Artist Friendly with Joel Madden - O'Shea Jackson Jr.

Episode Date: January 8, 2025

On this week's episode of Artist Friendly, Joel Madden is joined by O'Shea Jackson Jr. Jackson, aka OMG, is an actor, rapper, and songwriter best known as the oldest son of Ice Cube. For his debut feature film, he played his father in the 2015 N.W.A. biopic Straight Outta Compton, which was nominated for an Oscar. Since then, he’s gone on to appear in several other films (Den of Thieves, Ingrid Goes West, Cocaine Bear, etc.) and co-host the No-Contest Wrestling podcast with TJ Jefferson.  In this conversation with Joel, he discusses growing up with a famous dad, risking it all for family, and his new movie Den Of Thieves 2: Pantera, which hits theaters on Jan. 10. ------- Listen to their Artist Friendly conversation on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify.⁠⁠⁠ ------- Follow Artist Friendly! IG: @artist.friendly TikTok: @artist.friendly YouTube: youtube.com/@artist.friendly ------- Host: Joel Madden, @joelmadden Executive Producers: Joel Madden, Benji Madden, Jillian King Producers: Josh Madden, Joey Simmrin, Janice Leary Visual Producer/Editor: Ryan Schaefer Audio Producer/Composer: Nick Gray Music/Theme Composer: Nick Gray Cover Art/Design: Ryan Schaefer Additional Contributors: Anna Zanes, Neville Hardman Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, what's up? I'm Joel Madden, and this is artist-friendly. On this episode, I'm talking to actor and writer and one of the stars of Den of Thieves 2, Pantera, actor O'Shea Jackson Jr. Let's go. If we're not smoking on gas, I'm smoking out piff, that's my kind. I don't want no bad times. I don't want to have bad. The person that I am, I always want that to come across. Because I do care about the people out there that I come in contact when I'm going around the country or you're going on tour or you're doing- Reception of yourself. Absolutely.

Because I take myself seriously. Exactly. So there's a balance, right, of being like the entertainer, but not too much. Yeah, I'm not fake. Right. You know, like I really care about what I'm here to talk about. Exactly. Just because I got to put on my movie phone voice.

Yeah. It doesn't mean that, like, I don't think it's dope or I'm lying to you. A lot of people are so concerned with like, like, this, the idea. of Hollywood is just such a facade. It's just a facade and people who aren't in it or like have they hand in it in some kind of way

still believe that. So they're just like, oh, it's another actor just telling me to go see their project. I'm like, no, I really care. I just only got eight minutes to tell you. Yeah, just another Satan worshiper. Yeah, right. Join the cult and you're like, y'all don't even know. You don't even know me. I'm a grown

man at this point. Yeah. You knew me when I was a 20 early 20s kid who didn't know anything had not even experienced life yeah so thank thankfully for the success of the art i got to go around the world i got to form my own view of the world in a great way but then i also am a 45 year old dad husband guy who works right and there's two different perceptions always with artists and actors and and then everyone has this idea that hollywood is this like thing that you join and you're like the secret club and that Not really.

We all go to meetings and it's like, bro, if you look at my Instagram, my Instagram does not have me on it. It is just full of video game references, cartoons, movies, and stuff like that. And like my Twitter. I love your Instagram. You're, bro, most celebrity Twitters are just there to promote. Like, that's it. Like, no, I'm in the, bro. I'll cuss you out, bro.

Yeah. It's really me. And I try, when I did media training for the first time for Strider-Compton, I was told that relatability is likability. So like the more that I show you, like, dude, I'm just a guy with a cool job. I don't have this evil lore that you put on me. Muhammad Ali had a thing. And the thing, the reason why I don't post myself on Instagram a lot is because my family has been very private forever. Like, you've never seen my dad on cribs. TMZ, you rarely run across him coming out of anywhere or anything like that. So we've been very

private. And there's so many times where Instagram could come off. superficial, like, I have to remind people all the time. Instagram is the highlight real. The highlight real. It's the highlight real. They're not showing you the turnovers, the, you know, the fumbles. The losses. Yeah, they're not showing losses at all.

So, like, you have to acknowledge that and recognize that. And when Instagram, it's like, dude, I can only kiss my own ass so many times. So I would rather show people stuff that's like, oh, man, you used to watch that or like, oh, man, I got that joke. or like that type stuff because Muhammad Ali said, instead of selling myself to you, I'd rather get you to buy into you. Like I'm just like my job in its purest form,

I play pretend for money. Yeah. You know, it's nothing secret or like spooky about it. And, you know, it's just a bunch of people making it harder for us. Yeah, well,

I do think that the massive amount of people that watch that are likely not doing what you're doing have a fantasy. And that's their fantasy. And sometimes you've got to let them have their fantasy. And if they think it's all this or all that, how can I change their mind? Yeah, I can only lead you to water.

I can't make you drink. I knew I liked you. Yeah, man. From your Instagram, from your movies. You can always see a little bit of someone in all their movies, you know? Yeah. And I always knew you were a cool dude. Yeah.

I also suspected exactly what you said about your family. As parents who work in entertainment and you're trying to raise kids, and you're trying to walk the line of one, you want your kids to be aware of who they are, what they come from. Yeah. And the reality of what that means. So when you're going to go out in the world,

you're going to have people that are going to prejudge you one way or the other because of your family. Yeah. That's the reality for every family. Mm-hmm. But for a family of parents who have done well, it's very complicated for the kids coming up with parents who have done well, and then you have to go out in the world

and have people perceive. how great it is for you, how easy it is for you, or this or that, or this or that, it's preconceived. But then to find the balance of raising your kids while you're still just working, like everyone should. Yeah. Everyone should work. Absolutely.

The privacy thing is finding everybody has to do it on their own, right? That's why I kind of like, me and my wife, we try to find the balance. We're pretty private as well. Yeah. But we know our kids, as they get, they're teenagers. So we know we don't want them to be completely sheltered from like, where they grow up. Yeah.

But then you learn, they kind of learn on their own. Yeah, it's going to happen. Yeah. It's going to happen no matter what. You know, my,

I know, I know just because, you know, I got a seven-year-old now, so I know that my parents have the same thoughts that I have about my kid, they had about me.

Yeah. And they don't know, the older I get realized the stuff that they were saying stuck. Yeah. Like, they don't know that, like,

it didn't just go one in and out the other until you show, them. And so I've had to, you know, just off the lessons that they've given me, understand that my life is different than everybody, understand that there's going to be people that want something from me. And this is all schoolyard way of thinking. Yeah. And it, you know, I knew that I had to keep people at our arms distance. And it's, it's a wild thing to have to teach yourself as a kid of just, like, not everybody's going to be my friend. And not everyone's going to be honest. Yeah, exactly.

You got to learn how to have a filter at such a young age, which is good and bad. Everything has its pros and cons. But with my kid, I'm just like, I'm nervous, bro. Yeah. You know, this is, I just sometimes I call my mom or my dad and just be like, I'm sorry. I'm like, anytime I stressed you out or, like, didn't tell you what was happening at school or anything like that, my bad, because I get it. Were you an easy kid? He, bro.

I don't want nothing but my game. Just give me my, you know, I'm a gamer. It all started with Sega Genesis, and I never look back. You still game? Yeah. What games do you play? Right now, obviously, I've been playing Grant the Thaltoe for like almost 12 years now. Okay.

Is the new one out? No. Okay. That'll be next year. Are you going to have a shop on it? Like, they're talking about all these shops? Bro. You got to have a shop if you've been playing that long.

I do everything, bro. I love it. It keeps me out of, you know, clubs and parties and spending money. Yeah. You know, I only spend money on my game. Shout up to Lucille. That's the name my PlayStation. Oh, wow.

Yeah, it's, that's my thing. Your oldest friend. Yeah, exactly. She's had my back for 30 years now. But, yeah, I was a good kid, good grades because they instilled in me. As long as this report card looks good, you can ask for anything. That's what I say with my kids. Anything.

That's my rule. I say you have two jobs. Yeah. Listen to your mother. Yeah. And get good grades and just do what you have to do. And it can be so easy for it. It will be.

It will be so easy for you if you listen to your mom and you get good grades and just do whatever you have to do to pass. I don't care about school. I don't know about any science math. I had a very tough time in school. That being said, I didn't have parents who were there. So I didn't really have, I was working full time. I was doing a lot. So with my kids, I'm like, you don't have to have a job until you have to go out in the world and do something.

you know, that you hopefully you're, you care about, but just pass school and listen to your mom. And you're good. And you can ask me for anything. Yeah, you're good. And they do. Yeah. See, that's good. My daughter's doing great in school.

And I really like that. I had my first couple parent teacher conferences. And I was like, I'm looking at life. You know, it's wild. Those are weird, right? Sitting with the teacher. And she's like, yeah, Jordan's doing great. And I'm like, all right.

Well, great. That's good news. Yeah. And the only thing, though, is my baby is a yapper. She will, she likes to talk. She likes to be friendly. Yeah. You know, so like, her teacher was like, yeah, she gets the work done and she does it

the correct way or grades are great. But I just wish she would do it a little faster. And it's just like, you know, how do you teach a kid about procrastination this early? She gets distracted by stuff, especially when I was a kid, I was a daydreamer because Me too. I realized like, you taught me this last year. Like, I know this. Like, you know, so now I'm just in class just thinking away.

So I wanted her to have that quality because I was homeschooled from 7th to 11th grade. We were traveling with my dad. He was filming a lot. It just made sense. And my teacher, Hernan de la Oladay, he saw me daydreaming one day in class. And he dropped a notebook in front of me. He was like, bro, whatever. you're thinking about, just write it down. Just write it down. Get it out of there. And then

please tell me that you, you know, you're going to focus. It's like, all right, yeah, I got you. And I just started writing. And the next thing I know, like a story is coming out. And I ended up writing, he would give me 30 minutes every day to just like finish the story that's in my head. And then next thing I know, the story ends, and I've handwritten 120 pages. And so he was like, have you ever thought about writing scripts? And then from writing, he, you know, we got Bill Rubenstein who taught me how to write scripts. And from there, it was like, you're going into 12th grade. It's time for thinking about college and stuff like that.

And they're like, you have, you know, you have, you know, you've got ideas. You're a writer. Yeah, you're natural. Yeah. So like then the goal was to get to USC. And, you know, from USC, I, the script that I turned in was from that 120 page handwritten story. And that got me into the School of Cinematic Arts. So like, it's hard for me who got something good. Yeah. Or like for me to get something out of daydreaming, it's hard for me to tell my kid like, don't daydream. Yeah, I think you're right. It's like, she's thinking, you know, she's thinking outside of here. So I don't know. It's just a hard balance because she is in second grade, right? Yeah, but I actually think that the fundamental philosophical thing that you're talking about

is something that every single parent should be thinking about with their kid. I'm the same way with my kids. They're growing up in a house full of artists and entrepreneurs, everyone around them. Their grandfather is a legendary artist. Their aunt is a legendary actress. Their mom is a comedic TV. their dad is a is a rock and roll guy their uncles their godparent everyone around them is in the arts and in the business of creating things yeah and at the highest scale so wouldn't they naturally

be inclined to think that way and see the world that way yeah and that's just like you you weren't growing up in a situation where people were discouraging creative thinking exactly right because that's how we survive we're creative And we go, all right, how am I going to solve this problem? Yeah. Think about like career-wise, the next catastrophe happens to us. We have to be creative. Yeah.

And go around and figure it out. Figure it out. And the ones who don't are out. Yeah, you're done. And the ones who are continue to have careers. Yeah. And it's a resilience that's hard to explain until you've been in a creative career long enough to understand what the resilience actually is, is just go forward, be creative, figure it out.

Yeah. In every situation is different. but of course you're a writer. Of course you're a script writer. Yeah, it's like, dude, to create, I, when I was in like, how old was I? I think it was about 19, 20, I was like, bro, to create, that's the meaning of life. That's it. Like, even, it's about to get real deep in here.

Yeah, we love you. So everybody knows. That's what we do. I'm about to go off the rails. Yeah. Well, talking about the meaning of life. But, yeah, like, even when you go down to like the simplest form of life. or a single cell organism.

Like that thing only knows to create a copy of itself. And to grow. Yeah, and grow. And you think of just like with animals, they need to procreate. In order for civilization to move forward, we have to create, like to create is the thing that gives us our tech, our medicine, our food,

or like it is creating something. Like our basic human form is to create another human. Like, you know, like to create is the thing that pushes everything forward. And then like if you think of a, a, you know, a God, a creator, when they say that he made you in his image, it's like, yeah, I made another creator. Like, yeah. So like, that is the meaning of life to me, dude. And so I agree. When we're put into situations where we can't create, you're miserable. Yeah. You're miserable, dude. And there's something to like, by the way, I only think in terms of like deep philosophical. That's it.

Because if I could blow my own mind, I'd be like, yeah. Well, okay. So here's also what I'm interested in, right? The natural progression and evolution of humans, right, is to level up. Yeah. We're passed down information from every generation. Blueprint. We're standing on the shoulders of the people before us, right?

And we're taking all their experiences, good, bad. So to think, like, when I think about great families, right because i do think that like especially like when i think about the american dream right to come from nothing and to create yeah something and then make a name for yourself as they say right so when you think about your kind of your duty as a man or a woman right um everyone's kids right they have their name yeah and if we're not actually giving some of that to our kids and i tell my kids all the time like you're going to go in the world and make this name mean more. Yeah.

Add on to the creation. Yeah. And so when you think about your dad, right, to come from where he came from and to do all the things he's done, isn't it your job as the son of a great man to go out and try to be great? Exactly. And figure that out. Yeah.

Whatever that means if you're in the arts. But if you happen to be a doctor or like, is it your job to go into the world and create and make a name for yourself. Yeah. That furthers that entire story of the family. Yeah. It's like, that's why I never, for a little bit, it did bother me, like the idea of getting out of a shadow.

Yeah. But like, it's not that. Like, you only, it's only a shadow from somebody too far to see. Like, and so it's, you're adding to a, like, you know, just back in the day they went, add to empires. You know, you're, you're adding to your family name, whether it be creatively business-wise, or you're adding branches to the family tree. Like, you're always adding. And it's so that when, when, you know, we look back in time on the legacy of your family is something great. And you added to it, but I think where people get caught, because I see it, because I've been,

I've lived here now, I come from Maryland, and I've been here now for about 25 years. And I didn't have a family name. I didn't have a shadow to step out from, right? But I had a family name I was proud of. And I always said, I want to make it mean something. Yeah. Push it forever. But I saw it out here. Some kids get stuck. Every young person at some point has to come to terms with the separation from their parents. Yeah. Right? That's a part of life. Leaving the nest. Then you're an adult. Yeah. And naturally, we're going to wrestle with who our parents are. Some people, it's, in your case, it's greatness. Yeah.

Right. Or it's people's idea of your father, right? But you know the man. Yeah, exactly. So the legacy is one thing that's great, but the actual person that you grew up with that you learned from. And then as you cross that bridge into being your own man, the conflicts you guys probably had, that's natural. Everybody has to go through that. Yeah.

Mine was different. My dad had a lot of problems and I resented them for a long time. But then I realized that he actually taught me so much through his shortcomings. And I had real peace reconciled with that and ended up in a really good place before he passed away. But it was like a growth of actually coming all the way into my own self. Yeah. And realizing that part of my story is really important.

But everybody has to go through that some way, shape, or form. Yeah, no matter what. dealing with his greatness or his success or but i see some kids out here that have great parents and then the world has turned this thing into like catch phrases net tempo babies and this and that it's all kind of bullshit it's like that's how they make sense of something they don't know anything about outside looking in right yeah but at some point you reconcile it and you step out and start building your own life yeah and you go forward i see some kids with these parents who have done hugely successful

and they're these huge people and I see kids get stuck and they never grow up. I'm gonna'amena and like my music, my hair can't be able to be able to continue my rhythm. For so, Potion Nine, of Sebastian Professional,

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and you know he laid down the foundation for everything that we have now his fire was visible like his reasoning

for wanting better it was an external thing where he can see like I don't want this anymore. Right. When you are, when you come from a successful family, your fire has to be internal. Yeah. It has to. And if it's like, like, if you look around, life is great. Yeah, I want my life to always be

like this. But there has to be an, in, a more internal fire that you have to be like, no, I kind of want more for me. And it takes a lot to even to build something like that. I'd look at it the same way as a, I had a hard time two, three years ago, just, yeah, two, almost three, I couldn't cry in a scene. I couldn't tear up because, like, I had nothing in my life that, like, got me there. Right. So, like, I was like, bro, I can't have artificial tears. Right, you can't. Nothing to tap into it.

Yeah, it was nothing to tap into. And when I lost my, my grandmother on my mom's side, I had never cried that. hard in life. Like it was so much built up and then two months later I lost my Uncle Star. Like and the last time I saw him was at my grandmother's funeral. So it was like that was me saying goodbye to him because the next thing I know he was gone and then it happened again. And now I had I had like real pain I can tap into and like use. So Now need be, bro, I could cry on a dive because all I got to do is think about them. And so when it comes to finding that inner fire, there has to be something to bother you,

something that you can tap into that you think, I don't want that anymore. I want to keep growing. I want to keep forward. And there's nobody who can map out a way for you to find that thing that bothers you. And it has to be just a want to get yourself to be better. It'll be something little or something, but just the fact that, like, you want that for you would be enough to kind of kind of kind of kind of kind of kind of candle and grow into something internal to make you get your ass up and work.

I wanted to be a writer. You know, I wanted that because, I really wanted to be a writer because of video games. Yeah. I didn't want to write movies. You want to write video games. Stuffed up. When I was a kid. Well, you still should, bro.

Yeah, I'm definitely, when I was a kid, sixth grade, 12 years old, called Kingdom Hearts had came out. Yeah. And just the story of that blew my 12-year-old mind. And I was like, this game made me feel stuff. Like I felt like it was different. It was different. And so I've always, after that, I'd always just loved it.

And then by the time it was, you know, time for me to go to college, Grant the Thaddo and Call of Duty had made a billion dollars in a weekend. So I was like, I can make you pay $16 for a movie ticket. Or I can make you pay $60 for a game. Right. So I was like, I want to write for games. And then in the middle of my, like, that was my, like, that's what I wanted to do. And then in the middle of my second year, my dad was like, hey, they're taking this NWA movie

serious. And I'm like, all right, I'm happy for you, dad. He was like, no, bro. Like, I'm going to need you. I was like, to do what? There was no one else. Yeah. I was like, to do what?

He was like, yeah. You killed that. Thank you. You killed that. I need you to. That was crazy. I need you to audition. and I need you in a perfect world, you'd play me.

And I was like, because at the time, no disrespect. Wasn't a lot of good rap movies. You weren't a lot of like good rap movies. So I'm like, okay, my dad's never asked me to do a thing besides take out the trash. So I'm like, all right, I got to do it. We got to do it. I was like, who's doing the movie? It's like Universal Studios.

So that's pretty good. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't going to be small. Yeah, that's pretty good company. And then, yeah, from there, it was, I wanted to make him proud. Oh, my God, man. What a good story, bro.

That was my thing of just like, this is my opportunity to make him proud. Yeah. And then from there, like now my brothers and my sisters, well, my brothers and my sister and my mom and my cousins. And everybody is like, you got to get this. You got to do it. And so now my fire comes from like, I have. I got to do this for the family. And so now for the family, now, like, I'm auditioning for over two years before I get this part.

And I left in the middle, I left college in the middle of my second year. So I'm on Instagram looking at my friends graduate without me. And they're hitting me like, bro, what's going on? And I'm just like, I don't know. So now I'm scared. So now my fire is, my family is behind me. I just threw away college. I have no plan now.

And with USC, the School of Cinematic Arts, the writing division, it's a four-step four-year program. You can't just leave in the second year and then come back and be right here again. You have to start over. I have to go to a juco and get transferred to take somebody's spot. So like, I'm screwed. And so now my fire is we don't have a choice. And now it's public that I'm trying out. So now if I fail, it's a rat.

Yeah. So now, like, there's fear behind it. and there is a level of anxiety because I don't want to let the family down. Yeah. And so when it happened, it was the best feeling, but then it was like, now we have to keep it. So that's how I am where I am. But like, you have to find things that bother you, find things that give you that level of anxiousness. Yeah, there's stakes.

That's where your fire will start. Stakes are high. And then it'll make you move. Well, also, man, I think about- Now I got a kid. Now I got another one. I got another fire coming up. Yeah.

Like there's things you have to like find. Like Michael Jordan, when he would look for just the simplest things to motivate him to like go at you. Even if you didn't even really say it, he would lie to himself that like you think he sucks. Just like you have to make fake fire. Yeah. And that that will push you. So like it's the same thing. Yeah.

You have to create. Mm-hmm. Right back to it. You have to create your own fire, bro. And create those conflicts. But also, first of all, I think you're your, you're, a natural born movie guy. Thank you.

Like, you're great in movies. You play yourself. You're really, like, I always knew from the first time I saw you on screen, I think you playing your dad, there was no one else. And I also think to hear the story for me is amazing. Because it's what I hoped. You always hope that a father and son love each other. Yeah.

Because it's hard to believe when you didn't have that. And I think like what we do naturally is we look for models so that we can follow the models that seem like they worked better. Because what I want with my son is that. I want to grow up and not be broken. Yeah. And have a friend who's grown into a man that I respect. Yeah. That hopefully is better than me.

I guarantee you, guarantee your father wants you to be better than him. Like I guarantee I think that every father does. But you also want your son to earn it. Yeah. And then you also want him to trust you. And there's a moment there where he's like, I need you to do this and you have to trust. Yeah. And when we're young, we think we know everything when we're young.

I know. We're learning as the day goes. And he saw the board. That's why he is who he is. That's why he's a huge success. Because he sees the game. And he goes, not only do I need this, this is going to give my son an opportunity to build a life if he wants to. and you've done it.

That's just another step forward in what I think is a long career of creating and telling stories. And you know the game as well. You watch it as a kid. You're going to be in the movies and you're going to start writing the movies and then you're going to start directing the movies

and then you're going to start the production company and then you're going to do the things you want to do to be able to tell the stories you want to tell. Right. And we get more and more able to do that. As we get older, we realize, like, oh, I wasn't ready to write or direct when I was 19. I had to go make all the movies. Learn what it feels like to be on that set.

Learn what a good showrunner is. Learn what a good this is. Learn all the pieces of I had to work at the hotel valet. I had to clean the rooms. Now I can own the hotel. Yeah. Because I know how it works. Yeah.

And not only, I think, did your dad have that awareness? because he learned it all the hard ways. Yeah. And we want our kids to learn a little less hard. Yeah, a little less hard. I always say my kids, I'm going to try to teach you. Life is going to teach you. Yeah.

It's harder when life teaches you. Hopefully I can teach you some things where you learn faster, and then you can get where you want to go a little faster, and you can avoid some of the mistakes I made. But if I did at least do that enough and you avoid some of the mistakes, then I did a good job. if you don't want to listen to me, you can go out and life's going to teach you and you'll learn. And that is what it is.

We all have to learn some things on our own. But I think that to see like the relationship that you and your dad have is pretty incredible because there's two different kinds of success. To me, success is happiness, togetherness, and well-being. Yeah. To some people, success is size. It's amount. And we see the broken stories when people have it all, but they don't have family.

The quality over quantity. Right. And then there's integrity. My God. I, dude, it's one of the major things that my dad taught me going out into this career was, number one, never do a movie that you wouldn't go see yourself. Yep. And don't do nothing that when you look back, you'll be mad at it.

yourself he did that yeah why did you do that yeah why did i do that man because like you know why i let that guy talk me in yeah a director cannot talk me and they're doing nothing crazy because you not up there bro and the common fan is not going to be like why did they write for him to do this i always like why did i do it i always felt that about you and your dad yeah i always felt integrity there's something like when you see a guy with integrity you can just you smell it you can just see it, you just know, that guy doesn't got a price. Yeah. I always tell my son, like, I was tell my kids, both my kids, my daughter and my son,

so we don't have a price. People will pay for our time when we decided, like, oh, we want to do that. The money is a matter of time. Yeah. How much is that time worth that you got to give to that? But there is no price. Yeah, no, no. You can't.

It's got to be something you're all in on. Give it yourself up. Yeah. It's like, so when you look back, you just, you quiver a little bit. bit or are you cringe. I can't do it. And just to speak on a point that you said before, the parental advice, that's practice. Yeah. All right. You like, like, that is practice. That's coaching. The game is life. You're on your own. Yeah, it's different when you like, like, I could go outside shoot baskets and go, you know, 20 for 30, you know, like I'm balling. Yeah. But when you're in the

game, it's different. There are things that I can't tell you to be prepared for and you just got to be ready. So like I feel that 100% and something I had to kind of come to realization with myself, like while my dad is giving me advice, because just the same way that he can't prepare me for what's going to be out there until I see it, he's still going to be on the outside and not exactly know what's happening with me. Yeah, watching. So I had to have like moments of, you know what it's like, yes, but you don't know what it's like to be your son. Right. And there is an ideology of me before I get anywhere because of you.

Right. How they think of you. Or the just the concept of, oh, this is this rapper's kid. Yeah, one way or the other? Yeah. So, like, I have to kind of do things my way. Like, for instance, shout out to Denny Thieves. Here's some tea.

Yeah, tell me about Dinna Thieves. When we shot the first dinner thieves, I hated it. I couldn't stand it, dude. I was getting worked. Like, it's my third movie ever. Right. I got my head down, bro. I'm just trying to not make waves.

I'm just trying to do my thing. Do a good job. Yeah, yeah, not cause problems. I'm sure there's this idea that, you know, I'm, I need this, that, and the third. But all I needed was my big brother and my uncle with me, you know, I'm like. Right, but hold up. Stop for a second. Yeah.

to think about that, to come into a place and subconsciously know that everybody thinks that you need all this because you're this and you're that. And you haven't even said a word yet. Yeah, I'm chill. I'm chill. You're literally just showing up for the first day at work. I want to clock in. Everybody who goes with me has known me since I was kid.

They're not like I travel with family. So you come in subconsciously knowing that. Do you think that you have to behave differently than other people to make sure that everybody doesn't think that you need this, you need that, or do you kind of... Not necessarily act differently because I'm not that way anyway. Right. So it's like, I know when you find out, you're going to be like, damn. Like, I love the, you know, I thought you were going to be an asshole.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What do you mean? Hold on, why? That's funny. Hold on. So, like, um... It's real, though. It's really, real.

We're doing dinner thieves and our director, Christian Gutigazz, that's his first time directing, but he's produced and been on since his whole life. Right. He's another second generation Hollywood kid. So we're shooting, and my character in the first one is low-key. Like, you're not really supposed to be paying too much attention to him. So, you know, I don't get the big elaborate scenes and stuff like that. So I'm coming to set, and I'm just waiting for them to finish

so they could get to my little shit and then I get out of there. And so it's like I'm going like 11, 12, 13-hour days. days of just like not being used and I'm just sitting in the trailer just waiting and like it's a real mental game to keep yourself ready to do a scene all day and then they not use you yeah and so it was like the third time in a row that happened so I'm calling my dad I'm like yo pops like I don't know like do I do I speak up about him like what do I tell him and his reply was go just go home what do you mean just go home I just leave to dad I can't just leave yeah why not Like you're thinking like Ice Cube.

Yeah. I'm not Ice Cube, bro. I got to earn my stripes. I got to show that like, no, this dude's for real. Because they think I'm going to do that. Yeah. They think I'm going to do that. Like, and honestly, don't give me that green light, you know?

So, like, I have to have discipline. I have to show them that like, no matter what, you're not going to break me to be this shit you think I am. Right. From the first Den of Thieves to the second. Yeah. You all know each other. Obviously, you did well in the first one.

And now the second one, do you feel like at the end of that experience, do you feel like they did get to know you? Absolutely. Yeah. And I felt more comfortable because, like I said, the first one is my third film. I'm still nervous. I'm still just like, and that was my third film was my first time back on like a big budget film. Right.

The film I did in between Straight Out of Compton and Denny Thieves one was an indie called Ingrid Goes West. Yep. So like, and that movie did great things for me because he showed people like, oh, he really does. Just a side note. That is the one movie where I'm not doing any acting whatsoever. Right. I'm just being me.

And you're great. You were great in that. Thank you. People love it. You kill the indie movies. Yeah. Cocaine Barry. Indies are so fun because like we don't got no time for BS.

Right. It's just like, get out there and act. And it's all like, I love it. But so, Denetty. one is like back action you know it's different from the biopic I just did and the indie dark comedy with ingrit so it was like okay and I'm just trying to just have every stop I do nobody will have anything to say like no this dude showed up this dude did his job gave us no problems great on set great with crew that's all I want it's integrity man yeah that's all I want and so

It's also awareness. Yeah, just, just like. To care about your reputation. Yeah. Because you, you understand, and I understand now later in life, my reputation with how I behaved on that set or in that deal with that label or whatever. I always see everyone again down the road. Yeah.

And how I leave them is how they remember me. Bro. It's so many times, just a quick side note, I did Tony Hawk's podcast. And I was like, what made you hit me up? Like, I love you, Tony Hawk. And I was like, what made you hit me up? He said, dude, one time a young lady asked you for a picture. She said you were super sweet to her, super nice to her.

That was my sister. And it was like, I had to get you on. She said you were so cool. And it's just like, there's no point of being a dick. Yeah. And like, if people want to feel like, if I'm catching a flight or if I'm eating, yeah. But like people, you could not want to take a picture with me. Like you could just be like, you know, get out of my face.

But like the fact that you see me, you're excited enough that like, hey, can I get this flick? Whatever. All I'm going to do is staying here. But to get back to my difference with this dinner thieves in the first one, I was a nervous kid, the first one. Right. This time around, I've gotten plenty under my belt. Yeah. The IMDB is full.

Yeah. And I have confidence in my. And like you said, I've been around. I know how it works now. So I know what is asking too much of me. And I know when I got to stand up for myself. And I'm back with people who have seen that growth and recognizing. And I've done a television series where we got up to two seasons called Swagger.

And so that was my first time like ever having a crew that I remember and all that. This is my first time doing it with film. And to be able to be able to be able to be able to be able to be, I'm, like, ever having a crew that I remember. And so that was my first time. to have people who knew we hit lightning in a bottle the first time. The second one's really been our victory lap together. And it was, dude, it was great. Except when they kicked me in the ocean.

Yeah. They kick me in the ocean in this one, dude. Well, you know what's cool is a very hard thing for actors to capture and develop and get to is to be themselves on screen. See them cards? Yeah, I'm sorry. Oh, we'll get there. So I watch everything.

And I think I'm a good gauge, right? I always call everybody that's going to be big. I'll see someone in their first movie, and I'll be like, that guy's going to be big. I said that about you in Straight Out of Compton. Thank you, man. He said he's going to be big. Yes, it was the perfect role. Yes, no one else could have played it.

To hear the backstory, it makes me so happy because I love that movie. I think it's one of the greatest biopics of our time. and for a group that deserved the greatest biopic of our time. So as a fan of the culture of movies and music and and stories, I just thought they nailed it. And it was the story that should have been told and it was entertaining and it was heartfelt and it was all the things you want, right? But you are someone who I think come into themselves.

And for you, it's always going to be about the right role. because you played you. And guys who can do that are the best. And then to get to sit with you is great because I can go back to the movies and I can believe them even more. Because, you know, sometimes I see actors who are playing the role in life

instead of just on the movie. In the movie, you should be playing yourself. And then when I meet you in real life, it should be the guy that I feel like I know. That's kind of with me with actors. But I get it. It's hard for some guys, you know, they're playing, like, they're always playing the tough guy. Yeah. And then you're like, you meet him in real life and you're like, I feel like it would be confusing if you always had to be a tough guy. Yeah. You know what I mean?

All the time. That's how I feel about like. Always has to be a tough guy. I'm not always a tough guy. Like, that's how I feel with my dad and this goes back to what we were talking about before. Like, so I've always felt like Hollywood typecasts rappers. Like, then once they see you as this, it's hard for them to see you as anything else. And so, like, my dad is not angry all the time. Like, my dad is not, like, angry all the time. And a lot of the roles that he'll get from Hollywood is that. But when he writes something for himself, you see the real hymn. It's funny. And you see, like, like, yes, if need be, you can get the hands.

Yeah. But I'm also laughing, joking, playing heartwarming fathers. Like, Ice Cube is not my dad. O'Shea, senior. is my dad. And when he writes for himself, he does, he shows himself. And like every guy, he has sides to him. Yeah, we are, man. That's the thing in the world that we're, that we exist in, whether it's a guy with tattoos or a rapper or whoever, you're going to have two different kinds of interactions. You're going to have someone who comes up to you and kind of tries you.

Yeah. Because they want to see you're for real or whatever. And if you do that, I'm going to respond to that the way I respond to any guy who's coming up and that's a threat. I'm going to treat it like that. Exactly. Or if you come over the top, I might go, like, I'll try to be as nice as possible. But the most successful interaction you're going to have with me is a friendly one. Yeah. Because that's where I prefer to stay in the, in the pocket.

I mean, my show is called artist friendly because that's actually who I am. I like to meet people, talk to people, hang out. Yeah. And that's going to be the best interaction we have is if it's friendly. Exactly. And laid back. Exactly. You know, the genius of people who have been put in a box, my wife, I see her do it all the time.

They go, oh, this rich girl grew up in Hollywood. It must be dumb. Must be out of touch. Must be. She plays that character really well. And it's funny to her. Right. And I see her do it and I get inspired by it because that's not actually, she's a very thoughtful person who's great mom, great friends.

friend. Yeah, just solid. You got to find a way to, if you don't find a way to kind of maneuver through that. Yeah. If you fight against, stay here, never going to win. Yeah, because I'm constantly having to remind, like, it's just draining. And I feel that my dad, because they, people have this idea of what he's supposed to be, they can't see him in roles and things that I know he could crush.

And so when it came time to like really determine where my career was, because I did the music thing for a little bit. But then when straight out of conflict happened, a light kind of went off because then I'm starting to see like, I don't think I've ever been to an Oscar party before. Yeah. You know, like now I'm starting to like piece together what I want to do. And when I was a kid, my dad would get nominated for the MTV Movie Awards, that type stuff. And I wanted, as a kid, there was two things I wanted. I wanted that damn Nickelodeon blimp. Yeah.

And I wanted that popcorn from the moon man or the popcorn. Yeah. And Adam Sandler, you jerk, you will always be nominated at the same time. And Adam Sandler would win. Yeah, like, it's a kid. I wanted that popcorn so bad. Like, come on, Dad. Yeah.

And then straight out of Compton happened. And it fell on the 25th anniversary of the MTV Movie Awards. And the popcorn was black and gold. And we were nominated. And so that popcorn I was waiting for as a kid, I finally got and it had my name on it. And so that's when I was like, that's what we're supposed to do. Yep. In music, I'm never going to reach the heist that this dude has reached.

But in film, I know that they've shortchanged my guy because they see Ice Cube. They don't know my dad. They don't know the guy you know. Yeah, exactly. So my thought process was I'm going to get every award that they wouldn't give my guy. And full circle, he knew you too. Yeah, yeah. Man, I'm just saying, that's the most inspiring thing to me about your whole family.

You know, we could probably do a whole other podcast on the dynamics of your mom, your dad, your siblings. I like to, yeah, bro. But it's so important to understand, like, when they say it takes a village, right? Yeah. It does take a village. For all of us, we're all participating together. and the moment your dad says you have to do this role, he not only saw the potential that you had to go and realize by doing it,

and now look where you're at. He saw that. He saw all the way. He saw all the moves. But you had to show up and trust and then do all the work. Go to the set. One of the things I noticed too, very hard to accomplish. One, an actor that is playing that guy that you can rely on,

Right? When you see him on screen, you immediately connect with his character and you almost know him. You go right into the movie. You sink right into the movie because there's nothing uncomfortable about it. And it doesn't distract you from the role and the guy he's supposed to be. Right. And also your name now is on the poster. Yeah. Look at this guy. Come on. Yeah.

That's hard. That's hard, dude. When they do the movie poster, they have to decide which are the names are we going to put on the poster? I'm just saying, maybe not enough people talk about it. Yeah, that's... But we put the names up there that we can rely on. It's going to sell this. It's going to sell and people know it and they like it.

And if you're the name they don't like, if you're out there, if you're out in the world, causing havoc, you're not going on the poster. Yeah, no. You're a brand risk. But if you're out, if you're a guy we can rely on, and I'm not talking about fake, talking about the way we conduct ourselves in the world. We're either an asshole or we're a nice, we're a guy that, right, like, I don't want to be an asshole. We all have stuff we're angry about. Yeah. And there's places and times to express ourselves for sure. I'm not saying we shouldn't. But there's something about the success it takes to get to a level where hundreds of millions of

dollars be spent on something and we're putting your name up there. Yeah. That's a huge of Yeah, and it just comes back from worried about your reputation, how you conduct your business, having integrity in those things. And, you know, I understand that I've been blessed with an amazing opportunity, but then the opportunity, like, the door can open. You got to walk through it. Yeah, you got to walk through it. And the projects that I've chosen are stuff that I would always, I always see myself in. And that's what makes the characters I play seem relatable. because when I go into my acting coach, Aaron Spicer,

taught me how to think this way to kind of really get to the bare bones of who I'm playing. Like my dad, okay, is my dad, yes, you know, I understand that. When I did, Ingrid goes west. You know, I'm playing a guy, Dan Pinto, who is like this girl's landlord, you're unsure of her and all this other nonsense. What I held on to was, all right,

what about me is similar to Dan? He's a screenwriter. All right, got that. He loves Batman. I love Batman so damn much that immediately I was like, we're not acting in this at all. Which Batman do you like the most? Obviously, I love, I love bail. When I was a kid, Clooney was like the one I went to theaters to see, but I love Christian

Bail. I just love Batman because he's a regular dude. If he's not the most motivational superhero, because, like, he just got up and did it. You know, like, yes, he's got his family name, but there's a, version, absolute Batman now, where he's not rich and he's still doing it. And it's just like the guy who just had the guts, learned how to fight and just took it on. And also, just a side note to show how cool Batman is. In the Justice League, everybody in the Justice League calls Wonder Woman Wonder Woman, Wonder Woman. Batman calls Wonder Woman Diana. Yeah. That is, whoa.

You're a G, bro. So I love Batman. So I held that and I kept that energy and I used that with Dan. When it came to Donnie for Denad Theves Three, that was really just me using life to, you know, kind of reflect art with a guy who's just trying to keep his head down, do his work, and get out. That's exactly how I looked at myself with my career. When I did Long Shot, I play a tech billionaire, and I'm not sitting around thinking, what does a tech billionaire act like? They tell me, you're Seth Rogan's best friend, and you have to be his homie. I know how to be a good homie me and my friends we hype each other up for the dumbest shit

ever just you're a monster you're a beast like you know just so that's all that character is and we all have a homie like that yeah so like I just find those little things that I have a part of me and it makes it a real person and you're like no I like this dude

and when it comes to supporting roles with Stratton and with Shreda Compton and with Swagger and with this did a thieves you know it's more of a supporting lead role, but when you're doing supporting stuff where you might only have 15, 20 minutes of camera time, the way that I look at it as is everybody wants to be Luke Skywalker. Yeah.

Because you get the lightsaber, he's a Jedi. Hans Solo gets the girl, gets the car, gets the sidekick. Like, everybody wants to be Woody because Toy Story is about Woody. But Buzz Lightyear is the coolest toy in the world. Yeah. So you got to steal the screen a little bit and, like, have that like, yeah. I know what we're talking about, but that character, he's interesting. For me, if I was an actor, I'd always want to do supporting.

Yeah, you're the X factor. You push it forward. Absolutely. Yeah, man. Yeah, I agree totally. Because, like, the movie was what's being so. The coolest characters. It's always going to be, you know, what you paid to see.

If you can be the X factor in the movie of just like, oh, I wasn't expecting to have a good time with this too, now you got a great film. And everybody wants to see you again. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Then you get you, you know, it's just how it is. You know, those characters get spin-offs and stuff like that. Did you have more fun with Denny Thieves, too?

Absolutely. Because you came in knowing. Dennythieves one, I'm getting beat up for two and a half hours. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, like, after a while, just like, you're this, Dinothies One, I'm the snitch. Yeah.

Like, I don't get a gun. Yeah. It's just like, they get the, just getting beat up, just getting beat up in hotel rooms and choked out in police trucks. You get to be a little bit more of an action star. Yeah. Now I get to like spread the wings of the character a little bit because now the audience is, they know. Yeah. You're a liar. Yeah. You know, you're a facade. Yeah. So I got to have fun with that and I got to kind of learn about the character with the audience because I don't know nothing about Donnie. I don't even know

if Donnie's his real name. Right. Like we know nothing. So it was fun and I really think that's the advantage we have because everybody's always comparing sequels to the first one. Yeah. This is a a different movie with the same characters. Right. So it is, it's fun, man. I had a great time. And I got to go to Spain. I was never going to go by myself. So like I'd be able to go there for work. It was great.

Yeah. Do you want to do more action movies? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I've already been talking to Christian, you know, if you know, Lord willing, if this thing, if this saga continues, I'm going to have to get

so stupidly, Hollywood ripped for the next one, and I'm not excited about it at all. But I'm going to be gorgeous, but yeah, yeah. Yeah. I'll be gorgeous, but that sucks. It sucks. That's the part about action films that, like, it's a grind, but they translate better overseas, and that's when you become a superstar.

Like, you can be a star, but, like, when we do films in America based off, like, American topics, they might not have the gravity. that they have here overseas. So, like, it's not translated well of the weight of the film. Yeah. Everybody know explosions, cars and guns, baby. So, like, that's easy to shop in these other countries. And, you know, it's why blockbusters sell worldwide the way that they do.

Because, like, what's not to like about Spider-Man and Iron Man teaming up to fight who gives a damn? Yeah. It's just, it translates well no matter what the language is. language barrier or anything. So yeah, action. Yeah, get that, uh, get that salary up. Yeah. Yeah, well, that's what happens. Being a student of just watching movies, I watch everything. I love movies. I would say you're on the road to that, especially because you're just like coming into your prime. The next 20 years, you're just going to be making movies, all kinds of movies. And I want to, because in my, in my film student heart, I love,

I love artsy movies. Yeah. I want to do a Wes Anderson movie so bad. Yeah. Like the Grand Budapest Hotel, like that's one of my favorite films. Like, I love those. But just need, you know, I need to get a little box office first. And then I'll do it for the art.

But right now, you know, I got a kid and I got a daughter. And that's going to get expensive. So I need money. It does. Yeah. I need some bread first. And then, you know, I can do it for the cinematic. Yeah, that's going to come.

Yeah. I'm telling you right now, like, you're on that. As long as you show up and you do it, it's going to happen. Yeah. That's just how it works. Because you're good on screen. You're just good on screen. You do the indie films really well.

Yeah. But you do the big ones good, too. And I think it's a matter of time, you know? Because I could see you doing a lot of action movies. Yeah. But you're really good in the indie movies. I love, man, it's just something about it. TV, too.

Yeah, TV, bro. I love TV because, like, it'll send you a check that you've forgotten about. Yeah. That is the best. And it's kind of a, it's a good, like, almost like a nine to five gigs sometimes, you know. And you get to, like, film, like, yeah, we all, anybody getting into acting, like, yeah, you want to do movies, you know, you want the marquee and all that. But, like, it's something about being able to stay with a character beyond an hour and a half. Yeah. That, like, you get to really, like, find some stuff that you just can't with a film.

Unless you have a sequel, a trilogy and yada, yeah. But, like, when I did Swagger, to be able to have a character have to grow over 10 episodes and then the next season eight, like, I've been with this guy for a while, you know? And so you start to, you get to play in a different type of sandbox. So, like, yeah, TV, man. I dig TV. And it's cool now, too, because it used to be, the last 10 years has been different or beyond 10 years, but really, it used to be like you did TV or you did film.

Yeah. Now you do anything you want. There's no rules now. Exactly. It used to be, like, frowned upon, but then it's like, no, dude, like, don't shortchange yourself. Yeah. You know, don't cheat yourself, treat yourself. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, I can do it all. Why not? Yeah. I like your podcast. Yeah. Yeah, that's the shit. It's real.

It's real. Real wrestling fans. Yeah. And it's, I got to talk to, like, it's one thing where somebody's like, yo, you know, I'm a fan of you, yada, yada, y'all. But when you guys get to chat it up and then you start to like develop, like, it's the best, man. And I am. What era wrestling are you really like?

Attitude era. Yeah. I got my, um. Can somebody get my, it's something in the trunk. Can you grab that for me, Taylor? It came up naturally. I don't know what the problem. What do you have?

But, you'll see. But yeah, I'm an. Attitude era guy. I got a big brother, Daryl, who got me into everything except anime. I found that on my own. But we were playing Sega Genesis. He had a game, WWF Raw. And it taught me people like Razor Ramon, Bam Bam Bigelow, Undertaker, Doink the Clown,

Brett, like Sean Michaels. And so, like, that's where I know these guys from. And then it turned into, you know, we can watch this. I was like on TV, like, we could watch, like, they're real weekend. Yeah, I was like, is the Undertaker really dead? I keep it with me, bro. Oh. Where did you get this?

I got that when I was in fourth grade and I've had it ever since. That's amazing. Yeah. Where did you get it? The F, they sell them on the shop, but now, see at the top, it's got the F on it. The F, they don't sell them with the F anymore. Oh, wow. Yeah, so you can't get them with the F.

This is awesome. Yeah. This is a real. I always, the reason why. Do you ever put it on? Of course, dude. But you see how soft as leather is now, dude? That's 2001 leather right here.

2001. And so, yeah, I'm an attitude-era guy always will be, you know, rock, stone cold, Triple H, Undertaker. I started watching on a weekly basis probably in 99, 2000, and just really haven't looked back. And the reason why I just happen to have a wrestling belt with me, just keeping it with me, is because I bring belts, number one, to every set I've ever been on. They've seen me with a wrestling belt at some point.

I have 15 belts, all different. And the reason why is I bring them on days that I either don't feel like it or I hit a wall where I'm just like, man, I'm tired. And the reason why is when I was doing straight out of Compton, I was talking to my mom, and I was just exhausted. It was my first time acting, having early call times, having to bring on emotion for 12-hour days and like things like that. And I hit a wall.

And I talked to my mom and she was like, you got to go. And I was like, yeah, I know. And she was like, I'm not telling you you got to go because it's work and you have to go. You got to go because you're a champ. Got to go. Yeah. And then I took that and I was like, you know what, Mom? You fucking right.

And she was like, don't cuss. No, but no. I was like, yeah, mom, you're right. Sometimes that's what we need to hear. Yeah, so I grabbed my belt and I took it to work. And they were like, what's with the belt? I'm a champ, bro. I kind of like, I got it.

So anytime I'm like, I hit a wall, I take a bell to work. So it was just funny that you, perfect time. But we all need to figure out what our belt is. Yeah, absolutely. You know what I mean? Like, I think that we live in a world where no one is supposed to believe in themselves or something. Like, it's not okay. It's a dream.

Right. And I always talk about things on this show more for people listening because I actually believe that everyone has potential. Yeah. And somehow it gets beat out of us sometimes in the world or we're told to not be a certain way or not to be. And I think that to have a belief in yourself and the confidence that you have, whatever that confidence is, you hopefully gain more. of it, right? Yeah. Is to show up. And then also to view the world as a place where I can succeed is a hard thing to do sometimes. And it's understandable too, right? Everybody's up against a lot.

And we all have different things we're up against. But if you don't hear that from someone. Yep. Yes, dude. Because I tell people, we all know the saying, if you do what you love, you never work a day in your life. Yes, we get it. Number one that has plenty of holes in it. But like, most people don't see their own talent because it comes so easy to them that they don't think that you can possibly make money off of it. Right. And it's like until you have somebody being like, dude, why don't you do that? Yeah, that's valuable. Yeah, exactly.

And so a lot of people are saying that's not valuable. Yeah, I was a daydreamer who was thinking of stories all day and until I had a teacher be like, yo, write that shit down. That's valuable. Yeah, it's valuable. I'm like, oh, wow, I could, yeah, I guess I could make money off this. And the implicit message that you're valuable. Yeah. That we need to hear that from someone.

Yeah, you got it in you. It's something that you can do easily that is not easy for everybody to do. Yeah. And that's your shit and you've been ignoring it. Great people make things look easy. Yeah. That's why we can watch sports and criticize. Criticize them, I should have done this.

Right. Because you make him to look easy. Because he makes it look easy. Why didn't you just use your words? wings, LeBron. Yeah. You hear some great artist and they put out a song and like, that song's no good. And you're like, why don't you do it and see if it's no good.

Yeah, old wise one. Yeah, a wise one. Yeah, because we all are like these, you know, when we're sitting on our couch, we're all experts. We're watching. That's the entertainment side of it. Yeah. But when we get deep about it, which most people don't want to do because there's a bit of

vulnerability when we go deep. It takes work to dig. Yeah. And you tell someone like, I think you should believe in yourself, it kind of sounds. It's fairy tales. Yeah. And it's not. Well, my dream's going to come true.

Yes. Yeah, actually. Actually, yes. Like, do I want to live a life where I'm reaching for the very best possible result I can get? Or do I want to live a life that makes everyone else feel comfortable with my existence? Right. So that I can just go along. and not...

You're not living for you. You're living for other people in that point. And then the reality is, is it's still going to be painful. Yeah. So what version of a painful, a life of pain and suffering do I want to have? One that I enjoy or one that I don't enjoy. Because life is pain and suffering. We're going to lose people.

At the end, we're going to say goodbye to people. That's a fact. Like at some point, we are going to say goodbye to everyone we love. We are going to experience loss. We're going to experience moments of frustration. We're going to experience all the things that everyone experiences. No one gets out of it. I heard the motivational speaker once in a intense dude.

He's like, I don't know if he's a coach or whatever. Every time he talks to somebody, it sounds like a football coach, you know. But he said, don't cry to quit, cry to keep going. You already hurt. You're already in pain. Get something from it. Yeah. So like what you said of just like how you're going to suffer anyway.

Period. Let's at least shoot for the stars, baby. Swing. I say the same thing to my son when we're talking about work, and I go, he's like, how it was work? And I was like, oh, it was a long day or was a whatever day. But it's better than construction. Yeah.

And I worked construction and I did that and I made pizzas and I did this. And I got to have, I watched my dad work two jobs. We all got to work. Yeah, we all got to work. Got to work. Period. Keep the lights on. And to be alive.

Yeah. The sooner you get comfortable with the idea that it's all going to be work. Yeah. the sooner you can get to it and just get after it and grow and learn. So that's my mantra. And recognize baby steps count. Yeah, they do. Baby steps count.

It's not, we're in a very weird time where we're in the Insta era. Yeah, you're supposed to be big. Yeah, exactly, the Insta era. What do you mean you're not flying private? Yeah, what do you mean? Yeah, no, dude, shout out to Delta. Like any level of progression, is progression.

Yeah. You know? And as long as like Kobe used to say, if you're running, you know, you're running around the track, if I just look at the finish line the whole time,

it is going to seem like it's taking forever. But if I look at my feet and just one step at a time, one step at a time, one step at a time, by the time I look up, I've crossed it already.

So you have to acknowledge that you have to crawl before you walk. You have to walk before you run. If you run before you can think about flying. Every role matters. Yeah, exactly. it's just always going to be progressing you and then you will end up where you want to be.

One thing that I wish I would have known when I was in college though, because even though I did leave, my passion for riding state. So I kind of shortchanged myself because when it came to college and I was a rebellious student at USC and I was like, why the hell are y'all not just grading me on my major? I don't give a damn about G.E's. you only want me to do G E's, so your numbers is better than UCLA, and I just went on this whole tangent. Right.

What I didn't realize was a guy by the name of John Ireland, who does the Lakers play-by-play, told me this quote, don't let school get in the way of your education. And school is drama with students, teachers you don't like, and all the nonsense that goes into school will get in the way of your education. And one of the things that I wish I would have did or recognized from college is when you're doing your major and that's something that you really are passionate about

and this is what you want to do and like you think that that's your thing, recognize that all a college is doing is putting a bunch of people who have the same idea in the same room. So maybe connect, bro. Maybe that person will have the qualities that you wish you had

that will help make something happen. All the tech things we hear in the world started in a garage with a bunch of dudes. Yeah. So like, take advantage. Who dropped out of college together. Yeah, take a bit. But like, you were, whatever major, you were, like, and then, like, they link up.

Yeah. So, like, that's an advantage that I wish I, you know, shout out to all my writing buddies from that freshman class of 09. Because if I would have had them, that's 10, 10 writers. That's a team. I can make a show right now. I could like, you know. And so, like, through Instagram, I just got to hope that they all stayed writing.

Yeah. And, but yeah, that's just, that's my message to the world. But I would say to have that wisdom at 33 is you're ahead of the game. Well, that's good news. So, Lord, I don't feel like. So to realize that at 33 is wisdom because there are a lot of people in their early 30s that are still trying to figure it out. And I think that you're on track for already a great career. But I think that the work ethic, the focus, and the ability to navigate.

navigate the wonkiness of the entertainment business is something that I think it takes to be resilient and to have a career. And so if you just keep showing up, it's going to be really fun to watch. Because I know what I want for myself. I know it takes time to get there. I just got to keep staring at my feet. And I know one step at a time. One step at a time, bro. Congrats on dent at these two. Thank you, Doc. It's out in two days. Yeah. Congrats. I'll be watching it. Thank you, man. Do you want to rip some cards? I hope you enjoyed today's episode of Artist Friendly. If you really liked it, you can follow, like, subscribe to the show,

anywhere you listen to podcasts, Spotify, Apple, Amazon. We appreciate your support, and we'll see you next time.