Ask Dr. Drew - Vaccine Mandates for Children? "Canceled" Journalist Rav Arora & Steve Kirsch Discuss – Ask Dr. Drew – Episode 59

Episode Date: December 13, 2021

Rav Arora is a 20-year-old journalist who has written for The New York Post on media misinformation, vaccine mandates, and psychedelic therapy. He joins Dr. Drew & Steve Kirsch to discuss concerns about COVID-19 vaccine mandates for children. Follow him at https://twitter.com/Ravarora1 and read his articles at https://nypost.com/author/rav-avora/ . Steve Kirsch -- a tech entrepreneur who founded multiple billion-dollar companies and is an inventor of the optical mouse -- has become an outspoken critic of Dr. Fauci and the United States' response to the coronavirus pandemic. Kirsch recently appeared with Bret Weinstein and Dr. Robert Malone to speak out on his research into the potential dangers of spike proteins. Steve Kirsch believes that repurposed drugs and early treatment are the fastest and easiest ways to end the pandemic, but fears that the financial priorities of pharma companies are blocking research and discussion of any alternatives to their vaccines.  Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation ( https://kalebnation.com) and Susan Pinsky (https://twitter.com/FirstLadyOfLove). SPONSORS • BLUE MICS – After more than 30 years in broadcasting, Dr. Drew’s iconic voice has reached pristine clarity through Blue Microphones. But you don’t need a fancy studio to sound great with Blue’s lineup: ranging from high-quality USB mics like the Yeti, to studio-grade XLR mics like Dr. Drew’s Blueberry. Find your best sound at https://drdrew.com/blue  • HYDRALYTE – “In my opinion, the best oral rehydration product on the market.” Dr. Drew recommends Hydralyte’s easy-to-use packets of fast-absorbing electrolytes. Learn more about Hydralyte and use DRDREW25 at checkout for a special discount at https://drdrew.com/hydralyte  • ELGATO – Every week, Dr. Drew broadcasts live shows from his home studio under soft, clean lighting from Elgato’s Key Lights. From the control room, the producers manage Dr. Drew’s streams with a Stream Deck XL, and ingest HD video with a Camlink 4K. Add a professional touch to your streams or Zoom calls with Elgato. See how Elgato’s lights transformed Dr. Drew’s set: https://drdrew.com/sponsors/elgato/  THE SHOW: For over 30 years, Dr. Drew Pinsky has taken calls from all corners of the globe, answering thousands of questions from teens and young adults. To millions, he is a beacon of truth, integrity, fairness, and common sense. Now, after decades of hosting Loveline and multiple hit TV shows – including Celebrity Rehab, Teen Mom OG, Lifechangers, and more – Dr. Drew is opening his phone lines to the world by streaming LIVE from his home studio in California. On Ask Dr. Drew, no question is too extreme or embarrassing because the Dr. has heard it all. Don’t hold in your deepest, darkest questions any longer. Ask Dr. Drew and get real answers today. This show is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. All information exchanged during participation in this program, including interactions with DrDrew.com and any affiliated websites, are intended for educational and/or entertainment purposes only. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. Here we are, everyone. Thank you for joining us. In mere moments, I'm going to bring my guests in here with us. We've got a lot going on. I'm watching you guys on restream. Of course, we're on Clubhouse. Also, I'm hearing Susan's phone in the background.

And I have a news alert. Oh, tell me. Our son passed the bar. Now, the news alert is you can see this bobblehead. And we are now officially parents of Douglas Pinsky Esquire. Yes, indeed. So now we can get our contracts done for free. Oh, he's already discussed with me that it will not be for free. So I'll be prepared for

that. Well, I'll have to talk to him. But at least we'll keep it within the family. Yeah, the bobbleheads are on their way. They're sitting in a container in the port of Long Beach. And we just want to let everybody know they will be the perfect gift for Christmas. Pull it out of the box. Show them. It's too funny. It's so cute. Ilana and Susan have been hard at work with this for quite some time. And I see Ilana over on Clubhouse. So here we go. This is your product. Well, their husband's product. Isn't he cute? It's pretty funny. He looks just like you. Hysterical. Well, thank you for this, guys. I never thought I would live to see the day, but here we are. And it's not like they're handing them out at Dodger Stadium.

So I'm watching you guys over on Restream. Thank you so much. And a lot of congratulations, Susan, for you with Douglas' passing the bar. Oh, I know. It's so exciting. I'm sorry you couldn't be there to see it. It's so exciting. Well, we're going to go see the signing in, which will be fun. And thank you to Mark Garagos for all the help you've given, Douglas, and guidance getting to this point. So we got a lot to talk about. We're going to bring Steve Kirsch in here in a few minutes. Steve has some updates on what happened with Governor Newsom and vaccine mandates. And speaking of vaccine mandates, our first guest is Rav Arora.

Our laws as it pertains to substances are draconian and bizarre. A psychopath started this. He was an alcoholic because of social media and pornography, PTSD, love addiction, fentanyl and heroin. Ridiculous. I'm a doctor. Where the hell do you think I learned that? I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Loveline all the time. Educate adolescents and to prevent and to treat.

You have trouble, you can't stop and you want help stopping, I can help. I got a lot to say. I got a lot more to say. Want to give a shout out to our good friends at Blue Mics. If you've heard my voice on this show any time over the past year, including right now, you've been listening to Blue Microphones. And let me tell you, after more than 30 years in broadcasting,

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I can't say enough about Blue mics. And once you try one, you will never go back. Trust me. To take your audio to the next level, go to drdrew.com slash blue. That is drdrew.com slash B-L-U-E. Anyone who's watched me over the years knows that I'm obsessed with Hydrolyte. In my opinion, the best oral rehydration product

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or as always, you can find it by visiting hydrolite.com slash drdrew. Again, that is H-Y-D-R-A-L-Y-T-E dot com slash D-R-D-R-E-W. Be sure to use the code drdrew25 for a special discount. He is a journalist. He's 20 years of age, has been with the New York Post, discusses media, misinformation, vaccine mandates, psychedelic therapies. You can follow Rav at Twitter, R-A-V-A-R-O-R-A-1,

Rav Aurora, sort of Aurora. How do you pronounce it, Rav? Aurora. Aurora. Okay, Rav Aurora, one, A-R-O-R-A. Sometimes Aurora has a U, right? Yeah, yeah. That's the princess Aurora.

Princess Aurora. I'm not royalty. I'm just ordinary Rav Aurora. So let's just talk briefly with your story. You grew up where? Vancouver. Vancouver, Canada. Actually, no, not technically.

I just say Vancouver, but I live about an hour, hour and a half away in a small town called Chilliwack that nobody has heard of. So we just tentatively say Vancouver. That would be accurate. And so how did you end up in journalism and what's the story there? Yeah. So I graduated high school a couple of years ago and I was good at writing. I had some interesting views about politics and culture and I just started writing stuff and I sent it over to

a few publications. A lot of them said no in the beginning and I was really bored. I didn't know what to do. I didn't like doing ordinary jobs, working at a pizza place or a grocery store. So I just wrote, wrote some more. And then last year when George Floyd happened, all of a sudden there was this explosion of, of racial consciousness all of a sudden. And that was an issue that I had followed for quite some time. And so I started writing about racial issues, white privilege, systemic racism, racial disparities. And I had a very kind of refreshing perspective for many people because they were being fed all these very pre-packaged media distortions. And I provided kind of a nuanced alternate perspective. And so I wrote a couple of articles. They ended up going viral in the new york post a bunch of people were reading it which was awesome and so that just kind of set me off into uh uh an

improvised kind of freelance career in writing about controversial issues and you lost your job at one point for not telling the some party narrative yeah yeah i did what happened yeah it was uh it was kind of a complicated story and And I'm actually happy the way it turned out because then that kind of- What kind of job was it? I'm not going to name the specific- It wasn't pizza. No, it wasn't pizza. It was writing?

It was an online kind of consultancy job. I guess they're entitled to do that because these online things are such echo chambers anyway, right? But you used a word here that that caught my ear and that is nuanced a nuanced approach to to information in the in the press which seems to which seems to be anathema they seem absolutely intolerant of nuance and accuracy that seems to be the opposite of what journalism is about today and frankly it's the opposite of what public health is about and it's driving me insane as a scientist, as somebody who likes objective thought, what is going on? How do they publish the things they publish without adjusting course or at least are apologizing

for the nonsense that they've put out? No, no, they're totally remorseless in what they say. They don't give a shit about the truth. I mean, they try, some outlets try to pursue the truth. Other outlets, they're putting out all these salacious headlines because we live in this reality of clickbait journalism. Nobody's buying newspapers anymore. So you have to sell articles. How do you sell articles?

They gotta be snappy. They gotta be sexy. They gotta grab your attention. The headlines have literally become disgusting. And by the way, I agree. I mean, actually, actually I'm disgusted, but, but hang on a second. I just, I forgot to mention something else I was supposed to mention. I said a little bit about this in my restream. Aaron Carter is not here. Aaron Carter was all set up to come in. I don't know what the F is wrong with people that they have any opinion about me talking to Aaron Carter, all set up to come in. I don't know what the F is wrong with people that they have any opinion about me talking to Aaron Carter, whether he is genuinely sober or struggling.

I am happy to talk to him. And if he's and guess what? Guess what addicts do? They do drugs. Sometimes they're sober. Sometimes they do drugs. That is what having that condition is and not being allowed to speak to somebody because you think their relapse is none of your goddamn business.

So I will be happy to speak to Aaron Carter. Last thing I'm going to do is if somebody is fragile and struggling, the last effing thing I'm going to do is be harsh with them. So I want to be. You understand my job is to do no harm. So for you, a holes that think, you know how to manage a complex medical illness,

go to medical school, do a residency, do a fellowship. And then I'll listen. Then we can have a conversation about it. The meantime, I'm delighted to talk to somebody that is in sobriety or struggling with their sobriety.

I can maybe even get them in the right direction perhaps, or not. Just have an interesting conversation on him or her, whether or not they want to get better. Sorry, Rob. I said my best. Yeah, there's the strike back. Well, I've been dealing with them on Twitter all day, on my Twitter. I tried to keep you out of the conversation. I saw somebody. It was ridiculous. I know. They weren't that bad. The reason I thought of it is what Rob was just talking about. It reminds me of the fact that people who have no business even thinking about letting, let alone commentating. Oh my God, I'm a little charged up today. I didn't know it was going to be like this. Oh, I know. It's the dark energy.

Commentating on or creating a headline, what a physician does with his or her patient. That's none of the print's business. Now, other professionals may have something to say about it. Professional societies may. That's how we do medicine. But to have the New York Times editorial board say anything about words that they just learned how to pronounce, that people spend 30 years learning how to manage, That's insanity and it's disgusting. Brad, what do you think? Let's take a deep breath.

That's a tough act to follow. Let's take a deep breath. Do you agree with me? Listen, I fully agree with you. You know, I was following COVID for a while loosely, you know, over the past year. Last year we had the racial protests and my focus was on that particularly. I wasn't following like the new wave of covet every nine seconds going on

you know cases are rising they're following they're rising they're following whatever the headline needed is what it was happening two masks no masks vaccines coming no no vaccines bad trump is speeding up the vaccine process no that's evil that's bad oh no now you got to get the vaccine if you don't get the vaccine you're a you're aan devotee. So first, that was one of the more striking moments, which was first, it was Trump's vaccine. I'll have none of that. And it was, if you're not taking the vaccine, you're a Rogan acolyte or something, or you're Aaron Rodgers, both of whom seem to be just fine. And I even as a, I told Joe, I said, I'm a clinician. What you do with your doctor is that your business, you and your doctor's business, that's it.

And his doctor did some interesting things. The NAD infusions and, you know, what they're improvising. Monoclonal antibodies. Oh, well, which, you know, the fact that, why aren't they taking aim at the fact that there are physicians in this country that don't know about monoclonal antibodies or how to use them? That's, that's disgusting to me. That's insane. People should be outraged about that. That's how you keep people out of the hospital. Then we go, we prevent this case-demic from

becoming a serious cause of death and morbidity. But anyway, finish up. Yeah. It's all that. Yeah. I mean, dude, where do we get into this? Well, we were talking about all the back and forth, the back and forth. Yeah, yeah, the back and forth. And you know, I was never really interested in the whole COVID discussion from the start. It just bored me. Again, like cases rising, cases falling, masks, no mask, whatever.

It was just like, it was boring to me. Interesting. And then over the past six months, it's now affected my life. Because they want you to get a vaccine? Vaccine, the restrictions, travel restrictions. This is probably my last trip to the united states because i'm vaccinated well we were locked down how did it not affect you before well i was writing from home i was still seeing my friends i was going to it didn't matter just going to like i mean after the first you know

few months you know the gyms are back open i could still do whatever i want masks are kind of annoying but whatever you know i'm fine with it but now it's like you can't leave canada which is where i'm from unless you are vaccinated and and you can't leave and you can't come here yes yeah you can't leave the country you can't you cannot leave canada they won't let you leave without a vaccine you're going to go anywhere yeah anywhere after after november 30th and b yes, that's Trudeau's policy. With Biden, it was November 8th. You have to be vaccinated.

To come here. Yeah, to come here. And I came actually just the day before, November 7th. Well done. Yeah, well done. Thank you very much. But, you know, it's just, I just hate the fact that government can dictate what you do with your body. And I'm not anti-vax at all.

I don't listen to Alex Jones. I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I told my grandparents, you get the fucking vaccine right now. And my grandpa was like, yeah, I don't know. I'll be fine. I'll fucking just do it. I know.

I'm like, you know, he's like, yeah, and you know, you pop a couple of whiskeys every now and then, you know, you're good. Your immune system is good. I'm like, grandpa, no, you're getting the vaccine. You got the vaccine. And it was good. So I have a great question for you. So we were in Paris a couple weeks ago,

six weeks ago or something. And it made me wonder, and I've not been able to ask anybody this, are the French Canadians reacting differently than the remainder of Canada? Because the response in France, I'll tell you about is extraordinary and specific. And I think you'd like it.

So I'm wondering if you're seeing any of that from the French Canadians. Yeah, I haven't really followed that. I'm not close to Montreal at all, so I don't really know. Let me tell you what's happening in France. What's happening in France is they have all the mandates, same as we're here. They have a nice way of applying it.

They're apologetic. You have this, the EU has a pass, a vaccine pass. You have to either show the vax or they'll go, excusez-moi, go over here, get a COVID test, right? Okay, get the COVID test. Or can we see your antibodies? Do you have a documentation of your antibody profile to document natural immunity? Very apologetic, very sort of collegial about it and giving you options and things.

I felt good about that. Like, there's a mandate, okay, But you're at least given some options. The youth are in the streets by the tens of thousands and their position is vive la liberte. You've told me I'm 20, it's not a big risk to me. And now you're mandating, I put something in my body. You can't do that. And it's really, they are really out with it.

They're very upset about it. Kind of interesting, isn't it? Here they're mandating more mask wearing. Right, right. Yeah. Well, you know, when it comes to just vaccines, I just don't see, I just don't understand. And maybe, you know, you can tell me something, but I don't understand what the scientific rationale is for mandating vaccines.

Oh, I don't, I have a, I'm very concerned that mandating vaccines is gonna be the hill that the vaccines get destroyed on because- Really? Okay. Because here's why, is that, you know, we know that the endocarditis rate is about 5,700 per, about one per 5,700 vaccinations, right? Sorry, for young men, you're talking right? Sorry, for young men.

For young men. Not for the general population. Not for the general population. For young men, it's about one to 5,700. People go, well, that's probably what COVID has. No. We don't know that. And by the way, COVID affected my heart.

I had all kinds of very specific kinds of symptoms, but it didn't really do anything. And we don't have any real long-term anything from that. We're seeing now athletes dropping dead. That's concerning to me. People are asking on the stream here what I think about Aaron Rodgers. I think what he did was completely rational. Because if I were a professional athlete seeing other athletes who were,

they're having to exert themselves at a level of performance that's not natural. And if he has the stress of the vaccine, he's worried it could really adversely harm him. While if he gets sick, he's out for two weeks, then he's back. I think that was a very rational thing. And let's remember, everybody, what's coming is something called hybrid immunity. If you watch this stream last week, I talked to, where was that doctor from? UC San Francisco, I think. We talked to a very fine infectious disease doctor who said, when they talk about this thing being endemic, Rab, they're telling you everybody is going to

get it. That's what that means. That means that everyone gets it and it circulates through the environment and we get vaccinated so it doesn't affect us severely, particularly the elderly population. We have antiviral therapies, much the way we would have antibiotics for an endemic bacterial disease. So we can shorten the course and make it not a big deal. That's the future. Hybrid immunity, everybody gets it. Hopefully you also get the vaccine. And no one's saying this out loud, but they are telegraphing that when they use the word endemic. They just count on people not really understanding what that means. So there's that. Back to the vaccines and young people. So one per 5,700 is the rate of myocarditis. And thus far, it's been reversible and mild. The problem is that's betting on a hard

eight. That is not likely to continue. Myocarditis is a nefarious illness it can have long-term consequences somebody's going to get an arrhythmia and all you need is two or three healthy young eight or ten year olds to die of myocarditis and people are going to freak the fuck out right and that's going to be and there there is going to be such a gigantic anti-vaccine pushback at that point then i will not have any hope of converting the vaccine resistant in the middle age and older population who should be getting the vaccine but are fearful because they fear they can't trust their sources now this all makes sense yeah no no i've i've looked into the myocarditis data everything that's available with the vaccine yeah and i am not convinced that this is a a negligible or minimal

risk okay like you said one in uh 5700 yeah um some estimates even showing one one in 4500 some showing one in in 6000 yep so you know the problem sometimes it is one in 5000 just to yeah yeah sure yeah but you, we don't have enough data to have like a conclusive understanding of what is going on. That's right. But there is a signal. Anybody who disputes that, they are vaccine,

they're science deniers. But thankfully, much of the establishment recognizes this, but they pull these dirty, you know, tricks where it's like, no, no, no, no. The myocarditis risk is higher with COVID than with the vaccine. And they started almost saying, there was some journalists on this. I want to get back to the bullshit that is journalism because I know Steve Kirsch is listening to our conversation. He's dying to get in here, but, but, but because I want to talk about this with him, but I can't

wait to have him on, but just so everybody knows, I'm going to send up links for the other platforms because we're going to let you move you over from platforms because we're going to move you over from YouTube. We're going to come off YouTube and we're going to go over to Rumble because YouTube will put us in jail if we have this conversation. They already may put us in jail for this. But what was I saying? Journalism, media, bullshit. Oh, they've almost went as far two days ago as saying inflammation of your heart is good for you, strengthens your heart. They literally started going down that path.

I believe it. And I thought, I cannot believe I'm reading this BS. So that's where they'll go. That's how far they'll go. Right, right. I just want to finish off with myocarditis. Before you do, I've got to start yelling at me on Restream. I know that Aaron Rodgers talked about being allergic

to the mRNA ingredient. I don't buy it. I think the reason he did it, and by the way, he may not have done it on his own. His doctor may have done it with him, made this decision. That may have been part of the decision. That's what he went public with.

But just look at the data on athletes. You know this data on athletes dropping dead right now in Europe. It's really scary. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it doesn't seem to be like a huge pattern, but I'm seeing individual cases.

It's a signal again. It's another signal. Right, right. So go ahead, finish your exam. Yeah, listen, with myocarditis, God, I've written about this a lot and I hate saying this and some people have advised me not to say this,

but I'm having a hard time publishing these articles on myocarditis that I've written about. Just on what it is and just how it works. Just on what it is and what the risk is. Isn't that crazy? We shouldn't be mandating it. I don't- This is the thing that's crazy.

Just the fact that we can't have a conversation about what is, not whether we should, just what is, and then you decide whether you should, right? Exactly. It's too much. It's too much. Yeah, I mean, there's a whole conversation we can have just on myocarditis.

We could pump out two hours, but I mean, I mean, you know, with getting the vaccine, like people say, okay, so myocarditis risk is higher with COVID than the vaccine. That's not true for young men specifically, it appears to be. And also, you know, by getting the vaccine as a young person, as a healthy 20-year-old male. That's the part. Taking a healthy person and making them sick.

That's the part people don't get. That's the part that's going to freak everybody out. Yes. So for me getting the vaccine, there's a 1 in 5,000 likelihood of developing myocarditis. Very unusual. Rare, but not impossible. Yes. So for me getting the vaccine, there's a one in 5,000 likelihood of developing myocarditis. Very rare and usual. Rare, but not impossible. Yes. It's non-trivial. It is rare. It's non-trivial. It's non-trivial when you're vaccinating millions of kids. Yes.

It's probably trivial for you. Think about it that way right but but also by getting the vaccine the the whole the the most persuasive case for vaccination and that's why i told my grandparents to get vaccinated is to prevent serious illness or death yes that's right now when by the way we have antivirals in our fist all that's going away anyway right yeah but but for me death or serious illness was never it's never a concern right because i'm a healthy 20 year old guy, no underlying health conditions. Very, very, very, very, very. That's also trivial, trivial.

Yes, I'm driving down like LA for the first time in my Uber car. Way more serious risk. There's a higher risk there. Like my driver was zigzagging across. I'm like, holy shit, am I gonna make it a Dr. Drew? Or is Dr. Drew gonna come to the hospital and save me? Cause I'm dying here.

No, but it's like, so that's the risk with myocarditis but with you know with the vaccine you're not ensuring that you're not going to get ever infected okay it's correct the the protection against infection is short-lived it's correct by after five six months the the effectiveness against infection basically cuts in half yep continues to trend downwards i think that's accurate so so the public benefit for vaccination is really not persuasive. By getting the vaccine- Public benefit, what do you mean by that? The public, it's like you get the vaccine

to save everybody else. Oh, well- You do it to protect other people. Yeah, okay. So, okay, that's an argument worth examining again because I've not talked about it much since the newer data, so to speak, on the effects wearing off the vaccine.

So the thinking was was what Rav is referring to, Rav is referring to, is that the replication of the virus is the enemy. The more replication, the more mutants, the more we get into big trouble. So one of the arguments to taking the vaccine is, hey, you should step up and take some risk on behalf of all of us because you can reduce replication, which you will, right? You will. But we just got to get these antivirals out. They're going to change everything because that's when that argument goes away too, right? Because you're going to suppress replication with triple antiviral therapy and that's the end of that. So your point is well taken. That argument has been mitigated. Yep. Yeah. And just to quickly reiterate, personal benefit from the vaccine from preventing serious illness

or death, highly recommended for people who are at risk, people who are old, over 60, over 70, do it. And do it and keep doing it, by the way. Worth the booster, right? Yes. Yeah. But doing it to prevent infection, prevent transmission. Prevent replication.

Prevent replication. Less impressive. Yeah. Way, way less impressive i'll tell you there is a tiny little intermediate argument again this is where the nuance no one will talk about which is here's what here's what if i were king of the world uh i rob i would recommend you to get uh the vaccine and then get the virus it's called hybrid immunity and that's that's what's going to solve this problem i keep keep trying, but I can't catch the goddamn thing.

I know. So literally within six months of you getting vaccinated, when the infection is going to have the least impact upon you, you should not be wearing a mask. You should not be wearing a mask. And you should not be quarantining. You should be around people who are quarantining. There literally could be a time when we start recommending people to get get the chicken pox a little different than chicken

pox but the idea is the same but it's hybrid immunity when you have endemic illness hybrid immunity is how you suppress it so anyway keep going i'm sorry but yeah listen other countries i think are doing a much much better job with vaccinating children vaccinating younger people yeah uh like in europe like they they you know we're seeing a higher myocarditis risk with the moderna vaccine for whatever reason again we don't have long-term data so like all this stuff is just it's a live experiment which is what you know that's why i have a lot of caution with younger people because the benefit from vaccination is very small yeah so you have it's a higher bar you have to meet for safety yes that's true why that is controversial is beyond me okay but well let's let's go go now into the press why

what's going on why do they have an opinion why aren't they just reporting the facts what's going on here you know the best example of this of like what is absolutely wrong with the media and with covid please covid representation is that Dr. Sanjay Gupta on Joe Rogan. Yes. That was the perfect example. You could see somebody who is religiously devoted to vaccinating everybody, universal vaccination, no nuance. up, hey, there's this one study and the authors of the study I've talked to who are showing a higher risk of myocarditis from the vaccine than with COVID itself among 12 to 15 year olds they were finding in this really well done study. And he's showing this to Dr. Sanjay Gupta. And he's like, no, no, no, no, no, it's higher with COVID itself. And he's pulling out these papers

and showing, oh, look, no, actually myocarditis risk is higher with COVID than the vaccine. And Rogan's looking at this paper and he's like no that's for the general population yeah i'm talking about young people i'm talking about young males specifically and he had no response for that he goes back on cnn the day after and repeats that same lie like no look no no joe doesn't know what he's talking about actually again we've talked about this but again it's just there's this like push like vaccinate everybody or nothing like there's like a very universalized perspective whereas medicine you know this drew medicine is highly individualized it's highly tailored i know people who are on the carnivore diet michaela peterson and jordan peterson work for them i am you know for i'm

a presbyterian so mostly eating vegetation and seafood because that works well with me. If I eat poultry, if I eat red meat, something happens with my heart where I just like, I get these really bad heart cramps. So you can't recommend one diet, one lifestyle to absolutely everybody. It's all individualized. Anybody who says otherwise, they don't know the science.

And I'm watching CNN and I'm like, they don't know the science. That's right. And while they chant, follow the science. And I'm watching CNN and I'm like, they don't know the science. That's right. And while they chant, follow the science. And that's very disturbing to me. By the way, if anybody wants any good diet stuff that's in the zone for what Rob was talking about, Peter Attia, a surgeon, has a great YouTube

and just all kinds of, I mean, you could watch his stuff for weeks and just scratch the surface on what he's got up there. So he's got lots of great stuff. And one of his big things is all the different nuanced differences amongst the different genetic profiles and the kinds of this complexity of those biologies when you have all these different genetic combinations out there. Okay.

So we still haven't answered the question. Why is it so disgusting? Particularly the headlines. Is it just, is it just that they are so desperate in a phase of a massive shifts in how media works? They're so desperate to stay alive from a business standpoint that they're willing to take any risks. They only think short-term and their long-term sort of credibility is completely trashed but they don't care right right you know it's it's it's kind of a religious phenomenon right like people like i have certain friends and you know i love them but they're like nope jesus is the only way yeah to achieve this you know level of um you know spiritual yep actualization or whatever and other people in the muslim, do they have their own way?

And you're a sinner, you're not an acolyte, you're not a, you're not, yeah. Yeah, I'm very much informed by somebody like Russell Brand, Aldous Huxley, historically, like the perennial truths idea. Like there's something to, you know, every faith and there's all these like universal ideas about love, compassion, and union that we can all,

yeah, he's great. That we can all kind of unite around. There's no specific one way. You can look atan's instagram for the picture yeah that's my last we'll check it out but like like with media like it's the same thing there's like this religious orthodoxy surrounding race surrounding gender surrounding sexuality and now with with that what do you think that is is it the fact that religion is not actually that humans are it's homo religiosity and we just have no religion, therefore into the vacuum comes politics. Sorry, did you say homo religiosity?

You know, like they say homo economist, people will- Homo, okay. Homo meaning like- Yeah, I know what homo means. Man, like they'll use this, it's sort of a quip on homo sapien, right? I don't feel comfortable right now.

So, okay, you should. They'll say homo economicus, homo, you know, that's just the- I have no idea what you're saying. So homo sapiens, right? You know, yes. He just made up a new word. Yes.

So people, they're in the economic sort of circles, they will say, it's true, we should call them homo economicus because we're really just these economic beings. And I just invented another one randomly. What did I say? Homo- Religiosity.

Religious, homo religious. Don't ever say that again around me. I won't. Okay, I say? Homo- Religiousity. Religious, homo- Don't ever say that again around me. Okay, well. Okay, thanks. It's a shitty joke. That's why. Yeah, yeah. We can, but-

He's offended. Susan, cut this out, please. But that religion, religion is a seemingly universal anthropological, biological feature of the human experience. And if we're not using formal religion, we're using something else as the same mechanism. Yes, yeah, yeah. We all have a spiritual impulse and we're using something else as the same mechanism. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. We all have a spiritual impulse and we all have a God-shaped hole in our heart. It's kind of the way I look at it. And even if you say you don't believe in God and that's fine, people end up finding God through politics. That's why you have these mass movements like pseudo religious, uh, um, groups that form where, you know, you have all these certain kinds of precepts and these articles of faith. And if you don't believe this, if you don't believe that white supremacy is the original sin of the U S and it's pervading all facets of society, including in this podcast right now, as I'm looking at Mr. White, Dr. Drew, um, if you don't believe worse, worse of all. Yeah. Yeah.

Worse of all. Yeah. If you don't believe that, then, you know, you're a sinner. Exactly. You know then you know you're a sinner exactly you know that's kind of what happens you need to be cast out of the community exactly yeah you know i i feel very privileged being a person of color these days to be honest like just seeing the rhetoric the anti-white rhetoric right now it's it's crazy to me do you get painted with that brush because you're not the right color oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it's great but if you but if you like you said you work with mckayla and jordan peterson if you work with them where you're a white supremacist no matter what your color is right isn't that sort of how this works yeah yeah then then you're an oreo then you're white on the inside brown on the outside okay yeah you know with brown people it's coconut

and they say so i'm a coconut i mean i mean if you poke a hole and you see like white stuff coming out apparently but okay but uh yeah, that's probably unhealthy. This is one of his stand-up things, I'm sure. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I love this guy. Yeah, thank you. But yeah, my newspaper editor, this is a fun story, very fun. When I wrote this article last year on white privilege that was viral, everybody was reading it, which is really cool.

My local newspaper editor, this old white guy, the way um very progressive you know very woke he's got the the you know the the pronouns in his bio and everything and he's super woke he attacked me as somebody who's alt-right and he's like you're downplaying racism you have no idea like what like the struggles of people of color and i'm like bro have you looked at me i am i'm a person of color like listen to me what do you say what do you say well you know he blocked me shortly after, but like we engaged in all these like tweets and he was like going like through all these various like mental gymnastics to try to paint me as a racist.

And he's like, you know, you have to listen to people of color. Listen, listen to people of color. I hate that. Like looking down on people of color as like we're like children. That's what I was going to say. I began to feel like the far right and the far left yes equally racist yes one is infantilizing

and paternalistic the other is full of judgment and maybe even worse hatred and both are terrible for the people of color both don't help both make it worse for people of of color who are struggling as opposed to making things better. We're all kind of in the middle. I mean, that's reality. We're in the middle. And these yo-yos on the outside are ruining it for everybody, including the people they want everyone to listen to, who of course you should listen to. Yeah. I mean, the woke ideology just really is pervading everything right now, as you know, with race, with LGBTQ stuff stuff like the other day i don't know if you want to go down this road but the other day um i posted this clip of uh christina and tom on my

instagram where they were making some christina p and tom segura yeah where they were making some joke about rational recovery everybody that's what i'm sure part of what she was getting into but go ahead they were making some joke about like transgender pronouns or whatever and you know it was a nice joke i just posted on my instagram and and drew listen i got a flurry of messages from woke gen z females girls you do not want in your fucking dms who are like no rav this is transphobic what are you doing this is really offensive and then like all these like messages from like people who were like no no you know christina like she you know she's such a character such a white mom like you're putting up the stuff like you're a person of color you're supposed to be an ally to the lgbtq lgbtq well it endless ia2 which you i'm sure would want to be right

yes yeah listen you would like to be i'm all about individual freedom just don't make me use like crazy pronouns like i'm like i have trans friends and I fully support them. But like when it comes to like compelling people to believe a certain way or, you know, like, like, like starting to attack people on social media for reposting a comedy bit by Tom and Christina,

like, like that's suddenly this big transgression. I just don't understand. Like, I think Jen, I think Gen Z is screwed right now. Like we, like we take the slightest offense over like the, the most trivial of things like comedy all of a sudden whereas

like we're not actually a while we're yeah we're not actually like going through the real struggles and like we're attending all these classes in college on post-modernism and marxism and gender studies we're not actually learning real things and so you you know post-modernism i was sorry go ahead no i'm with you i'm very interested, postpartum, I was listening. No, I'm with you. I'm very interested what you're saying. And I was listening to a French philosopher on, uh, I forget what podcast one, but she was a high level academic out of the Sorbonne. And she was like, she was like, what the is going on in your country that you're preoccupied with postmodernist French philosophers who were completely discarded 70 years ago.

They haven't been of interest in France since 1960. Talk about dead white guys. Yes. She was like, these were almost punchlines in the world of philosophy in France. We are not interested in these idiots from 70 years ago. We have moved on why are you stuck on those guys who clearly were outside of anything useful from a philosophical

standpoint so that to me i was like oh oh this is great so academia united states is preoccupied with guys from 70 years ago yeah as though they are because they're post-modern i mean yep come on now guys let's get let's get with the now how about now floss yeah i mean there is a woke backlash coming now right like with the rise of the podcast industry that was the perfect response i mean it's good in many ways the podcast boom you know like you know i've done you know ben shapiro jordan peters in the show like those guys are awesome they're doing great work um but and think that's, that's great that we have this response. We have another option for people who don't want to listen to CNN or the young Turks or, you know, whatever mainstream media garbage is out there. But, but at the same time, like it's, it's kind of a tragedy

to me that people are listening to Joe Rogan more for medical advice than they are to doctors on CNN. Right. You know, like it's, it's concerning, but no, but the thingnn right you know like it's right that is concerning it's concerning but no but the thing is you know i'm gonna get in some trouble saying this but joe rogan does give in some cases better advice on general lifestyle than doctors do doctors are like get vaccinated boom you know that that's how you're supposed to let me let me give you one physician's interpretation of joe wrote what joe rogan says he does i don't know by the i don't know why people talk about joe rogan every five seconds like guys because he's because he's become a not just a cultural lightning bob but lightning rod but also a

cultural harbinger right he leads and i have almost no notes on what joe has said in the last year i mean i might disagree a little bit on i can tell you if you want but what do you mean so like what he said about COVID, like with like lifestyle stuff, he said, you know, take zinc. Yeah, I know. The point is I have no notes because I don't disagree.

Right, okay. Here's one physician's point of view. I don't disagree with anything he said. Yeah. Almost nothing. He may say things with a different emphasis or an enthusiasm that makes me truly happy, but I don't, that's fine.

That's pretty good. As compared to stuff i hear on cnn i'm going what where did that come from what are you talking about you're gonna hurt people exactly so i anyway yeah i mean i i have gotten into a bit of trouble like i went to my doctor and i'm like yeah you know for preventing covid like i'm taking like zinc and vitamin c paired with some dmt because i listen to joe rogan and my doctor's like go find a different family doctor you fucking idiot um he said nad not bmt was what he yeah yeah i was like yeah well joe rogan was saying dmt is Cause I listened to Joe Rogan and my doctor's like, go find a different family doctor, you fucking idiot. He said NAD, not DMT. Yeah, yeah.

I was like, yeah. Well, Joe Rogan was saying DMT is effective for COVID, right? Was he really? No, I'm kidding. No, I'm going to say. No, I want to keep my family doctor. Rob, then I have notes. Then I have a couple of notes.

Then you have notes. I mean, they say DMT, like the immune response, it kind of like boosts it a little bit. Listen, there's some stuff on cannabis and cannabis maybe being of some utility in that regard. So, but in any event, we gotta take a break. Let's take a little break here. And when we come back,

we're gonna switch gears yet again. I've been, I hope you guys have enjoyed what we've been discussing. I have thoroughly. It's nice to talk to a young journalist who kind of sees the excesses of what's going on in his, should I call it your discipline? Yeah, I'm not actually young.

Don't say young. I'm actually age fluid. I actually identify as a 45 year old political commentator with a medical degree from Harvard. Okay, okay. You identify as a physician who skipped medical school. Look at my credentials, they're better than yours. 45, and is there, dare I say, are there pronouns?

I guess, doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor. Dr. Ravarora. Dr. Ravarora. Dr. Ravarora. We'll be back with Dr. Ravarora in mere moments. And Steve Kerr. And YouTube, be ready to move over to the other platforms. Yes, please. Those of you on YouTube, I see a bunch of you talking here on the restream.

Head over to Rumble. Head over to Twitch. Because every time Steve talks, I go to YouTube jail. We go to YouTube jail. So let's see what he's got to say today. Here with my daughter, Paulinaina to share an exciting new project. Over the years, we've talked to a ton of young people about what they really want to know about relationships. It's difficult to know who you are and what you want, especially as a teenager.

And not everyone has access to an expert in their house like I did. Of course, it wasn't like I was always that receptive to that advice. Right. No kidding. But now we have written the book on consent. It is called It Doesn't Have to be Awkward, and it explores relationships, romantic relationships, and sex. It's a great guide for teens, parents, and educators to go beyond the talk and have honest and meaningful conversations.

It Doesn't Have to be Awkward will be on sale September 21st. You can order your book anywhere books are sold. Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Target, and of course, your independent local bookstore. Links are available on drdrew.com. So pre-ordering the book will help people, well, raise awareness, obviously, and it'll get that conversation going early so more people can notice this and spread the word of positivity about healthy relationships. So if you can, we would love your support by pre-ordering now. Totally. can notice this and spread the word of positivity about healthy relationships.

So if you can, we would love your support by pre-ordering now. Totally. And as we said before, this is a book that both teenagers and their parents should read. Read the book, have the conversation. It doesn't have to be awkward. On sale September 21st. Ravarora with us. I'm Dr. Drew.

We are with you. Dr. Ravarora. Dr. Ravarora. He identifies as Dr. Dr. Dr. We were on the restream here watching you guys. We're also over on Clubhouse and we're now bringing our friend Steve Kirsch in. And we're gonna say goodbye to YouTube. So see you on the other platforms everybody.

And by the way, I've noticed everyone on the restream is out of YouTube. Thank you for that. We're over on Rumble where we will be free to express ourselves. So Steve- Twitch is kind of where the cool guys are. Yes, well, it depends what you mean by cool guys.

She doesn't mean the Your Mom's House cool guys. She means actual cool guys. No, I mean, there's only one cool person here, which is Rob. So, Steve, I know you were listening to that and probably going crazy. So, I want to give you a chance to kind of jump in and start where you wish. Well, I took notes. I have a little bit different point of view here on a lot of these issues. I figured. Some of them, yeah, some of them, you know, I agree with. You know, the myocarditis rates on an absolute scale, they're actually a lot worse than what you talked about,

right? You're talking about the rates that the CDC has said they are. The rates are actually quite a bit higher than that. They're at least, by Pfizer's own admission, because they showed a slide they didn't realize they were admitting something, Pfizer admitted that varus is five times underreported for myocarditis at least. So take the number that you used before. So we're saying one per thousand. Yeah.

One per thousand. Well, it's actually more than that, but we know it's at least a factor of five by a slide that Pfizer sort of mistakenly showed at the last, it was at the last CDC meeting. Yeah. last uh uh it was at the last cdc meeting yeah i still stand by i still stand by steve what i said with that that's a trivial number for the individual the problem is when you scale that up to millions of people you're going to see a lot of stuff a lot of stuff oh yeah no it's it's more like uh one in 300 and change for if you're a 16 yearyear-old boy after the second dose, we're looking at like one in 300. And what's tragic though, is we don't know what the long-term effects are. We don't know if in a year from now, 10% of those people will be dead. We don't know if in five years from now,

50% will be dead. We just don't know because we have no basis for this and comparing it with viral myocarditis yes yeah that's one question how are you getting the 300 number from the fire oh uh because the underreporting factor in vares is a factor of about 41 and that's for a very serious event for less serious events it'll be more underreported so it'll be maybe 50 but that's just assuming the best case which is a 41 under reporting factor which is the highest possible that we think it is, because that's the reporting rate. That's the underreporting for anaphylaxis based on the JAMA study that was done at Mass

General. So Steve, for people that want to accuse you of vaccine, what should we say? Denialism. Denialism. I've known you to be somebody who's interested in helping during this pandemic. That's how you got involved, right? You did the fluvoxamine literature, right? Yeah.

Funded that. I have no conflicts of interest. I'm all about saving lives. That's my only interest is in saving lives. I'm a little bit unusual in that respect, by the way. Yeah. And you were put on the sidelines a little bit for that until the medical system milled it through a little more and started going, oh, look, there's this cheap antidepressant that seems to work. Hmm.

Yes. Huh. I wonder where that came from. Looks amazingly well. Yeah. But I was shocked that you were vindicated but not publicly vindicated. People didn't say, yeah, this guy did this a long time ago. Correct. Correct.

So I want to offer you that vindication. Yeah. Thank you. Tell me again. I was accused by an ethicist. You were accused of? I was accused by an ethicist at the University of Pennsylvania as being unethical by saying, hey, if you take fluvoxamine, it would save your life.

He said, well, that's unethical. It's not proven in a phase three trial yet. And I said, yeah, but the math proves it you know look these doctors just don't get a really really good grounding in statistics that's true that's true but but i think he was talking that the the you know this the standard of literature and peer-reviewed research is a certain thing today. And you were breaking that a little bit and going outside the box and thinking about things more from a mathematical model. And look, it turned out to be true. I took fluvoxamine. It helped me with my long hauler symptoms immensely. You mentioned myocarditis from COVID itself. I'm much more concerned about the neurological effects of COVID. and fluvoxamine may be a significant contributor to reducing those risks.

Right. Unquestionable. So there's that. Yeah. Yeah. So when you say things like unquestionably, that's when you get to, you get to trouble when you use words like unquestionably,

that's where people, that's the N word in the medical community. Unquestionably, you fucking sinner. By unquestionably, you fucking sinner. By unquestionably, I mean, you know, a chance of 10 to the minus 10 that I might be wrong. Yeah. Right.

You know, for those of you who are precise about it. Yes. Yes. I agree. No, he's right. And I know he's right, but it's still people bristle with that kind of language in this field. I'm just pointing that out. So how did you get over to the vaccine side? You went from being an enthusiast to try to help the therapeutics in a cost-effective manner without, you know, pharmaceutical companies making a fortune.

How did you drift over into the vaccine area? So before we get there, just let me say that fluvoxamine was proven in phase three trials. 12 times reduction in death. And the medical community did absolutely nothing. No, I know. No, no, they did nothing for you. They're waiting for the government. Well, I can tell you in the medical world, there is...

I used to talk about fluvoxamine and people would like look at me like sideways. Now they're like, oh, I've heard it. I've heard that. Yes, I've heard that could be useful. That's sort of what you'll see, which is a very different attitude than was the first time we talked about it, for instance, when you had the same data, by the way. But okay, now it's been proven. So go ahead. Vaccines.

But they're not doing anything because it's not we're not based on science anymore it's all based on whatever the cdc whatever the nih and whatever the who say and that drives um medical practice now it's not based on the science anymore so that's the tragic medicine well doctors have ceded their responsibility to bureaucratic authorities that are simply not in a position to make these kinds of judgments, not to adjust course efficiently the way they need to when you're taking care of patients. And we are taking aim at, and this is what Rob and I were talking about, and vilifying physicians for taking care of their patients.

Why does anybody have a... Do you think the CDC or Dr. Fauci was ever involved in my care of patients in my entire career? They were a source of information and guidance and sort of leadership a little bit, sort of tell us what direction to go. Now we have,

and I think it's because so many physicians are employed. So many of them are now employed by hospitals and large groups that they don't make decisions on their own anymore. And they fear losing their job if they do. I think that's what's happened. Yep. Yeah. So to answer your question though, the way I got into vaccines was I knew about early treatments. I knew how early treatments work. And I thought, oh, well, they have the safe and effective vaccine. And so why not get an extra level of protection? You know, there's no harm in that because there's no downside to this vaccine because the FDA has said it's been thoroughly tested and they have the most rigorous safety

monitoring in history. And so I believed all of that. And I got doubly vaccinated and my wife got doubly vaccinated and all three of my daughters got doubly vaccinated. And then a month later, I started hearing stories. I started hearing stories of, oh, my three of my relatives died within a week after getting the vaccine. And I said, that's impossible. And the woman said, yeah, but they're dead. You know, I mean, how do you respond to that? And then, then I had a vendor and both the vendor and his wife were injured by the vaccine. My, my, my carpet cleaner, Tim Damroth was permanently hurt by the vaccine. I mean, he's in terrible pain and it's not clear it'll ever go away. So that was tragic.

And so I started looking into it, and then the more I looked into it, the more concerned I became, right? It's clear now that this is the— This is the finish your thought, because I'm sorry. Yeah, and it's clear now that, look, this is the most dangerous vaccine in human history. This is 800, more than 800 times more deadly than the smallpox vaccine. And the smallpox vaccine was the previous winner, was the previous

most dangerous vaccine ever created. And it only killed one in a million. This vaccine kills 800 per million. Somewhere around there. One of the questions we have to ask ourselves is given how crazy this pandemic has been, and particularly the government's response to the pandemic, is it worth that risk? Let's say it's true. Let's say that is the risk. What do you say?

Is vaccination worth the risk? Yeah. Oh, no, no, absolutely not. I mean, the VAERS data is very clear. If you look at the VAERS data and you compute the correct under-reporting factor, then you find if you're an 80-year-old, we're going to kill two 80-year-olds to save one. And if you're a 20-year-old, we're going to kill six 20-year-olds to save one. It makes no sense for any age group. I don't care what your

comorbidities are. It doesn't make sense at all for you to take the vaccine. It's going to depress your immune system. It's going to permanently damage your DNA. It's going to make you less able to fight off cancers. It's going to be, you know, it's a complete disaster from a vaccine point of view, from a safety point of view. So even if it was just a perfectly safe vaccine, still using a non-sterilizing vaccine in the middle of a pandemic is a recipe for disaster. This is not the right approach that should have been taken. They should have used Farid and Tyson's early treatment protocol and the same thing that Aaron Rodgers did. He used a protocol, I think, similar to Fareed and Tyson. And these protocols have been known since March of 2020.

You know, that's the right way. Now, Aaron Rodgers, as a recovered COVID victim, he can't give COVID to anybody. He's better than a vaccinated person. You know, and when you talk about hybrid immunity immunity no please don't go there there is no data on that okay there there was a study that showed okay hey if you got vaccinated and you get you know you uh you had the disease and then you got vaccinated that you're better off in some short term metrics but no no no no no no don't do that don't don't even go there for this vaccine this vaccine should not this is like this vaccine is you know essentially radioactive um you know it's it's not radioactive

per se but you know you shouldn't go near it is is what it means um it just doesn't have a tell tell me what one of the reasons i brought you in today was to get your update on governor newsom's vaccine reaction you had some data on this or some striking information? Sure. He dropped out of sight for close to two weeks after he'd gone vaccinated. Not just out of sight. Was not heard from. This man has not stopped talking for two years.

All of a sudden, not one word. And in spite of a massive outcry about where are you, he never misses an opportunity to be public, to show up, to say something, to do a radio thing. Not not you couldn't hear his voice for two weeks. This was a massive change of behavior. Yeah. Even I from Vancouver here, I hear him on Twitter all the time. I'm like, why the hell is this idiot on my Twitter?

I don't even like him. I don't like the way he looks, the way he talks. Just get this guy out of my feed. And then he's just gone for a few weeks and it's just like it was striking yeah so what happened was he on a meditation retreat was he taking ayahuasca or what's going on there look there's no there's no like he if he was kidnapped by terrorists okay you know i can i can accept that but he's at home and he's in the office. How could he quit? He had one night of trick-or-treating. One night of trick-or-treating.

That's why he had to stay out of the view for 11 days. He's clearly physically able. So what's his excuse for not even appearing at that UN climate conference, which lasted, what, three days? He didn't show up for even 10 seconds. The guy doesn't show up for even 10 seconds. The guy doesn't show up for even 10 seconds. Sorry. Maybe he's hanging out with Aaron Carter. Aaron Carter.

Maybe he was doing some spiritual seeking. This was one of the most sort of sentinel sort of conferences for him as his brand, so to speak. And he just doesn't go just doesn't go it's the most important the wife says reasoning goes because i'm hanging out with family yeah family you know she tweeted something really they took it down right away bring his family into the call hey i wanted to you know i didn't want to miss the call but i wanted to do it with my family and hear my kids and it's for their benefit he could have used it as a great pr thing

to say that he's with his family and this is for his kids i mean he could have made it a family affair yeah so what happened where was he what what do we know no no what happened that's what i want to know clearly it's not what they're telling us yeah i mean i don't think he could talk um without um without difficulty right i think that's the reason why, you know, and then that's why he's not even, you know, on a phone call with anybody. Right. And then, of course, when he's at the Getty wedding, he's masked. Right. And and there are no photographers allowed except for the, you know the photographer and there's like one picture in all the pictures in vogue with newsome in it and he's he's got the mask on like this and he is like way way in the background and then when he finally makes his public appearance you're only seeing like pretty much one side of him most of the time and if you look at his forehead, you'll see that the wrinkles are gone. On his left side, the wrinkles are gone. Uh-oh.

Like, how did that happen? You overdid the Botox. Bell's policy, right? Because your face goes limp. That's right. I had it. Exactly. Bell's policy.

That's what happened. Why is this a problem? Yeah. Yeah. Huh? Why couldn't he tell us he could do it? is this a problem? Yeah. Yeah. Huh? Why couldn't he tell us he could do it? I have a question. Yeah.

Why did he have to hide that? Listen, less Newsom, less talking, less him. I'm seeing this as a win for everybody right now. It is a win. But the thing is, though, to me, the lack of transparency, again, that you can't handle the truth is what they're constantly telling the public. And that's the part that drives me insane. You can't handle the truth is what they're constantly telling the public and that's the part that drives me insane they you know anything that you know there's this guy this young kid that got my yeah this kid that got myocarditis that talked on some

program but he was on with what is this guy's name the the british nurse uh phd nurse dr campbell he's on with uh john camp, did an interview with John Campbell about his experience with myocarditis from the, he's doing okay now, but he just was reporting it. He was vilified in social media for discussing his medical experience. Really, he was almost suicidal.

And it's gonna, you gotta, oh, it was bad. There was another story with a young teenager who got myocarditis. He posted it on TikTok. TikTok banned that video. It's insane. I don't know why, like with this issue with young people, especially again, the risk from COVID extremely low risk from vaccine.

It is there. I don't know why we're just like clamping down and just like saying everybody has to get vaccinated. Doesn't seem like a hill to die on. I think it's going to, because nothing destroys vaccine support more than a healthy child becoming sick. You do that a few times and are really sick and people are going to freak the hell out.

Yep. Well, in the trials, in the phase three trials, which are viewed by doctors as the definitive evidence because everything else is an anecdote. And of course, the plural of anecdote is anecdotes, right? And so in the phase three trial, they proved one of the people in the phase three trial, one out of 1,100 kids paralyzed for life, less than 24 hours after she got the shot. Perfectly normal 12-year-old, less than 24 hours after the shot, she can't walk. Okay. So not a coincidence,

but the FDA should have investigated that because what happened is they reported in the clinical trial as abdominal pain. It's not, it's called permanent paralysis. And if you don't report that, that's fraud. You did fraud in the clinical trial in order to get the new way. You're talking about, no, no, hang on. You're talking about transverse myelitis. That's what causes the paralysis.

It's an inflammation at the, just below the brainstem. It's a well-known vaccine complication. It's called transverse myelitis. It's horrible. I've seen reports of transverse myelitis from this vaccine. It's not like they're not reporting it. It's called transverse myelitis. It's horrible. I've seen reports of transverse myelitis from this vaccine. It's not like they're not reporting it. It's out there. It's really rare, but it happens.

It may not be as rare as we think. That's the problem. Yeah. So, look, I don't know the particular diagnosis that she has. I'll have to check into what the doctors think. I'm sure that's what it is. But she's paralyzed. She has to eat from a feeding tube. She can't hold her head up on her own. But the point is that it was not reported accurately in the trial.

It's one thing if she had it as a bad adverse event and it was correctly reported, but to report it as mild abdominal pain and get your EUA on that because you said, oh, we're clean. We're clean on adverse events. I mean, they should have stopped the trial on that. And they haven't even investigated. Pfizer never called her. The FDA never called her. And Janet Woodcock said they would investigate. They never did. The CDC didn't call her. This is, this is, this is, this is criminal that they're doing this. And now to say, Hey, we're going to mandate this. And you had fraud that you know about that you never investigated. I mean, I remain, you know, I remain a vaccine

enthusiast. However, the mandate I have mixed very serious concerns about for the reasons you're bringing up, that this all is a, you know, it's different protecting old people from real risk and even middle-aged people from real risk. It's a horrible illness. You don't want it. That's different taking a moderate, even a significant risk to get our lives back. I'm for that. But taking a child and making them sick, uh-oh, now I'm concerned. Now I'm concerned. Hey, Steve, is it really true that Gavin Eason hasn't given his kids an vaccination? Sorry, the risk-benefit on kids is killing 117

kids to save one. Okay, so if you thought it was bad for old people, where you're killing two to save one, for kids, and this is not my analysis. This is done by Dr. Toby Rogers, who's a specialist in risk-benefit analysis. And so he thought the Pfizer risk-benefit analysis was pretty shoddy. He said it was, he's been looking at risk-benefit analysis for the last five years continuously. And he said it's the shoddiest piece of risk-benefit analysis he's ever seen in his life. So he did his own, and he put it out there. He put it out on his Substack, tobyrogers.substack.com.

And over 20,000 people had reviewed it, and they all thought it was excellent work. And he determined that there were 117 kids that would lose their life for every kid that we would save. This is not a vaccine that we should be putting in kids, not even close. And the, you know, I've always maintained that the, the FDA and the CDC panels need to compute what the VAERS underreporting factor is, because that tells you how serious the adverse events are. And they never did that. And I've contacted John Su and I said, John, you have to tell them that the VAERS underreporting factor is not one, it's 41. If there's an error in my methodology, tell me. And if you don't,

it's going to be serious because I'm a big spreader of information. And if it's misinformation, I want it to be corrected. He never replied. The CDC safety, CDC safety at the, you know, the, sorry, COVID-19 safety at C19.gov. I copied them on it. They never replied uh you know i and i i contacted i cc'd people at both the fda and the cdc nobody wants to chat with me about this nobody wants to correct me i'm telling them look i'm millions of people are viewing my stuff if i'm wrong

tell me where i got it wrong and they refuse refused to engage, which means I got it right. Well, some of it is you're analyzing, this is the way medical research is done. A lot of what you've been running into back since the fluvoxamine is the infrastructure of medical research, right? How it's done. We do it a certain way. And when you step outside of how we do it, they're not trained in doing it. You've broken the mold and you're looking at it from a different perspective. It makes you a gadfly in their mind, but they also can't respond because they don't have the kind of familiarity and training with the issues you're raising unless you do it within the infrastructure that they're accustomed.

Yes. Well, actually, that's what I did. I did it within the infrastructure that they're accustomed, which is the underreporting factor in VAERS. And there was a paper written by Dr. Su, or the same Dr. Su that I talked about before. He was the lead author on that article. And there are five CDC authors of this paper that was published a year ago. And I'm using the exact same methodology that's in their paper. I am using their data. I am using their methodology. And they don't like the number that pops out because it shows that the vaccines are very, very dangerous, more dangerous than any vaccine in our history. That's why they were obviously you got to do an article. You got to do an article with Steve. Susan, you had a question for Steve about Newsom's kids?

Yeah. Are they vaccinated or are they not? No. No. And they won't be vaccinated. How old are they? I know why, but I don't want to reveal personal information. His kids are not vaccinated.

They won't be vaccinated. It's fine to mandate this for your kids. It's not going to happen for Newsom's kids. I have one point about the VAERS. Yeah. Pretty. If people find that out man go ahead yeah about about vares from my understanding vares is all self-reported is that correct yeah people report so you can't fully trust vares either right from what i understand these are people reporting there are many there are many confounding factors so somebody

you know a person says they had heart pain after the vaccine, was that from the vaccine or is that because they had too much takeover? You know, there's so many confounding variables. So like from what I understand, VAERS is a way to test hypotheses. It's like you have these very raw reports. It's looking for a signal rather than noise.

They look for signals. Right, right. So when we say VAERS is underreported, VAERS cannot be fully reliably trusted either. So Ralph, how much time have you spent querying the VAERS database? Not a lot of time. How about, would you admit to zero?

No, no, I've spent a bit of time looking at some of the myocarditis cases because I've written about that. Have you done a query in VAERS? Ralph. Have you done a query in VAERS? Ralph, have you done a query in VAERS? What do you mean query? What does query mean? You've done a query in VAERS.

I've looked at some cases, but I haven't done a rigorous analysis the way you might have. Okay. So you haven't done a query in VAERS. Do you even know how many interfaces there are to VAERS? I don't even know what VAERS is. you even know how many interfaces there are to VAERS? I don't even know what VAERS is, okay? So you guys, stop it. So I think it's wrong

to talk about vaccine adverse event reporting system. And I think it's bad for people to opine on VAERS and talk with an authority if you've never done a query in VAERS.

What does a query mean? What does that mean? What do you mean a query? What does that mean? You have to find it. Even I don't know what that means. Okay, so a query in VAERS means that, you know, let me see the number of cases that had myocarditis

from ages 10 to 14. Okay. I get query. I just don't know what VAERS is. Okay, I thought there was some, maybe it might've been something formal. Okay, excellent. No, I mean, you look at the,

I made the points I wanted to. How many deaths were there from the COVID vaccines versus the previous vaccines? Like what was the greatest number of deaths in VAERS previous to this year in a year don't know don't know we should so like i said you know so if you're going to talk about VAERS you need to be familiar with VAERS and document listen i made a point about VAERS so

i want you to address that about it being self-reported and about there being confounding variables potentially, right? Okay. Yeah, but look, all of the records in VAERS are verified by HHS. I personally haven't reported to VAERS. I probably should, but I've talked to people who've reported VAERS. And when they do, they find, oh, they actually look at the, they retrieve the medical records of the person that's being reported on to verify that it's correct. And they actually coded in to the VAERS report stuff from the medical record that wasn't even in the original report that the person typed in. So it's not like you

type this in and it just gets published in the VAERS system like a Twitter post. It doesn't work that way. The stuff gets verified. And in fact, people are pretty surprised at the level of detail that happens in between your reporting the event and it appearing in the VAERS system. Now, it's true that there are two records in the 1.6 million records in the VAERS system that have been gamed. And one of them was gamed by Dr. David Gorski. And Gorski is then writing these articles on how the system can be gamed because he was one of the 1.6 million records that is fraudulent. And he said, well, gee, if I can put in one record, then we have to dismiss the whole thing. But that's complete garbage because nobody has shown that there's

more than two fraudulent records in VAERS. So if you're going to say, oh, no, it's not accurate, then show me, show me the data, right? Don't just, you know, give me these hand-waving arguments that don't have any evidence behind them. Anyone can do that. When we're talking about verified, you were saying that the VAERS reports are verified. When somebody, for example, says they had heart pain after getting the vaccine, how is that verified? I just have a number of questions on how these individual anecdotes in VAERS are reported and if there are other causes for some of these potential side effects from the vaccine? Yes. Well, look, there are always going to be some background things that happen and they're not going to go and do it, get it a hundred percent right. But on the basic stuff, like, you know, did you, did you go to the hospital? Did you get a,

did you have cardiac arrest and stuff like this you're going to see it on the on the medical records so um so some of the stuff gets um so it depends on the record right and they have all of these records that they're trying to verify but the point is that nobody has gone into those records and say no this didn't. This was fraudulent. This person made this up. But you see, you can't make this stuff up because you do this statistical analysis on the VAERS data, and you see patterns, and those patterns cannot be gamed by anti-vaxxers, you know, reporting in events that never happened and stuff like this that people hypothesize. These things are all real events. You go to jail for reporting a VAERS event, and it takes you about a half an hour to do a VAERS report. Who is going to do

this and for what purpose? Because people look at the VAERS data and you look at the reports. Look at the reports. Read the reports. Do you see gamed reports that look like they're gamed? No, they look like very serious things that have happened. And sometimes all it says is person died and, you know, he got vaccinated this, we don't even know which vaccine. And, you know, a lot of these reports are incomplete and they can only do so much with them. But others are quite detailed and the bulk of them were reported. Most of the reports are done by physicians and you can tell because you can tell the language that is being used and written in the report that these are professionals. These are health care workers that are reporting this. So there's no doubt. You know, so you could say,

oh, fine, let's throw out the 50% that were not reported by healthcare workers. It's still a disaster, even if you do that. Okay. So there was a huge signal in VAERS. And then people then don't like that, right? Because it doesn't comport with the narrative. So they write it off. They say, oh, well, it must be self-reported and we don't have to do that. But, you know, there is no doubt when you look at the analysis, the analysis of the data, it is amazingly consistent, right? Look at the myocarditis data, for example, on the first dose of myocarditis, the number, sorry, the first dose of Pfizer in 16-year-old boys, you know, you're going to see a bar that's this high. Second dose, you're going to see a bar

that is way higher. And you're going to see the curves that is way higher and you're going to see the curves peak at the 16 year olds right a 16 year old has the greatest rate of myocarditis and you see it go down now this is not something you gain because people don't know ahead of time what the curves look like but in fact you know this all makes uh uh sense when you understand the mechanism of action and you understand um you know, what goes through your body and, you know, why males are different than females and so forth. So, you know, it's not happening in females. Why would it not happen with females? It was gamed. They make it happen in females too. But females are wired differently than males. And, you know, so there's all sorts

of things that say that there's no possible way, unless you're the smartest guy in the world, to have gamed this system. Well, so I want to take us off a little bit. things to patients all the time in hopes of, from a risk reward analysis, from our humble opinion, reducing worse things from happening, not just that individual necessarily, but the population at large. So the fact that there are bad outcomes, I mean, there's so many treatments we use that we would never use if we considered, you know, one per thousand and bad outcomes, something that would prevent us from doing things medically, we wouldn't use antibiotics because the stuff goes down with the things we do. It just does. And that's a different perspective. And I get you and I hear you and I always listen to you. And I think these perspectives need to be thought about. That's the important thing. And maybe I will completely switch my point of view. But I want to ask you, are you as enthusiastic as I am about the antivirals?

I feel like once we get the Pfizer product out, this whole thing becomes kind of. No, no, no. I become very a very skeptical guy. And by the way, look, I agree with you that, you know, all medications that we have have risks and benefits. You know, even aspirin has a risk benefit profile. But the point is that when the risk benefit profile is is like oh the benefits you know weigh away the risks great but when the risks weigh out way outweigh the benefits it's like stay away and especially

when you have something like repurposed drugs and so the answer to the monopure of year or the any of the other drugs coming out from these drug companies is, look, I'm a very skeptical guy now. I used to be very trusting before, but I'm a really skeptical guy. And there's a lot of data on these drugs that say, hey, you got tested for 30 days, huh? Wow, that's really confidence building compared to one that's been out there for 40 years and has a known safety profile. Well, same thing. Well, molnupiravir has been around a long time so i mean that's not it looks quite safe i agree yeah aids aids and hiv but listen we we um we are out of time uh and as always it's it's very interesting to hear your point of view and And Susan, what are you saying?

Yes. Yes. Yes. Susan loves it when Steve's on the show. I do. But I just couldn't have him on. Well, our problem is every time we have you on, we get kicked off social media. No, I know.

We get kicked off everything. I'm kind of persona non grata on Facebook. Like when people mention me on Facebook, they get their accounts closed. It's really pretty bad. It's very weird. And I am radioactive. Yeah. And I'm like really radioactive.

I think I have the magic touch. Yeah. Your wife must be so happy. I remember back at the beginning of all this when your wife was like, do you really want to be doing this stuff? Do you really want to be studying fluoxamine? And do you want to just take some time to yourself? So it's been interesting to see you engage in all this. But you know what, Steve was persistent. He goes for what he believes

in. And when you had COVID, you had pretty much taken everything and you were having problems. And he was like trying to convince me to get you to take fluvoxamine. And he would text like every day he's like did he take it yet did he take it did he take it yet not every day almost every day i know and you know what he was right and i you know i i owe you for that one i mean i you know it's not about my beliefs it's about the data i'm just completely dated right now i i just i just tell you what the data says. I don't have any personal beliefs in this. I'm just saying, hey, here's what the data says. You can believe it or not.

I mean, I'm a simple guy. Beliefs should not enter into data analysis or scientific discourse. My belief system on this is all driven by what the data says and not what the scientists tell me the data says. It's like what the data says. Well, we don't really know all the facts like when people die from the vaccine unless you know them personally. It's not like we have a chart like we had the COVID chart at the COVID tracking system and everybody could see all the numbers.

It's not like we have that same chart for all the deaths from the vaccine. You have to really research it. Correct. You have to- But I don't like, the entire landscape, but I don't like- You have to query into the VAERS. What I don't like is somebody like Steve gets silenced just for raising questions.

Or us. Right. And that people are mandated and ostracized or prevent from getting medical care and all this craziness. Oh, yeah, that's crazy. People who aren't vaccinated. Yeah, it's all of it is not good.

This is really nothing I ever thought I would live through. You know, Steve, I've started questioning people and you're probably like this, too, talking to people who were in the decision making positions back in the early start of the pandemic. And and I always ask them, you ask them, what was that? What were you doing? And now they're starting to all say the same thing. A, we were panicked. It was panic driven, everything, closing the schools, everything, panic driven, number one. And number two, we did it because China did it, which is what I always surmised.

Which is what China wanted us to do. Well, I don't know. But to me, what China did was something they had rehearsed in case something had broken out from their lab. You know what I mean? It looked like something that was designed as some sort of drill to impress the upper authority to keep the community safe if the lab had a breakdown in security. Not pandemic policy. Not pandemic policy. Not pandemic policy. There's nowhere in pandemic policy. Ten years ago, if you read the pandemic policy of the federal government, none of these things are discussed, what we've done.

There might be local lockdowns or local school closures, but a national level max mandate, vaccine mandate, no one has ever contemplated things like this if you if you read the literature on the 1918 flu they'll kind of bring up things like uh mandates and all and they the the response is you got to be kidding this ridiculous it's unconstitutional and no one would ever put up with it panic everybody panic is the enemy but there we are striking back again but steve i think rob's falling asleep i don't know no i'm not it's just we were going deep into i'm not sleeping i was afraid to get i did not want to get into this topic but

okay go ahead it's it's go ahead okay you're really getting me kicked off social media now we have to play that disclaimer again yeah no no there is a um uh there's a paper out um that just came out maybe a week or two ago and it was an in vitro study okay so it's done in the test tubes uh but they discovered that the uh uh uh that uh uh basically it it pan the spike protein um uh or or the sars cov2 virus basically uh well well let me let me just let me let me here let me go let me go see if i can cause this infertility where are you going with this? No, no, no. It goes in and it depresses some things that are involved in DNA repair. So let me see if I can pull it up here. Maybe that's why the stem cells are so good for you.

Yeah. So why don't we switch topics here? I'm not a doctor. Don't listen to me. Give me a couple of minutes here to see if I can find it. All right. All right. You let's, let's take Steve down for a second. We're going to talk about LSD. And let me go back to my guest who came all the way out here.

We never talked about LSD. Let's talk about LSD. I'm awake suddenly. Let me, let me, what would you like to discuss as my guest? What's on your mind? What's on my mind? We have not talked about today. Let's talk about your medical credentials, Dr. Drew. Sure, if you want. No, not yet. What if you want to be pleased? I'm just throwing that out there.

No, I mean, listen, you know, I have a lot of thoughts about young people right now. What's happening with my generation. Yeah, tell me about that. I have a lot of concerns. Because you're from the next generation. You're not a millenn you're the gen z yeah gen z not proud to be gen z um but it's you know with social media and just clickbait media with the university system we're seeing just so much brainwashing happening right now we're seeing like certain norms just being totally reversed and young people find like we were

talking about religion a bit earlier like i'm just very concerned about where we're headed when it comes to like spirituality finding the meaning of life like with young people it's increasingly they're finding their meaning and their morals through political activism rather than a religious thing again rather than any kind of like real like spirituality or right religion to ground you because the problem with going to political activism for that is you won't find those deeper truths you'll only go skin deep quite literally you only go like you know whites are the oppressors people of color are the oppressed and you know we live in this patriarchy and this is the system we're not actually going into some of the deeper spiritual or mystical realms that I

think people do at the church or in the mosque or through psychedelics and meditation, which I'm very into. I feel like mental health right now is a big issue, especially with COVID. And I've been investing more and more time into mindfulness meditation and learning more about the nature of mind because we're just so distracted by social media and what this person said what cnn is saying and what's happening on twitter and this and that i feel like we're not actually focusing i'm concerned i'm concerned that excessive inwardness which i don't object to will leave you free of the inputs that actually create a good life and that's relationships and community so i i've always fear that inward seeking which is what happened during the 70s and it was

just look at don draper when he goes to that uh hideout you know when he's trying to find himself he comes back with you know even more crazy slogans uh it the real The real meaning is other people. I mean, whether you look at Gilgamesh or any of the mythologies or Jesus and look at what makes a good life or Candide looking at Voltaire, they all tell you the same thing. You've got to get back to your community and make a difference. Yeah. Care for the people that you care about. Yeah, yeah. I feel like that is definitely important.

And understanding the nature of mind is something that I'm kind of exploring right now, potentially through my sub stack as well, which I was telling Susan about a bit earlier. My sub stack is going to be devoted to exploring things like meditation, mental health, psychedelics, this kind of thing. I feel like, you know like all the decisions we make

are a product of how we think and the various external influences and whatever things we've been conditioned with in our environment through our genes. No, most of what you think, read Dr. Damasio's new book, it's Feeling and Knowing. Most of what we think comes out of our body

and what we're feeling. And then it's sent through the prism of the social historical context, but what's really going on is coming out of your body. And that is genetics and epigenetics. And there's, there's the book feeling. Okay. Interesting. And it's,

it's so clear. It is sub stack of Rob's ref subject. Okay. Yeah. I have the, so be careful. Rav's sub stack? Okay. I have the reference. So be careful. Okay. Okay. All right.

Back to Steve. Go ahead. So I don't think I can screen share on this platform. Is that right? There doesn't seem to be a little icon for that. Okay. So for people who are interested, if you go to my website, skirsch.io, it's S-K-I-R-S-C-H.io, you look in the vaccines article on that website, and then you pull up the first slidero study from Stockholm, Sweden, that's published in a peer reviewed journal that found that the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein enters the cell nucleus and impairs

DNA repair. So mechanistically, we found that the spike protein localizes in the nucleus, pretty surprising, because you'd expect it to be external, and inhibits DNA damage repair by impeding key DNA repair protein BRCA1 and 553BP1 recruitment to the damaged site. So the COVID-19 vaccine used mRNA to deliver an instruction to cells to produce the same spike protein. If the spike protein enters the nucleus and inhibits DNA repair, then this potentially increases the likelihood of cancer development. So the implication is that you end up like a BRCA1 patient, so you have an increased risk of breast cancer and various kinds of germ cell cancers, that kind of thing, which may or may not be true. But why isn't that true of natural infection as well then? It's not saying that it's not true of natural infection. It would be true for both. But here you're being mandated to take something which is doing that

as opposed to you know having it happen um at whatever rate and of course you know with the spike protein it has a free ride to all parts of your body right the i'm sorry with i'm sorry with the vaccines right because they're coated with polyethylene glycol that just gets them into you know every every place it's like it's like having an express pass to invade, you know, and it can pass through the blood-brain barrier too, right? So it can invade your brain. It can invade all, you know, parts of your body. It's pretty troubling, you know. And, you know, someone asked about the, you know, the question.

I'm not, I wasn't like bringing this up as a, you know, key point. It's just like one of these other things that are unknown at this point in in terms of okay why is this an in vitro study right like why isn't this uh done in vivo and you know let's measure this and you know yeah you know and and and get the data on it i mean we still don't have the data um drew on the spike uh production in terms of the amount distribution and duration of the spike protein in humans we have it for the lipid nanoparticles that those animal studies were done but i i haven't seen the animal studies on on actual the spike protein right because it's one thing to inject a fixed amount of of of mrna instructions uh you know in the lipid nanoparticles into your shoulder. But what that does is it's like growing plants, you know, it's the lip, what you get injected are like seeds and the seeds go to every part of your body and then they grow trees. And the

amount of trees that are grown, meaning spike proteins are variable in different people. And so what we don't know is we don't know what the distribution of that spike protein ends up being in your body because it was never measured. It needs to be measured in primates. That experiment, as far as I know, has never been done. So we haven't done the basic safety stuff on this vaccine. It was rushed to market. And, you know, it's just really, really tragic. You know, the FDA used to be an agency where we could trust it because they were like super careful. If you did any one formula change, you would have to go back to the drawing board and redo all the tests. Today, when they approved the 5 to 11 vaccine, it was tested using a different formulation

than what is going to be injected in your kids. What's going to be injected in your kids is something that was never tested. And people aren't, they should be in arms about this. The old FDA would have a cow about this. And the new FDA is like, eh, nobody minds. Nobody even asks about it, right? Different formulation done in the clinical trials versus in that's what's actually going to be injected into your kids. Well, it's super clear- Can kids well it's super clear the big issue all the way right it has been these emergency powers whether

whether you know in whatever you know whether all the mental health consequences they've done so much adverse to to the the citizens of this country through these emergency powers so-called that they still that are only now the courts are beginning to step back push back on a little bit you know in terms of stays on the some of the mandates and things so we'll see i mean the courts may be the the actual salvation and so i'm worried too because drew says when start when the kids start dying and that push back that's that's what i'm really worried about. I'm worried about the pendulum swinging so hard and so fast the other way because wealthy kids.

It's tragic because kids have already died, right? They analyzed, the CDC analyzed the 14 kids in VAERS that had died. And I did the analysis too because I was like, you know, trust but verify. So I went, you're not supposed to do this. um i i did the analysis too because i was like you know trust but verify so i did i went i mean you're not supposed to do this but i looked up the records myself and i looked at each of the cases myself and i found that five of the 14 died from cardiac arrest now kids that age don't die from cardiac arrest i mean they do it's you know it cardiac arrest. It's not five out of 14, I guarantee you. And two out of the 14.

This is the part that people don't understand with the myocarditis is when your heart is inflamed, it doesn't conduct electricity normally and you can have ventricular fibrillation really easily. That's the problem. Oh my God. And so it's not the cardiomyopathy down the line. It's not that you feel sick.omyopathy down the line it's not

that you feel sick it's that you can get rhythm problems during the illness but see again seriously i'm out of time thank you for raising all these issues no doubt we'll talk soon we didn't mean to scare everybody if well i just want to raise it it's not 100 but it's you know it's important to people hear both sides you know get the facts before you vax yes we're telling both sides it doesn't mean we agree or disagree. You know what I mean? We're just putting facts out there. So don't be mad at us. We're not trying to scare you.

Yes, yes. I still think, thanks, Steve. We'll talk soon, okay? Take care. But I still, Rob, does that change your attitude about vaccines at all, hearing all that? You know, a little bit. It doesn't change mine. It really doesn't. A little bit. Like doesn't change mine, it really doesn't.

A little bit, like hearing some of the stories of paralysis and death, I mean, not radically, so I would- We have got to get our country back. We have got to get the world back and it's gonna take some risk. It's gonna take stepping up. Don't take us out yet, Caleb. I wanna talk for five, 10 minutes.

I'm not done. He's not done. He's running the credits. He's like, he's like getting for the exit. I got you, 10 minutes. I'm not done. He's running the credits. He's like heading for the exit. And the fans want to talk about LSD some more. Yeah. Yeah. So I want to finish our conversation about, about mind and stuff. Cause I am very, very fair. I mean, I worked in a psychiatric hospital for 30 years and stuff. And so I, it took, it took me decades to have some understanding of how the human brain is sort of the complexities

of our brain works. And you have to kind of see this stuff a lot, a lot, a lot to really understand it and then work with it. And what's the matter, Rex? Can you guys see Rex? There's his head. Rex is worried about the children. He's worried about me. But tell them what you're planning to do with DMT. Can you? Is that okay to talk about that? Talk about DMT? Yeah, yeah.

We can talk about anything. Because the whole trauma issue, trauma is a major, major issue, particularly right now in human evolution. It's not normal. Not normal for humans to have this much trauma. But we have been through pandemics of it. And so healing trauma is a major issue. And a lot of people either don't avail themselves of, of trauma therapies or don't, or not patient enough to go through it, or it's too much, too painful. What is your plan with DMT? Well, I'm not taking DMT first of all. I'm going to be trying MDMA therapy next month. You told me DMT. No, I said MDMA. Yeah, I think you misheard me or something. Okay.

I said MDMA. Okay. Yeah, I'm trying MDMA therapy next month under the guidance of a trained professional who's been- By the way, I totally signed off on that. That has been proven to be useful and safe. MDMA therapy? Oh, yeah, I was wondering earlier, you were objecting.

I was like, what's going on there? Well, that's why I asked about ayahuasca because that is DMT, right? Right. And that's why we had that conversation that we were talking about DMT, but go ahead, keep going. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so you support MDMA therapy for even people who are not like severely traumatized, but have something to gain under controlled settings. Yes. Okay. Good. Good. Yeah. Um, so, you know, know i i'm a very spiritually curious person i have a lot of questions about existence and you know i want to write about that more and more and i hope i can do that with with substack but i find like all these conversations about like you know covid public policy what the government is doing like these are all manifestations of

really like pathologies within the mind. People who just, they get a bit of control. They don't know how to give it up. They're not treating people well. They're not centered on compassion, humanity, individual choice. These are things you have to cultivate in your own inner life. We're always focused on the outer life. The inner life to me is so important.

And that's why so many people like somebody in like somebody like Russell Brand, good example, or like somebody like Kanye West, like people who got very rich and famous and are addicted to drugs. And they're sleeping with all the women in the world and doing all these things. And then they realize this isn't satisfying. And they go out East.

They go out with Russell Brand or somebody like Sam Harris, like training with Buddhist monks in India, Nepal and silence, or somebody like Kanye West, like training with Buddhist monks in India, Nepal and silence, or somebody like Kanye West, who all of a sudden isn't rapping about, having 10 different women give him blowjobs in one night. Now, all of a sudden he's doing gospel songs. Like what happened to you?

He's wearing these like white robes. God save me. Is that what he's doing now? Oh, that's awesome. He's doing the Sunday. Well, I think he may have paused on the Sunday service, but that was a big phase for a while. He was doing these weekly service sessions where he was bringing people together people who believe

in god didn't believe in god and they were having these very profound services and you know having these very elaborate musical uh performances you know in the name of god in the name of spirituality i just feel like spiritual orientation is so important and and i'm not saying you should follow certain you know like there's certain spiritual communities that go really out of hand with like certain voodoo stuff you know tarot readings and psychic readings but something like meditation like i'm a huge huge advocate of mindfulness meditation because you know we're always lost in thought we're never actually fully paying attention in the moment. And meditation teaches you the art of actually connecting with experience fully,

rather than just being on this hamster wheel, jumping after the next sexual, romantic, physical, social, political desire without actually taking a pause and actually being grateful for what is actually in front of you. So I jumped on you a little bit when you were talking about society does this to you. Now what you're talking about is something totally different. Now you're really in the realm of spirituality, which I completely agree with you as being unserved in the world. And whether you want to, and we talked earlier about how religion used to sort of serve some of that function.

But you're right. There is a spiritual vacuum. There's a spiritual sort of, um, sickness in this country right now. Uh, and I completely agree with you. And, and I do think that a lot of spiritual searching does end you back at your roots and back with your other people, but, but you have to first sort of, what is it, make peace with whatever's inside or whatever. Peace and introspection. Something. Spirituality has always been a little bit of a mystery to me because it is so personal.

It's so specific to the individual. It does have a religious component to it. I do believe that interpersonal experiences can be spiritual but i think you're right i think that they we have to work on getting get it's like getting our rudder right or something i don't know what's wrong with us so is it easier for you to like find your spirituality like taking lsd or have you done ayahuasca are you talking about dmdma that's very different very different different. MDMA, yeah. So I've done a bit of ketamine as well.

I don't know if you know. Ketamine therapies are great. Much about that. Yeah, I've done a bit of ketamine. Well, it was designed as an antidepressant. Now I'm hearing they're using it in psychotherapy a little bit and that's kind of a new thing, but it's safe, it's safe.

Yeah, it's totally safe. I've been prescribed to it by a doctor. A lot of people have these very profound, like transcendental experiences on significant doses of ketamine. I've done a bit of microdosing with psilocybin as well. Be careful, just be careful. Yeah, I'm just doing microdosing.

It still worries me, just be careful. I'm not saying don't do it, I'm saying be careful. Haven't had really any major radical effects, which is good, you know. Well, the stuff I see is all down the road. That's what I worry about. Cause brain is so delicate. Right, right.

Yeah. With MDMA, you know, I, you know, I began to really engage in a lot of serious introspection over the pandemic and especially after graduating high school and not having a plan for myself. Are you representative of your, of Gen Z do you think? Are you way outlier? Depends which context. Well, in terms of Gen Z, do you think? Are you way outlier? Depends which context.

Well, in terms of the pandemic pressing your face to the mirror a little bit, now you're starting to look at some spiritual answers. Yeah, no, I don't think I'm aberrational in that realm. Good, that's good news. Yeah, that's good news. But a lot of people, they're finding their spirituality in Black Lives Matter and mass protests. Right, right, right. Then the doctors are saying, no, white supremacy is a bigger threat than COVID.

So go and protest. It's like, holy, what are you saying? Right. But I think, you know, I, during the pandemic too, it kind of forced me into a bit of solitude for sure. Because graduating high school, like I'm a very talkative person, as you can probably tell. And always being the very class clown type of guy, always cracking the jokes and embarrassing

himself to degrees that are far from normal. But, but like I, you know, after graduating high school, I just didn't have a plan. I was working at a pizza place and, you know, that was kind of just the pizza. Pizza keeps coming up as your bottom. Yeah. I'm not going to work at a pizza place. Right. But like, yeah, after that i just i

noticed like being alone like holy crap i am so miserable and i'm so depressed and anxious i don't know what to do with my life and looking for meaning and i found some meaning with my writing and thankfully it's resonating with people but even after you know getting all the success with the writing and you know getting a lot of applause from high places, I just felt like there was a hole inside of me that just wasn't being filled in the traditional ways that I was looking at things. And I had this major heartbreak actually this summer. It was kind of an unrequited love situation.

And I just did not deal with it well at all. I just became super, super obsessive. I just couldn't accept the reality that was in front of me. That's not so uncommon in your age group too, right? Yeah. Especially your generation. But for me, it was, I had a far more adverse response to it than a lot of people my age do.

You'd be surprised how much of that I see. Right. Really bad, over the top. Okay. Like too much, too much. I'm just a very obsessive person. So once I dedicate myself to something, whether it's a person or it's a career ambition. This is the best thing that ever happened to you, breaking this just, yeah, it's like, I want to do this. And so during the situation, I just couldn't deal with it. And so I just became, became very, very obsessive about it. So then I began, then I

realized like something is wrong with, like, I need to change something about the way I actually interpret the world because you can't actually conform reality to your own desires. It's you have to- Reality on reality's terms. Reality is conforming you. That's right. And so just realizing that, that's why I've been part of this spiritual group

where we're reading the Hindu scriptures every week. And a lot of people have reservations about that, but I'm not very skeptical about certain- Any scripture, they basically have the same stuff. They really do. That's a controversial take, but I go read them all. I tell you, I know people that have read them all and they will all tell you the same thing. They're so similar.

It's like they're a different form, but they're saying the same thing. Yeah. And so with these weekly Hindu scripture readings, because, you know, my family's from India. And so I've been kind of connecting with that, actually, more and more. It's great. Growing up in a very religious household, I was like, fuck this fuck this crap like all these weird elephant creepy people and the snake head and this and that like mom what are you doing like this is it enlightened yeah and i'd always be like mom like how is this how is this scientifically true and my mom was just like

banging her head against the wall like fuck we moved to the wrong country somebody asked me about kierkegaard earlier on the thread here and this this is to the, to this issue, it's leap of faith. Give into it. It's got some meaning for humans. It's had a, it's a reason we create the things we do the way we do. But that's how I went into MDMA. If you want to go into that a little bit, like that's, you know, just being caught up in the normal misery of life, being obsessively holding onto things.

Um, I, I began to read into psychedelics and i was like stunned by just how much promise there was for even ordinary people who have spiritual questions who want a fresh perspective that is totally safe within scientifically uh there are safe ways to do it and you're doing it don't go outside of that please no i am not listen to duncan trussell's pod ever no but i heard he's a wild man he's a wild man. He's a wild man, but he sounds a little like an older version of you in a weird way. And his thing is always like,

he's an enthusiast of all you're looking into, but he's like, it really doesn't keep you there. It shows you where to go. And then you've got to do the hard work to get there and stay there. Yeah, that's why I'm glad I'm in good company because even my psychotherapist, he's not overselling it.

He's like, dude, we're going to do MDMA next month and it's going to be under these guided conditions and we're going to have some intentions and we'll do it. But he said the integration is more important than the actual four hour experience. It's what do you understand about yourself from that experience that you integrate normally in your meditation practice

and through conversations with my therapist. But what led me to the MDMA was this romantic heartbreak and just obsessing over things and then i started reading into psychedelics and i read michael poland's book which i don't know if you've heard about how to change your mind was an instant bestseller um and he kind of went into it skeptical too and i did as well because my parents drilled down on me from a young age don't do drugs don't do drugs and i never did like even smoking weed and drinking, all my friends would do it, but I was just, you know, hallucinogens have these neurotoxic qualities and we just don't know what the thresholds for that all is. It literally takes your own neurotransmitters and turns them into

free radicals. And it causes also some vesicular dysfunction at the synaptic level and stuff. So this is all stuff we worry about, you know, is it worth it? Same conversation we just had about vaccines, right? Maybe it's worth it. Maybe it's not you guys.

Then we do have to wrap this up. I'm sure Caleb has a baby at home and that's where he was. He was scrambling off to why he was, why he was showing the credits. Cause am I right, Caleb? I feel a baby. Yeah.

Yeah. It's your wife going, where the hell are you? I missed the baby's bath time or feeding time. Yeah, it's night time. Your wife going, where the hell are you? I missed the baby's bath time tonight. So I am sad. Oh, see, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That was us.

That was us on us. I'm going to wrap up Clubhouse. We thank you guys for listening along with us. Sorry, we didn't get any questions in there, but I didn't think we would. But we're just going to stream it over there. We know we'll do questions sometimes but yeah susan wants us to stream every show with clubhouse so i dutifully yeah you know what i love about clubhouse is like if you're dual tasking let's say you're cooking in the kitchen and you're

listening you can go to your tweets you can go to your your messages and clubhouse just keeps playing like if you're on youtube and you it turns off yeah it you can't, I think Twitch, you can do that though. So guys, I will end that room. Thank you. But there were also in rumble. So, uh, this will not be censored on a run, which is amazing. We started on Facebook. There's a chance there's an awful lot of Twitch on the restream today. We appreciate you guys. We don't make any money over there. So they don't really. And, uh, Rob, you, Rob, you give me a little bit of hope for your generation, my friend. That's good. For a lot of reasons.

One is your independent thinking. You're willing to stand up for your thoughts. You're a work in progress, which we all are. And you're on a spiritual quest, which I would argue. Nothing wrong with that. I would argue we're in a spiritual vacuum right now. And that may be what everyone needs to start to really pay attention to, whether it's,

you know, you're kind of young, you're like in your forties or something, you know what I mean? You're a young 40 year old. I'm a young 40 year old. Who just happens to be 20. That's how I identify though.

He told us he was 45 and a doctor, doctor, doctor. I'm trans age. I'm already, we've already proven I'm trans racial. Cause I'm actually a white supremacist, but I'm also trans age. Fantastic. You're not allowed to, you're,

you, you, by using the word trans, that's an appropriation. You're not allowed to do that. Sorry. Oh, sorry. Sorry guys. Take it back. Yeah. Take it all. Caleb, Caleb, forget the baby. You got to cut that out. All right guys. Thank you so much. Caleb, get back to the baby. You don't want to miss bedtime and feeding time and all that good time. I'm not going to show us a picture. And don't forget about our bobblehead. Hold it up again. And Rob, where can people find you?

Twitter, RavAurora1, R-A-V-A-R-O-R-A1. And then I'm also at Substack now writing about MDMA, meditation, spirituality. That's RavAurora.substack.com. Congratulations. Susan, where can people get this thing oh we're gonna we're waiting for it to come into stock here's the i just posted the substack article on the restream we will know next week if if it's going to come into port like you know all those

when it does where do people order this thing i dr drew it.com. It'll be at DrDrew.com. There'll be an order form or something. That's a Caleb thing. I don't know. Ah. Is there a shirtless version? They want to know. So not yet, but if this sells well, I'm sure Susan will be on that. I think pantsless is better.

Pantsless. Susan wants a pantsless version. Yeah, we don't want that. Ladies and gentlemen, my wife. Susan Pinsky, everybody. She's lying. You paid her to say that. No, no, no, no. Couldn't even think of those things. She comes out with stuff I can't even imagine. Guys, I'm 20.

Let's keep it appropriate. I know, I know. It's like, come on. My parents sent me here to do educational stuff. I understand that. I understand that. I talked to Dr. Drew. It's bad. I get it. All right, guys. Purvy wife. Yeah, that's pretty much it. That's what he's thinking. Self-described. Own it. All right, you guys. We have coming up,

I've got a pediatrician coming in tomorrow who's Christina P's dear friend. She's an excellent pediatrician. And her pediatrician. And we're going to talk about vaccines in kids. We're going to keep

talking about vaccines. What happened to Vinay Prasad? He's the he's the 29th or something like that or 20 he's after yeah you're right you got alex baronson and prasad that week okay so on the november 29th and 30th we have you know alex baronson i like both those people yeah baronson is good he gets in a lot of shit. He's banned from Twitter. He does. Yeah, we're gonna have him on Rumble. You should listen to his podcast. I know, yeah. I've spoken to

Vinay over the phone and interviewed him for articles. We're coming out the other side here. I used to listen to his stuff before COVID. He was just an excellent oncologist, good, thoughtful researcher. And then all of a sudden, he started the same reaction I did. Like, what's going on here? What happened to us?

What's going on? And then he's gotten in a lot of trouble for just writing about those questions. He's very honest about the myocarditis risk, which I've interviewed him about. Great guy. He's concerned. He's not like Steve Kirsch. He's about like me. He's just worried about these things.

And it's appropriate for us to worry about this stuff. We have a guy named Sankeen on Thursdayursday and then we have danny casal on wednesday all right so uh pay attention guys we'll be here the next three days we have somebody named lucy mcbride days don't know who that is next tuesday lucy writes a medical blog i think and then your your your other lover dr gianta but oh he's a good friend of mine we're co-authoring a few things so he's uh talk about a bright guy that's a that's a dude who knows he's talking about yeah he's helping me publish some uh writing because i i can't i'm having a hard time publishing stuff because people are like what are your medical credentials and so he's actually helping me out in fact

checking or co-authoring some of the articles brilliant Brilliant. I love it. Great guy. I love Jay. Shout out to him. Okay. So Jessica. Look at this guy. I love this guy. We should have you pop in occasionally and can we do that? Have you zoomed in once in a while when you publish something that gives you a lot of trouble? I would love that for some publicity. Can you zoom or remix? So we're going to be in here the next four days. We're at two o'clock tomorrow with the pediatrician. We're at three, three, three 15. Yeah. Just look on our Instagram live or Instagram tomorrow. Next four days, we're at two o'clock tomorrow with the pediatrician. We are at 315 on Wednesday. Yeah, just look on our Instagram live or Instagram tomorrow. And then 230 on Thursday. So we're moving around a little bit, but we'll be here the next three days.

He keeps booking my hour. Let's let Caleb go. We'll see you then. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor, and I am not practicing medicine here.

Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was published. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, don't call me. Call 911. If you're feeling hopeless or suicidal, call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 800-273-8255. You can find more of my recommended organizations and helpful resources at drdrew.com slash help.