Ask Dr. Drew - How Did Jill Biden Get COVID-19 Again If She Had 2 Shots and 2 Boosters Of An “Effective” Vaccine? w/ Jeffrey A. Tucker & Dr. Kelly Victory – Ask Dr. Drew – Episode 260

Episode Date: September 8, 2023

How did First Lady Jill Biden test positive for COVID-19 for a second time if she already received two doses and two boosters of the vaccine? Why do so many continue to insist that the mRNA shots for COVID are both “safe & effective” when the evidence in front of them tells a different story? Jeffrey A Tucker returns with Dr. Kelly Victory to discuss the hypocrisy of people who say to “trust the science” until it disagrees with them, the constantly-moving goalposts of mRNA’s disciples, and new rumors of returning lockdowns and mask mandates. Jeffrey A. Tucker is Founder and President of the Brownstone Institute. He is also Senior Economics Columnist for Epoch Times, author of 10 books, including Liberty or Lockdown, and thousands of articles in the scholarly and popular press. He speaks widely on topics of economics, technology, social philosophy, and culture. Follow him at https://twitter.com/jeffreyatucker and https://brownstone.org/ 「 SPONSORED BY 」 Find out more about the companies that make this show possible and get special discounts on amazing products at https://drdrew.com/sponsors • COZY EARTH - Say goodbye to hot, restless nights with soft, temperature-regulating bedding from Cozy Earth. Susan and Drew love Cozy Earth's sheets made with super-soft viscose from bamboo! Use code DREW at checkout to save 40% at https://drdrew.com/cozy • GENUCEL - Using a proprietary base formulated by a pharmacist, Genucel has created skincare that can dramatically improve the appearance of facial redness and under-eye puffiness. Genucel uses clinical levels of botanical extracts in their cruelty-free, natural, made-in-the-USA line of products. Get an extra discount with promo code DREW at https://genucel.com/drew • PRIMAL LIFE - Dr. Drew recommends Primal Life's 100% natural dental products to improve your mouth. Get a sparkling smile by using natural teeth whitener without harsh chemicals. For a limited time, get 60% off at https://drdrew.com/primal • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at https://twc.health/drew • BIRCH GOLD - Don’t let your savings lose value. You can own physical gold and silver in a tax-sheltered retirement account, and Birch Gold will help you do it. Claim your free, no obligation info kit from Birch Gold at https://birchgold.com/drew 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 The CDC states that COVID-19 vaccines are safe, effective, and reduce your risk of severe illness. You should always consult your personal physician before making any decisions about your health.  「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/firstladyoflove). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. 「 ABOUT DR. DREW 」 Dr. Drew is a board-certified physician with over 35 years of national radio, NYT bestselling books, and countless TV shows bearing his name. He's known for Celebrity Rehab (VH1), Teen Mom OG (MTV), Dr. Drew After Dark (YMH), The Masked Singer (FOX), multiple hit podcasts, and the iconic Loveline radio show. Dr. Drew Pinsky received his undergraduate degree from Amherst College and his M.D. from the University of Southern California, School of Medicine. Read more at https://drdrew.com/about Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

welcome everybody uh that was uh jarring to see uh our friend speaking to us from beyond the grave uh he was he was sort of clairvoyant in a lot of ways and uh it was interesting to uh to look at consider what is uh right about what he was telling us and what might not have been a bit a bit apocryphal today hang on here i'm susan won't let me look at my computer where i'm getting to the materials for today so give me one second it is jeffrey tucker i just didn't know if you knew there was a camera i know there's a camera there there we go uh jeff has been here before we uh we're going to talk a little about the the Bidens and their COVID diagnoses and their previous vaccination status and a little vaccine therapy and what the state of the art is. He is founder and president of the Brownstone Institute, also senior economic columnist for Epoch Times.

Ten books, including Liberty or Lockdown. Many topics, economics, technology, philosophy, culture. You can follow him at JeffreyTucker.com and we will talk to him after this. Our laws as it pertained to substances are draconian and bizarre. A psychopath started this. He was an alcoholic.

Because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction, fentanyl and heroin. Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for f*** sake. Where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician.

I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. If you have trouble, you can't stop and you want help stopping, I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. I think everyone knows the next medical crisis

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As I said, you can follow Jeffrey Tucker on Twitter. Jeffrey Tucker, T-U-C-K-E-R. Jeffrey A. Tucker, I beg your pardon. Also at brownstone.org is an organization he founded. JeffreyTucker.me, I think I said dot com on the way out of that little intro. A reminder, tomorrow we are going to be early at noon. Dr. Joseph Freiman comes back with Dr. Victory, of course, and possibly Jessica Rose for a swing by as well.

We will not have a show on Thursday. Dr. Victory will be here by herself with Brian Hooker on Tuesday. There you are. And Thursday, John Phillips. Candace Owens coming in on the 19th. Pierre Corey on the 20th with Dr. Victor with us as well. Lois Lee on the 24th. 21st, rather. So we have a lot of stuff coming up. A lot of stuff. But today we are, of course, delighted to have Jeffrey Tucker back. Always something interesting for him to share with us. Please welcome Jeff

Tucker. That's nice to be here. How are you, sir? you sir good good it's a pleasure to have you i guess so the mask is raging you know i'm therefore i'm back on your show so there you go okay we have a little noisy noise yeah there's something wrong with yours a little if you just reset yeah just refresh that window jeffrey please. Refresh. It happened last time too. This has happened before. It's not a big deal. It's some technical aspect of the vMix system we use. That should be better.

How's that? Try again. Is that better? Much better. Way better. A thousand percent better. So we're all good. The Chinese are here.

So I guess I have a million questions for you. I guess an opening remark or question would be, have we learned nothing? Is people's learning curve flat? There have been so much, for instance, masking. It's obvious that mandates don't work. Yes, a single user could use it perfectly flawlessly and have some benefit absolutely uh yes the cdc recommends that after you've had for covid you might want to wear a mask for a few days afterwards not going to do very much but okay have we learned nothing else

have you learned that not is? Is that a radical statement, what I've just said? Well, I think it all depends on what you mean by the word we, because I think the members of the public have learned a lot of things. I think we don't trust anymore. The trust in government has collapsed. The trust in basically everything has collapsed, media, big tech, academia, the entire expert class. So the members of the public have learned a lot. I have to say the population resistance to everything we associate with MPIs or lockdowns is much, I would say, more intense than I expected it to be.

And I think the last week has taught me this. I feel like we're in a better place in terms of public opinion here than I would have expected. On the other hand, we are not getting any apologies from the top. They're all sticking by their story. From Fauci to Fauci's successors, the CDC and NIH and all the experts online have either gone quiet or they're doubling down on all the baloney that they've been preaching for the last three and a half years now. And it's almost as if one wonders why. Like, why not just admit one piece of it was wrong?

Well, we never should have closed schools, for example. Can't you just say that? Or, okay, forbidding travel to Europe and back was that was, that was an overreach, you know? Okay. We shouldn't have privileged the big box over the small business. That was a disaster. We shouldn't have sent out all those stimulus checks and created whatever, six, eight, $10 trillion of new money because that generated inflation.

Can't you just admit like one part of this was wrong, you know? Um, uh, but no, they, they're sticking by everything, you know, everything. Even the school closures. Well, we should have opened them up earlier than we did, but there were a lot of uncertainties. We wanted them to open up safely. So they're still defending those. And Fauci, the ever reliable Anthony Fauci, is still sticking by his story that we had to lock down. And he said this on an interview on CNN the other day, which is an interview that he thought was supposed to be friendly and an interview that was probably supposed to be friendly, but turned out it just tore his mask off.

And we can go into the explanation there. But in that interview, he once again said, well, we did the best we could with the information we had at the time, which is not true, not true. But nobody, he says, nobody doubts that we had to lock down. Then he said what he's said routinely, for God's sake, there were freezer trucks in New York because they couldn't hold all the bodies. Well, that is a canard because the freezer trucks didn't

arrive until two weeks after the lockdowns happened. And that was because all the coroner's offices were closed and the funeral homes were closed and everybody was afraid to touch the bodies because we thought we were going to get COVID. So it was the lockdowns that created the freezer trucks. And so you can't just say, well, there were freezer trucks everywhere, so we had to lock down. So that's just nonsense. So maybe that plays on the media, but that is complete gibberish. So the one thing that they will not say is that we never should have done any of this stuff. We should have treated this

as a regular respiratory virus, which is pretty much what the medical profession and the public health community was saying in the middle of February until the World Health Organization told everybody we should be more like China and the whole world changed. Well, I want to drill into that very thing. That is exactly where I wanted to go next. But before before we do i just want to shine a little light on this business of uh inability to talk about having maybe gone too long with the school closures i saw eric swalwell in an interview on cnn they're going to the other extreme he's taking the position that we are the party of opening schools and opening churches this guy's from california yeah we were going for two years people were arrested for going to church it was this was the most draconian

intrusion on civil liberties in the history of this country and he is the party of the people it's just so disgusting i i'm willing to back anthony fauci saying look i never suggested locking anything down because he really didn't suggest school lockdowns he said two weeks then two weeks and maybe maybe a little more but he he was not it was the states that really perpetrated the transgressions but i i just wanted to make that comment and then i want to talk about how the whole world went into lockdown yeah yeah we can't uh just one quick comment about the school closures, because I, more than anybody else, should be pessimistic about the social, economic, cultural consequences of lockdowns. I was warning about this from late January 2020, as you know.

But even I had not anticipated just how dreadful things have been. For example, on the school closures, there is awareness, this time last year perhaps, that children were two years behind in school. Well, the tests on reading and math were dreadful. We've lost two years, which is awful. But the adults all assumed that now we've got schools going, hey, the bells are ringing, the bushes are running, nothing's going on. The kids will become aware that they're behind and then catch up. Hey, kids are resilient, as we heard for the better part of two years.

They would catch up and, well, it's regrettable learning loss, but everybody's going to scramble and we'll get back to normal. Not only has that not happened, but the New York Times this morning on the op-ed page ran a very interesting article. The learning loss is getting worse. We're seeing cascading effects on student morale. They're not showing up. When they do show up up they don't know how to study they're on their demotivated to get better so in other words what's the right word the problems are escalating so they're not we're not getting I'm gonna be better we're getting we're getting worse actually you say how could it be other but I wouldn't have anticipated this I wouldn't have fully anticipated just how i would at least i would at least anticipate that the kids

that were in trouble you know the the very group that they claimed to want to serve most uh thoroughly those kids who are already at risk were of course going to get worse of course yeah but it's it's across the board. The demoralization, the cultural consequences of the lockdown, the shattering of the expectations and the ritual of life, that sort of liturgy of, here's what I do every day. I go to work. I go to school. I do the thing. I live a civilized life.

Once the government said, no, you don't do that. You don't have to do any of that stuff. We're going to shower you with money and just keep you home and let you sit around on Instagram for two years. That decision disrupted so much of what we took for granted about our lives. Adults, children, professionals, everybody. And now in the adult world, people are back at the office. They hate the office. They can't stand it. They're finding every possible excuse not to go in. Now businesses are having to offer one or two days remote work, and they thank God.

And it's just like nothing is going back to normal. It just isn't. And the consequences of this are being felt socially and economically. We can talk about that culturally. In every way, the world that we knew of 2019 has been shattered, and we're just not able to put it back together again in the way we expected that we would. I'll save this for a little later, but I'm wondering if you have anything prescriptive about that.

But I want to ask about the lockdowns themselves and what your theory is about how we fell into this collective delusion. I have my own timeline of significant events that I think, you know, the cascade that I've sort of put together through talking to a lot of people that by the way were silenced of course but uh who were there when some of these crazy decisions were made what's how do you put it all together

well as you know i've been working on this problem for three and a half years now and um an important piece of the puzzle at least to mind, emerged this morning with a FOIA dump of some new emails that came out to and from Fauci from late January. This is a very, very critical period. This is, again, when I was writing my first articles on the subject. Ahrens, who's, as you recall, Fauci's frequent co-author, with whom Fauci wrote that article in Cell in August 2020 saying we needed new infrastructure, human existence, keep everything shut down forever, no pet ownership, shut down the cities, no more big gatherings. You remember that article? That was the crazed piece. The one article that everything has been going wrong for 12,000 years, and that's why we have cholera and chickenpox. So if you want to get rid of an infectious disease, you have to just turn everybody back into, I don't know, foragers or something.

That was the essence of that article. It's extremely chilling. Okay, so that guy with whom Fauci co-authored the article writes Fauci on January 27th, and he says, look, I've been in very close touch with the Wuhan lab. This, and this is Warren's talking to Fauci, this lab was funded, heavily funded by EcoHealth. As you know, Dr. Fauci, EcoHealth is a very significant partner with the NIH. They're doing all sorts of, I'm paraphrasing, far-flung research, and they're pretty sure that the virus that's now swarming all over China today comes out

of this research. So we're implicated. NIH, EcoHealth, our fingerprints are all over this. This is January 27th. As a part of this memo, Marvins tells Fauci, they've tried to develop a vaccine to solve this problem. It hasn't worked, and neither have the monoclonal antibodies worked. Nothing seems to work. It just spreads and spreads, and nothing fixes this virus. Just FYI. That memo is apparently what provoked Fauci and Farrar in their first contacts. Farrar, Jeremy Farrar from the Wellcome Trust in the UK. That's when they go to burner phones.

Why are they on burner phones? Why are they having the super secure calls? Was it because they were worried about global public health? No. They were concerned about being implicated in a lab leak for a virus that was going to spread all over the world. And the whole world is going to say, down with you, Farrar, down with you, Dasik,

head of eco-health. You guys are all the bad guys. Okay, that's what is going to say, down with you, Farrar, down with you, Daszak, head of eco-health. You guys are all the bad guys. Okay, that's what they wanted to prevent, and that's why they went to burner calls. Within a week, they had produced a paper denying that there was a lab leak. They said this is of natural origin. This is the famous proximal origin paper, the first draft of which was produced on February the 4th. That paper contradicted everything that Fauci knew. I mean, he knew from his most trusted assistants that that was not true. He did it anyway. In fact, there was a debate around that paper.

What should we say? Can we really say it wasn't a lab leak? I'm not so sure. So I understand I need to refresh my page again if you don't mind yes sorry this is uh really important i want everyone to hear it but it's your mic is crackling i think it's it sounds like there's a cable issue with your usb mic or something but when you refresh then you're back there you go how's that better that sounds good again um you know where are those foia documents? Are they going to be out publicly? People will be able to read them? Yeah, they were just released. They were just released this morning. I'm sorry, I don't remember the name of the organization. Something

like Foundation for Truth and Public Knowledge, something like that. Nonpartisan. But they FOIA'd these documents in the January 27th memo. It was extremely important. And that to me is very, because I've suspected this. I've suspected that've said that we've got a number of problems with Fauci here. He was never a lockdown guy, ever. He's an infectious disease doctor. He knows that lockdowns are not going to fix an infectious disease, a respiratory virus. He knows that. The other problem is that on March 2nd, he writes Michael Gerson of the Washington Post, and Gerson's asking him, what's the point of this social distancing thing you keep talking about? Is it to wait for the vaccine? Fauci answers, it is not to wait for the vaccine. The social

distancing will drive the R-naught down lower and lower and lower to the point that SARS-CoV-2 will go away on its own. That's what he writes Michael Gilchrist. I've had a hard time making sense of this narrative. Whatever happened, it changed after the World Health Organization report of March 24th, where his other assistant went to Wuhan and got this Potemkin Village tour of how the Chinese Communist Party locked everybody, welded everybody into their homes, and that magically made the virus go away, right?

So Fauci changes his mind on 26th, suddenly promoting lockdowns and that sort of thing. But even on March 2nd, he's still saying we don't need a vaccine. Now, I think I know why he said that. It's because he got this memo from January 27th from David Morin saying that the Chinese have already tried to vaccinate against the virus and they've had no success whatsoever. So I don't think Fauci really believed this vaccine would work. So why did he change his mind on lockdowns? Panic.

This is, well, there's panic. It's also possible that Fauci was desperate to figure out some way to keep this from spreading further and further and further and further and devouring the whole world. And he did not have any other way except he did have coverage for something like lockdowns because CCP was already doing it and then Italy was was futzing with that stuff in northern Italy is like okay well that there's probably no hope I'm going to stop this but if there is a hope this is the way I'm going to do it right the problem with the lockdown all along along was that he he didn't have an exit strategy. So you locked down and then what?

Because it's just not true. You can somehow magically drive the R0 down to, you know, to one and then to zero and then poof, SARS-CoV-2 is gone. That's ridiculous. Every in the microbial kingdom viruses are forever. So as we approach late summer, we still don't have a now he's warmed up to the idea of a vaccine. And also, this crossed very well into his mRNA celebration from his AIDS days. He was like, okay, I'll do your vaccine.

Even if it's minimally effective, that's better than nothing. His co-author, Morins, comes to him in late July and says, look, I have an idea for how we can... Let's forget about this idea of getting rid of SARS-CoV-2. Probably that's never going to happen. Why don't we just pitch lockdowns as a new mode of social organization? Let's just keep them forever. It was during that period that Fauci says, I'll never shake hands with another person again. Everything's going to be changed forever. We'll never be the same. So by that fall, Fauci was trying to codify the lockdowns as our new social system. That way, releasing him from the obligation to find a rational scientific exit strategy

from what he had done. That's, anyway, you asked my view. That is my current understanding of what happened. Here's what we're going to do. We're going to take a little break. Jeffrey Tucker, of course, is with us, brownstone.org. You can follow take a little break uh jeffrey tucker of course with us brownstone.org uh you can follow him his website jeffrey a tucker dot me is that correct jeffrey did i get that correct yeah i mean i don't even look at that website so brownstone.org is is i think and also i write for epoch times every day yeah epic time thank you there you go we're gonna

take a little break and we come back kelly victory joins us she's got a ton of other questions to ask you this has been very interesting be right back fall is right around the corner which means dry flaky red skin from allergy season is coming with it but the best way to take care of your skin is with our skincare secret genucell you don't need to worry about that puffy tired eye look or those annoying dark spots or even dry flaky skin because GenuCell skincare has you covered. Susan and I love our GenuCell products so much. We want you to try our personally curated skincare bundles. It's risk-free at GenuCell.com slash Drew. GenuCell works so well. You can see the results in this unplanned live moment on our show when the Redness Repair Cream repaired my skin in just minutes right before your eyes their

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If this episode ends here, the rest of the show is available at drdrew.tv. There's nothing in medicine that doesn't boil down to a risk benefit calculation. It is the mandate public health to consider the impact of any particular mitigation scheme on the entire population. This is uncharted territory, Drew. And Dr. Victor, I'm sure you were as fascinated by the new FOIA documents as I was and what Jeffrey was saying. So pick it up from here. Absolutely. I want to welcome back Jeffrey. So pick it up from here. Absolutely. I want to welcome back, Jeffrey. So happy to have you here with us. I want to get into this brilliant piece you wrote just recently about specifically those people who are better able or better prepared to resist

all of the crap that's gone on for the past three and a half years. But before I do that, I want to pick back up where you and Drew were talking. I have long said with regard to Fauci that he's sort of been stuck in this Macbethian obsession, you know, out damn spot, trying desperately to get the blood off of his hands. And we've had other, you know, irrefutable evidence,futable evidence of his involvement. We know that he lied about gain of function. We have documents where he coached Ralph Baric at the University of North Carolina to continue with gain of function research, even though it was on a moratorium and things of that sort. So I guess my question to you to conclude your conversation with Drew, and this is an

opinion, do you think that these additional FOIA documents, now that with this other bombshell, now that he's trying to distance himself from their involvement with the actual development of this virus, do you think any of this will make, fundamentally make a difference? Is there a smoking gun

that would convince the american people of what truly happened nope we lost your fat sound jeffrey try one more time here it's been a day for uh sound technicalities caleb can can coach you through whatever's, there we go. How about now? Better? There we go.

There we are, we got you back. So there have been two narratives that have been toggling back and forth all along. One is the natural origin and the other is the lab leak. And I think the reason for that is that both these stories are essential. So Fauci was trying to pitch this pangolin, you know,

the Chinese have weird diets story for a very long time. That was for the public. But the problem is when they went to convince Trump to get behind the lockdowns, which took some doing, as you can imagine, they told him that it was a bioweapon manufactured in China in retaliation for his tariff wars. And that he, Trump, can be as great as Xi Jinping and lockdown. I mean, Xi Jinping defeated the virus with lockdowns. Trump's at least as good as that guy. And so he should do the same thing and beat him at his own game. I'm pretty sure how they got Trump to go along with it. You have two lines. On one hand, you have the military intelligence, intelligence community pushing the idea of the lab leak and that they believed it was a bioweapon.

On the other hand, they never wanted to tell the public that because Fauci wanted everybody to believe it was a natural origin. So this is all just propaganda. And I'm pretty sure we're very close to being able to prove this. I mean, there's ever more evidence that at least Fauci was far more convinced of the idea of a lab leak than he ever let on. But I think the people, the rulers of the public mind here, want both these stories to be forever in our minds.

Like, was it a lab leak? Was it not? Because both tales serve a particular propagandistic purpose. One, to justify why the Trump administration locked down and destroyed what he believed to be his greatest achievement, which is a thriving U.S. economy. They convinced him to do that on grounds that it was a lab leak and likely by a weapon. I mean, I promise you, Trump never imagined the U.S. taxpayers were behind it, right? So he didn't know were behind it, right? He didn't know that. Right, right.

But they did tell him that the bad guys have released a bioweapon. Most likely, they told him that they did it at the military Olympics in October of 2019 and told him it had been circulating now for six months. The best way to stop it would be to do what he did to Europe and the UK, what he did to China in January, which is to block all travel. And that's when everything just kind of fell apart. And the Trump administration essentially outsourced all of its governance of America to the CDC and NIH.

And then it was just out of control from then on. And then that's when the mail-in ballots came about. And you have the insurance to feed and so on. Then that's when the mail-in ballots came about and. Is the truth coming up? One of the problems we face is that very few people are even doing this research. As you know, I obsess about this and I'm sorry if I sound a little maybe more knowledgeable than I should be. But it's because of the failure of the national media

to really look into all this kind of stuff. That's why Brownstone does this work. That's why you do your work. I mean, we have to do this. And I think we're having real progress. I have evidence of this. I'm not sure that lockdowns 2.0 are going to get anywhere in this environment. I think we've really got them on the ropes this time. Well, from your lips to God's ears on that. I am obsessed as my middle name,

frankly, with regard to this. So I appreciate what you're doing because I think we've got to keep getting it out there in hopes that people will ultimately be, frankly, where it's simply not possible for people to avoid the truth. Then before I get into this article I was referencing, the other thing I want to follow up on is your conversation with Drew at the very beginning with regard to the fact that Fauci and others are unwilling to acknowledge their errors. I would take it one step further. I have been stunned at the hubris with which they not only will not acknowledge their errors, they deny that they said things.

We've got just three quick examples. In New Zealand, we've got officials saying, we never mandated vaccines. People made their own choices. Okay. We never suggest, okay. The FDA coming out and saying, we never told doctors they couldn't prescribe ivermectin. We never said that. It is absolutely stunning. You know, particularly to those of us who had our licenses threatened over and over and over again, uh, people lost their jobs, lost their board certification, lost their credentials at hospitals, but the FDA is saying, we never said that. And Anthony Fauci coming out and saying that he never promoted school lockdowns or never told anybody to close

schools or to lock things down. When, with all due respect, Drew, Anthony Fauci came out and not only suggested that, but criticized Florida, criticized Ron DeSantis for opening schools back up. Yet these people, do they not know that we actually have videotape of them on camera saying these things? It's horrible. Absolutely. It's unbelievable. So they just come out and deny it. Well, and another thing Fauci said in this remarkable Smirconish interview on CNN two days ago, he said, let's be clear, the CDC can only make recommendations. They don't mandate anything. Well, I am pretty sure that every time I got on a bus or a train or a plane for a year, I got screamed at and threatened to be thrown off the plane or whatever for not having the mask above my nose. Remember those days? That was a direct edict from the CDC, and they enforced it. It got so bad that there had to be a lawsuit that was

finally decided against the CDC and the Fifth Circuit of Florida against all these mask mandates. No, the CDC cannot legislate like that. Not only that, it was the CDC that enforced the rental moratorium. You have a rental property and you've got a renter and you rely on that for your income. The government, CDC, is saying you cannot evict the guy if he doesn't pay you rent. All right. And why did they do this? Because they said, well, you know, if we have people being evicted from their apartments and stuff, they'll go around the streets carrying COVID and they'll spread the disease. We can't have that. So that's how they justified the rental moratorium. And the Supreme Court ruled against that. So the CDC definitely had edicts. And you can look it up.

Why was there plexiglass everywhere? The CDC recommended it. Why were we dousing ourselves with hand sanitizer? The CDC recommended it. But they weren't just recommendations. They were hardcore enforcements, including domestic. We have to say these things on your show because everybody's going to forget. Domestic capacity restrictions. So, you could not have more than 10 people in your house.

You know, so much for whatever. What is that line here? The idea that my house is my castle, right? Forget that. You know, we couldn't have weddings, funerals. And the states were enforcing travel restrictions. So, if you came from New York and drove to Massachusetts and you had your location services, don't you love that euphemism, location services? They don't call it surveillance. If you had your location services running, you would get a call from the sheriff saying, you have to be there two weeks to quarantine before you get back.

So this was going on. So now Fauci's over there on CNN saying, the CDC doesn't mandate anything. They can only make recommendations. That is just completely untrue. And we had we had cities right in this well, and we had a comment about the school closure thing. The reason I was saying that he

didn't recommend school closures, I was on a nightly local news broadcast. When they lock the schools down, the school board member came into our, our program program and i was yelling at the guy i was saying who told you to do this why are you doing it did the cdc did dr fauci did you bring an infectious disease consultant in the answer was no no and no we just think it's the right thing to do the school board a bunch of lay people, made the decision. But it's even more interesting to me that you're right. Fauci later was all focusing on opening schools, which is now a function of the teachers union. So he was adulterated by that, perhaps, on the other side.

And that's why he stuck to the end. By the way, they opened too quickly in Florida. You couldn't possibly co-sign what Florida did. That's right. The reopening plans were always filled with all these stipulations. All the kids have to be masks. You have to make provisions to have them distanced, you know, in the classroom. So sitting, you know, six feet apart,

which means you have to have more teachers and more classrooms and you can't let them play together at the playgrounds. And you have to equip your school with all these ventilations. If you do all those things, sure, you can open your schools. Oh, and the sooner, the better. Just make sure that you do it safely. So it was this do it safely thing that delayed us for a year or two. And that goes for the openings also. It's the same sort of thing. I mean, Trump was desperate to open up by, I would say, by June, right? And they came to him, his son-in-law comes to him and says, well, Mr. President, we want to open up too. But you know, the important thing is you have to open up safely. You don't want to just open, you know, what is it, like freedom and rights? No, no. We're way beyond that. We have to open safely. So we're working on a reopening plan. And these reopening plans were really convoluted. It's like you had to go

through a fortnight with declining cases, which means you need universal testing. And if those declining cases reverse themselves, well, you had to lock down again, right? So you had to satisfy all these conditions. And so that was the White House's reopening, great reopening plans. It was basically, what do they call it in Australia? Snap lockdowns, right? We would have had snap lockdowns for years. We'd still have them today if that reopening plan had gone through. So in the name of reopening, they were actually plotting the perpetual lockdowns. One of the problems that I see is that the average American doesn't understand what the role and what the purview is of organizations like the CDC and the FDA, because all it takes then is for a public health

expert or an administrator to come out there and says, well, the FDA says, and the average American interprets that to believe that the FDA has that legislative authority. And it took a court just this past week, took the court this week to come out and say the FDA is not a physician. You cannot, the FDA has no right to tell physicians what they can and can't prescribe. Only physicians and people with FDA licenses can prescribe, and that doesn't include the FDA themselves. But this is the average American was led to believe that the CDC and the FDA and the NIH somehow create laws or legislate or control what physicians are allowed to do. It was really a big problem.

It was the weirdest thing about the American lockdowns because, unlike, say, China, they were, I would say, largely just took the form of threatening-style injunctions. But we never really knew who was enforcing them, what were the penalties for noncompliance. Were the police going to come get me? Do I have to pay a fine? Right. Are these just things you think I should do? Like washing my hands more often? I mean, clearly that's up to me.

You're telling me I should wash my hands more often. But you're also telling me I can't go to the restaurants, can't go to the bars, I have to keep the schools closed, I can't celebrate Thanksgiving. Which one of these, and I can't take it, I've enacted, which one of these is actually law and which one is just nudge versus just an exhortation?

We just didn't know. It was very confusing for me, I remember, at the time, wondering because they divided the entire workforce between essential and nonessential. And sending out these PDFs all over the country, you're grabbing the printer and reading it to find out if you're an essential worker or not. But then you wonder, well, I'm not essential, clearly. What if I just go to work? Am I violating the law? Am I going to get sued? Am I going to go to jail? Right. Also, whose interpretation is this?

One of the categories of essential was media. Well, let's say I have a podcast or I've got a Twitter account. Does that make me media? Maybe I can define myself as essential. So is it up to me? Who's in charge around here? We didn't really know. I'm not even sure we even know now, actually.

No, that's the power of the brown shirts. It's taking all of the citizens and deputizing them to be the little Karens and run around and report you and say, Jeffrey's having a barbecue this weekend and there were 14 people there. But another thing you just said, again, before I get to your brilliant article, you just mentioned the phrase universal testing. One of my absolute, so here we are now, September of 2023, and Jill Biden, who's been, you know, vaxxed up one side and down the other, I think she's four shots in, if we are to believe them, has, quote, has tested positive for COVID again. And she has very mild symptoms, we're told. So here's the question.

You wake up tomorrow with a stuffy nose or a little scratchy throat or you sneeze twice this afternoon. What in the world compels you to shove a Q-tip up your nose and question whether or not you have COVID? Who cares? And what in the world would you do differently if you found out that you had COVID versus you didn't? Why are people... I mean, this is just fuel, as far as I can see, for what is coming in the fall here. Right. And it also could be part of a big sales pitch, not only for Paxlovid, which is still, to this day, the only thing they really recommend. Take Paxlovid. That way, you can pretend to get well for a week until you get it again. Until you get it again, right. But also you know that Moderna has a huge –

Moderna and Pfizer have a huge advertising blitz right now, paying billions of dollars in advertising fees to the U.S. Open, which they also sponsor, to push vaccine advertising on the public. But they don't put it as vaccine advertising. They've got these new ads that look like public service ads. COVID's going to kill you. Many people are in the hospital today with COVID. It's far more likely to kill you than flu. It's terrible. It's still all with us. It's awful. What can you do? Well, you can get the vaccine, and it's coming up here in two weeks.

We're seeing this ramping up. And by the way, that one ad, I've watched the US Open. It comes on like, I don't know, every 10 minutes. And about the third time I thought, well, who is putting out this weird ad? Is this the CDC? Is NIH or NPR? I couldn't tell. Well, you look at it really carefully and right at the very end in tiny print, Moderna. So they're exempt from all the normal pharmaceutical ad stuff, right? When you put out an ad of, you know, get my foot cream, it's like, well, it may cause cramps and it could make your skin fall off. And, you know, they have all this stuff. But Moderna is exempt from all this stuff.

Because for one thing, they're not advertising a particular product. They're just saying, oh, get vaccinated. And there's 50% chance you're going to get their vaccine as opposed to their competitors, but Pfizer. So that's all good for them. But apparently under the EUA, you would know more about this than I would. But apparently you're exempted

from all the usual regulations concerning pharmaceutical ads on TV. Absolutely. That's one of the remarkable things about the emergency use authorization. Not only do you have blanket immunity against any ill effects, so you cannot be sued in perpetuity for any ill effects, but you also, frankly, don't have to abide by any of the normal regulations with regard to advertising. So you have to spend no money on advertising.

You have to spend no money on legal defense or having liability protection. So all the money you make in the vaccine just goes to the bottom line. It's really remarkable. And then if you call it a problem, you're completely indemnified against the harms associated with it. Absolutely. So I assume that this Jill Biden thing, why are we hearing about her, that she has a runny nose, you know, three and a half years later, why are we hearing this? It must just be to keep COVID fears alive in the public. Yeah, that's, that's my, that's my theory anyway. Yeah, no, I think so too. So now finally, on to the you, you penned what I really believe was a

brilliant piece just recently, specifically about what groups of people seemed to be more resistant or able to resist all of this craziness, people who are more immune to everything from the fear to buying into all of the ridiculous mitigation schemes. And you based it really, your premise was that it was people who had a profound or solid sort of foundation in religion. So I want you to talk a little bit about that theory. I've been curious about this for a very long time from, you know, from the very first days when I heard that the Amish never locked down,

for example. Okay. So the Amish continue to go to church. There's no difference between the church and the community. It's all just one thing. They live their religion. It is their whole life. And you can't tell them to close public spaces

or close their private spaces, since it's a fundamental attack on their whole way of life. So they just ignored the whole thing. We knew this pretty early on. I thought that was intriguing. And then the ultra-Orthodox in Brooklyn and Bronx and elsewhere continued out the weddings and funerals and got attacked by the mayor and the governor for doing it. And so that was clear. Well, I remembered,

I drove south from New England to Texas in the spring of 2021. And I noticed that the deeper I got into the south, the more religious people were and the more things seemed open, much more open. And the more religious radio stations were on the radio, the less you could find pop music, the more preachers you heard, and the fewer the masks. And I thought, well, this is really interesting. So the more sort of religious you are, the more you're paying attention to the actual data and you're aware of the relative threat of this disease and you're aware that you should just

continue on with your life. And I thought that was really interesting because we've been told for hundreds of years that there's some sort of dichotomy. If you're really religious, then you're ignoring the science, but if you're super secular, then you're adhering to the science. In this case, we saw exactly the opposite happening. The people that really wanted to keep their religious communities together were reading the actual science that was coming out and learning about natural immunity, incorporating the knowledge from past pandemics. They knew what happened in 1929 and 1918 and 1942 with polio. They knew what happened in 1956 and then 1968. And they became very aware of the history of pandemics and the absurdity of lockdowns at a very time in which the secular science masters of our age were preaching a bunch

of superstitious myths about masking and sanitation and wiping down your groceries and your mail, right? So it was exactly the opposite of what you would have thought. And I was just really intrigued about this. And I think it has something, well, I don't know. I've gone through a lot of theories in my mind. So I'm just really, the point of the article is just to recognize this empirical reality.

And part of the inspiration for the piece was that I think you mentioned that you were, you were raised Catholic. There are some, many, many bishops in this country close their parishes, which I think they owe all their parishioners an apology, but there were many parishes that never closed down, and they tended to be the really hardcore believing parishes, the people that are still practicing the Latin Mass, for example,

or they're really dedicated to an Orthodox style of faith with frequent confession. You know, actual believing Catholics never shut down their parishes, and it was just the mainstream that kind of went along with the Valtteri religion. I think that's just really intriguing. It's fascinating how it disturbs that traditional view we've had about the conflict between reason and faith. It turns out, in this case, faith was a better path to reason than the secular science. Yeah, and I thought it was a really insightful piece. And what I would add to that, Jeffrey, because I jettisoned my Catholic upbringing because I think that many of the denominational religions, the denominational

Christians in particular, fell into the traps because they aren't really based in true faith and true belief and certainly not in the Bible. I think that really what was very protective was those people who have profound belief and profound knowledge of the Bible look at it and said, this isn't scary at all. This is the book of Revelations. I'm not one bit worried about this. I'm not one way that I've read all this. I know this was God's plan all along, and I will be fine. I am not worried about myself. So I think that the fundamentalists and the Bible lists and the truly Orthodox Jews and the Amish were the ones who said, it's nothing but a thing. And I know this is right. This is biblical. This is exactly how

it was intended to be. And we will be fine. And therefore we will just continue on our way, living the path. And God will, this is God's plan. And I think, you know, remarkably, it ended up being very much a protective for them because they are the communities that did not largely get vaccinated. They did not shut down. They didn't close their schools. They didn't stop worshiping. They continued to get together with friends and relatives and celebrate weddings and birthdays

and go to funerals. And I think those are the things that were ultimately protective, despite the fact that those are the groups that, as you rightly point out, are most commonly painted as the non-scientific, those people who believe in the mystical. There's a feature, too, of the COVID response that, for many people, gave their lives a sense of meaning and purpose that they didn't have before. It's like, oh, now there's something i can really do i can throw myself into it i can rat out my neighbor i can be really scrupulous about wearing this mask

and i have a reason now to live you know whereas really religious people already have a reason to they didn't need all this but jeff jeffrey jeffrey isn't that phenomenon really just the, I'm going to try to frame this in a way that makes sense and is accurate. The manifestations of the phenomenology that they were presenting in this meaning making was precisely the phenomen function of religion to make meaning and to deal with the inevitable tragedies of life which kelly pointed out and able to manage that and even more importantly what i've been noticing lately in the whole cancel world and the cesspool of social media religion contained um let's see let's say not the angels of our nature but the opposite the the worst angels of our nature like envy and envy is ruling the world right now envy is alive and well envy and aggression and narcissistic rage and without religion and back to kelly's notion of watching the bible the

bible tells you what happens that That's exactly what happens. These other things fill in that have the same phenomenological structure as religion because humans seem like homo-religiosity, homo-religion, really, and it's our own little way. And those things are not structured in a way to make humanity better. They make things worse.

Yeah, it's unmitigated. Is that a lot? This is the problem after uh after the covid thing hit and everybody had this new purpose for existence you're right people became astonishingly mean there was a a change in the public culture uh towards they were going after sinners they were going after the thean, the dirty, the sinners. And that's that impulse. Same thing filled in that had its own sort of, you know, has a long history of being used for good. And what we do on our own, we use the same impulse for not good.

The level of cruelty was astounding. The segregation of our cities by vaccinated, unvaccinated was something I can never entirely shake off, especially when you look at the disparate impact in terms of race. I cannot believe this country tolerated that. It's just, it's mind boggling just how cruel we were. We really did bar a vast number of city residents from libraries, from restaurants, from bars, from theaters. And this went on for months and months and months with not any complaint from The New York Times. It's amazing. No, and we fractionated families, entire families,

entire social structures, groups of friends who had been friends for decades who now no longer speak. And so when you talk about things that aren't going back to the way they were before, things that aren't going back, whether it's using actual paper menus at the restaurant or being able to do the things that we did pre-COVID, all of these silly things, rituals that have been put in place. I don't know how we have cloven society in two, really, because where you stood on the issues around the pandemic really put you in a certain camp. I don't know how we undo that. And that's so part of my interest in getting people to acknowledge that they were wrong.

There is no forgiveness without contrition. And so people have got to say, I was wrong. What I did was wrong. I should never have discriminated against you. I am sorry that I did that. I'm sorry you were disinvited from Thanksgiving because you weren't vaccinated, or I'm sorry that I wasn't willing to get together with you. I truly think this is the biggest issue that we face right now as a society.

I'm glad to hear you say that because I completely agree with you. And sometimes I feel like I'm crazy. But when you talk to people in private, when you get their trust and you open up about the last three and a half years, almost everybody has a tragic story in their lives. Children from whom they're estranged. Marriage is shattered. Job loss. marriage is shattered, job loss, vicious arguments with colleagues, the breakup of bowling clubs and bridge clubs and bands. And it's just there's so much pain out there. And it makes me crazy that we're not really talking about it.

I mean, we can't just move on and pretend like this never happened. It's not going to work. And nor can we pretend as if we were making the best decisions we had at the time we had, like Fauci keeps saying. Or as many other people just pretend like nothing ever happened at all. No. All social functioning and all social ritual and liturgy and all freedoms and normal expectations of human rights, even the right to invite people to your house, we did this in the name of controlling a microbial kingdom that we really could not control. We did it in the name of putting politicians in charge of a virus, and it just didn't work. It just didn't work.

So we need honesty and truth. Contrition would be great, but just open discussion instead of this strange blackout that we have. It's very odd for me because I founded Brownstone in the spring of 21, and people said to me at the time, well, Brownstone seems to be founded mostly about the COVID response, but that's over. What are you guys going to do after that? And my thought at the time was the 21st century can be divided so far into two parts, before COVID and after COVID. I mean, we're so much suffering from those decisions made in those catastrophic two years. And we still are. Yes. I think the challenge of repairing society following what happened in the pandemic is a far

greater challenge than anything having to do with a silly virus that impacted us for a few years. I think this is the real challenge is how do we get beyond this? So I think the Brownstone Institute has lots of good work to be done because it's going to be an uphill battle. Drew, what are the topics I didn't bring up here today? We were talking before we came on air about a number of different things. So what have i failed to bring up i think we sort of ran the cycle here i think we got uh i mean if we launch into too much more here we will quickly run out of time i i i think it's very interesting and we all are just

in agreement and astonishment about this let me ask this one question so the American history is dotted with great awakenings do you think we are in for something like that not necessarily the form of those you know essentially traveling circuses that many at least one incarnation of great awakening was but is there a sense that people are going to find some sort of spiritual life again uh in uh or have they come to this on their own we have to or else we're going to uh forever languish in and growing amounts of despair like i mentioned earlier about the kids you can't just turn off the function of society and turn it back on again and expect everything to go back to normal people are shattered in so many ways you see it in the ill health,

the substance abuse, which is unbelievable, just the depression. And you know this from your own lives. I mean, you know people that are just still tremendously traumatized from it. We predicted it. Kelly and I just saw the train coming. We were talking about it before it arrived, that it was was inevitable there was just no way it's actually worse particularly

the age groups it's far worse than I really expected the only thing I would say um is something that Smirconish actually said on his radio show that I thought was really interesting I I'm actually getting optimistic that at least people are starting to clue in to what went wrong and are determined to resist it. You know this hashtag, do not comply. So what percentage of us hold these views? And last week I was saying maybe it's 10%, maybe it's 20%. But Samir Khan has said something interesting on his podcast. He said, because, you know, when he confronted Fauci with that question, it was not supposed to be a hustle.

He was waiting for Fauci to answer the question of the Cochrane Review on masks. It was supposed to be a softball. He didn't expect that. He thought he would respond with just gibberish. He texted him later and apologized to him, which is funny. Fauci apparently wrote him back and he would not share Fauci's response with the audience because he didn't have permission, which I don't know how. He's a reporter. Tell us what he said. Anyway, he said something interesting on his podcast. He said, of his listeners, who I assume are the CNN crowd, of his listeners, he thinks that 25% are absolutely passionately opposed to ever locking down or anything remotely like any NPIs or anything like masks or travel restrictions or anything.

They're going to resist. And what he said about that is that this is an informed crowd. These people know the literature. They have all the arguments in place. They feel a tremendous amount of passion. They're totally dedicated to this. They will not let their churches close. They will not allow their kids to be masked. And he said in his experience that when you have a totally dedicated, passionate, and informed 25%, their will carries the day. He said, that's what I'm seeing right

now. He said, they can never be- I've heard that number before. Yeah. He said that if the ruling class is planning to lock down again, they've got some bad news coming because the anti-lockdown forces, the people that are informed, are really informed, and they're really passionate, and they're not going to let freedom and rights be taken away again. They're going to restore their own health. They're going to restore their families.

They're going to restore their communities. So I think you're right, Dr. Drew. Will this give us a new sort of fire? It certainly has given me that. I mean, I was coasting for years. I thought everything just kind of ran automatically, right? Hey, well, we're free. We got a constitution. What am I complaining about? I used to write articles about chicken salad and whatever. I hear a laugh. True. I would write about anything. But now I feel it, right? I

feel a tremendous fire. I realized something really important. The world that we love needs us to protect it and champion it and to guard it and to defend it and sustain it and bring it back and make it real and make it permanent like that's our job we all have a job i did not know that until uh the lockdowns happened so so i think a lot of people feel similarly amen brother yeah i agree with you second to the choir yeah you know i was i was telling kelly the words like you know bravery and courage and freedom. Those are not words I was thinking about five years ago, four years ago. Now, all of a sudden, they're emerging from my mouth constantly.

All right, guys. Jeffrey, it was great seeing you. Tell people, you want to maybe preview anything, any articles you have coming that they can look forward to? Oh, God. You know, every day we run stuff. And I've always got like about five articles lined up. And, you know, I have a guy I work with, and I let him surprise me every day. But we're doing ever more research and revelations on the early days of the lockdown period, which everybody's forgotten

about it, but I think it's really important to deconstruct these months. We have many, many articles coming out on that subject. You can go to BrowseTerm.org. Put those four out. Yeah. And I strongly suggest that people subscribe to our email. I only send one a week, and I send it myself. And I always write a personal note. But that's where we list all the things we publish for the week. And so it's very light touch. But getting on the email list is important because because I, you know, that we, you know, that's something we can own and that's the way we stay in contact with you. And then these times with third party cancellations all the time and everything gets extremely important.

Yeah. All right. I'm gonna do it right now. Okay, guys. Thank you very much. Yeah. Great to see you again. Hopefully you'll come back very soon. Kelly, I'll see you tomorrow at noon Pacific for Freeman and Jessica Rose. She's now for sure. Sounds great. Yep. And Brian Hooker on Tuesday.

No show on Thursday. John Phillips on the 13th. Candice Owens on the 19th. Pierre Corey coming back around. And Dr. Lois Lee. So we'll see you all tomorrow at noontime. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment.

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