Ask Dr. Drew - New Psilocybin Mushrooms Research + Q&A on Clubhouse - Ask Dr. Drew - Episode 39

Episode Date: July 5, 2021

[Originally broadcast on April 14, 2021] This episode of Ask Dr. Drew is dedicated to YOUR questions! Join the show on Clubhouse @DrDrew to ask Dr. Drew anything - questions about COVID-19, vaccines, addiction, relationships, health, current events... or anything you want to discuss! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. Our laws as it pertains to substances are draconian and bizarre. Psychopaths start this way. He was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction. Fentanyl and heroin, ridiculous. I'm a doctor for.

You say, where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. If you have trouble, you can't stop, and you want help stopping, I can help.

I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. Hey, Joe, you there? Hello, Drew. How are you doing? Hey, buddy. Good to talk to you. So tell us about the – I was doing okay.

I'm having a little technical stuff. My Wi-Fi was not good. Clubhouse's servers were struggling, but I think we're all good now. So Joe Giannotti. Sounds very clear. You sound clear too, as a matter of fact. Tell me what you saw in that Michigan data, and I guess you were interacting with Phil Kirpin as well,

and he was setting you straight on some things. Tell us about this. Well, he was interacting with me because I posted, when I sent it to you yesterday, I also posted it on Twitter. And Phil directed me to a group that's also working with data, their Twitter handle is at Hold LLC. It's on my Twitter feed, which is at Stanley Cup OT. So you can take a look there. And so with Michigan, Michigan has been doing some data dumps. Now, do you have, I sent you the graph.

Could you please show them to kind of explain? And I'm kind of looking right now. We're looking at the graph, your graph, the blue and the yellow. Okay. So in the blue, the blue are the case numbers so which which is on the left axis okay and you see how the case numbers are still going up however if you look at the orange the orange is the percent positive and those numbers for the last four days are now going down. The percent positivity of COVID.

So that usually precedes everything else. So that's good. Yes. Yes and no. What Michigan is also going through, the last few days is a data dump. Now, I sent you earlier, about a half an hour ago, I sent you updated materials. And if you could show. Is that the bar graph?

Is that the bar graph? Yes, please. Okay, let's put up the bar graph. There we are. Okay, we're looking at that. Let's see here. It looks good. I mean, it looks like things are improving rapidly. Well, that's correct.

And take a look. This is from the state website. This is Michigan's website itself. And so you can tell very easily when Saturdays and Sundays occur. Those are the lower numbers, okay, in the graphs. So, you know, it takes the rest of the week to catch up. But if you look, look at the most recent increase, which is from Monday, which is three to the left. Do you see how that number is kind of in sync with Friday with, with the right. So in my opinion, I think, I think their cases are starting to go down now.

That's what it looks like. They're rather dramatically, right? Um, not rather dramatically, but it's, it's starting to go down. And what I think is going to happen is it's going to rather dramatically in the next week to 10 days start going down. Go to the next graph because I want to show you the hospitalization. Do we have that one? We only have these two. All right. Hold on.

I sent you four of them all together. Hold on. I'm going to have to explain the others. Okay. Just kind of summarize it for us because I've got people waiting to come on in so we got to get to them i'm sorry okay i'm sorry uh so the the hospitalizations are still going up but they are not going up as rapidly right and that's a that's a lagging leader lagging indicator by about a week or two typically so that's good and and then the one the one thing that you know we have we have noticed is that the deaths aren't significantly going up.

Right. They're not going up. Some of the reason we think that is that there's a lower age group of COVID than has been sort of the national average. Like the sort of 16 to 28-year-olds were getting COVID in this Michigan outbreak. Right. And the average deaths, the average deaths are about 40 to 45 a day, which it's sad enough that that many have died. last wave in the last wave we were in the ballpark of 80 to 90 and upwards over 100 for a number of days during that wave in january you know drew it shows you that this wave is not as deadly which is telling me which is good if i had to make it if i had to make a wild guess, I believe that it seems like the general consensus now that B.1.1.1.7 is the dominant strain now. And certainly in Michigan it seems to be. That's true also.

However, I don't think it's as deadly of a strain. I think that's right, Joe. Well, I think there's two things. If it's hitting this 70-year-old plus, it's going to be bad. It just is. That's the way COVID is. And there's some hint that this virus may be a little worse, in which case, in that age group, you would see some more problems. But the fact that Michigan is predominantly skewed young in this particular outbreak, it makes sense that this should be an outbreak with relatively little death.

However, I was reading some data yesterday that suggested there was a lot of pediatric hospitalization, which is disturbing. I mean, you don't want kids to be so sick that they end up in the hospital, right? No, of course not. Yeah. But I think you're showing us some good news. So thank you. Thank you, Joe, as always.

Thank you for doing the hard work and presenting us the data. We appreciate it so much. You're welcome. Have a great rest of the day. Yes, buddy. We'll look for you over on Locals. I see some of you there raising your hand. Before I get to you, Tori, Glenn, and Anthony, Caleb, I sent you an email with just a headline, a title of a study. And I wonder

if you can just throw that. Is there possible to throw that up on the screen in any way? I'm going to find it. Give me a minute. It's just an email. It's really not important. It's not a big deal, but it's kind of dramatic. And it just came through from the New England Journal of Medicine literally while I was speaking to Joe. And the title of the study, I'll tell you the title of the study. It really is a dramatic, it's not about COVID. It's a whole other domain that I'm kind of interested in. I actually did an interview with the founder and president of MAPS, the Multidisciplinary Psychedelic Research Group for the Advancement of Psychedelic, whatever, MAPS, N-A- and APS. They're a legitimate research organization and

They have some good data coming out on MDMA and PTSD But now this the title of this little study is trial of psilocybin births versus a cytala pram which is essentially What do we know the common name as? Lexapro, yeah, Lexapro. So it is Lexapro versus mushrooms for depression. This is the first study I've seen the New England Journal publish on this, a double-blind, randomized, controlled, top-notch study with 59 patients,

29 to the Lexapro group, and then the other 30, I guess it was, to the psilocybin group. Now, interestingly, the outcomes were the same in both groups, right? Let me read you the actual, see if I can get to the conclusion on this, just read you the basic conclusion. This is on depression scores at week six, right? Trial did not show a significant difference in antidepressant effects between psilocybin and ecitalopram in a selected group of patients. Secondary outcomes generally favored psilocybin over ecitalopram, like generally how you're doing secondary outcomes. But in other words, not the primary outcome of the study, right? We

have primary endpoints. They added other things like side effects of medication, I'm sure, or quality of life, or diet, or sleeping. There may have been many other things that they were looking at as well. The analysis of these outcomes lacked correction for multiple comparisons. Larger and longer trials are required, okay? This was out of Imperial College of London. Center for Psychedelic Research. They have a Center for Psychedelic Research. This is just the first New England Journal publication that I'm aware of. Point is, Lexapro is a well-established antidepressant that improves mood at six weeks.

The headline should be psilocybin compares favorably. That's a kind of a really interesting observation. Now, whether it's a significant finding or not, yes, bigger groups, longer studies, absolutely reproduce the data, see if it works. But this is kind of really interesting that we have a very substantial bit of data that suggests psilocybin compares favorably to e-citalopram. I'm going to see if I can figure out very quickly what they, how much mushrooms they gave to people. Hold a second. Let me see if I can find, I'm looking through the methods

of this thing here so I can. Drew, do you want me to just pull up that page and show the article? Just, just, no, just throw the headline up there. Just throw the, just so they can see what I sent you. Or you can show the article if you want. There it is. There's the whole article. So there it is, everybody. Just throw the, just so they can see what I sent you. Or you can show the article if

you want. There it is. There's the whole article. So there it is, everybody. New England Journal, trial of psilocybin versus esitalopram for depression. Very impressive. Very impressive. I can't, by quickly screening this thing, it literally came in while we were talking. I can't see how much psilocybin they use. I imagine usual esitalopetramid doses. Adverse events, week one, six, have you been at the base of the events, additional details.

All adverse events that occurred are worsened between dosing day one and week six. We'll record it, and it doesn't say what they are. All right, I'm going to have to read this carefully. I'm sorry I didn't have time to do that because it came in while we were talking. So something for all to look at there. Let me bring in another call from really is frightening considering, you know,

people who got their vaccine in, say, January or February are really coming up quite quickly on the six to seven months. Right. So here's, again, if you were reading something on Twitter that this is how fake news is generated, right? So something that is not true becomes factual and then everyone reacts to the fact. Here's the fact. We have proof so far

that the immunological response is adequate at six months. Now they're taking it out nine to 12 to prove that there will be continued coverage at nine and 12 months. We're just about there with that data. And everything I'm hearing suggests that it will last certainly nine months and and 12 months. We're just about there with that data. And everything I'm hearing suggests that it will last certainly nine months and probably 12 months. Okay. So we're not looking at getting another shot in, say, you know, a couple months? No, but you probably

are looking at something at some point. They're predicting trouble in the winter. They're predicting another surge. They're predicting more variants. And at that point, we'll all probably have to take a booster. And trust me, I didn't like taking this vaccine. I had a bad reaction to it. So I don't look forward to it. But I do not want more COVID. I've had an ass full of that.

Thank you. Yeah, yeah. You had your fair share. Thank you. Thank you, Tori. You doing okay otherwise? Yeah, yeah. No, I'm about to get my second one on Friday, so I am a little bit nervous about that as well. But my family, they got it all earlier because they're older, and I'm kind of concerned for their health because they're obviously in the riskier category.

It's looking good. There's two great follows on TikTok that will keep you up to the minute. Oh, okay. One is at drknock, D-R dot knock, N-O-C. And the other is at laughterinlight. She's an immunologist that really reviews the data every day and just looks at all the publications and the preprints too, the stuff before it gets published. So you can get really up to date with Dr. Knock,

who makes it kind of fun and silly and easy to understand, but he's accurate. He you can get really up to date with Dr. Nock, who makes it kind of fun and silly and easy to understand, but he's accurate. He's spot on accurate. And then Laughter and Light is a little more conversational and giving you the up to the minute reviews. Okay. Oh, that's perfect. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. You betcha. Again, I'm looking at your calls here. You bring our buddy Anthony Brown on up here. Anthony, what's going on, man? What's going on, Dr. Drew?

What's happening? Hey, I'm sitting here just catching a little wind of this whole psilocybin, antidepressant type thing. Crazy, right? Interesting. It is crazy, yeah, because, you know, we've tried all kinds of things. Uh-oh, you're breaking up, Anthony. Hey, buddy.

And I know I was thinking. Wait, hold on. Anthony, I couldn't hear a thing you said. It all broke up. Start again. Okay. Can you hear me? Yeah, I got you now. okay, yeah, this whole psilocybin thing, and I was thinking about all the different experiments they were doing with ayahuasca and different roots and things like that. And I know that from my experience, yeah, mushroom does relieve depression

because it makes you euphoric. Well, it does when you're taking it, but is there a downside on the other side is the question, right? Well, yes, exactly. Because you're going to have to, eventually it's going to have to come out of your system. downside on the other side is the question, right? Well, yes, exactly. Because, you know, you're going to have to, eventually it's going to have to come out of your system. Well, I mean, for instance, you know, they're doing ketamine infusions now, right, for resistant

depression, and that works rather well. Now, I have seen recovering addicts relapse after ketamine infusions, so I'm concerned. I'm concerned about that. So obviously, if this psilocybin thing ends up looking like a decent therapy, in other words, I think the reason people look at hallucinogenics, they think that it will be a course of treatment that you can stop. That's sort of the thinking about psilocybin, right? And certainly, if that turns out to be true, I would not suggest that form of treatment for people in recovery. Exactly, because it definitely would trigger that whole craving thing. And next thing you know, you're just sitting around just eating anything that makes your head tick.

Well, because, you know, Anthony and I know each other, because your drug was cocaine, cravings are a big deal to you. But I, and that, you know, cocaine is the drug and tobacco and meth to some extent. The stimulants cause craving, really bad craving. But I worry, I'm sorry, a little less about craving and a little more about how activating your addiction distorts people's thinking. Because then you start thinking all kinds of things are good ideas. And that's where people get themselves in real trouble. Right. and that's where people get themselves in real trouble. Right, and it would be sad if people think, well, if you're going to compare antidepressants to mushrooms and you're getting the same effect,

then why not eat a bunch of antidepressants to get high? Or a bunch of mushrooms to get your depression better. And look, I'm just following doctor's orders. You know how addicts think. Yeah, yeah. Mushrooms are supposed to grow out of cow patties. Let's be super clear. Not for you, my friend.

Not for you, okay? But even the ketamine thing, I've had some patients, you know, one of the things about here, it gets complicated, right? Because one of the things about having been a drug addict is you can really alter your serotonin system permanently sometimes, depending on what you did to yourself. And so I've got a lot of recovering addicts who have

chronic recalcitrant depression. And I have in some of those in very select situations, seen people go ahead and use ketamine, sometimes it works, sometimes it triggered a relapse. So it's a hard call. We don't know who should be getting it and who shouldn't just yet. So if you're a recovering person, stay away from this stuff. I would agree 100%. All right, excellent. Thanks, Anthony. I'm going to try to take a few more calls here. This is Bianca. Hi, Bianca. Hello. Hey there.

What can I do for you? Hi. I actually wanted to ask a question on behalf of my sister. So for probably many years, she's had an autoimmune disease, I would say. We're not really too sure what it is. And when we've tried getting it diagnosed in England, so far so many doctors have been unable to sort of diagnose what she has. Right.

So I sigh when I hear about cases like this because we just – some of them people literally waste away. They just waste. It just can be a really serious thing. Now literally waste away. They just waste. It just can be a really serious thing. Now, go ahead. Ask your question. Then I'll tell you. COVID has moved this ball forward a little bit, interestingly.

So go ahead. So, yeah. So what normally happens is sometimes it's something which is induced by stress. Other times we really don't know exactly how much of an effect things like diet and stuff have on it. But she has really severe stomach pains and cramps. And then this is then presented in bruises which appear on her face, particularly her chin and both of her cheeks, sometimes her nose. She has things like cold sweats,

and then she sort of passes out for a period of seconds to maybe one to two minutes. And now, just recently, in the past couple of months, she sort of has back pain, which has developed as a sort of after-run effect of it as well. And they've done an adequate workup of this yes so she's been taken to have um patch testing done to see if she's allergic to anything uh she's had blood tests done she's gone to give things like stool samples just to see if it's

anything bacterial um if it's there's sort of been anything within her. CAT scan? She's had ultrasounds. I'm not too sure. I don't think she's had a CAT scan. But the main diagnosis we got was reactive eticharia. However, we now know that's not what it is because- That's sort of like nothing, hives. Yeah. Yeah.

They just have to do with hives. Here are two things that occur to me that are rare conditions that people rarely test for. One is something that's called a Gardner-Diamond syndrome or painful bruise syndrome, they used to call it. Let me look up here. Gardner-Diamond. I'm not even sure how you work it up. It's also called, these are rare, rare, rare conditions, also called autoerythrocyte sensitization. It's essentially unexplained painful bruising that mostly occur in the arm, legs, and face. There it is. Gardner-Diamond syndrome. Okay. It has been thrown into the psychiatric realm a little bit in terms of treatment. However, we're now finding out that many of the antidepressants that were used for chronic fatigue and these so-called psychiatric syndromes are activating an anti-inflammatory

pathway called the sigma-1 receptor, the Sigma-1 pathway. And so it's actually having physiological effects on the inflammatory system. So whether this is some sort of autoerythrocyte sensitization or post-viral syndrome or God knows what, calling these things psychiatric mischaracterizes them. You can use psychiatric medication and them not be psychiatric problems. The other thing I worry about when people are having conditions like this is porphyria. Did they ever look at porphyria for you? I don't think so.

Something called acute intermittent porphyria and abdominal pain is a major, major piece of that one. Let me read that one to you. Most severe episodes, neurological, motor neuropathy, blah, blah,

blah, weakness, central nervous systems such as coma, short-lived psychiatric syndrome, anxiety, confusion. Let's see. Hold on.

But I'm sure it's abdominal pain, because that was the thing I always remember with this, that they would get these weird abdominal pain symptoms. Well, it's not really in this little particular description. But acute AIP, it's called, acute intermittent porphyria, and it's rarely tested for. I think if I remember right, you have to do a urine collection, like a 24-hour urine collection to look for porphyrins.

But these are not things that doctors normally think of. This is Dr. House stuff, you know what I mean, like that TV show House. Although the writers of House did not know enough to bring up conditions like this. They interestingly brought up common conditions every time he solved the problem, but be that as it may. So I would look at three things. I would look at Gardner-Diamond, acute intermittent porphyria, and whether or not this is a post-viral syndrome that might respond to something like fluvoxamine. Fluvoxamine, I had long hauler COVID symptoms and my God, did it help me.

And it's helping a lot of people. In fact, there was a study just out of Germany this morning that was waxing poetic about the potential of antidepressants in the certain category, the ones that hit the sigma one receptor, helping with inflammatory diseases. So even if we don't know what her disease is, it still might help. Does that make sense? Yeah. No, definitely. Thank you so much. So even if we don't know what her disease is, it still might help. Does that make sense? Yeah, no, definitely. So I'm sorry. These are very frustrating conditions to have. Very, very, very, very. And because our medical systems are set up now to be perfunctory and fast and non-thoughtful, it's very hard when you get a condition like this, right? Yeah, I think the main problem we've sort of found is that because of the fact we come from Zambia, people treat it as though it's a tropical disease.

Listen, I'm glad they did that because they need to rule that out first, right? And there are weird, exotic tropical diseases out there too. The most they look for is malaria and HIV. And when somebody, they look for is, um, malaria and, uh, HIV. And when those

are sort of the tests that they keep running repeatedly, it's just, there are, there are much more interesting things than that out there, uh, that people can get exposed to. So, so it would also be worth her while it would seem to me to have a tropical disease specialist, just look her over. Cause sometimes, you Because sometimes dealing with those illnesses, you literally have to do a smear of the blood and look out for hours under the microscope, looking for the parasites and things. And again, we are not set up with that. Somebody would have to go do that. And so there you go. Very interesting, Bianca. Please keep us updated on that, will you? I will. Thank you. Okay. You bet. I hope that helped. Those are interesting

medical problems. Glenn, Glenn, what's going on? Hi, James. Hey, Dr. Drew. Hi, mommy. What's up? I'm doing pretty good. Good. I listened to you a lot. Been watching you since K-Rock, so big fan. Thank you. So I have a question. Yeah. On your mom's house, you've been talking about kind of how COVID messed up, you know, messed with your ears a little bit. Yeah. I had something. I had a flu. I don't know what it was. It was a sinus infection and it really affected my ears.

And ever since I had that infection, you know, um, when I had that infection, my hearing went to almost zero. I was at maybe like 10% hearing. And ever since then, my, my eustachian, this is, um, kind of just like what I've been told, but my eustachian tube has just not worked the way it should. And the only way that, um, well, my, my pressure in my ears when I, when I blow out or I'm changing altitudes or I'm swimming, um, no pressure's ever released. And it usually takes a little time for it to, to relieve. Um, so you can't equalize the pressure in your ear. Not at all. No. The only way I can do it actually is with spicy foods. Funny enough. I don't know why. Interesting. Have you, have you

seen it, your nose and throat doctor? I did. So I've been to two separate ones for two separate opinions. And, um, uh, both of them have, uh, administered me, uh, steroids for, for the, for the issue. And then I went to an audiologist and the audiologist was kind of just like, well, you can hear. And that just wasn't the problem. Well, so you're describing essentially a persistence in the middle ear inflammation or fluid or something or that the tubes are inflamed and not draining properly. The thing you worry about with a post-infectious problem is something called otosclerosis, right, where the ear bones sort of, they kind of become stiff, and so they can't move the way they're supposed to. So you've got to make sure they ruled out otosclerosis. And it seems like

they treated you like just a post-infectious persistent middle ear inflammation in other words but it also feels like again they're sort of dismissed you like move along and what what i will tell you i don't know what your insurance situation is but but what doctors rely on when somebody is given a treatment and it doesn't work. They rely on you to come back. And so often patients don't. This is the problem. I did not. Yeah, because we get frustrated and we get, you know, and if you go back and you go, I'm so mad you didn't, why did you come back? We got to keep working on this. We got to keep going. So you need to go back. I don't know what those doctors or either one of them were thinking. Hopefully it's the same one you can see.

Yeah. Or at least the same chart so that doctor can see the thinking of the other ones. And get on this and say, look, let's get a treatment plan here. This isn't working. I'm not better. See me again. Why didn't you make another appointment? This is the other part.

We don't ask patients to come back because we assume they're going to get better. And really, we should be asking patients back to come back and visit and make sure things are better, which it sounds like you fell victim to that process, which you assumed you're going to get better, move along. You need to go back. Okay? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Because it can be serious.

It's unfortunate. You can get serious problems with the bones in the ear, right? You have two little bones in your ear and a couple of muscles actually that tune the bones to the sounds that you're picking up. And those bones can become stiff or even ossified and you have to have them removed and something else put in. So it's a real deal. Okay. Let me bring in Alessandro. Alessandro, how are you? Hey, deal. Okay. I'm going to bring in Alessandro. Alessandro, how are you?

Hey, Dr. Drew. So, yeah, right now I'm currently planning to get vaccinated. And only because – yeah, I'm planning to get it a few months from now. Only because I really don't – I currently don't really go anywhere. And my friend's getting married in December. So I'm sort of planning out the vaccine so that I'm certainly covered around that time. I like that. And not only that you're, you're watching and seeing what other things emerge in the meantime. And the later you get it, the more you can push back the, uh, booster too, possibly. Yeah, a hundred percent. And I'm really grateful

that, you know, you've mentioned a lot of treatments such as banlanivimab, ivermectin, fluvoxamine. So I wanted to ask, should I unfortunately get COVID, you know, then that's a few weeks or, you know, just unfortunately, right? What would be your protocol? And I'm currently 25, so I just, 25. 25-year-olds really don't need much. That's a different group than, say, a 60- or a 65-year-old. My son is, you know, late 20s, and he got COVID at the same time as I did. I was taking a bunch of stuff because I was at risk of getting into big trouble.

He didn't take anything, and he was done in three days. And then he was a little pissed, too. It was like, geez, I quarantined for this, you know um so i think you should just sit tight tylenol only if you start to desaturate with anything being required and even then for a 25 year old as an outpatient you have to be 55 or older right now to get the monoclonal antibodies. So the only thing that somebody might do for you really is maybe some steroids and or a steroid inhaler, something like the budesonide. That now there's some good data on at least that it shortens the outcomes and things. So that would be probably something someone would do for you, either decadron or budesonide,

but you're probably gonna be fine. And then, and just for my parents as well, because they're, they're planning on getting vaccinated as well. So in terms of like fluvoxamine, I think you've mentioned that that one was the most successful in bringing down those symptoms. Steve Kirsch is a, and again, this German data that just came out this morning suggests that you maybe, maybe the fluvoxamine should be part of the early treatment. That is not established yet, but there is some evidence to suggest that that's true. How old are your parents? My dad is currently 72.

Mom is in her mid-60s. Yeah, so they would get the bamlanivimab. They would get the decadron. Everyone ought to get their vitamin D levels up. The enthusiasm around zinc has fallen off in some of the recent data. So the zinc quercetin, not clear. But the vitamin D, vitamin C is looking less of an issue, but I would still, what do you got to lose? Vitamin D, vitamin C, no harm, no foul. And really, other than fluvoxamine, there's not much established early treatment yet. Now, there are people out there that are looking at ivermectin again,

but that is yet to be established. So the main thing is the steroids and the steroid inhaler, the fluvoxamine, and the abamlanivimab, which now is combined with Etesivimab. So it's a combo medication. And I'm hearing it's getting harder to get the infusions at home. So you may have to go somewhere to get the infusions. Let's see. I'm reading your guys' work on... Ah, people don't use halidine on your bum. Okay, thank you, Tom Cigar.

Yes, that's not a good idea. But there was a study that came out this morning. It was not a good study. I'll go to the ads immediately after I mention this, that showed that poviadine was like the number three beneficial substance out there for early prevention of COVID. And that's what halidine is. It's poviadine.

So I heard that study. Don't get me wrong. The study wasn't good. But it was looking at all the compounds that have been used, all the chemicals that have been used to treat and prevent COVID. And halidine, if not halidine, poviadine, which halidine is what it is, came up like number three on the list, which caught my attention. And I swear, as God is my witness, nasal swab, mouthwash, these are good things to add to the efficacy of the mask.

We will take a little break and back again with your calls. Anyone who's watched me over the years knows that I'm obsessed with Hydrolyte. In my opinion, the best oral rehydration product on the market. I literally use it every day. My family uses it. When I had COVID, I'm telling you, Hydrolyte contributed to my recovery, kept me hydrated. Now, with things finally reopening back around the country, the potential exposure to the common cold is always around.

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Well, digestive issues aren't just for grownups. Kids can suffer from it as well. That is why I wanted to pass along a clinical trial participation opportunity in the event that you may have or know of children who experience occasional constipation. SEED is currently recruiting 300 to 500 participants for a clinical trial to study the pediatric gut microbiome and assess their pediatric daily symbiotic, a probiotic and prebiotic formulated with strains that are intended to alleviate gastrointestinal discomfort. Participants will be compensated up to $225. Here's some details about this double-blind study. Children with constipation between the ages of 3 and 17 are eligible to participate.

The study duration is 16 weeks. The study is fully remote with no in-person visits. Subjects will provide stool samples at baseline and week 12. Parents or direct relative guardians of study subjects will receive extensive education on the symbiotic use. If you'd like to learn more and or enroll, please go to drdrew.com slash trial. That is drdrew.com slash T-R-I-A-L. On behalf of my friends at Seed, thank you for moving science forward. I am so grateful for our friends at Blue Microphones. Not only have they completely changed what our show sounds like, they've given me headphones so I can monitor things better.

This is the mic for millions of creative people, and now I know why. I'm so grateful with them, completely changing the quality of our audio. You'll find Blue mics like Yeti and the Mouse, which we're using here, both in pro studios and home studios, all literally all over the world. Their popular Yeti caster is a Blue Yeti microphone, plus a boom arm system that's behind many of your favorite podcasts. I run into them all the time, and now I know why. If you've ever thought about creating your own podcast

or YouTube channel, Blue can make you sound and look great. Just visit bluemike.com and click get started and you can start telling your story. All right, everybody. Thank you for your calls. Thank you for your patience there. Let's get back to them. Of course, I'm watching everyone on Restream and I've got Pete up.

Pete, hey man, what's going on? Pete? Hey, how's it going, doctor? Thank you so much for doing this. You betcha. So my questions are, I've heard that melatonin and antihistamines have been shown to, well, I want to get your opinion on, are those good studies? On COVID? Yes. Yeah, melatonin, there seems to be something going on in the high dose of melatonin.

Some of the antioxidant properties kick in around 10 milligrams. And pretty much everything that is over the counter, unfortunately, that can affect COVID, the zinc, the D, the quercetin, the C, the melatonin, I took all of it. I took all of it. And the data looked good to me, but I didn't expect much from it. I didn't expect much from it. And I got sick and I got very sick. So did it prevent me from going in the hospital or did it make no difference at all? I don't know. But I did all that myself. I think it's not a bad idea to do those things. But expecting a lot from it, it's probably not going to be a lot.

Probably not going to be a lot. As compared to, and let me just compare it to when I actually got sick and I was heading towards hospitalization. When I got the monoclonal antibody, I stabilized immediately. I mean, it was a dramatic effect. And I told the infusion nurse, who was a lovely guy that I was chatting with, and he said a reminder that the bamlanivimab and the etesivimab is available to everyone. It's not, you know, you don't have to have special insurance or anything. The government actually

pushed it out. And he said he sits all day in all across the socioeconomic spectrum. And I was telling him that during the infusion, I was feeling better. And he goes, yeah, I hear that all day. I said, not only that, like colors are getting brighter. Like my brain is changing. And he said, yep, yep. They tell me that too. So that's a lot different than melatonin.

You know, 10 milligrams a day might help a little bit. You know what I mean? Yes, that's fascinating. Thank you so much. All right, buddy. Thanks for calling. Appreciate it very much. Hold on here. Let me get Pete back in the audience. mean yes that's fascinating yeah thank you so much all right buddy thanks for calling appreciate it very much uh hold on here let me get pete back in the audience thank you pete uh i am now looking at

nate whoops nate go right ahead buddy nate hey man hey, buddy. Yeah, well, hey, I had a question a little bit different than the previous question. I was wondering if you could, like, make your – you seem to talk about, like, problems in terms of, like, current system bad and not really in terms of, like, what would be good. So I was wondering from your perspective what what would be like the ideal healthcare system? Oh, dude, I wish I knew. I wish I had a great answer for that. The one thing I know that's bad, the more you take things away from the basic unit of the physician patient, that should be your, that should be the unit that's in charge of healthcare. When you put things on top of that, when you encumber that, or when you pull away from that, you make things worse. And people are trying to make it better, but it's not going to make it better. So the question then

becomes, how do you get it back to the practitioner and the patient? There are a lot of people that suggest market forces that are a way to do that. There was a time when they were talking about these individual savings plans. But that really demands that people pay attention to themselves as consumers of health care. And we don't really want to do that. We don't like that. We don't like that. I don't like it either. We want to be able to just plug in and then get away from it again

and pretend we're not biological. And I'm sympathetic. I understand that. But I think the only way we're going to do it is if we have a couple of tiers. If we have something that's pure market-based, that people who like to be in the weeds on these things and manage their own stuff, let them do it. And some intermediate insurance program like we have already, and then a public program. We have to have a – to demand that everybody be in one system, it's just not going to happen.

I just don't see where that works. And so there's got to be some way of managing a choice where people can manage their healthcare the way they want to and be able to provide healthcare to need it, who need it, that's good. But boy, you know, when you're doing that, you're providing health care to hundreds of millions, tens of millions of people at least. And the whole issue becomes how do they, I don't want to say it too pejoratively, but restrict care. How do you manage care? Now, is what I'm saying make any sense at all so far, Nate? Absolutely, Yeah. It sounds like kind of I'm kind of coming from the Dan Crenshaw direct primary care idea as being like the care has been taken out of the equation is, I've been in primary care for 30 years and it's been horrible. It's almost impossible

to practice primary care. And I think they've done that intentionally. So they can move in what are called physician extenders. Now, here's another thing. I think physician extenders are great, but you got to be prepared that you're going to see a nurse practitioner or a physician assistant and not a physician. Now, the physician can supervise all that pretty effectively, but the consumer has to get used to the idea that that's how it's going to go. The one thing that must, and that's the only way you're going to come up with a public system, frankly. But the one thing that must be taken out of that equation is the total liability cannot flow up to the physician. It can't be that we have eight people under us or you want us to manage 20 people under us and then all the liability goes to us. It can't happen. Can't happen.

Yeah, this is my strikes back episode. Thank you, Tom's Cigars, who suggest I have a segment every day called Dr. Drew Strikes Back. This is it. There's got to be some shared liability or tort reform or something. Because if you just allow, I could manage 20 physician extenders if it weren't the case that I accepted all the liability for every minute of every one of those individuals' caretaking. I would learn to understand their caretaking. I would be using my judgment, and my judgment would have to be adequate defense against liability. Now, if I was just totally asleep at the wheel or I was up on opiates or something, well, of course, there should be liability on my doorstep. But the fact that all the liability flows upstream is one of the reasons we can't

get this system right. There's got to be some tort reform. That's amazing. Thank you for that response. I think this actually would be an awesome segment with you and Adam going through just any kind of public policy. What could we do in a positive sense? Well, I know precisely what to do with the homeless situation. I know exactly what to do with that. It's not hard. It's very easy, but it requires some laws that are going to maybe be difficult to get through. Hey, Drew.

Yeah. Thank you, Nate. Could you do me a favor and tell the people on Clubhouse that this is also a live stream and it will be a podcast so that anything they say on here will be in perpetuity? Okay. So I did not mention, I did mention to this group that it will be a streaming show, that you're streaming when we call you up onto the program, out of the audience here. You'll be on the streaming program,

which is on Twitch, Facebook, YouTube, and Twitter, Periscope. But I neglected to say that it would be a podcast because I didn't know it would be a podcast until just this minute. So I apologize for that. But thank you. Thank you. That's appropriate for us to warn everybody.

Josh, what's going on? Can you hear me? We do. Oh, great. So I have a couple of questions. My first question was about the mushrooms. And I feel like medicine is going in that direction you can't really stop it i heard a really good podcast um about psilocybin use in new york i feel like there's two big ones there's the

mdma study that you just talked about is that out yet is that out now no no no but you had you had that woman that psychoanalyst come on and talk about mdma about i don't know a long time ago well no this is this one though but this is wait till you hear the interview with this MAPS guy. Let me find you his name. He's in Toronto. He's amazing. And he has a great study about to be released. Yeah, so it's really good.

And my point was that sort of like, you know, you're hanging out with your friends, and someone says, you know, I'm not feeling very well. They're like, here, you know, let's, we're going to do some drugs tonight. Come with us. We'll hang out. We'll have fun. I mean, that's kind of the way the medical community is going. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. They, they are making, they are, they will have to get training in the application of these substances. They will have to be trained in what the potential downsides are and how to look out for those downsides. They will have to follow up and take responsibility for what happens to that patient in the months and weeks following. And they will have to do measurements to make sure that the depression or whatever it is they're

trying to treat actually improve. And there will have to be a risk-reward analysis for each step along that path. At this point, we don't have enough information to even advise using these things because we don't know the risk-reward. Now, when it comes to the MDMA, in the setting of carefully executed trauma therapy, it looks like MDMA has some added benefit. In people who are recalcitrant, whose lives are ruined by their PTSD, that's worth the risk. We don't know the risk reward yet on many of these other situations. What was your other question? So my other question was, I feel like the last year, we've basically been, I mean, I don't even want to, I feel like I'm coming back. Everyone's coming back.

But psychologically or just anything, I feel like this last year is like you just give it up. I mean, we need another year to get back. Well, I don't disagree with you. But imagine if you're 80 and you have two or three years left and they just took a year away from you, you know, from being around your family. Well, what do you do then? Hang on a second. What do you do in that situation? Hang on. Dr. Drew strikes back again. It's going to happen more than once a show.

This is disgusting to me. It's disgusting that without any conscious awareness of what they're doing, they prevented people whose life expectancy may be only two or three years. They made them cash in maybe all of what was left when they could have been finding some way to spend time with the people they love. And by the way, one of the things they might have done

was ask the individuals themselves how much risk they'd like to take. But no one ever did that. They just pushed them all away. And now people, like you say, Josh, we've lost a year, and it may take us another year to get back. I agree with you. It might. I kind of feel that. You're right. So what do you say to the 80-year-old guy? I mean, these people are human beings.

I tell them I feel terrible for them, and they should get the vaccine and get out and get moving and get doing stuff. And, yes, there are variants out there they should be concerned about, but you can manage that risk. If they're really concerned, use some of the halodine. Use the mask. Do all these things. Keep your distance. See people outside.

There's zero transmission outside. Strikes back again. There is zero transmission outside. In one large study, two out of 7,000 cases they found an outdoor transmission. In a couple that was standing face-to-face outdoors having a conversation, it transmitted. Otherwise, the other 6,998 did not transmit outdoors. It doesn't transmit outside. We just had Texas Stadium filled. Was it two weeks ago,

10 days ago? Was there a massive outbreak or has Texas continued to go down? It's continued to go down. Now, I'm certainly sympathetic to people say that that was very risky and maybe we shouldn't take risks like that. I'm with you on that. I looked at that too and kind of made me nervous, but I thought to myself, zero transmission outdoors, zero transmission outdoors. That's the data. So let's lean on that. So yeah. So Josh, I agree with you. It's another year ahead of recalibrating and sort of, but maybe we'll enjoy it more. You know what I mean? Because it's stuff we've lost and we're finally getting it back. Thank you for your question, man.

Marlis. Hello. Can you hear me okay? I hear you. What's going on? All right. Well, okay. Eight days.

Okay. Personal question here. For you or me? For me. Okay. Johnson & Johnson shot. Eight days later, I take myself to the emergency room cause I feel like shit and I know something's wrong and I'm having some extreme pain. Don't know what it is.

They ruled out left chest area. Um, they can end up calling it chest wall inflammation. Here's what's odd is I'm showing, I'm throwing giant platelets and variant lymphocytes so far in the, and it says the platelets are clumped. We're going to repeat it on Friday, but when do I feel I'm an old hypochondriac, I've been in recovery for many things, including this. When do I allow my old behavior to trigger up a little bit? When do I start getting anxious about some of this? Oh, okay. Well, not yet.

Don't get anxious, but pay attention. Pay attention. So have them check your antiphospholipid antibodies because... Hold it. Yeah. Try and say that one three times fast. phospholipid antibodies because the platelet clumping is probably caused by an antiphospholipid antibody. That's what they're thinking now. So if your antiphospholipid is up, did they do a pro time on you? No. You get a pro time, get an antiphospholipid level. Somebody may want

to put you on some anticoagulant. That may happen. Are you on estrogens? Yeah. I would stop them for the time being. Don't let me give you direct advice. Please talk to your doctor.

I want to tease you for a minute. I'm in the middle of building a huge building that goes open May 15th and you want to throw me into menopause? I don't. I don't. I understand. Susan, we're getting the horn here.

We understand. We have a profound empathic attunement to what you're expressing. Joan, I understand. Susan, we're getting the horn here. We understand. Yeah, bad move. Yeah. We have a profound empathic attunement to what you're expressing. I'm thinking weapons should be put where? I'm with you. No, and I'm also hearing what you're saying. Yeah, so we know that the people on birth control pills were the women that had trouble. You're how old are you now? Do you mind me asking? I don't mind. 61. Yes. You're outside of the age group that really had trouble, had big trouble. Um, and as you know, the, the

clotting was weird. It was transverse sinus and it was weird. So for you to have chest wall pain, did they do a D-dimer? Did they do a CAT scan? Yes. One second. The D-dimer was fine. Real fast. I felt like they did a very good evaluation. It was just go home, you have chest wall pain. And that was a little freaky. So I did call my primary and we're going to repeat on Friday. Antiphospholipids, ProTime. Think about getting off those estrogens. I think there's more weird shit going on with this J&J than we know. And that most of it is sort of subclinical. That's what I bet. I mean, look at me. I got a weird black eye. Did you hear this story? By the way, did it get worse or kind of hold stable? It looked, but it's as bad as it could possibly be. I have a raccoon eye on one side. And that's, guess what?

A sign of a transverse sinus thrombosis. But, you know, without a headache or spinal accessory nerve changes or something, it's not what I have. But isn't it weird that that happened following the vaccine? Just like isn't it weird that you're having this thing following the vaccine? So I think there's a lot of stuff going on. The pain keeps moving. There are days that I'm crippled up with a headache.

Then it's over here. And I'm like, what is? Well, and then it faded away. So it's bizarre. Again, I'm going to say subclinical. I'm going to say subclinical. I'm going to say subclinical. The probability of a serious event is 0.000040, I believe, 9%. So, you know, the probability of this being serious is very remote. But you want to mitigate your risks.

Absolutely. Yeah. And the hard part is if you have antiphospholipids, some of the problem has been hemorrhage with this thing. So it's because the platelets can really drop. Did they do a platelet level when they? The platelets were adequate but clumpy. Okay.

Well, that clumpiness to me, that sounds like antiphospholipids. So let's go see and let me know, okay? I will. All right. Thank you. Good luck. I appreciate your time. You betcha. Thanks.

Okay. And now, whoops. okay i will all right thank you good luck i appreciate your time thanks uh okay and now uh whoops tanya how you been true how are you i'm good what are you doing now i'm still in public child welfare um i actually am i pulled over to the side of the road right now, just so I could say something. I don't have a question. I just want to take a minute to say thank you, because amidst this global pandemic, you continue to, you know, want to help people and bring awareness about, you know, so many different conditions. And I just want to thank you. I know you've got a lot of hate. And you are my personal hero.

Well, you're very kind. But listen, you're now a mental health professional. So what am I doing to contribute to all that hate? Where do you think that comes from? You know, I just have a lot of concern overall for the public um i feel like there's so much mental health advocacy that that needs to be done especially for our youth um and now that they've been out of public you know school settings for the last year um i definitely feel like we have a lot of work to do ahead of us.

That is, that is an understatement. There'll be plenty of work for all of us. Yeah, I know. So you, you see all this spite as some, an expression of overall lack of mental health right now. I think it's a combination. Um, a lot of the population that I work, it's just like intergenerational trauma that is this like ongoing cycle where people just want to tell their story. People just haven't had the opportunity for somebody to actually listen to all of the ongoing trauma that's been passed down. So it's really more about intervention and having either a good therapist or a case manager or court intervention. Or mutual aid, man.

It's free. Support groups, mutual aid groups. I mean, we've got to really get behind more of that. I know they're not professionally managed and people worry about that and whatnot, but, man, they can really help people. Yeah. So I just wanted to say thank you. I know you get a lot of hate and so just, you continue to be my hero. Thank you so much for everything that you do. So great to hear from you. Congratulations on the work you're doing. Okay. Thank you. All right. See you. Uh, I've still got a few more questions up here. Are we good on time? Everybody? Susan, are you good? Susan, get on that horn.

She doesn't want to talk to us. I'm good. I've done the strikes back, so I can now just take phone calls. Did you like the strikes back? I think Tom Cigars is brilliant. That was Tom Cigars' idea. I'll make a better animation soon. That one I only did in five minutes.

Okay. How dare you? I need one too. Let's see if we have, Jen, are you up there? No, not yet. Oh, there she is. Hi, Jenna.

What's going on? Hey, I am such a huge fan of you and Susan with Tom and Christine. It's amazing. And I'm curious, I know I could probably Google and find it, but I was wondering if you could briefly just say, how did you guys all first meet?

The four of us? Because this friendship's amazing. Okay. So Susan, this friendship's amazing. Yes. Okay. So Susan, this is for you. This is a good one for her. So not how Susan and I met, but how the four of us got together. Yes.

Oh. Do you remember? Well, it really was- I had- Go ahead. They're friends with Jason Ellis, right? I think it's the Kreischers. Oh, the Kreischers.

Wait, no. Isn't that how they got to us? I think I had Jason- Burt Kreischer. Let me just say, Burt Kreischer's. Oh, the Kreischer's. Wait, no. Isn't that how they got to us? I think I had Jason. Bert Kreischer. Let me just say, Bert Kreischer has been my friend since he first told the machine story on my radio show 15 years ago or something. So we kind of became friendly and kind of circled around a few times. But I had Jason Ellis on my podcast, and then somebody told me, one of my fans said, you need to get Tom Segura because they're friends.

Right. And then maybe it was Bert. And then it was Bert. No, I think we did. Well, we did Bert. He was on your podcast and he didn't like it. I think we got Tom through Bert, but I got it through Jason Ellis or something. And because they were on my calling out with Susan Pinsky podcast like five years ago.

Okay. And they wanted to talk to their dead ancestors. Okay. And Tom Segura was the worst guest I ever had. He hated it. He was the worst. He hated it. But here's what I remember.

We found you and I were watching Netflix, and we watched Christina P's first special. And I just went, that is a super bright woman. Remember that conversation? I was like, she's hiding how smart she is. This is like somebody who's super crazy smart. I said, oh, she was on my podcast. And you were like, what? I think you said her husband was or something. No, they were both on it. Okay. And then I said, we got to get them on my podcast. And so Christina turned out was a fan of Celebrity Rehab. So she was fans of me and Bob Forrest. So Bob

Forrest and I had a podcast. She was very anxious to come on that podcast, and she did. This was four years ago, five years ago? Yeah. And we just sort of became friendly after that. Then you went on their show. And then they kind of coaxed me. We weren't friends yet. They kind of coaxed me to come on their show. I had zero idea, Jenna, what I was getting into. I mean, back in those days, it was their house in Canoga Park or wherever, and you went in their back, like they had a back room. And I went with you, and I watched you guys.

You sat in the doorway, as I remember. And they're like, oh, is is this normal and they just showed me these horrible things I'm like what what is going on I don't understand and uh that was where our friendship started and then we all went out to dinner a couple of times you to do a spinoff show but that's why we had dinner they said your ratings were so good and they loved just making you squirm yeah they wanted to make me squirm regularly. And they called me and they go, can he do a podcast where he sees all these things and we interview celebrities and blah, blah, blah. I go, yeah, he doesn't have any contracts. And they went, what?

Okay, let's do it. And originally the idea was, Jenna, that I was, Christina had a weird obsession with comedians' brains. And so she wanted me to talk to a bunch of comedians. So if you look at the first season of Doctor After Dark, it was all just me talking to comedians. And it was pretty much trauma, trauma, trauma, drug addiction, trauma, you know, exactly what you expect. But it was funny.

It was interesting. I really enjoyed doing that. But then Tom came in and said, eh, let's bring it closer to your mom's house and why don't you and Christina do it? And that's what we've been doing ever since. It's absolutely amazing. I love seeing you on them. Well, you know what?

You guys are just all so good together. What's amazing to me is, and you represent this to me, your mom's house fans are amazing. Amazing, amazing, amazing. And what I love is not just they're such an interesting group and so welcoming, but on my stuff, for those of you who don't know what this is, I do a show called Dr. Drew After Dark, and they send voice messages in, 818-253-1693. 818-253-1693, you can send voice messages in.

And it feels like old school Loveline. And because of that, I've started doing some shows where I'm just answering messages and things here and there. And that's, that's a nice thing to kind of bring that back a little bit. There's still a lot of young people have a lot of weird questions. So we try to get to them, not all Brown and yellow and white. If you know what I'm saying, Jenna. Yes. Thank you guys for all the laughter. I just love that story too. So thank you. Thank you. You bet. Well you you bet what that's an that's that's a story i never thought i'd tell you know what i mean that's kind of interesting uh you know what's weird to dinner with um heather mcdonald lisa vanderpump and jill zarin tonight at pump tonight i'm good i'm good with it i was gonna make chicken parmesan no let's

go go with those but i can do that okay what pizza but I can do that what's weird is that that's also how you and I started working together I was on Susan's show one time and I overheard she was saying something on the break about how something needed fixing on the website and I was like wait I know how to do that and then all of a sudden within minutes

she sent me the passwords and the logins and then from there it kept going and going and now fast all these years. We are a little impulsive when it comes to getting stuff done. I'm like, hell yeah, take the password. Here you go. Vienna, Vienna, what's going on? Hi, how are you? We are good. What's happening? Good. I've only been here for like 15 minutes. I'm not sure if you guys talked about this already, but I just had a couple of question concerns about the COVID-19 vaccine and with women who are currently pregnant or who want to get pregnant. And I guess my whole thing is that I've heard doctors say it's fine. It's fine. It's safe.

It's safe. And I just don't understand that at all because it's like they haven't studied women for a year. You're right. Not for a year, but they have studied women going into pregnancy, during pregnancy, and after pregnancy. And the data has been very solid. Very solid. Now, you're right. They didn't look at things a year from now.

But this isn't the sort of a – not much can happen a year away. I mean, it just doesn't make any sense that there would be, you know, really anything significant. I'm sure they'll continue to follow to be sure. But I get it. Go ahead. Well, it's that pregnant women have more severe COVID, but they do okay. But there's certain risks with it. I mean, I understand if you don't want to take the vaccine.

I get that. Yeah. I mean, I just don't want to take the vaccine. I get that. Yeah. I mean, I, I just don't know, like I I'm not pregnant, but you know, my husband and I are kind of on this, like we were going to try to here shortly. And I'm just like, I don't know if, you know, I, I just don't know because there's, there's no like studies and data. And, you know, this was just something weird that I was reading. I forget what it was, but it, it was like something 30 years ago that gynecologists gave to, um, that is, that was a terrible mistake. Poorly. That was a misadventure of massive proportions. Oh, so you know what I'm talking about? Of course. Of course. And trust me,

the medical system learned from that one. It's not like we're going to make that mistake again. And believe me, the system was different entirely. I mean, there was not in any way as thorough as things are today with all the liabilities and things attached to any medical, any interventions. I suggest, I've recommended this a little earlier. I'm going to suggest this to you too. There is a, do you watch TikTok at all? Yes. Go look up at laughter in light, at laughter in light. She's an immunologist. She has, she, on her, if you go through some of her stuff, she already answers some questions there about pregnancy and the vaccine. She's very thorough, very smart, runs an immunology lab, and that's who you should be listening to for this kind of advice. Okay. Okay. And she actually takes questions. So you could probably even get through to her with your questions if you can.

And I think the way to frame it is, how do we know there aren't long-term effects? I think that's really what your question is. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And go look through her scroll there. Look through what she's presented. She gets a little angry at the trolls and spent a little time fighting back on stuff. But when she's just presenting data, she gives data up to the minute in preprint even before there's peer-reviewed release. And she analyzes it. She talks about it.

You'll know I've sent you somebody somewhere good as soon as you start watching her stuff, okay? At Laughter In Light. All righty. Good luck with that. Thank you so much. I'm going to wrap things up, everybody. We thank you for asking the great questions. We thank you

for joining us here on The Thread. I thank you guys for being on the restream here. It's a very interesting afternoon. I'm going to end the Club Thread. I thank you guys for being on the restream here. It's a very interesting afternoon. I'm going to end the Clubhouse room. I thank you all for having been with me. Yep, we're going to end that room. And I'm going to say thank you, Caleb. Thank you, Susan.

We will be in and around here tomorrow. Is that true, Susan? Tomorrow about 3 o'clock. Yeah, we have Dr. Kelly Victory. Dr. Kelly Victory is going to make a performance. See how she's feeling these days. Yeah, see if she adjusts her position at all. If she has similar ideas, different ideas.

She'll be like, I told you so. She may be told you so on certain things, but I bet she adjusted her position on some stuff. And we're going to go out with Lisa Vanderpump. Is that the plan? Yes. Good times. Okay, I've got to go make a pizza.

All right, thank you so much for joining us, and we will see you tomorrow at three o'clock pacific ask dr drew is produced by caleb nation and susan pinsky this is just a reminder that the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care or medical evaluation this is purely for educational and entertainment purposes i'm a licensed physician with over 35 years of experience but this is not a replacement for your personal physician nor is it medical care. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger,

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