Ask Dr. Drew - Solar Flares & Climate Phenomena: Astrophysicist Dr. Willie Soon Is Censored After Challenging Climate Change Science in Tucker Carlson Interview – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 328

Episode Date: February 28, 2024

Dr. Willie Soon – an astrophysicist, geoscientist, and expert on solar phenomena and global climate – was attacked online after making controversial statements about his climate change research in a recent Tucker Carlson interview. Dr. Willie Soon (aka Dr. Wei-Hock Soon) is an astrophysicist and geoscientist. He is a leading authority on the relationship between solar phenomena and global climate. In 2018, he founded the Center for Environmental Research and Earth Sciences (CERES-science.com) in order to tackle a wider range of issues and topics without fears nor prejudices. From 1991-2022, Dr. Soon was an astrophysicist at the Solar, Stellar and Planetary Sciences Division of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics. He served as receiving editor for New Astronomy from 2002-2016, astronomer at the Mount Wilson Observatory from 1992-2009. Dr. Soon earned bachelor’s and master’s degrees in science and a Ph.D. in aerospace engineering from the University of Southern California. Learn more at https://ceres-science.com/ and watch his videos at https://youtube.com/@ceresscience6032 「 SPONSORED SEGMENT FROM CHROMADEX 」 Dr. Charlie Brenner is a scientific advisor for Chromadex. Learn more at https://chromadex.com 「 SPONSORED BY 」 Find out more about the companies that make this show possible and get special discounts on amazing products at https://drdrew.com/sponsors • PET CLUB 24/7 - Give your pet's body the natural support it deserves! No fillers. No GMOs. No preservatives. Made in the USA. Save 15% at https://drdrew.com/petclub247 • PROVIA - Dreading premature hair thinning or hair loss? Provia uses a safe, natural ingredient (Procapil) to effectively target the three main causes of premature hair thinning and hair loss. Susan loves it! Get an extra discount at https://proviahair.com/drew • GENUCEL - Using a proprietary base formulated by a pharmacist, Genucel has created skincare that can dramatically improve the appearance of facial redness and under-eye puffiness. Get an extra discount with promo code DREW at https://genucel.com/drew • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at https://twc.health/drew 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 Portions of this program may examine countervailing views on important medical issues. Always consult your personal physician before making any decisions about your health. 「 SCIENCE NOTE 」 The World Health Organization states that climate change is directly contributing to humanitarian emergencies from heatwaves, wildfires, floods, tropical storms and hurricanes. Portions of this program may examine countervailing views on controversial issues. 「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/firstladyoflove). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. 「 ABOUT DR. DREW 」 Dr. Drew is a board-certified physician with over 35 years of national radio, NYT bestselling books, and countless TV shows bearing his name. He's known for Celebrity Rehab (VH1), Teen Mom OG (MTV), The Masked Singer (FOX), multiple hit podcasts, and the iconic Loveline radio show. Dr. Drew Pinsky received his undergraduate degree from Amherst College and his M.D. from the University of Southern California, School of Medicine. Read more at https://drdrew.com/about Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

we are going to get into a different territory today we are welcoming dr willie soon he's an astrophysicist and a geoscientist an authority in the relationship between solar phenomena and global climate uh in 2018 he founded the center for environmental research and he has been um you know another one of these voices that gets silence for daring to speak away from the orthodoxy. And of course, that immediately intrigues me. I want to see what I can learn. Although I don't have a horse in the race, I bet I'm going to learn something today. We'll get to know Dr. Soon in just a second. Also, and later in the hour, we have Dr. Charlie Brenner in here. He developed nicotinamide riboside. If there's one supplement that you

should be using using it is that one i am crazy enthusiastic about this and with dr brenner we're going to get into the science that'll be in about an hour but first let's get to dr soon our laws as it pertained to substances are draconian and bizarre the psychopaths start this right he was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography ptsd love addiction, fentanyl and heroin. Ridiculous. I'm a doctor for f*** sake. Where the hell do you think I learned that?

I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat. If you have trouble, you can't stop and you want help stopping, I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. So whether you have three minutes in the morning or 30 minutes to keep your face

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He has been in the middle of a little controversy around registering some opinions on climate change and perhaps a little counter narrative which to me is scientific just the back and forth of science is a necessary feature of science if you remember dr joseph freiman telling us about rational uncertainty rational lack of certitude should be our position in science therefore we should be entertaining all opinions uh dr soon got his bachelor's and master's in science and phd in aerospace engineering from usc please welcome dr willie soon oh thank you my my first question is how you went from aerospace engineering to geophysics.

Oh, okay. I guess I got a fellowship at Harvard University. And after my PhD, I reluctantly go leave Southern California, obviously. But it's such an attractive position because there was only three people out of 175 people that applied got in. So I was lucky one of those. And it is a very exciting time for me because I got to switch field. I was working on things called plasma physics, high temperature gases. Then I switched to study the sun. I have no clue what a sunspot is when i go to the postdoctoral fellowship to show you how uneducated i am but then by 10 years later i actually wrote a semi

popular book about the sun you know really diving deep trying to explain how does the sunspot activity comes and go why does it do so and then if it does that, for example, a period called Vanda Minimum, from 1645 to 1715, sunspot almost disappears. It's one of those very rare 70 years period that sunspot disappears. We can have sunspot disappear during sunspot minima, but only for a year at the most. This is 70 years. So that time was very unique. unique in fact it happens to fall into a period called the little ice age so immediately there would be some question would it is the

little ice age which means a cold period in fact little ice age is it goes on about 1300 to about 1900 a.d right so about 14th century to about beginning of 20th century. And it's actually a long period of time in which that is the coldest in the last, I would say even 10,000 years, okay, before the Glacial Maxima. So this is a very unique period. So why and how? Indeed, over 30 years now, I can tell you that we really, really have some evidence to show that this is something to do with the sun, obviously. Between the sun getting dimmer, slightly dimmer, but it's sufficient enough to trigger the whole Little Ice Age phenomenon. And it's called Little Ice Age because the glaciers are growing to a very large size.

You know, there are churches in Switzerland and many places where the glaciers growing, they're actually coming down the valley, I mean, trying to crush over churches and things like that. So you can imagine the prayer is very, very hard. Where was that program again, that you got the geophysics?

Sorry? The microphone glitched a little bit when you described where that post-post-postgraduate program was. Oh, it's Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics. It's in Cambridge, Massachusetts. Got it. Yes. Got it. Yeah, I actually lived with one.

I was there for 30 years. I was there for 30 years. Oh, my goodness. 32 years, yeah. I was actually, i lived with some in the 70s early days of this discipline i lived with some plasma physicists from mit and uh i would open their textbooks once in a while and just sort of marvel at what was going on so this has been a field of and obviously that you know people are trying to create

energy from this these days and i understand um but i got a million questions okay let me sort of try to organize my thoughts here first of all i want to just get into your training a little bit um how you know when i think about astrophysics i think about gravity and I think about fundamental sort of relationship between quantum physics and gravity, right? That people are trying to make these connections all the time. That's where I interact with astrophysics. Did you get involved in that mess at all? Are you involved in that mess, or you just went down a completely different path? Right.

My specialties at the Harvard Smithsonian was to study what you call the sun lifestyles. As you know, we have only one sun. And if you, I mean, so far we have since Galileo Galilei pointed the telescope 1609 or so, we have about 410 years or so of the data, but 410 years for a sun of 5 billion years old is kind of nothing. So the idea is the first Caltech PhD did this, by the way. The first Caltech PhD, the guy by the name of Olin Wilson, go up to Mount Wilson Observatory in Southern California and then decided that maybe we should map out the universe, look for the nearby stars, sunlight stars, in Southern California, and then decided that maybe we should map up the universe,

look for the nearby stars, you know, sunlight stars, to study whether they have this sunspot cycle. In fact, it is our project that proved beyond doubt that all the stars have this kind of activities. So it's a generalized phenomenon. And so you mentioned this 70- period with no sun sunspots but you also mentioned that something that's 400 million years old 70 years one year 700 years these are not statistically massively different units of time was it just a statistical variability or was there something significant about that 70 years that you were

able to learn about sunspots oh yeah yeah yeah sorry you know i say just a long stretch of time no doubt about it but the modern minimum happened to fall into a period in which that the coldest period during the whole little ice age is actually around 17th century that's part of the reason it shows you that the sun deeming sufficiently to to provide that causal factors in fact causal factors is the most quintessential point about science yes you want to know what is causing what right and then most of it you are statistical, but it is indeed a very difficult subject, just like people claiming that CO2 causing global warming. As far as I'm concerned, after 32 years of searching, I can't find it. They can say all they want, but I like to see the evidence.

This is part of the problem that I'm not just simply being, you know, what you call, just don't want to disagree with them, but I actually couldn't find the evidence myself. That's the whole problem. And then, unfortunately, most of the evidence they put out, it's all not so real, it's not so rigorous. So everyone has a hole in it, so it's not a very good explanation. In fact, we found that it's most likely explained by the Sun, and we have evidence to show it. We published paper.

We explained the reasons of the difference between my, our, our results versus let's say the United nation in the governmental panel on climate change IPCC. I mean, those guys are really, I call them climate gangsters. It's essentially that they don't talk about evidence. They don't want to debate. They just simply say, I am more powerful than you. You shut up, say nothing. So I'm sorry, that's not science.

So however they want to put it, it is not very satisfactory. And I know that people want to pick sides. I'm not picking any side. I simply want science to go straight, you know, show me the evidence and explain. I mean, what are the basic problem that after 30 years of work, in fact, I just published a major paper last year, was able to show that the thermometer data that they use after all these years

are contaminated by something called the urban heat island effect. No one was able to show that conclusively. I think our result achieved that status, that we showed that very conclusively. Now, I guess the ball is in their court. Let's see whether they can find anything wrong in our work, right? Fair enough. So I'm waiting for them to say something. Obviously, they will just try to ignore us.

In fact, one of the reporters wrote an article about our work in 2021, so like three years ago, asking them, why are you not referring to Dr. Sun's work? Oh, they say because Dr. Sun's work was published, you know, like not meeting the particular deadline where they are supposed to write the IPCC report. So, I mean, IPCC, they use a lot of claims saying that, oh, it's the most authoritative, the most comprehensive scientific report on climate science. But unfortunately, they don't

realize that when they make the statement that they couldn't include my peer-reviewed published scientific papers in time to even, you know, showing that their report is already outdated the time that my paper came out. So it's a very kind of a weak statement for them to try to say that, oh, we can ignore his work for now because it didn't meet the time deadline for them to write the report. So it's that kind of what you call weak argument. So what do your peers, you're 30 years at the harvard program i imagine you have

a large network of peers what do your peers say in regard to your data number one do they the ones that agree are the lot of them agree and what then do they say about the you know the international organizations that are trying to diminish it and the ones that disagree with you what is their argument i find none okay let me not oversell myself because actually some of the questions you should ask them but it is the fact that i publish all my works you know like it's published in peer review it's been reviewed by any of them it's open science is not like a hit and run you know like you find somebody in the face and then you turn around. Who hit me? It's not like that. You have to be serious. You write down your evidence and then you've got to give away the data. Things like that. Everything is open. But the problem is

all this thing has been published. I do have a lot of, by the way, here's a problem. Climate science has become so utterly corrupted that it becomes here's a problem. Climate science has become so utterly corrupted that it becomes a real serious problem. I mean, from the Nobel Prize Foundation, from the National Academy of Sciences, sorry for me to be so daring, who is willing to criticize all this big body?

But unfortunately, they all become anti-science groups because they simply refuse to engage in science. Every single time when I say, here's the paper, here's our work, can we discuss this? None of them want to discuss all of this. But our paper has been published. So we keep doing more and more work, more and more work to we are right you know or why we are wrong things like that so what i'm trying to say is that science is a live document it's a living document we continue to try to put out work right and uh so i have to say that i'm waiting for them to

challenge me directly and i can tell you honestly dr drew if they found anything wrong in my argument i'll just say yeah yeah, I'm wrong. You know, big deal. Well, that's the science, right? I'm sure you're used to that, right? You're used to people attacking your work because that is the nature of the scientific process. It's called scientific scrutiny. You withstand scientific scrutiny.

You respond to the criticism. You try to refine your position by virtue of the criticisms that come your way. Yes. I think you got it. I mean, you understand science, but the problem is that those guys, they are not engaged in science. You understand all their behavior. I mean, you ask them for data. They say, oh, I shouldn't give you the data.

Yeah. Listen, I opened up by talking about irrational certitude. Science is the opposite of irrational certitude. It's rational incertitude, lack of certainty, constantly revising our point of view. And it's all actually alarming to me because what you're describing is the same thing going on in the medical sciences, the CDC, some of the major journals, the same exact. And, you know, you tell me if you're saying this in your discipline. The first thing I noticed in the scientific literature is it all only goes one direction. And in my entire career, I've never seen science only go one way. All the major journal publications only go one way that's that's just fall it can't be just that's how science is

we're trying to get to a theoretical frame go ahead right for for climate science it's all about co2 causing all this thing it's just ridiculous mean, they are actually considering CO2 to be that knob, the thermometer, thermostat for the planet Earth. Turning left will be cooling it. Turning out will be warming it. But climate system is such a complex thing with so many variables, with even geology involved, with long timescale, short timescale event. Even the fundamental question about what is the weather and climate, it's never been resolved as a more

formal definition. The World Meteorological Organization likes to say that climate is the 30-year average of weather. But you know, you can ask the question, why 30 years? There's no such thing. There is absolutely no such thing. You see, then they say I'm the authority. Oh, you cannot challenge me.

Things like that. Oh, that's not a scientific discussion. Okay, you can say that. Good luck to you. In fact, I'll give you a round of applause for being so brilliant. This is what they do. Guys like Al Gore, guys like Greta Thun thunberg like all these third-rate scientists quite a lot of them actually i can even mention names i mean one guy presidential science advisor john holdren i mean they're talking trash every day all the

things that they talk about like they say oh global warming causing extreme weather but they can never explain it and the extreme weather mean but they can never explain it. And the extreme weather means that it's also extra snowstorm and things like that. They cannot explain all this phenomenon that is against the narrative. And then they keep spewing out all these irrational kind of excuses and justification and all this post hoc explanation which went after the event. They never tried to make some kind of forecast with the realistic hypothesis and then trying to see that whether, okay, I'm proven or disproven. They never function as a science. That's the problem. So by now, I would say that this CO2 global warming is only an idea. It's nowhere

close to being a theory or a hypothesis this is part of the problem that i've had with them for a very long time in fact all the statement that i i you know that i make here it's all been published actually i publish all these papers everywhere to try to express my perspective and bring in evidence scientific evidence you know to, you know, to show, you know, what is what. And this is why it's so confusing. You said it's neither. I get it. And I got a lot of questions. But the issue of, you mentioned it's neither hypothesis nor theory.

Would you explain to people why that's an important construct? It's the basic of the scientific method. Yes. The reason why it's important that when you make a statement, it better be something that can be verified and checked and all that stuff, or disproven to be wrong. This is actually

some of the science philosophers. The most famous one is Karl Popper, the guy from England, who always makes us say that science is about refutation. If you can prove your theory is wrong, then it's a level of science. Because all of these guys,

all they say CO2 causing global warming can never be proven to be wrong. And then they simply use words. They say CO2 is a greenhouse gas, but they don't try to explain how the CO2 operates in the infrared, the long wave radiation. How does it interact in the system, the long wave radiation, how does it interact in the system, causing, let's say, cloud to change or causing, I don't know, ocean to

warm. For example, I challenged a Nobel Prize winner, Stephen Chu, he's also a Secretary of Energy, who made the claim that rising carbon dioxide will drastically melt the Greenland ice sheets. And I asked Professor Chu, why don't you try, you are a physicist, by the way, he got his Nobel Prize for laser confinement, so why don't we shine a carbon dioxide laser like 15 micro wavelength? That means it's in the infrared.

Try to see that we can melt an ice cube isn't it i i challenge him actually this is the problem this infrared radiation is not doing any such thing when he make that kind of claim it ought to be challenged right it's a nonsense actually by the way when we say the sun is causing global warming well have a sunlight which is in a visible sunlight. Yes, sunlight, if you put a regular light radiation, it would melt the ice, isn't it? Things like that. And then it will

penetrate certain deeper layer of the ocean, which is actually where all the energy resides. And then infrared radiation, it doesn't even go to a skin layer. Micron, a micrometer, 10 to the minus 6 meter that's how small the effects can be and and part of that problem is that these people are not willing to engage in

that kind of discussion obviously and you mentioned carrie and i guess podesta now is in the mix what what what is there what is there who is ears? Oh, I have no idea. All I know is that my good friend, Professor Richard Linson from MIT, that's retired now, he called him the average D student. This is the revenge of the average D student. They don't want to learn science.

They never are good in science. They don't want to learn about numbers. And all they do is basically spewing this dogma, you know, just basically recycling information. I mean, Al Gore is one of the number one guys who actually are all constantly using his political power to force scientists to make statements that is not supposed to be true. I know a lot of this detail for example in in about 2006 or so he forced a scientist a scientist from postgraduate naval research i think it's in montreal california to try to make a statement that arctic sea ice was all melt away in like 2012 okay uh so can you do we have we seen the arctic sea ice all away? He forced the scientists to kind of make those

kind of computer scenarios. You understand? It's a computer game. Using a computer feeling that it's going to melt. Yeah, you can do that, but if you change the numbers that they use, it's not realistic. This is part of the problem. That's not science. And the computer model, it

never works. All the computer climate model they always don't want to talk about now by the way that's another typical strategy they don't talk about now because they say oh all we worry about is the future future increase of the co2 right

and then it's going to melt the ice green on ice shit melt even Antarctica you know cause polar bear to go extinct, have hurricane increased intensity. All of those things have been proven to be wrong because increasing carbon dioxide

is not going to change the intensity of the hurricane. They created a lot of fake things. I don't know if you saw a lot of fake news that say they want to call hurricane category six because they have no more skills. It's complete baloney, these people. it's really really bad stuff no and they make use by the way a lot of this is a collusion of politician and a bit of those uh what you call bad scientists plus media this three golden triangle is extremely potent in terms of spreading misinformation and disinformation

and then they don't allow any other dissent any other question and i am actually been doing this for a long time by the way so i was never always go along with them i used to kind of play a little bit because you kind of have to you know you, you go to NASA proposal review meeting, you try to be pleasant, but you always ask question. That's what science is all about. I get into science, not to get rich or get famous or anything. I get into science because I want to learn. Only want the truth and nothing but the whole truth. This is what the problem is.

These people are never, never interested in science. That's the problem. And I, I really have a hard time dealing with these people. All I have to do is that I kind of try to have debate with them many times. There's never a time that they're willing to debate you in public, things like that. So I've tried so many ways of doing things. Nothing works.

By the way, I just got invited to debate Professor Robert Sokolow at Princeton in fall. So that should be very interesting. But again, it's a mismatch. He's a professor dealing with energy policy. And he wants to have the policy to cut carbon dioxide, but he doesn't want to know that whether CO2 causes global warming. Think about the kind of, I mean, it's such a detachment, you know, like separate from reality. Well, if CO2 is not causing global warming, then why are we cutting CO2?

I've been always asking that question. And what's the most important point I have to say, no matter how many times you say CO2 is plant food, it's actually gas of life, right? If you cut CO2, I am quite sure the biological kingdom will be harmed, okay? And that's the problem. And they don't want to be. I ask Al Gore a question.

I say, yes, even if I'm willing to swallow all my saliva right now and say that, okay, you're right, Al Gore. You're cool. You're okay. But tell me,

why are you cutting CO2 emissions? Will you change the temperature of the globe? First of all, I don't think you can show that. Absolutely no evidence. Then, what if you harm all the biological kingdoms? What if you turn all the desert areas into complete wasteland? What if you do all of that? Who will be responsible for

this kind of idea that you are proposing? I mean, they have no answer. They have no answer. And Al Gore tried to invoke his moral authority. He said, oh, the chance to save human civilization. And I answered, me too. Part of the reason why I'm in this is that also I want to say make sure that science is straight these people are always having all this ulterior motive he wants to change

our energy infrastructure but he doesn't propose any alternative solution this is part of the problem if I may quote one more my favorite physicist of all time is Professor Freeman Dyson, the guy from Princeton. His name card is behind me.

But Professor Freeman Dyson said that CO2 is a gift of life. We should thank China. He said, oh, for burning coal and then giving us CO2. I'm sorry, it may sound a bit extreme, but he's a very deep thinker. He's a very, very deep thinker. He said a very, very deep thinker.

He said that he's afraid that China might want to charge his money later because of the CO2, the free service. So I want to give the answer. This CO2 is something very, very good for the system, and these people are just misusing it, misusing it. So we have to take a little break here Dr. Willie Soon is with us and for those of you that don't know the

basics of ecosystems what Dr. Soon is talking about is CO2 is pulled out of the air by plants and combined with water and made into glucose essentially through photosynthesis and that becomes the primary production of food

sources for the current for the herbivores and then the carnivores eat the herbivores and now we have our food kingdom essentially but you have to have those primary producers and primary producers tend to determine the amount of biomatter let's say that survives on the planet so let's take a little break. Also, when we get back, there have been some extreme phone outages throughout the country, and this may have been connected to, well, I'm going to ask you, is this connected to solar flares? What do you think? We'll be right back after this.

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We've got some very interesting things coming your way. Dr. Willie Soon is with us, astrophysicist, famous for studying the sun in a little bit of controversy around climate change. And before the break, I asked whether or not he thought the phone outages that have been across the country had anything to do with solar flares.

Is that possible? Well, clearly solar flare is possible to do all of that, no doubt about it. But for this particular event, it turns out that maybe not, because we do see a blackout, a radio wave blackout. But the radio wave blackout occurs for this particular event. It's about 3 to 30 megahertz. So it's that kind of wave. And the typical cellular network is only from 600 to 2,000 megahertz.

So it's a different wavelength. And then if we talk about 5G, three to four gigahertz so it's not in the same regime but it is true that yesterday there were two back-to-back within seven hours there were two x-classes solar flare and they're very energetic in fact one solar flare typically can be compared to up to a few hundred million to a billion of the atomic bomb. So it's very powerful in that sense. But unfortunately, a lot of these things, it has to be very specific to hit the Earth. I mean, we always have very large solar flare events, highly energetic ones. But then most of the time, they blow up somewhere else into space.

They're not hitting us. For this particular event, it did. It came because it's about sun facing. It's about to come straight to us. And it did come to us. We saw the events. Unfortunately, yeah, I think not much else can be said about it. Probably that AT&T company ought to explain what happened.

It might be some kind of internal thing that they were doing. And some people are talking about a lot of this conspiracy story, obviously. So I have no other opinion on that. All I know is that solar flare is a phenomenon that we ought to study and be prepared for. In fact, I'm very fed up also with a lot of this lack of preparedness. Because some of this solar flare and then another type of name called Corona mass ejection, these are huge amount of plasma abloid that come and then another type of name called Corona mass ejection, these are huge amount of plasma that come and then facing the earth and really will

disrupt a lot of events on the earth. And that will cause a lot of problem. You can even fry the electricity, your electricity grid and things like that. It happened many times in the history. 1989 was a very famous event, right? And if we don't have anything prepared for it, then we'll be in serious trouble because some of this large event is clearly imminent and possible. And we have seen that.

Do we have, is there any biological risk from some of this, or is there a potential or even theoretical biological risk? There always is such a thing, like higher x-ray event but but most of the time if you put a piece of cloth i mean that's enough to even show a lot of this radiation problem but what we worry more is about the charge particle the electric charge particle you know like electrons and protons and even helium nuclei, the nuclei of the helium. Comes flying our way. So let me ask you this.

Are we getting warmer in the globe, or can we even tell? But let's say you decided it's true. What's the sun's role in all that? Oh, all you have to do is actually come to my website, right? Ceres-sign.com, C-E-R-E-S-sign.com, where we have a few of our new paper that we just published. We basically explain that the way to look at this problem is to try to get the best measurements of what you call temperature of the earth. The old temperature curve that the IPCC, the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, and Al Gore and a bunch of those people use, a temperature record that is contaminated by urban heat island effect.

So we actually say that why don't we take away all the urban data and only look at the rural station data. And what we show is that the rural station data is actually have a character of warming and cooling, warming and cooling, more cyclical, more like an oscillation, calm, warming and cool every 50, 60 years or so. And then if we show that with the best estimate of the sun, yes, it shows that it fit. So now we throw the ball back to them can you explain this you know because we show that if you try to fit

this with a co2 it doesn't work because especially one one is very well known is that from 1940s to about 1970 remember that time the co2 continue to write co2 concentration but how does a temperature cool? Does that mean that rising carbon dioxide causing the temperature to cool? I mean, just because that you have one phase from 70 to now that is warming and then you have rising CO2, it's just one, right? Because from 1900 to 1940, there was barely no CO2 change. So it is CO2 idea. It's not working very well. That's part of the problem.

This is why I work very hard, not because I want to prove that the sun is doing that, but I want to seek the alternative explanation because it's not satisfactory. The explanation they offer about CO2 is just don't even cut it. I mean, that's the problem. So they score basically 30 percent yeah in the test i mean i want a hundred percent kind of test you know i'm not that kind of weak student that i just want to get 30 and then power on my chest say that oh i'm so smart mommy mommy i got a no no no no i want to score a means 100 or 90 at least you know what i mean

yeah but it is after all the revenge of the d students as you pointed out earlier So A means 100% or 90% at least, you know what I mean? Yeah, but it is after all the revenge of the D students, as you pointed out earlier. So what is your theory about what do you imagine is happening to science? This is a thought I have all the time. I'm trying to figure out what has happened here. Did we not educate people in science properly? Has centralization of authority just overridden the practice of science? Are people afraid?

Is there a mass formation psychosis? What's going on? Why has science been seemingly so adulterated? I can't explain it. I really cannot explain it, but I am disappointed for sure I mean the flow of information of science even now

has been interrupted in a very clear way as you imagine because I mean I just published a very important report today on my website on our series.sci.com website

which is to show that Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, these are all, if you count the number, it's close to 6 billion active users monthly. They are actively blocking the

interview that I did with Tucker Carlson a month ago, and don't allow any clips of it, at least put something to block it. And then the way they do that is that they basically give the authority to a group called Science Feedback, which means Science Feedback wrote an article saying, oh, Willie Soon is wrong on A, B, C, D, E, F, f g and then we answer a b c d e f g it was z so we go we go five times longer than that explain everything in full detail so i really encourage people if they're concerned about science somebody gonna send in comments and and i guess complain that they ought not to try to

use this sort of censorship to try to control flow of information, because I have always been willing to discuss science with anyone, anytime, any day. So in that sense, science is highly corrupted. It's funding. It's the funding of science that is a primary problem in that sense,

because people keep claiming that all funding from taxpayer, they like to say government funding is a healthy thing. I say, hell no, it's not. And then never mind that funding from pharmaceutical is also not very healthy. In fact, somebody just sent an email to me asking me if I want to do some work, if I get some funding from Pfizer. I said, no. Thank you.

Thanks. So let's assume that you know we have pretty good reach here and we get through we're able to sort of reach people through some of these censorship blockades and before we wrap things up here you and I what is it

you want people to know that they would have heard had Facebook or Instagram not blocked you well they should first understand that there are some that they would have heard had Facebook or Instagram not blocked you? Well, they should first understand that there are some of these censorship actively going on. I'm sure they see that in COVID-19 information and things like that. By the way, we are also actively publishing on COVID-19 also. And in terms of the peer review, we know it's only people that is saying their narrative would be allowed to publish.

And then ours will take extra long, which I don't mind, by mind by the way i'm always here so all i care is good science what i really want people to know is indeed we are doing the best we can and the whole system now is really broken in a very serious way on climate science because now there's just no no one you are not allowed to dissent you're not allowed to even share data you're not allowed even ask them for data data that we pay for essentially taxpayer so they are they're playing all kinds of tricks they either hide it somewhere and take a long time and then you have to be so persistent that you keep asking that every few weeks which is like a nanny watching a little kid so it's such a bad thing in that sense yeah overall i think that people should maybe the

first stop will be to come to a series that sign.com c-e-r-e-s that sign.com so please come by and then we have a lot of information and hopefully that you can start from there especially on climate science i'm not proclaiming that we know everything, but we have the best, what you call, collection of all the information there. And that is at CERES-Science.com. You can also follow on YouTube at Ceres Science, one word, 6032. So at Ceres Science. So at series science. So there's two S's there, C-E-R-E-S-S-C-I-E-N-C-E, 6032. And one last question for me.

I have a question too. You keep saying we, okay. You keep saying we and us. Who is in the we and us that you're describing? I haven't heard who's in there. Oh, okay. In fact, I would encourage you to invite my colleague, Dr. Ronan Connolly, especially,

because we have published a very powerful work on COVID-19, by the way. So we study seasonality in the human coronaviruses, and we show that it matches all the activities and events in Northern Europe, more so than any of this intervention, like vaccine or mask or lockdown, things like that. So we're able to demonstrate, we published a new paper on that. So yeah, my two other colleagues, Dr. Michael Connolly and Dr. Ronan Connolly,

they are father and son, and then myself. So three of us are basically the key guy. And then I can tell you that we work to close to at least a hundred different scientists from all over the world. So, you know, basically they give me data and things like that. And then we share our computer program, things like that, you know? So there's a lot of us. There's a lot of us. My group is very, very small.

So we need donation. But then, you know, we are very small, but then we are very powerful in that sense because we keep publishing paper that is of high caliber that, in fact, IPCC have no answer for. I mean, they are the ones who actually keep saying they are the authority on science. I mean, by the way, there's no such thing

as authority on science. I want people to be assured that. That's right. Caleb? Dr. Soon, so we're talking about the, I guess guess solar flares are a big topic today right now especially with all the phone outages and people assuming that those might be connected does this mean anything to you that there was a apparently a solar flare it was a 6.37 6.3 maybe about 45 minutes ago is there some sort of a weird pattern happening or is there because cause it's, they're saying they're like three X level solar flares in the past 24 hours.

And this one happened about 45 minutes ago. Wow. This is exciting. Yeah. Real time 6.3. I didn't know about this one because we have the 1.7 and 1.9, two days, seven hours now, another big one. And this is from the same region that AR13590. By the way, we memorized those. It's called active region. Inside this region, actually, it's about five times the size of the Earth,

this particular bright place, that big. So this shows you that this particular region is very, very active. By the way, you get solar flare because you have opposing charges. These are all plasma, right? Magnetic field, they meet together together and then the energy go nowhere. They have to release the energy in a very small confinement of volume of space. That's why it's so energetic. Like I say, one of these explosions is of the order of a, even a billion atomic bomb of Hiroshima, things like that. So it's highly energetic. By the way, the question to ask is that, can it get higher? Can the sun be even stronger?

The answer is that yes, it can be even a thousand and a million times bigger. That's the number that we want. That's what we do physics. We want to constrain the number. And that's the one that we have to really worry about and keep in mind that we have to be ready on earth. In case we have one of this event,

you can shut down the satellite but we don't want to have problem with our electric grid actually that's the most important thing to protect because that's the one that one of the electric grid if you don't prepare for it you'll be out for two months three months okay and then plus that most of us don't even make those transformer anymore all from china so we're're in trouble. So we better be prepared. How unusual is it to have these three X class in the past? I blessed this past 48 hours to have three of these, and they almost seem to be getting stronger and stronger as time goes on.

Is that unusual or does this happen frequently every few years? I think I'm sure it happened before, but this particular one X six point seven is quite is quite large, actually. Because the scale of this thing is jumped by a factor of 10 each time. So it's very, very large, this one. Wow. I never see a 6.9. Caleb, you better shelter in place, my friend.

That's what you got to do. That's wild, yeah. Thanks for the advice. No, wear something for it. It's a Faraday cage. No. It's a Faraday cage. No, it's a Faraday cage. You can protect him. That's actually a smart idea.

Yeah, a Faraday cage idea. My patients are onto something, just not on your head. Exactly. All right. Well, Dr. Soon, it's been an interesting ride. We will all go to take a look at some of your publications. I am all about dissent in science and discourse and refinement. And I appreciate you fighting the good fight because it is the scientific method.

And it's just been a very odd time when publications go one direction. You just know immediately something is wrong. There's literally nothing in science that goes only one way. So thank you for all that and hopefully we'll talk again soon yes thank you goodbye you got it that's really soon everybody so we're going to switch gears we're going to flip into biology and what's that susan what's that that was good you like that i it's way over my head like i don't know i but i'm glad you know it was interesting it was very interesting uh but we're gonna switch to biology okay uh and rather than there being um i'm going right to the source this time in terms of the science on this particular matter it is dr charlie brenner chromadex is the company you can find out more chromadex ch r-o-m-a-d-e-x.com uh you can also follow oh no you can also yes you can also follow

at chromadex on x true niagen is the product that's spelled t-r-u-n-i-g-e-n you can follow that true nitrogen.com or true nitrogen on x facebook uh slash chromadex and uh i have interviewed dr brenner before i was thoroughly convinced the first time i interviewed him that this was breakthrough uh biological sciences and i have been on his supplement ever since and so please welcome dr charlie brenner so there we are oh no we've uh you're muted for some reason there we are you're back yeah great to see you but i don't work for chroma x i'm uh i'm the um alfred mann family foundation chair of diabetes and cancer metabolism at City of Hope. So I'm the chief advisor for Chromadex and discover the vitamin activity of nicotinamide, riboside, NR.

But I run an academic lab here in LA County. Well, welcome. And how long, do you remember our first conversation together i swear it goes like at least 10 15 years ago right no you first had to go right into this five or six i was living in i feel like that was the second time we talked together because i feel like i've been under true nitrogen for about a decade but anyway keep Really? Yeah, I was the head of the biochemistry department at University of Iowa from 2009 to 2020. And I came here to City of Hope to continue my research program. So just give them a sketch, if you would, of how you ran into NR.

I guess we have to really break it down. Why is NAD important metabolism? How does it relate to cell health and aging? And how did you run into NR? And why is NR superior to some of these other ways of getting at the NAD system? Sure, sure. Well, the thing is that NAD is the central catalyst of metabolism. You know, we had a sun expert on here earlier, and you even pointed out, you know, the biggest picture of ecology, right, is that the sun hits the planet, right, and plants grow, and then animals come along and eat the plants. And then we either eat the plants directly or we eat the

animals that eat the plants and the center of the metabolism that allows the conversion of food into energy is nad coenzymes and nad coenzymes are also required for us to build and repair our bodies to maintain homeostasis. And NAD gets disturbed in the aging process and as we're exposed to conditions of metabolic stress. And so that's the use case for taking NAD-boosting vitamins, of which NR is the superior form. Talk a little bit about how NAD works in the system. It's determining the oxidative state of the cell, right?

But it's also driving and being driven from metabolism. Right. There are these four different NAD coenzymes. We don't have the whiteboard here, so we won't go too deep into it. But NAD is basically an electron carrier. So if you picture an electric car or even an electric toaster that's plugged into the wall, these are devices that run on high-energy electrons. Living things run on high-energy electrons as well. We don't have copper wiring to carry the electrons. Instead, we have NAD coenzymes. So, NAD coenzymes basically pick up electrons from the food that we eat, and then we use them to

generate ATP. And then we use those high-energy electrons to make nucleotides and lipids and to repair cells and to repair DNA. You can't live without them. I kind of think of it also as it's sort of the necessary ingredient to, I'm going to use a broad term, sort of anabolism or building, right? Yes. Would that be a necessary ingredient? And by the same token, right. And by the same token, if you go too far the other way in the NAD, NADH, NAD, NADPH system, you're actually in a state that accelerates breakdown, right? Yeah, well, it turns out that 10 different conditions of metabolic stress

disturb the NAD system, right? So we can't live without oxygen. We don't enjoy life very much without sunlight. And we can't live without food. And a lot of people have alcohol in their life. I always say, you know, if we were to have a giveaway on this program and offer people a free trip to Ibiza, right, everybody would enter, right? And they would jump in a plane and have a time zone disruption right then they'd be out in the in the beautiful sunlight and uh they'd be eating and

drinking at all hours of the day listening to loud music maybe on the beach, all of those things, the sunlight, the oxygen exposure, certainly the alcohol, overnutrition, and noise disturb the NAD system. And so in the course of our life, we experience conditions of metabolic stress that disturb the NAD system. Taking a supplement basically allows your cells and tissues to repair and to be resilient in the face of these conditions of metabolic stress. And I think people have heard of NAD infusions and Joe Rogan has been very public about this interestingly you uh you are you and i talking off the record we're talking about nad system and uh and covet at one point and it's interesting that joe's doctor did two two back-to-back nad infusions on him when he got coveted that oh this is interesting Go ahead. Yeah. So, late 2020, when we basically, you know, looked at each other in the laboratory in flight of stairs down from me was one of the few coronavirus labs in the United States.

And so we had already looked at the effect of a mouse, you know, hepatitis virus causing coronavirus on the NAD system, we'd already shown that coronaviruses turn on five different NAD-dependent enzymes that almost no one had ever heard of, attack cellular NAD, and thereby damage the innate immune system's ability to fight viruses. So it turns out that viral infection and inflammation attack the NAD system. And that we were able to show in this paper published in JBC in 2020, that boosting with nicotinamide riboside, you know, enhanced the innate immune response to coronavirus infection. People read this paper.

There have been four or five initiated clinical trials, one or two completed. One of them was done in Sweden and Turkey. phase three that showed that NR in combination with three other over-the-counter supplements accelerated time to recovery from COVID. But, you know, this is an evidence-based approach. Yeah, which three? I think they were, I'm not sure that the others were really important in the activity. I think one of them was leucine, which I don't quite understand why that would be used. You know, those valine, leucine, antiviral stuff

has been around for a long time, a long time. Yeah, so in this case, we understand what NR would be doing. NR would be allowing these five members of the PARP superfamily to work better in the face of this attack that happened. And so the cells see double-stranded RNA as a threat, and they activate the system, and your innate immune system is using NAD to fight off a virus. Other than, and I think this is my last metabolism question before I get to NR specifically, other than sort of helping be anabolic, what else is, I guess I'm asking, what is the direct relationship between NAD and aging? Right. So there's increasing evidence that as we age, that our NAD system comes under attack.

It's not entirely clear whether it's a timer or aggravated by inactivity and inflammatory processes, but NAD declines in aging. And so that's, again, that's part of the use case that NAD is critically important for life and particularly for healthy aging. And we think that NR is, you know, the most effective NAD booster. It's also the one that's sort of fully legal, known to be safe, and is, you know is produced by a company that cares about safety and quality. As God is my witness, if I had access to only one supplement,

NR would be that supplement. I'm just so enthusiastic about it. I can't even. The fact that it's not more widely used and distributed, I just can't get over it. I want to be a part of it being being used widely i finally i mean it's only 20 years ago yep i mean 20 years ago i think i need more 20 years ago we had our first graduated out of the mouse system.

And folks at Chromadex figured out how to scale up the synthesis. They licensed the IP from Dartmouth. And so everything was done the right way. It was safety tested, established as a new dietary ingredient, and got the generally regarded as safe designation and so you know i'm proud that you know this company did did things the right way i'm still a little unclear on dosing and i know you guys have iv therapies coming along where are we with that um I have no information into IV. So NR is orally available.

That's the thing. And safety tested in that manner. The clinical dose is a gram a day, right? And the initial consumer dose was 300 milligrams. But if you look at the 80 registered clinical trials, almost all of them are using one to two grams of NR per day. And we know it's safe. I need more. I need more true niogen.

I'm going to be taking three or four. I've had a feeling I should be taking at least 600 milligrams. And I've been taking either the fives or two. I think I'm taking 200 or something. Two of the threes. I think I'm taking 200 or something. Yeah, we've got to juice that up. Okay. Yeah. And then how, I guess we have to ask now, so why NR and why not NMN?

Right. So NR is the biggest piece of NAD that can get into cells. I guess we should thank David Sinclair for popularizing NAD. He's gotten people to take NMN, so that's good, but NMN is just delivering NR because NMN has a phosphate on it that can't get into cells. There have been some people that, you know, promoted the idea that there's a transporter for NMN that really isn't.

There's also not a safety path for NMN because NMN is being tested as a drug. So it's not approved as a new dietary ingredient. Companies that are selling it don't really care about, you know, what is in the bottle and are kind of like, you know, doing so in form of NR that was developed by Chromadex, is the best and the only fully legal form of NR. And this is really the gold standard for NAD boosting vitamins. And do you have sort of recommendations? In other words, so we're somewhere between 500 and 1,000 just forever? Is that the plan? And what age do we start?

That kind of thing? I mean, there are ballplay, uh, football coaches, um, you know, both, both two, two Chromadex advisors, Rudy, uh, Tansy and myself have been photographed with, with Bill Belichick, who, as you know, um, had a long career with the Patriots. Um so the use case for athletes is that they're in collision sport, right? And they're getting beat up on a Sunday. They got to go back to practice on a Tuesday and they might be playing on a,

at this point, they may be playing on a Monday night and then on a, or a Thursday and then another Sunday. So they are in a line of work in which there is a lot of repair. I think that as we age, the use cases for something like NR that boosts repair are obvious to people that, you know, when you fall and have a cut or scrape or a mild burn, people that are taking Nijen notice that their repair occurs much more rapidly. This is now the subject of randomized clinical trials in order to establish claims in this regard.

As you know, it's sold as a supplement. And so it says on the label that it's not intended to treat diseases and conditions. We're also very interested in having it tested in those diseases and conditions. In small trials of Parkinson's, there's been a positive signal. In seven different trials, there's an anti-inflammatory signal in human beings. And so we're really excited about the potential uses in medicine. But as for now, it's healthy aging and promoting repair. Yeah, I want to be able to push it out through my website. I just am such an enthusiast about this product.

And to people to get it now, they just go to just look up like Amazon True Niagen or Google True Niagen, something like that. That's right. Yep. T-R-U-N-I-G-E-N. And we may be getting our own link, the special link for drdew.com. We'll get some discounts. We'll let you know when that comes.

I could use that too. So yeah, there's few things I can say with such great enthusiasm and clarity as this. And not only is it not going to harm you, I am convinced there are significant benefits. And the way longevity is, the way aging is, the earlier you start, really, the better. I mean, certainly in your 40s, because the aging is kicking in, for real.

And you really want to start early on exercise and diet. And I think something like true nitrogen is a very, very, there may be other things coming. I don't know. But to me, this is a cornerstone of progress. And everyone should take full advantage.

We have all the neurons that we're going to have, right? And we're trying to maintain our skeletal muscle mass. Oh, yes, I am. Yes, I am. Yes, I am. Both the brain and the muscle mass. And it's getting more challenging every year, even with true niogen. But I'm convinced it has helped me along the way.

And it is not cheap. I'm not going to kid anybody. I'm a little... But it is worth the expense, in my humble opinion. So I don't know about all the getting to a gram. No, I'm going to have to see if they... Look how young Dr. Drew looks. Whenever anybody says that,

I've been on it long enough, Charlie, that I think to myself, I wonder if it's that true Niagin. Yeah, he's been taking it for a long time. I think we had, you guys were a sponsor for the This Life You Live podcast like 10 years ago. I interviewed Charlie for the Dr. Drew podcast a long time ago, first time. We're going to have to look that up. But yeah.

No, you guys were i think you're one of our sponsors for sure there was that too for that but that was that was after i was way all right somebody's saying should i take 150 or 300 i'm in my 30s i would say 300 for sure and as i'm talking to dr brenner now i'm i'm thinking 600 for me, maybe 900. So that's where we're at. How about me? You're the same as me. I need like 10 bottles then. I know.

Charlie, anything else before I kind of wrap things up here? I feel like we've sort of run through the basics. So the older you get, the more you should have, the more you need? Is that how it works? Not really. The key is, you know, for healthy aging, repair is really important. And the data really strongly indicate, initially from animal systems, but it's now being tested in humans, that NR supporting, you know, liver function, it's supporting heart function. The differences between the NAD precursors, the NR pathway gets jacked up when tissues are under metabolic stress.

And so we think that during conditions of metabolic stress, your body is looking for NR. That's why it turns on the nicotinamide riboside kinase genes. And so we're very happy that there's a safe form of NR that's available to people. And I'm delighted that you and your listeners are aware of this product. Yep. And I'll keep pushing because I just think this is... that you and your listeners are aware of this product. Yep, and I'll keep pushing because I just think this is, there's too many, we're too metabolically unsound. We're not doing all the preventative things we should be doing to prevent chronic illness.

That's so obvious to me now. All right, Dr. Brenner, thank you so much. Anything else before you go? My pleasure. And people can ask me questions on Twitter, at Charles M. Brenner, and they can look up our academic lab at brennerlab.net. Beautiful. All right, hope we'll talk soon.

All right, thanks so much. You bet it, Dr. Charlie Brenner, everybody. Tomorrow, I think it's Tessie at 11 a.m pacific is that correct everybody uh maybe we'll throw up the schedule here so i don't get off yeah it's 11 a.m pacific pay attention uh out for a week and then brett weinstein dave rubin kevin bass adam crowleyell, Jimmy Fela, Christine Anderson. We just got her rebooked. Fascinating. She is, look her up on Google and listen to some of her exciting

what should we call them? Rousing speeches. She's coming for you. Yeah, and this time we're going to try and get her on camera. Oh, was she off camera? There was a picture of this time. Last time there was some sort of a tech issue connecting, but we're testing it all in advance so you can see her this time.

So it'll be great. She was amazing last time. Solar flare, yeah. She was amazing. Must have been a solar flare, yes. And Caleb, get your true Niagen, I'm telling you. Maybe get your wife in too if we can get her gaffed on board. I know she likes supplements and things.

Oh, yeah. All right. So, yeah, it is. So here we are. We will be with you. Pay attention. 11 a.m. Pacific, 2 p.m. Eastern. And that is on a Friday, which we normally don't have shows on Friday

because I will be out. It looks like I'll be out next week, although I have not had a final confirmation of that. Keep an eye on that schedule. And thank you all for being here. I've been watching you guys on your, uh, restream.

And of course on the rumble rants and you guys seem to like Dr. Soon. So maybe one day we'll get him back here as well. It was an amazing little, amazing coincidence there that we had a gigantic solar flare right at the beginning of the show. And we had a solar flare expert on at the same time. Look at that. I dug it.

I'm curious how you knew it. Did you pick it up? People in the comments, people in the comments told me and I went and researched it and they were right. So yeah, thanks for the people in the comments keeping me up to date. Is that restream or where were they? They were on, I mean, some on YouTube and some on Rumble were leaving comments saying, oh, this just happened 40 minutes ago.

And so I went and looked it up. So thanks to the audience for that one. Amazing. And I don't think we ever got onto Twitter, did we? I think that we sort of, right? The Twitter spaces never really came back. Maybe that was the solar flare that did that. We didn't need it. We have plenty else going on. See you all tomorrow at 11 a.m.

Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, Thank you. that is available to me today. Some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was published. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger,

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