Ask Dr. Drew - Pneumonic Plague In Russia: Researcher Dies After Breaking Test Tube, ~200 Now Quarantined – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 673

Episode Date: October 6, 2026

A 28-year-old researcher died from a “pneumonia of undetermined origin” after breaking a test tube in a Russian anti-plague lab. Nearly 200 people are now in quarantine over fears of a pneumonic plague outbreak in the Siberia region. Untreated pneumonic plague has nearly 100% fatality. The White House is monitoring the situation. But even the World Health Organization says, based on the current information, “the public health risk to the general population appears to be low.” Is this simply another round of media pandemic panic – and will they vanish from the headlines as quickly as cyclospora, measles, bird flu, and monkeypox? Steve Kirsch breaks through the press-induced anxiety over minor biological threats, analyzes Florida’s landmark consumer protection lawsuit against pharmaceutical companies, and reveals new research on blood-brain barrier permeability. James Lindsay examines the escalating riots tearing through France, the tactics of revolutionary political movements, and why Western legal systems tolerate street violence while censoring online speech. James Lindsay Ph.D. is an author, speaker, and the founder and president of New Discourses. He holds a Ph.D. in mathematics from the University of Tennessee and is best known for his criticism of “Woke” ideology, the Grievance Studies Affair, and his bestselling books including Race Marxism and Cynical Theories. He hosts the New Discourses Podcast. Follow at https://x.com/conceptualjames Steve Kirsch is a Silicon Valley entrepreneur, MIT graduate, and philanthropist who has founded seven companies. He is the founder of the COVID-19 Early Treatment Fund and the Vaccine Safety Research Foundation. Kirsch has one of the most widely read Substacks in the world at https://stevekirsch.substack.com/ and can be followed at https://x.com/stkirsch 「 SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS 」 • FATTY15 – The future of essential fatty acids is here! Strengthen your cells against age-related breakdown with Fatty15. Get 15% off a 90-day Starter Kit Subscription at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/fatty15⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • PALEOVALLEY - "Paleovalley has a wide variety of extraordinary products that are both healthful and delicious,” says Dr. Drew. "I am a huge fan of this brand and know you'll love it too!” Get 15% off your first order at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/paleovalley⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twc.health/drew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Executive Producers • Kaleb Nation - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://kalebnation.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • Susan Pinsky - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/firstladyoflove⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Content Producer • Emily Barsh - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/emilytvproducer⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

My reg league goalie says he plays for the love of the game. You gave up six goals last week, Steve? Maybe play to win, huh? Like with Bet365, I get paid the second my team goes up big with early payout and can cash out at any time before the game ends. Steve, Bet365, the home of winning early. Must be 19 and older, Ontario only. Please play responsibly.

If you were someone you know is concerns about gambling, visit connectsontario.ca, or call 1866-5-1-2,600. Terms and conditions apply. Once we get started, I'm going to give you a few minutes on the Russia so-called anti-plague lab accident that clearly happened in Russia and the poor young lady that died as a result. We'll get into the details. I do not want you panicking about that. You've been through, just to name a few, cyclospora, measles, bird flu, monkeypox. Are you dead yet? They've been killed anybody you know or you? No, we're fine. They've made a meal of each of them. They've tried to induce panic.

strangely this one they seem to be kind of handling kind of appropriately i'll tell you why steve kersh comes in also founder of vaccine safety research foundation talk about the latest panic cycle florida's legal action against pharma his latest clinical data you can follow steve at s t k-irsch on x but first up we are going to talk to james lindsay paris is on fire again i've been watching this very closely uh james is the author of new discourses and co-authorizing of one of my very favorite books to try to make sense of our current situation. Cynical theories. I cannot recommend cynical theories strongly enough, so I'm imagining that new discourses is

equally as powerful. We're going to analyze the unrest tearing through Europe, the mechanics of anarcho-tirity, post-structuralism, and cynical critical theories. Governments tolerating street violence and whether or not things will change. To my eye, the French have had about an... of this. You can follow James at Conceptual James on X. Back in a minute, I'll give you a few minutes on the, should we call it the Russia Gate? The Russia Plague. Our laws as it pertain to substances are draconian and bizarre. The psychopaths start this. He was an alcoholic because of

social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction. Fentanyl and heroin. Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for a shit. Where the hell you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveland all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. You have trouble. You can't stop and you want to help stop it. I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. I misspoke. New discourses is James's speaker series, which I'm going to dig into immediately. Again, James is somebody I've been looking forward to talk to for a long time. Let me just give you a couple minutes on the Russia plague incident.

Many countries have been looking at bubonic plague, sorry, pneumonic plague as a potential bioweapon for sure. Whatever they have in Russia, we apparently have here. Russia has as many as 65,000 workers in this setting of bio-warfare or has had that, and they have this anti-plague set up. at least they had the decency to kind of report it to the world, unlike Wuhan, who still hasn't taken Chinese Communist Party, is still not taking accountability for what happened there. And this young lady, she's like a 20, late 20s, she broke a vial. When the first responder showed up, she said, I've been exposed to plague.

She was taken to the hospital and she was dead by the next morning. Plague does not normally do that. Pneumonic plague does not normally transmit in that manner. Pneumonic plague is a particulate, it's droplet transmitted. You have to sneeze on somebody. You have to have a cut or in the mouth or something of that sort. But in this case, when you develop the pneumonic plague into an aerosolized form, which is not its natural form, now it's a weapon. Okay?

How contagious it is, we don't really know, though generally even aerosolize, it's very difficult to get person to person. Neumonic plague. Pneumonic plate is treatable. The quinolone treat it quite nicely, sometimes with amino glycoside if you're hospitalized, needs to be treated early, very early. Bubonic plague, which is the black plague because of the boobos that develop all over the place, bubonic plague is something different and it is treated with doxycycline. Caleb, I see you working on all my stuff here.

Are we okay? Do you need to do anything? Yes, no, you're all good. I'm just trying to fix that little bit of distorting. coming from the mic. I fixed it. You're good. Ah, okay. We're using a new mic and we got an urgent situation here with our sound. So sorry

about that, everybody. So in any event, doxycycline for a bubonic plague, Cypro or other quinolones plus amicason or other amino glycosides work usually very well. But this young lady was exposed to

so much, it appears that it overwhelmed her system. So there is not nothing to worry about, but I think our government is doing exactly the right thing. There is an interesting reminder to be had here with all this, which is we are always one airline away from something breaking out, right? Somebody with the exposure gets on a plane, exposes everyone on the plane. Now we've got a problem. But this is not that kind of thing. It's not highly, not highly transmissible. All right. Let me introduce you all to James. Get the book. It is called Cynical Theory's.

Read the book. I cannot, I cannot recommend it strongly enough. New discourses, dot com. His other books are the Marxification of Education and how to have impossible conversations. A very practical guide. I think I should read that immediately. He's written about a half dozen other books. Those are the notable books from the producers here. Conceptual James on X, new discourses.com for the speaker series. James, I appreciate you being here. Hey, yeah, it's absolutely my pleasure, Dr. Drew. Good to see you. So I want to do two things. I want to frame this in the way you did in the cynical critical theories, which is essentially,

and then also talk about this present moment in France, and then we'll get into sort of broader topics. But cynical theories started talking about the horrible ideas presented by post-structuralists, who, by the way, were largely abandoned everywhere throughout the world except the United States. and now because we decided they're cool again, they made their way back to Europe. Yeah, that's kind of long and short of it. These guys are, I mean, there's a lot of intellectual history we could discuss. I mean, they're post-Marxists technically, which means they're in the line of Marx. Marx himself is a German derivative of the line of Rousseau.

But then there's also the they were the line of the existentialists who kind of came straight off of Rousseau. So it's kind of like two channels of Jean-Jacques Rousseau remet in these post-Strault. structuralists, and they basically had this crazy idea that truth is not real. It is contingent. It is located within a culture. And so whatever a culture decides is true is what is true for that culture, but not necessarily for other cultures. And then power dynamics determine how you're going to resolve conflicts between competing truth claims. The oppressed side of the conflict has a greater claim to truth because of their suffering, and truth is relative, so you have to go with them. Yeah, and let's remind us also about Rousseau, although he was brilliant, wrote operas, played the piano, wrote the famous treatment, social theory.

He was a horrible human being. He was a terrible human being. In his first, one of the first autobiographies ever written, he talks about how he set up some young girl for something he stole, probably ruined her life forever. Then he went about as an adult, had a concubine that he hauled around all throughout the world as he went around lecturing and had five children with her, each of which were, he forced her to leave at the steps of a, you know, an orphanage where the survival rate was 5% or something. I mean, this is, this guy was there. And then later in life, has a carriage accident and becomes acutely paranoid and just preoccupied with his compatriots. I mean, yeah, I don't normally love to do kind of ex homonym arguments where we look at the

character of the philosopher. but in some cases, and Rousseau's being one of those, Michelle Foucault, the leading kind of postmodernist being another, you absolutely have to. These are actually pretty terrible human beings. Karl Marx is another example where you cannot ignore the degeneracy of the guy when you try to understand his theories. And so Rousseau, not just this, though, you just described his degeneracy with his own ill-gotten children and the way he treated him. He then goes on to write one of the most famous books of the 18th century discussing how children should be raised and educated, even though he refused to actually do it himself.

So this guy's a total mess. And so his philosophy almost has to be read as like a set of excuses for why he should be allowed to behave badly. And people who take up his cause deserve to behave badly because they're more enlightened than others. You know, his philosophy boiled down at one point. He said, man is born free, but everywhere he's in chains. And the chains are all these social restrictions like having to take care of your own kids

and act like a grown adult in life that he thought were. actually imprisoning people. And this idea, of course, becomes kind of a motivating factor for Karl Marx, for the French Revolution, for the post-structuralists, for Michelle Foucault with his crazy and dangerous ideas about sexuality, age of consent, and all kinds of things that can't really be mentioned in polite company. Yeah, it also moved people away from reality. No wonder they thought it was located somewhere else, but both Rousseau and Foucault made outrageous claims. with zero evidence, just based on their own opinion. Yeah, they, I mean, again, another controversial philosopher is Friedrich Nietzsche.

But Nietzsche had this one famous remark that I really like that he says that the philosophers aren't really, you know, analyzing wisdom or reality so much as they're rationalizing their own pathologies. And I think it really stands out when we look at this particular line of thinkers. Yeah, I think you were right. So let's let's go. to France, make our way over there now. So one of the things, I became preoccupied with pre-revolutionary France in particular for a couple of reasons. But one was, it was the closest thing I could find to the personality pathologies predominant in our current time. And so 20 years ago, I looked at that and I said, oh, we're going to have guillotines too, I guess. There's going to be mobs and there's

going to be guillotine. And lo and behold, here we are. I didn't know about social media. didn't know about cancellation culture, but that's what happened. But one of the most curious things to me is how if you listen to a French speaker, minimum 10 minutes go by before the number 1789 comes out of their mouth. They are absolutely obsessed with it. They dismiss, much like Rousseau, horrible behaviors. He's a libertine anyway. Or just terrible.

Even the terror itself is sort of like, oh, no, you know, Rose Pierre was doing the best he could. but he was a very principled guy. They were attacking us from the outside. What are you supposed to do? It's insane. And I talked to a French politician. I go, what is that? He goes, oh, it's the left.

The left believes history began in 1789. But it was a complete mess. So, A, are we seeing echoes of that now? Is that what they're dealing with? And B, what is your opinion about what's happening with these so-called students in France right now? I mean, you know how sometimes if you go to the mountains and you yell, you don't hear echo. you hear echo, echo, echo, echo, echo. That's basically been like the last century.

We keep hearing echoes of the French Revolution. Everything Marx wrote, he's looking back, not just at the Paris Commune, but the attempted revolution in France. Everything that Lenin tried to install was inspired by this. Rousseau's philosophy inspired all of these German idealists that gave them their ideas. The Jacobins gave them their methods. That's right. And so it's echo after echo after echo.

And like we mentioned with the postmodernist, these lines of thought kind of came back together in the 1960s, 1970s, especially going from the 70s into the 80s and mostly in America, and now we've re-exported that to Europe. So we're definitely hearing an echo of that. And the echo is this general idea, what 1789 and the left boiled down to

is that terror is a legitimate instrument of virtue, and they believe that they have cracked the code on virtue for all men. That's why they believe it's when history began. It's because it's when we figured out the virtue code. and so history had to be written anew in blood. So are these students? Who are these people? Well, I mean, the thing that's going on in France right now is apparently quite complicated.

If you actually try to get under the headlines under the surface, my social media feed for days has just been absolutely flooded with like some of the most horrifying images, people on fire, people being sprayed in the face with a homemade flame terror. I mean, just beatings and violence everywhere. Fire truck rolling down the street. undriven, full of flames. I mean, just horrible things. But if you actually get underneath that surface and say,

okay, well, what actually happened here? It appears that the school situation that the students claim to be protesting really is bad. So I think it's important to recognize that there are, this is the, this is the dynamic in many cases, just like with the French Revolutionaries. Hang on. What do you mean bad? What do you mean? I mean deteriorating.

The recent survey, the recent survey where they're all failing and they're none of them can read her welcome to America. Yeah, well, that's happening everywhere too. And I think this is going to be part of the broader story. But I mean the degenerated conditions of the school buildings themselves, of the faculty and staff itself. I mean, the students had reasons to be upset, but they've also been whipped up. And this is the formula we almost always see, legitimate grievances that turn into illegitimate actions. It's a very simple formula. You take something that's a kernel of truth, a kernel of real grievance or real anger, decades of mistreatment, decades of unfairness, a failing system, kids not being able to read,

whatever it is. And you use it as a justification to whip up the worst elements and set something loose that once it kind of hits the streets isn't easy to stop. Then what follows is the blame game where everybody tries to point the finger at each other. And therefore, in a very postmodern sense, nobody knows for sure what the truth is. It's hard to figure out who started the problem. It's hard to figure out what the solutions look like. And I would submit to that this chaos is the revolutionary model. It is a fundamental part of the model. And we're seeing it exactly because revolutionaries in the end will benefit from it.

Yeah, that does seem to make sense to me. You know, I've been watching the French carefully for a couple of years. And about four years ago, just in the heels of COVID, I saw some of the, for some reason, I became, I get preoccupied with things. I got preoccupied with Napoleon. So I started listening to lectures in French. about Napoleon. And this one guy, what's his name? I can't reason.

I got like a Polish name. And he goes, you know, we really got to take a look at what it means to be French. And we've lost track of it. And I thought, oh, that's what? Whoa, whoa, whoa. That is a massive turn in the direction they've been going. And he said, you know, he started essentially defending Napoleon as something, you know, made some mistakes, but he's part of our history and we need to embrace it, blah, blah, blah.

And it has moved on from there. where if you listen to talk radio in France, every, you know, outside of the big, outside of Marseille, and to some extent, even in Paris, the callers are like, I'm sick of this, I'm sick of this. What are they doing with the budget? What are they doing with this? Everything's a mess.

And my question is that all that is factually true, is this going to propel Marine Le Pen into the presidency? That's entirely possible. We're kind of seeing this all over. I mean, the other thing that my social media feed is saturated with right now is all of this kind of very quick right-wing shift in South America, which is obviously not the same as Europe, but we're seeing these kinds of movements in Europe.

We're seeing them take over in South America. We're seeing them rise in North America. U.S., Canada's not really pulling it together on that. And this, in fact, in my opinion, cuts both ways. There are good elements to this or bad elements to this. My guess is that what's actually happening, if we zoom out from the schools, we zoom out from the fire, we zoom out from the violence, and we say, well, what's going on here, right?

So the idea is generally speaking that there's this action-reaction cycle in the revolutionary process. The Jacobins didn't have this as much. The revolutionary technology was a little bit lower. But higher revolutionary technology has an action-reaction process. You've probably heard the phrase action-reaction solution as a dialectical means of transformation of a society. And so the idea is going to be to try to gin up these polarized sides, a far right and a far left, both of whom can't stand each other, and let the conflict play out until, in my opinion, the people who want some longer range goal are able to step in and say enough is enough.

And that longer range goal usually for our period of time looks like something that they cooked up in China, like a surveillance date to finally quell the fires to put everybody in their place. Maybe it's a, I don't know, the joke is fun, the two-state solution for France. But I see these exact same currents that you're seeing. and I see them not just in France, but in the UK, in Germany, to a degree in Belgium. And then we have a mirror image of that that's taking place in the Western hemisphere in the United States. And then, you know, more recently swinging to the right in Central and South America. So I think what we're seeing in the big picture, if we zoom all the way out, is the deliberate constant destabilization of the left.

Or sorry, of the West. We're going to destabilize that while these other places are being fortified. China, India, and so on. You don't see these, Russia, you don't see this unrest there. Those places are being fortified while the West is being destabilized, and that paints a geopolitical picture that the West is supposed to come down and something new is supposed to come in. And I think when the boiling point gets high enough on these conflicts, that's where this goes. That the West comes down. That the West is weakened enough so that it either comes down or that it adopts the same control.

mechanisms as the solution set that put us under the same boot of tyranny. There also is the, it's interesting, it's like, you know, GWF Hegel is now operationalized as some sort of procedure. But there also is, you know, I mean, Machiavelli pointed this out and others have as well, which is the strong man could show up. That doesn't have to be a surveillance state, right? That could be just somebody who somehow has sway over all this nonsense. Right.

And so that's what we're seeing, I think, in South America as kind of an offer. Like I said, my propaganda on my social media, which I just generally, by the way, consider my social media feed propaganda, period. I don't even try to pretend that it's something other than that. So what I'm seeing is, oh, wow, of course something interesting is happening in Brazil. Of course, Lula is terrible, and it's very good to overthrow this pretty clear communist. And I don't necessarily have too much beef with Bolsonaro, but we have, you know, Buckele, we have these other guys, not Millie, who's a classical liberal, but if it's risen to power,

and they're the strong man, and they are held up as like the new model, you know, the left is run amok. What you need is a guy like Buckele to come in and clean everything up. Same kind of thing in Columbia. And so the strong man model as the solution is being sold. So what I'm seeing, and this is, frankly, you know, this kind of bugs me, Drew. What I'm seeing, my feed all day today on social media has been, America has two choices, France or Brazil. And I sit there and look at it and think, what the hell are you talking about?

We have America, that's a choice. When did that stop being a choice? Right. And so we have a fundamentally different model, a fundamentally different system. And I think there is a strategy to induce people into this false choice between the right-wing strong man and the left-wing surveillance state, both of which threaten individuals. liberties across the board. And so, you know, these are the kind of, like, we're looking at fires in France, and this is the kind of stuff that I think about.

No, I think ultimately it is the genius of our state system and trying to keep back the federalizing of our national government to high a degree. We shall be reading the federalist papers again, it seems to me. But that that is such a genius system. My friend Adam Corolla says, what's going to happen is the states are going to break down into safe spaces and octagons. He keeps saying safe spaces and octagons. And that may be the two state, literally, system we end up with. We get a California and we get a Florida.

And we have luggage. We can move around. Yeah, I've been wanting to have something, you know, it's in the back of my head. I don't know that I'll ever start it as an official nonprofit or an organization, but it's been in the back of my head, the 50 stars project that, no, We don't need to balkanize or split the United States. We don't need to separate into the blues and the reds or into a constellation. You know, maybe it's that there's all these tensions around Indian Americans, around Muslims, around Christian nationalism, all this stuff, all at the same time.

We don't need to separate into a bunch of kind of fractured affinity groups. We need to stay together and we need to defend our Constitution. If people want to dive in on the Federalist Papers and they don't know where to start besides number one, I recommend a number 51 pretty strongly. It's by James Madison. And it talks about the crucial value of limiting federal power while also having some and then dividing those powers, dividing faction against faction and self-interest of each level of the faction so that you don't have any group that's able to tyrannize the system. And I think that this is an incredibly important moment for Americans to kind of realize that breaking us apart, old school, divide and conquer. is happening not just in America, but in the UK, in France, and Germany, and across the West,

while all of these other places, South America, India, Russia, China are all fortifying and unifying. That's a scary transfer of geopolitical organization that we should be thinking about. Okay, we've got to kind of wrap things up. Other than reading Federalist 51, what other prescriptions do you have? Yeah, thanks for asking. I think we actually touched on it, right? When you brought up that moment where you were shocked to hear that the French have to, you know, rethink who they are, right? The French don't remember who they are.

I think that there's something deep there. I think that there's something actually that we can even draw from kind of Jewish wisdom on this. The Jewish tradition remembers who they were. They remember what they went through. Their holidays celebrate what they went through. October 7th was on Simchat Torah, which celebrates the rereading of the Torah every year. We just passed that. They always celebrate who they were and what they went through.

And Americans, I've noticed this. I've been reading about the American Revolution. And I tend to say the Americans, this and the British, that when I start to tell the stories back to people. But that's not right. It's we and the British. We were there. We fought at Valley Forge. We camped at Valley Forge.

We fought at Taekondroga. We fought at the battle across the Delaware at Trenton. We fought these battles. Americans fought these battles. So we need to remember who we are, what our founders, were about. I would strongly recommend people look for one essay by John Adams, sorry, 1765. It's called a dissertation on the canon and feudal law where he lays out exactly what Americans are about and how we have to remember who we are and where we came from to save the country. Yeah, we fought

a revolution to be able to establish the Constitution. We had some brilliant people do that. We have state constitutions. We fought a civil war to try to bring ourselves into line with our intentions. We fought, you know, in Europe, which leads me to the other side of your prescription, which is these people who want to undo the Constitution? Who are you? Who are you to want to do that all of a sudden? After all these, hundreds of thousands of people died to build and defend this thing, who are you? Tell me why you should be given that privilege. It really is very disturbing. So, yes, there's two sides that. I will read dissertation and canon on feudal law.

Yeah, don't miss it. Preach, preach. That was a great. And finally, tell me about new discourses. What am I going to find there? New discourses is basically, I wanted to continue the work that I was doing, writing cynical theories, writing that book. And I wanted to have an outlet to put it out as quickly and as thoroughly as I could. So there's podcasts, there's videos.

Like you said, there's my lecture series on there as well. There are articles. Some of them are by other people. Most of them are by me. And it's basically as fast as I can learn about the threats to American liberty, the woke, the communists, the fascist, everything. I digest, metabolize, and publish that for everybody, mostly reading primary sources to people with my interpretations as I go. Back to cynical theories. Isn't Helen the Pluckrose a physicist? No, I have the physics background. She was a literary, she was a literary. Yeah, I'm physics and math. So I guess I'm just fascinated how this happened? People were wrong on the internet, namely the exact feminist, the post-structuralist feminists

that were downstream from Foucault who brought these ideas to America and gave them new life were wrong on the internet. I started to argue with them. I wanted to understand them. I realized there was a problem. We wrote a bunch of fake academic articles. That's the Grievist Studies Affair, got a bunch published through peer review. And then cynical theories was the story.

of what we learned without even talking about the prank we pulled. And then I thought, wow, this unravel civilization, if we don't stop it, and I asked my wife to quit my job, dedicate all my resources to getting this material out, as fast as I could learn it and publish it. She said, can you make money doing that? And I built new discourses to solve that problem. Yeah, I saw what Foucault did to mental health and mental health treatment and brain disease treatments, not that psychiatry should be defended in certain areas.

There's tons of reasons to be. you know, skeptical of psychiatry, but not on Foucault's terms. That was just ridiculous. And it's why we have homelessness, frankly. He was, he was the convinced people that psychiatric illness is caused by treatment and by institution. Another top for another day. I really appreciate your work. And I appreciate you come here and talking to us.

So I've got some homework assignments here with new discourses and the 1765, John Adams. That's right. 1765. 65. All right. And then we'll follow you on X at, I'm sorry, I lost that already. Conceptual Jane. A minute ago.

Conceptual Jane. It's very good. Thank you so much for joining us. We'll talk to you again soon, I hope. Yeah, me too. All right. All right. We're going to switch gear, take a little break.

And our friend Steve Kirsch is going to give us an update on his findings. And we're going to talk a little more plague and we're going to talk a little more about bio-weapons. There's a lot to get into with Steve right after this. Hey, Dr. Drew here, and we are interested in health and longevity, and the longevity nutrient is Fatty 15, discovered amazingly by a veterinarian who was responsible for the Navy's fleet of dolphins. Turns out, dolphins are healthier when they have adequate amounts of pentadecinoic acid, which is C-15. It also, for us, it helps humans as well, reduces the

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Hey, Dr. Drew here. And even when we travel, we bring the new convenient fatty gummies. They're delicious and they're portable and they're great. And remember, this is a longevity ingredient. It fights against the oxidated stress on our cell membranes. We call that process feroptosis discovered in dolphin research by Dr. Ben Watson. And I'm taking this every day, even when I travel. It's fatty 15. Now if you want to see stars, you have to watch them dance, dive, or go to rehab with Dr. Drew.

Dr. Pinsky told me that you are having some issues? He says I'm depressed. Are you? Here is where you can find Steve Kirsch on X. It is S-T-K-R-S-C-H, also VaxSafty.org, and his substack, Steve Kirsch's newsletter. Steve is a Silicon Valley entrepreneur, MIT graduate, who had the temerity to try to find the potential of alternative uses for various pharmaceutical agents at the outbreak of COVID, which is customary when we are in trouble and looking for ways to treat a new condition. He set up the COVID-19 Early Treatment Fund and the Vaccine Safety Research Foundation. him. His subtext is one of the most widely read. Steve, welcome back and thank you for being here.

Oh, I think we don't have sound yet. Maybe the mute. I just promoted you as a tech genius, so be careful here. We want to make sure. Okay, let's see. This probably works, but I mean, a little bit out of sync. There you are. No, no, no, you're good. You're good. I'm good. Okay. Yes? Yeah, you're good. good. So what is on your radar right now? I just want to bring it right up to the minute. What do you

worried about? I'm spending a lot of time on autism and the causes of autism and the causes of autism seem to be the vaccines. And this has been known for decades. And people have been gaslit for decades. Pediatricians tell the parents, no, no, that was just a coincidence. It wasn't the vaccine. This happens all the time. People think it's the vaccine, but it's just a coincidence. that we give vaccines around the time that kids get autism, so parents naturally connect it. Yeah. The problem, of course, is that we... A coincidence.

Exactly. The problem, of course, is that when you look at the statistics, there was a study done in 2003, and they recruited very neutrally into the study, and they asked the parents, what do you think the cause of your child's autism is? and the parents basically 60, over two-thirds, said it was the vaccine, even though they're being gas lit by their pediatricians. Right, right. Do you have any access to any of the, I understand they're starting, they are initiating a big study to try to figure out if there's any prospective study to see if there's any evidence. Do you know how that's going, what the plan is there? This is just getting started or do they have any data yet?

Well, there are probably some studies and I am not privy to them because they keep these pretty close to their vest. But I'm definitely talking to RFK and he knows about the study that I'm doing. And we're doing it very carefully to, we basically found a national autism organization. and they've got a large number of members, and they're very neutral. The organization doesn't have an opinion on vaccines or not and stays away from that issue. So that's the perfect sampling grounds. And so we've been given permission to sample those users, and so we can now pick from an unbiased sample,

and we can find out what the timing proximity is. because the research I've done shows that when you give a child a vaccine and the child suddenly becomes autistic, about 50% of the cases happen within two days after the shot. Now, that cannot happen if the vaccines aren't causing autism. So the excuse is that, Steve, you're just talking to the wrong people, you're just talking to a bunch of anti-vaxxers, and you're surveying anti-vaxers, and your survey is skewed. and I find out that when I go and I look at the data from the intake of neutral autism clinics, that they have very similar numbers in terms of their rapid onset autism cases happening.

So, no, I don't have a bias sample. I mean, I do have a bias sample. True. But the bias is relatively small compared to the signal. and the signal is huge. And the amazing thing is that when I reach out to these autism researchers and ask them if they want to be involved in this research, they want to participate, they want to help determine what questions should be asked and the design of the study, nobody wants to get involved. Somehow they're pretty comfortable with the status quo and they give excuses like, well, we don't have time or something else for. not being able to participate in this.

Now, look, if vaccines really don't cause autism, then this is the perfect study to prove it. So this is like the inconvenient study where Marcus Zervos basically said, I will do the study that proves that Del Bigtree is wrong. And he did the study on vaccinated versus unvaccinated. He found that Del Bigtree was telling the truth. So Zervos decided not to publish because it would destroy his career.

So that's, I guess, how science works. And it's very disturbing. You know, Thomas Kuhn wrote a book about this. I never saw it when I was in training and coming up and working. It certainly, it feels like there's maybe some natural life cycle to science where it becomes bureaucratically ossified. and then you're into trouble. I mean, Galileo ran into an ossified system,

and that's why they kept telling him to kind of shut up, Mr. Dr. Galileo, please shut up, because it would take so much to go through the biblical reinterpretation to say that the sun, you know, the sun, you know, didn't stop in the sky, it stopped because we stopped rotating or whatever. And so it's very, very similar now. It's, it has the feeling of a sciop and when people attack, anyone who wants to sort of raise questions,

that was always the most, that was always the highest order recommendation, is to try to disprove things, try to improve our scientific understanding, which just leads me to your story with the fluvoxamine. Has anybody ever thanked you for that study and for helping people with protecting their brains in and around COVID? Well, you have. That's good.

I'm glad of that. Maybe the extent of it. But I did go on, I was featured on 60 Minutes, and people saw me on 60 Minutes and said, hey, wow, saw you on 60 Minutes, impressive. And so clearly people knew about my work, but the FDA ignored the research. And they said, well, we don't have enough data on that. So this is a drug which is given it very much lower dose than the FDA dose. And it has a pretty good safety record, not exceptional.

But it was very successful in treating these COVID cases very early on, not just in clinical trials, but in real life. In the race track, which was highlighted by it. I used it for long COVID. and you and you sort of browbeat me a little bit about not doing it when you were right. And it did help me. It really did help. I was noticeable. In fact, I had to do some television production during all that. I started, I was, you know, I had long COVID. I was really running down. And the fluvoxomy kind of got me. I could tell the difference between taking it and not taking it. It was noticeable. In fact, people around me were commenting about it. It's interesting.

Yeah, I think Susan commented, right? No, no, she did, yes, but it actually was my co-host at a television thing I was doing. She goes, hey, you're looking to run down. And then later, she's like, oh, what did you do? Something is, something's better. I was like, okay, yeah. So, well, so here we are. It's amazing to me that I'll take a little break quick and then we're going to have more conversation here.

But it's amazing to me that we have this difference. in, say, European vaccine policy and mandates versus what U.S. offers. And then we have this difference in the incidence of autism in these two different populations. Seems to me that be the first place you look. You would just look where the differences are. If we can find other differences in child care or in exposures, whether it's glyphosate or radiation, or I don't know what. But let's look at that too if that's different than places where they don't have so much autism.

But to go, oh, no, you can't look at that one. That's bizarre. Yeah. And in fact, we don't have to look very far because the Amish in the United States basically don't vaccinate their kids very much. And I could not find an unvaccinated Amish child with autism. The child apparently doesn't exist. None of the... So I'm linked with people, with some Amish people.

And the Amish people, they have a hierarchy, the bishops and the deacons. And the deacons and the bishops are the two people in the community who are very well connected with other bishops and deacons. And they also are well connected with their community. So all you have to do is talk to one bishop or one deacon and ask them to question, do you know of any unvaccinated Amish child with autism? And the answer is no. It's there in black and white. And so people can then speculate as well.

Maybe that's because there's a genetic difference. But you see when children who are Amish get vaccinated, they do get autism. So it is not a, oh, they're genetically protected because if it was that, then they could get vaccinated and they wouldn't develop autism either. And then we would study what's genetically different between the Amish and the rest of the people in the United States. Now, interestingly enough that studies never been done in terms of identifying the autism gene difference between the Amish and. and people who are not Amish. Now, not very credible to say that you could not have looked at this because this is the most obvious thing to look at.

And then problem solved. We would find the autism gene. We would find out what the susceptibility is by doing the genetic comparisons. No, nope, not going to happen. So here it is. It's right in our backyard. And they're the perfect control group.

So what do we in the United States do about it? We try to force vaccinate the Amish so we can get rid of the control group. And that's what they're doing in New York. Basically get vaccinated or get out. I was just thinking about, I got to take a little break here in a second. I was thinking about vaccine therapies. And, you know, I still vaccinate my else. elderly patients with various things and pneumonia and flu and um no you shouldn't be doing that we

should have to talk about that when we come back well well we will but i don't understand what i'm doing i don't understand what with that vaccine but but um but the m rna vaccine for flu caught my attention and i'm like wait a minute you you you've had you've you have champion to me as a provider as a physician, that even though we only got at best maybe 40% of the variants that were coming in for the flu, absolutely the flu vaccine reduced hospitalizations, reduced late days lost at work, reduced severity of illness. That was championed for my entire career. And now you're saying, no, we need something better? Wait a minute. What doesn't work? I'm saying that research is wrong. There's, There have been multiple studies showing that the research is wrong.

In elderly, or in the sort of more middle age and adults? That's where it happens. Yeah, that's where it happens. The Simonson's study in 2005 and the Anderson study in 2020. These are two really, really good study designs. Yeah, I'm aware of them. I am aware of them. Okay.

Let's talk about them when we come back. All right. When we come back, we'll talk about it right after that. If there was ever time to be rationally ready, it is now. I urge you to consider getting one of the emergency kits from the wellness company. Because TWC has seven different kits that are customized for a variety of situations. Wouldn't be a bad idea to take a look at each. Considering, say, what we've just been through in California with the fires,

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as well as reducing viral replication in the airways. Go to Dr.Doo.com slash TWC for 10% off your performance. Hey, Dr. Drew here. When I am traveling, I am always so grateful that we bring along Paleo Valley products. Both, this is the grass-fed venison, which is delicious, one of my favorite. Also, they have the grass-fed and finished beef as well, where they check in that pork. And the superfood bars, which have saved me a million times. It's made from the bone broth, which, again, is 100% grass-fed, finished beef, bone broth, and it's made from real bone, not hides, and other superfoods within this bar, including blueberries and cashews.

check the label. This is a great supplement and wonderful to have on hand when we're traveling. I don't see the profession doing anything to really build trust beside you. Happy to be on here.

Thank you for having me. You and I see the world the same way. What is it like for you to be the most chiseled and best looking man in media? Giving us the information we need. Thank you for the truth. My pleasure.

We are going to take your calls at 8333-D-R-D-R-E-W. ST Kersh on X and check out Steve's substack as well. Steve, before we go into the flu controversy, would you mind give me your thoughts, something I promised to do at the outside of the show on the Russia gate, the Russia, what is the anti-plague institute and the accident there? Well, I don't know much more than what you know. which is what we read in the press about it.

And it sounds troubling. And it sounds like the Russians are working on something that could be very destructive. And it seems to me that Trump's, Trump is spending billions of dollars on Iran. And only making people in Iran not like us even more, is the end result of that. And I don't think that's going to make us safer. I think that when you look at it,

there are lots of ways that people can attack us other than nuclear weapons. They can attack us through biological weapons. And Russia is the perfect example of that. So, okay, so how do we know that Iran isn't working on a biological weapon to get even? And so anything that we do that creates enemies, and we're spending billions of dollars,

in order to make sure the Iranians hate us. And it's just mind-boggling to me that we think that way. But now I'm getting a little bit off-topic from what you asked, which is, is it plausible that Russia could be developing a biological weapon and that this is the first sign of that? One has to be pretty naive to think that that, isn't happening. And the other thing that we should not be naive about is whether AI can be used to construct a biological weapon that could be much more dangerous than the biological weapons that

we know about. And we seem to acknowledge that that's the case as well. So here you are. That's interesting. If you're spending all of your time, if you're spending billions of dollars essentially making everyone in Iran heat us, what do you? think those guys are going to be doing with their spare time? I mean, it's so counterproductive. There are so many ways that a country can get

even if they don't like you. We should be spending all of our time and all of our resources, making friends with other people, rather than making enemies. That's probably the best course of action is to have great relationships with other

countries rather than what we're doing with Iran, which is... We were developing that with China, though. We were getting there. We're trying to see how that turned out. But be that as it may... Look at the U.S. and Canada, for example. I mean, what are we thinking here?

And maybe I shouldn't use the word we. I should use the word Trump. What is Trump thinking here? Like how... Well, you don't move yourself. ahead by making enemies. But you're, you are, you are inadvertently making Dr. Fauci's argument to make sure we also do gain of function so we can develop anti-measures and whatnot.

So we, you know, it's got to be really careful with this whole landscape. No, no, I, no, I didn't, I, I didn't, I never suggested that, that we should do that. I suggested that we spend our time making friends. I think that is, uh, fair enough. The, the most productive thing that we can do. It is, apparently it's known that many countries have this aerosolized version of pneumonic plague, that everyone's got it. The fact that this woman died of it so quickly is what's kind of disturbing to me. I mean, the pneumonic plague is not normally aerosolized.

It's a droplet derived infection. It's hard to get. It's not really human to human. You know, the bubonic plague is flea driven. We've got it in Southern California because of the lack of rat control. and the homelessness. I mean, we have these things around us. And most of them in nature, highly treatable with antibiotics, easily treatable.

And even if it gets away, IV antibiotics, amino glycosides, things like that really are helpful. But the fact that this one was overwhelming an hour, it's like, well, you've got to worry. It could just be that the dose he got was so intense that it just overwhelmed her system. But it's also possible that they've increased the pathogenicity of this thing. But let's go back over to the flu articles. You're referencing two articles that, one of which came out, what, two years ago, I think, and sort of blew holes in the whole vaccine. Was it older than that?

The Anderson study, I think, was 2002. Let's see. So, sorry, 2020. Is it the most recent? So that was six years ago. Okay. So six years ago. And the other one, the Simonson study is 2005.

Yeah. I know there was an old one. It got ignored. You got ignored. This one in 220 people are talking about. It's not that people are ignoring this one. They're still vaccinating. And what they will say is, well, we have all this data that suggests the vaccine.

Also, what do we do with the data that suggests it works? Which is fine. There's usually a back and forth in medical literature, right? Yeah. And so you have to look at the study designs and the limitations of the study designs. And people spend a career looking at that stuff, and most people don't. But the facts are that these study designs that people rely on, everybody knows they all have limitations. And so now it's just a question of, well, does the limitation apply to my particular study and how reliable are the results?

And the answer generally is nobody really knows because you don't know what you don't know. And so that's why this Anderson study, which was really, really well done, it basically used a method. It was a discontinuity design. And the method is such that it's very infallible and very immune to confounders that would typically affect other studies because it's so simple in its design. And the design, I can describe it. they used the UK healthcare system. And what they noticed is that when you turn 65 in the UK, you get free flu vaccinations. So what would happen is that 64-year-olds wouldn't have very high flu vaccination percentage.

But once they turned 65, the flu vaccination percentage drastically increased. So they had a perfect natural experiment where one year older, they're getting vaccinated at like twice the level than they were before. So they expected to see a discontinuity in the deaths in flu season between 64-year-olds and 65-year-olds. There should be a dramatic difference between those two groups because of the differences in vaccination. So this study capitalized on something that occurs in, in, nature, and in this case, because it was the NHS health system opportunity given to people. And so it took advantage of this discontinuity and showed that, oh, wow, when we have increased

vaccination, there was no effect on mortality whatsoever, no effect on hospitalization and no effect on mortality. The flu vaccine doesn't work. It's unequivocable. If the flu vaccine, it's unequivocable. If the flu vaccine worked when you get more of it to get more people. It's supposed to reduce the deaths. It can't get any simpler than that. So this was just a beautiful confirmation of the 2005 study done by Simonson, which is the NIH study, that the NIH forbade the researchers from talking to the press about it because it showed that the flu vaccine didn't work. So, Fortunately, they were able to publish. I'm also afraid that this is going to be used as motivation to get that MRNA vaccine more widely distributed it because the conceit that, well, conceit that somebody could be saying is, well, yeah, of course it didn't work because we only hit 20% of the variants.

So how do you explain? We couldn't even pick up enough. The power of the study wasn't enough to pick up just 20%. And so we need to do better at picking up the specific variants as they occur. That concerns me with very little look at the risk of that. Not not the solution here. The MRNA just makes things worse, right? The MRNA platform as a whole just is an opportunity to create autoimmunity where there was none.

And for your body to attack its own organs like we have with myocarditis. we have all these kids dying. Like, have you ever seen the number of child deaths in the press that we've had since the COVID vaccines rolled out versus before? Now, I just came back from my doctor because I burned my hand, so I got bandaged up by my doctor. And we got into a conversation, and he was saying that he was seeing myocarditis cases in his practice. He had six myocarditis cases in his practice in the last few years. And I said, were they

all after the vaccine came out or were they, you know, were you getting seeing myocarditis cases before the vaccine rolled out? All after it rolled out. All after. Yeah. And this idea that COVID does it at a higher rate is simply nonsense. It does affect the heart. The spike virus does affect the heart, but not this particular problem. Well, listen. You see the opposite results. You see all the myrocharditis happening in 2020. And then, oh, they introduced the vaccine.

Nobody's getting COVID. Nobody's getting sick. Nobody's getting myocarditis. Come on. You have to. You can't go from zero to six. I mean, even those are tiny numbers. But from a Passon point of,

Basan distribution point of view, that is a huge difference. You feel that people are more willing to kind of scrutinize. these things now, that the sort of, I don't know say the, at least the SIOP has settled down? Yeah, the answer is yes and no. So yes, people are more willing to have these conversations. But as I discussed with my doctor, I said, so how many in, so, and by the way, my doctor said no to the COVID vaccines, right? So he's clued in. And so I said, so how many, and he owns the practice. So I asked him, So how many of the other doctors in your practice feel the same way you do about what's been going on? And are they red pilled as well?

He says, I don't know. I'm afraid to broach the question because it's so politically radioactive. And so even today, even when the guy owns the practice, he is reluctant to bring it up with his coworkers who work for him to be able to ask the question because he's afraid of pissing them off and then having them. leave. No, no, no, no. He's afraid of them anonymously calling the state licensing board or some other professional organization. And in fact, he brought up Simone Gold. He says, you know, there was this ER physician that I know about. I was doing great work and basically told the truth during COVID and had her license taken away. And he was like very complimentary. He forgot her name and then he had to look it up and then, you know, found out it was Simone Gold. He was talking about it.

and he was surprised I knew it. Yeah. Well, Steve, I appreciate you continuing to bang the drum and to do the work that needs to be done. And thank you for fluvoxamine. And you've been a champion of trying to help people, trying to ask questions, trying to do the science that we've always done. And somehow all of a sudden we're not able to even suggest,

which is so bizarre. But any last thoughts where we wrap this up? You know, I used to believe in trusting the experts. And now I find that that is very unreliable. And doing your own research is hard, but it's much easier with AI. But unfortunately, AI is also blue-pilled. If you want more honest answers, there's an AI called Alter AI, which is available at

I don't even remember the URL. I think it's alter. systems. Let me see if I can find that. You can argue with AI. And if you kind of know what you're talking about, you can sort of bring it around, but you're right, it does have a bias,

a very significant bias. Very much so. And the CEOs of the AI companies admit that. And some of them are actually working on things to correct that, which is good. Because if we can correct one of the, if we can red pill just one AI system, that can be totally game-changing. That could really drastically affect the health of people throughout the world. I would say, Claude apologized to me at least twice a week after I point out, you have to go around like six, seven times and point out their flawed logic and their inconsistencies and things are not looking. looking at it will get there, but you have to know what you're talking about to do that.

That's right. You don't want to get gaslit by by AI. That's a, that's a bad thing to do. I try to avoid that. There are lots of opportunities. Yes, everybody thinks a good policy. Yeah. All right, Steve, thanks so much for being here. Thanks for all the work. Thanks, Dr. Drew. You got it. All right. We are going to be back and we, Susan, I have to actually dash out of here right now. This was a special Monday edition. here tomorrow. Rob Rosen, Kelly Victory will take over on Nick, Nick Holcher. I will be stopping by, hopefully schedule permitting on one of those shows, and then back again

on the 20 with Eric Molle, Muckle Gates, and others. Well, here's Susan. What's going on? Oh, I just want to say hi. Glad you got to talk to Steve finally. Yeah, yeah, finally, my goodness. We should, yeah, we should maybe give a, we got to do a show where we bring callers in for Steve. That would be very interesting. Caleb, anything I do. your end? Nope. I think we got all the tech issues figured out. So we'll be having you coming back in from New York

coming up. What's that? Thursday is the next show? I thought it was tomorrow. I have tomorrow on my schedule. The sixth is tomorrow. Viva Fry. Yeah. And Thursday, I'm traveling. Yeah, Thursday, Friday. Wednesday, I'm kind of out too. So, all right, you're out

on Wednesday. All right. We'll see tomorrow at 2 o'clock Pacific. Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. Emily Barsh is our content producer. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future.

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