Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - Lil Wayne

Episode Date: December 27, 2023

Celebrate 50 episodes of Artist Friendly as Joel Madden is joined by multi-GRAMMY award-winning rapper Lil Wayne. Wayne, who joined Good Charlotte onstage for “Lifestyles of the Rich & Famous” at When We Were Young back in October, has shifted from an off-the-wall rapper — always packing a punchline — to an elder statesman who can still spin woozy bars. After releasing his platinum debut album, Tha Block Is Hot, when he was 17, Wayne continued to make his mark with Tha Carter series, which boasts bonafide classics like “A Milli,” “6 Foot 7 Foot,” and “Hustler Musik.” All these years later, Wayne remains inspired, as evinced by his latest project, Welcome 2 Collegrove, a collaborative LP with 2 Chainz, that was released in November.  ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠⁠Spotify.⁠⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up everybody? I'm Joel Madden and this is Artist Friendly. Hope you're having happy holidays and you're getting ready for a very special New Year's. Today is a very special episode of Artist Friendly because we're celebrating our 50th episode and I couldn't think of a better guest to have on than one of the greatest rappers of all time and one of my favorite rappers of all time. My friend, Lil Wayne, let's go. Bad times I don't want to have bad.

Thanks for coming, dude. Yeah, I'm stoked. I think a lot of times as artists, we go through our own process and we just make art. I don't think we think too much about our process. We usually just follow our instincts and we make shit we like. But to have success at the level you've had success, there's got to be a process there that is, there's a winning formula. There's a process. You know what I mean?

And not that you're thinking formulas, but. replicating success is very hard for people to do. Yeah. My answer, I mean, as far as the process for me, if there's a question, if the question is what's the problem, the simple answer for me is consistency. And it's not about,

it's not about when I say that, I don't mean being consistently successful or making us, in our profession making a hit, making a good, doing, successful with that. I mean, being consistent with that. I mean, whatever your process is, being consistent to your process. And what I mean by that, I literally do this every day.

Yeah. Yeah, like every day. And so the answer to how or why you do it every day, I think, it's being, I mean, the simple, cliche answer is because I love it, but not the true answer is It lies within the inside of me. And I think that's my, I think that's the answer to it all. The true answer is, me trying to find whatever that is inside of me every day. And I've been doing this for a long, long time. And I just still find whatever I find, I put it out there. Yeah.

And I don't aim for success. I don't aim for it to be a hit. I don't aim for it to be this. I just be the best at it at that time, whatever the song was, whatever situation is, be the best me I can be. And hopefully it works. And because the only reason why I say hopefully is because if you ask me to do it again, that's exactly all I can do.

It's the same thing I just did, the best me I can be. And so the process, consistency, reason why, I never know the reason. I am the reason why. Yeah. You figure the reason out, you know. It's funny, me and Benj, we're talking about you. one of the words we said coming from being a fan right and listening to your music but then being around you enough times to get a sense of you right a real sense of you the one word we actually

said top of mind both of us said it was consistent I appreciate I'm glad it is because we you know you've been in this world that we're we're all in this entertainment sphere it's a big it's a big world you meet all kinds of people and I give everybody space to be who they are so I don't really judge how someone rolls everyone has to roll the way they need to to feel safe in a

sometimes hostile environment because entertainment is weirdly can be weirdly hostile in some ways so you find that entertainers all have to set their lives up sometimes when they're dealing with all these different stressors they have to manage and so you see all different

types of approaches to that And then you meet people who you could go, oh, the way he does it, you take notes on how you maybe want to change things that you do. Exactly. And we were talking about you today and the word that both top of mind, consistent. I appreciate it. It's very consistent. Yeah. It makes a lot of sense.

Yeah. I mean, I try to make sense every for the listener, for the observer. And I mean, when you said, you say replicate, you said replicate what you do it. That's, again, that's just being consistent. I mean, being consistent, believing in it. He said, I mean, putting something down that you like, hopefully, in my case is always, I'm a perfectionist, I got to love it. And still, once I give it back, once I give it to, or once I put it,

I'm still going to hear something I should have said. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're picking it apart after, always. That's that, but stay consistent. Yeah. Yeah, so, I mean, and again, doing something over and over and over. it can tire anybody. It's gonna tire anybody out.

You can get tired of, you can get sick of it, or you wanna do this at a certain time, or you wanna go branch off and do it. Oh, if you are, thank God, if you are successful, you wanna bask in that, you wanna live some of that success out. You wanna see what that, if you wanna live that out. And that's when I found out the difference in myself. Right.

And it wasn't about other artists, it wasn't about people that was around me. It's about my friends. Yeah. It was about my friends. was about noticing how they wanted to do, they would be begging me. You know, man, let's go here.

Let's go there, man. We need to go here, man. We need to, like, you want to go to that. I don't want to stay right. I'm loving the success a different way. My love for the success was, it's more like an athlete. Oh, the first shot just went in. Shit, I want to shoot it again.

I'm about to shoot it again. I don't want to go to the club. I want to make this next shot go in without looking. I won't make this next one going like this. I ain't really trying to. And that's how I saw it. And that's when I noticed it. What I mean by that is I probably had to be at least 14 when I noticed that.

And the reason why it would be because my friends were the same age and they would be like, you know, you are who you are. Man, we could go to these clubs. It ain't about us being this age. Man, we could go here. We can go there. We have access. Yeah, because of you. Right.

I mean, I want to go straight back up to my home basement and do another. It reminds me of an athlete. It reminds me of like Kobe. It reminds me of great athletes, great perfectionists, people who want to, it's like self mastery. Yeah. It's in competition with yourself. With yourself, yeah. You know, listen, I think the reality of life is we only get to be ourselves. We were born who we are and we only get to be the best version of ourselves. We can be. What I find a lot of times people get lost in the sauce when they're trying, they're chasing other people's dreams and then you meet someone who's very comfortable in themselves and they can say no with ease and it doesn't feel like a slap in the face it feels like a very thoughtful no yeah that's just

not me yeah and also you can walk away from it and it makes yourself wonder you know like you say you pick up things from people sometimes you see something you might not want to pick but it also helps you and whatever decisions you make uh and like you said you can meet something you know i mean you can meet someone that you can be something that you can be so old so so up about yep you know i mean uh you you get stressing out about or whatever you see somebody else may not even notice it it may not and you may not be but it make you sit back and figure out ask yourself why you know why either why am i so up and about it and or not a why is that person not uh just may us sometimes you can see why like something you can see that very comfortable in themselves and none of this shit that matter to me matters to

him. Yeah. You know what I mean? And so it's interesting. I like to be to him. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes I meet people I respect immediately because I can tell they're just being themselves and they are just doing their thing. Yeah. I think that's when I met you, because I had listening to music for so long, immediately I knew I was like, this guy's different. I appreciate it. You know, and I think we see those people along the way. And a lot of times the great people tend to be that way. Every now and then you'll kind of see something that's been constructed. And you know that it's a... A little bit of a house of cards.

Yeah. Yeah. And then you meet someone that's great and you're like, yeah, you're different. Yeah. Definitely. So what age did you finish kind of like the school journey? 15, 15-ish. I was, I had just put out a, like around 14. I just put out the black that's had my first solo album.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I was in a... Classic. I was in 10 grade. And that's when my mom was like, you know, that's enough. It was time to get your tutored or something. Right.

Just go get your diploma or something like that. She figured out that I was only going to school because I knew I was, I was only going to school because I was on TV every day. I just wanted to. Right. Yeah, so I really wasn't. And also, she knew my school was, the schoolwork was, I never studied. You know, she's like, you don't even, I never see.

She's like, you're too busy to study. You're always rapping and you're bringing in straight A's. Right. So the education, either the education system ain't working. Yeah. Or either you don't need, you're a little too smart for that. we moved on, I went to college. And you went to college?

Yeah. Oh, wow. University of Houston. Oh, wow. Yeah. And of course I got way too busy for that too. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, school was pretty easy for you. No, I wouldn't say, I mean, paying attention was pretty easy for me. Right. Yeah. Also, you know, my mom, my mom, I never, she's not strict, but she means, she mean when she says, say what she mean. And so I was, I was the only child for a long time. I got a little brother now, shout out Samaj for a long time.

And so, you know, I listen. I listen to what she said, and listen to it. So I would take that to another parent's house, another friend's house for the weekend. I would take that listen to the way I'm very disciplined. By the time she's coming and picking me up, that person's parent or that brother,

that person's brother, sister, something that's telling my mom how good I was over there. I forgot he was here. He's so quiet and things like that. And so they're telling their kids the whole time I'm over there, you need to be more like. Yeah. You need to be more.

And I hate being that kid. Now you're like, oh, you know what I mean? But that's why I get to listen. I mean, that's what, so when the teachers say something, I paid attention. Yeah. It was easy. I always told my friend, you know, they're struggling. It's like, I'm not, I'm not no wizard.

Like, it was on these exams. You know, she actually taught us that. She actually said it. She actually told us where to find it in the book. You just ain't do it that day. Yeah. So it was, you know, it was nothing. It was just pay attention a lot.

But I have a theory about that. I think emotional intelligence is a real thing. Mm-hmm. And emotional intelligence, I think, is the tool or the IQ we have when we're in a room with a bunch of people, how to maneuver through that room with as little conflict as possible. It's almost a survival skill. Okay. Right. So I think good parents, when they raise their kids well, they teach their kids how to maneuver through a room with as little problem as possible.

Of course. Then you can go out into the world. world and you can maneuver through the world with as little damage as possible. What I feel like in the music business, if that's life, if that's a metaphor for life, because it can be sometimes. If I can move through the business with as little problems as possible, I can get to my goals faster, especially in the early days when I didn't know anyone, didn't have anything, and didn't have a resume to back me up. And I noticed that with my own kids was school. I always tell them like, look, I don't care about school.

I care about you having the experience you're going to have. I care about you getting something out of it because you've got to be there until you don't anymore. And I think that when you come to the conclusion that you're going to go off and have a career in music and an art, then you don't really need to go to school because there's nothing there that's going to further your music or art. And I knew at 15. and so we left home at 17 and we were off so school didn't really matter. I never really had a idea of how I'd go to college. I always kind of wanted to go to college because I always felt I respect educated people,

something about that that has equated to smart for me. Even though I think we both know lots of smart people who never went to college because there's different kinds of smart. But I think emotional intelligence is one, you know, part, your mom probably imparted a lot to you. And then you also, I think, have to be born. Of course. I got to be in the year. And then environment as well will cause you, I think, to become aware and have gut instincts and be able to maneuver and sense things. I'm gonna, and like my music, my hair changed with me and has to be able to

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a lot of stuff that was huge for me in my emotional intelligence my environment yeah and have my mom telling me every day you're not gonna be this right so you must bring in great grades so she so you not couldn't we had to sit down and talk

about i bought a c in that right you know i mean like if a c came through there what this about or what you you don't know this subject or you you know what's this what's this c if i need to see the c be a b next time yeah you know i mean next time it need to be a a a and it was only and i always knew it was not because you better be a doctor or you better be a law or you better be smart only because you better not end up being what we see around here right you know and so that was another and that was another driving force to pay attention yeah you know I mean because I can't break a see it back home so and also while I'm while I'm paying attention I'm actually paying attention and so what that means is it actually does help me and my idea that helped me in my career yeah

regardless of the reason at the beginning, you start to understand. You know, what I always say is what we think is our weakness is actually our strength. So you grew up in a tough place, right? You get to see a lot of raw reality. Everything. Everything. And where you could say that affected me in this way, that way, lots of people could argue that that was a negative circumstance, which it was in a lot of ways.

Statistically. In this way, yes. Yeah, but you could also say that it tuned you up. Yeah, definitely. And gave you capabilities that you wouldn't have otherwise needed. Yeah. That served you to this day. Very well. Yeah.

I think that there's something about a strong woman. Yeah, definitely. You know, I married one. I was saying about the strongest woman I know to, I've been with her for 17 years. There's a reason why. Yeah. There's something about. the fierce, strong nature of her when it comes to the parts of life.

Reality. Yeah, the reality. Reality. Yeah. That's it. That's a good word. Yeah, I read on. And mothers can be that.

I think all mothers have that fierceness to them. Yeah, the MVP, the most valuable. Yeah. Yeah, I was watching someone tell. I was watching one of my shows that I watch a lot today, and there's two guys on there at debate. What's that show? It's called Colin, The Herd.

Shout out. Shout out of my man, Colleen. I know that show. Shout out of Jay Mack. It was him and Jay Mack talking. It was talking about MVP and Kyle was trying to tell him. Like, you know, he was like, you know, you got to understand what value with me. Yeah.

He's like, you know, it's not about the most great, the most guy with the best statistics. So like, because that's the, if it's about the best statistics, then that's how you end up with such and such getting it because they did. He's like, but the team sucked and all that. Yeah. And then, you know, Jay Mack might be like, well, no, but the team are best and he's the best play. But he's not the best player on his own team. He was like valuable. So he bought it to license.

He was like, listen. It was like, who's the most valuable person in your family? He said, and you said, your wife, right? J. Mac was like, I mean, how about make the money? You know what I mean? And he was like, yeah, I make the money. She knows what to do with it. That's right.

Yeah, and that's when you say what's real. It's so true. Money is gas. Yeah. It's gas in the tank. And then it's also a resource. It provides. Yeah.

it really i just look at it as a resource it's fuel we use it to fuel things and if we use it well it will fuel it further yeah if we burn it you can also burn fuel yeah you can burn that money yeah so not to say that you you don't like to light a little bit of money on fire every now and then right we could argue from your perspective i could do something with my money that to you looks like i'm lighting it on fire but for me there's value whatever that value is definitely there's lots of ways to art to definitely That's why I always, with artists, I kind of say with money when it comes to money, it's looking at it the right way.

It is good to spend money. You have to. There's an abundance we need to have. But it's spending money that you actually want to spend versus if you feel your, if you feel you're keeping up with someone, you're always going to be burning the money. Yeah, of course. And you'll never keep up. Yeah.

Because there's always going to be a richer guy. Yeah, definitely. There's going to be, and there's going to be fools. We've seen, think about this. Over the last three decades, right? You've been here almost three decades of this, right? Almost. But the better part of three decades, how many people have you seen come in, light it all on fire,

and you can't even remember their name right now, but you'd have to go back and really try to remember who they were, what their song was, or what their thing was, or what their big thing they were selling was and the lifestyle they were living, you likely could name dozens or hundreds. Yeah, sometimes you see them. You see them. Yeah. And you kind of see them and you go, ooh, man, that. They can't end up if you're, if you're still doing what you're supposed to do the right way, they see you and they go, ooh, you're still here. Yeah. Yeah. Sustainability is a thing. If I can't have my cake and eat it too, right? But I can, I can find the middle of that.

Yeah, you can. You can have some cake and eat some cake. Yeah, it's definitely. Right? And you can do both for a long time. All positivity. Yeah, exactly. Sustained both.

Because I think we have to be aspirational for kids who grew up with nothing. So I came from nothing. So I always think it's important for us to find things we like, obtain those things, and enjoy those things. Yeah. And strike the balance of that feel. to me, I feel like it's responsible. It's life, actually.

It's life, right? Like it's the ballots. This idea that we can just have whatever we want, whenever we want it, however we want it, it's kind of just a false fantasy. Of course, I mean, and it's one that we don't live, actually. It's actually being lived out. And people are not around us,

but the people actually, something that don't know us, and that's just what they think we could do. Yeah, they think we can do what we want, when we want, how we want. You know what I mean? Trust me. Trust me, they always do, you know what I mean? Somebody always see, be like a statement may get thrown around or coming around. It never had never happened to, like, actually, it had happened to me way before what happened to you.

Yeah. Yeah. And so you have to, also, you know, unfortunately, you may live a life experience of you that teaches you that. Yeah. You know what I mean? All you can view from the side and see it happen to someone. else and you see what you shouldn't do or should do, things like that. So definitely you have to, you have to, hopefully you have that balance. And like you say, you can be aspirational in many ways.

So you can be that way to appear. You know what I mean, someone, like I said, someone on the sideline just looking and trying to figure out, okay, why is this person that way? Maybe they send it to themselves. That's why this person is so successful. That's why this person is still here. hopefully you can be aspiration in that way as well yeah there's a there's a there is a thoughtfulness to it and it's just smart yeah yeah yeah if you don't yeah i mean because you i mean if you don't know the downside to it'll teach you the downside to like yeah you can learn from others or life will teach you very fast and life will always teach you yeah i always kind of feel like life is is the perfect parent. It's harsh sometimes, but it's kind too. And I think what I always try to pull out of these

conversations is, I always think about the person listening. And I do this because I used to do this and I still do this when I wrote songs. I always thought about if I was this person, I was no money, didn't feel like there was opportunity. I had a low self-esteem. I felt I was different, but I didn't have any confirmation of it. The world at that point had kind of just, up until about 19 was when things started to kind of move. That's when I started to get self-esteem. I was like, oh, I thought I could do this. I can do this.

And so it's hard to move forward in life if you don't feel you could be successful. Right? And so the message to most people is you can't be successful. That's like generally, I think, except for, I think, artists, we tell people you could be successful. But life in general, society in general, they box people into labels and boxes and they go, you're from here,

it's very hard to be successful. Or success is magic. It's all magic. I mean, for us, when we came up, definitely. But today, it's a little different message right now when it comes to successful if you ask me. Yeah. And I think today it's a bit more,

a little less magical. Right, it's obtainable. Yeah, it's obtainable, and it's a lot of less magical because you can eat a cigarette and a certain way you did it, you know what I mean? Certain way you did it, you might have you eating cigarettes on Jimmy Fallon show. That's right.

You know what I mean? You know what I mean? You know what I mean? And I don't shun that. I don't, you know what I mean? It's just I make sure I pay attention. Yeah, observe it. You know what I mean?

And get whatever. but I can't get out of it. Yeah, be aware of it. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the only, when people ask me about, you know, I get asked a lot, like, what was the difference between, you know, because you've been here using all these, all them different levels of music, when music was dis and what was the difference?

What's the difference now is that you actually asking me this? Tomorrow I'm gonna find out that you just put out, you already put out a mixtape and you, this, that, you got that, and it might pop off. That's the difference. So whereas when I was doing this, you knew the person you was sitting across from you don't do this and you can't do this and you won't try to do this and you won't ever like I don't even know nobody now that don't rap right including friends right yeah because all of a sudden like you said they've all all all of a sudden they're all 19 they are you at

19 feeling oh I can do this oh I can't they all of a sudden and it's they getting that that boost that that motivation from that and saying that they being that person that that's You know, like I told you, they're becoming that person, I bet that person can do whatever they want, when they want, how they want. Right. You know what I mean? And they're saying this and figuring I can do what I want,

when I want, how I want. That's also the danger, though, because what we know is we actually know the cost of things. So not only do we know the cost of what they're portraying, we know that you can make things look a certain way for this much, but then to actually have it like that. So, trust me, man, I'll be looking. Sometimes I'll be looking,

and I'm myself, you know, thank God I'm who I am. I got to live something. You know what I mean? And sometimes I'm even looking like, like, you got more of that? Like, every time I see something, I'm like, that's, I know it. I wouldn't even, I don't have that to show you. That's put up. That's right.

You know what I'm like? Yeah, that's how I feel. You know what I'd be sometimes looking like, because I don't even know who you are. Right. So I don't even have it. Well, you can rent? No, sometimes, you know, sometimes, you know, we also know what's real and was not. Yeah.

Sometimes you can see like, God damn you, who you are again? And then, you know, all you got to do is they'll show you. You go check them out. They got a show coming up. The whole crowd about to sing the song back to, you know, what song is that? Yeah. So is that, that's what I mean by. I think.

Like you said, obtainable and it's a little less magical. Obtainable, I think sustainable is a real word. That's the part. So to be a spectacle is one thing. So I understand the spectacle of the modern careers. There are these artists that you, well, you could say at the very early stage of their success, they are, they're just a spectacle. They've created a spectacle and it's gotten everyone's attention. That is the one you have to kind of go, well, we'll see.

We'll see if there's talent under there. And some of them do have talent. Yeah. And some of them don't. And the spectacle's gone and you don't even remember. and then it just kind of gets sad and weird because you're kind of watching them try to keep having a spectacle

and it's like really unsustainable to be a spectacle. Yes. You can only do the trick a few times before everyone's like, all right, now show me a new trick. And I need to see more blood this time and more mess until you're dead. And the nature of entertainment is like gladiators. All right?

So they love to see the gladiators fight and they love to watch them die sometimes. And that's another part of our, of our careers they don't talk about is the lifespan of artists people love to mourn. Of course. That's why I, for the most part, I don't, I struggle to publicly mourn because it's so sacred to me that a real person has passed. But to everyone, it's entertainment.

So everyone, and I get it, people are, it's not that they're being negative, although some people can be, you know, in social media land, there's certainly people who joke and it's harsh out there. with how people talk about real people in their lives. Definitely. And they're not real too. That's not real. It's Mickey Mouse at Disneyland.

I want to punch the guy in the suit to see if there's a real person in there. But I think that an artist makes art. I was really excited to talk to you because I was a fan of your art. And then the way that my brain works is I analyze everything. I always want to know like, how does that work? How does that guy? how did he become who we became? A lot of times the answer is it's special.

That's the magical part. That's the spiritual part. That's the part where I like, you were made different and that's just how it is. But we can try to see what part of the environment, what part of the person, your mom, or the guardians, angels around you that you met that maybe even just for a short time inspired you,

what part made you find your way to, like when I think of Baskiat, because they've never seen a Baskat painting I don't like. I've never heard a little Wayne verse that I don't like. I appreciate you. It's just that's when you're a fan of art, you just like their version of the art, how they use the paint.

Exactly. And then I think about this, 50 years of hip hop, which is ironic, it's interesting, or serendipitous. This is my 50th episode of this show. And I was thinking about 50, 50 years of hip hop. And then I was thinking about you and you've been here for more than half of hip hop.

I don't know if you've if you've thought about that, but I have. Yeah, I thought about it to why I even questioned the 50. I was like, they sure it's just 50. Can't just be 50. That's what I thought at first. Is it just 50? I was like, what are we counting? I was like, what they started counting at?

But I guess. So 50 years of hip hop and you've been in hip hop for more than half of the time. it's existed. We all know that you're on every, let's say every top 10, right? In every category. When you start, and maybe like an athlete, you think I want to be the greatest, right? And I think that's the way we all have to go into the thing we're choosing to do, is I want to be great.

Of course. Was it 15 when you were like, I want to be the greatest? Or was it 21? No, it was the start. It was a moment. Because I always wanted to be with cash money. And the only reason why I wanted to be with them is because they were cash money, and they already had rappers and that was known.

They were the best. They were the best. Yeah. In my eyes, like you said, to me, they were my artist. They were my favorite artists. So when I got with them, it was never a competition, but the environment, the environment was always, you know, let me hear yours. Let me hear yours.

And then you see the reaction off if they hear one person's verse, they start talking about it in their regular day. That's how I always used to look at things. It's like, you know, late on in the day, they might, hey, what did he say? What did he have said earlier? And it didn't reveal, it revealed itself in real life. And whatever he said or he or she said earlier than came out in life. And so I was like, so that's when I noticed I would tell myself, okay, I don't think my rhymes,

they're not coming, my lyrics aren't coming. I said that was the first time I noticed that it ain't how I say something. It's actually what I say. You know what I mean? So it was, I mean, I guess that was what it was. It was, like I said, it was no competitive nature, but it was just the environment. And so that made me always, obviously, when you compete in, you want to win.

Yeah. You want to, like I said, you probably could ask everybody else who was in. It probably was not a competitive nature. This was just me that I was the youngest. And so to me, it was always, I need to be the, and that translated to songs, and that translated to life, that translated to everything. Like, I need to be the best, if not the best.

I need to be one of the best. and not just good, not very good, I need to be great, and I'm aiming to be the greatest. You always stood out. That's another, yeah, you want to stand out. Yeah. You want to stand out. And that was another thing, too, you know, that's so cliche from a lot of people.

Hey, you want to be the greatest. I want to be the greatest. And then you know how they throw it around now. Everybody's a goat. Right. So it kind of makes it a little more difficult to actually be great because you got a lot of ghosts that's not great. You know, and they know, so if you're not great,

they know what they're being the great is. Right. So that just, so that lets you. know that let you know what you're dealing with the crowd and let you know okay the crowd said this guy this guy this person they're great they're goat so that makes it difficult that's it there's my i love a challenge and there's my challenge so i got i know my crowd now so if my crowd they're not lowering their standards that's just their standards you know what i mean so that's my crowd i want to step over all that and i want to still be viewed as yeah you're the goat you're

the goat you're the goat what about when i ain't even in the cat ain't even in that category he's the goate So the goat, I want to stay there. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, goat is a nice compliment that people throw around now. Yeah. But there's a difference. Yeah, of course. And I want to make sure that I stay.

You always stay there. Yeah. Who was your favorite? Hey, and Missy. Yeah. When I was much younger, it was Missy. And then even when she kept, she started doing her own stuff, like, you know, I mean, not, when she started really putting out albums and stuff,

that and going crazy and I'm opening up more. I used a lot, you know what I mean? Just her ability to not care of, it wasn't that she wasn't caring. It was her art. Yeah, she was artistic. I loved what she did with her paint. Yeah.

And I mean, so, and then Jay, and Jay was, to me, was the, you know, I mean, it was almost like Baskia and Andy Warhol. You know, Jay, to me, you know, you already know, everything he'd do gonna be good. Everything you do gonna be great. So, yeah, you take from it.

Yeah. Yeah, and he never seemed to concern himself too much with what other people thought. I know. He always moved. You got to worry about yourself. Yeah, he moved with a lot of, it's smooth, it's confident. It's like he knows they have that everyone's always going to have an opinion because the mass group of people that are consuming want to argue about what their favorite is because there's something that makes you, it's like football teams.

It's like, I wear this jersey and you wear that jersey and we can argue about. our team and people take a lot of ownership over artists and their art when they're a fan. He seemed to just move with it in a way that I thought was presidential. Yeah. And you did the same thing. And that comes from being around baby and slim. Right. Yeah.

Just watching the way they move and moving how they move. Also, you said about Jay, that's what you're saying how when we put him and people like him and myself, you also have to think about that's what. the differences because when we put something out or when he first came out all of a sudden like you said the talk is always going to be who's the best who's the greatest is jane is great is it's interesting right yeah they got so many people put stuff out that that's not what you say after hearing that's not your first thought not your not it's not it's not your name no way in your head right now it's no way in your head i love your song i love it play it again i love it's great i love it

no but he who's better than him is it him and it's just those that difference those difference guys Yeah, I love being one I know. You are one of them. It's interesting too. I think also there's something about being able to exist in every moment of the culture through time. So when you think about the 90s and you think about Biggie, Pock, there's a handful of people that you kind of think that stand out at the time as pop culture relevant, culture relevant, and every part of, of the conversation they touch and then the next

you go to the next decade and you you you guys have been able to exist in every part of the culture through time and there's something about longevity artistically but then there's longevity of life

and being able to build a life that like we talked about sustainability and livability and being able to live and be here in a decade is a real part of success. Like, I want to live a long time. I don't want to die young. I want to live a long time. I have my own legacy in music that I love. It's different. And I like where I exist. I have a different calling, right? You're kind of cursed with a size and scale of legacy that I think is,

it's not that you were given a gift, but you were blessed, right? So you earned it and you actually have to do the real work, you don't get to, you know, zonk out and wake up 20 years later and have this. And you have to suffer, the things you have to suffer, and you get to be on all parts of the ride. But when you're, when you find yourself in this kind of precarious position where you're a legacy, one of the greatest, right? You have to respect it and show up for it and not reject it. Of course. So it's a different size job. You have to embrace it. Yeah.

Yeah. So it comes with a different stress. Yeah. So as great as it is, there's a whole side. Equal to the greatness is the stress of managing it, right? Exactly. And then how do I live in that success and look after it, right? You're almost like the steward or the caretaker of this blessing, right?

And then I also have to be a dad and be a person in the world with my own. own like feelings and life and experience and all that and I got to manage all that and then I got to go out into the world and act like everything's cool because that's what everybody wants yeah because that's not you all the other stuff don't matter doesn't matter and it does matter to you of course because I would venture to say that's the only way I got back in front I'm able to stand back in front of you yeah yeah by taking care of stuff that don't matter to you right because you know when you think about it too like you you you have kids I got kids and I always think about my kid and I go Okay, my experience is my job and I'm making money and I'm doing all the things I'm doing.

And I'm really grateful. My wife is a great mom and she's taking care of them. And that is a blessing. But then I also have to think about how they relate to me as their dad, not as the guy that, you know, they just saw these guys come up and say they love my band or this or that. But you also want them to have a relationship with that so they understand it. it and finding the balance of helping your kids make sense of all of this shit. To me, it's been the thing I've been the most perplexed by is just, I want to make sure that they're not overwhelmed with the size of all this shit

because they're around their, you know, their granddad is a legend, their aunt is a legend, their mom, me, we're all, and I still want them to have their real life experience where they get to be them and they have a shot to be great in their own way, whatever that is. Of course. And that's been the most perplexing thing as a dad is just going like, I want to make sure, I think just by us asking the question will be better dads for it.

Definitely. I don't know if we'll ever have the answer. Yeah, but I mean, you live too far as, as long as you keep trying to find the answer, then you're on the right path. Yeah, that's great advice. Yeah. For me, it was what you said. They don't, so they don't have the, you know what I mean?

And I thank God. because I would definitely love if they did. They don't have the famous aunt and the famous grand. So that's what sometimes I feel where they get their real life from. When they get to, yeah, when they get to leave from mom's nice place, from dad's nice place, and they got to go by grandma. You know, they got to go by, and then they get to see like, okay, this, you know, we don't, you get to,

and I lived that out by just, by, when I was a kid with my mom, just by the way, my mom would bust her ass. on the own. Yep. She refused to not give me the nice stuff, whatever the hell it was I wanted. And, you know, it's just me going by a friend. Right. You know, a cousin or something just seeing that night,

it ain't like that for everybody. Right. You know what I mean? So that right, that was my, like you said, that was me coming, getting my reality. And also, you know, now I got to take that in and figure out what I do with that. Right. It's a part of reality.

Like, I don't want my kids to feel poor. Yeah. But I want them to be able to have empathy. and respect for where when I take them home, I don't want them to feel bad for me. It ain't even, like it ain't even about that, but it's about just reality. Yeah, it wasn't even, it's just about like,

you know, when you're by dad, dad's reality is, you know, he's in that working or whatever. It might hit me argue with a, what a coworker, you know, somebody, staff member or something. That's dad's problem. That's work. Yeah, and whatever, moms dealing with. But when they go over,

there, you know, and when they come back, you ask things like, what, what, how's little such and such? He's in jail, you know? Yeah. And, you know, too, when you ask, come around me, you might ask me, well, how's Bree? How's Bree? How's Bree? She's right there. She's good. She's doing good.

And it's different. Yep. You know, and because I'm living that. You know, so when I ask, how's such and such, I can't hang with him no more because he bought a gun to school. Right. You know, so it's like, what? You know, so that's just, but I remember what I mean.

and what I mean by them is, by that is being able to tell me just like that. Right. And understanding, knowing and not having a question after it. Yep. You know, not being, why? Why did they do? Why did this? Why did?

Because they already figured it out. And that's because, you know, they got that balance. And that's, they figuring, they meet in that middle. And they're having that cake and eating it. And they figuring and they knowing how to meet that middle ground with that cake. It's always about the middle. Yeah. In the middle, we can't have some and eat some.

Yeah. And keep some. You got to figure out the balance. And that is the truth of life is reality is complex and it's like layered and nothing is as simple as it seems. Of course. There's always complexity to everything. The reality.

That's probably the best word. The reality of me and Nicole being your mom and dad. It is cool. And then there's also complicated, complicated, complex things as well. Yeah. Right? So that's just the truth.

Them know how to navigate it all. And yeah, you just, you talk about it, you figure it out some shit, you don't talk about until later some shit. You trust them to be, you trust whatever it is inside of you, you know, whatever it is. You trust that, that's inside of them and they'll figure it out. And that's, at the end of the day, you also, I mean, when they could get to a certain age, you depend on them. Yeah, you do.

You depend on that little, you depend on that knowledge that they have that, like you said that blind that blind that blind intelligence yeah you know from being just you know you don't even know you you don't even know you just you know you're just you're you're you're very you're innocent there's an honest innocent yeah yeah it's an innocent honest reaction and they tell you exactly what they think exactly without filtering it yeah or making because what happens in our line of work kind of being like when you right in our line of work when you go to Asia So when you go at like China or something, and they don't know that they don't know that they're being rude by telling you you fat.

Yeah. Yeah. Or like Germany. They're Germany. They're like, you've gained weight. Yeah. Oh, tell us. Why have you gained weight?

Yeah. Like, you're like, damn, you're German. They're the German interviews. Yeah. You know what stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, it's funny. There is something about that. That's why kids are so great. I saw a clip of you and your son, Cam. Yeah. Courtside at the Lakers. Yeah. talking and I thought it was one of the best father-son clips I've seen I you know I think we all are

interested in how other people navigate parenthood because I think growing up I didn't have a model so I did so I tend to always look for models for like good dads that feel real it feels it feels it feels like they're not putting on a show they're actually just a good dad they love their kid. I constantly look for people out in the world when I've noticed people parenting whenever I do, because I'm always questioning like, am I doing this right? I feel like I'm a kid. I don't feel like I'm the adult here. Sometimes. And I think sometimes that's good. But I saw this clip of you guys, and it was cool. It really felt like two guys, two friends watching a game and enjoying it and just chopping it up. It was like a little glimpse into a picture of. A picture of

of fatherhood that I thought was was purely good. Yeah, that's good. Thank God for those moments too, trust me. It's an accomplishment. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I mean, I've been, I mean, you'll be able to see, you'll be able to see pictures of me and Cam Corset for over the years. And the kid, he knows so much about sports, you know,

and he's so much about everybody, you know, I love sports. So just going to a game, you know, it's been different over the time, it's been going to a game with him is, we damn they don't even watch it because we know. know so much. We love the, we love the sports so much. Man, when you, like, when you say a friend, that's why we can say a friend sometimes, you know, you could meet or see a friend and y'all can just talk forever. It's the way you got to remind yourself on the time sometimes. Me and my, me and my bro Skip, Skip Bellis, we like that. We start, and they ain't got to be a subject

on sports. It'd be a life subject. Both of us love to talk and love to pick each other's brain so that can last 30 minutes and it was supposed to be two seconds. You know, so something like that. And that's me and that's Cam and I as well as the rest of my kid. Can you find something? You find that with each kid. With each kid, you have your thing. Yeah, you find that with each kid.

Y'all have, you have that moment. Yeah, it's like you're... I mean, you have that in each way with them all, because they're all different. Yeah, it's like your point of connectivity is usually around something you both love. Yeah. And with each kid, I know with my daughter too, she's the same thing.

It's different with her. It's usually our opinion. on some music or some clothing. Yeah, I was just about to say fashion for me. Yeah, it's like that. And then with my son, it's sports, and lately it's been video games. I've been playing video games with them.

That's been cool. It's cool. Kids or teachers? I play with their games with them too, yeah. Which game do you play? I play a bunch of sports games, but they know only sports with me. Yeah.

You love sports. Yeah. You could be a sports announcer if you want. Yeah. Easily. Yeah. Yeah. And I would also aim to be great at it. Probably be a coach, too.

Yeah. That part too, but I think I'll be too in love with it that I think my, I'm not sure if my confidence level, my motivation level would be too over the board. Right. Because I love it too much. So, and of course, you know, if you, when you hate, I would hate to fail. I would hate to fail. I would hate to lose.

Right. And now, you know, so. Yeah, music is a different sport. We can win a lot of different ways. Yeah. And sports is only a couple ways to win. Also, you know, sports have rules. Right.

And what we do doesn't is art. Like you said, give me my canvas, give me my paint. And it also, when you said about, you didn't ask it, but you were saying about how I lasted through the different decades and styles of music and all that. And when, you know, at any given time, I could have went throughout music was gone. And those ways, you know, those ways die.

And then the new route start. And if you were on one of those dying ways, and dying rouse you know you want to be you just did you're gonna die with it something i never did i never done that so when people always ask this question you know like what do you listen to now you can i swear bro you can go with it probably 20 years ago and my answer is always the same it's because obviously if i'm asking it's the same is because of the truth and i don't listen to no one right just i'm i'm too busy listening to what i just did and depicting it and and trying to figure out or what I shouldn't have said or what I shouldn't.

Literally, bro, literally, I would not lie to you. You know when I hear something? And I literally would live for this moment, too, because it's my moment to hear something different. It's when I was driving in my, when I lived in Miami, I was driving, you know, I didn't need no chauffeur, nobody, no sprint or nothing, driving my own cars. It's when you first get in the car

and you cut it on and whatever's on the radio, I used to die. I used to literally live for that moment because the only time I'm going to hear something else. and it's so, and it feels, it's so new to me. You know, I'm like, what is this? It's the biggest song in the country. You don't even, you know, you don't even know,

like it's number one song in the country, food, that's what it is. But what I do, what I would do is, what I'm doing with my art is I'm in there, and I'm the guy that's in whatever warehouse he's in. He don't comes out, he don't come out, so he don't know what the hell's going on in this world. Right.

But when he opened that little shade garage up or whatever, when he comes show you the art, they put it to whatever's going on to, or whatever, and I make sure that, I'm not told them, I use the term another day, man, I'm just shooting my shot every time

and hoping, hoping is valid, hoping is relevant, you know, and my, my confirmation to myself is your reaction, and your love or dislike

or dislike for what I'm doing. That's my confirmation. that I probably need to stop or I need to, are you waiting for the next one? Yeah. And thank God they still be waiting for the next one for me. Well, you're one of those. You're one of those.

And so what I try to teach them is you can't, that's the sacrifice that you have to take. It is. You can't listen to everybody else. I'm sorry. You can't do what everybody else doing. I'm sorry. That's the sacrifice you have to make if you want,

if you believe in yourself and your art. And the success from it, If you want to find out, if you're making that sacrifice, then what can I do? What I'm doing? You know what's interesting? Been a great father

and figuring out this middle ground. Yeah. Yeah, that's what I'm doing with this sacrifice. You know what's interesting is probably why you enjoy sports so much is because you can. Yeah. You've committed, think about this. I don't you mean.

Because you've committed your life to music. Right? You are music, essentially, right? You live it. So it's a life of like servitude almost to the music, to the art. And this might sound dramatic, but hear me out, okay? Because I can be a little dramatic because I like to wax. I like to, I like to think in philosophical terms because I like for people listening to get an idea of something that they can take and apply to their own craft. Right? Maybe they're their craft is cooking or or they're making their little their brand or they're trying to build something and be great. Yeah. They need to aim upwards and you are up. Okay. Your life is one that is up and that is a decades of work of commitment.

There's all the reasons why it is, but it is. The reality is is that the aspiration for if someone's starting out in any avenue to have success to go forward, they have to aim up. Yeah, you got to. And they have to believe that it can be done. Yeah, the belief part is right. And so what's the point? If we don't believe we can have success,

we are not going to go forward with and actually try, like really try. I believe that what we do with music and then us being able to have a conversation about it actually does give the world a conversation to listen to that is good. And someone could be listening to it and it could change. I say helpful. Yeah, helpful and change an idea they have. So to think that you've committed your life to making your art has basically eliminated the idea that you can ever listen to something in a in a consumer type way and just enjoy it and just go, oh, this tastes good. If it was food, if the metaphor was food, you would taste everything they, every ingredient and you would know exactly how much they put in and something would bother you and you couldn't enjoy any food. Right?

Yeah, I get it. So with music, not only will it cloud your ability to be clear and convicted, it will fuck with your process. So you've had to protect your process to just create. So you go to sports and you can actually watch and root for a team and they can lose and you can be like disappointed, but you can live. And you can actually consume it. I can't live when the Packers lose.

But go ahead. Yeah. Did they win this week? Yeah, they did. We beat the Chiefs, yes. That was a good win. Yeah, it was a very good. I actually watched that. I forgot, though. Hey, we had beat the Lions on Thanksgiving, too.

Yeah, you did beat the Lions. Yeah, we did that, we did that. M&M wasn't happy. It wasn't happy about that. Yeah, I love Eminemino. I was sure he wasn't. It makes a lot of sense to me why you know sports. Because you got to love something.

Yeah. Because you bring that, this is the other thing is, I noticed it. I've been around you a few times now with people. Yeah. whether you want to or not, you've been in people's lives for decades. So when they're around you, there's a sense of like total joy they get.

Like they're just geeking out because they have so many, you don't even realize how many life moments and memories that are your tied into. And when you think about, it's likely hundreds of millions of people that your songs, multiple songs,

are connected to key moments of, that's me. When you get told, it's when you're told by them. Yeah. You know what I mean? And I had a moment. I had a very unique moment in my life that I was able to be told in a different way.

Okay. Because you and I, we both, you know, do the same thing. I'm sure people run up to you and sometimes they tell you, not even run up to you. Sometimes you meet some money just tell you, man, you know, that song you made got me through this. Sometimes you don't, you know, you hear them. But I was able to see that through letters when I was locked up.

You know what I mean? So I got locked up at the height of my career. Yeah. You know what I mean? So those letters that came in, and it was so just by the amount, plain and simple, they used to, we had to, me and the prison, we had to form a process to where you only could get, you know, we'll give you the mail on a Tuesday, and we got to give it back to your somebody, your people or something because it would be a fire hazard in myself.

There's too many. It was over 10,000 a day. Wow. Yeah, so it was like, you know, so what happened, just for family members and stuff, I would have to like, you know, man, don't even write a letter, man. You know what I mean? Because if you got to send it in a different type of envelope or you got to do this or something. I mean, because I would let them know it comes, literally, it comes down to me.

It's just ping ball for me now. They bring two garbage bags in here every other day and I just, whichever one I want. But, you know, that's, it became, you know, now I'm sitting in the cell. I ain't got nowhere to go. You know, and I ain't, you're not catching me. walking, walking to a stage or walking off a stage or walking in the mall and can't talk. No, no, no, no, no. I can't do nothing.

We sit here and read this letter and pay attention. And one thing about writing a letter, one thing about writing, that's one of the purest forms of showing whatever it is, your expression. Not sure who knows it and if you know it, but it's one of the purest forms. That's why back in time and all that, we try to figure it out to say, look what we saw, look what we, it's still one. the pure response when you come down to this day in time to have to have someone write you anything means a lot yeah handwritten letters it's an art form so that's why i said i was sitting literally reading and pay attention and so when you read that at a certain at the at the you know i'm at the height of your career and at in that place you and then you meet people and like you say you meet people

that first of all i didn't think you listened to my music i didn't even think you knew who i was you know and they tell you, no, no, no. When you made How to Love, I was going through this, and I used to be worried about, I was a model, and I was starving myself, and this one, you made How to Love, and now I'm a model, but now I'm a plus size of mind, and I feel better than ever now,

and I'm making $10,000 more money than I've ever made when I was this, and I wanted to kill myself when I was back then, and this, and you're like, in what country are you from? You know, you're like, and you're like, and they play, They played that there. You know? And so when even something simple is, and then I think that's another part of me

that's also amazing that I love is my surprise and my reaction to someone's reaction someone's love for me. I still get the feeling of you what? You know, like, well, you know me? And I don't know why that doesn't, why that's never faded, I hope it never does.

So what I mean by that is I was reading the intro the other day for that game. You was asking me about that Chief's game, though. I had to read the intro. I read the intro for it. So before the game played, they played, it was my audio.

Yeah. So as I'm reading the script that they sent, it's an NBC thing, whoever the game was on, at the end of it, they put, maybe the packer figured out how to love again. And I was like, they know, they know that? Yeah. Like, to where I literally still thought,

I was like, that's a real, real coincidence that I, you know what I mean? Because the quarterback name is love. You know what I mean? So I was like, but nah, nah, they did that all all that was on purpose. So that's still, little things like that

is still surprising to me. Yeah, it's a, and it's a, showing you that you touch places, people in different places in different times in different ways.

You got coaches, I got a coach, the coach of the 49 is Kyle Shannon. He named his child after me. One of his sons named is Carter. Yeah, and when I talked,

you know, you ask him like, Kyle, you're like, why, how? You know, like, how what the hell? I meant to it

when he sat down and told me. Like, wow. I believe that you create your legacy in life, your name, your body of work, your catalog of work, you know, your book of poetry. If we put all the little Wayne verses into a book and then we had scholars, right? Think about this. Because this is the thing that, especially with hip hop. So when I look at hip hop, because I've always been a fan, I see poets using the metaphors of the things they see to make sense of the world of life and to philosophize.

how it all works, right? That's what, to me, that's what hip hop is. I think there's a whole section of music that hasn't been looked at yet. And I think it will be, though. I think we'll be able to look at culture in all these different points and dissect these poems. And so back to you, if we look at your work and we just put into a book, it's letters and poetry.

As a body of work, it's iconic. And so when you think about a guy would name his kid after your last name, all of those are just ideas that represent something culturally that are iconic. And when we name our children, we give them names, we want them to live up to. And so we think of things that symbolize something, sometimes it's beauty, sometimes it's power, sometimes it's, they all have different representations. Right, I named my son Sparrow. I've always loved birds. I think the person that probably hears that they're something that probably get told, I name my son after you, I name my child after you, child, period.

It's probably Michael Jordan. And I think you're doing that. And like you say, you got your reasons. And I think his most likely the reason would be for greatness. Greatness and something to live up to. Something to live up to. And I think that the reason that it still moves you is because you're honest. Yeah.

The other thing that I would say, me and Ben, we were talking about, you. I was telling me, I'm getting ready to go and talk to Wayne. I was like, is there anything you want to know about? And he was like, man, he's so consistent. I just want to know about that. And then the other thing is honesty, is meeting an honest person is interesting because for the most part, it's very easy to fall into kind of a dishonest representation of yourself in the world because it's doing what we do. Doing what we do and going into different rooms all the time. And you can easily fall into a kind of this is the persona this is but there's again I think a through line of all the iconic people I've met and I've been lucky enough to meet so many

different kinds of iconic people in different categories of sports or art or music uh film TV all that uh there is an honesty when I meet someone who's it's like they're in the center of their being they know who they are didn't even think about the the time you had to spend in jail. How do you come out of that, right? How do you survive that emotionally, mentally, to be able to move through all that and stay honest and not bitter? I think that part comes probably from my grandmother. Right. You know, my grandmother raised me until I was about 11. I lived with her. And so, you know, that's just an older person. Strong women. Yeah, and also that didn't saw everything. And so, you know, the world could end right

across the street from her. You know, if it ain't touched this side of the street, we're okay. Yeah. You know what I mean? So you, I leave out, I'm getting that every day and every night and I'm leaving out the house with that. And that's when you, that's when, you know,

I was one of those kids where, you know, the people around you're gonna tell him, tell you something like, yeah, he'll hear this time. You know, things like, I'm not kid, you know, that was, too smart, he did he ahead his time and stuff like that. Right. And that's just my grandmother.

Yeah, I mean, because when you didn't know with your grandmother, And nobody else. It was just being hurt. You got to be a little adult yourself. Yeah. You know what I mean? And so that's what I think that's what I'm being,

the honesty and all that part coming in. And also, I always tell somebody. I always tell everybody, I mean, to say also, man, if you work hard enough and if you live, there's no right and wrong way to live. Because when you get into whatever you're doing, there's a right way to do whatever you're doing. Right. Even the wrong things.

Yeah. You know what I mean? So, but if you work hard enough and you live, you live hard enough. Because life is hard, period. Attack it, embrace it, and love the results. If you do that, then I always tell everybody, man, my truth is beautiful. I can't hide it. So that's why I'm honest.

That's why I give you the truth. And I mean, even what's not beautiful to you, you know, it's, I'm honest. I got to be me. because and like you said because I don't have a persona I don't have a character right you know because they die once the book closes

and once the movie goes off right you know what I mean so I used always wonder why you know they had artists they used to always wonder why when I go to the studio and I see an artist going there and you know they're talking to you like this

as soon as they go in there and start doing the verse or whatever they've got they got to put on this it's old they got to put on the board I'm like man it's a character Yeah, it's kind of like what's going to happen when nobody don't want to hear that voice no more.

I always think that. Even about like, even about my own colleagues back in the days, I just sit there and say to myself sometimes like, wow, I don't do that. You know, like I'm just going to this song and just do exactly what I. But also that was helpful because I was around people that was living a certain way and I wasn't. And so that's why I told you. I had to figure out how can I make my verses.

How can I make the people that's asking me to me this? Let me hear that. Let me hear, okay, let me hear yours. How can I make them talk about my verse after they hear it? And that's what made me aim for upwards, like you said. Yeah. Because I looked at those guys, I want to shoot. Because they're hearing y'all verse,

and they're going to talk about it after months after. I want it that bad. Yeah. You know what I mean? But I want them talk about mine forever. And you have to earn it when you are, I think the best strategy is to be yourself, because it is the most sustainable you.

I told you, I locked myself in that warehouse and give you me. And if on the moment me don't work, I know that's my confirmation. Yeah. Yeah. Also, I think there's got to be something about the competitive environment you were in with cash money. Yeah. That forced you to find those answers in real time. Yeah.

Right? I can imagine, and I don't know Baby and Slim, but they struck me as really, I guess the word would be determined. Mm-hmm. Serious. serious a little intimidating from out outwardly right i'm sure there was probably a lot of camaraderie there it was probably like it was probably a really fun place at times but it there was it was probably also really edgy and in no it was it was never edgy like that it was just that the the what we all came from right and you know that was that was the edge at all time yeah we're getting it after it

yeah like just period just you know the people that would that would be around you know you you would know that they're dealing with a lot. Right. And they're doing things that you would never fathom that I would never, that I would even make you go hard on, like I said, make you, that's where I get where, that's where my mom would kick in. Right. And that's when, you're going to go to school and be this because you're not going to be that.

And so now that's kicking in. And when I'm around baby and slim, because now the people that's around me, they really this and they really that. He's really a this. He's really that. And now I'm getting my, now I got to me. That's my decision. And do you really want to, are you really, no, I'm going to be me.

There's an intensity to that. Yeah. That's what I said. The edge was just there because that was the edge, period. It was already around. And so it was about navigating that room and navigating yourself through that without figuring, without getting, I mean, without any conflict. But it's kind of almost like it sharpens the blade. Yeah, blade still, sharp and still.

And you come out of that and it's kind of like, what could really shake you? you when you've been when you came up in that school yeah and then you come out and everything just kind of seems like Disneyland because you come from a place that's the intensity is high a bit different the work ethic is high yes the the the determination is it kind of like a no fail no lose we're going to get this right and we're going to do it until we get it right yeah we get it right right and then the competitiveness is everyone there wants to make it because everyone is that needs the opportunity. There's a need.

There's a real need. That was another part of it. It was the necessity to make it. Right. It was a necessity. Yeah. I think that was our edge when we started, was it the necessity.

We had no other, there was no uncle with money. There was no backup plan. Necessity. Things that I think other people took as challenges as kind of like light work. Because we knew we weren't going to quit. And I'd work 24 hours if I had to work.

work 24 hours. Yeah. It was this, everything else was, didn't matter. Yeah, exactly. There was a need to,

to get there. Like I said, I, also, you know, I had success around me. Right. You know, the people that was before me

that was coming, you get to see that, you want that, I want that, you know, I want that and more. Right. That was another,

that was also very helpful for me, you know what I mean? And thanking God for their success as well. Was, welcome to Colley Grove. You and Tuchains

are friends? Yeah, real. brothers yeah yeah i like him yeah he seems cool i don't know him yeah but i like him yeah he seems cool so was that just like we all man we have you know we got category one already so yeah i was just him just me and him just getting together doing it putting songs together yeah yeah yeah yeah we record together a lot so is he one of your best friends yeah that's my hon that's like like i said like my bro yeah yeah and tit was rapping before i knew he was rapping and so once i

Once we got together, I did one in his first big songs, Duffel Bag Boy. Yeah. Once we put that out, he was gone from now. Yeah. Yeah, so you also, you respect that about him because I can do shit else. You know what I mean? He did everything else is all him. Yeah, he seems like a hard worker.

Yeah, what? Yeah. Yeah. And he also get it from being around. He was around in those times with cash money right there. Right. Yeah. It's weird how you can kind of almost spot those guys,

even if you don't know them personally, you can always spot the people that have that drive and that work ethic. No matter when they got kind of, whatever song it was where they got on, you know the decade before that of work they had to do. You can almost feel it when they rap. Crazy.

What's the next thing you're working on? Right now, working on, of course, the car is six, about to put that out. and got so much stuff outside of the booth that I'm working on, you know what I mean, that I got to get that, I got to take care of that I'm learning to approach that. I mean, I'm loving every opportunity I get. Yeah. And so doing that.

But other than that, as far as music, man, everybody knows I work every day, so I don't even be having a reason with the song going on. I just do songs. I just do music. Helping my artist, doing things for them. And of course, you're all right now I walk in the studio with five features. to do every night. So I'm doing features all the time.

But other than that, and of course I got something coming before quarter six, probably, probably, probably, probably not a mixtape, probably not, something like that.

Yeah. You know, when you think about Young Money and how long it's been around, that's another thing is like, you always forget, this is the power of being culturally relevant now. You almost forget until you think about it

or you look at it, how long something's been around. Yeah. It's because young money, it feels, it feels so right now. But then you think about it and you're like, oh, no, it's been around.

Through two decades it's going to be coming into, it's crazy how well that young money's done. Thank God. Yeah. Thank God. We should make some rock music. Yeah, they told me they told me about ideas. Yeah.

We're going to send you some stuff. Let's go. Because that, when we reworked Millie, we were like, oh, we got to do some stuff. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, that's going to be good. Yeah. Great, man.

Thanks for coming on. Man, thanks for having me, man. 50 episodes. Are you doing anything for New Year's? Most likely. Are you going to be? I don't know what I'm doing, but most likely I'm going to be out somewhere. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, happy New Year. I hope you have a good 20-24. Happy New Year's too. Whoever's listening. I hope you had a great year this year and hope this next year be the best year for you.

Amen. Thanks for coming on, dude. And thanks for having me. Best. Love. I don't want to Thank you for listening to our 50th episode of Artist Friendly and thank you for listening all year long.

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