Ask Dr. Drew - Moms ARRESTED For Lockdown Protests: Michelle Efendi, Denise Aguilar & Tara Thornton Allege Government Harassment For Resisting COVID-19 Vaccine Mandates – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 302

Episode Date: December 27, 2023

Three moms – Michelle Efendi, Denise Aguilar & Tara Thornton – were arrested after protesting against COVID-19 lockdowns and vaccine mandates. Though the COVID vaccination policy ended in March 2022, they allege an ongoing campaign of harassment against their families and tyrannical persecution by government officials. Michelle Efendi is the mother of four kids and lives in Boston, MA, where she says she was surveilled, tracked, targeted, arrested, and physically harassed by local government officials after peacefully protesting mask and vaccine mandates. Follow her at https://x.com/EfendiMichelle Denise Aguilar & Tara Thornton are civil rights activists and cofounders of Freedom Angels. They were arrested in 2020 after protesting against California mask mandates – even though the arresting officers themselves were unmasked. Denise is currently running for State Assembly D13 . Follow them at https://x.com/FreedomAngels2 「 SPONSORED BY 」 Find out more about the companies that make this show possible and get special discounts on amazing products at https://drdrew.com/sponsors • GENUCEL - Using a proprietary base formulated by a pharmacist, Genucel has created skincare that can dramatically improve the appearance of facial redness and under-eye puffiness. Genucel uses clinical levels of botanical extracts in their cruelty-free, natural, made-in-the-USA line of products. Get an extra discount with promo code DREW at https://genucel.com/drew • COZY EARTH - Trying to think of the right present for someone special? Susan and Drew love Cozy Earth's sheets & clothing made with super-soft viscose from bamboo! Use code DREW to save up to 40% at https://drdrew.com/cozy • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at https://twc.health/drew 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 The CDC states that COVID-19 vaccines are safe, effective, and reduce your risk of severe illness. You should always consult your personal physician before making any decisions about your health.  「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/firstladyoflove). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. 「 ABOUT DR. DREW 」 Dr. Drew is a board-certified physician with over 35 years of national radio, NYT bestselling books, and countless TV shows bearing his name. He's known for Celebrity Rehab (VH1), Teen Mom OG (MTV), The Masked Singer (FOX), multiple hit podcasts, and the iconic Loveline radio show. Dr. Drew Pinsky received his undergraduate degree from Amherst College and his M.D. from the University of Southern California, School of Medicine. Read more at https://drdrew.com/about Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today we're gonna get a bit into some of the excesses of the COVID days. I have three moms arrested, surveyed, manhandled, targeted, physically harassed. We're gonna get into all of that with these three women who were really out there trying to advocate for their rights and privileges and not just themselves but their children. Denise and Tara have freedom angels. They were arrested in 2020 after protesting against mask mandates. Michelle Effendi, she's a mother of four,

lives in the New England area, lives in Boston. And she alleges that she was peacefully protesting mask and mandates, vaccine mandates. You can follow her on Twitter, Effendi Michelle, E-F-E-N-D-I, Michelle with L-L-E. And the Freedom Angels are also on X, Freedom Angels 2. So we'll get to them after this. Our laws as it pertained to substances are draconian and bizarre. The psychopath started this. He was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction, fentanyl and heroin.

Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for f***'s sake. Where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time.

Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. If you have trouble, you can't stop, and you want to help stop it, I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. Ladies and gentlemen, it is the holiday season, and our friends at GenuCell Skin Care want to give you the gift of younger-looking skin with their best sale of the year. For the first time ever, get over 60% off our favorite skincare bundles at GenuCell.com. GenuCell has so many products that Susan and I love. GenuCell's XV Moisturizer. It locks in moisture, making dry spots a thing of the past. It's especially great with the colder weather coming in. And with its immediate effects, too, you can

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We'll have sort of a little levity. Jiayun Summers and Brad Williams. Jiayun will be in the room here with me, which is interesting. Next week, Dr. Li Mengyan, we'll get an update from her. Emily Kaplan, you'll be very interested in her skepticism about a lot of things in the medical system. Sean Baker, Brian Kilmeade on the third, Jim Brewer on the fourth, Roseanne coming in on the 10th, and Dr. Paul Alexander on the 11th. Our crack producer and booker, Emily Barsh, has been hard at work.

Today is no exception. Like I said, we have two guests after the break, which is Denise Aguilar and Tara Thornton, which I'll get to them in a second. But first, let me welcome Michelle LaFendi, who has a hair-raising story from New England. Michelle, thanks for

joining us. Thank you so much, Dr. Drew. What happened? Give us the story. Well, I first want to say, unfortunately, the COVID days are not behind us. I know in your intro, you said that this was something, you alluded to it to being of the past. Unfortunately, this is still very much a part of my present. I was arrested 659 days ago, and until now, the charges still have not been dismissed. There's a shorter story, and there's also a longer story. I'll start with the short story. I had peacefully gone to the Massachusetts State House where I formerly lived. Right now I live in Florida. I do not live in Massachusetts right now, but I lived in

Massachusetts my entire life up until a year ago. So I was living in Massachusetts, of course, and I went to the State House. They had finally opened. It was the last state house in the country to open. And that was on March 1st, 2022. This was not a 2020 event. I wish I realized what was going on in 2020, but I was a lefty. I thought that I believed my government. I thought that COVID was real. I participated in all the things. But in 2022, I went to the Massachusetts State House and I asked to peacefully enter because I wanted to meet my elected officials. No one was answering the phone. No one was answering emails. No one was responding to the concerns that I had. And instead of allowing me to enter the public building, I was thrown to the ground and arrested. So I was bruised, battered, and I was charged with disorderly conduct, trespassing, and assault. They charged me with assault. They charged me with assault. So hold on.

Do we, Caleb, do we have video of some of this? Is that what Michelle brought us? Yes, I believe this is the video. Let's see. This is, I believe this is it. Is this the right one? Well, this is the. Was that the correct one? There's a lot of video from that day. And, you know, the interesting part of that video is that they ended up bringing

me into the building i had to be cuffed but they brought me into the building so they wouldn't let me into the building when i wanted to walk inside peacefully but then they brought me into the building when i was handcuffed so i mean i don't I don't- Did you get this? No, I didn't. What was the allegation? What was the reason they wouldn't let you into the building? What was their reason? Because I could not or would not show proof of vaccination. Had you been vaccinated?

No, I was not vaccinated. Had you had COVID at that point? I had lost my sense of smell like one time a few months beforehand, you know, but until then, I, you know, it was already in 2022. By then, it was really clear to a lot of the people around me and And I imagine to you also that we're moving past this and the emergency was no longer the big bad COVID. The emergency was the government that was now continuing to say the control. Because coincidentally, and I do really appreciate you allowing me to be on this incredible platform, especially with the guests that you have. Thank you.

Thank you so much, sir. Today happens to be the two-year anniversary that the mayor of Boston, Michelle Wu, announced that there would be Vax Passport system in Boston. I think it's kismet that you allowed me to be on the show today. So she had announced Vax Passports on December 20th, 2021. And the system did not go into place until January 15th, which was some weeks later, which happens to be Martin Luther King's birthday, which was just a sick, twisted irony. And I was so terrified that my husband was going to be forced vaccinated to keep his job that I began protesting at that point. And I saw other people were protesting as well.

So I began to collaborate with them. And by collaborate, I mean sometimes I would protest on the street with a sign. Is this some of the, this is, this looks like you're trying to get into the, go ahead. This is the initial time when they had refused us. I'll let it speak for itself. Excuse me, you're not able to go over there. Are you in charge of this policy? No, I'm not. You have to come back over here.

I'm sorry, I'm just asking you a question. Are you in charge of this policy? I answered your question. No, I am not. You have to speak back over here. I'm sorry, I'm just asking you a question. Are you in charge of this policy? I answered your question. No, I am not. You have to speak to the governor. The governor? Move back. There's nobody between you and the governor.

That's a person that's running the state, so I have no idea. I can't tell you anything else. We were at the governor's office. We were at the governor's office. Like, we were at the governor's office. Like, we have to speak to the governor. Okay, well, let us inside. We'll try to speak to the governor. And she said, you'll have to speak to the state.

Well, we're at the state house. Can't we speak to the state? And so I was engaged with protesting in a sense that sometimes I would protest on the sidewalk with a sign, and other, or whatever time when people would sit at a lunch counter and ask to have lunch just like everybody else. Well, I would go to the public library and ask to, I didn't feel like I needed to ask. I would sit down in the children's room with my children and suddenly the librarians would swarm and the police would swarm and insist that I was trespassing and insist that I leave. But again, this was not in 2020. This was in 2022. And furthermore, this also occurred at the Franklin Park Zoo. I went to the zoo with my children and they insisted that I was not allowed to go inside the indoor exhibits. They had security follow my children and I around the entire zoo. We were allowed to be in the outdoor exhibits, which was humiliating because even the animals. So hold on.

Well, at least, listen, California, they closed everything down. You couldn't even be outdoors here for quite as long easily as Massachusetts. But this was already in 2022. Oh, I understand. Yeah. But you didn't have a VAX mandate, a VAX passport. Is that the deal? Was that the problem?

Yes. The problem is that this is entirely unlawful. It's unlawful. It's unlawful. It's not a law. It's their policy, and separate is never equal. There's already precedent set

that you cannot segregate spaces. You cannot segregate spaces by religion, by medical, by disability. So when we go to these spaces- I don't understand how they got away with the discriminatory practices. New York City had a very serious problem with African-Americans getting vaccinated, and they were being excluded from public spaces and restaurants and bars.

I mean, it was the most discriminatory policy I've ever seen. And whenever you make an in-group and an out-group, you create trouble. I saw it coming. And now I've got a video I wanted to play, but we can't play it for whatever reason. But it was showing how the press was just parroting and condemning and making this all about the unvaccinated or the unmasked. And so what was your evolution in your thinking about this? When did you sort of start waking up and how did that work? In 2021, I started to have negative consequences because of the mask. I also,

with the looming vaccine mandates, I thought that the vaccine was coming out too fast. I am a community organizer and I was trained in emergency management, as a trained emergency management volunteer. So when COVID first happened, I actually reached out to my town officials and told them I didn't think that they were doing enough for COVID response. That was in 2020. But in 2021, again, the negative consequences of the mask and the looming mandates, I was forced to give birth in a mask. And by the end of 2021, 2022, it was like, wow, this is just, the emergency again is no longer COVID. The emergency is the unlawful elected officials that are violating our rights and it is on what authority do they have to be insisting so were were there to be a sufficient emergency circumstance would have you been and

we can debate about whether there was was or was not that circumstance but my question to you is if there was sufficient reason to have to to violate our civil liberties uh would you support that or is that the circumstance that is only to the most dire of circumstance and and uh and it's hard even to conceive of what that would be not anymore not anymore there's no trust well no no that wasn't my question oh i see so now so now because of the extreme overreach the the foolishness of the overreach and circumstance where it make no sense you don't want anything to do with any emergency where they violate your civil rights you'll take care of yourself i i would i believe that there is these are my god-given rights and they have been violated again i I don't think that I've

expressed this point yet, but I'm threatened with six months in prison. Every single day, I have my four children. One of them is three months old. The other is a two-year-old special needs toddler. And then I have a six-year-old and an 11-year-old. And I have to be with them every single day. And in each moment, I think, wow, if and when I'm in prison, I'm going to miss this. Okay? Because that's- And what are the charges exactly?

He said it was public- Disorderly. What was it again? Disorderly. Disorderly conduct. Disorderly conduct, trespassing. And what is your- Right.

And assault. And then assault. And your contention is you're just walking into a tent where somebody else was getting assaulted? It's on video. I was the one being assaulted, sir. I was the one assaulted. I was the one assaulted. I did not assault anybody.

I walked past a man and then they've accused me of assaulting him and they right shackle they this is this is me being assaulted by the cop that's because you were walking by that tent I walked into the tent. Ah, okay. And there is absolutely no need. It's totally unlawful what they did. Was there some sort of crowd control issue going on at the time? Because it sounds like a lot of people yelling. There were other people that were also being refused,

unlawfully refused entry into this public statehouse. This is not just a restaurant. This is not just about the baker who's refusing to bake the gay couple a cake. This is the Massachusetts statehouse that's refusing entry to its citizens. I get it. I get it. I get it. I just want to raise all the issues of the naysayers in case so I can represent them. So they would say things like, was this a big group?

Did you intend to make a big scene? Were you in any way obstreperous or difficult before all this we're looking at? Was it a big group? No, and even still, I think that there were maybe like four or five of us there, and you could only call it a big group because we were being blocked entry. The building is huge. It was recently renovated. What are they renovating it for? Did you come together to protest the same thing? We met there in order to be able to go inside, but we didn't all come in a school bus or a van. We were companions. But furthermore, the issue here also is selective persecution.

My congresswoman at the time was Ayanna Pressley. And in 2020, she is quoted as saying that there needs to be unrest in the streets. Protesters were allowed during the high time of COVID to be able to, they were allowed to go out, to spread COVID, if that's what it's called, and to peacefully protest because that's their right, to have freedom of speech and freedom of assembly, okay? I, on the other hand, by Ayanna Pressley, was called in a press release a violent, threatening, misogynist, supremacist, myself and other peaceful protesters. She labeled this in a press release, along with the DA, the sheriff, and others, without proof. My husband- Do you have any plan to take action against some of these people or some of these allegations? This is a great point that I appreciate you bringing up. So I recently had to end my relationship with my former lawyer.

And this interview couldn't have come at a better time because myself, I really do need to have a more experienced legal team that is very committed to standing up to these draconian unlawful measures because this involves very, very high-powered officials who are involved with persecuting people, and there are rotating corrupt judges. And I should have already had my charges dropped years ago, whereas other peaceful protesters already have. Throughout 2023,

there have been at least 38 people who have gone inside the statehouse and have been arrested for environmental protest, and their charges have already been dropped. But me and the other man that was arrested that day, we continue to be tied up in court because process is the punishment. These people are violating our rights. So as you've sort of, again, I'm more curious than anything about your evolution and your thinking. Like that, you know, you were, where'd you live in Massachusetts by the way just curious I've always lived minutes outside of the Boston area if you're familiar with in the greater Boston area you're in Framingham or something you're out there that way or you're out the other way Belmont no I'm originally from um Peabody Massachusetts but

I lived in Randolph during the time. However, my husband was a Boston employee, so that's why I was so scared. Okay, so you're a standard, average Bostonian, average Massachusetts. Lefty. Yeah, born liberal. Right. And so how do we understand what's happening now? I'm not sure. I'm sort of always been kind of moderate, but I'm still trying to understand what has happened. The frame has moved in a strange direction and people are getting caught in it.

And you seem to be one of them. What do you imagine has happened here? What's your interpretation of this? The forced vaccination broke the camel's back for me that was just a to me it was it was a human rights violation i i couldn't believe it why don't why don't other people who are liberals see it as such um i think namely your your mayor i i believe that um that i think that they're these the politicians, I think that they're being paid to do what they do. I mean, that's just what it is. And for her, she's in a lot of hot water right now. And I'm glad that

she is because what she's done is incredibly evil. I'm actually one of the people that has been targeted by her over the summer. A list came out of 15 or so people that were named as peaceful people that had their names sent to the police. And I'm one of those people named. I've been persecuted and that's why I don't think I'll ever be given a fair trial, not like any of this is fair or lawful. Well, I appreciate you telling the story. Where would you like people to go if they want to support you or help learn more other than Twitter? Do you have a website set up? Not at this time. However, again, I really do appreciate this opportunity. I do have a Twitter thread set up of all the legal documents that I've been able to compile.

I've been digging through public record searches. It's been two years, and I have not until now asked for a dime. But at this time, I do have a fundraiser set up because I just never would have expected it to go this far and this long. And it just drags on. So I'm at a Fendi show. In the meantime, you're trying to raise and homeschool four kids, right? That's the other problem is that the judge now expects me to go back to Massachusetts and that's just financially impossible for me to do. So it's Effendi, Michelle, E-F-E-N-D-I,

Michelle, M-I-C-H-E-L-L-E. This stuff is deeply troubling. It really is. I didn't see any of this coming. I just wonder what the mayor would say, what the reason is, how they defend this. I just always try to look at the other side and understand it, but I can't. It's hard to. They claim what? They claim that we were supremacists. And my husband is a Muslim Asian man. I was married in a mosque. So they're just lying and threatening and using projection. And mayor is Asian, an Asian woman. So again, they just were throwing whatever lie they could at the dartboard. And it's just fiction, unlawful fiction. And meanwhile, that's why it was important for me to come on this show and try to state this case because more people need to be aware of what is happening. And it's not just me. Because if I'm convicted of these crimes, then it will set such a poor precedent for others.

Because trespassing just for being unvaccinated, that's something that everybody should be fearful of. Susan, do you have any questions? I hear you moaning over that you know very emotional yeah it's awful well I hope you find the right attorney and everybody you know maybe can get some help on your twitter uh just you know stay strong and do your best and yeah if you have updates you can come here and give them the updates and we'll watch your stream on twitter and uh see where this goes it's uh you're you you've gone from being a massachusetts citizen to being a an unusual freedom fighter of sorts right isn't that your new job

yeah is that your new job along with breastfeeding it's my new job yeah it's the baby yeah i i think lean in lean into the mom aspects of this. I think it has, it particularly lands when you, when you realize what, what are we doing? That's a thing is that I couldn't like, it's, it's sort of, it is also humiliating because, and that I need to show my pictures of my children because if I'm only just showing myself face planted on the cement then that's not gonna that's not gonna give me the the exposure that I need so I have to show that my children need me and this is who they are and that I can't be flying back and forth to Massachusetts for five-minute hearings. That this is not just a ripple of, this doesn't just affect me.

It affects all these other parts of me. And it's important. You might want to, the group that's doing the Biden versus Missouri case, Dr. Blankenspeyer. Cariotti. Cariotti. Dr. Cariotti. Do you know who Dr. Cariotti. Do you know who Dr. Cariotti is?

Wait, is Tom Renz working with him? I don't think so. Maybe. But Tom Renz would be another source. That'd be another good place

for her to go. What about Mark Geragos? I would love any connections that you could please provide me. Yeah, do you have your stuff summarized somewhere

like in just a paragraph so people don't have to spend, you know, these people are busy. I want to get a lot of i have a twit yeah i have well i have a um my pinned post on my twitter account really speaks for itself with just like the the graphics and and that sort of thing and i'll send that to send that to our send that to our producer if you copy it and send it and then we can send it on to a couple of these people and see if there's anything we can do.

So Michelle, thank you so much. Thank you, Dr. Drew. God bless you. Of course. Speaking of moms, we're going to lean into a couple more moms. We each have a very distinct and interesting story on this.

What? And Drew, before she goes, look at this. This is wild. I haven't seen this on any account that's like just a legitimate just just a person when i go to her account on twitter it says it may include potentially sensitive content like it's some sort of like a like a porn star account like what what

is that that makes no sense at all is that just because of the protest do you maybe the video are the videos up there it had it's happened to me before the, the, the thread that I put together to send to your staff and any other media was all labeled sensitive. So the thread that I put together to describe my arrest and the monitor, because I've been monitored online and off by social media and I'm sorry, not to me. I've been monitored online and off by the government. I have public records that show that. And, um, that thread became marked sensitive right before the show, I put together a new thread. So I guess it doesn't surprise me that this has happened. And it's very sad. That's the new sensitive content.

I'm trying to. So, Caleb, we'll probably get dinged too here. Oh. You can expect it. Sorry. Yeah, wow. That's, yeah, that's definitely unfair, especially with Elon Musk's new takeover of Twitter slash X.

Like, that shouldn't be happening. There's nothing inappropriate. There's no inappropriate content. No. You're a mom. This is ridiculous that they would put a warning on your account for that. I watched the videos and it's not like there's no blood

and bones everywhere. There's nothing here that's graphically gross. It's just an egregious overreach of power. That's ridiculous that your account is restricted that way. Censorship. I had staff members from the city of Boston reporting my been experiencing along with other moms and other immigrants and fired healthcare workers. It wasn't just white people. It was a group of

freedom fighters that were labeled as right-leaning supremacist. And it was just totally unfair. And like I said, I'm glad she's now in hot water because very recently she came back in the news for having this quote, no white people allowed Christmas party. And- Good news is though your kids could go and your husband could go. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, but- You can't, kids could go and your husband could go. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, but they'd have to fly to Massachusetts. You can't, but your kids and your husband could. Yeah. Well. All right.

Let's wrap it up. Thank you. We'll see what we can do. Send us that email, and we'll send it on people that do this kind of thing. Okay? All right. You got it, Michelle. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much. And a little bit different, but similar kinds of stories. We're going to talk to Denise Aguilar. I just followed her. Tara Thornton, good. Civil rights activist, co-founders of Freedom Angels. They're going to tell you about that. They were arrested in 2020 after protesting California.

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Now we are welcoming, in just a second, let me give you their particulars before I bring them in here, Denise Aguilar and Tara Thornton. Freedom Angels is freedom-angels.org. Also, freedomangels2 on X. Informed Mama 209. Not sure what they'll tell us, which one of them that is. And Pioneer Mama. Ladies, not sure what they'll tell us, which one of them that is, and Pioneer Mama.

Ladies, welcome to the program. Hi, thanks for having us. Hello, thank you. So did the Michelle story surprise you guys, or is it no duh given what we've been dealing with here in California? No, it's unfortunately very common with what's going on in every state. Every state is dealing with a version of this. It's just very upsetting that we are still dealing with it. How did you guys get together? Well, my political journey started in 2015 when SB 277 was introduced that removed non-medical exemptions for K through 12 children. And then in 2019, we led the strategy for SB 276.

So the work that we've done really focuses on human and civil rights mandates, children and families. Yeah. And you're running for an, oh, go ahead. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I keep interviewing. I interrupted you. Go ahead, please. Yeah, no, 2015, the bill SB 277, it was the one that removed personal belief exemptions to childhood vaccines for going to school. What people don't know is that bill at the time was, it was COVID on steroids. It was comply or move state. And it didn't even have a carve out for kids who are homeschooling. So it was private, public school, homeschool, and you couldn't, you couldn't delay or have one less shot. It was literally follow exactly as this or move state. And that was really, you know, so that jumping into that battle really set the stage for, for us when 2020 hit, we already were fighting all these same forces.

You know, sadly, they create this big storyline around anti-vaxxers. That's what we would have been called the anti-vaxxers. And it was, you know, it's about really about people choosing for like informed consent, for choice, for transparency, for true health and well-being, for human and civil rights. But, you know, it was made into a big, you know, a taboo subject. And so the same issues that people who are questioning or wanting transparency and, you know, wanting to stand together on a path forward through COVID, you know, we came up against this in 2015 with our children. And as, you know, mothers and parents, that is like, if you're ever

going to hold a line and stand up and engage in building the world you want, it's that it's, it's for your children. And so your children and, and is masking the latest thing you guys are questioning or have been questioning? You know, I didn't participate in that program. We really look into health and wellness. And when the mask mandates and the vaccine mandates were rolling out, we did a full stop. We were part of the first group of people who were protesting against any type of mandates or lockdowns, really overreaching government from the Gavin Newsom administration. So it was the whole thing. We wanted to stand and say, no, we do not support any type of medical mandates. We need to have real conversations around this, real transparency around it, instead of being called every trigger word in the book, like a supremacist or racist, all of those things we were called. I'm second generation American. My family is here from Mexico.

So being called those names because we were questioning certain policies was really eye opening for a lot of people. Yeah, being called racist. Speaking of eye opening, go ahead, Tara, say that again. I say it's a little delay here. And so I think of things I want to ask Denise and that's when you speak so don't let me do that you talk right over me go ahead okay yeah it's very racist to be called racist uh and you know my family's mixed race

my child and and his father and I mean if you're ever going to have proof of being non-racist racist it's being in a mixed race marriage and kids. But really, you know, for us, when the lockdowns happened, Freedom Angels held our first protest at the California Capitol in April of 2020. And then on May 1, we held a really big one. And, you know, for me, it was a big deal. My that was my son's 10th birthday, May 1, he was born in 2010. And he was a miracle baby. And I, you know, when I was pregnant and had my child, I like, like most parents, I made the commitment, like, I am going to protect him and build the world for him that I want. And I never could have imagined it was going to include things like having to be a freedom fighter or having to stand in, in front, you know, stand up and protect him in a manner of like by protecting

our First Amendment rights to peacefully protest and being arrested. I never could have imagined this journey was going to be part of being what it is to be a parent, a mother, to protect children. But it was very simple to make that decision. Yeah, you can see the pictures of our arrests there. There was there was 32 arrests that day and there was thousands of us there. And I'll tell you, your state capital is your town's highest public, your town's highest public town square. And if ever your First Amendment right for free speech and to redress grievances is to be protected, it is on that ground. And so it's quite simple when they form the skirmish line and started to move us out. The decision was like,

don't move. This is our opportunity not only to protect my child and create the world I want, but to protect free speech, to literally stand and say, I believe in the First Amendment. And so it's simple. I will not move. And that was his, and that's peaceful and how you can live, you know, your convictions and creating the world you want. It was still scary though. It's so odd. What's scary? Getting arrested? No, none of this. I've never been, Denise and I talked about this. We've never been scared in any of these moments because it's truly, you feel guided by God, you feel the conviction of it. But the next day it was hard on, you know, May 2nd to wake up as the, we were the evil

face of the COVID resistance globally. And, but yet, you know, you win the day, I think when you see just regular people, moms in dresses, peacefully being arrested. And our message to people is if we can do it and we're still standing, you can do it too. Like be brave. It's so odd to me that a country that was founded on freedom, where that was the major sort of inciting motivation that if people stand up and fight for freedom today, they are somehow anathema, they're racist, something's wrong with that. That to me is just the oddest shift. And Denise, your path to all this is interesting, right? Yeah, I wasn't always into politics. I actually, I was a very active gang member in Stockton

from the age of 12 all the way up to 2012. I was in the streets. I did all the things, all the violent things that gang members do. And my husband actually introduced me to the vaccine program in 2012. And he said, I think you need to read this insert because the kids are always sick. So I thought he was a crazy conspiracy theorist. I was like, tell me everything. And I went home and I downloaded my children's medical records and I cross-checked it against the insert. And I was really upset at what was going on. And he took me to my first protest for SB 277, where I grew up Catholic and Democrat, and I never really paid attention to any of it. When I went into the Capitol building, I saw how disrespectful the California legislators were

spitting on children, keeping us out of the building. I never expected that from an elected representative. And from my background, I'm a street organizer. And so when I experienced that firsthand and I experienced and saw the kind of horse trading that happened and the money for votes, like the pharmaceutical companies gave one of the senators, Richard Pan, $95,000 during this bill. bill, it was really eye-opening for me as to, I have missed out on some really important things. And from there, I started talking to people in my community. I started talking to other moms and I experienced certain things within the medical community that really upset me of how much they pressure mothers and how much they create this very scared environment that you're scared to say no, or you're going to have CPS called on you. And so I took my experience in the street organizing. I started organizing the moms and that's where Tara and I in 2019 got together.

And we decided we were, this is enough. Enough is enough. We want representation and we want course correction. We are not extreme in California and we're going to work towards bringing some kind of correction of these horrendous laws that got put into place. And you're going to run for office, correct? Yes. I announced my assembly district 13 race. This is San Joaquin County area, Northern California. How's it looking? Good. You know, I've had,

Tara and I have worked so deeply within the community with town halls and showing people that they're fully capable of getting involved in politics. They're fully capable of reading bills and laws and being involved and giving them the ability to see that there's power in their voice. You know, and we've have, we used to have a really big social media presence through FOIA requests from judicial watch. It showed that the California secretary of state sent a request for Facebook to censor us on Instagram. So we have been working really hard through that type of censorship. I think I'm like on my 11th account. But, you know, the polls are in, and people are done with not being represented. They're done with the extremism that these legislators and the Gavin Newsom

administration have put forward. And so it's looking pretty good. You know, we have an opportunity here to look past party lines and look at the votes and look at the issues and stop playing the game of Republican and Democrat and really start getting involved in politics. God, I hope you're right, because I've lost faith and trust in the California voter. They just seem not able to make good decisions. And it's just really a wild time when I see some of the propositions that go through and just wild. But Tara, are you going to say something? Well, yeah, that's because people are disengaged. It's, you know, the civic engagement has been, you know, not fostered in education and community.

And that's really what has caused the problem here. You know, the elected representatives have a responsibility to hold town halls, to inform their constituents of what is before them, what bills, what issues. But it's also on us, and this is why community organizing and networking is so important. It's on us also to be civically engaged and not only, you know, demand that we know what's going on and that we have a voice at the table, that we're truly represented, but that we stay involved. Just like when you wake up and brush your teeth, you kind of have to have civic engagement as part of your life. And, you know, we, one thing we'd want people to know

is there is absolute hope. We have lost more battles since 2015 than most people would even want to battle, but we have had historic wins and on the worst terrain, which is California. We look at things like with terrain theory, like assess the terrain. If you're talking about health, same thing. If you're talking about politics, look at where you have strong terrain where you can move protections for children, for families, for human and civil rights. But even in the worst of trains like California, and I say worse because we are so polarized here, but that is not a true representation. I think one of the things we're so grateful to be on your show is what we'd want the world to know is that the people of California are not extremists, that the extremists in the leadership of the legislature and the executive branch don't represent the vast number of people. And we know this because we've been organizing from the ground up across the whole state,

that we are real California, just like most people. And most people are aligned more than not aligned, that these issues that have been politicized in practice, on the ground, in community, in conversation, are what we all know, they shouldn't be politicized. Everyone has pretty much wants a balanced path forward for their children, their families, and that means your community. So there's good hope, and we've had some good ones. Yeah, I always wish for a pragmatism here in California that's just been lacking.

I mean, anything of a salute, I mean, homelessness being the prime example, there's the easiest thing to point at. I mean, that's a manageable problem. I know exactly how to do that. No, they'll have none of it. No. Well, this is where you should work with us. Honestly, people don't realize that there is, because we work in grassroots organizing, and you have to look at all the pieces. And we get in there, and there's bills that we'll be working on. And we're like, gosh, we can talk on this medical part. And we have these great doctors

like Aaron Cariarty, who would be one of our expert witnesses. But we're like, gosh, we can talk on this medical part. We have these great doctors like Aaron Cariarty would be one of our expert witnesses. But we're like, you need to be in there with us more. Like Dr. Drew, if you walked in to some of our hearings as an expert witness and brought the spotlight, more importantly, as you're bringing a spotlight and a request for balance and reason, that will have more political power than you realize you, Joe Rogan, Elon Musk, you wouldn't even believe what you could do to help turn things around and bring the course. Correct.

Susan will kill me. Susan will kill me. She's she's, but as long as he doesn't run for governor, it's okay. So I'm willing to do that kind of thing. I just feel a concept. I got to do something.

I do something. The homeless thing was a first mobilize me. It's like, this are my patients dying on the streets. It's so, this is treatable stuff. What are we doing here? And in like 2018, I was up in Sacramento. I accused them all of being murderers because they are.

This is negligent manslaughter. It's negligent homicide. It just is. That's what that is. And they're running open air hospitals without doctors and nurses. In fact, they're forbidding doctors and nurses, and they're making poor social workers who are not trained to do this manage severe medical and psychiatric cases. So now they want to vaccinate the shit out of these kids, and the moms are pissed. So let's not let it happen.

And that's what we do. We want the message to be that if you want to do something you can do something this is going to be a multi-layer issue right there's so many different issues happening in california and because we've not paid attention for so long it's going to take a little bit to course correct but well it seems like the number one thing needs to be taking the wind out of the rhetorical sails where people cannot be called supremacist and racist and not caring about other people. All this stuff that gets leveled, that needs to be fought back hard because that is not only disgusting, it's insulting. And it's just ridiculous. So it's stop it with the childish stuff. Stop it. If you have a problem

with what you guys are proposing, let's get into it. That's fine. But stop it with the childish stuff. Stop it. If you have a problem with what you guys are proposing, let's get into it. That's fine. But stop it with the name calling. That is just disgusting that that has any merit whatsoever. But Denise, I mentioned that you had an interesting story to where you are now. I wasn't really talking about vaccines. I was talking about how you got out of the gangs and off the streets. Because I don't know that story.

So how did that evolution occur? And what do you do to help other kids? Well, politics really changed my life. My husband really changed my life by getting me involved in something that was outside the box that I was told I had to fight in. This was a generational thing that I was involved in to where I saw my brothers. I saw my family members. This was some place that I knew that I had to be. And I didn't my backpack. I mean, I was the all in it kind of person. And, you know, throughout having my daughter as a teenager, my mom having to step in, there were so many pieces in my life that I wish that were changed. But because of politics, because seeing that there is a different world out there, and there are actual gangsters in

politics. This, this is where I found my, oh, I know what this is. I've seen this. I know what kind of battle this is going to be. I've been well equipped, because I've dealt with it for years. And this is where the generational curse is broke for my family. I try to help children within my community with learning how to be entrepreneurs. We have a homeschool co-op where we teach children how to be business owners, how to create product, how to sell product. I try to do the best I can to fill in the gaps that my community is feeling. And that's what something that Tara and I like to do. We like to help build out the enrichment centers, help build out the co-ops, talk to people within the inner cities that there is another option besides sending your children to a public

school system right now. Public schools, for me, in my opinion, are a very dangerous place to have kids. And we can't fight the policies while our children are in the front line. So in all the years of being in a violent situation, being a teen mom, being away from my family, having all of these decisions, I have been able to take that experience and take it to the Capitol. I have never seen the type of extremism that I seen working in politics. And, you know, for my community, my underserved community that always gets targeted for different things, vaccine campaigns, or to get our vote, we're not being

represented. That ends with me, that ends with me and my community. And if we all stood up and said, I'm going to do something about it, I'm not just going to go on Twitter. I'm not just going to go on social media. I'm going to go to my local district office. I'm going to go to my school board meetings. I'm going to go to the Capitol. And that's what we try to model that no matter where you come from, no matter what you did, there's always a place for you at the table of protecting children, protecting families and protecting our rights and our freedoms. Yeah. And when we do town halls, we do a lot of community organizing. And one thing that always, you know, you can see it moves people. They tell us that here it is. And we say is,

you don't need to change anything about who you are right now to actually step in and lock arms with us and everyone else and actually create the world we want. You don't need to know any more science. You don't need to know how the legislature works. You don't need to know and you don't need to buy a new set of clothes. You don't need anything other than like what you're being called in your heart to do and to believe that we get to create the world we want. I mean, the hope is we have wins we can talk about that show you that California is not extremist and this is how you can actually course correct. But more than anything, like we can literally change the world in a day. All of us, if we just, you know, we get the world that we accept.

And we also can start to together bring the solutions that create the world we want for not, I mean, literally our children and all of humanity. And that means a lot. People don't realize I can just go as I am right now. I can step in. And it is absolutely because that's politics. Politics, what they don't want is for you to actually show up. Five to 10 people in a district can scare the heck out of any elected representative. And so we work on training strategy and building district to capital networks so that everybody can start to work together and we can push them and say, hey, you don't want to go this way. Not only do you have the cover to vote into balance or to protect children or parental rights, but this is what your community wants. And, you know, we can get there.

And California, too, has a real pathway to get there with, you know, moderate Democrats and Republicans at the state want to work together. And I really, you know. Yeah, so many of us lost faith. It's inspiring to hear you talk about it, but a lot of us feel like so helpless. But go ahead, Denise. It is, you know, go in inside my community i talk to everybody about what is going on sacramento because no legislators are talking about it and in within the latino community within the black community within the asian community they are sick and tired of being pandered to. And nobody agrees with sterilizing children.

Nobody agrees with abuse of children. Nobody agrees with mandates in my area. We have to start talking to people. And this is where the hope comes in. You know, we're being bombarded with social media, with mainstream media, with politicians, and people don't actually know what's going on. And so with Tara and I, we're going up to the Capitol. Our legislative session starts again,

January 3rd. We take groups up there and we do grassroots lobby training day where we show people how to talk to legislators, how to just approach legislators because politics is very confusing sometimes. But our goal and our mission is to talk to everybody, talk to people. They want to know. People are hungry for the information. And when we're talking to my neighborhood Latino event that's going on, I tell them it's not just one demographic.

It's not just affecting Latinos. It's not just affecting the Black community. It's affecting all of us with our children on the forefront. Common ground that we can come to is that children should always be protected. And when we walk into the moms. Oh, yeah. Well, and when you walk into the we walk into the Capitol the beginning day of session, there's no bills that are out yet. Right. We're waiting a little bit for the bills to come. And we make a point of going around to each office and we'll have people, you know, 50, 100, 150 people, every demographic, every district all over. And we say, just look at everyone's face. We'll literally say to the like, they'll come out like we want you to, you know, hey, good to see you again.

We want you to look, look at all of the faces here, every one of them. And we don't want you to put us in a box. What we represent is the real California, every demographic. And we're't want you to put us in a box. What we represent is the real California, every demographic. And we're telling you, we want to protect children. We want to protect families. We want to protect freedom. And we're going to move on any issue, whether it's a central bank, digital currency, whether it's a violation of parental rights, whether, you know, whatever it might be, uh, uh, an issue around medical transitioning of children. We're working on that heavily. We're like, don't put us in any one category.

Know that we're going to move locked arms together. And this is how we've won. I mean, people will sleep a lot better at night if you start engaging in the work to actually course correct, because it's important that we use microphones. One thing that we all pray for on the ground and the work we're doing is for the big microphones to spotlight in so that the legislators feel that pressure as well. And that gives them the cover to move in the direction to balance that we want. So, you know, it's really, you'll sleep better at night engaging, but we've won in 2022.

We defeated a bill called SB 866 that would have medically emancipated all 12 year olds in the state to make their own vaccine decisions without any parental knowledge or consent, every shot. It was, you know, a hard fought victory. We went to the end of session and we defeated it. And I mean, we even had the authors, Senator Scott Wiener, have the California Medical Board tweet about us calling, you know, the opposition led by anti-vax extremist moms, you know, who led the COVID lockdown. And, and I will tell you that that, this is interesting, that used to work. It used to be like, the media calling us these names used to work. But in 2019, Denise didn't tell you when we formed Freedom Angels, we started peaceful civil disobedience,

we stood on chairs at the final hearing. And we said, you can arrest us. These are our kids, and we're not moving. And we're not going to comply. We we believe that you can arrest us. These are our kids and we're not moving and we're not going to comply. We believe that if it's tyranny and it's going to hurt our kids, it's our duty to not comply. And then we had an 11-day Occupy of the California Capitol. We chained some of our best friends to the door, to moms, to the doors of the California Capitol. There was seven arrests one of the days. We lost that bill. And then we went into COVID and we were arrested during COVID and locked out of so many processes. We turned to move in the counties. But what happened when we went back in 2022, Denise and I went back as, you know, we,

you couldn't be more vilified or censored than we were. And especially in the California legislature. And we walked in and we showed up as many days as we could to just build relationships and say, nope, we're going to keep coming to the table and having reasonable conversations and trying to move you there. And with that win, it shows you it's a proof. We're not winning all of them right now but you can look at the wins it's a proof we won we also defeated the hpv mandate this last year for um for all kids k through 12 and college in california and then we helped pass um sv14 which was protections on human trafficking so against against children, child human trafficking.

That's good. Yeah. That's great. But that's both. They wanted HPV for K through 12 or just, I thought you had to be like 13. Nine, H9 it starts. K, she said K through 12.

They wanted you to give it to them at that. Both, right? It's really right now, it's sixth grade, seventh grade. They want it, but they're looking at, like Dr. Drew said, nine. And this was basically for whatever age checkpoint they decided that they were moving it to plus college. But we defeated it. And this is for it. So we got to kind of wrap things up.

I appreciate you guys being here. I appreciate what your work you're doing. It sounds enormous. It sounds daunting. Susan, do you have any question for them? No, I just, I'm so excited that moms are finally standing up for what's right. What have I said?

I've always told you that, you know, when they finally take charge, things will get done. I believe I was the one that said that first. Didn't I say that? Once the moms get involved. Yeah, we've reached that point. But I do know that to be true. And I know

the difference between a mom and a pit bull is eventually the pit bull lets go. So I like to see you guys in action i just snorted in 2012 when i decided to make that decision to walk away from that lifestyle that was a really hard decision that was a decision that could have been in harm's way because i decided to leave. You know, and so it was, but it was one of those decisions I made. I'm like, there's no way I'm going to get in trouble and locked up for that when this is happening over here.

Like I'm going to move my energy. So let me, I'm very interested in moments of change, particularly, you know, I deal with addicts and things like that all the time. And usually people have these moments of clarity where they decide I'm going this way now when they make a big big change like that do you have a specific moment of clarity uh for leaving the the gang and is it the same moment of clarity that you saw on politics for these things dovetailing together? It merged together. I mean, in 2012, like I said, I was an active gang member.

I was out on the streets. I was with this lifestyle, and I was not with my kids. It was one of the most extreme positions that I was in. Were you doing drugs? Did you get sober or something? No, I never did drugs. Was there any treatment? That's amazing. No, I told did drugs. Was there any treatment? That's amazing.

No, I told them. You were not treated? Were you inspired by a new relationship? Was there somebody that got a hold of you and started getting you to think? Or was it just on your own? My husband. My husband. I actually, before I met my husband, I had a wife.

I had a wife and I had children with her. And then when I met my husband, it was just one of those moments of meeting somebody and having that interesting conversation. And when I sat down and I started cross-referencing what my children were dealing with, and then I pulled my daughter's old medical records where she almost died from getting the HPV shot, I was pissed off that I was lied to

and that the doctors gaslit me and that they made me feel like I was a horrific mother because I asked questions. And so I sat there and I made the decision to leave this lifestyle that that decision put my whole family at risk. But it was a decision that I had to make because I couldn't do that fight and do this fight at the same time. I was going against laws and ready to be arrested for whatever I needed to do. But going into this battle was a moment of sitting down on the floor crying because I'm like, what did I do to my kids? I don't understand this. And not understanding, I threw myself in it. And I started going to conventions and meetings and meeting people who could help me move through

what I was experiencing. And so after a while, that decision was very easy for me to make. I chose my kids, I chose my family, and I chose to pretend I'm dead of everything else. It is the ability to see yourself with a new pair of glasses and your life with a new pair of glasses. And usually it's another person reflecting to us that gives us that opportunity to put those glasses on. And as you're representing here,

there are people along the way that continue your growth and continue to help you. And I hope that you have many, many more ahead as a assembly member. Boy, do I look forward to that. When is that election? March 5th is the primary. So I'm hoping that the moms and the dads realize that Sacramento has sold our children out to the pharmaceutical cartel.

And so it's time for some course correction. Even if you don't have strong feelings, go ahead, Tara, say again. Well, back to what you're saying about a different lens to view life. I think that's actually one of the great blessings of the COVID lockdowns is it gave so many more people a new lens. And I always think that that feeling of like, wow, anything's possible. There are no rules in a sense. We get to, you know, on the bad end for the COVID lockdowns, though, actually can, if

you hold that perspective, you're like, you know what, anything is possible. We can, and it is like, what is the meaning of us even being here in existence? Like all through humanity, you didn't ask for, I'm all for society, but society that's a support structure and not a cage and that takes care of each other. And I think that, you know, if we end up looking at like it that way, that we can, we can change. This is what we're here to do. We're here to build the world we want. We don't have to accept things that are broken. We don't have to accept a world that we have no power in we

absolutely do and especially if we lock arms together then we can help each other because it's not it's like it's like in the wilderness we're together and we can like pioneer this path with each other and figure it out along the way and then then we get to reimagine including medicine and medicine has failed. And you want people to go to angels. Let's see if we have it. We have freedom angels too, but what is the website? If the people want to participate,

freedom hyphen angels.org. And if you sign up for our email blast, we'll send you out the dates of where we're going to be in Sacramento. All right, ladies, thank you so much for joining us. And hopefully Susan, anything before I wrap this up with them and anything you want to go out to

Sacramento with me. And she's with the moms. Yeah. Come. And then we're going to have a hangout party. Okay. Sounds good.

Well, if you get her in, I'm so it's pretty easy all right guys thank you so much we'll see you soon i hope thank you came up with strong work uh ladies tomorrow we are in early uh again we're gonna have a couple comedians in tomorrow jiao ying summers she's a chinese comedian she's. But she unfortunately, Susan Wall always wants her to talk crap about the Chinese government, which she cannot do

because she works in China. She doesn't want to get disappeared. She doesn't want to get disappeared. You'll get to talk to Dr. Li Ming Yang. I was reading about her a bit and apparently she has over a billion views on TikTok and yet she already was banned for like three full months off of TikTok herself.

There's a lot of story behind her. She's very interesting. They banned her. They banned her account on TikTok entirely is what I read for three months as she was coming up. Banned her account entirely and she somehow got it back and now has over a billion views there. So she has a lot of stories. A lot of stuff from China as well.

She's so funny. Caleb's excited about the social media presence there. She's a friend of ours and she's very, very funny. And she's got a lot of interesting insights. She can talk about all the craziness of this country from her perspective, which is really interesting. And then Brad Williams comes on back as well. Brad, what do you want to say, Susan?

You're looking poised. There you are. And Zhao Ying, Li Mengjian, and then Emily Kaplan next week. All right, everybody. We will see you at noontime tomorrow. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician,

but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor, and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was published. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, don't call me. Call 911. If you're feeling hopeless or suicidal, call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 800-273-8255. You can find more of my recommended organizations and helpful resources at drdrew.com slash help.