Ask Dr. Drew - Ask Dr. Drew with Scott Adams: Hydroxychloroquine, COVID-19, Addiction & More - Episode 22

Episode Date: August 11, 2020

Ask Dr. Drew returns with Scott Adams, to discuss hydroxychloroquine, zinc, and their opinion of Dr. Fauci during the COVID-19 pandemic. Dr. Drew also answers caller questions about alcoholism, how to help family members with opioid addiction, and how Dr. Drew first became interested in addiction medicine. Get an alert when Dr. Drew is taking calls: http://drdrew.tv/  Scott Adams is the creator of Dilbert, which has over 70 million books and calendars in print. Order Scott Adam's book LOSERTHINK at this link and part of your purchase supports our shows: http://go.drdrew.com/loserthink  Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (@KalebNation) and Susan Pinsky (@FirstLadyOfLove). THE SHOW: For over 30 years, Dr. Drew Pinsky has taken calls from all corners of the globe, answering thousands of questions from teens and young adults. To millions, he is a beacon of truth, integrity, fairness, and common sense. Now, after decades of hosting Loveline and multiple hit TV shows – including Celebrity Rehab, Teen Mom OG, Lifechangers, and more – Dr. Drew is opening his phone lines to the world by streaming LIVE from his home studio in California. On Ask Dr. Drew, no question is too extreme or embarrassing because the Dr. has heard it all. Don’t hold in your deepest, darkest questions any longer. Ask Dr. Drew and get real answers today. This show is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. All information exchanged during participation in this program, including interactions with DrDrew.com and any affiliated websites, are intended for educational and/or entertainment purposes only. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. It is a special Ask Dr. Drew. We are welcoming my friend Scott Adams. You can follow him at Scott Adams Says. You can watch his Periscope every morning. can get his books how to fail at almost everything and still win big or also win bigly persuasion in a world where facts don't matter his those are the two books I have read I didn't realize God debris I

got to read that one as well so there's more for me to be learning here from the great Scott Adams our laws as it pertained to substances are draconian and bizarre psychopaths start this way. He was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction, fentanyl and heroin. Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for f*** sake. Where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat.

You have trouble, you can't stop, and you want to help stop it. I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. Welcome, Scott. Thanks for having me. It is a privilege, man. And I was giving you grief before the microphones heated up that i have a coffee here i didn't understand why i was getting coffee but because

you're a trained hypnotist clearly you have programmed me every time i see not just you but your room there which is where you do your periscope i must be drinking coffee to have the simultaneous sip that's we all participate in every morning you know i try to model the various you know persuasion tricks that i talk about and one of them is matching something you like with something you want somebody to like so i match having coffee with my periscope to make them like them and you can see the results it's it's pretty strong if you just keep doing enough enough it is ridiculous and and by the way, I was having sort of a powerful experience just looking at the backdrop behind you because I watch your Periscope on a regular basis. By the way, I found out about Scott long before he started doing his Periscope.

I get fascinated by people that have very clear points of view that are communicated about phenomena that aren't usually addressed so i got very fascinated with jordan peterson years ago because i thought he was bringing together anthropology and psychology and i thought that was very interesting his maps of meaning lectures and i found you on various podcasts talking about persuasion probably like four years ago uh when did you start the periscope probably 2016 I think so it was related to the first election and maybe you would just maybe you were making the rounds because you had started the periscope or something I wasn't aware of it until one Greg Gutfeld leaned across his desk to me when I was on his show and said aren't you listening to his pod his periscope

I'm like what what periscope and that was that and i was hooked and you it strangely had greg greg gutfeld on this morning i did his book is on the shelf behind me right there the i've already forgotten the name of the plus the plus the plus it's a good book i i i read it and i dog-eared a bunch of stuff i'm going to be interviewing him on this stream and i've got a bunch of stuff i want to talk to him about i thought it was quite good it was not win bigly it was not win bigly but it's quite good so uh also before the mics heated up well i'm deflecting because this is a an auspicious day when scott is in the middle of a you'll excuse the expression a shit storm and we'll describe it in a mere moment i know those of you that are on youtube we're going oh here we go all right here it comes before we go to that

we talked about something more positive which was this coronavirus experience has shaken the box in such a way that there are hidden benefits that you're beginning to see tell me about that yeah one i mentioned is that the cost of my wedding went way down if you can only do it in the backyard it saves a lot of money but there's no gas no gas or not very few there's just a ton of things that are there's small things that are better for example when i go to the grocery store i don't love the fact that i'm wearing a mask but i really like the fact that everybody else because because i'm going to be picking up that food and putting it in a bag and taking it home and the less

exhalations there are better. I mean, it may be 100% psychological, but it makes makes me happy. We got way more outdoor dining. Yeah, you know, my town was one of the ones that you know, I suggested early and I hope that helped that they would turn the main street into a dining thing at night and weekends and they did and it's great it's it's better than you know saying can we have an outdoor seat on a summer night and they go oh you should have called three days ago now it's outdoors all the time yeah the weather's perfect here i got an e-bike best thing you've ever seen in your life if you've never

ridden an electric bike it's a whole cool experience that's like not like anything you can imagine um people walking more exercising more i mean it's just it's a pretty long list of small things i i got a paper receipt yesterday at the grocery store and i said to myself i'll bet this is like a few weeks from never seeing one again because why am I touching it right now and there's a whole bunch of handshake things that are not necessary then today in the news I heard a news bit about how the airports are thinking of eliminating the whole line for check-in and they just sort of maybe scan your face on the way in you're like

we know who you are so a whole bunch of stuff's going to be better not to mention pandemic preparation for the next one i mean it's hard to put a dollar amount on that but it's trillions yeah that's that's an important point is that we are sort of ready for the big one so to speak i mean this is it's like this is like this was a moderately large earthquake as compared to the big one nothing i've noticed we're also ready in case there's a i would imagine maybe you can tell me if this is crazy but aren't we more ready for like a biological attack or would that be just so different you know no it's not so different and i've discovered that there is a major virology or bioterrorism uh uh institution in nebraska just outside of i think lincoln and they i've talked to someone whose sister was working there

and they were like oh my god these guys guys, you know what they're doing. But it is it is on over there. So there's something stirred, you know, by this. Obviously, reasonably right. I mean, if you're a bioterrorism expert, you're going to you're going to learn from this and you're going to you're going to ramp up your activities to try to make it better from what we've learned from this when the other thing we've learned is that um and i'm so glad for this is that models don't do anything models are not science this this constant calling in the name of science what we're doing is just they have to stop it the models are just sort of they're almost like putting you know say put your finger up if you're a sailor and go

which way the wind's blowing it doesn't mean you've got nowhere it's going to blow in an hour i i would give it a just slightly more usefulness yeah which is it could tell you the range of what's not crazy right right but that's all i could that's in such a big range but it does tell you that you know you've run all the numbers in every way you can you can't get it up to here right like you can't get it to 10 million dead no matter what you do right that's useful but it doesn't tell you it's going to be 973 642 right so so when you see things carried out to beyond two digits frankly you know immediately that's that is rhetoric that is somebody trying to manipulate you uh i i what did i see oh this uh study that said if we just shut down one week earlier we would have saved 10 473 lives okay that's yeah and and and don't get me started

about trying to compare one leader to another or country to another. Right. They're just fundamentally, completely different. And if you don't trust me, and I do this work, we may mention that later, but, you know, it's something that I actually know a lot about. Ask somebody that you trust who does, you know, data analysis for a living. They really understand statistics. And ask them to compare two countries, any countries, and see if you have enough to really make any kind of determination. Someday, maybe we can tease that with something after the

fact. But I'll tell you what you can't do is look at all different strategies in the middle of the, I'm going to call it a game just for reference. It's not a game. But you don't know if the rope-a-dope is the one that comes strong at the end you don't know if the people who preserve the economy get a gigantic payoff that's you know 10 to 20 years of extra market dominance that they wouldn't have had you know compared to the other economies who got maybe a little more crushed so there's just no way to evaluate this stuff right and so many variables so many untoward consequences for instance i love the model of stopping you know if we'd only shut down 10 days earlier

if we shut down 10 dailies earlier there would have been no south carolina primary and bernie would be your democratic candidate is that good wow wow right yeah yeah the the unintended consequences the you know yeah they're they're just too many and that's what's good what's bad as a clinician i'm very accustomed to thinking that way it's all we constantly do we're always okay we're going to do this aggressive thing what are the potential downsides and how do we prepare for it when i was teaching residents that was always what i slammed them for i said make your mistakes but have your backup plan know where you're going i will never i'll never fault you for making a mistake but have your backup plan know where you're going i will

never i'll never fault you for making a mistake but if you don't know what to do next because of that mistake or because of untoward consequence then then i'm going to slam you uh and that's i look at the performance of all the leaders like somebody just you know dropped a bag of marbles you know on the on the ground and some some rolled in some directions randomly somebody was going to get a better result right but everybody was guessing they were all guessing initially because the data was terrible the model you know just just there was no real information to make real decisions we didn't know what meds worked we didn't know when we'd have meds right we didn't know how bad the economy would be. Nobody really crushed an economy intentionally.

We didn't know what that was going to look like. Is that good? Is that bad? We didn't know the herd immunity. We didn't know anything. So on day one, early on, I was saying publicly and often, someday you're going to look back and say somebody made mistakes or didn't, and you're just going to be wrong.

Because if you were there there wasn't anything to know it's great to have hindsight hey you're a genius now looking back at the past that's right but it's just not fair i remember when uh our governor california and by the way susan i i think i'm on your show's call-in studio so i can't get in so i just can't get in yeah um but when our governor shut down uh the state I thought it was a gross excess but I thought to myself all right we don't know it's the fog of war he's preparing for worst case I I don't know how I'd make that decision in that moment so I'm going to support the guy so that was my feeling at the moment right right and and he gave the um he gave the option of adjusting yeah we'll try this we'll pull back try it pull back and as long as your leader is is

testing they're transparent they're telling you what they're going to do tell you why they're going to do it yeah and they say if this doesn't work we this is how we adjust it's sort of as good as you can do and i would say that about you know most of the governors blue or red has nothing to do with that's right politics i agree with you uh the um the other thing i think i do a nightly news program on fox 11 local affiliate here and we're dealing with politicians a lot and i think the other thing the other other unto uh beneficial effect of coronavirus that we may not see yet is that politicians have learned who pay their bills i feel like they they learned they learned that oh my they're they're literally all

astonished that their tax base is sort of is dried up they're like what where's the where's the money oh and i literally had one politician tell me with a straight face well we have a 56 billion dollar deficit and we can't print money so we got to get the federal government to print the money and give it to us they'll just print it up and give it to us i was like oh my god you're a leader you're a budget in the budget committee of the state oh my god i hope you learn the lesson from this but you know the thing that nobody quite understands and i'm including myself in this and i've got, you know, degree in economics is that can you just print money? Now, ordinarily, ordinarily, no, it would be hugely inflationary. But in this weird, weird

situation, that's not like any other situation, demand has just fallen through the floor, right? And under that condition, maybe you can print a lot of money and sort of get away with it, or at least it's the best thing you can do. So the whole issue of printing money goes from the worst idea to the best idea just by the situation and it's happening worldwide and nobody's ever seen that before so who knows what that's going to do i mean hopefully we'll just restart in a different place a friend of mine framed it this morning for me rather interesting he said it's like building a bridge don't think it's not so much a currency issue as much as building a bridge or a time machine it's going to move us forward to where we can resume

you understand uh i yes i i heard that uh the the notion is that it's sped up all the things that were going to evolve that way anyway we just had to get there faster. But I'm wondering now with the the printing of money, it is certain and inevitable that we'll go to digital money. This when and how what's the transition look like? And it might be and I'd have to talk to somebody a lot smarter. So this might be just crazy talk right now. But hey, you're used to that. You've heard me before. Yes, I'm wondering if the transition to an all digital let's say a crypto kind of a thing might be the point where you could extinguish your debt you you might be

able to wipe it out if you were if you were clever now I'm not positive that works but the native the nature of the crypto is that it's demand-based and you know you've got lots of flexibility about what is what it's demand based and you know you've got lots of flexibility about what it's what it's worth etc so maybe there's just a way to extinguish it it's interesting to me i i've had this feeling that something about this is going to create a i'm sorry i'm reconnecting a new computer here as we talked here because my computer wasn't getting the call in studio i needed but um going to create an efficiency that might do these these seemingly impossible things like that well i want to here's the deal i want to get into the shit storm you've been in the middle of today if you don't mind uh today you've tried very hard

to get canceled uh if you do get canceled we will all find you over at locals is that accurate correct yes locals.com and just look for me by name. Okay, so Locals.com if Scott disappears. He's been trying hard to get canceled by being honest and provocative. But let's open the conversation by taking a call. Is that cool with you? Sure. All right.

This is Danny. Go ahead, Danny. Hey there. Thanks for taking my call. My question was about, I want to know what your thoughts are on states banning hydroxychloroquine. And I guess in particular, I was reading an article about Ohio banning it, and I guess they might have reversed that ban. But I'd like to kind of hear your thoughts on that. All right. So let's frame it as such. Thank you, Danny. Great question. might have reversed that band um but i'd like to kind of hear your thoughts on that all right so let's frame it as such thank you danny great question uh the thing that i find so astonishing

about this whole situation and then the reason i got in trouble scott is i saw this coming i i saw it i i was the reason i kept got so vocal at the beginning about trying to regulate everyone's emotion and trying. I was trying to push back on what I saw was a tsunami of hysterical panic porn press. And my fear was they were going to adulterate medicine. I just kept saying, just listen to Fauci. Just that's where you go. Read the CDC. That's it. And then listen to your doctor. just just that's where you go read the cdc that's it and then listen to your doctor you and your doctor you'll figure this out

the way we did with the h1n1 epidemic is what i kept saying which affected a billion people and killed 600 000 people and you don't even know what happened so you know relax calm calm yourself and and listen to fauci he'll get us through this. Well, I was condemned for that. And my rhetoric was excessive. And I apologize for that. But here we are now where physicians are unable to prescribe a medicine that I've literally prescribed a thousand doses of. And I've never seen a single side effect. I cannot say that of aspirin or Tylenol. But I can say that of Plaquenil. You now know it's hydroxychloroquine

and lawmakers are getting involved with my relationship with my patient and my ability to prescribe a medication that I the patient and I together might be appropriate you take it there there does seem to be a difference between what an organization can handle as their risk both political risk and you know how the public sees them, and what a doctor and a patient would do, which is just make a risk management decision, which is independent of what anybody thinks of it. The privacy of the doctor-patient relationship gives you flexibility that an organization... Somebody told me that my health care provider kaiser permanente that they don't allow a hydroxychloroquine for this particular use for the coronavirus i don't know if that's true but it would make sense to me that an organization would be cautious in a different

way because they have a different set of concerns yeah the liability is different standards are different they have sort of uh standards of practice and stuff. Yeah, I get that. I get that. I agree with you. And I was trying to guess how many doctors worldwide who are real doctors in other countries. I know a lot of Americans are surprised, but the doctors in other countries, they have medical degrees. What? They can Google stuff. They're real doctors. but the doctors in other countries they have medical degrees what they can do what they can they can google stuff they're real doctors crazy and how many would you guess and of all the doctors

in the world i don't know how many millions there might be what would be the total number do you think that would prescribe hydroxychloroquine for the coronavirus it's hard to tell because everyone's afraid to speak up dr oz and i went public i have prescribed it for coronavirus to good effect i suspect uh he and i both agreed if we developed a fever we would take it with zinc um and and that's as far as we sort of went so there's two doctors opinions it's over the counter in in many countries it's so safe that it's literally over the counter but there are a number of you know first world countries are there not who are uh prescribing it routinely yes and it's part of their part of their national

the national directive of what's okay and what's not okay yes there are and so at the very least cnn which is a national program should say yeah if you look at the whole world, they have doctors too. Yeah. And they think it's okay. Right. And they're real doctors. Right. So what happened to you today?

So I have the weirdest life. This is why sometimes I think I'm in a software simulation because my life is like a, like a, like a game with levels. So I'm just, I'm just minding my own business this morning. You know, I'm getting my second cup of coffee. I'm like, ah, I think I'll see what's on the news. And I opened up the news and I'm in the news. I'm like, no, I want to watch the news i want to be the observer i want to be here i want you to be the news you be the news i'll watch no i don't

want to be the news and what happened was peter navarro was on aaron burnett's show on cnn and they got into it on hydroxychloroquine but But of course, you know, on TV, you got crosstalk and, you know, misinformation and everything. So Peter Navarro couldn't quite get out the risk management argument, which is the argument that I think he would prefer. So instead, he referred to me by name and said, do you know Scott Adams? You should watch the video he made. Now, here's the part that got me in trouble. If that's all you hear. And Aaron Burnett,

you know, uh, quickly, uh, corrected him to say that I'm a cartoonist and you shouldn't get medical advice from a cartoonist. But that of course is fake news, right?

Cause I've never offered medical advice. I would never offer medical advice. I practically say it as a mantra. When I talk about this yeah this is no medical advice yes and moreover I don't have a firm opinion on whether hydroxychloroquine even works right you've been very you said 50% probability that that will find out something good that's sort of all you've ever said 50 50 50 based on the fact that it's true that the most rigorous studies say it doesn't work, but it's also true, this is the part they leave out, that all the studies where there was a

rigorous good study, studied the wrong application of the drug. Wrong application. And that's well known. And wrong drugs. That's well known. And wrong drugs. And the wrong drug. Yeah.

So let me frame for everyone what we do know and and by the way i am changing and adapting my opinion as the literature comes in as of yesterday morning i had i was sort of inclined to think that hydroxychloroquine might be a good prophylactic agent the literature that came out in the new england journal of medicine yesterday showed pretty clearly it's not a good prophylactic agent now the study was done without zinc which is thought to be the active agent let's say this very clearly studies without zinc are non-stud not studying the treatment they're studying something else uh whether hydroxychloroquine would work by itself but nobody's advocating for that everyone who advocates how the galaxy chloroquine has said

zinc is the active ingredient and they leave that out crazy okay so but i'm still prepared to accept that it's probably not a good prophylactic agent there's some good really good studies about five studies on hospitalized patients sick patients now let's talk about it when people get to the hospital they're in the next phase of the illness typically the first phase is the viral typically the first phase is the viral replication the second phase is the cytokine activation once you get to the hospital if you're having resolved your viral replication and now you're into the cytokine storm there is no expectation that this treatment will work so they studied that it didn't work okay without zinc by the way without zinc we still have not answered the

question and here's the here's the here's what somebody's got to do a randomized placebo-controlled study but rp rps randomized placebo-controlled or rpc study rather rpc study on early disease first three days when the viral replication is doing its thing zinc at at least 25 milligrams hydroxychloroquine unclear on the dosing at least 400 milligrams at the beginning 200 maybe there after that maybe more 400 milligrams more than that i don't know that's now you're looking at big dose stuff i don't know but let's say two 400 begin with maybe two i'm thinking 200 after that and then the azithromycin and i i'm less you know sort of enhanced i don't think the disarmates is doing very much but it's been part of the protocol and let's remind ourselves that in 2005 there was a very fine article published i believe it was

journal of virology that a one anthony fauci championed that that hydroxychloroquine i think was actually a chloroquine study chloroquine was a excellent treatment and he went public with this for sars coronavirus one are you aware of that study but without a rpt right uh without the with it without a gold standard trial because in 2005 real people i think i think it was largely based on it was based on reduced viral shedding if i remember the study correctly it was it was again not a placebo-controlled study it was more like hey we can really reduce the viral shedding in people let's use this this looks great that was that was the application but to be fair fauci says today that the only reliable one would not include his own study because it was a lower quality

correct study that is correct it was an observational study yeah so so so on twitter on twitter people are frying him for being inconsistent because he used to say it works and now he doesn't yeah but i would i would i would say that he's very specific oh he's very he is i've known i the reed scott the reason i got on the radio was because of anthony fauci and yeah i was i was an accolade of his in the aids epidemic and he was saying we've got to get out and educate we're gonna have 10 million dead he's he's a little he has a rhetorical flair but he is very careful with with the science he's exquisite so i know you can always rely on him when people are critical of him i i know there's something in it that's accurate even if it seems like he's flip-flopping now let me ask you this i saw somebody uh look look to see how many hydroxychloroquine trials are still in some kind of process.

Now, according to CNN, we already know it won't work. Are there 117 trials in which they haven't seen CNN? And they're like, if only we'd seen CNN, we would know we could cancel this trial because it's got to be expensive. And first of all, how dare you? It's a first rate killer. it's going to kill people ask ask joy behar i heard i heard her screaming at a senator that how could your doctor do that joy behar i want you to think about this and and i love joy i've known her for many many years but here's a talk show host who learned how to pronounce a medication two weeks prior a medicine i've been using for 30 years

and she has an opinion about it that's insane everybody that's that's the nuttiness of the world we're in would you agree uh yeah and you know just to defend myself a little bit uh when I talk about it I only talk about the risk management and I just point to the fact that there's uncertainty and low risk low cost yeah might work right so that so let's state that so that's that is my diathesis that i rely on which is if somebody has a fever let's say they have a high risk exposure and they get fever i have nothing to offer them except this possible treatment that cost about a buck 50 uh and no one benefits from it no one profits what's that and it would take you two days to confirm a test from the virus yeah at least i mean if you're lucky you get a

turnaround and so we have a couple of days where no harm no foul no cost the cost benefit analysis come down and by the way 30 years of experience using the drug comes down very hard in favor of doing it now it may do nothing but i don't believe i will have in any way and i've done it i've actually done it in clinical practice uh so i'm not harming anybody with it in the hospitalized patient different story different story different thing i understand that it's it's still a you know it's not conclusive in hospitalized patients, but I think a consensus is there. That's fine. But this rhetoric around it stays.

You got to have an EKG. And by the way, Scott, watch this. If you ever hear a doctor say you need to have an EKG or be monitored, they've never prescribed the medicine. They've never prescribed this medication. Because here's what we would do. Because I used to, it was first-line medication for lupus and rheumatoid arthritis back like 30, 40 years ago. And I used to prescribe it a lot then. And we would tell the patient, hey, after a year, see an ophthalmologist. There can be corneal deposits and there can be this retinal thing.

But don't worry. It's really after 10 years. And just do me a favor. Do you see the ophthalmologist every year? And that's it. That's all we would tell people now we might get an ekg to begin with because of some of the um the the concerns we have about chloroquine which is not hydroxychloroquine and let's remind ourselves chloroquine is the malaria medication used throughout the world over the counter in most malaria countries which i've prescribed also hundreds of times hundreds of doses and that's

a little more of a substantial medication and you think about ekgs and thing with chloroquine and you might thereby go maybe with the hydroxychloroquine i'll get an ekg make sure there's not a qt prolongation just to kind of cover my ass not that i really think it's anything most of the time after years of doing it i don't think i ever got ekgs on people because it never happened so the thing that doctors and economists and peter navarro and my own background have in common is that we're dealing with trade-offs and risk management all the time yes and we and when the journalists talk about it they're still treating it like it's a medical decision Exclusively and it and it really isn't this is the one situation in which the medical stuff is

Known as much as we know now which is looks like it's safe and we don't quite know if it works Like everybody agrees every pretty much every doctor would agree with those two Well, well except except the guys that they get on msnbc and cnn who start chanting about its dangers and i'm like okay i know for sure you've never prescribed it i you're a surgeon or something and never had to deal with rheumatic disease i i'm i'm 100 positive because when you talk to rheumatologists they go i've used a million times never had a problem well let me ask you this the um the nigerian doctor who caused all the you know the trouble recently with her recent uh promotion of hydroxychloroquine yeah she i understand she's a pediatrician but also an emergency room physician okay and i wanted i wanted to ask

somebody who actually knows that world if you're an emergency room physician and a pediatrician would that imply that you you get all the kids if a kid comes in sometimes sometimes well you could have boards these days if you're going to work in an er you have to be board certified in er so my suspicion is she has some some specialization in pediatric er because they could really use her in the er for the pediatric cases it's sort of a sub-specialization of pediatrics it's easy for a pediatrician to get that sort of well it's not a leap for them to get that certification what sometimes happens is a doctor works in like an urgent even though they're a pediatrician they will still occasionally work in like an urgent care or a walk-in er or something where there's more general medical stuff coming in

that used to happen a lot that's kind of rare these days i i suspect she has more pediatric er like you're thinking the only reason i ask is because if somebody says i gave it to 400 patients and they did well i kind of want to know how old oh no she's gonna that's adult it's adult that's gonna be adult so she must also she I wonder you know again I you you gotta you're doing the right thing you got to ask people strange maybe she was a family practitioner to begin with and then sub-specialized in pediatrics and they may you know this language is used very loosely in medicine, well, by the press about doctors, and we always have lots of questions like this. So exactly what is your training?

And weirdly, the journalist never asked that, weirdly. Yeah, I wasn't so interested in her training as the age of her average patient, because that would be relevant. It can't be, it can't be pediatric age. This is an adult treatment um and by the way let me say people are asking about quercetin um so i interviewed dr zelenko and you can find that interview susan what on youtube on youtube uh and he is advocating a treatment of quercetin which acts it's an over-the-counter substance that acts like hydroxychloroquine to get zinc into cells so he's asking he's people are asking if susan and i are

taking it we are taking it there's not enough data for me to say as a doctor you should take it but i i can tell you that i'm taking it it's 500 milligrams of quercetin and originally he said 50 milligrams of zinc now he's saying 25 milligrams of zinc i think it's probably because the 50 causes a lot of nausea um And 25 is probably adequate. Somebody is saying that Dr. Stella has an emergency care office in the same strip mall as her church. Huh. That's interesting, right?

That covers all bases. Yeah. Wow. Put a mortuary next door. Okay. This is an interesting question i'm gonna take uh have we have we done the hydroxychloroquine have we have we hammered that out enough do you think yeah yeah sure i think we have i'm getting tired of the topic i but oh wait one more thing oh yeah one more thing i just your your listeners have to hear this. So the articles, which, of course, piled on to me after CNN story and Peter Navarro said, go look at the Scott Adams video. The articles did not include a link to the video.

That's perfect. Just try to imagine that it was such a story that they had to rush to press the Daily Beast, The Hill, a few others. And the whole story is that he said, go look at this video, which they mocked me. And they don't put a link to the video. That drives me crazy. Yeah. Really? Yeah.

And it's just so obviously they're suppressing a point of view that it's laughable at this point. At one point point you did say i think yesterday that cnn is causing deaths i'm surprised they didn't go after that statement do you remember that one that that was the video that uh peter navarro pointed oh that's it all right okay so the title votes they may have killed hundreds of thousands okay he what scott was what he was saying was he's just saying look i'm not saying they're killers but i'm just let's do a statistical analysis if these all these countries are using hydroxychloroquine and it's working and saving lives you can easily conclude that people that

that caused a panic that were either prevented or pulled people away from the treatment by some means those people may have caused directly thousands of deaths right yeah it's it's it's not hyperbole yeah there are only two possibilities this stuff works or it doesn't and we don't know the answer all right if it does work we've got a lot of explaining to do if it doesn't well i doubt that will happen i doubt that will happen but uh all right let's get to another call here and we're going to sort of go down the vaccine uh trail a bit go ahead there philip hi scott hi dr drew i have a quick question dr drew uh looking to the future when the actual vaccines come out would you predict that the media will shift their stance to questioning the efficacy or of the vaccine or will they um relay that to the professionals to say it's effective and

therefore we stand by it it's a great question it's another great question and uh thank you thank you philip um or will they highlight uh side effects or will they or who knows i i'll predict that whatever they say before the election will be different than after the election. Would you agree with that at least? Yeah, I think that's fair to say. But, you know, they're going to want to hold Trump accountable for anybody who dies, you know, within six months of a vaccine for any reason. You know, the anecd uh reports will be wild let let me let me float a thought to you and you see if this is um consistent and so so one of the

reasons i like listening to your periscope every morning is you have a way of predicting the future and it helps calm me down so you calm me down um and i i've gotten a sense of who trump is and how he behaves and i thought to myself hmm wouldn't it be classic donald trump if he were to really slam through this vaccine early somehow and get it out like the third or fourth week of October have the military distributed and then have a huge party of success going into the elections doesn't that sound like him yeah but you know that's really dangerous because it is I know like it's rushed yeah if it feels like it's rushed he's done I I agree that's very dangerous but it feels like him to do something like it feels like him to do something like that though if there's a i don't know just it just occurred

me because i think we're going to have it in november for health care providers um meaning that you would there would be enough testing done by them that it would be safe for you guys i i have signed up for the to be on i've tried it for two clinical trials to be in the phase three of the vaccine i want to be a human subject because a i can't get this thing fast enough and b um i want to push to help push the science forward i want to be part of the process and everyone i've talked to these trials are like oh you know by you don't have to be that enthusiastic because it is so efficacious that we don't think people are going to be able to withstand the ethics of keeping a placebo going.

This thing will get opened up quick. Have you heard of, I wish I had more information, but there's a Tony Robbins is an investor in one company that's got a vaccine that's some kind of a synthetic version, whereas all of the other ones are you're growing something in an egg and something's alive and the and the risk of something going wrong with anything alive is pretty big yeah yeah so it's it's a constructed protein I I don't I'm not aware of what this is but I know of the thinking which is the spike proteins are very stable and we know a lot about them and you can constrain that's part of what the immune system is reacting to so you can construct those spike proteins that makes sense yeah i think the idea is that the organic

one can come in you know one one doorway but the synthetic can come in all the doorways and also doesn't have the biological risk in theory who knows and they and they also have an ability because it's synthetic they could crank up much faster yes that makes sense i don't know you know i don't know what to believe and not to believe because you know you just hear one size claim it has no credibility whatsoever because there's one side and they're selling something right but on the surface on the surface what i heard was if this works it's big well keep in mind part of the strategy is to find a cheaper uh version so there can be really worldwide cheaper faster for worldwide distribution that's one of the strategies here too

um do you agree i was thinking about you know this little story we just went through and we've just talked about so many we've in the last 15 minutes we've talked about so many missed reports distortions lies not doing your homework by journalists should they call themselves a profession anymore you know i i talked about in my book loser think that if you haven't had exposure to different domains different fields such as let's say economics or history or whatever that you have you have a blind spot that you're not aware of and it's the not being aware of your own blind spot that's the problem now if you take journalists they tend to be high iq people with a fairly with a fairly narrow range of experience

which is you know what they're doing and if you're smart and you have a narrow range of experience, which is what they're doing. And if you're smart and you have a narrow range, you're really dangerous because you don't know what you don't know. And you're smart, right? Right. If you're smart, how hard could it be? But listen to see if you can find one journalist who's just a journalist, not somebody who's a business person or an economist who became a journalist, but just a journalist who says, you know know we've got the deaths from the economy and we've got the deaths from this and there's really no way to know which one is going to be more until the end right if you hear a journalist say something that reasonable maybe they have a more talent but if they just say

oh deaths or deaths that's all you hear and that that sort of reveals the limits of their talents yeah we are we are on track to have more deaths from delayed medical treatments suicide opiate addiction we are on track then from covid so by word done we're done that could well be the case yeah when i thought we were only going to be closed for you know maybe four to six weeks in the very first i thought you know we might actually come on ahead meaning that the fewer car accidents it's not so much time that people are going to get as much suicide in one month or so right but man you're right you know you you reach a turning point and people are wigging out and it's not good

and you talk about and i see it all the time and then the we don't even know yet the the implications for eight-year-olds to 15-year-olds where their whole developmental trajectory is being taken off offline and and i your your um phenomenon of the journalist uh not having any i call that wisdom real experience and experiential learning they only have you know what they googled or what they've read about which is a different kind of learning and that's what fosters the dunning-kruger effect i feel like the dunning-kruger effect is everywhere now well maybe it's been everywhere all the time but social media just you know emphasizes it.

So the more Dunning-Kruger you are, the more clicks you're going to get. So there's probably a reason that you see it. The more outrageous you are, the more you can drive attention. And that's what Peter Navarro did when he called out my video. I think he knew that that was going to get a lot of attention. Probably negative, but if they looked at the video, he wins. Right. Which was a really interesting play and actually quite smart. Who is Pierre Navarre?

I don't think I know who he is. Economic advisor to the president. Got it. So he makes really all the biggest decisions or advises on the biggest decisions about trade deals but also do you open the economy how do you do it that sort of thing so he's exactly the guy exactly the guy you want to make a risk management decision once the medical community said here's what we know and then he adds it to what he knows and then you've got a decision and if it's just one or the other you don't have anything it also sounds like he's a persuasion guy he kind of knows strategically how to do that

well you got that right yeah here's a another call for you this is uh scott for scott go ahead scott hey guys hey man this is a question about persuasion. Is there any chance that Biden's recent comments to the black community have been persuasion, purposeful persuasion? So, in other words, did Cialdini have something to do with it? Is that what you're asking, Scott? No. What I'm asking is, is Biden trying to bias the decisions of the black community through those comments? Ah, okay. Scott? Well, pre-suasion is not what people think it is.

It's not just, well, let me just say what it is. That would be, pre-suasion would be some unrelated exposure to information biases you for this later piece of decision making in ways that you don't even know. Right. So for example, maybe you saw something about somebody being kind to somebody else, and then unrelated, you're negotiating a deal. And then suddenly you find yourself being more generous, because you got primed and you didn't know it. I hope I'm explaining it right. The book persuasion does it better better by Cialdini. My read on Biden's comments about the Black community are just, it's just a mental challenge. I don't know the nice way to say it. There's something going on. It's obvious to everybody. I mean, we can stop pretending the Democrats don't see it i mean they're practically begging

to have no debates so they see it um and i don't think there's anything else to it i think it's just that i think biden is clearly not a racist but man when you say stuff like he did today like the what do you say the hispanic community has lots of opinions but not so much the black community no they're diverse they have diverse elements or something yeah they're diverse community yeah yeah i mean i i feel really bad for him i he you know there's uh a real serious tell in terms of how he's doing neurologically which is his gait watch his gait watch how he walks he doesn't he doesn't swing his arms it's like his arms are at his side he's just he's kind of trying to move but nothing it's not fluid and his arms don't swing

and that is a sign of something going quickly um and concerning and then the other is the flat affect you know and then the irritability to hear him go off on the question about the mocha test, which is the Montreal cognitive test. And it jumped to something bizarre, which was cocaine addiction. It was very weird. And by the way, he got fake news by the right. So the folks on the right said, Joe Biden, you said that you've been tested a lot for your cognitive stuff. And now you say you've never been tested.

Of course, when he first answered it, in the in the context of doing his job yeah i'm tested every day right right right and and then you know fox news turns that into a little different thing i i as someone that i as someone that's super independent super moderate i see the the excesses going on both sides it is not you know it's not exclusive to any, any group. It seems to be a function of time. The other thing, well, this is a whole different topic, but do you ever feel like people are treating you? You were talking the other day about how you're treated in the public a couple of days ago. And I got,

I started thinking about how they treat everyone that has a public life is treated like a cartoon character. It's like we're some sort of cartoon that people can that aren't humans you know what I mean um not only do I know what you mean but I know it from both sides because I I know it from the the receiving end I'm like really these did the whoever just said this they don't know that I can see their name right right so it's so weird it's like what motivated you to say that to somebody right yeah i'm not going to retaliate or anything but would you say this in person i mean this is just so cruel and then you know it'll be 20 minutes later and i'll be firing off this you know extra clever uh tweet and i'll look at

it and i think i'm just being a jerk. I didn't accomplish anything. I didn't make the world better. Nobody learned anything. I'm just being a jerk. It's so easy because it does feel like a game. You just slap yourself in the face every 10 minutes on

Twitter and say, real people. These are real people. It really matters. I know. All right, let's take one more call. Let's talk about this. And then I know you have to go, Scott, or we'll get you out of here in less than five minutes. Brian, go ahead. Brian?

Hey, it's Brian Peterson here. I'm just going to preface this by saying I'm a huge Scott Adams fan. Yes, I'm here. Scott Adams, Dr. Drew, huge fan. Donald Trump fan. Enough of the accolades. Anyway, my point is I feel that you guys are diverging away from Fauci.

I just feel you don't support him. I don't understand why. He seems like a science guy. Yeah, let me... Hang on, Brian. Hang on. I'll let Scott speak for you. I'm not trying to be a jerk.

No, no, you're not being a jerk. I feel like you guys don't agree with Fauci. I feel like... Alright,'t agree without you. I feel like that's it. All right, so let's answer that. I'm not trying to be a jerk. Brian, Brian, Brian. We got it.

Brian. We got it. We get it. It's peace and love, peace and love. We get it, my friend. We get it. We get what you're saying. Yes, yes.

I'm on your side. Brian, relax, buddy. You were good. We're good. We got it. We were really good, Brian. I love you, Brian. I do. Let me answer your question, buddy. You were good. We're good. We were really good, Brian. I love you, Brian. I do.

Let me answer your question, Brian. I had to put him on hold. He was perseverating too much there. Go ahead. You can make it rhetorical. I would say that I'm pro-Vouchie. I would say that pretty much everything except the face mask part, he's acquitted himself well. And I actually forgive him for the face mask part. He's, he's, he's

acquitted himself well, and I actually forgive him for the face mask stuff too. Because there was a reason. So that reason was good. Now he, my understanding is they didn't want them to be hoarded because they wanted to keep them for the frontline people, right, which meant that I was making a sacrifice by, you know, having less information for the benefit of the frontline healthcare workers do i have a problem with that no no because if you'd asked me that's exactly what it would have done i would say yeah let those guys have it now the fact that not

everybody might have acted like i did because i you know i can self i have the luxury of being able to self quarantine etc but i don't know that everybody would have done that and and he had his priority completely right yes now historians will say well you should have told us the truth anyway and i think that's going to be an open question so i'm going to give him that one so so let me let me i'm going to even let me modify even scott i think you'll like this even a little more um he he qualified his concerns about the masks before this vec before this virus remember at the beginning how concerned we were about hands and and surfaces do you remember that that was because we didn't yet know the primary means of transmission of the virus throughout my training i was always taught

the hands are the main means of transmission of viruses so he always said but only because something came out of somebody's mouth um there's a lot there's a there were famous studies about people playing cards and we we were we were fueled with a lot of data about hands in our training let me just put it that way where it came from and how it got to our hands is a thing but but he but he always made a point of saying i don't want people's hands going to their face and messing with a mask you got it you got to pay attention to it he's so exquisitely careful with everything he says but he he said i don't want those hands going to the face and we did not know that cloth masks worked until the mit study which was a month into the into the whole pandemic that was what

turned everything availability of masks cloth cloth mask works primary transmission not the hands that's when he shifted his opinion so he had lots of reasons to have the opinion that he had in spite of the fact that they knew it worked in 1918. there I'm doing a lot of research on 1918 there were mask laws there was all kinds of mask stuff same exact rhetoric you're hearing now was going on in 1918 and they worked in 1918 as well isn't that interesting can we even know that though that it worked no in 1918 do we know that i mean i'd like to think it did we know that nurses that wore cloth masks didn't get the virus we know that for sure and we know that cities that clamped down wait wait wait that doesn't count.

Why? Because the use of the cloth mask is so that the person who has it is not exhaling. They're not even intended to prevent. Not then. Am I wrong about that? No, not then. They were trying to, they were, the nurses were wearing the mask and not getting the illness. They didn't know to put it on everybody, on the patients yet. The patients still didn't wear the mask.

And cities that, cities that had stringent mask laws did better. They did better. Now, coincidence, whatever, there's no randomized placebo-controlled studies. We'll never know for sure, right? But the evidence suggests that there were some very strong opinions about masks back in those days. But the fascinating thing is the craziness around it was exactly the same as today. It's a constitutional overreach. They can't tell me what to do it's a muzzle you know the same stuff exact same stuff here we are today scott i know you have to go i'm going to keep taking calls i appreciate you being here it's always a thrill to talk to you you help me

even just in conversation calm down and i hope it helped other people as well so thank you so much thank you so much this is fun yeah and at scott scott adam says and look for his periscope every morning it'll it'll uh entertain and i i think it's therapeutic and some for some of us so i hope you'll use it accordingly uh and there's of course the book loser thing That is my alarm to let Scott go. I'm on time. Scott, I will see you tomorrow morning. You won't see me, but I'll see you. Okay. Take care.

Good luck. And let us take some calls now. We've got a bunch of calls on hold here. I was too enthralled with talking to Scott. I know. You have a super chat, too. What was the question on the super chat? Okay. I did see somebody saying he was having trouble with alcohol.

And he was asking whether it should be outpatient or inpatient here's the general thing um if you drink on a daily basis and you have any withdrawal symptoms in the morning you can get into serious trouble by oh he's on the phone also Taylor says he's on the phone uh How would I find him? I can't scroll. Oh, there he is. I see him right now. Is that Rick? All right, let's talk to Rick. I'll get him in here.

Rick, I saw your super chat. Thank you for calling. I started to talk about you, but then I saw you were there, so let's get into it. What's going on, Rick? How you doing, man? I'm good, man. How are you? Oh, my gosh. You are an idol to me oh well let me see hopefully

i can help let's get out i i don't want to i don't want to spend yeah i don't want to spend a lot of your time but i've watched you grow up from the age of 14 and i'm 34 so i've watched you um my question is can you hear me? I gotcha. I'm listening. Okay. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Um, my question is, so, um, I've been drinking beer. Okay. Every single day I've been drinking beer. So I'm drinking like two, four packs a day. And that's after work. So that's three o'clock. Okay. And I've been doing this for so long.

I don't even remember the date. And watching you and you talking on that couple things, talking about outpatient, inpatient. And you were talking about comes with withdrawal with 48 to 72 hours yeah yeah and it should have been a met should it be in a medical setting right and okay so social anxiety disorder kind of scares me okay Rick so so here's the deal a lot of that social anxiety may actually be withdrawal so all anxiety gets worse when you're drinking how is it during the day do you have the shakes no okay so you're you're having no withdrawal symptoms uh you're at a lot of beer it's uh i i think you care i think you can do this

you at least can give it a shot without formal treatment at this point. You do need to see your doctor before you stop drinking to see if there's anything you should be doing or that they can give you to help you with any withdrawal symptoms you have. But that can be managed as an outpatient. And then you should start going to AA meetings like right away, even before you stop drinking, you should just go right away to meetings. And I know, I know it makes you anxious. I know it's difficult.

You can just look online. They will pick you up. They'll come and get you. Uh, you're there meetings right now, or does it have to, Oh crap. There's zoom meetings.

Oh my God. No, there's me there. There is maybe no, there is maybe. Okay, good. And I've been to two of them.

Oh, good for you, man. So Ricky, I got this feeling that you're motivated and, and it takes work. I'm just stuck at home. I know this is what's going on right now is people are stuck. They're depressed. They can't get out. It's just this COVID thing is killing people, but, but go to meetings, go to meetings, get some phone numbers, find some winners there and hang out with them.

They want to help you. And then and then talk to your doctor. I don't know if that you may have to try a couple of times. It's not like it's a straight line to success, man. You may have to really kind of it may be, you know, it's hard. It's really hard. And you may need some more formal treatment. And again, once you hook in with your doctor, hopefully he or she can kind of monitor you and make that decision for you.

But people do it all the time without treatment. And you strike me as somebody who's motivated, man. You're motivated. You want to do this. I am. I am. Yeah, I hear it. And honestly, I think it's because of you, bro.

Well, me or not, let me... Because you like talk what it is. You don't give the runaround. You tell what it is. And I think it's because of you that I feel this way. Well, then you do on my behalf. Let me reach out and shake your hand and pull you over to a meeting. We call that the warm handshake.

Get some and take that handshake and hand it off to somebody else at the meetings. Let those people. All right. I'm trying to think of ways to motivate you. So my words ring in your head. But I think what I'll say is. No. Here's what it is.

I have faith in you you seem to have an unusual degree of motivation go do it okay yeah can I ask you one more question yeah buddy what is the difference from alcohol and people smoking cigarettes

or people drinking energy drinks all very different things people drinking energy drinks all very different things uh and the the energy what is the difference energy drinks aren't going to kill you that they they're not good for you but they're not going to kill you and that's really um caffeine is the primary thing there tobacco is going to kill you and uh people have varying opinions about when to try to get at you with the tobacco i mean if we were working, I would start to talk about it right away. But I would be more focused on getting you engaged with the alcohol because that's what you're ready for right now. You got to be ready, just like a diet or anything else.

You got to think about it, plan for it, do it, get a sponsor, get phone numbers, and work the steps. No sponsor, get phone numbers, and work the steps. No sponsor, no treatment. So go, get a sponsor, work the steps, and let my faith in you perhaps motivate you a little bit more than the motivation you already have. Thank you, buddy. Good luck, Rick. Ashley. Dr. Drew, you live. Oh my gosh.

I can't believe I'm talking to you. What's going on? You are a legend, little president. I stumbled upon that episode by accident, and that was incredible. You did a great job. You're a great actor, but that was awesome. Here we are. Okay.

So I've noticed after devouring many, many hours of Loveline on the archives that the way you understand an addict's brain is just unreal like i've never seen that from somebody who's not an addict and i just wondered like i've seen our intervention like a lot of the interventionists were addicts so so what led you to want to be in the addiction community so you just get it that's a very astute observation a very astute question a question because all all of my peers you know i i surround myself with recovering people in the treatment field and they all say the same thing and they're like dude you

sure how do you know this so well and and i i just have i have kind of a knack for it i have been in i've been saturated with it for 30 years in terms of treating people i've seen it across many different incarnations i'm i've seen all the different fads of treatment come and go and i've been there as the biology got sorted out and so i paid careful attention to that i just yeah i just know what it. I just know it intimately and I know what it needs. And I actually went to therapy myself. One of the reasons, one of the reasons I went to therapy is I knew I needed to be a better instrument for addicts in terms of the patients I was treating. And so I, I use that also a way of tuning myself to what was going on. And it really, it made a huge difference. it really took me about 10 years to get really good at it i was probably in it for five years before i really even understood what it was and about 10 years to get really really skilled at it takes a long time and it was an accident

it was an accident it was just an accident i just liked the you i liked hanging around everyone i like the the richness of the community around addicts and the people that treat them and they're just a very rich smart it's an incredible group of people this is and this disease is robbing us of the best and the brightest it is well i'm glad that you always uh remind people that it is a disease because there's still not enough studies for it. That's crazy. Yeah, it's just it's crazy to know that you went to therapy

too. I didn't know that until after listening to you for many years. I realized that you said that you had suffered some really bad anxiety in your 20s and I'm 24 right now and I'm really struggling with my anxiety and my depression um

and just started taking medication so it's like the same thing with you where you said you were angry because you could have gotten treated and diagnosed but nobody knew how to treat you but it was so simple to treat you you know yeah I could have been helped and it wasn't even just that they didn't know how to do it. There was no adolescent young adult health care. Nobody focused on that group. And so I was just sort of marginalized by the medical community. It was really awful care I got. And so it made me think like, well, I don't want that to happen to anybody else.

I'm going to pay attention to young people because their trajectory is getting set up right then. And you can really get off course if you're not careful. Exactly. All right, Ashley, thank you for the call and thank you for the kind words okay yeah all right thank you for doing you got my privilege and let's uh I want to talk to uh Tracy here okay you want to tell me what that was is uh you can't hear your mic yeah my. My mic on? I'll turn my mic on. It's from Mark Page. Thanks for helping us get through this with genuine objective perspective.

Any ideas why the homeless population is doing so much better with COVID? Great question. I first thought it was because they're outside. Because I think UV has a major major contribution to um reducing the spread so i think that may be a big part of it because i here in los angeles when homeless came inside that's when they got it so so ones on the street did a lot better also i feel like maybe they don't have the same contact with other people you know the average person doesn't get close to the homeless population and there's

permanent social distance and they're spread out one from the other right and so there's a lot of social distancing going on uh already in that population but i think uv light may be the bigger component so hi tracy what's going on so i participated in the pfizer study today awesome i have a question for you you didn't have a lot of information and of course i've So I participated in the Pfizer study today in Anaheim. Awesome. I have a question for you. They didn't have a lot of information.

And of course, I've done a lot of research between Moderna and Pfizer because they're both here in Southern California for testing. What about ADE, the antibody dependent enhancement, where if you have the vaccine and they saw this like in the 60s with RSD, they saw it in the original SARS vaccine that was never, of course, finished because it burned out before it was necessary. But where you have the antibodies from the vaccine, but when you actually get exposed to the virus, it becomes extraordinarily large and you have much worse outcomes. Right. And there is, yes, that is the dreaded complication of vaccine therapy and believe me the the theorists are on top of this exactly what they do to reduce that risk i'm not sure i suspect it has something to do with the targets they're using uh i think they had a lot of this with zika virus if i remember right is that correct I think so, yeah.

Yeah. And there are, you know, when you're talking about new vaccines, there are potentials for, you know, unanticipated reactions. I mean, there just are. With the RNA vaccines, I worry about, I mean, we're talking about genomic alterations. I worry about, you know, lymphomas and leukemias down the line, like years down the line. That's the stuff I worry about withomas and leukemias down the line, like years down the line. That's the stuff I worry about with the Moderna vaccine.

I'm still willing to take the risk because I believe they've done their homework. But the more traditional vaccines, exactly how they prevent that AD, I'm not sure. I'm not sure, Tracy. I'm sorry I don't know that. Share a little bit more about your thoughts about the concerns about lymphoma and yeah it's it's it is uh fantasy only that i'm having that concern i've brought it up with other peers and i found that a number of them had a similar fantasy like you know whenever you start messing with the we're also used to the lymphatic system going haywire through through a genetic phenomenologies for not for the genetic alterations i i don't want to get into

specific biochemistry but the the white cell system leukemias lymphomas you know we as physicians deal with a lot of environmental, whenever there's an environmental exposure that leads to cancer, those are the ones we worry about, the bone marrow. And we worry specifically about the white cells because that's where it tends to go. And so whether it's radiation or an RNA vaccine

or other things that are in any way monkeying with the genetic functioning of that system, our fantasies immediately go to those sorts of outcomes now there is zero evidence of this zero evidence and i want to put my money where my mouth is and take that moderna vaccine and be properly scientific but the fantasy is oh my goodness could it you know at some point cause that kind of thing that we've seen after all these years. So Pfizer has one too? Yeah, different, different vaccine.

It's a very different kind. Kathy, what's going on there? Kathy? Hi, Dr. Drew. Thank you very much for taking my call. Can you hear me? I do. Hello?

I hear you. Do you hear me? Oh, hi, Dr. Drew. Thank you very much for taking my call. I'm actually re-watching all the seasons of Celebrity Rehab currently while I'm at home quarantining. Oh, nice. My question is, I have a brother who has been dealing with opioid addiction for greater than 10 years on and off. He ended up going into treatment about a year and a half ago around Christmas,

and we thought everything was fine. We just found out recently that there's been a relapse, and my family, they're pretty much ready to turn their back on him, giving up on him because, you know, they're just tired of dealing with the lies and stealing and everything like that. He's never stolen from me. But my question for you basically is having felt like an enabler in the past, I can't turn my back on him. Okay. Because I'm afraid. Okay.

That I'm going to get that phone call that something happened to him. You're afraid he's going to die. And believe me, he will use that fear. Did I do enough? He will use that fear against you. But before I launch into this, somebody is setting me straight on the Pfizer vaccine. Apparently, that's also an RNA vaccine. Really? Moderna is a DNA vaccine of Pfizer's RNA vaccine. No, uh, it probably is vice versa. Yeah. It's probably vice versa because the Pfizer Pfizer there, I knew there were some DNA vaccines out there and that may be the,

I thought Pfizer was also, okay. I don't know enough about the Pfizer product. I think Astra Zeneca may be again, this, they're all just alphabet soup here. I think AstraZeneca has a more live attenuated virus vaccine. I think the DNA vaccine may be the Pfizer one and the RNA, but the Moderna, I don't know for sure. But yes, Susan, you're saying something? Yes. Yes. All right. So Kathy, here's the deal. You know, opiate addiction is very dangerous. It is fatal. You understand that, right? Kathy?

Yes. Okay, so you understand that it has a terrible prognosis to it, and we just have to accept that he has a disease with a bad prognosis. That's something you have to kind of prepare yourself for, come to terms with now i'm not saying give up on him not quite the contrary have you ever gone yeah have you ever gone to alan on i have not okay well that's the one it is something i've recently considered though it is the one thing you can do that will make a difference is to go to Al-Anon and get a sponsor and work the steps yourself.

If I were treating you or I was involved in your family, I would order you to go. And I can't tell you how often I say that to people and they say, I'll do anything. Oh, no, I won't go to Al-Anon. It is the one thing that has a measurable difference, creates a measurable difference for the patient. You must go if you actually want to struggle on behalf of your brother. Okay. For instance, your fear that he's going to die,

that is a normal fear. He, in his disease, will use that to to manipulate you and there's no way you can withstand that on your own you have to have somebody with you when he comes at you with with that material and that's what alan on is your sponsor will stand with you as you deal with your brother and it will change the dance you're engaged with with him and allow you to do the things you need to do i always tell people the the disease of addiction is uh exactly like the the plant the audrey tube in the little shop of horrors if you go if you ever saw a little shop of horrors there's this plant that eats people and if you go in the room by yourself you go into the plant the plant eats you and that is the way addiction is if

you are it's a it's a relational disease you're in the disease when you're around your brother unless you have somebody pulling you out i call it ariadne's cord if you have somebody the golden thread pulling you back and standing there with you it's a different dance and it and when the the patients feel that difference it often really gets their attention and it begins to start the motivation towards getting well and you may be able to offer some some things you couldn't offer if you weren't engaged with alan on that might help him as well. Does that make sense? I appreciate that.

It does make a lot of sense. And like I said, it is something that I considered. I sat with my phone in my hand and dialing the mental health number on the back of my insurance card and then hanging up and you know what i mean like doing that a couple times because it's like whether i was looking for um some kind of uh counselor in my area that specializes in this like private counseling so versus if they can refer me to a local alan-Anon. But I don't know. I don't know why I kept hanging up. So I'm going to say something even...

That's just where I was at the time. I'm going to say something even stronger. If you do not get it, seeing a therapist will not replace Al-Anon. It will just enhance it. So you still have to go to Al-Anon. Just go online, find a meeting, go to an Al-Anon meeting. There are lots of Zoom meetings now, too.

So you can go to an Al-Anon Zoom meetings. They're easy. There's no barrier. Just go. If you don't go, you are actively contributing to the problem. Listen to me. If you don't go, you are actively contributing to the problem. You're actively contributing to the problem if you do not go.

I understand. So to say, I'm contemplating going, makes no sense if you actually want to help your brother. You just must go. The other thing to think about for him, has he had suboxone therapy? Has he failed that yet? He was on suboxone when he was actively going through the steps of treatment like he went through uh the detox and then he went to some uh the step-down treatment and then he went to the halfway house like the whole thing took about like six months by the time he was discharged. And in that time, I can't remember how long after he was discharged, if he discontinued it while he was still in or shortly after. So the point is he's had good treatment. But yeah, he was on Suboxone for a while.

He may need to get back on it again. He may need to go back into the halfway house for a while. I mean, he needs more treatment. Just like if he had a relapse on any other medical condition, he's going to need some more. Yeah. And the only way he's going to get there is with, you know, family laying down the right motivation.

So that's going to be Al-Anon for you. So I head on out, go to the meeting right now. You can zoom on in. Marie is asking a question along those same lines. She's on narcotics for chronic pain for 20 years. What would help her pain marie i've seen remarkable results in the last six months with suboxone i'm not a huge suboxone fan for opiate addiction though i'm not i'm not against it i just i just think it's overused a little bit but in the setting of chronic pain it has been miraculous susan we may want to

do a stream someday with dr bruce because he's accumulated a ton of experience with this now and he turned okay go ahead also a super chat for mary t i just posted for marie mary i just put it up mary t should emu i can't even say that word immunocompromised go to the dentist how about the airplane husband has cancer long-term transplant patient um it depends what he's on right now still i'm i imagine he's a bone marrow transplant patient unfortunately i can't she's not giving me enough information um what is crime 411 somebody wants me on crime 411 don't know what that is let me just say yes immunocompromised in any way you ought to take extra precaution it's

obviously a risk factor if you're older and immunocompromised then you really have to watch out because age is a major determinant of how this disease affects people obviously if you're immunocompromised going to the dentist is one thing where there's a lot of protections. I don't worry about that so much, but unnecessary things like plane travel and whatnot, I wouldn't engage in that if there's any concern that you're in a risk category.

So let me just think this. There's another one. When are you coming on Crime for a Woman? I one we just have you on the show we just said that okay we just said that uh you can contact us at uh drdrew.com contact okay and carrie wanted me to repeat uh my thoughts uh on um quercetin and zinc. So Susan and I, on Dr. Zelenko's recommendations, have been taking the prophylactic. Because we're going to travel.

Right. We are taking quercetin, 500 milligrams. That's Q-U, it's not quercetin. It's quercetin. Q-U-E-R-C-E-T-I-N. We get it from Amazon. Quercetin, 500 milligrams, and zinc, 25 milligrams. You're taking your zinc, right? Mm-hmm. Okay. I don we get it from amazon quercetin 500 milligrams and zinc 25 milligrams you're taking your zinc right okay and i don't get sick from it you take a whole tablet or a half

25 i don't know whatever you gave me i i gave you 50 oh i just take it it doesn't bother me all right you're you're bionic um and uh it makes me not hungry all day but oh that's interesting that's interesting uh but anyway i i the research is not there yet for me to say, hey, you should be doing this as a clinician. I'm suggesting you do it. I'm telling you for the two of us, I'm convinced I'm doing it. Whether or not it's fool's errand or not, I can't say yet. But it makes sense to me that it might be somewhat useful,

and that's why I'm doing it. Are we going to take hydroxychloroquine with us on our trip yeah i've got it in my suitcase a hundred percent i've got a covid test halfway yeah if we get a fever i will immediately switch to hydroxychloroquine that that is what that is where i believe it has some utility is right at the beginning i feel like if you get tested after you a week after you fly it's probably a good idea just in case, right? Well, it could take a week to turn positive. No, I know, but it just feels better to... It's hard to know.

Again, timing... A little bit of a... No, I'm all for being as careful as possible. Proactive. Connie, yeah, wearing masks, I'm convinced, is a more effective preventative agent than just about anything else so um somebody's yeah i'm sorry i think i drank a lot of money you and very helpful with information so i'm trying to get your uh the the references monique are uh physician referred through dr zelenko if you look at. If you look at that stream. Find it.

Yeah. I did an interview with him and he convinced me that it was a reasonable thing to do. There's not much for us to do, right? So it's about a risk-reward ratio. So if it costs $3 and it has almost no downside and there's some physiological reason to expect it might work. This is the sort of realm we're in while we wait for the randomized placebo-controlled studies. And particularly when these things are cheap. The only thing I worry about with zinc is copper metabolism.

Some people with their copper metabolism can get out of whack with it. But that's really it. Zinc gives you ringing in my ears. Jeanette, I get the exact same thing. That's at the higher dose. Yeah, I got that a little bit. And I get that, interestingly, from any medication in a high dose. So it probably has something to do with the dosing.

Be very careful with that. I don't get any ringing in my ears. You're bionic. There's a reason I selected you to reproduce with evidently i just need a shot of vodka that's all that that's nothing comes without some potential downside uh um i'm looking at the calls here for a second here oh cody uh you want to talk about eczema i i wonder if you tried the immunomodulate to our newer medication

for uh these kinds of things like some of the really actually the psoriatic medication i don't have expertise with using these things so i really don't want to get into that conversation it wouldn't be right i would absolutely talk to a dermatologist and if you're unsatisfied would maybe go to a tertiary center like a university where they're teaching dermatology and doing research on again the the immune medication you see they advertise them on tv all the time right uh the immune modulating medication are changing dermatology asthma and crohn's disease radically uh i have a tom cigar a friend get addicted to crack that person became criminal that person isn't trustworthy i don't have well uh tom cigar

the he may not that person is not trustworthy when they are in their disease in order for him to uh recover from his disease he will have to become rigorously honest that part of the part part of the disease of addiction is lying if you don't if you're not lying you're really probably may not have addiction even uh okay you guys i am I am exhausted, I got to say. I don't know why. Have we seen The Dead Zone? No, what is that? I don't know.

Somebody said season two, episode 14, Plague. It consists of a viral outbreak. I thought we... Hydroxychloroquine. I heard about that. And how the CDC eventually would have figured out it wouldn't work. Boom, a polar clip. Thank you.

Weird. Psychic. Husband had a kidney transplant as a child, no 43. That's immune compromised. So we're not going to get to all the calls today, unfortunately. No, I addressed all the calls. Oh, you did? Yeah.

Thank you. We appreciate the call. For calling in. And if you want to, the next Ask Dr. Drew, if you want to get your question online or get your questions, you'll get a text when we start. You text your question to 9842DRDREW or go to drdrew.tv and just sign up to be on the email list and you'll get a notification. And we are going to set up a Patreon where I sit down with small groups and really go into this in greater detail. Artemis, you have a great question, which is, is buprenorphine better than methadone for pain?

That's kind of a complicated question, but I would say methadone is just extremely risky. And once you're on it, it's almost impossible to get off. And it has lots of side effects. Buprenorphine, not so much. Easier to get off, not great to get off, but easier than methadone and less side effects. And more benefit for pain. Chronic pain particularly.

I've seen buprenorphine change people's lives commonly. Yeah, Patreon coming for these Zoom meetings. That's me. Hey, I just had a great idea. What if you have Bob do an AA meeting on Zoom? Can't do that. You can't. I can't.

He's not a Zoom. He doesn't do that? You can't. That's a professional stuff, and AA is a wholly separate operation. It can't be adulterated in any way by anybody. It's a non-commercial. We could have an interview with him, and then he could just be. Well, he could come in and do a Zoom with me.

Yeah, that's what I mean. So we'll do some stuff with Bob and then he could just well he could come in and do a zoom with me yeah that's what i mean so let's have let's have we'll do some stuff with bob fairs we'll bring shelly in and do some stuff talk about suboxone and yeah um opioids and so i am that'll be caffeine i am addicted to caffeine josh we'll do that on a patreon um what is the ethical mess wendy king are we happy to address it if you if you have questions the email list you're going to get some really exciting information coming up about our Patreon and our new ideas. And so get it first. Buprenorphine essentially is Suboxone, Mr. Canada. I mean, essentially.

Methadone clinic, a lot of those folks turn to Coke. I know. The methadone, a lot of people on replacement anything are using other drugs. So that's a concern, right? They gave it to you after surgery, worked better than fentanyl. Fentanyl is a nefarious drug obviously um and it i it gives me headaches really bad headaches uh are you aware of antibodies being studied for treating covet no that's a

strange thing i i saw that uh viagra is being used to treat uh covet i found that was a strange study uh okay let's kind of wrap things up here. Again, we appreciate y'all being here. We love Scott Adams. We appreciate him being here. We're going to have Cat Timp next Wednesday. Great. And then just some random dose of Dr. Drew's coming up.

And then next Thursday, we'll also have another Ask Dr. Drew's. So we'll be able to do live questions next week. Next Thursday. Next Thursday. Yeah, we're going to live stream from New York. And Caleb's going to run the board here. And then you're going to be on the VMIX.

And then we can see if somebody else will do it. Maybe we can find somebody in New York. Yeah. So it's just me doing the phone call. Yeah, and then Kat's going to come in person and do the, she's going to take over for Tyrus on Wednesday since we're traveling. Jennifer, what about ketamine nasal spray for depression? FDA is going to approve.

I believe they have approved it. I know a lot of people are using it. I'm more interested in the ketamine infusions. The ketamine infusions really do work in resistant depression. They're really more used in the ketamine nasal spray as sort of a maintenance thing i i worry about that nasal spray a little bit um but again they want us to speak dr peterson there's a lot of talk about that who is the uh lamont laura the rap guy so susan we may want to get onto that okay yeah that'll have to be after the 17th yes we're traveling uh we are hopefully not going to get covid that we're going to work hard and not do it. We are going to be using our UV wands.

I am really an advocate of UV wands. So this is going to be in my pocket. I know the airlines are sometimes using UV wands themselves to go through the aircraft before they clean them. I mean, before you get in, but I'm going to be using it myself. Well, they're testing it. They're using it. JetBlue is testing it. JetBlue is using it. Are they using it? Well, they're using it jet blue is testing it using it are they using it

well they're using it but they're they're kind of obviously they have to attest make sure so united this really gets rid this 20 seconds of uvc does seem to have a significant effect so in terms of for me it's like use clorox on everything and then all the other it gets at all the little crevices you can't get it everything with clorox and to me it's a good and if you're getting in an automobile like an uber or something if you're going to travel i i don't know how you do it without trying this uh get jordan peterson in here your mouth to god's ears he's still he's still struggling with his clonopin thing but i would still happily talk to him i'm fascinated by a lot of his stuff do i have research on the uv ones mary i do uh somebody just sent me some uh a

bunch of um research on it because i didn't want to mention it so i'd read the research most of it is on um the non-wand uvc there's a lot of stuff people are putting uv into the ventilator systems people are putting uvc in the rooms as a standalone to you know sort of parallel to to um sterilize rooms overnight i am personally involved with a medicine a company called red hawk who got into this stuff and i was a big enthusiast when they did that they're the needle destruction people that i've been trying to get people to sign on to because we have such a massive problem with needles but um i'm just telling you what i'm doing with the wands. I am doing it actively. Dr. Peters needs to talk to me.

Why, Josh? Why would he need to talk to me? Tom Cigar says, wands, duh. We can't get Clorox. I know, Mary, it's hard to get Clorox. I understand that. But that is the, what you, you know, we've got, we actually bought jugs of Clorox solution. You can just put paper towels in there. Yeah, we're making our own.

Also, the airlines are handing out the wipes as well. I read. Interesting. They're giving you like a lunchbox with a wipe in it, a bottle of water and food. They're not like surfing food like they used to. And our buddy Terry Dubrow is apparently selling it. He's still cutting it in. Our buddy Terry Dubrow is an advocate for the UV sticks as well.

Oh, is he here? No. Somebody else is he here? No. Somebody else is saying. He's probably selling them on QVC. I think this could help people get around. I really do. We have to have him on Doc Talk Monday. Or Doc Talk Tuesday.

Sure. Get him in. He'd be a good one. He would be good. It would be interesting to see what he's saying. Get off the hydroxychloroquine thing and talk about plastic surgery. Tom Cigar, I'm sorry, I only have a phone number for the Swans. I will have a website.

Do you know the number? It's 866-4-REDHAWK, is that it? Yeah, I think so. 866-4-REDHAWK, that's the word. They're building a new website, I think, but they're just taking their... And we'll have the website, I was told, a week from Monday.

Donald, wait. The division over face masks is a public health risk, making them this up as you go along, excusing every excess by authorities because they're massifying the problem. I'm not sure what you mean, Donald, but I'm a mask maven i'm a strong i cannot advocate mass strongly enough they are they are a significant in the 1918 flu they've turned things

around you can see the data for yourself as people start distancing and wearing masks you can see this this recent uh little surge we're in uh getting back to normal so to not wear masks i think is a terrible problem a terrible terrible problem and i really ask people to please do so there's just i i understand there's all sorts of overreach i understand it feels like a muzzle i know you don't want to listen to the government they ignore that they have the authority to make you do these things but please do it it does make a big difference all right we'll wrap things up right there we thank you for the calls thank you for scott adams thank you for being on the chat we'll be in here susan when maybe monday or tuesday oh um you're busy this weekend but

monday maybe we can hook you up thank you to caleb for producing this thing thank you to taylor for great show calls uh thank you to michelle Poe for the set design behind me here. And thank you all to being, being in here and hanging in and asking great questions. And hopefully, hopefully we're helping things. Hopefully, hopefully we're moving things forward and that's really our goal.

So if we can do that better, let us know how, and we will continue to do it. I don't know why the mic goes in and out. It's driving me nuts. We got to fix it. We're going to wrap it up. Thank you so much, guys. We'll see you next week. Ask Dr. know why the mic goes in and out. It's driving me nuts. Caleb, we got to fix this. We're going to wrap it up. Thank you so much, guys.

We'll see you next week. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. This is just a reminder that the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care or medical evaluation. This is purely for educational and entertainment purposes. I'm a licensed physician with over 35 years of experience, but this is not a replacement for your personal physician, nor is it medical care. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, don't call me.

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