Ask Dr. Drew - Ghislaine Offered Me To Trump But This Is How He Responded, Say Epstein Survivors w/ Lisa Phillips, Anouska De Georgiou + Comedian Ryan Sickler & Chef Gruel – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 560

Episode Date: November 29, 2025

Epstein survivor Anouska De Georgiou says Ghislaine Maxwell introduced her to Donald Trump with a clear intention of trafficking her to the billionaire. But Anouska says Trump refused: “at no time did President Trump behave with any impropriety with me.” De Georgiou – a friend of the lated Virginia Giuffre – joins with other Epstein survivors including model Lisa Phillips, who are urging Trump to release the full Epstein files to the public. Comedian Ryan Sickler discusses his battle with Factor V Leiden, a rare blood clotting condition, and Chef Gruel joins with pro turkey tips for Thanksgiving. Anouska De Georgiou founded the Kintsugi Foundation to support women in recovery. She grew up between London and the south of France and is a survivor of abuse and trafficking by Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell. She has been in recovery since age 26 and now supports women healing from trauma. More at https://instagram.com/anouskadegeorgiou Lisa Phillips is an Epstein survivor who has advocated for the full release of Epstein’s case files. She suffered abuse at 21 and continues to speak publicly about accountability and transparency surrounding the case. She is a model who has appeared on multiple magazine covers. Learn more at https://instagram.com/iamLisaPhillips⠀Ryan Sickler is a comedian and host of The HoneyDew. His special Live & Alive is available on YouTube and Patreon, and his 2018 album Get a Hold of Yourself reached #1 on Billboard and iTunes. Follow at https://x.com/ryansickler Chef Andrew Gruel is a food entrepreneur, Huntington Beach City Councilor, and founder of American Gravy Restaurant Group. He hosts American Gravy on Rumble and is active in small business advocacy. Follow at https://x.com/ChefGruel 「 SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS 」 • AUGUSTA PRECIOUS METALS – Thousands of Americans are moving portions of their retirement into physical gold & silver. Learn more in this 3-minute report from our friends at Augusta Precious Metals: ⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/gold⁠⁠⁠ or text DREW to 35052 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• FATTY15 – The future of essential fatty acids is here! Strengthen your cells against age-related breakdown with Fatty15. Get 15% off a 90-day Starter Kit Subscription at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/fatty15⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • PALEOVALLEY - "Paleovalley has a wide variety of extraordinary products that are both healthful and delicious,” says Dr. Drew. "I am a huge fan of this brand and know you'll love it too!” Get 15% off your first order at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/paleovalley⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • VSHREDMD – Formulated by Dr. Drew: The Science of Cellular Health + World-Class Training Programs, Premium Content, and 1-1 Training with Certified V Shred Coaches! More at https://drdrew.com/vshredmd • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twc.health/drew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://kalebnation.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠) and Susan Pinsky (⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/firstladyoflov⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠e⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Executive Producers • Kaleb Nation - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://kalebnation.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • Susan Pinsky - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/firstladyoflove⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Content Producer & Booking • Emily Barsh - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/emilytvproducer⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Hosted By • Dr. Drew Pinsky - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/drdrew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

well we have just one show to provide for you before the holiday weekend so it's going to be a big one lots of guests ryan sickler we get ryan in here finally of course he is the host of the honey honeydew podcast uh honeydoo with y'all they put that as the name the honeydew the honeydue again he has a new uh one hour special debut at number one it's we're going to talk about it it's called live and Alive, available on YouTube and Patreon. It is a 2018 album. Get a hold of yourself, reach number one on Billboard. Everyone knows Ryan Sickler. I hope they do. If they don't, you should check him out. He'll be in here a minute. We'll talk a little bit about health.

Speaking of health, we're going to switch gears and talk to an issue that's pertinent to health, but it is very much also tied to what is in the news today, which is, of course, the Epstein File. Our friend, Anushka DeGeorgio returns. She'll tell her story and tell us about the Kinsugi Foundation as well. She supports women in recovery, and she was brought with her, Lisa Phillips, also an Epstein survivor. Got a lot to get into. And then finally, chef Andrew Gruhl, fruit entrepreneur, Huntington Beach City Councilman to talk about the upcoming holiday and some holiday ideas. Back right after this.

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Ryan Sickler, he is a friend. He's a friend of the program. He's a friend of mine. He's a great comic. He has a lot to talk about. He's been through a lot. You can follow him on X at Ryan Sickler, S-I-C-L-E-R. And be sure to follow or go watch live and alive on YouTube and Patreon.

Ryan, welcome. Thank you, Dr. Drew. Good to see you, buddy. Good to see you, too. So, you know, two, a couple things. We, I didn't know almost where to start. I'm guessing Live and Alive is about your journey with pulmonary ambuli and hyperquagulability and the Factor 5 Leiden phenomenon that you did not know you had but showed up after a surgery, right?

Yes, you and I have talked about it a bunch. The special is just about the aftermath of all of it and where everything is now. But you know what, go watch and support it, all that good stuff. I actually have a question for you, Dr. Drew, and we've talked to bunch and I'm just going to switch gears right now because this is actually something I've never asked you before. What made you, what inspired you comedically, because I like to highlight low lights. And although you've been a professional for a long time, you've leaned into the comedy part of your career with Corolla early on. You're in the YMH verse. You're not afraid to come on all the comedy podcast.

What about combining your medical background with comedy did you see as an advantage? So I was not thinking about comedy. So the way this all happened to me, I think I've told you the story before, was I was invited to go on a radio program on late night, midnight to 3 a.m. on Sunday night, that needed to fill community service hours. And it was K Rock here in Los Angeles, which at the time had just come on the scene. Like it exploded on the scene as a popular station. And it was like across the street from my apartment. And so I was, people I knew, was socializing with people there and I was invited in. I was like, I don't quite get it.

But I went in there. And here was some of the most important elements, medical topics for young people. You could imagine being presented to FM disc jockeys in the middle of the night. And I thought, wow, this is what they trust. This is where they come. This is where they bring their questions. I wonder, and certainly rock and roll radio had been this incredible force for destruction of health, as I saw it. I wonder if we could turn the ship around and turn it into something that force for healthier choices by just educated, just showing up and answering questions.

And then it became more comedic when Corolla showed up in the mid-90s, right? And I didn't, what do I know? And so Corolla and I kind of came up with this concept that the entire way the show worked was we called at the time the Gainesburger and the pill, which you might, people don't know what even know what Gainesberger is anymore. So I'd have to say like the, oh, Jesus, you're all too young. You'd have to say it's like turkey and a pill.

Like if you want to get, right, a dog to take a pill, you have to wrap it in turkey and then you're peanut butter. Oh, Gainesburger or the old ground beef. That's what I'm talking about. I do remember Gainesburger now. I do remember Gainesberger now. Man, that one was gone. That was gone.

You brought that back now. Okay. It's a long time ago. But the bottom line was... I guess my question is, what made you not? Corolla was the Gainesburger. I was the pill. Right?

And so I just... And you can think of it as a straight man for a comedian. But that structure stayed in place for a long, long time. There was Gainesburger. Thank you for that. So who were your... comedic influences then because you could have easily said i'm not leaning into these clowns these guys are laughing and joking in a way that could look like we're making fun and mocking who were

comedic influences for you where you felt comfortable to stay in this mind you mind you corolla was was well i i at the beginning it was the outrageousness that got through to young people and made them feel comfortable and the rock stars and people music musicians that were coming through So I just saw it as an environment where they sort of felt like they could take difficult. Their difficult material didn't seem so intense. It sort of de-escalated things for them. Later, when it was more comedians per se, it was improvisational comedy. It was not stand-up comedy.

And Corolla pounded me over the head with that and does so to this day. He's like, I would disagree with him. And he would go, you cannot say no. Do not say no, say Adam, not only that but, or yes, and or whatever. And he was just hammered me with that for years. And I was like, dude, you're wrong. And if you're wrong, I have an obligation to point out that error and make it right. No, it's not how it works.

So I got used to sort of playing along, so to speak, with their stuff. But it was not, believe me, it's not some conscious intent for that's what I was trying to do. No, I do believe that. I just always wondered why you said, yeah, I'll go ahead and lean into this instead of, I'm going to distance myself from the comedic aspect of this. You got to go, who hears you if you're not going where people are congregating and the material that I have, particularly back in the day, was so boring that you had to find a way to make it entertaining so people could hear it.

You know, the Gainesburger and the pill. Gainsburger and the pill. Yeah. So I want to talk more about medical stuff, speaking of boring for you. So factor 5, Leiden, is a clotting factor. It's a more than more common coagulation disorder, so to speak, and it can predispose to clots after things like surgery. And pulmonary embolite, if the clot forms in your leg or your pelvis, those clouds can

migrate to your lungs. That's called a pulmonary embolus, and those are serious shit. And that happened to you. And I remember the first time I met you, we were at, YMH in Austin, I think. No, no, we were in Recita. No, in the Valley. Yeah.

And you told me, if I remember, you had a lot of depression and things after that after that whole experience, right? No, actually, there's a couple things because we've known each other so long. So I, there was a point where my daughter almost got hit by a car and I told you I'd become unhinged. I couldn't fly.

I was terrified of heights, all of a sudden, all these new things that I had never felt. before my life. And you introduced me to EMDR therapy. And I have preached EMDR therapy since that day because unlike, as you told me, talk therapy, there's an end to this. And I had to fly. I have to fly for work. And now I sleep on my flights. I don't medicate myself or anything like that. It really worked. I live on the top floor of my building now. It worked. So those were the two things. I've been able to manage my feelings post-surgery because of EMDR and the monkey taps and all the things I've learned through that have helped me, yeah.

You know, EMDR is extremely good for sort of phobias and things like that, like fear flying, fear, you know, whatever, even not so much OCD, but these phobias, I would say. And so it's really very, very effective as you're finding out. Do you talk about that in the special? No, not yet. I haven't talked about EMDR, but I preach it on the podcast nonstop. I get so many emails. What's the therapy?

EMDR, EMDR, EMDR, EMDR, go, go find somebody. Go find somebody. It works. I've done the talk therapy forever. And while it certainly helped, as you said, there is a absolute definitive end to this. Some people take a while to get there, but, man, that really, really worked. And once it extinguishes, the same thing with other sorts of preoccupations. So between EMDR and exposure therapies, now, we are really good with anxiety and obsessions

and these sort of symptoms that can be disabling. They don't correct the emotional landscape, you know, but they deal with these symptoms extremely well. And when they're, like you said, when they're disabling, that's a big, big deal. you had another experience during the COVID riots that I'm not that I keep I obsess about a little bit because it seems so horrifying

and I'm not I don't think you talk about it that much maybe you did for a while but can you share that story a little bit yeah yeah forgot be honest I just moved into the studio you originally came to over in Santa Monica that day we were told that the riots were going to happen people were coming by the studio saying we're coming back we're coming back you better get out of here we're coming back and man did they come back um they came and

i mean it started down you know look there's always good and bad the good people started down at the beach and they went south with their movement the bad people knew where the good people were gathered so they also gathered there they headed east down san an monica boulevard um And I mean, all the way down, robbing people, and it came in a wave. I'm telling you, I was there. We watched the first wave broke windows and just destroyed stuff. The second wave came behind them with suitcases and cars and things, unloading, grabbing, everything. We watched SUVs drive by.

We watched the military drive by. We watched the police drive by. All to go protect the Nordstroms. and everyone down at Third Street Promenade, while mom and pop shops were just wrecked. And they came to us, and they said, if you have a legal firearm, you should exercise your Second Amendment rights.

And I'm telling you, Dr. Jerome from Baltimore, Maryland. I saw more guns on that block in Liberal Santa Monica that day that I've seen anywhere. And there were people out there firing them into the air, one guy. I also had a guy come to me, and I tell the story, did not point, but held it up and told me, get the fuck. Am I allowed to say that? Yeah, yeah. Get the fuck out of here and held the gun up, and I was like, I'm out, I'm out. So they robbed the music store. They are everywhere. They're CVS right there everywhere. The only guy that I saw not get messed with was across the street

was a pharmacy, and they knew people were coming for what they had in that pharmacy. So they were boarding up early. And that gentleman stood out front with an automatic rifle, and nobody messed with that man. He didn't threaten anyone with it. He just stood there, and they walked right on by. And at the time, this is mid-pandemic. So everyone's wearing masks. It looked like the purge. It was terrifying. And then everybody wants to get into the, what was, I don't want to say, there's one generalization of what happened that I saw and it was young. It wasn't about a race. It was about an age.

I saw a lot of youth, young white girls, all of them were there. It wasn't any race that I specifically, this, that it was a youth movement, at least on our pocket. I'm only speaking on my experience. And it was absolutely wild and terrifying to see and be a part of. And you weren't by yourself and also tell them about what the music store did before they destroyed it. Well, so the music store, Santa Monica Music Center, hosts a lot of underprivileged kids. They do a lot of not-profit. They supply the music instruments for, I want to say, all the West Side schools.

Also, where your children go to get their lessons. etc, etc. So this is a mom and pop shop that's been benefiting and helping the community for decades. And, hey, when you got guitars right in the window, Dr. Drew and your opportunist, which is, by the way, the other thing I saw, there was no one there. I guarantee you could have plucked anyone out and said, hey, what's going, why are you doing this? They couldn't even told you what was going on. They were there, and we watched them on cell phones. Hey, we're over here now. They were on different little, I don't know if it was Twitter, or where they were, but they're like, we're going here now, and then they would go.

And then we had already known they protected the, or excuse me, they already had announced the one they were going to do in the Valley the next day. And then they went and did that there. So it was a wild terrifying time to be a part of it. We had just gotten to studio that day. That was our first day. That was day one, buddy. Oh, my God.

It was a new studio, too. His studio was new, yeah. Brand new. We grabbed as much of the stuff as we could and then just left, yeah. Oh, my God. Who was, there were some young people with you, weren't there in the store? Yeah, we had any, any, remember any from YMH was working with me too, and they all came over to help right away, and I was like, guys, we are getting robbed,

and they all came and helped, and then, you know, Tom and the YMH crew afterward gave us some equipment to help us get back up going and stuff. But yeah, it was quite a wild time. That's the thing. Those are the two things that stuck out to me the last time we discussed this was the fact that they were threatening lethal force and that none of them had any political agenda

they just wanted to loot. They just wanted to take advantage of this. That's all those people were. That group, again, I am talking about the group that went from the beach and all the way down. And again, you know, L.A., we didn't think they were going to Ross Lincoln, that's eight blocks. They went, I mean, out of the numbers. They went into West

L.A. all the way up that street and just wrecked the car dealerships. They're just over there, smashing windows. You know what I mean? Like, just, I saw a guy walking with Jack Daniels. I'm like, that's what you stole. Jack Daniels? Like, that's what you stole. And we're all losing our businesses and watching the police. And also, I don't know if you've ever been in an area where four helicopters are circling for six hours super low. That sounds. starts to wear on you for a while, too. You know, it's, it was men. Were there a lot of,

were these a lot of homeless people that were just, no, it's gay. You said, there's sort of gangs in there, too. This is trying to be a BLM thing, right? I can't even say I saw the gangs. I saw what looked like regular high school, early college kids, regular people

of all races who had cars, who had money. These weren't, these weren't those opportunities. These were a bunch of punks. They were just a bunch of male, female, of all races, but if you had to generalize, it was a youth group. And am I right that you have the honeydew right now? You have an interview with Brian Novak? Brandon Novak.

I said, what did I say? Brian. Brandon, yes, Brandon. Yeah, Brandon. I know Brandon was. He's got one of the great recovery stories. Yeah, he's up right now, actually. We just had him in and we're both Maryland guys. And, you know, it's so funny that we've been just missing each other by this much forever. So it was nice to finally sit down with him and his story is great. It's a pretty wild story.

It's, and, you know, he is an example of you're not ready until you're ready as much as anything else. He had to really go down. That stuff he told me, man. Yeah, he went down. You got to watch, you got to listen to the Honeydue podcast because Brandon is a great interview and he's really colorful. And he has a book too, doesn't he about his experiences? I can't have the name of the book. He's got a few of them.

He gave me here. I can't remember either. But he's, yeah, he's published. He's got quite a few pieces out that you should read. His stories are great. He's going to come back through our other podcast, the way back. We could catch up with him there too. But what a great story.

And the episode's doing really well. well Ryan as always I can talk to you all day but I've got other guests I've got to run to have a great Thanksgiving it's always good to see you're welcome back here anytime everyone go watch go to just YouTube and Patreon for the usual live and alive just YouTube check it out everybody thank you Ryan and also listen to the if you're not subscriber at the Honeydue podcast you should do so right now highlighting the low lights thank you Dr. Drew all right back good talk to you Happy Thanksgiving. Indeed. All right. We're going to switch gears and talk about Epstein. I know that Lisa has to leave

in about 15 or so minutes and I want to give her a chance to tell her story. Anushka will stay with me a little bit longer. Anushka to Georgia, you know her. She was previously on the show. If you watched the opening a little segment, that was she, I was interviewing there.

She was groomed by Gislane. She was abused by these two people. She has a story and she has spoken out about it and she has suffered the consequences. Lisa will tell her personal story as well. She was another one of the survivors who has spoken. And there's Anushka. So is Lisa with us too, Anushka?

Oh, I don't hear her. There we are. I don't hear Anushka. Anishka, you must be muted on Zoom. While she is figuring that. Okay, good. So, and now, Anushka, how are you? Did you and Lisa learn

about each other as a result of testifying or speaking up publicly? So I met Lisa for the first time when we went and stood outside Capitol Hill and when we had our private meeting with Congress and I'd heard about her obviously from, you know, and seen clips of her and really very much wanted to meet her. And now that I have, we're connected. And so we're even more so working together toward the same goal of transparency of not only in the short term for this particular situation, but also in the long term, helping to change laws around how this type of grooming and this type of abuse is handled by the legal system.

So Lisa, I'm going to give you a chance to tell your story because I know you have to go in a few minutes and talk to us, not just about your story, but what you would like to see changed. Well, in 2019, is when I started speaking out. It's because I heard Virginia Joufrey talk about her abuse with certain powerful people and I was brought to the island in early 2000 by another young girl. We were both on a photo shoot and what I saw on the island and what happened to me when Virginia spoke out, I had to remember that, no, that looks like the girl that I saw on the island. And the person that she was referring to was the person I met on the island. So it really wasn't about me speaking out to tell my story. Originally, I got to that a couple of years later,

but originally it was just to support survivors. And that has always been my mission, is just to really not only support, but to educate the public. I felt, I always, and I still to this day, feel like there is a huge education, not just an empowering of survivors, but the education of the people to understand how we even got to this point. How is someone so eloquent and beautiful like Anushka, you know, brought into this web. Why were there underage girls that were brought in from Glein? And, you know, why were there so many models and ambitious young women in New York?

Hundreds of them brought into this orbit. And I always looked at it from that point of view. Well, I've just got to own, I've got to own what happened to me. I've got to be honest and truthful, no matter how much people victim shame or blame me. it's just what happened to me in my early 20s and I just wanted to always just speak up and speak out

and going to Capitol Hill is scary, it's scary. I figured a lot of different things were going to happen, but I just always wanted to speak to the survivors out there of not only Jeffrey Epstein and his co-conspirators, the sex trafficking ring, other victims

of sex. sexual assault from serial predators out there like Weinstein's and Cosbys and Nassars and all the rest of them. And then also just so many of our people in the United States, man and woman, boy and girl, that suffer from abuse. And, you know, I had a podcast. I had a podcast that sat down with survivors. And that's where I really learned of how deep and dark it really goes. So I just felt like I had to do this. And tell us about the podcast. Well, I'm the host of From Now On, and I've been in the modeling industry since I was 16.

And about a year and a half ago, I was like, enough is enough. I keep seeing all these models come to the office that are like, we say, you know, what happened to me with this photographer or this client, or I went for an audition at a movie, and then, you know, just this power dynamic that was still happening. Okay, it's not as bad as it was in the Epstein era, but it's still there. and in a lot of ways the sex trafficking part of it is getting worse and I started just seeing this

this trend still happening and new ways of abuse and so I was just like screw it I've got to do something I'm so sick of being in this business that just is enabling this kind of abuse to happen so I was like well I want to get back

in some way and all the other survivors that I met in 2019, 2020 and now this is 2024 last year and they're just like you gotta do it Lisa you you have to be the one to speak out and do this I'm like no way am I doing this but one day I was just like you know what no one else is doing this I have to step up and do it so I just immediately did it so quickly so I didn't change my mind and I just started this podcast got a studio and just lined up everyone and then started interviewing survivors of just a whole arc of healing journey we talk about healing

mechanisms like EMDR. It's my favorite to your guest before. I was just praising what he said because that is what changed my life and gave me the power to do this, really was EMDR. And so I would have these survivors on and they would tell their whole arc in their healing journeys and a lot of them became therapists or authors or, you know, changing legislature and all these exciting things were happening. And I just sat there and listened to them and provided a safe space for them to tell their stories. So your Instagram is I am Lisa Phillips. The podcast from now on is available at usual places, I imagine.

Do you have an X also? Not so big on X. TikTok, YouTube, and Instagram. Okay. And so I'm going to talk to Anushka more about her tale of grooming and how it just hers is such a classic tale. And is yours equally sort of similar or is it just, you took an opportunity and all of a sudden oh my god here i am but you know i can imagine people

could fall into some of these things in a more digital way let's say well the only opportunity i took was just go to an island of a of a girl who said that's what i'm saying that's what i'm saying you think nothing i'm doing oh i'm going on a trip big deal and then all of a sudden oh crap now what is it was that kind of thing it was exactly that kind of thing it was just you know had a free day on the island and And the boat came for us, and I just spent the day thinking this was going to be just another day of just hanging out with friends. Yeah. Yeah. And the M.

So from the standpoint of education, go ahead, finish your thought. I'm sorry. No, I was just going to say that the M.O. that Epstein used was the same for Anushka for myself and for everyone, 14 to 24, that was involved. It was the same M.O. So from the standpoint of education, is there something we can educate men and women about? So they, maybe two steps earlier, they could sort of see signs of trouble. Is there anything like that that you've learned through your podcast?

Well, honestly, when you're up against a serial predator, they're just, they're just quicker and they're smarter. They're two steps ahead of you. And they're preying on the vulnerable part of you. I just don't feel like in that situation, I would have gotten out of it. Yeah, interesting. And I'm, that's not, you know, I'm not that surprised by that response. And there's a new sort of flavor on the scene I've noticed lately, which is sort of the cult of two, that people get sucked into these relationships where there's a power imbalance. It's just sort of a classic abusive relationship, right?

Kind of a domestic violence. But some of this has a flavor of trafficking too, right? Oh, it's a big flavor of trafficking. That was the whole system. But, you know, as you said, Jeffrey used the galane, he used a woman, many women, to bring in other young girls. And unfortunately, he used the underage girls to bring in other underage girls. He bring, I mean, I was brought by a young woman, you know? It's just like, that was the way that he operated.

Of course, he can't be this older man saying, come over to my house and give him a massage. And everyone's going to be like, yeah, I'll go. No, it was other women who brought you in. and did you observe anything that you can share with us that people are so hungry for information it seems like is there anything you can share or you would rather not no i mean i mean to share what what happened to me well jeffrey abused by the so so so caleb's headline on this was galane offered me to trump but this is how he responded it says epstein survivors with lisa phillips and a news guy i don't know which one that happened to, but I don't know why I wrote it, but it was Anushka.

That's Anushka. Yeah, she's going to talk after the break. Yeah. Yeah, so I'm, I'm just curious, like, we're hearing a lot of things in headlines from people saying, yes, he was this, he was that. I don't know what to believe anymore. Yes, no. I mean, you guys are the only ones that can really confirm. I mean, what do you mean, you don't know what to believe anymore? I don't know. Susan, Susan, first of all, wait, Susan, first of all, you need to introduce yourself to Lisa. Oh, hi, I'm Mrs. Pinsky. No, I mean, I'm just following Instagram and X and everything that's coming out. And what is, you know, what's real and what isn't in social media.

And you guys are the only ones who can really tell us the truth, actually. You know, if you had an encounter with him or what he did say or what he didn't say. Who are you talking about? The president of the United States. Oh, you're talking with the president. Okay, well, Anushka can speak more to that. I didn't have any experience with him. And is there any, again, I don't, I feel weird asking these questions,

but I know these are on people's mind. Is any other surprises do you have for us? I guess I'd ask it that way. Well, you have to always understand that a predator is always going to prey on what it is that you need the most. he's going to ask those questions just to know do you have a father who's in your life what was your family life like you know what are your dreams or aspirations depending on you know if you're 14 or you're entering the career world at 22 you're they pray on what you need so they always like I said use another woman to bring you in but also they pray on what

is it that you want in life and they act like yeah yeah that would seem like that was Galane's role, and I'd heard Epstein use a similar thing for praying on the vulnerable. But it is what you're saying, that all the men that were there used a similar thing, you know, being the nice guy, you know, and then just knew what they were doing ultimately. It makes you want to vomit when you hear it, right? It's really gives you the chills. It's really wild. Yeah, they know what they're doing.

But the reason why I speak out is really to educate the public of, you know, I don't know what to believe well you know what the survivors are there to tell you like what happened to us each one of us has a different story but it's basically the same story of when you meet him and how he pulls you into these creepy massages and gets you to trust him and look up to him help you and then all the sudden bam i'm going to abuse you now you know and you can't get away you know so um a lot of people can victim blame you and say well you should have known better and you should have ran away and you should have done this, you should do that. Well, you know, I was kind of like a young kid who was just trying to figure out the world by myself as well. You know, it's like I'm not, like, I'm in my

40s now. I didn't think the same way as I did as, you know, as a young person who I graduated high school in Belgium. The other girl that I met, you know, was from Poland. My other friend that, you know, just recently spoke out was from Canada. You know, it's, we're not like smart of America. I mean, he was super smart at, you know, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22. I wasn't. understand that when a man comes up to you and talks to you, you just think he's a normal nice man. You don't think of what he's going to do to bring you into his orbit and you out to his, you know, wealthy friends. You don't think like that. And Caleb, you're asking a question about age, whether or not the 14-year-olds were treated

differently a 21-year-old. They all got the same manipulation, I guarantee it. I'm sure they, yeah, I'm sure it was all the same treatment. But did you notice any sort of differences in the way that people who were younger were treated as opposed to you who were in your 20s like did were they even less careful to keep things secret where they were they even worse like what were they more yeah because we hear mostly about the underage people but it's very rare that we hear about someone who was over 18 that was that got pulled into this by them yeah and i don't like that to be honest with you the press really focused on you know 14 and 50 year old like as they should and the PSA that went out only focused on i was

14 and I was 15. But the majority of Epstein survivors were in their 20s. They were between 19 and 25 years old, the majority. It's just those women don't speak out because of that reason, because you think, oh, gosh, you were old enough to understand it. You know, it's not, underage, you can't consent, right? But overage, you can't consent. You could have ran away. Like, you did it for your career. There's all these things they throughout you, but it's not really the same when someone's grooming you and manipulating you. And they can use that over your head. Like Jeffrey Epstein introduced me to the owner of a form modeling agency. Once I was in with the agency, once he introduced people to a university and you're in for four years, like you're stuck doing what he expected to do. And you don't expect him to abuse you. You really don't. That's where I was going with the question is that I feel like there's actually probably a

much, much longer list of people that don't want to say anything because they're kind of afraid of that fact that people are going to say, well, we're over 18, you were able to choose when it's just as controlled. Well, they get re-victimized. I think the approach, at least I know I've got to let you go here. You've got to leave at 22 and I'm going to let you do that. But I think the important, this idea of blaming people for describing their experience is just bizarre to me. You should be learning from these experiences so you too don't.

end up in a similar situation because these are not unique. You see how it happens over and over again at the hands of these perpetrators. And so to say Lisa was not 14, it just makes no sense to me. Learn everybody. And also doesn't make any sense either because, right, I just want to say really quickly, it's like you pray on someone 18 to 25 on their career because they're getting their career started. That's of course what you're going to pray on. If I'm sitting at home eating potato chips all day long and don't have any ambition what are you going to pray on well well you could you could kind of go after your worth and things like that and they did that too i'm sure because anushka talks about how special they made her feel and you're the best you're this or that and that's again this love

bombing is all part of the part of the the grooming and so so listen that's also watch the go what oh sorry that's also what i was wondering because you had said earlier that specifically that you're not very active on X at all. And I wonder if you've noticed a pattern of these strange accounts that seem to be against the survivors of Epstein that come out and attack people constantly. Do you notice, do they even seem like they're real people? Or does it seem like it's automated activity from some other group that's pushing this? Because I just can't fathom it in my head attacking someone who's just telling the story of what happened in their lives. Well, you could hire companies that you could, yeah, go on and like infiltrate.

your account and just do whatever, say whatever, just to discredit you. That's a very real thing out there. And I see it all the time with the bots. Right. That may be that may be the Caleb, the guilty parties, you know, doing some preventative, you know, sort of. That's what I'm trying to figure out is who's motivated to do other than the guilty parties, but who's motivated to actually spend time attacking you online for one thing, but then who's motivated enough to organize it other than the perpetrators who obviously, they aren't winning that battle at all, like they're wasting their money. All right. Well, they have endless funds, don't they?

Yeah, I was going to say. That I think is the issue. They just want to make a few people down. Follow the money, as they say. Lisa, appreciate you being here. I'm Lisa Phillips on Instagram. The podcast, let's Caleb throw that up there if you don't mind there so people can get another glimpse of what she is doing where you can learn more about how this happens, who it happens to, the range of behaviors that go into it. From now on is the podcast, from now on, with Lisa Phillips. Check that out. And Lisa, we appreciate your being here and sharing your story. Thanks so much for having me. All right. So Anushka, let's bring Anushka up just for a second.

Anushka, I've got to go to a break, but then I want you and I to get into more detail about all of this. Before we go to break, though, tell them about the Kinsugi organization for women in recovery. Yeah, so actually the Kansugi Foundation is something that I did have before. but now I've shifted my focus to my own podcast, which is the Empowered Exchange podcast. It's on YouTube. I also put clips on my Instagram, but shifting focus more to empowering women

and to get the message out to more survivors and to reach more survivors and potentially existing victims to help them learn about not feeling alone and learn techniques to try and get themselves out of bad situations or not actually end up in them in the future. first place. There it is. All right, take a little break, be back with Anushka and then chef gruel coming at the later in the hour. Talk to you then. I'm excited to bring you a new product, a new supplement, fatty. I take it, I make Susan take, take my whole family takes it.

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So you're saving a lot of money this week. All right, let's bring Anushka in. Anushka, I appreciate you being back with us. And we have heard the tale of grooming and love bombing and all the special, special talk that they gave you. It just made perfect sense how they were able to pull you into their web. Susan, you had a question about the headline about Galane and how she offered people up. Yeah, well, we had Anushka on our show before, and Caleb's memory is 10 times better than mine. So, but we have the headline that, you know, Galane offered me to Trump, but this is how he responded.

And, you know, I, we just want you to tell us what that was. Sure, yes. Thank you, Dr. Drew. Thank you, Susan, for having me on the show. You know, back at this time, this was, you know, I was 20 years old and I'd already been in the, in the clasps of Gillen Maxwell. and Jeffrey Epstein for almost four years at that time. So I was already completely trapped and completely indoctrinated and forced to be submissive through fear,

mainly through fear, honestly, through threats to physical safety and just creating a whole environment where every single person around Epstein and Maxwell was complicit in this situation and going along with it, right? So when Gillen Maxwell told me that she was going to introduce me to Donald Trump, then just Donald Trump, you know, he was a very well-known businessman. She talked about how close they were, he was one of her closest friends.

And when I went to meet him at a party in New York City, you know, it was very clear. that they were very close, and actually, I don't think, Epstein was not with us, it was just myself and Gillen Maxwell. And there was very much a sort of, the grooming process was even happening sort of in the car on the way, you should wear this, you should be like this, I would very much like you to impress this person, and I think he'll really like you. And, you know, the truth of the matter, which is something that I think it's very important to correct, is that that clearly the intention from Ghidan Maxwell was to present me to Trump with the hope that he would like me, that he would like me possibly in the way that Epstein liked me, and that

possibly that would be a good fit. That being said, as I've corrected the narrative in the past, there was no impropriety on the part of President Trump at that time. That's by no way to negate any of the experiences that other women or girls claim to have had, you know? Yeah. Did you think Elaine was trying to extract? A lot of this quid pro quo stuff, it seems like, they sort of lived in that world. Do you think she was trying to extract something from Trump? I mean, it's really hard to tell.

You know, now we all have the benefit of hindsight, and we're all looking back on this situation trying to figure out what was going on at the time. For me, this was a situation I'd been trapped in already for several years. And it was more a moment-to-moment survival type thing. And I had already started in the first year of the abuse, I'd started to disassociate as a coping mechanism. I'd also started to be a heavy drinker and moving towards alcoholism an addiction. So honestly, you know, I don't know what the situation was exactly. So, so you're, you know, I'm just curious what the experience was like that you were in. Was it just leaning into the addiction as a survival way of, of me, or were you also convincing

yourself this was okay in some way? See, it's odd how we, you know, addiction does that too, right? addiction will convince you this is all good, right? And, you know, everything's fun and whatever it might be. Well, I definitely think that the addiction and the alcoholism was my coping mechanism. It was a way that I could disassociate with help of substances. And, you know, what was happening to me was in no way natural or healthy feeling. It wasn't something that I was like, ooh, like, It's kind of borderline.

Is this something actually I am enjoying? No, it's not something I'm enjoying. Yeah. And so you're in the therapeutic world and have been for a while. Let's talk about, kind of let's get into the weeds a bit on, you know, what is it unique about the women's experience in the West, really? I mean, that's what you're talking about, you know, you meant Lisa, I think, mentioned women from all over Western Europe and things.

where I don't even know how to frame this conversation where they get taken advantage of even in their romantic relationship with a single person it can quickly go into a cycle of domestic violence right and is there some and women seem so unhappy today that's the other thing I'm noticing in fact there is actually documentation it's called the paradox of female unhappiness and the more freedom the more

to professional success, the less happy right now. Now, I don't know if they're correlated or it just happens to be temporarily related that this is happening at the same time. What do you encounter? How do you, how do you, how do you, we understand what's happening to women and then how do we help them? So I think what I see with the women that come across my, you know, my path and who I try to be helpful to with my own experience is that often there are qualifying factors

with people who are abused, whether in childhood or in, you know, in their adult life, you see things that start, parts of their childhood, where they were in some way diminished, where they were in some way their opinion wasn't important, how they felt wasn't important. And if you look back at... So I'm going to stop you. I want to stop you. I completely agree, a thousand percent. And there's actually no disputing that what you're reporting. But is there something about...

the deficiencies in my generation's personalities that, you know, were we, I mean, were we traumatized? Was it World War II? I mean, why did we get into this situation? Our children always been parented like this, but it feels like our parenting has failed in some substantial way. Who's parenting? People, people of your generation? I don't know if it's mine or the one before or whether it was war or what you know what cultural social anthropological phenomenon has you you're observing something that I observed too which is that kids are they're either to have devouring parents or unavailable parents or abusive parents they don't have parents that are just good enough it seems like that's not very available too much today and I'm constantly

wondering why that is well I think um you know when we look back in history a hundred years ago, there wasn't access to the kind of travel. And so we lived in smaller communities. And within smaller communities, really, it was more possible for people to keep eyes on their children. As we introduced more media, as we introduced more travel, you're getting lots of young adults and sometimes even children who are living far away from their parents. And also we have many parents with both with jobs. You know, we've lost the family system. We've lost the community.

And so with that, you also lose the sort of ability to have accountability within your own parenting unit. And I think a lot of parents that are doing the best they can, you know, yes, I think the war, the thing. And I think also you see people, parents who've had a lot of struggle, then go on and want to give their children opportunities they didn't have, and there's an overcompensation in that. So sometimes they're offering their children a suspended reality and offering that, and that's confusing for them. And it actually lessens their ability to overcome challenge, to move through diversity, to make good judgments. And I think that's a factor too. And then how do we help? Women seem to be suffering especially.

And so what do we do? I mean, Lisa is trying to educate them about the circumstances of grooming and abuse. And you're trying to help them with addiction and surviving trauma. Is there a unifying theme here with all this? I think there are so many places that need to change. And I think it's hard to know where to start because we really have to address them all. Yes. I think, you know, I said this before on your show before, but one of the biggest thing for parents is keep your children off the internet. Do not, not for multiple reasons. Number one, because it, as you know, Dr. Drew, it starts to feed into conditioning their brain to be addictive, to develop the mechanism of wanting different, wanting more all the time. Also, of course, if you are a predator, one of the best places you're, can go to access children is on the internet because children naturally want to feel as though

they're more grown up. They want to feel as if they're, you know, they're talking to older people and they start, as you start going into pre-pubacence and also puberty, children want to feel that they're special and they want to feel that they have secrets with people. And that's the best place for predators to access your children. So I think that's number one. But I think Sure. Yeah. Right, Susan? And you know, I heard, okay, so I was listening to some newsflash,

and they said that bots are doing that now. I love you, and I'm the, I will always be here for you. Oh, I know. And they're like the help. Chat GPT does it. Right? Yeah. Like that South Park thing.

Yeah. You know, they reaffirm, you're a great person, and you're so wonderful. And, you know, and that's, if the bots are getting them, then, you know, some predator is definitely going to get them. Yeah. Absolutely. And, you know, one of the things that I'll see that I've seen through all the different survivors of the Epstein case is, is this sort of sense that on some level there was a vulnerability. And really, every single family system is flawed, right? So we can't do a perfect job. Yeah, there's no perfect family. No, nobody. But as Lisa spoke to, really, if you're a predator, if you're well practiced at this, if this is your goal, you know, it's like you can't be ready to be mugged, right? Because you don't know it's coming.

Yeah. You know, there's another thing that occurs to me that not all predators know their predators. You know what I mean? They think they're being a nice guy. They think they would. I'm just trying to make a romantic attachment. They don't, really, they don't understand because they're narcissists usually and they're self very injured also. They don't understand their being predatory on another human being. I think there's a side to this too. I'm talking an awful lot about what do we do to help women. I think we've got to educate men about where that line is. I don't think most men understand that. I absolutely agree. But I also think, you know, there's, and as you point out, one of the things specific to narcissists or sociopathic narcissists is not just the fact that they don't know, but they don't want to know, because they're not interested in somebody else's experience.

Yeah, then we got big trouble. We got a lot of trouble when somebody's like that. You know, yes, we want to try and help people not to become potential narcissists, potential perpetrators. And that's all in the childhood, right? Because what's crazy is the same kind of experience that could create a potential victim also creates a potential perpetrator. That's exactly right. I used to say it this way, that the child whom our hearts going out for and we're crying for today, has about a 40 to 60% chance of being a perpetrator.

People debate about what the risk is. What are you seeing on the addictive front, any trends that you're noticing in terms of behavioral addiction, substance addiction, things that are sort of on the rise so people know what to look out for that way? I think, you know, we're still in a major fentanyl crisis and that is ongoing. And of course.

And meth, and meth, absolutely. And, you know, what I see is, of course, fentanyl is something that will kill you and it'll kill you, you know, fast. And the thing with meth is many people can live a long time as sort of shells of humans with really no life, but it's harder to die from that. So I am being, but what I see in every single addict is a theme of trauma that goes through coming before. You know, I'm one of those people who believes in, you know, it's always trauma it's always trauma well you know what it is and i will tell you it very the way i used to frame it is at very minimum what i can share is that if you need to see me there's a hundred

percent probability of trauma so that's for whatever reason i see trauma so and so there's big tea and little tea and all kinds of stuff um there's a comment on there i want to address on our restream uh why are you smiling it's not funny the reason you should report it to the law enforcement is so they don't do it to others. I don't quite care what that question is. However, I will say that somebody accused me of laughing when I was talking to Lisa, and you've got to understand something. These are unpleasant topics.

And what I was laughing about when I was talking to Lisa was, oh, my God, I almost threw up. I literally almost threw. I was laughing at myself because the topic made me so sick, I almost threw up. So please, don't superimpose your bullshit under the fact that this is an uncomfortable thing. I'm laughing now, not because I think any of this is funny. Try being the host. What's that, Susan? Try being the host.

Or being the guest, you know, I'm just saying. And by the way, we're all trying to just be. And if you haven't been a victim, then try not to step into the position of being judgmental because that's the last thing that's helpful. Right, exactly. The reason that people don't come forward who have been perpetrated upon, the number one reason is they won't be believed and they will be judged. And here we are. And let's even refine

that a little further, which is if you've been traumatized, you're very prone to shame and that shame gets triggered and that is the most unpleasant of situations for people who've been through stuff like this. All right, I need to this is, I could just talk about this

stuff endlessly. I know. So with the whole proceedings and the Epstein files coming out Anushka, since we've spoken to you the last time, what is like finally coming out that you're glad about like what is something that sort of are we going to and is enough coming out that's the other part of that so listen I think you know I've got my opinions okay and I'll share my opinion with you but let's be clear that that's what it is when we spoke on Capitol Hill myself Lisa and

you know quite a few other survivors of Gillen Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein we were first of all we didn't realize what big waves would come next we wouldn't we didn't realize what was going on we were kind of invited and we wanted to initiate this stand that we wanted to take to claim our power in saying we the victims want these these files released only with our names redacted only with the names of the victims redacted so what's happened subsequently is we we saw this pushback where, you know, both the president and many Republicans were fighting the release of these files, which of course caused huge question marks around why that was happening. And, you know, I didn't go to Capitol Hill again this past time because it was

too difficult for me to be there. And then, of course, we saw that the vote got pushed through the discharge petition got pushed through and voted on. And then the Senate actually voted the same day and it got pushed through. But now I think the big question is, you know, is everything going to come out? And my opinion is everything is not going to come out because if it was this easy, it would have happened before. If it was this easy, if it could have just been, okay, now we're ready to hear everything, then that would have been allowed to happen before. And I do feel as though the people who are being protected and whether that's, you know, President Trump or whether that's other people who perhaps also are being protected and, you know, covered for, I don't think they're going to let everything come out. Is there, is there ever a world where the victims get to name names?

If that makes sense? That's something that comes up. Right. It comes up time and time again, and I get asked this hundreds of times a day. The reason the victims can't name names is because all the names of the perpetrators are powerful people. They're very wealthy people. As soon as you say somebody's name publicly, outside of the legal system, you will be sued by those people. We're talking about perpetrators who acted and perpetrated on victims many, many years ago. If there is a case to be built, it will affect the case in a detrimental way if the victims come out and just start throwing the information out there because suddenly you'll have a defamation suit. And these people are wealthy enough to bury us in legal tape.

It just feels like there should be somebody that could organize the group in such a way that they could threaten to name names or something in such a way that they could be. I don't know. It feels like there's something that the victims could do collectively, not individually, certainly, but collectively or get a benefactor, you know, a Peter Thiel or somebody to sort of go, hey, I've had enough of this. I'm going to, I'm going to support you and I'm going to fund your defense or something. If Peter Thiel or anyone else would like to come forward, then, you know, we're all pretty easy to reach. We all have attorneys. We all have social media pretty much. And definitely if we want to look at that strategy, but it has been, you know, we all want the same goal that everybody else wants, but we need to be protected first. You know, I have a person in my own mind right now who I know is somebody who would bury, very anyone who had any information in, you know, in legal bills, you know, in perpetuity. I mean, I've been reading Virginia Jufre's book. nobody's girl and I've actually started reading it on TikTok and I'm reading it in real

time so as I read it I kind of give my own reactions and she explains in her book lots of different situations and the reasons why we can't just come out and say people's names you know it's we'd have to have a whole different legal system for that right and I think that's needed for you guys. But Caleb, of course, takes this to a little paranoid place. So go ahead, Caleb. Yes. I'm sure.

I'm sure you are there already have this set up or you cannot confirm or deny it, but I would highly suggest that you make sure you have a dead man switch set up with all of the names, everything you know, ready to automatically send out. If you don't check in with this account every, you know,

three to seven weeks. And so that if anyone tries to do something to you, then they know the names are going to be out there. You have nothing to fear if they do anything. It gets released. It gets released. Yeah. And I don't think that's paranoid. I don't think that's paranoid either. No. I think that's self-protection. I don't. I'm sorry. I didn't. Caleb goes to the extreme and I thought he was going to, I thought he meant something different. So yes, that seems like a very sensible thing, actually. Well, I mean, and I do have that. I mean, my lawyer, Brad Edwards and Brittany Henderson

of the crime victim law firm, they have all the information. And, of course I have that set up. And the reason I say it's not paranoid is, you know, I have received hundreds of threats. And we, you know, we see Marjorie Taylor Green who stepped in and, you know, very bravely, frankly, stood up for us. And despite being kind of a Republican and being somebody who hasn't always had views that align with many of mine, I saw her step up. And, of course, then she started to get threatened. And now she's been forced to step down. And, you know, welcome to the life of publicly going against wealthy predators.

Yeah. Well, I have one more thing. You know, when they show, like, everybody that flew on the plane, the Epstein plane, I would like to believe that there were parties there and not all these people were involved with knowing that there was trafficking going on or weren't like privy to this information and that, you know, because I can't, you know, there was a lot of, you're saying there are people that were in a, that were just, uh, they're on the plane, but they didn't know, you know, these women were beautiful, maybe the older ones or whatever, but. Useful idiots. Wasn't going like,

how old are you should, can you show me your driver's license or, but you know, just were, you know, like did Charlie Sheen do this? Like, I know he was on the plane. We didn't have a chance to ask him, but some of these celebrities, I'm just thinking they weren't really involved in the massage area or getting... And Susan, you brought up another interesting point, too. Other people have their own planes. They went there, not everyone that went to the other than went on Epstein's plane, I assume, right? They got there on their own. Took their own plane. But, but I, I don't, what else went on there like, were there big parties that he threw that weren't necessarily all, you know, orgies or whatever? Or were there people attending who were just at the party kind of thing?

So I think I'm going to only speak to my experience and of course my experience was in the early 90s and went on for over 10 years but I think the the system that Gillan and Jeffrey set up

had an evolution. So I can't speak to what happened in maybe some of the later years but I will say that you know if you went to one of these parties once I think you could get a pass right that you went there and you didn't know.

All of the houses that I visited, there was no question because there were young naked women and naked girls all over the walls, you know, every single wall. So if you went there and you saw that and you went back, I feel like it's fair to say there's some ambiguity at the very least about whether or not you knew what was happening and whether or not you wanted to be involved in that. and you know is there a story in here

this is not a justification but a way of understanding what happened around addiction per se sex addiction in particular sorry I'm not understanding the question was you were describing all these pictures over the wall and everything's so excessive and so bizarre

that I started thinking is part of what was going and with Diddy the same question too is this story of just progressive sex addiction to the point of criminality, like many addictions take people. I mean, I think, I think understanding something doesn't mean that you approve of it, right? I think it's helpful that you understand it. And I'm clear on what you're saying.

I'm totally clear on what you're saying, Dr. True. I think, I think, yes, I think it's sex addiction, narcissism, and sociopathy run wild, right? And if you add money and power to all of this, then I don't think Jeffrey Epstein, ever thought he would be stopped, ever thought he would be caught. I don't think Gillen Maxwell ever thought she would be stopped or be caught. And I think many of these powerful men who are still out there who know what they've done, they don't think they're going to be caught either. But if you want to look at what's going to happen tomorrow, look at what happened yesterday.

So if I were there, I would, maybe they should have their own get-out plan too, because we just don't know what's coming. Anushka, I appreciate you being here. I appreciate you speaking on behalf of the. victims and I appreciate the work you're doing with addiction. We should just do some of these days just a straight addiction show but we'll see if we can

both of us have busy schedules but thank you and the pod tell us about that again, your podcast? The podcast, you can find it on YouTube under my name, Anushka de Georgia, it's my channel. The podcast is called the Empowered Exchange. We've got guests like Gabor Matte, Dr. Gabor Matte,

Nile Rogers, a bunch of amazing people and survivors. You can also follow me on TikTok. And on TikTok, I'm reading Virginia Dufre's book in real time and giving you my reactions. So I'm also on Instagram, Anushka DeGeorgio. So I'd love to continue to interact with the captive audience around this because this is such an important topic and I'm so grateful to be here today talking about. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. We'll see you soon. Thanks Caleb too. You know why I asked that question, right, Drew?

Which one? About like people on, like Oprah Winfrey was on the list. Do you think if she showed up and saw a bunch of naked women, she wouldn't react to it? Like there's, they must have. She wouldn't have a bad feeling about it. She was raped. She knew. Yeah, she would not go back.

No, I understand. But I don't think Oprah Winfrey, from what I can see, would show up, see an island like this and not report it. Like that just doesn't seem like that. Oh, that's an interesting question. The real question is, why didn't any of the useful idiots, so to speak, the part. party goers. But same thing with the Diddy parties, right? Why didn't anybody... They must not have always been very apparent. Like, you know, because we can't go, oh, all these people that were on the plane knew what was going on. It just doesn't seem like, I don't know. I don't see Oprah as hiding something

like that. This is how I, this is how I think of it in my mind is that it was a known fact that for Diddy parties, you don't stay at Diddy Parties after night. Like it was a Hollywood thing. Everyone knew you go during the day to his white parties and you leave. But also, So here's the other point. Here's the other thing, too. They knew it went south. They didn't, they didn't tell anybody. They knew, they knew.

But also, like you've said before on the show, that you have, like, had either patients or clients or someone who have been at Bohemian Grove before. Well, those people that may come to you as a professional, they're not going to spill any of the bad stuff or tell you or expose you to that because they know you would do something about it. So it's this circular group of people that it's the ones that, no, they know, the other ones

Macy, like Epstein was pretty obvious of signs based on his ugly artwork he had on all of his walls. Like it was pretty clear. But at the same time, it's like Drew has interacted with people in these circles but they would never tell it to Drew because they know that Drew would report it. Like it would be

over for them. Well. Yeah, Drew would never get invited. But you know, but Oprah Winfrey would I don't know be somebody that I think would have integrity and go, hey, there's something up with this guy. I would think. I would think.

You know, I don't, I mean, all those people on the list. But you did hear that there were people that eventually got there. You kind of hear people going, hey, guys, weird. I don't want to, you know, let's not let him come to Marilago anymore or whatever. There are things like that going on, but why wasn't there more concern is the question. So anyway, we're going to have to. I mean, we have to leave that. I don't want to leave, like, make everybody a criminal that was on his plane.

No, I understand that. I get that. and there were party goers, useful idiots, and people that may have gone several times before they, who are probably beating themselves up now, that they didn't sort of weren't aware of it was going. They saw something, but they didn't put two and two together. Right.

But again, that's a little bit convenient. Maybe they did report it, and that's what they've really been pushing to keep redacted out of the files, is that, well, you don't want getting out that Oprah Winfrey went and told the FBI because they promised she'd be protected, and it would never affect her. She doesn't want to be a part of the story at all. And so even just even a hint of it, it brings that whole story.

Then it's going to be every headline of Oprah reported this. Maybe she didn't spend $200 million to fix it. Like maybe people did report it, but that's what we, that's what they're trying to redact. But we'll know that soon, hopefully. Hopefully. Let's get chef Andrew Gural in here. We're going to talk a little Thanksgiving turkey. Yummy.

Chef Gruel, welcome. Good to see you, my friend. Great segue, Drew. Also, Huntington Beach Councilman, how's that going? Yeah, it's going really well. Thank you so much for asking. That was an unbelievable interview, by the way. I just got to say, as people don't know, I was in the waiting room watching that.

And so many strong topics. Very interesting, right? I could, we could just go and go and go. There's so many things to talk about there. But let's see what I've got to talk to you about. A, will the Calico Fish House be open on Thanksgiving? No, we will not. I'll tell you, I tried that one year, but not that many people showed up. And it was really just me running around the dining room trying to force feed chicken legs down, you know, people's throats.

Turkey. And tell people about the fish house, because if you don't, I will. All right, Calico Fish House. It's on Pacific Coast Highway and Huntington Beach, Sunset Beach area of Huntington Beach right before you hit Seal Beach. We're a seafood chop house. We work with a lot of local farmers. Actually, we're serving wellness farms meat on our menu, which we'll talk. about, but also all the seafood. We work with our own fishermen. It's a great, you know, it's a seafood chop house to people. They say, what does that mean? I mean, it's just a bunch of a changing menu of local seafood. We've got some really wonderful meats. It's a freestanding building, 80 parking spots. So if you're coming down to the Huntington Beach area, you want to park, enjoy some great food and go walk the beach where the place to be. There's that, but I want to go a little

deeper and say that it's because i don't think people get what a fish chop house is andrew is an expert in sourcing fish and not just great fish but also properly sourced fish and so what you get in calico fish house is the best fish you've ever had made a lot of very interesting ways and it's changing and it's extraordinary and i mean the menu's changing so probably the i would say for sure the best uh lobster rolls you know east of massachusetts It's for sure. And I don't know if those are always on the menu or not, but that's the kind of thing I'm talking about.

The lobster rolls are always on the menu, and you'll appreciate this with, you know, you have a similar drive as me to bring people together and not divide people. There's the Connecticut lobster roll, which is traditionally dumb, hot, butter, pure lobster. And you have the main lobster roll, which is cold with mayo. We combine and create Arcalico lobster roll, which is hot with a dash of mayo, a little bit of butter, and a squeeze of lemon. So we're bringing people together here through the lobster role. That's right. Combining states that normally don't get along.

So very interesting. And then let's talk a little bit about TWC and wellness farms. Let's get into that. And then we're going to talk Turkey. Well, you and I have talked at length in the past about the supply chain and how it's so difficult to get really high quality seafood and meats, mainly because we've either been over-regulated to the, degree that the supply chain has become bloated. And what I mean by that is that you only have

a couple food manufacturers or processors at the top that are controlling the entire industry. So the independent, small ranchers and farmers, and in many cases, fishermen have to really sell their product into this behemoth that is known as this master. Or you're actually, they bypassed, they bypass everybody stateside and you're buying yourself from another country as opposed of what's off your shore. Of course, of course, and that's part of it, right? The good local stuff just gets churned into the mix of international products, and then there's really no specialty element to it,

especially when they're putting forth all of this work. And when they get commodity prices, then they're really just, you know, a farmhand at that point. But there's so many amazing ranchers and farmers out there, including and fishermen as well. So what the wellness farms did was they say, you know what? We're going to go find those people that are producing these great products. And we're going to create an alternate, almost a parallel supply.

chain or a parallel economy where our existing customer base and beyond can actually start buying some of these high quality products directly from the rancher or the farmer and basically go around that broken supply chain. And that's thus the birth of the wellness farms, which right now is primarily focusing on meat, all different cuts of meat because we own the cattle, right, from head to tail. So these beef boxes, which are focused on, you know, they're medical in the sense that in a way a lot of the cuts are also providing these other benefits to your health and the way in which they've been packaged and communicated. But also, when you're eating this incredibly high-quality

meat that's much higher in the B vitamins, omega-3 fatty acids, grass raisin, grass-finished, it's going to provide a stronger nutritional profile for you, and it's the right meat to be eating, and you're supporting a farmer who's doing the right thing. So that's really the basis in the DNA behind what we're doing there. And then we're expanding into poultry, We've got some amazing local farmers, so we'll ultimately expand into poultry and then seafood as well. And the proper use of the animal, nose to tail. These are not animals sacrificed to a gigantic system and done carefully, you know, sort of they're not mistreated in any way whatsoever. I think it was in the wellness chat group.

I was reading about Salisbury steak that Dr. Salisbury during the Civil War. Do you see this post? Did somebody put up? People argue is meat good, not good. Salisbury State came from a physician during the Civil War notice that if he gave the troops red meat, beef three times a day, their wounds healed at a vastly greater rate. I also heard, and this was in a separate chat room, that that was a huge push at the time to help with digestive issues. Because people started having digestive issues as we were eating a lot more of these low-quality, mass commercially produced grains, and it was actually the meat that helped with some of the

irritable bowel syndromes. They didn't know that that was the name of it at the time. Oh, interesting. Or God knows what that would have been in terms of the gut microbiome. Susan, you said, you had told me there's some, you have a call to action on the wellness, wellness farms. Oh, so since we all work for the wellness company, I gave Peter a call and said, hey, we need a link to the wellness farms, and we have a special link at's Dr. drew.com slash wellness farms. And on Thursday, you can get a discount

with the code Black Friday. So check it out. If you guys want to check it out, you can get a discount, and it's all gruel stuff, and we just want to be supportive. All right, so highest quality meats, doctor.com, slash wellness.

And then on Thursday, at the checkout, the code is Black Friday. That might even work for the whole wellness company. I'm not sure, but I know for sure it's working for this. Okay. This is the time to stock up on Faddy 15, TWC, Paleoval, all this stuff we sell because this is when they put everything on sale. And the broccoli sprouts.

I love the broccoli sprouts. Those are phenomenal. I got to throw that in there. Okay. Yeah. No, I'm going to order it. I'm going to try it. So I know there's a lot of excitement about this.

project, the Wellness Farms. It's going to continue to expand, I'm sure, across this next year. Is there a plan that you're a part of in 2026? Well, there's various plans. First and foremost, it's been about trying to get this product, right? The entirety of it from everything that the rancher is producing processed and to the consumer. They do not make it easy to do so in the United States. And that's what I talk about with the regulations and how we can fix the supply chain. So we've been able to do that. that. And we're processing it and getting it shipped out in the thousands and thousands of pounds. That's huge right there. So that's really been the first lift. And then as I mentioned,

going into alternate proteins and then also kind of Nutra Foods, medical foods is another element of this. So, you know, having conversations with Peter is unbelievable because he's a visionary, right? So he has all of these amazing ideas and it's exciting. This isn't, you know, these aren't He's an engineer. He thinks differently than you do, thinks differently than I do. He thinks about, you know, these systems that I love how engineers think sometimes. But, well, I'm just curious, what are the sort of roadblocks of just being able to process and send out meats? Why does U.S. make it so difficult? Because they want to consolidate it all through only a few large companies. Just getting your product. If I tomorrow, say I got a bunch of cows in my backyard and I want to process them, I got to find a USDA approved facility. There's never any room. costs hundreds of thousands of dollars to build your own, then you can't get into one. So you're subject to having to sell it to the auctioneers and the mask, the guys producing or processing the big amounts of meat. Now, I should mention, if you're trying to bring in international meat, you actually can

sidestep the USDA system because you only have to bring it from a country which has a system which generally meets the standards that the USDA does. So it's easier to get international meat shipped across state lines than it is. domestically raised beef. Terrible. All right, let's switch gears, talk a little Thanksgiving. What is your turkey tip and what if all goes wrong? Well, it's a great question because if all goes wrong, this is what I always say, buy a roast, a chuck roast, the pot roast, even a pork shoulder, and braze that the day before, right? So just a nice five or six pound roast because in the event something happens with your turkey and you got this beautiful, meltingly tender roast that

you bought for maybe $4 or $5 a pound and brazed it off. And the benefit of that, you can throw that on the table and everyone can break some of that meat up. You know, it's a slam dunk and then you can mix it into all your sides. They say in doing surveys, Americans are more interested in their sides this year than turkey, which frankly, I've always felt that way about turkey. So that's one thing to do. Even if you think you're going to nail the turkey 10 out of 10, you still want to braise that roast because the juices that you get from a braised beef for pork roast, added to your turkey gravy, oh my gosh, it's going to take it to a whole another level because you have all that connective tissue that melts into collagen and creates

all that rich flavor, that umami in there. You can jazz it up with different sauces and spices and fortify your gravy with that brazing liquid. So that's something you've got to do. And you can do that on tomorrow or even on Wednesday, just throw it in a crock pot or in the back of your stove and braze it off. The second piece to this is... Hold on. I think Mrs. Pinsky's doing it already. I said, whoa. I heard you trump. And I have to beg ignorance on something. I don't know what umami is. Umami is actually the fifth flavor profile. So we know salty, sour, sweet, and bitter. The Japanese always knew umami, which is defined by a savory, unctious mouth feel and finish. MSG is really the signature of umami because it's that savory richness you get when you eat Chinese food.

But umami is naturally found in other foods like parmesan and tomatoes and mushrooms and seaweeds. And you can create that savory flavor. You can use MSG. That's the cheat. Some people are allergies to MSG, but you can find natural umami in seafoods, right? So just a dash of Worcestershire sauce. That's why they use anchovy paste in so many dishes.

You're not going to taste the anchovy. You're not going to taste the seafood like in a Worcestershire, but you're going to have that rounded out finish on your palate that's very. memorable. Okay. Interrupted your second point. Well, the second point I was going to make is that with your turkey, you want to really focus on getting it ready for Wednesday because Wednesday is the day in which you pre-salt your bird. It's called a dry brine. Don't put your bird in a liquid. Don't wet brine your bird. There's no reason to do that. No reason to have poultry juices everywhere. If you have a thawed bird, season it all over with salt and throw it into refrigerator uncovered.

That salt's going to work your bird for 24 hours. It's going to go in, it's going to go out, basic osmosis. And in doing so, it's actually breaking some of the proteins down such that when you cook the bird, it's going to retain more moisture. That's why brine-injected chicken meat, which isn't high quality, actually taste juicier so the food manufacturers realize they can sell water to you and also have a juicy bird. The salt alone will fulfill that effect. So you want to dry brine your bird. The second tip I give is that if you can, spatchcock your bird. What that means is that you're going to cut the back bone.

I beg your pardon? I know. I know. I said this on Fox News the other night. I said spatchcock and then I said succulent breast and I realized I'm getting thrown off this show altogether. But the spatchcock is when you cut the backbone out of a bird, a duck, a chicken, squab, or in this case, turkey. and then, right, you flip it over and you press it down so it's flattened. And then you actually roast it on a roasting pan with the bird flattened.

You're going to cut like 50 minutes out of your roasting time. But if you think about the way an oven works, right, the heat comes from the outside in. So your legs, which need to cook to 155 or 160 degrees, are going to cook faster because as the heat hits it versus your breast, which only cooks to 145, 150. So by the time the breast is cooked to 145 or 150, your legs are at 165. just by virtue of the geometry of roasting. So it cooks at the exact same time and you're never going to have overcooked breasts

by the time your likes to cook. Oh, interesting. Very interesting. I do that with my goose. And then Plan B. Oh, you're going to be, the braised meat. This is the braised meat. I guess so focused on the praised meat.

I know praised meat is going into my world here soon because she's going to add that to the gravy. Yeah, but I already spoiled you with filet. So we have to have a big filet roast. then I cook a goose. But I do what you do. I cut the goose in half and I put it down, face down, or, you know, rest up in the pot. It cooks a little different than a turkey.

You don't roast it. You just sort of slow cook it. But, yeah, we always have the backup. But in case the goose comes out tough or something like that. I love turkey a long time. We should have a whole other episode on cooking a goose because I love that you do that. And save the fat, obviously. an amazing fat, the goose fat.

Oh, it makes the gravy so much better, so much better. And then we cook also our lotkas because we do potato lotkas as an appetizer with a little bit of caviar and cream and truffle oil and truffle oil. Wow. I've never seen somebody impressed to Chef Pruel before. You just did something. Oh, no, look, you're smiling. No, you should come over and try it.

It's so good. But it's ethnic. This is a, this is a northern, eastern European thing. Check. I love it. This is like potato. I do miss making turkey, but nobody really wants turkey anymore. So they like the filet.

So what can I say? The Latkas? I love the Lakas. I mean, I did a whole episode on the Lakas because there is an art to cooking the potato lacca. And I think when, you know, Americans became obsessed with the hash browns. And I'm like, you got to focus on the lacca. It's so much better when you really get in there, a little bit of,

onion in there. I like to shred the onion juice actually versus having the chunks and different types of flour to use in there. Crispy on the outside, soft and meltingly tender on the inside. What time should I be there? I like potato flour the best, but

I also put caraway seeds in everything. So the goose is coated in caraway seeds. The sour crowd has caraway seeds. The lodkas have, so it's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot of care away, but that's the check way. Don't you put sauerkraut in your Latka sometimes or something? Is that true? Oh, yeah. I tried it. I mixed the sauerkraut in. I went to Prague on a little trip and we did a

cooking class and they put the sauerkrautka's and it really is, it cuts down the calorie content and it isn't as fattening. But it's so amazing. It's just ridiculous. Thanks, Drew, for reminding me that. I forgot about that. There's a traditional, there's a traditional British or Irish dish called bubble and squeak. And you basically, the Americanized version, you can take some mashed or gently pressed potatoes and you mix in sauteed or slightly brazed cabbage, a lot of vinegar in there. And then you make a potato cake out of it and you pancy or those. So that reminds me of dish, which is wonderful because cabbage is another inexpensive, underappreciated item that just has so much versatility. Maybe it's my Russian heritage that makes me, oh, cabbage.

Okay, before you go, I want to know how you cook a goose. Well, I actually agree, right? So I want to cook it in a vessel in which you can let the fat drip out so you get that beautiful crispy skin. I do a 24-hour dry brine on the goose as well. And then constantly paying attention to the temperature. I do spatchcock the goose, but when I have it spatch cocked, I'm putting it on like a two-tier roasting rack so I can get that skin super, super crispy. And then sometimes I'll even create a layer in between the skin and the flesh so that you can really crisp that out. making sure you put it in the refrigerator for 24 hours uncovered.

It dries out the skin, which allows for a pellicle to be created, which is just really that dry exterior, so it roasts more or it gets crispy. Oh, before, while you're salting it, you put it in a refrigerator and go straight from the refrigerator? And then I go, yeah, so I do a 24 hour salt all over the goose, right? You can have it on the sheet pan and then, but I leave it uncovered almost near where the fan in the refrigerator is. And that's kind of what they do with dry aging beef too, because you create the, this pellicle, which is just behind the exterior. And that's what allows you to get a crispy or exterior because then you don't have the

surface moisture, which would otherwise inhibit the browning or the crispy, crispiness of the skin. All right, my friend. I'm going to try it. Great to see you. Follow Chef Krul on X, Gruel, Gruel, anywhere. When are you going to be on Gupfeld next? I'll be on Monday.

Family Cookbook. Look for you on Monday. Family Cookbook, Andrew Grul's family cookbook, as well. and we appreciate you being here as always. It's always an honor. Thank you so much. Great talking food with you. It's out of Lauren for us.

All right. That was fun. That was fun. I'm not doing Thanksgiving this year, but I will do it for Christmas. I always, I love food conversations that feel like an education. And that's always the way it is when I speak to a chef cruel. When I used to make a turkey, I used to take like, okay,

I take a bunch of vegetables and everything, and I grind it up and I put beer in the, it and then I would stuff it underneath the skin. Like I would, you know, use a syringe and I would put the vegetables under the skin. I don't know if you remember this. That was my... I kind of do. Yeah.

And I, that seemed to be good. And then that also made a good gravy. Shall we put up next week's guest, everybody, so we can see what's coming. That's with Tim Hardaway, basketball great, coming on first guest, Rhode Angeles. Rob Henderson is a great guest. He's a sociologist, of course, from trained at Oxford. And a lot, Del Bicktree coming back. We got so much to talk about.

So much going on as we head towards the new year. Have a great holiday. Wait, wait, one more time. Okay, Drew, don't go yet. Okay? All right. Excuse me. Yep.

Here. So when I interrupt him. I just want everybody to understand that there are specials going on at the Wellness Company, Dr. Drew.com slash wellness farms. You can get the meat at a discount. use the Black Friday discount code, but that starts on Thursday. Okay. And then Fatty 15, if you use, go to doctory.com's Fatty 15, you'll get 30% off

on that product as well. And, you know, 90-day starter kit or the whole year. Oh. You can buy the whole year at a 30% discount. So it's well worth it if you've already bought it before. Also, Susan, I have a live event tomorrow for V-Shred at 530 Pacific time. and I don't know, let me see if I can figure how you get to it.

Did we play the V shred out today? I don't even know, right? I don't know, but it's called Momentum Mastery. So look, go to V-Shred-Movementum-Mestery. Dot circle.org. So I'm not quite sure how everyone gets to go to it. God. But look for, you know, ask me anything.

I'm going to ask me anything. You're going to ask me anything. Just a real quick check here, Drew, Have you verified that that is a real link from your V-Sread people, not a spam link? That's a long link. You know, maybe it's my link that I have to go to to get on it or something? If they go to V-shred.com or V-shred.com or they go to V-shred on Instagram, there will be a link there. They'll mention it.

Okay. I know I had to go to Momentum Master. I don't know. They didn't send me anything to promote. Yeah, I wish they had. because I love you'd love for you all to be there. It's 5.30 tomorrow Pacific time. It's the last thing we are doing before we head out for the holiday. We appreciate you all so much for supporting the show, supporting the people that will give us the opportunity to do the show.

Watch, sign up on Rumble, sign up on YouTube, put the word out, and have a great holiday. We're wishing you a, this is sort of the beginning of the holiday season, and we hope you all have a great time with your family and loved ones. Day healthy and safe. So be it. See you on. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. Emily Barsh is our content producer.

As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving, though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was published. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, don't call me.

Call 911. If you're feeling hopeless or suicidal, call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 800-273-8255. You can find more of my recommended organizations and helpful resources at doctordo.com slash help. Thank you.