Ask Dr. Drew - Censored Doctors: Race Hoax Exposes Dark Side Of Mandated Speech In Medicine w/ Dr. Azadeh Khatibi – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 471

Episode Date: April 3, 2025

Censoring doctors leads to mandated speech, racism hoaxes, and death. Dr. Azadeh Khatibi has had enough of California’s silencing. So she sued the state and its Medical Board, and was a driving force behind the repeal of CA’s “medical misinformation” AB2098 law. But the fight isn’t over. Now she’s taking on AB241, yet another CA law mandating speech in continuing medical education. “Why does California keep passing laws that mandate and censor doctors? California is not home of the free,” writes Dr. Khatibi. Dr. Azadeh Khatibi is a board-certified ophthalmologist, filmmaker, and activist. She hosts the Within podcast and has testified before Congress on physician autonomy. She completed her MD and MPH at UCSF and UC Berkeley, and led lawsuits challenging California laws restricting medical speech. Her film credits include Window Horses and Sinjar. More at https://x.com/AzadehKhatibiMD and https://substack.com/@azadehkhatibi 「 SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS 」 Find out more about the brands that make this show possible and get special discounts on Dr. Drew's favorite products at https://drdrew.com/sponsors  • ACTIVE SKIN REPAIR - Repair skin faster with more of the molecule your body creates naturally! Hypochlorous (HOCl) is produced by white blood cells to support healing – and no sting. Get 20% off at https://drdrew.com/skinrepair • FATTY15 – The future of essential fatty acids is here! Strengthen your cells against age-related breakdown with Fatty15. Get 15% off a 90-day Starter Kit Subscription at https://drdrew.com/fatty15 • PALEOVALLEY - "Paleovalley has a wide variety of extraordinary products that are both healthful and delicious,” says Dr. Drew. "I am a huge fan of this brand and know you'll love it too!” Get 15% off your first order at https://drdrew.com/paleovalley • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at https://twc.health/drew 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 Portions of this program may examine countervailing views on important medical issues. Always consult your physician before making any decisions about your health. 「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/firstladyoflove). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

very pleased to welcome today. Azadeh Katibi, I got that right. She's going to hold my hand to the fire on that one. She amongst other things has an MPH. She's an MD, she's an ophthalmologist. She's a performer as well. And she has been fighting against

physician censorship and fighting for medical freedom and physician autonomy. I saw some of her videos on, I think it was on X and I thought, I need to speak to my peer here. This is somebody who is doing God's work, and she's a lot younger than I am,

so I'm very interested in her perspective on how this has affected her career and her peer's career, and we will get right to it after this. Our laws, as it pertains to substances, are draconian and bizarre. A psychopath started this race. He was an alcoholic. Because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction, fentanyl and heroin.

Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for ****. Where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying. You go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real.

We used to get these calls on Love Line all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. You have trouble, you can't stop and you won't help stop it. I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say.

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Go to fatty15.com slash Dr. Drew to receive 15% off a 90 day starter kit subscription or use code Dr. Drew at checkout for that 15% off or just go to our website, Drdu.com slash vady15. So in addition to being a physician, Dr. Katibi is a filmmaker and an actress. She actually acted and helped produce a feature called Window Horses with Sandra Oh,

a short list for Academy Award nomination. She's done a lot of work, but she's an ophthalmologist. She's a physician from UCSF, which those of you of you who don't know, is one of the top medical schools in the country. She has a master's in public health, which fascinates me because the public health world seems to have lost its mind. And so we should be able to get a good perspective from her. And most recently, she's become an advocate, vocal advocate, for medical freedom.

She particularly has been active against the state of California, which has been egregiously intruding into the physician-patient relationship. She sued the state of California and the medical board in two lawsuits regarding First Amendment rights violations of physicians. And she was successful in getting the legislature and the government to repeal AB 2098, a law they had passed. And we are currently waiting a ruling on that. She's going to join us now. Welcome, Dr. Katibi. Dr. Drew, I'm super excited to be here. I'm super honored.

Thanks so much for having me. I used to listen to you as an adolescent every single night on Loveline. So it's like Full full circle moment were you down here in Southern California or Northern California? Where were you? Oh, yeah, I'm a valley girl So I grew up here and LA girl It's weird I just before we went on the air here first of all as I'm going the air Adam Corolla called me That's him up there at the top of the banner. And I just saw Kevin Ryder from Kevin and Bean

has been reinstated on K-Rock as of this morning or something. It's very weird. Everything's going, and now Dr. Katibi's here with me. So see, it's all meant to be. We actually had something else in common too. We have something else in common, is that have something else in common is that you and I have both been on 20 years apart.

We've both been on Wheel of Fortune. Oh my God, that's too weird. That is too crazy. Because I actually hid that for years. I was sort of ashamed of it. Well, I lost and I seem so dumb. A friend of mine who's like. Yeah, it is, but I just felt dumb at first. I had a great time and it was good. And it

wasn't until I was on one of my appearances on The Ellen Show, the producer dug it up and played it. And I was like- I saw the clip. Oh my God, I couldn't believe it. And she goes, how does it feel? And I said, you know what? Face your fears, everybody. It's not as bad as you expect. Absolutely. So when it actually came through,

I thought, all right, it's not so bad. Just a little bit embarrassing. No, it's fun. You went for it. I love it. You went for it. I did. That damn wheel.

That damn wheel turned against me and the little woman from Kansas City next to me cleaned up. So there you go. You forget about the wheel. You practice for the hangman, you know, the game going in there and you forget the wheel can just go bad. It's just, it happens. It happens. It's just like the ups and downs of life. You just do your best. It may be, it's my recollection, but my recollection was I missed a letter and lose a turn then bankrupt. Oh God, that's terrible.

I mean, I see why I was embarrassed again. That's very 80s. That's so great. Sunny Delight coupons. Yes, I got, I got enough Sunny Delight to fill my apartment. To me, I got a trip. I got a, I got some cash and to fill my apartment. I got some cash and a trip to Chicago. So even though I didn't win. That's not bad.

It's better than I did. It's pretty good. That's better. So let's get down to business here. So what happened here? What happened to you? First of all, I have a just a, I want to get us kind of a set up here

because one of the things I noticed that was confusing to me was how many young physicians were getting MPHs. And I couldn't understand why they were doing that. It didn't make, it made no sense to me. And, and then now we find ourselves in the middle of COVID where public health goes sideways. So why did you get an MPH? And then what do you think about your public health goes sideways. So why did you get an MPH? And then what do you think about

your public health peers and their behavior during COVID? Well, I mean, I got an MPH because I went to medical school and I realized, I'm learning about individual health, but I really want to learn about, always been a very curious,

knowledge seeking person. So I said, okay, well, I wanna learn about health from a public perspective. How do we actually shift change instead of like dealing with a heart attack here? Like how do we prevent heart attacks, like on a, you know, population scale? So that was interesting to me. I was also in a five-year program that only accepted 12 people a year at that point, the joint medical program between UC Berkeley, UCSF. And so I was like, okay, I'm here for five years. Might as well learn more. And so I got my MPH. I was also getting a

master's at that time too. So I got three degrees and had a baby in like six years. It was a lot. I did it and I'm so grateful now because of having that background of all those degrees really helped me analyze things, I think, in a way that maybe some of my peers didn't. As for why people are getting multiple degrees now, I kind of, you know, I kind of, part of me wishes for the good old Donna Reed days where you just, you know, got your MD and then you established yourself in your practice and you became part of the community and you saw patients. But I think now like it's people get their JDs, people get their MBAs, like a lot of physicians get their MBAs because they saw the corporatization of medicine. They wanted to understand it better and take leadership in those roles.

For me, I just the MPH seemed like a natural thing to do is an intuitive thing. And I love knowledge. So it just made sense. And it was convenient to get to. What about public health? It felt to me like public health during COVID had gone completely out of its mind. Oh yeah. And it certainly had, yeah, and it certainly become draconian, totalitarian. I could use a lot of words to describe the behavior

and no contemplation of the fundamental task of medicine, which is to assess the risk reward of every decision and every intervention we take. And we have Redfield on the record, not Redfield, Francis Collins on the record saying, oh no, we didn't pay any attention to what might happen as a result of what we were doing. We just had to stop this thing.

Great, well done. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I heard him on the Derate the Hate podcast with Wilk Wilkerson who you've had on your show. He's a friend of mine and I his interview of Francis Collins. Francis Collins was like, well,

we were just so in the thick of it that we didn't have time to ask our physician colleagues on the outside what their perspectives were. We just wanted to look at what was in front of us and take care of it. And, you know, he had time to make a mediocre song music video during COVID.

Exactly. He didn't have time to like- Did you teach after your ophthalmology training? Did you teach at all or do you still teach? So I have not been teaching recently. After, you know, you're participating in CME after medical school, so you're actively teaching because you're a doctor at that point.

And then after I finished training, my residency and fellowship, I was a retina physician. I was still teaching. And then, you know, with these new laws especially, like it's, it's just keep coming on the books. Like I just, I want to be able to get there. We're gonna get there. Hold on. We're gonna get there. But the point I want to make is the one thing that I would excoriate residents and medical students for is if I asked them for their reasoning in a particular intervention, if they ever said to me I had to do something

and couldn't tell me what the expectation of outcome versus risk was, I would excoriate them. That is the most unacceptable thing somebody with an MDF to their name can ever say. And there was Francis Collins saying it as though it was an acceptable way to behave. It's disgusting to me. It's the opposite of what our charge is. Do no harm is numero uno. And if you don't contemplate the risk of what you're doing,

everything, everything you do has risk and we have to contemplate it at all times. And the fact that he did not, I find totally unacceptable. Yeah. And, you know, and I think that part of it is like this group think that happens. Everybody shows up at the meeting probably in DC and they were all like, you know, there's the group dynamics that happen, who's the leader, who were the followers, like all these things, I would have loved to be a fly on that wall to find out like how their neuropsychological profiles and personalities led them to become followers versus leaders and to be inhibited to point things out. Or there's also like tribalism that happens, right? This this this tribalism of, oh, this part of the media is against us

so we must be right, right? Because I don't agree with them on other stuff. So the conservatives are against me and so I must, and since I don't like conservative media, I must be on the right path. And there's also something I think deeper too in terms of reactivity. One of the things I've really worked on myself is like in my mindfulness practice especially is to reduce the reactivity. One of the things I've really worked on myself is like in my mindfulness

practice especially is to reduce the reactivity and instead have a responsiveness and an open-mindedness about things which I generally tend to be an open person. But like I remember you know when I was listening to you on K-Rock all those years ago I thought all doctors you know I looked up to you because I thought, oh, all doctors are open and they're open-minded and they're humble and they're wise and they're, you know, and the open-mindedness and like being able to say you're wrong. But then I went to med school and realized a lot of people aren't like that, even in the medical field. So the risk-benefit analysis that you talk about, just to bring it back to the public health thing that you talked about, I was The risk benefit analysis that you talk about, just to bring it back to the public health thing

that you talked about, I was so frustrated and then flabbergasted and then just completely overwhelmed by the fact that the people in public health were not looking at following the basic public health principles that I've been taught in public health school. Basic stuff. Like, what is going on with the people? What do the people want?

You don't just push an intervention on people. And this was a public health ethics thing that we learned in medical school, an issue of coming in and just pushing what you think is best on the populace is not the right thing to do. You have to understand their understanding, their culture, their desires, and incorporate

that into a positive public health plan. That's number one. And then ethics, right? It's not just a Machiavellian ends justify the means, right? That's like the opposite of what we learned in public health school. The means that through which you achieve your end is very important. It has to be ethical. It has to take into account what's going on on the ground and what the people's desires are and what their cultural understandings are. And so that wasn't being considered at all. And the mandates with the vaccinations that came,

there was no public health uproar about, hey, what about the Geneva Convention? You know, how about all these documents that we have that in times of emergencies, right, when things are like chill and no problem and there's no pandemic, although we can, you know, discuss what the definition of pandemic and how that changed over time and how that was used incorrectly. But like, if there's an emergency going on,

that's the time when these documents, these ethics and medical ethics documents and agreements that you guys have, throughout the years and decades of experience, especially people in World War II who saw the horrors of what happened, especially us in California, which were the leaders, the leaders of the eugenics movement

that fed the Holocaust. And we've gone through this stuff and then we have these rules. Like, don't do this to people. Don't mandate biological interventions that they don't want on them. If you just forget about that, it's just the opposite of what public health ethics should be. So, and then I thought to myself, another thing was like, oh my gosh, why aren't they talking about, and about about the importance of diet and exercise and sleep?

This could have been fresh air, sunshine, like the basic doctoring things that now we're realizing the reasons they said fresh air and sunshine is like an important thing. Why aren't they talking about this stuff? Because they were so myopically focused. And that lack of open-mindedness, that myopic focus, prevents you from seeing everything else. And this dependence also on medical intervention in the form of a pharmaceutical, as opposed to all the other things that actually create a human thriving.

It was hugely to our detriment. And it really was sad the way it played out. I'm really happy that there were some doctors who stood up. I think there were a lot who were just scared and didn't stand up. After I started speaking out, my friends, who come from many different parts of the political spectrum who are doctors were like, oh, I really admire you.

It's so great that you're speaking up, but I can't speak up because I'm hired by this organization. Even the private practice ones were scared. Oh, don't say anything. One of them told another friend of mine at a dinner party, he said, don't ever sign an exemption. It's just like saving your skin as opposed to actually following the ethics of what a doctor should do.

Yeah, and then they went into full Psyop mode. Guys like Aaron Cariotti were lost their job, the people reminding those, literally the medical ethicist who was reminding his institution of exactly what you're talking about, their response was to fire him. Genius, I'm telling you, genius. But there's embedded in what you were just saying was a really, you were tilting at something very interesting. And we're going to get to the California law stuff.

We got a lot to talk about. But there's two things that you said that was of a sort of a tone or a sort of a theme in what you just mentioned. And I want to pull them forward. One was that life is going to be better with a pharmaceutical agent. You called it a medical intervention. And we'll just call it a medical intervention. That it can only make the, hang on, but yeah, drugs.

Because I was raised by an old family practitioner who told me meds are dangerous, dangerous, dangerous. Only when it's worth the risk do you think about it. And I didn't take an antibiotic until I was 15. My dad was a doctor. And so you just, the medicines are dangerous in all situations, unless it's worth the risk. If that's not taking it is more dangerous than you take it. But this was not the case for a 19 year old male or a 24 year old male. The vaccines were

more dangerous and the illness was not dangerous. So not worth it. So the issue A is one, everything's gonna be solved by medical intervention. Let's use your terminology, because as soon as you say pharmaceutical, it gets sort of front-loaded as pharma, but let's just say medical intervention, number one. Number two, on the back of that is some weird notion, that human thriving is predicated on safety.

Safety, safe, safe, gotta be safe, safe, can't go, can't go to the palisades, so it's safe, can't go to Arcadia, so it's safe, safe, safe, and that's insane. Life is not safe, being biological is not safe, the, the risk of doing the things that were necessary to thrive necessitate risk, and risk requires being unsafe once in a while. So pick up on both of those themes, if you would. Well, let's talk about, say, then you can remind me what your first thing is. Oh, the pharmaceuticals. The concept of a drug.

Yeah. Pharmaceuticals. Yeah. Everything's going to be solved by medical intervention and everything has to be safe. Both wrong. Right. I mean, the word safe, we've lost the concept of what the word safe is anyway. There is no such thing as safe, we've lost the concept of what the word safe is anyway. There is no such thing as safe, right?

I think, again, so reactivity in my mindfulness training was something like, oh, we have to reduce reactivity and promote centeredness, which really, the reactivity really fed a lot of people's dysregulated behavior during COVID and them feeding in from COVID. You're choosing your words very carefully, I'm noticing, and you may want to fill in...

I know the code you're using, I get it, but I'm not sure... You may need to flush some of that out. Well, I mean, reactivity of politicians, reactivity of the populace when they listen to the news, and then they're like, oh my God, and they feed into it. The reactivity of doctors to try to save their skin, instead of being centered,

calm, wise, and then responding appropriately in the given moment. That's kind of what I mean by reactivity that leads to like dysregulation within society and also dysregulation within the self. But for me, you know, coming in medicine, this is very basic like medicine 101 that you learn. Okay, go get consent from the patient for this procedure. So you go in as, you know, your med student with your intern, for example,

and then you tell the patient, okay, you know, we're going to do this procedure on you. It has risks, benefits, and there's alternatives. And so you document risk, benefits, alternatives, discuss with the patient. You never go to the patient and say, this is safe. You should do it. Like you're taught that is actually unethical to do. It is wrong to do. And you're lying to the patient. You never go to the patient and say, this is safe, you should do it. Like, you're taught that is actually unethical to do, it is wrong to do, and you're lying to the patient.

However, somehow during the COVID time, the word safe was like this wonderful thing, vaccines are safe and effective, safe and effective, safe. And I was making the argument, especially on my physician Facebook groups, like, why are you guys using the word safe? Like, is the world upside down? It's never, nothing is ever safe. There's always risk. And I never told a patient when I, you know, when you're during the consent procedure, whenever they asked me like, is this safe? I would say, nothing is safe. There's always a risk. In your case, you know, in your case, you're a 20 year old, there's always a risk. In your case, you know, in your case, you're a 20 year old, 25 year old male engineer

who's very conscientious and you can't see from this, because of this membrane on your retina and you're really upset about it and you can't do your work. I would say the risks are outweighed by the benefits of this procedure of getting a membrane peel. However, if the same lady, you know, if another patient came to me who was 75 years old

and said, yeah, I know I have this membrane, maybe it's a little bit warped, but I just watch TV, I don't really do much reading, it really doesn't bother me. I'd be like, no, we're not gonna do that because the risk of the procedure outweigh the benefit to you. So it's gonna be case by case basis. That was thrown out the window during COVID,

I don't know why. And so I had to find myself discussing like basics of medicine. The word safe should not be used when discussing medication. No medication or any intervention is safe. Walking down the street is not safe. Being in this physical body and having this physical experience on this earth has risk. And sometimes terrible things happen even if you've tried to mitigate the risk. And you just have to even if you've tried to mitigate the risk and you just have to understand

that there's gonna be a risk. So there's no such thing as safe. We should just get rid of that word in medicine. Yeah, I agree. I tell people, you walk across the threshold of my office and there's all sorts of risk, just risking falling down in my office, but also any interaction with the medical system.

We have a propensity to do harm. And we use things that are potentially dangerous all the time. And that's just what we do. So one quick question. Can I just say one more thing? As far as the drugs, I'm absolutely 100% with you that we need to minimize use of interventions, from a school intervention.

It's gotten to this crazy, it's crazy. We live in an insane system where 40 to 40 and 50 year old women, 25% of them are on antidepressants, right? You go to the office, you're like a 50 year old woman, I don't feel good. Here's an antidepressant. There's no counseling, there's no,

maybe they'll refer you to a therapist and they're not looking at all the other things that are happening. Are you living a purpose-driven life? Your children have left the home. How does that make you feel? What other things are you doing with your day now? Have you considered volunteering? What is, what makes you happy? How's your activity level? Are you getting movement? Are you getting sunlight? You know, what's your nutrition like? activity level, are you getting movement? Are you getting sunlight? You know, what's your nutrition like? 75% of the country is deficient in magnesium, right? We're sucking, taking it away from our bones. Like the basics have been completely ignored and we're just throwing

drugs at people, which is just upside down. Yes, that's exactly right. And, and it's not, I don't want to lay it all at the feet of our peers because the patients play a role in it too. They demand things. You gotta give me something, give me something. And we cave because we're in a hurry, we're doing our thing, whatever. And then you add to that patient satisfaction surveys.

People don't know about that. If the patient doesn't get what he or she wants, they shit on the doctor and that doctor easily could lose their job, easily. Yeah, that's another thing that's been, you know, it was like, used to be, and you know this better than me because you were, you saw that before of like how pain became the another vital sign. Right. And so everybody had to make everybody's pain zero or else, you know, if you didn't make their pain zero it became bad. So then everybody was getting over-medicated.

Now with these surveys, you wanna get a good survey results. So you're just gonna appease the patient. And that's just, it's just terrible. It doesn't make sense. That's right. All right, so before we go to break, give us a sketch on how you got involved

in the California circumstance. And you started really speaking up for medical freedom. What was the evolution there? And then we'll get into the weeds of it. People are criticizing, how are you going to get into the weeds? We're gonna get into the thicket of it after the break. But tell us, sketch it for us, what happened?

I was initially super overwhelmed and shocked, couldn't believe it. And I started following the public health training and medical training I got. And I was like, what I'm hearing on the news, and it really COVID woke me up to how much the news was teaching me things that or was trying to tell me things and indoctrinating me in things that were not reality. And as I awoke, I decided to work on myself, strengthen myself. And then I started speaking out. California made these terrible laws, one after another, or bills. And then I started speaking out. California made these terrible laws one after another or bills and then I started advocating and as I grew more strong in my voice, as I grew

more strong in my confidence and took steps, I started speaking out more and more and had got involved in fighting some of these censorship laws against doctors and they keep writing them so we have to keep fighting them. So which one was the first one up? So the one I'm currently fighting right now is actually written before the first one up but the first one up was AB 2098 which was a law that was made by authored by members of the vaccine working group especially Evan Lowe was the bill's primary author. And so these people kind of wrote a slew of bills during the COVID times in California as a reaction, right?

Not thinking, as a reactionary. And one response, we have to control, doctors was one of them, because doctors are spreading misinformation. And so that was what they were saying. And disinformation, they're saying that there's, you know, nanobots in the vaccines and we have to get doctors who say

there's nanobots in the vaccines. I was like, what doctor is saying there's nanobots in the vaccine? Like, you know? And don't we have laws on, and we have laws on the books already that prevent, that can show that legal action can be taken against doctors by the state if they say this

information. And so they put out a law, AB 2098 was the bill, and Governor Gavin Newsom ended up signing it, saying, and the law said that any doctor who engages in disinformation or misinformation can get their license taken away or investigated and the Disinformation I agree with a doctor and this information is like a doctor knowingly spreading false information. That's unethical. It's wrong. Absolutely but their definition of misinformation was really frightening they defined as misinformation as Information that's contrary to that's against consensus contrary to standard of care. So this word consensus loomed. I'm like, what's the consensus? Is it formal consensus?

Is it informal consensus? Who is deciding the consensus? Why, why? Why are we saying that what's consensus? So everybody's gonna chill their speech. The legal term is called chilling your speech. Not speak, which was already happening among physicians. So I was like, oh my gosh,

this is gonna compound the issue. And we saw that it did compound the issue. And so as I spoke out against it, I met with my representative, my state Senator, Sydney Kamlager's office, who by the way, was the author of the second bill or the second law that I'm fighting now. She's now gone on to Congress. I don't know what she's doing. I guess she and I have some celestial karma that we're figuring out, or at least I'm trying to figure out on earth now. But she backed that law. I met with her office. I was like, you cannot push AB 2098. That makes all doctors fear to say anything because they're afraid to be outside of

consensus. This doesn't make sense. It's unethical, it's wrong, it's free speech violation. She voted for it anyway. So many Democrats in the state legislature voted for it anyway. Governor Gavin Newsom signed it. And as I'm speaking out then, I got the opportunity to be a part of that lawsuit along with some great doctors, Ron Duracelli, Erin Cariotti, Pete Masolowski, Tracy Beth Hogue, and supported by the wonderful people at the New Civil Liberties Alliance. The ACLU, who by the time, who by the way during COVID was pushing for vaccine mandates and saying that vaccine mandates were wonderful thing, you know,

was nowhere to be found when this free speech violation. So it's wonderful, you know, it's so important to support great nonprofits, legal nonprofits like the New Civil Liberties Alliance, like the Pacific Legal Foundation that's heading up as counsel for the current lawsuit that I'm involved in for free speech for doctors. Was that her first suit? Was that her meet Dylan? Was she involved with that one?

She was very interested, but she ended up not being involved in that lawsuit, but she was one of the people who reached out to me and was like, do you want to fight this? And so I really appreciate her fierceness that gave me that feeling that, hey, this is possible. We could do this. And she's been, she's a role model.

So what ended up happening is that multiple, so there's a couple different groups that sued children's health defense fund was one of them. We had individual doctors. I was also suing in the capacity of a patient because I, you know, as a patient, I also said I want to be able to hear my doctor's speech because the First Amendment not only affects the speaker, the First Amendment is also supposed to protect the rights of the listener to hear that speech. So if the government is interfering with the First Amendment rights of the doctor, then the patient's First Amendment rights to hear that speech are also being interfered with. So I sued in both capacities as a doctor and a physician.

And there were several other doctors, there was another legal nonprofit that was also fighting. So it's nice to have different groups fighting the same law, because it gives you more opportunity and for the nuance in the debate to get, for the nuance in the discussion, the arguments to get better as well. And so we got a preliminary injunction

when we were fighting the physician consensus law. And that's very rare to get. And our judge had come and he was prepared. He was like, what? This law doesn't make grammatical sense. This law doesn't make it clear on what a doctor can say and what they can't say. Who's deciding what they can say and what they can't say? And he was asking these questions of the state's lawyer. By the way, the state's lawyer is the same lawyer in this current case.

So at both lawsuits, the state's lawyer is the same person. And so she really couldn't answer some of these questions. She did her best in that first case. And she, I mean, he just pointed out how ridiculous the state's arguments were. He's called the law nonsense. And when he said that, I felt so much better. It's like, finally, someone can see how nonsense is.

Gavin Newsom didn't see the nonsense. Rob Bonta, the attorney general, didn't see the nonsense. All those Democrats who voted for this bill didn't see the nonsense. Didn't see the gross ethical First Amendment rights violations in it. And, but he gave us the preliminary injunction, which meant that they couldn't come after us

if we broke the law. And then he decided to hold off on ruling. And in the meantime, one of the other groups of doctors that had lost to the appellate level. And in the appellate level, the three judge panel was like really cooking the state attorney, basically giving her lots of questions, like this doesn't make sense, and really questioning her.

So it looked like they were going to lose at the appellate level. And what happened, this is the back insider story, is that one of my friends had Gavin Newsom come up to him. And what he did is he said, and this is actually after the fact, what ended up happening is they repealed the law very quietly. And Gavin Newsom went up to my friend

and he said it was my idea to repeal the law. And he took credit for it. And I think what ended up happening is that he saw how grossly unethical and a violation of free speech this was, and he wanted to look good. So he saw that it was going to make him and the state look bad. And so he got the Democrats to push for the deal.

I have no doubt that he saw that it was going to make him look bad. I do doubt that he actually had an appreciation for the intrusion on our speech. That I don't think. But it would have made him look bad and that's important. We're going to talk more about him. I have to take a little break. We're also going to talk about

a study that has been exposed for being a hoax about African American babies be more likely to die after the care of Caucasian physicians, which they now have on the record the researchers saying, and then leave that data out, leave that part out because it

won't help make the narrative that they would literally say narrative in terms of a scientific publication, which is again, I'm disgusted by people, but we'll talk about that right after this. We're here with Dr. Azadeh Khatibi. Be right back. Wellness company knows that taking charge of your family's healthcare is a top priority and being rationally ready, who knows what the future will hold for us. Now TWC has a service to cover your family's medical needs, including and especially prevention. For just $100 a month, the One Wellness Elite membership includes two free medical grade nutraceuticals per month, free prescriptions

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All right, so let's bring Azadeh Katibi back in. We were talking about Governor Newsom. We were talking about the attorney general or see the attorney general is- Yeah. Unto the attorney general's, yeah. And neither of them seem to understand. see the attorney is, is, um, yeah, until the attorney generals that, yeah, and, uh, and neither of them seem to understand. Yeah. They need to see, neither of them seem to understand the concept of free speech or evidently not even the bill of rights, which is odd. That

used to be as a someone who I thought I was a liberal. I thought that was one of my organizing principles as a liberal, but it seems to have lost any meaning for people that continue to identify that way. Also over your left shoulder, am I seeing a bust of Thomas Jefferson? Is that what I saw there? Is that a Hamilton? This is a bust of Washington. George Washington.

George Washington, yeah. Here, I'll put it over here so Georgie can be seen. I got this as an award for, I got this as a bravery award for speaking out against AB 2098. Well, you deserve it. Congratulations. And it is the founding fathers that would be proud and it's their memory that we have to sort of bring forward

to make the, to protect these sacred principles. So it's, all right, anyway, I can't believe we're having to have these conversations. But let's go talk about that article, that hoax article about the African-American babies in the ICU. Did you have a chance to look at that and review the hoax that has been revealed?

You know, I didn't look at the article overall, but I did look at who was involved and some background work. And I did look at the FOIA email record. So I have some stuff to say about it. Go ahead, let's do it. Well, so this was an article that came out in 2020. It was called Physician-Patient Racial Concordance and Disparities in Birthing Mortality for

Newborn. and disparities in birthing mortality for newborns. So what this means is basically patient-physician racial concordance is like if the doctor's white and the patient is white, the doctor's black, the patient's black, they're racially concordant. So they were looking at are there disparities in the death rates of babies, newborn babies, based on whether or not the babies are black and the doctors are black or the babies are black and the doctors are white. If there's differences in race between the doctor and the patient, will the babies die at a higher rate? And this was published in the journal Economic Sciences in 2020 and the authors are Brad Greenwood, Hardeman Laura Huang and Aaron Sojourner Guess how many of these people are doctors?

Zero Zero, so what from what I could tell the backgrounds were in economics electrical engineering One person had an MPH and a PhD but no MDs no nurses no DOs and a PhD, but no MDs, no nurses, no DOs, no medical background. And I think that's also one of the reasons that the article came out being such poor quality and had such a gross error in it. But the article when it was published came out to much fanfare because what they were saying is that it showed that when black babies are taken care of by white doctors, they have a higher mortality rate than when black babies are taken care of by black doctors.

And this became, this got a lot of press, also a lot of backlash, people were upset about it because some people really don't want us to look at racial concordance data. And I think it's gotten so much back press. One of the people, Rachel Hardiman, the MPH PhD, she now blog, you can't see her tweets unless she approves you as a follower. So some of them have felt this backlash against them. And rightly so, because what happened is that when the paper came out, people were making, including Judge Jackson,

Supreme Court Justice Jackson, talked about in one of her opinion judgments about how this lack of, or about how the death of black babies at higher rates at the hands of white doctors is a huge problem. And really focusing on like, you know, there's some biases and there's some huge problems here in terms of the mortality rate of black people that we need to adjust, to attend to, especially implying that there's like all this subconscious bias of white people towards black people that's affecting their mortality rates.

However, do no harm, which is actually one of my co-plaintiffs in the AB 241 case that we're appealing right now, do no harm, God, the email records, they foiled, God bless them, they FOIA the email records of the authors involved in the study. And what they found is that when they were writing out the study, one of the models that they did

showed that white babies died more under the care of a black physician. died more under the care of a black physician. And what Brian or Brad Greenwood, the lead author, said in the comments section when they were editing the paper together, he said, I wanna delete this. I'm deleting it because I don't want to take away from our main argument.

I want to strengthen our from our main argument. I want to strengthen our narrative. He used the word narrative. He didn't say argument even, he said narrative, which is just the most bizarre word for a scientist to use, bizarre. Well, that's, you know, yeah. He said, I want to strengthen the narrative

of saving black babies. And I don't want to undermine that narrative. That's, it's just shocking to me, right? Because as a scientist, yeah, you should, well, it's not shocking, but in a way it's shocking, right? The ethical person who wants to like just look at the data and we of course understand that models can be twisted to say whatever you want them to say a lot of the time.

But like you should be pursuing the truth. The essence is close as possible as truth. And these ideas of stories and narratives are just ridiculous. And I wonder if there had been a medical doctor, maybe, maybe they would have, at least someone would have pointed out, wait a minute, we have to show what the data is actually showing. We can't massage the data or leave parts out to fit a narrative story. I'm a storyteller, right? So I'm a filmmaker, I love telling stories, but those are like two very different parts of the brain and there's, you know, you have to, there's

one where you want to show people and lead them emotionally, etc. Then there's the one where you're like based on facts, that part of the brain where it's like let's do fact-based, let's adhere to the ethics. If you're allegedly, you're allegedly doing science, you're applying the scientific method and the null hypothesis is either informative or non-informative, and that's that. That's it. That's it. You either learned something or you did not, that's it.

And then you do that many, many times and build other experiments. You do not get to create a narrative from your study. It's just informative, non-informative, that's it. Statistical analysis to back it up. That's all. But it shows you like what the layers of convoluted, like egoic desires that are feeding, feeding this quote unquote science, right? It's no longer science because there is like this

egoic desire for an outcome, right? Or that my office focus. It's like religion. It's like religious. Yeah, it's fundamentalism. It's it is, you know, it's the old school in the days of sort of Thomas Aquinas when, when the, you know, the, the authorities decided what the truth was. That was that. And it was based on some dogma, you know, and that's not what, that's not the rule. Well, I hope we move beyond that. I don't know.

I kind of feel like you're going to get a JD or you've all had a mini JD already. Is that in your future? I'm done. All right. Okay. But I will tell you, I think one more, one more.

Can I just tell you one more important thing about this article is that they didn't actually look at the reason black babies were dying at higher rates under white doctors. And the reason was that more serious ill babies were being taken care of by the white doctors because more white doctors- Let me say it in a way it's clearer.

Let me say it's clear. The kids that needed the neonatal ICU tended to be more likely to be black. And the doctors that were attending to the most severe kids in the neonatal ICU tended to be white. It's like assessing a hospital that treats the most severely

ill patients, the surgeons that take on the most difficult cases. Guess what? They're not gonna have the best outcomes. They're not because they're starting with things with a very low probability of success. That's just the way medicine is and that's how we do research. We take that into account when we're assessing a hospital or a doctor's outcomes. What did we start with? How sick were these people? How likely were these things to get better

in the first place? And then the other thing is, and let's both agree on this, we are not saying in this conversation, we are not saying that physician race concordance is a good or bad thing. We are saying, and I would argue that if a patient wants it, they absolutely should have that. Or if a family wants it, absolutely say should have a raised concordant physician if that's what the patient wants. But for us to sit on high and mandate it all over makes almost no sense.

It doesn't. And then when you have people who are not involved in medicine, actually don't have that understanding, you're gonna get junk science like this, junk science like this, which leads me to the AB 241 lawsuit, which is the government trying to basically architect the medical consciousness of doctors. Tell me about this one, this sounds unbelievable. So this law was actually signed, was passed and signed by Gavin Newsom and the legislature in 2019.

But it's taken a few years for it to be implemented. And what it is, and the bill was AB 241 and the case is Katibi versus Hawkins, and we're fighting it with the help of our legal nonprofit, Pacific Legal Foundation. What they basically said is that they want every doctor in CME based on this law to satisfy the implicit bias teaching. So the law says that every single continuing medical education course, and in the state of California, a doctor has to have 50 hours of continuing

medical education every two years. At every single continuing medical education course, and in the state of California, a doctor has to have 50 hours of continuing medical education every two years. At every single continuing medical education course that a doctor teaches, they need to teach examples of how implicit bias affects perceptions and treatment decisions of physicians and surgeons, leading to disparities in health outcomes, or strategies to address how unintended biases and decision-making may contribute to health care disparities by

shaping behavior and producing differences in medical treatment along the lines of race, ethnicity, gender identity, sexual orientation, age, socioeconomic status or other characteristics. So that's what the law says and the law says that you have to, every doctor or organization or organization has to do it at every single CME. So I think that this is ridiculous. It's a first amendment violation.

It opens the door to basically government controlling, not just doctors, but all licensed professionals in California. And essentially what they're doing is they're saying implicit bias is bad and we can have that discussion because I actually think implicit bias understanding is very good for doctors to have. Is it, it's still very, it's still controversial.

So different doctors have different opinions on what like implicit bias is. Is it the roots of prejudice? Is it not the roots of prejudice? But Sidney Kamwager Dove, with the help of some organizations, created this bill and got it passed into law because they want to avoid different outcomes based on race and gender, et cetera, especially race.

And basically with CME, it's a system, just so your listeners understand, CME is continuing medical education. It's a system, just so your listeners understand, CME is Continuing Medical Education. It's a system that was created by doctors, for doctors, privately, with private institutions. And it was just a bunch of doctors getting together and saying, hey, it'd be nice for us to have these education courses.

And they would just meet and hang out. And then it became, as things grow, they became a system. Then the government, and actually the doctors were like, hey, it'd be good if doctors were licensed. We should have some level of licensure. And so the government, system. Then the government, and actually the doctors were like, hey, it'd be good if doctors were licensed. We should have some level of licensure. And so the government, they went to the government, and then the government created a licensure system,

and that's why doctors have to be licensed in our states. And the state then said, hey, you guys have the CMU system, we're gonna require a certain number of hours every year that you guys have to learn. And so what has now happening is the government is saying, hey, in your CME, in every single CME course that you teach, you have to teach on implicit bias. So they've hijacked a private system, and now they're calling for government speech

in that private system. And Rob Bonta, the attorney general, and his lawyers are arguing, and they've won it. They won it at the lower level, and we're appealing it in the higher court, in the appellate court. They're basically saying, we can mandate this speech because every physician knows this.

Doctors who go to CME are engaging in government speech, and doctors listening to other doctors know that they're listening to government speech. So they're just making this stuff up. It's incredibly dangerous. Government speech, what are they talking about? What do they mean by government speech? It's the, they're basically saying it's,

you're speaking on behalf of the government when you teach CME. Did you know that Dr. Pinsky? Did you know all these years you've been going to CME? You've been listening to government speakers speak? I've been going and I've taught at CME and no one ever told me that the government was involved. Right, so the lower court has said the CME-

I want you to do something though. You gotta go back to about 1994 or so and look at this exact same phenomenon as it pertains to the prescribing of opiates. You mentioned the pain is the fifth vital sign. You were required to go to a full day CME, I think every year or every three years on how to give massive doses of opiates to anybody who says there's pain. There should never be pain in California. No human should experience pain of any time.

And if you don't let your patient leave with 60 hydrocodone when he walks out of the office, you're guilty of patient abuse. And I remember, let me see if I can remember this. I remember the pain doctor getting, pain is the vital sign, pain is the most important thing, was what they were pushing. And there, what did he say?

I wish I could remember this. I think he said something like, there's absolutely no evidence that opiates are a good treatment for chronic pain. So let's talk about how to prescribe Dilaudid for pain patients. I mean, do you know that there was never any data to suggest that a chronic pain situation is improved

in any way by the prescribing of opiates, yet we were required by law to get, people don't understand, want to blame the family the the family that funded the the drug company i forget the name of the family now they the people that made Oxycontin yes they were duplicitous but this thing was perpetrated by the government when the government regulatory agencies got involved in this, they mandated that we do this and threatened us not with malpractice, with criminal actions or patient abuse. That was state of California. Go look at that, bring that up as the infinite wisdom of the state.

And then when it all goes down, they're nowhere to be found. It really, and it got so scary in the 90s, those of us that needed to, had patients in pain, we would turn all of our patients over to the pain management teams, because it was too high a liability to not adequately treat the pain and not give them enough opiates. I had patients stopping breathing

on the physical therapy table, because they were taking so many damn opiates. And that's what the pain world was doing. It was, you just bring up that history. Look at what they required us to do and then how they ran away and

blame the Sackler family when the shit hit the fan 20 years later. My God. And that wasn't, they weren't even mandating your speech at that point. They were just saying you have to take this course. So, it'll help you. Oh my God. And that wasn't, they weren't even mandating your speech at that point. They were just saying you have to take this course. So, I mean, that's why government should not get involved

in medicine at all. They were mandating how we practiced. Pain is the fifth vital sign. Now, think about this. Your happy face pain scale was more important than your pulse. If you had zero pulse, what's the pain scale? What's the pain scale? That's the insanity of what was going on at the time. And boy, I was

fighting it and I got, you know what it feels like to fight this stuff, I got crushed on every side from the Department of Mental Health, my own hospitals, from the California Medical Association, all the above. Just they come crushing down on you. You're interested in harming patients. Then with this bill, it'll be, you're a racist. It'll be something crazy like that every time they take action against physicians who raise their hand and go, you're ruining medicine.

You're intruding on the practice of medicine. Well, if anybody says you're racist, the come back to that is implicit bias is a controversial topic. And there's people who created the implicit, the psychologists who created the implicit association test, those three, there's discussion and debate and difference among them

on whether or not it contains the roots of prejudice or not. So even the people who created the implicit association test that coined the term implicit bias have disagreements. And there's evidence that implicit bias training can even backfire and make people even more bias or resentful. So this is not something the government should be involved in it's opening the door to like the government say.

To be fair, the topic you, me and our peers should be struggling with this and try to figure out how to make sure it's expunged from our practice for sure. We don't need the government to do it on our behalf because they fuck everything up. I'm sorry to say. Yeah. That's, I mean, what we've seen throughout history is that terrible things have happened when the government is involved in healthcare and deciding what should and should not be

done, whether it's the eugenics movement and forced sterilizing thousands of people, including Californians. California was the head of that, the opioid stuff that you're talking about. And now this, I mean, we should keep government out of health, healthcare and decision making. Now, I mean, with this idea of CME being government speech, what are we going to do? What if a government, it's going to open the door to different states? Just so you guys, your listeners understand, it's going to open the door to different states? Just so you guys, your listeners understand, it's going to open the door to different states. One state saying all doctors at all CME have to teach that abortion is health care. Another state will say all doctors at all CME have to teach that abortion is unethical.

And so what if a doctor's, first of all, it's wrong to be mandating speech of doctors. And second of all, what happens if a doctor's licensed in both of those states? Now they're in like a terrible position because now they have to teach opposite to what one state wants. Are they going to get investigated? Is a fellow or a resident who's pissed off at an attending going to report them for not teaching implicit bias at the one CME that they forgot to teach it at? Are private institutions or pharmaceutical companies that fund CME now funding state

speakers? or pharmaceutical companies that fund CME now funding state speakers are Teachers at academic institutions now going to get Fired because they can't teach CME which is a job requirement for them because they don't believe in it And so the judge asked the lawyer for the for the state What can they disagree with this law? Can they say they disagree with it? And she couldn't define how much they could disagree with it. So you don't even know what, to the extent to which you can disagree.

So this is a dangerous precedent for all licensed professionals, because it opens the door for all licensed professionals, whether you're a physical therapist, whether you're an architect, whatever you are, to have mandated speech at both the state and federal level when you're being taught courses. And some doctors can then become targets

because the state can, the government can weaponize this law, can weaponize this law against them. I've been there. You, you, I'm sure you'll find it. I've been there. Hey, let me, let me ask you a quick question. Ophthalmological question before we can, we had a rep so pretty soon.

Retinal manifestations of COVID or vaccine, what are you guys seeing? Oh my gosh. So you can get retinitis, you can get not just retinal. So let's just talk ophthalmic so you can get like a conjunctivitis. It's like the most common thing that you hear about. And so, I mean, what are you going to do about you can also get retinitis? What can you do about? You know what I had? I'll be sure you something. Put up the picture can also get retinitis. What can you do about the port of care? Let me show you something. Let me put up the picture, Caleb, of my vaccine reaction.

I woke up in the morning after the J&J vaccine. And if you remember, the TTP was the reaction. Now, if you can see my raccoon eye there in my left, in the O.S. Yeah, wow. I woke up with that, which is the presenting feature of transverse sinus thrombosis.

And I thought, is this my cavernous sinus going? What the hell? So that was a vaccine. One eye. It was just one eye? Okay, so yeah, usually when you get these raccoon eyes, it can be also be not just an eye thing, but it can be a sign of allergy

or it can be a sign of sinusitis or yeah, maybe a thrombosis of something. So that's not good. But that's what was happening. That's what was happening from the vaccine. They were getting TTP and then active thrombosis in places like the transverse sinus. And I thought, oh my God, I'm gonna be the only male

to get, it'd only been in females at that point. And I thought I'd be the only male to get this terrible thing. And the transverse sinus also, I don't know if you know, is associated with a midbrain stroke, which I did not get. Everything seemed fine, but it all passed, yeah. But it all passed. But in any event, that was my vaccine story.

Are you seeing anything? Do you worry about anything else on the front now? Are you seeing anything still active on the COVID front or the vaccine front? Well, what I'm gonna tell you is in addition to my MPH degree and my MD, I had also studied molecular biology at UCI. It was a region scholar at UCLA.

I studied molecular biology. And when I looked at the mRNA vaccine specifically, I looked at that and I said, why is nobody else speaking up? Because this mRNA vaccine is a setup just the way it is. It's a setup for inflammation. It's a setup for immune disorders. It's a setup for recurrent cancer. It's a setup for, or excuse me, a setup for cancer. It's a setup for latent cancers coming back. It's a setup for recurrent infections and latent infections resurging. Can nobody else

see the mechanisms as actual? Why aren't we talking about it? And why didn't the studies actually look at this? Why didn't they even look at inflammatory markers when they were doing this? When we knew from before, from decades, maybe not decades, but years of mRNA research that this is an inflammatory product? And why didn't they look at this stuff? And then when I listened to the Vaccine Advisory Committee for Pfizer in 2020, December 2020, none of the people on the

committee were asking these deep questions. One person asked about is it possible that through a reverse transcriptase mechanism the mRNA vaccine can then integrate into your genome, not the vaccine, but the mRNA can integrate into the gene and maybe through reverse. And the person, and what did the Pfizer representative say? It's a possibility. We think it's low, but we haven't tested it. You know, it was just like, you're saying it's possible.

That's what you're telling me. Yeah. So, I mean, there's just so many things, but for me, infection, cancer, inflammation were like these big things that were glaring. Yeah. So, I mean, there's just so many things, but for me, infection, cancer, inflammation, were like these big things that were glaring. Yeah, yeah. And now we're seeing them. We're seeing them. A very sad chapter.

And there's a new study about to come out in mice where they actually took a piece of the, I forget, I think it's the spike protein itself, which is what's manufactured by the mRNA. And then they measured inflammatory markers and it's just off the chain when they actually do it. So it's shocking. Anyway, more to be revealed.

This all is a story that we've been sort of talking about for a long time. And it was just, this whole thing has been, it's so mind bogoggling that here we are but I'm so proud of a young physician like yourself stepping up and and making a difference in fighting the fight because all of our peers sort of rolled over and That just before we wrap up. Tell me what what what is the plan going forward? What are you fighting now? And what do you need us to do?

Sure so what you guys and your what you guys can do is you can call and tweet your state senators and representatives and tell them to reappeal AB 241, the law. You can contact Gavin Newsom's office and tell him to put pressure to reappeal the law like he did for

AB 2098. You can donate to the Pacific Legal Foundation and other legal nonprofits like the New Civil Liberties Alliance. I really appreciate what Pacific Legal Foundation has done for us with this case. And yeah, keep pressure on your representatives, tweet

this stuff out and follow me for more information. I'm working on a documentary on free speech now with some great people and free speech in medicine specifically. And you can follow me on my podcast within with Dr. Azadeh Katibiibi, MDMS, MPH, as well as my sub stack and keep speaking up about these things and be interested in them because it's your future. It's your health and stay healthy. Don't go to a doctor if you need to unless you need to. That's a really important point.

Come to us when the risk is worth it. Number one. And number two, if it can happen in medicine, it can happen all over the place. Believe me, this is not the only place you're going to lose your freedom. So it's just got to stop. And I hope you'll let me be a resource for you.

Whatever I can do to be of use, you'll call on me, okay? Thank you, Dr. Drew. You've always been a role model for me, even starting from when I was 11. And I really appreciate you. Thank you so much. Drew. You've always been a role model for me, even starting from when I was 11. And I really appreciate you. Thank you so much. You're awesome. God bless you. Thank you so much. Dr. Azadeh Katibi. Thank you so much. Follow her on Twitter. Let's see. Oh, you got it. Kayla, put her Twitter handle up there. Get her ex handle. Sorry. Is it just Azadeh Katibi? It's too small for me across

the room here. Is there any D-R-O-M-D right at the end? MD at the end. Okay. So look at the spelling there. It's not easy for us honkeys. So for us, a lot of things are not easy for me to spell these days. Oh my goodness. I'm just getting a COVID myself, the third or fourth time I've had it. Good times, whole household here has it, and I'm getting that little weird long COVID feeling of fatigue and whatnot. That's kind of why I'm wrapping up a little earlier.

I'm poor Susan is really suffering with this as is my daughter. They've got it much worse than I did. I thought I had just allergies, worse, a cold, because that's what COVID has become now, but it still has that funny, it can be a little worse, it can make you fatigued and that kind of good stuff.

So I am actually taking, I have met with Peter McCullough today, I'm actually taking the ultimate spike support, ultimate spike detox, I think he calls it. And he regaled for me today, the success he's had at resolving long COVID, which I'm kind of in a little mini version of right now. So I want to go away.

Now it makes more sense. I knew you must've been taken something like that because I don't understand how you're able to sit up and do a whole show. And I think this is the first time in the whole show you've mentioned, oh, by the way, I also have COVID. Yeah. Well, I did pretty well with it. I'm sort of pleased with myself.

I was kind of, I thought I was well by Monday, and, but then it's kind of waxed and waned and I don't like it. I want it to stop. So that's what I'm doing with the Ultimate Spike Sport. It's, maybe it's psychological, but I feel like I'm a little better after I take it. Did I get the Vax integrity?

I got the J&J vaccine five years ago and that was that. And I think my daughter's had multiple vaccines and she's got COVID worse than all of us. So there's a case study in this household where the vaccine didn't make any difference. And I had bad COVID back in the alpha delta days. That was a nasty, nasty version. Caleb, anything else?

Should we put the upcoming cases? We're gonna be in here tomorrow at two o'clock. Is that right? Is that correct? Or the three o'clock tomorrow? Let me look at my schedule. I was asking and not, I think it's two o'clock tomorrow. Our new schedule is supposed to be at two Pacific, but today was just the odd day. So all of these are at two Pacific. Right. We're going to, the reason I asked for three o'clock today is because I was with the wellness company people and I had to get across town, I have to go back.

But I wanna say that we're gonna dig into the French politics tomorrow with Jerome Riviere, which is Marine Le Pen being essentially put in prison for nothing. This is what's happening in Hungary, in Romania, in Brazil, now in France, almost happened here. This, what the French are calling judicial, what would they call it?

Judicial dictatorships, that the judges are determining the functioning of the democratic process and they've taken over. Marine Le Pen is a firebrand, much like, I'm forgetting the one we talked to from the EU, help me with that, Caleb. Christine Anderson. Those two remind me.

Christine Anderson, they reminded with that, Caleb. Those two remind me, Christine Anderson, they reminded me of each other. And she was the leading candidate for president of France. And now she cannot run for five years. So fascinating, we'll see what happens. She's appealing it, we'll see what happens. And then we're also gonna talk to the founder of the hypochlorous acid that we all so enthusiastic about

here, the skin product that we're using on our babies and our kids and ourselves. And so I suggest you look into it. Did we get a website for the skincare? Caleb, I don't remember who might've said it. Yeah, it is. Let me double check and see where. While you're looking it up, I'll say Adam Coleman

coming up, Sean Frosch, who, let's see, he was, oh my gosh, he was in a, I can't remember exactly what it was, but he had a situation, I can't remember now, I'm sure Emily's gonna suddenly. He was a swatting victim from the recent swatting attempts. Exactly, he was a swat victim, that's right. And we're gonna talk about swatting,

Salty Cracker, Mark Rebeer coming around, a lot to talk about. So we got a lot of good stuff. And anything else there, Caleb? Did you find the- All they have to do is go to drdrew.com slash skin repair and they'll find all this stuff. They actually get a discount with that as well.

All right, excellent. All right, and I've got some very exciting product that I have developed myself that I'll be talking about shortly, with the V-Shrit people that I'm really excited about. So I'll let you know about that, but as soon as it's available, I take it myself now, and I think it's great. All right, everybody, we'll see you tomorrow at two o'clock.

Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the

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