Ask Dr. Drew - Global Elites Fear A “Population Bomb” Will End Humanity, and They’ll Sacrifice You To Save Themselves w/ Dr. Clayton Baker & Dr. Kelly Victory – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 284

Episode Date: November 13, 2023

If you were a billionaire member of the global elite, and you became convinced that the greatest threat to humanity is overpopulation, how far would you go to “save” your species? In a recent article for Brownstone, Dr. Clayton Baker offers a possible explanation for the strange actions of the world’s top health officials and authorities during the pandemic: they think they know something that we don’t, and they believe we are too simple to understand the impending danger even if they tried to tell us. “The consensus, reached after lengthy consultations with these men and other luminaries, was that the worldwide human population must be reduced from 8 billion to 500 million units. But how?” writes Dr. Baker in his fictionalized account. War? A bomb? “A plague, a pestilence, a pandemic seemed more promising,” writes Dr. Baker. “Past naturally occurring pandemics had reduced human populations much more successfully than wars.” Dr. Clayton Baker (MD) is an internal medicine physician with a quarter century in clinical practice. He has held numerous academic medical appointments and his work has appeared in many journals, including the Journal of the American Medical Association and the New England Journal of Medicine. From 2012 to 2018 he was Clinical Associate Professor of Medical Humanities and Bioethics at the University of Rochester. Follow him at https://x.com/cjbakermd 「 SPONSORED BY 」 Find out more about the companies that make this show possible and get special discounts on amazing products at https://drdrew.com/sponsors • GENUCEL - Using a proprietary base formulated by a pharmacist, Genucel has created skincare that can dramatically improve the appearance of facial redness and under-eye puffiness. Genucel uses clinical levels of botanical extracts in their cruelty-free, natural, made-in-the-USA line of products. Get an extra discount with promo code DREW at https://genucel.com/drew • COZY EARTH - Trying to think of the right present for someone special? Susan and Drew love Cozy Earth's sheets & clothing made with super-soft viscose from bamboo! Use code DREW to save up to 40% at https://drdrew.com/cozy • PRIMAL LIFE - Dr. Drew recommends Primal Life's 100% natural dental products to improve your mouth. Get a sparkling smile by using natural teeth whitener without harsh chemicals. For a limited time, get 60% off at https://drdrew.com/primal • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at https://twc.health/drew • PALEOVALLEY - "Paleovalley has a wide variety of extraordinary products that are both healthful and delicious,” says Dr. Drew. "I am a huge fan of this brand and know you'll love it too!” Get a discount on your first order at https://drdrew.com/paleovalley 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 The CDC states that COVID-19 vaccines are safe, effective, and reduce your risk of severe illness. You should always consult your personal physician before making any decisions about your health.  「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/firstladyoflove). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. 「 ABOUT DR. DREW 」 Dr. Drew is a board-certified physician with over 35 years of national radio, NYT bestselling books, and countless TV shows bearing his name. He's known for Celebrity Rehab (VH1), Teen Mom OG (MTV), Dr. Drew After Dark (YMH), The Masked Singer (FOX), multiple hit podcasts, and the iconic Loveline radio show. Dr. Drew Pinsky received his undergraduate degree from Amherst College and his M.D. from the University of Southern California, School of Medicine. Read more at https://drdrew.com/about Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

and welcome everyone if things look a little different today we are coming to you from Austin Texas and the SoundShed studios they're very kindly hosting us and I'm out here a fair bit so I might once in a while stop by the studio give us some flexibility and today we are interviewing Dr. Clayton Baker he is an internist like myself and much like Kelly Victory he was early to concerns about some of the excesses in the COVID pandemic and his concerns have only grown since then. Both he and Kelly and I share concerns about our access to high quality editorial medical information and we're concerned that the major journals have been adulterated in certain ways and various other things he's going to talk to us about today.

So please do stick with us. Of course, we'll be watching things on the Rumble Rants and over on the Restream. And as I said, Kelly Victory is here with me. But first, I'll be welcoming Dr. Kayla Baker, Dr. Clayton Baker myself. Sorry, there's a lot of disorientation being in a new studio. We'll get right to it our laws as it pertained to substances are draconian and bizarre the psychopaths start this right he was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography ptsd love addiction fentanyl and heroin ridiculous i'm a doctor for say where the hell you think i learned that i'm just saying

you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. If you have trouble, you can't stop and you want to help stop it, I can help. I got a lot to say.

I got a lot more to say. Thanks for watching. at GenuCell.com slash Drew so you can look your very best at all of your Thanksgiving gatherings. Look 10, 15, 20 years younger guaranteed with the best natural skincare anywhere. Take advantage of GenuCell's best sale of the year and say goodbye to fine lines, crow's feet, puffiness, and dark spots. The GenuCell experience is like no other, but don't take my word for it. You will look and feel your absolute best or your money back. No questions asked So for results in 12 hours or less GenuCell's immediate effects is included for free Plus if you go to GenuCell.com slash Drew now, you'll get a free upgrade to priority shipping That is GenuCell.com slash Drew G-E-N-U-C-E-L.com slash Drew Did you remove a comment?

Hey, we are here. Susan and I are just chatting. She's actually in the studio here with me. She's got to get her mic on, so give her a second. So your mic isn't muted. So when you start asking me questions... Ah, okay. Well, so you heard us talk about the fact that we're over on the Rumble Rants,

and I see a message where it says it was removed by the moderator, and I'm wondering if that was Susan. I did that. Ah, okay. Well, so you heard us talk about the fact that we're over on the Rumble Rants, and I see a message where it says it was removed by the moderator, and I'm wondering if that was Susan. I did that. It was spam. I didn't say who's... Ah, gotcha. Okay, well, somebody's in there working. I didn't even write who's hallucinating and it popped up. It is so odd to me, though. You know, Caleb, some of you may not

see this, but before the show, while we're warming up, the sort of preamble, Caleb will put up videos of old shows in the last couple of shows he's been putting up uh our last interview with dr zelenko and uh in that interview he talks about how uh someone was predicting uh by the late 2020s everyone will have a digital identifier and i don't know if you're aware but the european union just approved digital wallets. And their comment after getting that approved was, all right, let's get to work on putting something in that wallet,

which is going to be all the health material that we've been very concerned about. And we were talking to Christine Anderson about yesterday. So continuing that discussion we had yesterday, Kelly and I are welcoming Dr. Clayton Baker. Dr. Baker is an internist like myself. We have a very similar training and background. He's a little younger than I am, but he was early to concerns about COVID-19 and some of the excesses by the international community and our government in particular. Please welcome Dr. Clayton Baker. Welcome, sir. Thanks, Drew.

Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. So you and Kelly were chatting before the mics heated up here on air, and I thought it was interesting. You were talking about how COVID tore some of the veneer off, things that, concerns that have been kind of free-floating for a long time in medicine. And you said something very interesting, and I'm going to quote you. It's a quote about how people go broke. I forget who wrote it. You may be able to straighten me out on this, but I'd heard it before, which is it happens slowly and then quickly. And that's sort

of what happened during COVID. There was a lot of concerns flying around about how medicine was going. And then COVID hit, and it's like, oh, man, we got a lot of problems here. And they're very obvious now. Absolutely. Yeah, that's the Hemingway quote from Sun Also Rises. One guy asked the other guy, how'd you go broke? And he said, gradually and then suddenly. And we were talking about that, Kelly and I,

because you knew that there were a lot of problems in our profession, a lot of undue influence due to big pharma, a lot of compromise in the way that clinical trials are held, a lot are not just held, but how they're devised and how they're funded, of course. And all of these factors were so present, and we kind of knew about them, we're kind of aware of them. And the industry kind of scratched the surface on dealing with them, but never really addressed them. And now you see with COVID, it's just completely out of control. And it's really discouraging,

as I said to Kelly, for two reasons. One, because it took this knock on the head, which was COVID, for me to really wake up about it. But then I feel like so many people in our profession still haven't woken up despite getting that knock on the head. Yeah, I agree with you. And I got to tell you that I'm continuing to evolve. As long as I've been practicing general medicine, I've always said, oh, man, first of all, these insurance companies and the hospitals and the various regulatory organizations, whether it's the VA or the California Medical Association or the Department of Mental Health or insurance.

There was all these people who were invading my ability to maintain, invading my relationship with my patient, essentially. And I just kept saying, look, the most effective unit we have in medicine is a well-trained, caring, informed patient, a motivated, informed patient. That's it. That is your best unit. Anything you do to that or put on top of that, you're going to adulterate it and make things less efficient. And so my whole career has been primarily fighting on the insurance and the hospital side.

But I realized recently, really, and COVID is what brought this to sort of focus for me, we've lost. We have lost as physicians. We have to find a way to put the authority and the control of healthcare in the hands of patients because we have lost our ability to control it completely. It's just we got to run up the white flag and admit it. Like you said, it's been a free-floating concern. I don't know how long you've been practicing medicine. It's 40 years for me. For the entire time, I've been worried about this, and it's been a free-floating concern. I don't know how long you've been practicing medicine. It's 40 years for me. For the entire time, I've been worried about this,

and it's been getting worse, worse, worse. And it's now when COVID made me realize, oh, we're all employees. We're all adulterated. It's over. I hate to say that I agree with what you just said, not because it's so discouraging, but I agree with what you just said, but I, not because it's so discouraging, but I agree with what you just said. You know, it's something where we can put it, we can give it back to the patients. There's gotta be a way where we can creatively give things more, put control more in the hands

of the patients so they can advocate. We can help them advocate for themselves rather than us advocating for them as we had hoped, as we'd been trained to do. Where did you go to undergraduate, by the way? I did my undergraduate at Harvard and I did my medical school at McGill. And it's interesting you mentioned that because McGill back in those days was old school medical education. I mean, I'm just old enough that I actually had oral exams with three attending physicians on the other side of the table grilling you until they found out what you didn't know. And it's really, things are unrecognizable now compared to 30 years ago. Yes. Well, and I'm wondering if you also had science education as an undergraduate, because you strike me as somebody who has had good science

education. I was a bioengineer. And that's also missing. That's also missing a lot from people's training. And if you've had science training and you have rational uncertainty, if you're rationally sort of skeptical and looking at things, you can't help but shake your head and go, what? Particularly all these people that are expressing irrational certitude. It just strikes you as absolutely bizarre. And I was talking to, I'm forgetting his name now, the guy, Azar, Secretary of HHS Azar. I had to meet him and talk to him.

And I was complaining about how our randomized controlled trials were so underpowered and were adulterated. And he looked at me, because remember, he used to talk about the coziness in the government and the drug companies. He was the CEO of Lilly. He was the CEO of Lilly, and he was a good guy. He was a good guy and he was a smart guy. And I talked to him, and he goes, we don't know how to fund the phase

three trial. There's nobody else that can fund it that has a deep enough pocket other than pharma. We don't know what to do about that. And that was where my alarms first went off. And then with COVID, watching what's happened to the editorial process of the major journals, that's where my head exploded. And so what do we do about this? Well, I think one thing is, I think if you start with the perhaps the more correctable, I don't know if anything's fully correctable, but the more correctable possibilities, one thing I would say is that the traditional medical literature and the traditional medical journals are largely dinosaurs anyway. I think there has to be a different way to get study results and so on out than through

those journals. And I say that as someone who wrote, you know, my CV still says I got one publication in New England Journal, you know. But the reality of the matter is, is that they're so compromised and their business models are outdated. They're either owned by someone like El Sevier, who is rotten, or they just take pharma money and do whatever pharma tells them, because nobody pays for a subscription anymore. You know, so, you know, this is the kind of, I think we really need to look at that as just an antiquated model in terms of getting information out there. And I think that

maybe some of these free sources and so on are a much better way to go. I think when it comes to the trials, I think that it's really problematic because we've been indoctrinated into thinking that these randomized controlled trials are the be allall and end-all for every aspect of medicine when they just simply aren't. They are the best if they're well-designed and well-run to demonstrate causality, but they're not necessarily at all the best way to demonstrate number needed to treat or any of those other things that are so important when it comes to practicing medicine clinically. And that's what we've seen, I think, largely during COVID, isn't it? Because, you know, we have studies, for example, of masking where, you know, you have a whole state like Florida where they had the data showing the schools that masked and the schools that didn't mask, and there wasn't any difference

whatsoever. Well, that should be case closed, really. It doesn't matter if the holes in the mask are smaller than the virus or not. If you've got 10,000 kids who wore masks or were told to wear masks, I mean, it corrects for all of the problems with an individual doing the mask properly, et cetera, et cetera. So a randomized controlled trial is not as good as some kind of retrospective trial for that type of thing. And yet we've been indoctrinated into thinking the only way to know if anything's true or not is through a randomized controlled trial, which as you pointed out, is so expensive that only pharma can afford it.

And number two is only as good as the way it was designed. So I think that that's something to really keep in mind going forward that, you know, if you can't afford an RCT, maybe that's not an option, you know? Yeah, and I really am dismayed that clinical impression, clinical experience of practitioners has been completely, I don't want to say adulterated or minimized, it's just been completely ignored. What are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes? You're not allowed to believe your lying eyes even when you see things over and over and over again.

And again, we may be wrong. We may be wrong on precisely what we're doing, but we know what's happening. You know, we know when people get better, when they don't get better, there's, it's just as simple as that. I mean, yes, maybe it's just our caring presence that has a significant impact on what's going on. But what, who cares? We're making people better.

That's what's important here. But I, I do care. I, I'm being facetious and angry about this whole thing, but let me talk really who cares? We're making people better. That's what's important here. But I do care. I'm being facetious and angry about this whole thing. But let me talk really quickly before we bring Dr. Kelly Victory in here a couple of minutes about something we were talking to Christine Anderson about yesterday, which is about medical freedom generally and the fact that now we have the World Health Organization coming in with a treaty, so-called, to get authority over our sovereign

institutions, our duly elected institutions in an emergency. We have the digital wallet now in the EU. You know, what do we do about that? It seems like that's a terribly concerning trend. Yeah, I mean, I'll be blunt. I think that, you know, we talked about some perhaps insoluble problems within our profession. I think the one that's solu we talked about some perhaps insoluble problems within our profession. I think the one that's soluble is just get out of the WHO. I don't think that the WHO is serving any kind of a positive or salutary function whatsoever. I think it's a power grab, and I think they've demonstrated that. And, you know, I think that that's something that is just simple as can be. It's just something they really don't have at this stage.

Who knows what it could be like in 10 or 20 years. But right now, they really don't have the means to enforce their – that's always been one of the problems with the UN is they can't really enforce their mandates. So if you just say, well, we're not going to play, I think that's the simplest and best way. And maybe the best way for us or people who feel this way is just say, this is not public health. This is a power grab and we don't want any part of it. And you're not going to want any part of it once you fall into it. There's a guy, John Campbell, I think his name, Dr. John Campbell in the UK, put out a great 13-minute review. It's on Twitter where he just goes through item by item with the things that they're trying to update from that 2005 document. And it just boggles your mind that anyone would want to sign on to that.

It boggles my mind anyway. Yeah. He also does a good job of reviewing some of the claims by the British Health Service versus what is actually published data and opinions of the CDC. There's so many. any, it just, I just, when I, when I think about what I've learned through this whole thing, it's like the bureaucracies, particularly non-medical bureaucracies in particular, but any bureaucracy just can't be making medical decisions. It's a disaster when they do. Absolutely. And that's what we have now. And that's what you're. You mentioned, yes, yes. And you mentioned colleges too, which is another domain where there's a battle going on in terms of these vaccine mandates. I think the only way that's going to get undone is if kids who get injured, and there has to be some. I mean, it's just statistically the way we now know there's going to be a certain amount of young, at least, that have some sort of injury.

And they should be suing the hell out of those schools for requiring them to take something they didn't need that hurt them. Absolutely. And I think that that's something that I would say if there's anyone in a university that's by chance listening to this podcast. The things that you have, the protections that the vaccine manufacturers have, like the 1986 Vaccine Act and so on, I've read that. And I'm no lawyer, but it doesn't say anything about the people if you're if it's not someone who's forcing someone to take it it protects the manufacturer to a very I think unreasonable degree but it doesn't it doesn't protect anybody who's forcing these things inappropriately on people and so they'd better be careful because I think what you're saying is absolutely true they listen and this, hey, we didn't know.

We're just doing the best we could. It's like, how did Dr. Baker and I knew something wasn't right? How come we had concerns about that? How come Aaron Cariotti, as a bioethicist, had to stand up and go, hey, don't do this. You don't have enough information for a mandate. And then he's fired. I mean, this is the problem. The excesses are the problem.

Not that you were trying to do the right thing. Not that you made a mistake. No problem with any of that. It was the excesses and the authoritarianism and the punitive quality that just was rolled out and the lack of assessing and looking at risk reward and all the things that are the very fundamentals of when you are doing medicine, when you are giving something to people, you have to do that constantly. Right. And I, you know, that's something you talked about being aware of this very early on in COVID. And for me, it was something that clinically I saw right away. It said, I can't get, you know, before COVID everyone was hounding me, you know, the insurance company, my employer was hounding me to get everyone's cancer screening done. And all of a sudden, nobody's going to have cancer for a year. You know, how am I going to get my colonoscopies? Well, it doesn't matter because COVID. Well, wait a minute, what's going to happen? Well, you could tell in April of 2020, that there's going to be excess death down the road, which is exactly what's happened for any number of reasons.

And, you know, you have patients who are are alcoholics that can't go to AA meetings. This is disastrous. This is disastrous. Disastrous. And by the way, when that came down, when they closed some of the meetings in Los Angeles that I'm associated with, I thought, oh my God, it's just not going to work electronically. I was pleasantly surprised. For the record, Zoom did carry people at least six months, maybe 12 in some cases. Then they had to get back in person. They had to. But I'm at least relieved that we got about six months of,

and we have a new mechanism to enroll people now into 12-step, which is Zoom meetings, which is great. But still, the idea that they just, you know, we're going to arrest you if you go to the log cabin meeting. They're there to save their lives. They're there to maintain their health. Anyway, we got to take a break. Dr. Clinton Baker is with us.

Go ahead, Dr. Baker. Finish, please. No, I was just saying, what was your dropout rate, though? How many people did you lose, you know, to follow up with AA meetings and stuff? Because, you know, that's something that's something that it's hard to know anyway. Well, I mean, you need no look no further than headlines on TMZ to see how many celebrities are dying of addiction of various types and on the streets and everywhere else. I mean, of course, the stress of the lockdown, the lack of access to meetings, the depression, the economic distress,

of course, addiction, mental health, of course, the depression, the economic distress, of course, addiction, mental health, of course, mental health was going to run out of control. I kept saying it over and over and over again. There was no doubt about it. There's just a lack of risk reward. So we're going to bring Dr. Victory in. Dr. Baker, other than, let's see, CBakerMD on Twitter, where else would you like people to go to find? Yeah, it's at cjbakermd. cjbakermd at Twitter. I'm also on Brownstone Institute.

So you can look at brownstone.org. My writing's on there. Thank you very much. And I gave an email that people can email if they wish. I get an occasional email that I like to respond to if people are really interested. Um, and you can do a CJ Baker, MD at consultant.com. Very good. We thank you very much. We're going to take a little break here. We've got to share with you some of our, uh,

enthusiastic supporters and the people that we support as well. And then we'll bring Dr. Kelly Victory on in with Dr. Baker. If you're trying to figure out the right present for someone, you will not go wrong with gifting the most comfortable sheets, clothing, and accessories that your friends and family have ever felt. Of course, I'm talking about Cozy Earth. Cozy Earth has the softest and most comfortable sheets, blankets, towels, PJs, joggers, and more guaranteed. Susan and I love them. In fact, we still have Cozy Earth sheets on our bed.

I slept in them last night. I was thinking of how great they were. And look at this. I'm wearing one of their super comfortable t-shirts right now. I just can't get enough of Cozy Earth. Their sheets are durable, machine washable, and come with a 10-year warranty against defects. So no surprise that Cozy Earth's brand has been featured on Oprah's favorite things

for five years in a row. Whether it's their luxury pajamas, super soft bedding, loungewear, or plush bath towels, you will love shopping and gift giving at Cozy Earth. Here's my gift to you this holiday season. Go to CozyEarth.com, enter code Drew to save 40%. That's CozyEarth.com with code Drew. CozyEarth.com, code Drew, save 40%. These products have transformed my life and Susan's and saved their marriage.

Discover the key to oral hygiene, regardless of your current daily dental routine, whether you diligently brush and floss multiple times a day or you struggle. You got bleeding gums, bad breath, plaque buildup. This revelation is for both of you. Surprisingly, over 350,000 Americans experience health issues that may be connected to their toothbrush or even caused by it, ranging from heart or blood sugar problems, forgetfulness, digestive difficulties, immune issues, all related to oral hygiene. Scientific studies have shown that a simple switch of your toothbrush can lead to a healthier teeth and potentially save your marriage. Yes, save your marriage.

Our study, we did a personal study. My wife, Susan, hates the sound of the sonic toothbrushes. But introducing the Real White Sonic Toothbrush, of course, also their Hydroxy Appetite Dirty Mouth Mineral Toothpaste by Primal Life Organics, these products have transformed my life and Susan's and saved our marriage. It's much quieter. It's a very powerful toothbrush, but it is quiet and it saved our marriage. So, the Real White Sonic Tooth toothbrush from primal life organics stands out among all other electric toothbrushes i've tried it effectively eliminates plaque harmful bacteria promotes gum health get yours and enjoy 60 off at naturaltoothbrush.com slash drew i think

everyone knows the next medical crisis could be just around the corner, whether it comes in the form of another pandemic or something much more routine, like a tick bite. You and your family need to be prepared. That's where the wellness company comes in. You know the wellness company. We have their physicians on, like Dr. McCullough, frequently. The wellness company and their doctors are medical professionals you can trust.

And their new medical emergency kits are the gold standard when it comes to keeping you safe and healthy. It's really, it's a safety net. It's an insurance policy that you hope you're not going to need, but if you need it, you sure as heck are going to wish you had it if you need it. Be ready for anything. This medical emergency kit contains an assortment of life-saving medications, including ivermectin, Z-Pak. The medical emergency kit provides a guidebook to aid in the safe use of all these life-saving medications. From anthrax to tick bites to COVID-19, the Wellness Company's medical

emergency kit is exactly what you need to have on hand to be prepared. Rest assured, knowing that you have emergency antibiotics, antivirals, and antiparasitics on hand to help you and your family stay safe from whatever life throws at you next. Go to drdrew.com slash TWC. That is D-R-D-R-E-W dot com forward slash TWC to get 10% off today. Just click on that link. Some platforms have banned the discussion of controversial topics. If this episode ends here, the rest of the show is available at drdrew.tv. There's nothing in medicine that doesn't boil down to a risk-benefit calculation. It is the mandate of public health to consider the impact of any particular mitigation scheme on the entire population. This is uncharted territory, Drew.

Of course, welcoming Dr. Kelly Victory. And you know, Kelly, I was just thinking to myself as we change and update this show with time, the one thing I never want to get rid of is you talking about everything in medicine being distilled down to a risk reward or risk benefit ratio. It is just such specific, universal truth about medicine. I want to hear it every day of my life, and I want other people to hear it too. Well, welcome, Dr. Baker. I've really been so looking forward to this conversation, and I want to talk with you more about those sorts of topics and how it is that there's been such degradation in medical education that the average medical student or resident doesn't even understand that as the most fundamental construct

in all of medicine is the risk reward calculation, let alone sort of the fact that they don't even teach the pillars of medical ethics and those sorts of things. I really want to get into that with you. But before I do, I want to go back and delve a little bit more into this issue that we were discussing yesterday with Christine Anderson and that you've written about very recently, which is the WHO treaty. Because I think there's, unfortunately, so many people, just before the show today, I was talking with some friends about the conversation and I said, well, we're going to talk about the WHO treaty. And again, these are very intelligent people, not physicians, not medical people, but they had no earthly idea what I was even referencing. The average American, I'd say probably 95% of Americans have no idea what this is.

So the first question I would ask to you is, what's your elevator pitch? You're on the elevator with somebody you got two minutes to say, to explain to them what this thing is and why they should care about this WHO issue. Well, the first thing I would say, well, first of all, thank you, Kelly, for having me. I'm a big fan of yours and Dr. Drew's, Dr. Drew ever since Celebrity Rehab way back in the day. But, used to love that show. But anyways, my elevator pitch would be this.

COVID was a manmade catastrophe. No matter how you want to slice it, no matter how much you want to say this was an accidental lab leak or whatever. And it's absolutely the case for at least two reasons. Number one, because this was a genetically modified virus. There just aren't furin cleavage sites on coronaviruses naturally. And it didn't come from a scaly anteater. It came out of the lab in Wuhan. Everyone from Rand Paul to John Stewart knew that in 2020. Okay. So it's a man-made catastrophe. The other thing is that the COVID response was a man-made catastrophe because all

of the collateral damage was for exactly the reason that you stated and that Drew and I touched on a little bit earlier. and that is that no one gave a damn about the collateral damage of the lockdowns, of the mandates, of all these school closures, all these terrible things that were done to people. So this is totally a man-made catastrophe. My second point to that person on the elevator would be this. It would be that this is not, you can judge them by their fruits. Nobody is saying, we screwed up totally. I'm stepping down or I'm going to totally re-overhaul things. We're never doing this again.

They're saying, oh, we didn't know. That's the best you get out of these people. And this is a template. This is a template for what's bound to happen in the future, in my opinion. And now you move to the WHO, the new treaty that they're supposedly producing. And what that is really, in my mind, is setting the stage to allow them to just reapply this template whenever they see fit to do so and some of the language that's going into it is it's there was language in the 2005 treaty that said specifically you have to take into account the individual freedom and the benefits to the individual person that's being struck out of

the new language. They basically have said now that countries are not supposed to communicate directly with each other. They're supposed to communicate through the WHO. So basically, this is a power grab which allows them to kind of lather, rinse, and repeat what they did to us in 2020 through 2022. And if people don't realize that, then I think they're incredibly naive to an absolute fault that's potentially deadly. Yeah. So I would go further and say, and I said it yesterday, I'll say it again today, to be clear, the WHO is the long arm of the Chinese Communist Party. They work hand in club with the World Economic Forum.

They are not our friends and they do not have health, certainly public health or individual health as their core concept. That is not what they're after. What they're after is power. This has nothing to do with health. And whether you agree or disagree with much of what Donald Trump did during his presidency, the one thing that I think you're hard pressed to disagree with was his removing us from the World Health Organization. program or initiative, if you will, is called One Health. And although I like Drew and Susan, I like you very much, we don't share the same health. We don't have one health. I'm here to bring, okay? I like you, but we don't have one

health. Mine is very different from yours and yours is different from mine. And we all, we have individual health and the idea that this would be boiled down and that's what i was saying in in that little open you saw public health you really are obligated to take into account still the impact of these programs on everybody and it's not just uh on their physical health but their financial health, spiritual health, economic health. And that was absolutely ignored during the debacle that was the COVID pandemic response. So in your estimation, knowing what you know about the treaty, it's my understanding that this is, you have to opt out of it. If you don't opt out, you are otherwise as a member country in the WHO,

you're automatically in it. And as of right now, the United States and Canada have not opted out. This thing is due to be ratified, I believe in May. What's your understanding of number one, the likelihood of it passing and what happens from there? I think that the, I've heard different people make different projections, you know, people whose opinion I respect. So I don't know how likely it is. I think that the correct solution for the United States is what you said and what I offered to Drew earlier, which is leave the WHO, if not the UN altogether. And I think that that is really the solution. It's not an opt-out situation. It's a get-out situation in my mind. And I think that if you remain a member of it, then you remain within their sort of purview to some extent. You become kind of this second-class citizen of that organization.

And so I think that's really the only option. I couldn't handicap what the odds are that the United States agrees to it or not. I think that that may be something, again, that we can make a difference in the people who disagree with it is really say, we need to get out of the WHO. My approach would be just get out of the WHO, not refuse to be a part of this particular resolution. I really think that's the way to go because it's so egregiously bad. Why do you want to be a part of it anyway? And I think even threatening to leave the organization as a whole puts a lot more pressure on them because where does their funding come from? It comes from, WHO's funding comes from Bill Gates, the Communist Party of China, and the

United States. I mean, no one else really pays into it in any significant amount. Well, I'm happy to, I was happy to hear you say with Drew that you don't think that the WHO has any teeth or an ability to really, you know, follow through on their mandates or these sorts of things. And again, to be clear for anybody who's listening, although they have teed this thing up to be related to healthcare, you know, this was with the WHO will take over if there's another pandemic. It's not so simple. It's whatever public health crisis as they define it, that public health crisis might be

climate change where they say you know you can't drive your you know your gas car or it might be a gun violence and they say therefore you have to turn over your firearms I don't know any number of things it doesn't simply mean a global pandemic the the other thing that I think would happen if this did pass, uh, Dr. Baker is that it gives plausible deniability to everybody in, in our own government, the people we actually did vote for, uh, our own Congress and people we actually did elect now have plausible deniability because they can say, oh, it wasn't us. It was the WHO. We're really sorry that you, you know, you had to take this vaccine or lose your car,

lose your livelihood or whatever the heck it was that happened. And I think it would be just- Which we saw, if I may interrupt you. I'm sorry. I agree, which I may add is exactly what we saw at every level of government during COVID, right? Isn't it? We saw the local government saying, well, the state told me I'm supposed to do this. And unless you had someone with the cojones to stand up at the local level, then they did whatever the state said. And then the state, unless you had someone who had the guts to stand up at that level, then they did whatever the federal government said and so on down the line. So you're absolutely right. What it does is it gives our people cover to do the wrong thing and I think that that's that's really where the teeth is and and you don't know what the teeth will be in 20 years 30 years you know I've said this many times you know I'm 56 you know I'm not rich by any

means but I'm not destitute I could move to the reddest County in the reddest state get a double-wide and a 12 gauge and a pitbull, and people would probably leave me alone. And I'd probably be able to play out the string if I kept my head down. But what about our kids? What about our grandkids? And that's the other sales pitch is, do you want your kids to grow up in the United States or do you want them to grow up in Krypton where a bunch of people dressed like fools, like Klaus Schwab are telling you what to do from Switzerland. I don't want my kids to grow up in that world. I don't want my grandchildren

to grow up in that world. And that's another sales pitch. Right. No, I want the Hunger Games to remain fiction. Yeah, I really didn't want to be living it. So go ahead, Drew. So I have a couple of questions I want for both you guys. I'm going to say something first, then I have a question. I hate it when people start attacking anything we say because of splitting hairs. So I always feel like I've got to run to our defense and clarify certain things. Like you mentioned no fur and cleavage site on coronaviruses. Technically, that is true. People go, there are in nature.

Yes, there are. But the subset that is particularly represented by COVID-19, there are not. So it's a true statement to say that there are no fur and cleavage sites in nature on the coronavirus in the subclass that coronavirus is a COVID-19 is a part of. So let's just leave that. I don't want to hear you more about that from people. Secondly, we don't Kelly talk a lot about what we should be doing. Uh, in other words, you, you guys are putting your finger on something here that is kind of interesting and, and it needs to be called called out which is we're starting to see a revisionist history narrative getting made you see you have

a news and going around i i didn't do anything you've got fauci going i didn't mandate anything they did it on their own and and they're finding these little loopholes to sort of wiggle through to to sort of side to sidestep the responsibility for their actions, which were egregious. The only person that actually, I think, embraces what she did is Deborah Birx. And what she did was awful. And history will not be good to her sense of heroism and evangelizing about lockdowns. I don't understand why she's not being actively criticized or even from a legal standpoint addressed what she did to us. But okay, it was her opinion.

But my question is, what do we do with these people? To make sure this kind of thing doesn't happen again, other than the schools, injured people suing the schools for vaccines they didn't need. Do you guys think of other solutions so this revisionist history doesn't become history? Do you want to take a bite at that first, Dr. Baker? I'll give it a whirl. I think the first thing is it would be wonderful to see really the most egregious people see some kind of criminal justice.

I think that that's the first thing. It's not just to have a scapegoat. It's to see that there is a legal consequence for doing this to people. You know, it's so egregious, you know, by the second episode of Tiger King, I realized that my civil rights had just been thrown completely out the window. And so had my kids, and so had my whole family, and my whole community, my whole country. And that's really something that people don't appreciate, just how diabolical that was. The Bill of Rights doesn't say unless there's a pandemic. Thomas Jefferson lost most of his family to infectious disease. He lost two kids to whooping cough. His wife had

smallpox and it made her sick for the rest of her life until she died at 33. Benjamin Rush was the first American to bring the true smallpox vaccine back from England after the war. George Washington had smallpox. These people knew more about infectious disease and about pandemics than we ever will. And even after COVID. And they didn't put into these documents, hey, unless there's an epidemic, you have a right to go to church. You have a right to go and earn a living. You have a right to speak your mind. You have a right, unless smallpox is in town. It's not there. It was never there. And they knew that that could be a confounder and it didn't make any difference. And people need to know this. They need to know

this is such an egregious abuse of fundamental civil rights. We can go down to the issue with medical ethics, which I've written is really just a bill of rights for patients. What those medical ethics pillars are, they're really protections against patients being abused by the system and by physicians. It's like a bill of rights. It's like the 10 commandments, you know, thou shalt not, you know, commit adultery or thou shalt not murder. And, you know, thou shalt not coerce a patient into taking a medical treatment that they don't understand and they don't agree with and that could hurt them. It's the same thing. And so these people, you know, this whole system just threw every moral precept out the window for this purpose. And, you know, I'm kind of going on a rant, I apologize, but I would say that it would be really nice to see someone, whether it's Deborah

Birx or whether it's Anthony Fauci or whether it's somebody, you know, pay some kind of a legal price for that. And that's yet to happen. Yeah. So I want to get back into the medical ethics. Feel free to rant anytime. I would circle back before the end of the show on the medical ethics thing. But my answer to this, Drew, would be, and I've said it many times, there is no moving forward without contrition and without accountability. And I fully agree with Dr. Baker that people need to be held accountable. And what remains to be seen is whether even the Republicans in Congress will do that with regards to people like Anthony Fauci,

who perjured himself not once, not twice, but so many times with regard simply to the gain of function issue. He knows darn well that the United States was involved with gain of function research. He funneled US taxpayer dollars to the lab in Wuhan. He was participant in that. And he perjured himself when they knew that. To have somebody like Gavin Newsom standing up and so many of them do the same thing and say, oh, you know, it's's a fog of war we didn't know it was a novel virus gosh if we knew then what we know now bullshit okay that's ridiculous I knew how did I know I knew and I said the things I said from the very beginning not because I'm a good guesser okay okay? It's because we've known for decades that masks

do nothing to stop the spread of respiratory viruses. Social distancing, are you kidding? Standing six feet apart from somebody? And these things, Drew, weren't just nuisances. They weren't just inconveniences. People lost their livelihoods. You take a small mom and pop shop oh my goodness that's working on thin margins and make them put a plexiglass and and limit their the capacity on bars and restaurants we closed down i mean hundreds of thousands of small businesses kelly we're closed not only close them down not only stress them out financially there was a great example of a couple of restaurants that attempted to stay open with outdoor dining mind you there's a famous place called tin horn flats in burbank i think it is who when they attempted to they've been around for 50 years when they

attempted to keep their employees employed their business operating not only did the authority show up with guns they that place is still closed with a fence around it. You can't even get into the physical area anymore because the authorities came in and you dared to question their authority by trying to maintain your business safely. You dared question it. You paid really the ultimate price. Right.

And by the way, I apologize for talking about being on a rant. I apologize for cussing, but Dr. Baker, it makes me so angry that when people do this, talk about revisions, how could we know? Well, there were those of us who knew, and they shut us down. They came after me. I was banned from every social media platform they came after my medical license and no one's coming back and saying wow turns out you were right from the beginning but i want to say you wanted to kill grandma you intended to kill

grandma you were a grandma killer that was your intention kelly how dare you i was a yeah i was a threat to humanity. But think how, look at that now through the retrospective scope. Look at that through history now. People were railing on people like you for that, saying that in those words. Think how stupid that was. I should lose my license. Where did that come from? I should go to prison.

I should go to prison. You know, they wish death on me and my family. What kind of hysteria gripped us? Right. Right. Where did that come from? Dr. Baker, you have any theory about the hysterics and how profound

or where it came from? Let me just, let me just ask him one more thing when you, when you answer this, because I want to know about how you feel about the complicity. And that's what it was of our profession, because I would submit to you that none of this could have happened had physicians not bought into it. Let me tell you a story from my own personal history. So in May or June of 2020, I had three kids in school. They were not in school. They were home. You know, I'm in New York. So they were home basically doing nothing. And I got together with a friend of mine who's a pediatric emergency room physician. We wrote a three-page document. I did the bulk

of it, but she certainly helped. And we looked up all of the available information at the time. There was data from France. There was data from Ireland about kids, about the lack of transmission of COVID relative to adults with kids. In schools. There were even, yeah, exactly. There were even preliminary, there was a lot of, you know, Sweden was all the rage back then because they didn't close their schools and all this. I called up, I spoke with the health minister of Finland once. You know, crazy stuff. I'm thinking to myself, what am I doing here? And we created this document.

I managed to go around town and this was still early enough. This was June of 2020. And it was a beautiful summer where we were, things were winding down. People were just kind of taking a deep breath. And I got 24 physicians to sign this document saying the schools need to be open this is why i can send you the document it's kind of lost to the in the histories of the dust we should put it up i'd love to see it i'll send it to you and this was from we got it out i think in july 12th 2020 and it was causing a bit of a stir locally i'm in rochester new york we had a press release and all this kind of thing and then all of a stir locally. I'm in Rochester, New York. We had a press release and all this kind of thing. And then all of a sudden people told me, I can't be associated with this. I can't be associated with this. I can't be associated with this. And it just shut down. There's two

major health systems in greater Rochester, and they both told their people, you will have nothing to do with this. And from then on until this day, I'm the only physician in Greater Rochester that I'm aware of who goes on any kind of platform and says anything. And there's 750,000 people. It's not a small place. About two weeks later, a private pediatric practice, I'm pretty sure they were inspired by our letter, put out a similar statement that schools should be open. About three days later, it was all over the local Facebook and so on that they wrote a written apology for having done this, a written apology. We spoke out a turn, blah, blah, blah. They had quoted the American Academy of Pediatrics,

which at the time was putting some stuff out there that the school should be open. Everything flipped around the school-related stuff, which was really how I got involved with COVID sort of dissidence in a big way initially in that summer of 2020 where I was. And they just shut us down. They just shut us down. They knew exactly what we were saying. They knew exactly what we were doing. And 99% of people wanted no part of it. They just said, we were saying. They knew exactly what we were doing. And 99% of people wanted no part of it. They just said, I'm not getting involved in this. And so that's

my personal experience. And my personal experience is someone that owns you says you shut up and almost to person, they shut up. And that's, that's terrible. Yeah, you're exactly right. We've talked about this before. The reality is, and this long, long predates COVID. COVID, as you said, ripped the veneer off. COVID revealed the man behind the curtain, that's the wizard behind the curtain. Okay, this has been going on for decades. And it started with the fact, I believe that physicians now are largely more than 85% of physicians are employees.

They're employees of either large hospital systems, medical practices, or insurance companies. And like it or not, you work for who pays you. You don't work for the patient. We like to think that you do. And the patients certainly want to think that you do. But the reality is, unless you're a concierge doctor or somebody who's independent like I am, you work for who pays you change over the decades that I've been in medicine in medical education. I think other than you, Dr. Baker, and myself, I'm not sure that your average physician has any idea that there are four pillars of medical ethics, let alone what they are. They don't even teach them anymore in medical school. And if you don't know what the

four pillars of medical ethics are, you're hard pressed to follow them. As you referred to it, I think rightly so, is kind of the Bill of Rights for Medicine. So talk a little bit about, you wrote an article about it, I think for Brownstone, touching on that issue of the medical ethics. So talk a little bit about that, because I think we were ripe, if you will. I think we, meaning the medical industrial complex, physicians, healthcare professionals, were ripe to have bought this bogus story of COVID and to buy into this because this degradation

of critical thinking, the lack of adherence to medical ethics has been going on for decades, unfortunately, as physicians have become more and more bought. So talk a little bit about that. So, you know, I think that we really should know those medical ethics tenets really well. They were very historically, as you know, very well established. They weren't controversial at all before COVID. And, you know, their autonomy, beneficence, non-maleficence, and justice. And autonomy has kind of got pride of place as the most important, and that's patient autonomy. We'd like to think physician autonomy, and that we've probably seen that when you give up physician autonomy, the patient autonomy disappears pretty quickly in its stead.

But it's really patient autonomy, as you know. And one of the cornerstones of autonomy is real informed consent. And informed consent is, number one, it has to make sure that the person, as you said, kind of understands a risk-benefit analysis of what the potential harms are, what the potential benefits are. And furthermore, they have to have full information. And that's a cornerstone of it. So none of those things were upheld in any way, shape, or form during COVID. You weren't allowed to have the information. If you tried to get the information out there, you were silenced and you were not allowed to have an open conversation with people. You could get in

trouble. I know people who got in trouble for just basically really going through the information sheets, the attached sheets to the vaccine. No, you just give them the vaccine. And so this was absolutely dispensed with. And then of course, all of that risk benefit stuff that you focus on so rightly goes into the beneficence and non-maleficence. If you have no capacity to help somebody, they shouldn't be getting the drug. You know, that's kind of the beneficence thing. It's not a taking one for the team kind of thing. It just isn't.

And that's what we heard over and over again. You know, you're supposed to take one for the team. No, that's not the way medicine works. It's not the way it's supposed to work. And then, of course, non-maleficence, obviously, you don't do it in a vindictive and harmful way. And how much vindictiveness and harm was people without vaccine refusenik should die. How many times did we hear that from doctors? I won't care for this person. I take care of a lot of patients, not nearly as many as Drew, but I take care of a lot of patients with addiction problems.

I take care of a lot of people who have been in trouble with the law. I have violent felons amongst my patients. I don't judge them and say, well, you're not a good guy, so I'm not going to take care of you. That has no place in medicine whatsoever. That's maleficence. Correct. And so we just saw this over and over and over again. And then, of course, justice, you know, with medical ethics, it's usually described as distributive justice, you know, so it's like a rich person shouldn't get a one care and a poor person get no care, but it's also goes the other way. So the, the, the, the burden should not be on the vulnerable and the benefits beyond somebody else. And, and that's exactly what happened. You're telling these kids that are going to college that they have to get a vaccine that can only hurt them. And the rationale

supposedly is that we want to get to herd immunity, which of course is absurd with the respiratory virus to begin with. So, you know, every single one of these tenants was just absolutely just shredded. It's like you took all, it's like you went to Sodom and Gomorrah with Ten Commandments. It just got trampled on It's unbelievable what happened Yeah, I remember thinking back, you know looking at my own colleagues again And I've been very critical of my own colleagues and I hold them to account. I'm a trauma physician You know what in my many many years practicing many years practicing hospital-based trauma medicine, I might be taking care of the police officer who was shot, or I might be taking care of the guy

who shot him. I might be taking care of the patient who got hit by the drunk driver, or I might be taking care of the drunk driver. It's not mine to judge. I give the same level of care to them regardless of what they are. I don't get to play God. Unless they refuse to get the jab, then they're all dead. Right, exactly. Unless they refuse to get vaccinated, in which case I can say you shouldn't be allowed into a hospital. They're not humanoid at that point. They're less human, remember.

They're less human. Think about that. But anyway, I want to point out another area where it gets challenging like this and i've i've seen this a lot lately where if somebody's in their addictive disease or let's say they're even in some other severe mental health crisis where they're not in their right mind let's say addiction they don't know what they're doing they're way in their disease and they do something or at to somebody let's say they have a sexually inappropriate or they you know or they're way in their disease and they do something or at to somebody let's say they have a sexually inappropriate or they you know or they're touch somebody where they don't want to be touched

and then years later that person is in recovery and the accusation comes forward is that person done now their life has to be contemned or do we so that was in their disease this person has cleaned up his life he needs to go back and make an am we say that was in their disease this person has cleaned up his life he needs to go back and make an amends for that and there may even be criminal consequences he or she needs to take those consequences but the rest of us need to shut the hell up because this is a new person in their recovery from addiction from when their brain wasn't working and people won't even forgive those people or understand the ethics of what it means when somebody's in an altered brain state versus when they fully recover it's getting ridiculous

from my perspective yeah so i i think i i just i think back to the the medical ethics um these pillars dr baker i think it's you know it's criminal that these are not even taught anymore in medical school. So I think when you have a degradation of really the understanding, the core foundational constructs of medicine and healthcare, the sanctity of the patient-physician relationship, the idea of informed consent, when you look at what happened during COVID, there was not only in little pockets a breach of the Nuremberg Code. There was absolutely part and parcel, it was thrown out the window. The idea of informed consent was thrown out the window. The idea that people were coerced, mandated, shamed into taking a shot that is, as of today, as I sit here today,

November 8th, 2023, there is still not a single FDA approved injection for COVID. They are experimental still today. And therefore no one, if you read the Nuremberg code, can actually be coerced or mandated to take one. Yet here we are. So you made an interesting comment before we went on. You and I were chatting about the universities and the number that still are maintaining the mandates and those who aren't and some observations.

We're asking, why are there holdouts? Let's talk a little bit about that, the university mandates for vaccination. So the last time I checked, I've been fortunate enough to do a little bit of work with No College Mandates, which is one of the main groups that's really fought this. And my friend, she's one of my great COVID friends that I've never met in person, but I've met over the internet, Lucia Sinatra and all of her people have done great work. And just to put a little context in, at the beginning of the, I guess it would have been the 2021 fall year of college, there are roughly 2,900 colleges and universities

in the United States, and all but about 600 of them required some sort of COVID vaccination at that time. However, a lot of them have since dropped it. It's down to 75 holdouts now, just 75. And it's through a lot of pressure, intense pressure. And one by one, they've picked away at them. But as we were talking about, there's some very interesting demographics about the remaining groups. It's not random. I look at it and I see some of the, well, Harvard, my proud alma mater, who's also the worst university in the country for free speech, I just learned as well, but they're still mandating it. And they are the number one recipient of NIH money in the country. The number two recipient of NIH money in the country is Johns Hopkins. They're still holding out. None of the other

Ivy elites are incidentally. And then you look at a place like Rutgers, it's the only Big Ten school that is, and Rutgers has a very cozy relationship with Pfizer. They get millions of dollars from Pfizer. And of course, Pfizer's in New York City, and they're right across the Hudson River. And then you look at the HBCUs, which I saw that and I immediately thought to myself, what on earth is going on there? Because obviously, if you know a little bit about the history of African-Americans and the CDC and the Health and Human Services, it's a rocky story. The thing most people are aware of is Tuskegee, which was an absolute travesty. But a lot of African-Americans are historically skeptical of government mandated shots and

so on. And rightly so. Absolutely. As I think Tucker said, when he showed those people in Baltimore dressing down Tony Fauci when he was making his door to door rounds and Tucker says, you know, they may be poor, but they aren't stupid. And, you know, so how do they address that? Well, through the associations of the historically black colleges and universities, they are

funding aggressive drives to get these young people to get heavily vaccinated. I think it's a very deliberate attempt to break that sort of resistance in the black community against some of the, you know, skepticism, healthy skepticism about what these government agencies have in store for them. I don't think there's any question about it. And, you know, then you've got, you know, these pockets of very small liberal arts schools. There's a whole group of liberal arts schools in Ohio, like Oberlin and so on. And there's something going on there. I'm not sure what that is, but you look at it and it's not because there's any good reason. It's not because these 75 places are smart and the rest of the other 2,900 are dumb. It's because they're getting paid or they're getting strong-armed

to do it. And I wish people would come to realize that. And it pains me to say it, my alma mater is probably the worst, but that's the way, that's where we are right now in the United States. No, and I'm really hoping that, back to the conversation we were having earlier, that there is legal recourse. I think people need to start, the vaccine injured people, or people who lost their jobs, their livelihoods, their military benefits, whatever it was because of these vaccine mandates, I think should sue. I think that even the liability protection that was offered, the blanket protection that was offered to the vaccine manufacturers because of the emergency use authorization provisions and because of the Vaccine Act of 1986, will go away when we are

able to prove fraud. And I think that we will be able to prove fraud. They were fraudulent. They withheld information about the risks from the FDA. They were deceitful about the processes that they used to make the vaccines, the ingredients of the vaccines. And once we are able to prove fraud, I think they will be open to liability. But as you rightly pointed out, again, I'm also not an attorney, but I don't believe that there's blanket protection for the universities or the employers or the whomever who actually forced these things on people. And again, it doesn't have to be in the form just of a mandate, coercion or threatening somebody that they will lose their job. Their livelihood constitutes,

you know, that that is a breach. And I'm really hopeful that there will be just massive lawsuits. I don't care if it ties up the courts for the next 50 years. I think without that, we are likely to see this kind of atrocity again, or I certainly fear that we are. Well, I think the other thing that I'd just like to parenthetically add is, you know, we're talking about this, and then we're also talking, Kelly, about the situation of medical education. And, you know, the American Association of Medical Colleges is pushing hard for all medical students to get the jab. And so, you know, what's the rationale for that? I think it's very much to say there's absolutely no medical indication for it. And they know that,

but I don't even think it's a significant financial incentive because there aren't that many medical students. It's because you're going to basically make every single one of these kids that's going through to become doctors, basically one of the club. There's going to be no purebloods in medicine and that's what they want. And it's really, when you think about it, it's diabolical. And that's what's really happening now. It's just absolutely diabolical in my opinion. No, I agree. And we've had people like, we talk a lot about the unbelievable increases in disease rates and certainly the sudden deaths. The issues not only with cardiac injuries, but, you know, falling birth rates and fertility issues and everything in between.

I think it's undeniable you'd have to be living under a rock to not understand that there's been massive fallout from these vaccines. The number harmed eclipses the number of people who are actually helped by having some reduction perhaps in the severity of their illness. Again, it's by orders of magnitude, more people have been harmed. And again, they're trying very hard to keep that silent. I see the clock is winding down here.

Drew, are there things, items that you would like to press Dr. Baker on before we let him go? Yeah, I'm just thinking of something you just brought up in terms of, let's say there hasn't been in sheer numbers, worse effects so-called from the vaccine, but the phenomenon that has had no attention during the entirety of this catastrophe has been years of life lost. Even if you just take into effect the years of life lost from the mental health consequence of lockdowns and masking, and if you add in years of life lost from other interventions, let's say vaccine and others, it dwarfs. I say this over and over again, we were not honest about who this was primarily affecting. And let's remember that the average life expectancy for a male requiring

institutional care, average life expectancy after admission to a nursing home is six months. And we were, we were destroying lives with six, seven, eight decades ahead in order to save six months. Now I do believe we should absolutely save these people in the nursing homes and protect them, but not sacrifice the other. You could have done both. And that was what, you know, when they would sell it back to your original quote, Kelly, in the opening introduction, it all boils down to a risk benefit analysis. Where did that happen throughout all of this? So to sort of wrap up with Dr. Baker, going forward, is it a medical education problem? Is it a public health problem? Is it a bureaucracy problem where things on high have taken over from the actual caretaker in the room with the patient? Where has this gone off the rail completely and what what do you recommend for the future just as sort of ending concluding thoughts thank you again thanks for having me it's a real pleasure to

talk with you guys and be anytime you want me back i'll be back in a flash but uh my um my take would be was it was it each of was it abcd i would say it's all of the above. But I would say that the thing that we can do, I keep telling myself this, I tell other people who are like-minded or who are on the fence, I try to think of it, what can I do at an individual level, at the personal level? And what can I do then in addition to that at the systems level? And at the personal level, what I have to do is I have to take every single one of my patients that I see, and I have to redouble my efforts to be absolutely forthright with them about everything. And I've really found myself in some ways doing a better job taking care

of patients in one sense, and that is, hey, we really need to be on all of these pills. Let's see if we can get you off one or two of them. And the patients love that. Deprescribing as a physician and empowering them. Look, what are you doing for exercise? What are you doing for your diet? What are you doing for your healthy? I have a much more open mind about supplements. I don't necessarily say you should be on a ton of them, but I have a lot of

people, vitamin C, vitamin D, zinc. I mean, that's like water to me now. And I don't want to put people on, again, the pill burden's an issue, but I mean, those are things that I've come around to. So in some ways it's hopeful, but it's one person, one patient at a time. And I've gotten to the point when people tell me something, I just say, you know, I don't agree with that. I don't get in a fight with them. I don't get in an argument. I think you're all wet. I just don't agree with you. I don't think it makes any sense. And let them think, let them chew on that. At the systems level, I think that for me, I try to look at the things that are the priority right now. And it's hard to know because you listed them, Drew, and there's tons of them. But I think that one of the priority right now. And it's hard to know because you listed them, Drew,

and there's tons of them. But I think that one of the priorities right now as a physician is trying to do something to wake people up within our profession. That the ship is completely, the ship, you know, the house is on fire as Peter McCullough said recently. The house is on fire and we need to do something drastic. And I think that that's really, you know, we didn't get into the whole issue of the greater picture here with my

little Halloween story and stuff, but that's, that's perhaps beyond my pay grade other than to write about it and opine about it. But I think within our profession, we have to sound the alarm that look, the house truly is on fire. We got to change things dramatically. Yeah. Is that your population speculation, the population bomb article? Yes. Yeah. Well, I would encourage, thank you so much for your time. It's been really a pleasure and I'd love to have you back. In the meantime, I would absolutely encourage people to seek you out on the Brownstone Institute website. I think everything you've written, I have not only agreed with, but I think they're really brilliantly written, very approachable. And so people should go to the Brownstone Institute and read your stuff there. And then we should circle back and talk about some of these other issues. I agree with you. The house is on fire. And I've been sounding

the alarm through this COVID debacle. We've got to do something. Because again, I will say without the complicity of those in our own profession, we would not be in the situation we are in right now. The COVID pandemic response would never have played out the way it did if more people had been willing to speak out, be brave, be courageous, do what you did. And so I appreciate it and I'm thrilled to have you back anytime. Well, thank you both very much. I'm big fans of both of yours. It's great to have a chance to talk with you and get to know you. And you say the word, I'll be happy to come back. Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Baker. No doubt that will happen. And Kelly, so I think the other part for us, and actually I felt very positive with Dr. Baker's response to what I asked. Oh, I do too.

It was kind of nice to end on a positive note. But you and I need to keep talking in the meantime. Because this story continues to unfold. And it's becoming increasingly clear to people what a mess, you know, and how many mistakes were made. And there's growing awareness and something like a consensus. So I think that's our job going forward. The other thing is the thing I mentioned early on is we got, we go,

there we go. Brian O'Shea tomorrow and, uh, Pascal on 14th. Uh, and then Michelle Bachman on the 16th to talk about the world health organization treaty so cold. And,

uh, I, but I, I give, we got to give stuff back to the patient. Kelly, I was thinking about something today. I was talking to a young kid on a different program who had gotten urethritis,

which is sort of a sexually transmitted disease. And I thought, why shouldn't he have azithromycin on hand? I said, he goes, well, can I get a test? I go, did you take a test? Yeah, I took a test. Was it positive? No, it was negative. But they gave me the azithromycin anyway.

And I thought, yes, that's what they do when people have these symptoms. We need to make things like this more accessible for patients when the testing is sort of neither here nor there. And by the way, provide for the partner as well. Why shouldn't have access to these things with some supervision, a little supervision, but having things so far behind, away from the patient, we have failed. We can't watch the way we'd like to. So we need to help patients empower themselves. I really feel that's a strong solution to all the challenges that Dr. Baker brought up today. Yeah, I think that there are lots of things we need to do to fix this ship, but I think part of it is bringing back the physician autonomy, meaning to disarticulate

the relationship between the hospitals, the insurance companies, the big groups, so the physicians are free to do it. And it means not relying on an electronic medical record to tell you what the drop-down box is and what your choices are and all of those things. We need a whole reset. And there's a medical freedom movement behind it. So I think we need to keep talking about this and really rely on those people who are the warriors in the medical freedom movement. I'm very closely aligned with it. And I think it's really the only way out of this mess.

Thanks, Kelly. We'll see you next Wednesday. I believe it's three o'clock. I think that's right. Correct, everybody. I think we saw that up there. I can't remember. I think Tuesday.

I think Tuesday I'm back. And then tomorrow we'll be back in here at three o'clock with with I'm blanking on his name Brian O'Shea. So Susan will be in on that conversation. She's in this beautiful studio. She's here. In Texas. I'm getting a lot of ideas for our studio

at home. It's the SoundShed AV Solutions Studio. I don't know what I sound like. I have a little level ear mic on mine. I don't know what I sound like. I have a little level here. I hope you sound okay. We're going to wrap it up. Thank you all for being here. We'll see you tomorrow at 3 o'clock Pacific time.

Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor, and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was

published if you or someone you know is in immediate danger don't call me call 9-1-1 if you're feeling hopeless or suicidal call the national suicide prevention lifeline at 800-273-8255 you can find more of my recommended organizations and helpful resources at drdrew.com help