to make music for fashion show.

you know, like I want music that will change people's lives, right? And I want to work with artists who are making music for that. Like that's why that's also partly why, you know, I stop making music because even if I love the music, you know, there's just something about being 40 years old and trying to speak to a 15-year-old kid that's like, it's the energy changes. I feel the same way. And it just part of it is also like it just becomes not honest in a way, right? Because it's part of the reason why a young kid connects to someone just a little bit older

than them is because they're still experiencing the same challenges, right? And we're still like immature in our 20s. We're so immature. We still relate to. But by being honest about that immaturity, being honest about the challenges and just like what you're going through, it helps other people who are going through the same things. Yeah. Yeah.

I think that's amazing. Who were your best friends back when you started as far as bands go when you guys first started touring? Like what were the bands that were your guys is like the people you really knew and loved? I wasn't, I was around you guys. But I was, I felt like a little. Maybe I wasn't an outsider and it was just me feeling like an outsider. I always felt like there was this like group of fans that knew each other.

But like who were your friends that you would say like your best friends? Newfound Glory. Yeah. The movie life. I love the movie life. Me too. I love Newfound Glory. Yeah.

I mean, I knew you guys in Newfound. We're tight. Yeah. Yeah. I mean like I used to when we were kids, I used to go on tour and stay and sleep at Chad's house when we lived with his parents. You know, like we're like 16, 17-year-old kids. So Chad was like such a, he knew all the bands.

He was so like cool like that. He was such a special person, you know, because he was always so positive. Yeah. Very positive, encouraging. But a hard ass too. Yeah, he was like a hardcore kid. I remember, well, yeah, he was a hardcore kid playing pop punk, which is crazy. He was a singer of Shai Hulu.

He was singing in Shai Hulu. Luh, you know, and then he's like, is a great guitar player. and it's kind of like pop punk band. But it was really like, it was, you know, post-em-em-mo. I mean, that first Newfound Glory record comes from like the third stage emo world, you know? Yeah. But I just mean like his bar, like he would just push everyone, you know? He was the engine of that band.

I remember he told me something he's like, practice doesn't make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect. If you just go and practice and you keep making the same fucking mistake every time, you're not going to get better, you know? So I just remember he just pushed me to be better. You also pushed me to be better once. I remember once you told me you're like, on our first record, you're like, yeah, your verses are

really good, but you got to work on your choruses. And I just, you know, I wasn't thinking about music then yet at the time, you know. So, you know, it's just like, you know, I like your choruses, so I don't know what I was talking about it. Later, I'd improve it. I was just like, oh, I have to think about, because my choruses were basically. Look at Cobber Starship, dude. Courses. I figured out the course thing. Bang. I figured out the course thing. But I, you know, you were right. When I first was writing, I was just writing choruses. And that's like a very like punk rock trait. Like, your choruses are just basically alternate verses, right? You know, just a little bit catcher, but still wordy, nothing repeats, you know? Those are some of favorite records,

you know, like, saves a day. Like, it's just like, I love saves a day. Me too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A fan had a huge influence me musically. I never met him. Ever. Never met him? To this day? To this day. Bro. Was such a fan of their music. Oh my God. Had a huge influence on me musically. Yeah. I was tied with them, too. I had, I have a funny story about saves the day. Like I remember I saw them for the first time. Saves Day, I think just really changed the game. You know, I think people don't give them enough credit for it now. They don't get enough credit now.

But they changed everything. Like I saw them play. The first time I saw them play was at a VFW show in Boonton, New Jersey. And it was this hardcore band called Ensign. And it was a record release show. Ensign, I think, I can't remember label they were on. But the band that opened, I had never heard of them before. and I see someone like setting up the drums and he's wearing like a puffy he's a really skinny kid skinny jeans

and this is the era where in like hardcore shows everyone's wearing cargo shorts yeah yeah yeah okay like big baggy yeah yeah yeah cargo shorts you know the choker necklaces everything was just like I remember that so there's a kid with like really skinny jeans this is 1997 98 really skinny jeans and a puffy polo jacket it said polo on the back of it really big and I'm like you would never see that at a hardcore show back then, you know, like, like, it was very fashionable. And I'm just like, I thought it was like someone, someone in the band's friend helping send up the drums. And turned out as the drummer from saves a day and they're playing. And like the kid is, you know, Chris, I think it was like 17 at the time. His voice was even higher than than that it is on his record. So he's like singing super high page,

really melodic. I'm like, dude, this band is amazing. Who are they? They're like, hey guys, we made vegan cookies if you guys want any. They're like, you know, they're tabling. They're handing out pamphlets. Like, they're doing all the hardcore scene stuff, you know, but they're playing like this really melodic stuff. I'm like, wow, this is amazing. So about the cassette, they're like, we just signed to Equal Vision Records,

which until then was like a tough guy hardcore label. Yeah, yeah. And it was like, wow, these like really skinny, you know, cute. And that was the show you got to go to as a teenager. As a teenager. That's so cool that you got to be there for that. New Jersey had something very special.

Yeah, New Jersey had a lot of cool opportunity for music fans and guys coming up. Obviously, you end up with a career in music, but like it all was born in, in probably like a 20 mile radius or whatever. Yeah, VFW shows, bro.

Yeah, VFDW shows. I saw Flyer Online, a VFW show. Get Up Kids at the drive-in saves a day, Midtown. That's stupid, man. That's stupid. That's crazy. It's really funny. So, yeah, they're amazing.

And then I was in a band at that time, like a high school band before Midtown called Humble Beginnings that I got kicked out of. So I got kicked out of that band. I'm just like, fuck this. I'm going to school. I'm in school. Why did you get kicked out? Like, I didn't get a good reason.

I can speculate. My speculation is that the dynamic of the band, I just played bass in the band. It was kind of like a fall-up board dynamic where I was the bass player, but everyone knew me. You were the front man. Yeah, I didn't sing.

I just played bass, you know, but the singer was a little bit introverted. Right. You know, and this goes to what I was saying about the human nature. Like, I definitely, like, wanted the spotlight. I was out going. Yeah, yeah.

I went on a show on stage. For sure. And, but I wasn't like boxing anybody out, but sometimes when you have big energy, people can feel boxed out. But that's why, think I realize now when I'm older, like, you know, I have a lot of energy and I can take up a lot of air in the room. I don't do it to suck anybody else's air out, but, you know, sometimes now,

like I try to be, yeah. And I'm, I'm passionate and enthusiastic. I don't feel like I should necessarily have to make myself small because other people don't feel that way. Yeah. But sometimes I do anyway, just out of respecting it. Yeah, it's weird. It's like a dance you do. It's a dance. And you find your, I always say like we get in where we fit in and then we kind of like start dancing together and then sometimes you lead sometimes i lead but like i have big energy sometimes too i'm a front man of a band sometimes i want to take the mic yeah and i can overdo it for sure but when you learn to dance with people you start to get a good feel but they have to want to be in the you know they have to want to be in the group right and some people just begrudge you just because you have that

and they don't yeah and i think that's what happened in it in uh humble beginnings i just feel like the singer just was, uh, just begrudged me for that. And he's just like, bye. And I was like, okay, fuck this. I'm going to school. And did any of those guys go on to be in any other bands that you, that, like, went on? Oh, okay. Unfortunately, yeah. All right. Um, sometimes that's cool. I mean, you know, like, I don't, I don't talk to those guys really, but when I've seen them, it's cool now. Like, you know, what do I have to be angry about, you know? Yeah, whatever. Yeah. But, but, um, but, um, but it was great. I'm glad that happened because then I started midtown, but I was like right at the beginning of midtown, we just,

just had done some rehearsals. Midtown wasn't a thing. And the Saves a Day record came out. The first album came out. I bought it the first day. And I'm like, wow, this is incredible. I remember being in the shower at Brett Hall at Rutgers. Okay. I remember shampooing my hair with herbal essence of shampoo and just thinking, man, I would love to be in Saves a Day. You know? Yeah, yeah. That night, I go into the city to see Elliott play at Coney Island High. Okay. And I'm there in the crowd. And I see this kid. I'm like, hey, dude, this might be a weird question, but are you the drummer from Saves-a-D-E-D-A? He goes, yeah, it's not weird? That's me. So we start talking, end up, we end up hanging. I

played him, you found glory that night. And I was like, I was like, dude, there's another band that kind of sounds like what you guys are doing too, like, and it played me from guys like, wow, this is sick. And then we ended up playing, go back to his dorm with his friends at NYU and played, uh, 007 until like two in the morning. He's like, he's like, actually, we're looking for a new guitar player. I'm like, I'm a bass player. I don't want to play guitar. He's like, Well, if you want to try out anyway. So I tried out for saves a day. That's the funny side story.

Oh, wow. And I did not make it because I was not a good guitar player. I'm barely a good bass player. But I did not make it in saves a day, but we stayed friends. And then, yeah, we played a bunch of shows in Jersey forever together and toured together. And I was on the, I'm on the CD of through being cool. So I'm gonna. And like my music, my hair changed with me.

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bar records. Oh, in the group of people. Yeah, yeah, that's dope. There's a picture

of me kissing my college girlfriend on the actual CD of through being cool. Oh wow. I was 19.

That's crazy. It's so funny. Yeah. But that was like, Like those were like. And then we met shortly after that on the Newfound tour. I feel like it was in Philly. We played together for the first time.

Oh, right. We did play together in Philly. Before Newfound. Before Newfound. Oh, yeah. We played a show together in Philly. That's the first time I met you guys. TLA?

Yes. Yeah. The smaller one next door. Like, uh, maybe it was too late. No, no, no. The Cadillat, uh, um, it was like a bar.

Cadillac Grill. Yeah. Yeah, I might have been that. Yeah. That sounds right. Which I don't even know if that's still the name of it. I don't know if it is. But I remember seeing you guys.

And I just remember just being blown away by your harmonies. I'm like, holy shit. Oh, my God, it's not fair to the twins. We always like that. That's how good Charlotte all started on acoustic guitars, writing songs. No, we thought we were good at harmonies, but you guys just grew crushing there, bro. You guys were good at harmonies. And you grew up in Queens.

I just. Oh, I know. We started this interview about my story. So, yeah, from Uruguay to Queens to Jersey. That's basically the long and short of it. Right. But the one thing that stuck out, the thing I've been thinking, about every single time you start telling stories.

I always go back to, and maybe this just is like, I don't know what it's like to grow up in like the greater New York, New Jersey area, but it always kind of is romanticized for me because of movies and TV and stuff. But like Maryland in the sticks is just a different thing. What's it like to grow up in Queens? I grew up in a pretty like, like, scary area of Queens. The one's scary, but it was just like, I couldn't like run. No, no, no, no.

It was like city. And it was like the city that was like the low income of people who service Manhattan. Right. Right. So I think when I was growing up as a very Hispanic neighborhood, like I remember I wasn't allowed to ride my bike around the corner. Right. We found a butterfly knife.

Me, my brother found a butterfly knife outside my building. And we're like, well, this is cool. We brought at the school. You know, like, it was just like, just stuff. I remember driving one time and like we're driving like some kids on the corner, like through fireworks at our car. Like, you know, it wasn't the same. safest neighborhood, especially back then in the 80s.

You know, the 80s and late 80s, early 90s in New York was like, it was dangerous, bro. Like, you'd go into the city. Absolutely. That was the 80s and 90s. Like, that was the idea of New York. But I just think it's interesting. I'm sitting here in 20, 23 with a guy who's family immigrated here from South America and grew up in Queens and is now a music executive with a wife and kids living in Los Angeles.

Fucking crazy. Living a really, you know, living a what seems like a very fulfilling life. Only in America. But honestly, like that, to me, like, we talk about all this stuff. And we have the luxury of analyzing our feelings and, you know, the luxury of having the tools that we have now compared to what our parents and their parents had to do to get us here. and we are standing on their shoulders. But I always think about, like, yes, I'm hyper-focused on growth and progress and for myself to evolve. But I have the luxury, right?

And there are people who are still trying to get their family stable and get their position on the board stable so that their kids will have the luxury of being able to analyze, how am I doing this? Can I do it better? Can I make a strategy that'll work for me? Your strategies work for you. But I just think it's cool when I think about your story. I'm like, oh, wow. Immigrated here in Queens, New Jersey, goes through the crazy music ride. And here we are in 2023.

You're raising a family in Los Angeles, building a company, and with a wealth of experience and the career you've had. I just think it's cool, man. I think that's a great story. Thanks, bro. It's interesting to hear it all summed up like that. But yeah, I feel very grateful, you know, and I think it's good to remember that. And I think no matter where you are in life, you know, back to what you were saying before,

it's like being grateful for whatever you have is what's going to help you get more. You know, people think that being angry and, you know, is what motivates you? It's like, no, you need to be motivated and be grateful because what's the point in getting anything if you're angry when you get it, you know? So I'm sure you experience. that when you were younger. You know, you get stuff, but you're still angry. You can't enjoy it, you know? What I learned to do is look inside instead of outwards and go like, what's wrong? What, why am I feeling this way? It does start with me. And I learned that all the problems I thought

I had with everyone were actually me. It wasn't them. And 99% of my problems start here in, in me. And, you know, I think that like, why does that always happen to me mentality? You can have it when you're younger and you grow up in a tougher place. But like, you realize like, oh, no, it's me. it's how I feel about myself, it's how I feel, and it's my gratitude, it's all the things that we can work on. Each of us probably have a different one we need, but like 100% gratitude and, yeah, self-awareness, self-reflection. I mean, I think that, I would not, you know, I think that's a very rare thing. I think you should be very, both proud of yourself and grateful that you have that, you know, and I think if anyone listening takes away one thing today, it's just like, just that

moment for self-reflection, looking within, just like maybe entertaining the possibility that you, how do I say this? You know, when I say people, it's when things go bad in your life, taking responsibility for it. It doesn't mean that it's your fault, but it's actually empowering. It means that you have the power to change what you're not happy about. You don't need to look to anybody else to change what you're not happy with. Yep. Right?

Looking inward. I think that's very important. And I think if everyone did that more, including myself, including you, you know, and keep reaching for, I'm never going to stop trying. trying to do bigger shit. Yeah. And be bigger, be better,

be faster. You know what I mean? Faster, I think as we get older, we just can't help. Yeah, yeah. Like,

I do think I can still put some, no, but the last thing to go is that old man strength, you know, the death grip. But like, I'd like to get to a place where I come up with an idea,

I get to the, through the process, to execution faster. And then from execution to success, I get there faster. Like, for me, How fast.

And then what part can I not speed up? Because there is some stuff that you have to like, it just takes the time it takes. But then where are the places where I can actually cut out a bunch of meaningless steps? And like I'm always constantly like kind of analyzing that too, like our process. Are we too slow here? Is it because of X, Y, and Z? And how do we fix that?

And sometimes fixing it is literally just a factor that you can't control. like maybe it's money. Maybe we need more money to put into this to make it go. So maybe we can't do that right now or maybe this. Whatever it is though, like I always want to get faster at like my process to know that I'm like optimized, optimized, optimized. And I think that like it's a that if I obsess over anything, it's understanding process and then optimizing the process. Yeah. And like and then where does that?

in each state area of my life, what does that mean? What's my process with my family? And again, like, it's a little too analytical sometimes. And my wife and kids don't always want to hear it. They're like, okay, dad, not right now. You just go, okay, I'm just going to sit and listen and be a part of the fam. That's a skill too, man. That's a skill.

That takes work to be able to do that, you know? And I probably still can't teach you guys to pick up after yourselves and take care of shit. These stuff. Not like, I got in my car this morning and Nicole had taken it to pick up our daughter from dance. And it was like someone, it was trashed. Yeah. And I was like, in 30 minutes, you guys trashed the front of this car.

Like they had a full meal in it or something and then just left everything. I was like, who does that? Who has a meal? I don't even eat in other people's cars, but it's dad's car. So, of course, which is fine. But who leaves? My kids know there's no eating in dad's car. That's what my old rule was.

But when they become teenagers, they do not give a fuck. Really? I'm just like, walk. They literally are like roll their eyes. So I've submitted that like you guys can eat in my car, but you just have to take your shit out. Like I feel like the guy that's asking for the stapler in that movie. Office space. Office space.

Like if you're going to eat in my car, maybe. you can just throw away your trash. Anyway, so I was so pissed on this morning. I was like, my son doesn't do it. It's the girls. It's crazy. You have three? Two, two kids.

Two kids, okay. A girl's older? She's older. She doesn't go, fuck. She just smiles and goes, okay, daddy. How old is she? 15. 15, your son?

13. They say, tell me if this is true, they say that girls are easier when they're younger and older when they're harder. Harder when they're older. Yeah, I think so. Yeah. But it's also amazing. You have a girl?

No, all boys. Okay. There's a, the girl dad thing is a real thing. Everyone tells me, like, everyone's like, oh, yeah, you just need to have a girl. They'll soften you up a little. It is a real thing. Like, she could do, and honestly, she could do whatever she wants. Wow.

She laughs at me because she's also the one that would stick up for me for anything. Like she's, she's amazing. We have a, the girl that thing is real. It's really cool. It's great. Boys are great too, though. But Gabe, thanks. My brother.

Appreciate it. Great to see you, man. Thank you. Hey, thank you for listening. Hope you guys enjoyed that episode of Artist Friendly. We'll see you next time. This car only take premium gas. I love my engine.

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