Ask Dr. Drew - Zachary Levi: The Truth About Charlie Kirk, Secret Conservatives Of Hollywood & Why He’s Building A $100m Film Studio In Bastrop, TX w/ Batya Ungar-Sargon of NewsNation – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 532

Episode Date: September 19, 2025

Hollywood celebrity Zachary Levi refuses to be censored. The actor, best known for starring in Shazam!, Hotel Tehran, and voicing Flynn Rider in Tangled, supported RFK for President, says “woke” is “indicative of any ideology that sacrifices logic, reason”, and even spoke out “against Pfizer in early 2023.” He was one of a small handful of celebrities who publicly mourned Charlie Kirk. As expected, Hollywood has not responded kindly – he’s reportedly been blacklisted by actor peers and multiple studios. In response, the actor is launching his own $100 million Wyldwood Studios in Bastrop, Texas. He tells Dave Rubin: “What is it to gain the whole world and lose your soul in the process?” Zachary Levi is an actor and founder of Wyldwood Studios. He will appear in “Sarah’s Oil” (MGM/Amazon, 2025), “Not Without Hope,” and “Hotel Tehran.” He previously starred in “Shazam!”, “Tangled”, and “American Underdog.” Follow at https://x.com/ZacharyLevi Batya Ungar-Sargon hosts “Batya!” on NewsNation. She is Opinion Editor at Newsweek and author of “Bad News” and “Second Class.” Learn more at https://x.com/bungarsargon 「 SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS 」 Find out more about the brands that make this show possible and get special discounts on Dr. Drew's favorite products at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/sponsors⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• FATTY15 – The future of essential fatty acids is here! Strengthen your cells against age-related breakdown with Fatty15. Get 15% off a 90-day Starter Kit Subscription at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/fatty15⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • PALEOVALLEY - "Paleovalley has a wide variety of extraordinary products that are both healthful and delicious,” says Dr. Drew. "I am a huge fan of this brand and know you'll love it too!” Get 15% off your first order at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://drdrew.com/paleovalley⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ • VSHREDMD – Formulated by Dr. Drew: The Science of Cellular Health + World-Class Training Programs, Premium Content, and 1-1 Training with Certified V Shred Coaches! More at https://drdrew.com/vshredmd • THE WELLNESS COMPANY - Counteract harmful spike proteins with TWC's Signature Series Spike Support Formula containing nattokinase and selenium. Learn more about TWC's supplements at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twc.health/drew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 「 MEDICAL NOTE 」 Portions of this program may examine countervailing views on important medical issues. Always consult your physician before making any decisions about your health. 「 ABOUT THE SHOW 」 Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Kaleb Nation (⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://kalebnation.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠) and Susan Pinsky (⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/firstladyoflov⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠e⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠). This show is for entertainment and/or informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Amazing show today. We have Zachary Levi. He's an actor, of course, founder of Wildwood Studios. He will appear on Sarah's Oil. He's got a lot of talk us about, including the studios, multiple, multiple projects. You can follow Zach on, just on X, Zach, Zachary, Levi, Levi, L-E-V-I. Also, wildwood.com, excuse me, W-Y-L-D, Wildwood. And then Bacha Angar Sargon.

She's been on fire lately on Bill Maher. Pierce Morgan. You can follow her on X, Bungar Sargon, B-U-N-G-A-R-S-A-R-G-O-N. Big show, lots of great guests to talk, lots of material to get into today. Stay with us. I'll be watching you all on the re-stream and the Rumble Rants. So if you have things you want me to bring up, put them there. It's an extraordinary time, and these are two great guests.

We'll get to them right after this. Our laws as it pertain to substances are draconian and bizarre. The psychopaths start this right. He was an alcoholic because of social media, pornography, PTSD, love addiction. Fentanyl and heroin, ridiculous. I'm a doctor for a shit. Where the hell you think I learned that?

I'm just saying, you go to treatment before you kill people. I am a clinician. I observe things about these chemicals. Let's just deal with what's real. We used to get these calls on Lovelin all the time, educate adolescents, and to prevent, and to treat. You have trouble, you can't stop, and you want to help stop it. I can help. I got a lot to say.

I got a lot more to say. I've done most of my career dealing with illnesses that shorten life. And now we have ways to extend it and extend wellness. I've been working with the team over at B Shred to develop a product that has everything I want in a longevity supplement. NR boost has nicotinamide riboside. You know how metal can rust? Well, your body behaves in a similar way. It's mediated through something called NAD.

NAD falls as we age. So we're less able to fight off that oxygen. oxidative process. We oxidize much like that metal. And NAD fights it, but nicotinamide riboside elevates NAD so we can push back on those oxidative stressors. Improving health, improving longevity. The other product is Senosink, has phycin, one of the key molecules to fight off zombie cells. And we've added resveratrol to that, which is a well-known anti-aging antioxidant again. I don't like supplements that have a ton of ingredients. To me, it suggests that none of it's working. When I prescribe a medication, I prescribe that medicine because I expect that to work.

That is exactly what I've done with these products. And I want you to go to Dr. Drew.com slash V-Shredd-M-D for 10% off. Again, that is Dr. Drew.com slash v. shred MD. So, Zach is famous for, well, a lot of things, but recently telling Dave Rubin, quote, what is it to gain the whole world and lose your soul in the process? Zachary Levi, everybody. Zach, I'm so pleased to have you. Hey, Drew. I'm so pleased to be here. I've been a massive fan of yours and all of the really reasonable, logical wisdom that you've been putting out into this world for a long time. So thanks for having me. God bless you. Thank you, man. We became your fan during Chuck, right? When you had something downloaded into your brain and that Australian actress was getting in trouble. What is Strahovsky? Was that her name? Yeah, Ivan. Avon Strahovsky, who's wonderful.

Our whole cast, still one of my best families of fellow cast members and crew. It was a really special time, and it definitely launched my career and everything that I've gotten since then, I think, was built on that. Yeah, and then we were, you know, we've kind of followed along. Oh, my God, there is on Maisel when you played a Jewish doctor in the up north in New York here. So funny, so good. And then Shazam, everyone knows you from that. But now you've ventured into actually creating a studio yourself. Tell us about Wildwood.

Yeah, well, so I mean, I'll try to, I can be verbose and tangential, so forgive me. But, oh, my camera zooming out on me. But listen, the long and the short of it is, the long and the short of it is, I have always felt very compelled to use my life to make this world, the best world that it can be, help as many people as I can live to the highest level. And I think that there are so many issues, obviously, that we're dealing with. And I started to work in Hollywood, and I saw how broken it all was. I was 18, 19 years old.

I got my first look behind the curtain. I saw how all the sausage was made. And I was so heartbroken because I care far too much about other human beings and excellence to be working in an industry that doesn't really care about either. And I felt very compelled by God in that moment when I was crying out to God and saying, why would you bring me here? Why would this be my path? This path that I always knew was going to be my path.

knew deep down I was supposed to be an actor. And I felt God speak to me in that moment. And it wasn't audible. I don't think most of the time it is. But it's kind of this resonance in the frequency of, you know, your soul talking and hearing from God. And I believe that what I heard in that moment was, Zach, I put you into this broken industry so that you can learn all about it

so you can make a better version of this and you can lead people to living better lives. And that doesn't end with just building a new movie studio akin to, let's say, what Chaplin and Pickford and Fairbanks and all of those OGs in the silent era when they created United Artists, they knew that it was so broken even over 100 years ago and they tried to fix it,

unfortunately it didn't work. And I think we've needed a new United Artists ever since then, but I don't think it stops at just building a place of work. I think that if you really want to help people live better lives, you need to get them connected back to themselves, back to each other, back to nature, and back to God.

And that requires creating a campus that fixes lots of different modalities, giving people better places to live, quite literally better homes to live, and a better community to live, and better schools for their kids, health and wellness, regeneratively organically grown food,

all of the things that we're fighting for now that Bobby Kennedy is fighting for in Washington, D.C. right now, these are things that we must care about, and I think that if we can fix all of these modalities, if we can create an intentional community that really focuses on human flourishing, and not just bottom lines, This is the problem.

Every industry is just, it's driven by bottom line, it's margins, it's how do we please shareholders so the CEO can make a big fat, you know, bonus at the end of the year. And I think that we are so lost in that we need to start valuing people over profits and not the other way around. And ironically, when we do that, plenty of profit comes. In fact, I believe that you make even more profit in the long run. It just requires patience and it requires empathy and it requires understanding that you need to invest in the right things, the things that are of actual value.

that is life. It's human life. It's animal life. It's plant life. It's, it, it, we are the only real miracle. Everything else can be recreated in some way. And so wildwood is that. It's, you know, honestly, it's kind of like a, it's like a factory town of old. It's like, you know, I use Hershey's Pennsylvania as an example. But, you know, once upon a time, a guy wanted to make chocolate. And it's like, okay, I needed a factory to make that chocolate, but I'm going to need homes. There's not enough homes for my workers. So I need to build them homes. And I need schools for their kids, and I need clinics so they can all stay healthy and well. And I firmly believe that the happiest bees make the tastiest honey. And so if you can go create a one-stop

shop where everyone that works and lives and plays there feels truly seen and truly heard and truly valued, well, guess what? You're going to make the best movies and TV shows and video games and music than anybody's ever heard. And you're going to create, I believe, a synergistic effect that we've only seen in what were kind of accidental renaissance throughout the ages, right? Like, Why did we have the Great American Renaissance in the United States in the early 60s? Well, it's because all of the artists all lived in the village. They lived on top of each other and next to each other, and they all spilled out into the same cafes and restaurants and parks and all of these things.

And they would have these, you know, because of that, the circumstances of them bumping into each other and co-creating and making new and better things together. That can be done. You can architect that. And you can also do it in a way where you've architected what I want to do. And this is an intentional blue zone. We know enough about the blue zones around the world to, understand why people live the longest and the healthiest, the centenarians. And that's because

of community. That's because of purpose. That's because of clean, good food. It's because they're moving their bodies every single day. You're not just stuck in a car and commuting hours to and from a work, a place of work. And so I'm trying to solve for all of these problems all in one fell swoop. And it's a big mountain to climb, but damn it, that's what I was put on this earth to do. So I have a million things. I want to ask about that. It reminds me of, I think Walt Disney had images like this, right? Is that he started his original little animation studio, and then what he did in Burbank, he did for his workers, and then Epcot was going to be this community like you're talking

about. And that's really interesting to me. Are people there now? Do people live there yet? Yes and no. So I bought this ranch. I've got 75 acres, 30 minutes east of Austin, 15 minutes east of the airport. I really believe God led me here.

It's a beautiful piece of property with lots of great virtues to extol. But it's been very slow going and trying to move this boulder up this hill, particularly since I've had to balance my acting career and bootstrap this for the last eight years. I bought this eight years ago. But I've had various people who have come and lived here and stayed here over the years. And in November, we are finally at long last about to break ground and build our first sound stages. I've got some great partners involved. We've got some money's already invested.

We've got a great game plan. Of course, we're looking for more investors and more like-minded people that understand the necessity of this. And I really do believe that it is a necessity. It was a necessity for a long time just, I believe, to make better art and to give artists better lives. But we are very quickly stepping into a, I don't know what even to call this world that we're stepping into, but AI is about to disrupt everything. AI is about to quite literally take away everyone's jobs. don't think enough people are talking about this. I think a lot of people are kind of burying their heads in the sand because it's far too much for most people to take on. Cognitive

dissidents, I understand. But we cannot just bury our heads in the sand. We have to, we have to recognize that the technology is exponential, Moore's Law, right? It just does this. And we are right now at the precipice. You can corral it. You can wrestle it into something that serves you in your community theoretically. I mean, why does it have to go against you? Absolutely. I think that I'm a firm believer that philosophically you cannot stop progress, you can only hope to guide it. So I have no delusions that we're going to stop this march of AI. But I do believe that we collectively, around the globe, regardless of what country you're in, we must work together to understand what we're stepping into and know that we have a responsibility to

guide this new technology. This is not like electricity. A lot of people are saying, yeah, we've had industrial revolutions in the past, and yeah, it took jobs away, but it created more jobs. I'm sorry, but this technology, quite literally its definition or its purpose is to do jobs. It's not just electrifying things that other people can run. Once we have AI and robotics that are programmed with this AI that are the next level, which is around the corner, they'll be able to do every job. So we have got to recognize that if we don't carve out a space for human effort, for, in my case, just for my industry,

if we can't carve out a place that holds the line and says, beyond this point, you know, like Gandalf and Lord of the Rings, thou shalt not pass, you know, like, I'm not saying we're not going to utilize AI to optimize and to make better the things that we humans do. But when it starts to replace us at scale, we have major problems.

And then we're talking about UBI and all of the other arable things that are downstream of that. So what Wildwood is, I believe it's an arc. It's an arc to save human art and entertainment for us, for future generations. I want my children to know that there is an opportunity for them to be an artist and to make a living being an artist if they so choose. Or I hope that other people in other industries are building wildwood-esque types of campuses for whatever their industries are. Pretty inspiring stuff.

I've often said, I, you know, I've been doing in this environment, I'm not, you know, I'm not a creative. person in television or anything but i've been fortunate enough to use media to create things and i've always said i'm i'm doing it try to just to do good what an empty experience it would have to be to be using media just to hey because it's me i want to be on tv or whatever that's got to be the most empty experience in the world and yet i was watching the emmys a couple nights ago and i thought oh yeah that's still alive and well did you have any reaction to that ceremony i wasn't i didn't watch i don't know. And by the way, and I didn't watch out a protest or anything. I have a lot of respect for a lot of the people, the talent that's in that room. You know, I just, I think that there are

more important things right now in the world. You know, I don't know. To be honest, the last five days or so, I've been really, and like a lot of us, I've been in a very weird headspace, very defeated and despondent because of Charlie. And, You know, and not to say that I couldn't have watched the Emmys to, you know, have a little, you know, a little respite from that. But I don't know. I got a kid now. I got a six-month-old at home, and that's what I was focused on. Congratulations.

Thanks. Yeah, we got a nine-month-old, eight-month-old granddaughter. And it's fun to have, yeah, it's a lot. Having babies is a lot. We had triplets, Zach. My wife gave birth to triplets. I want you to think about that. Yes.

Now you know what that means. Now you really know what that means. Oh, my gosh. I was actually kind of hoping we were going to have twins. I was hoping we were going to have twins because I have heard. Well, I've heard that the upside to that, though, is yes, it's, you know, twice or three times as intense when you're going through that phase. But then all of them are out of diapers at the same time.

You don't have to ever deal with that again. Now you've got three kids that all have perfect age playmates. And, you know, so there's pros and cons. But listen, we've got one six months old and that's a lot. If you survive, once you survive, once you survive, there are dividends. We went to end up five. You're like, oh, okay, this is not going to be good.

But even that, it's still always something. But, but yeah, so this, the Charlie catastrophe, I mean, and then, you know, the extraordinary, almost the more as disturbing as that was. And I think the fact that we all witness the violence. I mean, it's, there's no, there's a reason that medieval, you know, warlords and kings used to do public execution. There's something about that violence and the inviolability of our bodies and having to witness that collectively that moves us in ways that nothing else does. And I can't get it out of my head. I wait a little and I thinking about it. It's so disturbing.

But what is more concerning, and I don't want to minimize the trial thing at all, but what's more, I can't know the right word for it, are the people who are laughing and celebrating at this. That's the ineffable part to me, the uncanny part. The lack of moral sensibility is so profound that I don't know what to do with that part. Yeah. No, you're not wrong. And by the way, we're hearing the killer was in that same mind space. I saw the press conference today with the DA, and it reminded me of the kind of person that I saw laughing and celebrating. they're all kind of the same like oh well i had to do away with this guy

what happened to you what's going on how did you lose your humanity well i mean i think drew we know i mean that i think that's one of the hardest parts is that i think that we know how this happened and not to say that there's not multiple factors and i don't know everything about the suspect although more and more is coming out about his personal life and the influences that were around him. But when you have a media, legacy media apparatus and not even just the legacy media, but lots of people, you know, voices on X or Instagram or, you know, the new modalities of the media, when they are constantly programming people to believe that Donald Trump is the new

Hitler and anyone who sides with or votes for the new Hitler is a Nazi and they are the evil in the world and they must be stopped. That is what desensitizes everyone and activates them to then go take matters into their own hands. They think that they're being a hero. They don't think they're being callous. They think that they're doing away with someone who was actually evil instead of recognizing that if they were able to become so callous as to look at another life, another life, by the way, like Charlie, who, and I said this on my Instagram live, like, you know, I don't agree with everything Charlie said. I don't agree with necessarily how he said everything.

But I took the time to recognize what he was trying to say, what he was trying to do, and what I think he was very effective in doing 90% of the time, which was trying to engage people on the other side of the, ideological divide and say, let's talk about this. Let's debate, right? Now, unfortunately, a lot of people would step up to that microphone thinking that they had thought through their opinions more. Yes. And then they didn't. And so they found themselves in what felt like a gotcha moment. They felt embarrassed. They felt changed. And then that gets transposed onto Charlie. Oh, look at this bully. Look at this guy who's going to college campuses who clearly knows more.

And he's just trying to get people on these gotcha moments. But that's not what Charlie was trying. to do. Right? And so what that does is that just it, it activates this side more and more to dehumanize, Charlie, to dehumanize me, you, anyone else who had, I believe, the common sense to look at what we were being presented in our presidential election. What were we being presented with? What are we presented with every presidential election, unfortunately? We're getting two people, oftentimes, both of which we're not happy with. I didn't vote for Donald Trump, the first two times he ran. That was not my guy. And the only reason I voted for Donald this time was, well, multiple reasons, but one of the biggest was I was a Bobby Kennedy guy. Still I'm a

Bobby Kennedy guy. I believe he would have been one of the greatest American presidents that ever was. That wasn't in the cards, in large part because the Democratic Party made that impossible. They could have put him on their ballot. They were like, no, we can't control him. He's not going to tow whatever agendas we want him to tow. He's not going to be our guy. And then we're going to actively try to keep him off the ballot. And then once he got on the ballot, and then he, then he was trying to get off the ballot because now he was with Trump and now they were keeping him on the ballot. I mean, it was just screwing around with everything, right?

But Bobby was my guy. And then there was the miracle in Butler, a miracle that I wish we would have seen in Utah, but unfortunately we didn't. And that miracle in Butler, I believe that that was a humbling experience for President Trump. I believe that it was something that he had never experienced in his life. And it was enough for him to really dig deeper as a man and as a leader and go, okay, we're not playing around anymore. This isn't just like I get to be president and this is some game.

There is real darkness in the world. And that darkness is trying to destroy the light at every turn. And so any of us who understand that, we have got to do whatever we can to fight for the light in love. We have to do it in love. We cannot, you know, I know that there's, you know, a lot of people who say, no, now is not the time for love. This is evil. We must attack that evil. Guys, you cannot drive out evil with more evil. Martin of the King, you know, he was a polarizing character as well.

Also, died in the exact same way, trying to bridge divides. And you cannot drive out darkness with darkness. It must be light. It must be light. And so we have got to dig deeper right now in this moment. We need to galvanize, certainly everybody on the conservative side of things, to make sure that nobody is baited into what they would love, debate us into. And when I say they, just so everyone understands, I'm never referring to the voting populace of the left or the Democrats. I have so much empathy and so much sympathy

for everyone on that side, who I know are really wonderful people, but who have been lied to over and over and over and over again. Eventually, that becomes programming. Eventually, that becomes brainwashing. And by the way, we all need to check ourselves from a conservative standpoint. I'm a libertarian personally, but I mean, I lean more conservative in a lot of ways, obviously. And we all have to constantly check ourselves. Are we being programmed? Is my feed on X or Instagram? Is that feeding me an echo chamber? Am I just getting riled up for no reason? So we all need to be doing this all the time. But right now, we've got to have empathy for those who are lost in that programming and not attack them. Do not attack those people. That's exactly

what the dark powers at the top of all of this would love to happen. They want us fighting over everything all the time, faith and religion and gender, and you name it. They want us at each other's throat so that we're not looking at them and holding them accountable for the messes that they continue to keep making. Yeah, you mentioned media. Somebody asked me, what do we do a couple days ago? And I was like, well, I was sort of saying the same thing you were saying is saying however the people that have done the brainwashing the academics the media pundits those people we need to go hold accountable and and i prefer that i'm starting to use the word sinister i i notice you use the word dark a lot as opposed to evil and because when you start saying

evil people have all kinds of interpretations and ways of looking at that i and i just want to everyone to start to say on the same page it's dark it's sinister we can all agree on that it's not it's not light, it's not love, as you're saying. And I think we have to look at it that way. I had not also thought about what you were just mentioned about the Socratic method that Charlie was

using, that people don't understand the Socratic method anymore. That, yes, that's, Socratic method is designed to make you uncomfortable, to make you think, to hone your your analytic rational skills.

and it never feels good. That's what it's supposed to do. It's just awful to me to think that I thought he was moving people forward. You're right. But he may have been exposing them to shame or awkwardness or humiliation, which these days people equate with destructive kinds of feelings. Yeah. Yeah, it's really unfortunate.

And again, that's part of this nefarious, sinister brainwashing. It's telling people that you deserve to live a life. life where you are never challenged. You deserve the little life in a constant safe space. That is not reality. And it shouldn't be reality. It's unhealthy. We know this about mental, emotional, physical exertion is good for you.

It stresses your body. It stresses your mind. And it makes you a stronger individual. We are here in part for those purposes, I believe, for our soul to graduate, for our soul to evolve, to grow, to become strengthened. in this experience that we get to have. And personally, I don't want to walk around holding beliefs that are incorrect. If I'm, I wanna, I drill holes,

I poke holes into everything that I believe before I ever present them to anyone else because I want to at least have done that work so that when I do show up and I'm debating somebody or having a conversation, I don't look like a complete fool because I've thought about some of these things a few times. But occasionally somebody will bring something up to me. I'm like, oh man, you know what?

I never thought about that. Thank you, thank you. It might, it might feel like you're and crow, and you might have to eat a little crow, but that's life. That's what it's about. And that's why we have a First Amendment. I've heard this over and over again, and now, before Charlie passing, and now in the wake of him passing, you know, the First Amendment is not there to protect speech that you like. If the whole point, if that was the point, then why would we need the amendment? Why would we need to protect speech that everybody likes? You don't need

that. You need to protect speech that you don't like, that does make you feel uncomfortable, that is opposing your ideologies. And then through that, while people debating, grinding through it, that's how we figure out what is true, what is absolutely true. And I wish that there were people on the left that were doing what Charlie did.

I wish there were. I wish that there were people that sat there and said, hey, listen, I believe all of these things, and I would love, for any college campus conservatives or anybody else,

you want to challenge it, let's go. Let's talk about these things. Let's do it. Charlie was one of the only people And certainly, I don't know, maybe there's some people on the left that have done this, but the only people I've ever heard of or seen really doing this

are people that were on the conservative side of things because they recognize that it must be done on college campuses. College campuses have been, universities have been infected for far too long. And it needs to be challenged. That is where so many of these young minds and hearts are coming up with no one helping to guide their thought process. They believe, as we all did for the longest time, well, if you go to university, of course professors are teaching you what is true.

Otherwise, why would they be there? We trust these people. We trust these institutions. But they've been captured, man. They've been captured. So many of them have been captured. And it is terrifying to know that that is what's being programmed into the hearts and minds of these young people. I was just thinking about how so much the debate I've seen,

coming from both directions, Charlie, not at all this way. it devolves into ad hominem attacks or aggression. You can't get anywhere that way. You can't get anywhere with defensiveness. And what's the guy's name from Mumford and Sons that got kicked out? He was debating in the Oxford Club against Nancy Pelosi. I'm blanking on his name. Yes.

Because you just asked, it was tip of tongue and now it's gone. But yes. He's got a brilliant. He's brilliant as a podcast. That to me, he is the essence of the style of debate. that I want to see us us all engaged in and unfortunately

it just devolves so so fast it's almost like people don't know how to do it Winston Marshall Winston Marshall yeah well and you know

and to your point Dr. Drew and I think that you clearly understand this and I think that a lot of people just don't but this is the ego at work

right the ego once upon a time the ego which is this incredible survival, you know, beacon inside of us. This thing that is supposed to be there on some level to, you know, scream out danger, Will Robinson, danger. Like there's something going on.

We must address this. But once upon a time, once upon a time, our ego required five things to be satiated. Food, clothing, shelter, food water, clothing, shelter, and community. That's it, right? Prior to that, we were tribal peoples. You didn't really need anything beyond that.

And truly, community was the most important of all of that because let's say you found yourself in a terrible situation. You broke your leg. You were sick. Whatever it was, you had a community of people to be able to help you sustain through those tough times. Yes, occasionally there's some lone wolf human being who was just like this lumberjack crazy person

who goes and does everything by themselves. But by large, as humans, we were designed, created by our creator, to live in community with one another and to have that type of understanding. And then I believe that whatever, 10,000 years ago, all of a sudden the Samarians or whomever did it, they were like, well, you know what, why don't we, instead of constantly bartering and, you know, or, you know, having, you got sheep and I've got pots and we got to carry these things around, why don't we have these shells that kind of denote some value? And then now you can just carry those around so we don't have to keep lugging around all of our wares. Great, fine. Sounds like a wonderful plan. But I believe in that moment in human history. immediately the ego was hijacked, and the ego all of a sudden was like, well, I don't need all of these other things. I don't need five things. I just need one thing. I just need more shells. And then from that point on, we started to twist the ego and not understand how it works,

really, how it operates. And so now, cut to today, you have someone who has the vehement opinions, these strong held opinions of Charlie Kirk is a fascist and racist and big and all of these things that are completely untrue. And if anybody actually looks at the unclipped, in-context videos about Charlie Kirk, talking about any of these things, you can see that. You can clearly see that. But if you're presented with new evidence and you haven't seen it and you haven't thought about it and you haven't really put it into your thought process yet,

of course you're going to turn to ad hominem attacks because your ego is now threatened. You don't realize that it's actually your survival instinct kicking in. And your survival instinct says, do whatever you can to get out of this. conversation. Do whatever you can. And so then it starts to become mudslinging and you're a horrible person and you're a racist and you're a bigot because they don't have the capacity to argue it or debate it intellectually with wisdom, with reason, with rational thought. Of course. And I completely agree. And you know, you call it ego. Hagle used to call it spirit, that the spirit moves itself forward through the dialectic, that the back and forth of thesis, antithesis,

synthesis through history, through intellect, through scientific discourse. It's all spirit moving forward. And it's very hard to know what Hegel really meant when he said spirit. But zeitgeist, he invented that word. It's sort of the zeitgeist moving forward. And he once is famous for, he was sitting, I forget one of the cities that Napoleon invaded and Napoleon rode through and he said, I just saw spirit in a human form coming through the town. So he thought, you know, that humans moved everything forward through

this spirit. It doesn't sound right to use it in English. He had, he was in, he was in German. But in any event, I'm getting way off course here. I read somewhere that you identified as libertarian. Is that accurate? Yeah. Yeah, I would say so. You know, I grew up, my parents were, you know, for the most part, they were like Kennedy Democrats that turned Reagan, Republicans like a lot of people did. And, you know, I grew up in a household and I'm very grateful for this where my parents instilled in me and my sisters to have a healthy level of distrust for the government and all major industry, you know, to recognize that absolute power corrupts absolutely.

And that is true because, again, I go back to the ego. Higel might call it the spirit. But biblically, you know, over and over again, it talks about this wrestling between the flesh and the spirit, right? And so I delineate the spirit as being our soul, our connection and frequency to our creator. And the flesh is the ego. The flesh is this more hormonal, animalistic version of ourselves. And I don't think that we are to kill the ego.

And a lot of people are about ego dissolution, or killing the ego. I think what is better, perhaps, is that we wrestle the ego. that we look at the ego and we almost like a like in a pride of lions and you have some young upstart lion that wants to take on the pride right they want to they want to rule it well more often than not the alpha lion in that pride it doesn't go and kill that young upstart it hens it to the ground and it says not today not today and i think that that's how we need to be treating this we need to recognize that we are going to have impulses in all kinds of different ways addiction Obviously, it taps into so many of these things. It's this ego because we don't know how to process our trauma. We don't know how to process our emotions. We're struggling inside. And so we're reaching out to these other ways to self-medicate.

Well, it's the ego trying to survive in this. You've got to pin that to the ground and you've got to say, no. We are going to be spirit, soul frequency with our creator led. And that's a difficult thing to do in a world that celebrates the ego constantly. It's flexing the ego constantly. How many followers do you have? How many likes do you have? What kind of car do you drive? What kind of clothes do you wear? Oh, do you have the new Birken bag? Oh, you don't have the new Birken bag? Like, all of this

nonsense. And everyone's just judging themselves based on everybody else as opposed to recognizing that all that's nonsense. It's nonsense. Like, what is the value of your relationships with your friends with your family? What good are you putting into this world? How are you leaving this world? Like, man, it's going to make me emotional just talking about it, but I want to leave this world. I want to leave this world the way Charlie left this world not in the way that he I don't want anybody to shoot me dead

but listen man you never know you don't know tomorrow was not promised right but you want to leave the world having left such an impact that this is the response that even people who disagreed with you even people who are very much on the other side of the aisle politically

not all obviously there's a lot of people like you said, this vile response of people dancing and celebrating because they're lost. Not because they themselves are evil, but because they've been programmed with evil thoughts. I firmly believe that. And we must have grace and we must see them as children of God. But there are so many

people, so many examples of people who were atheists, who were not conservative, who had nothing, didn't want anything to do with God at all. And they are seeing this response and they're going, oh my gosh, man, maybe I am on the wrong side of this. Because this guy,

really was trying to do good in this world and he was taken out because of it and man look at the response look at the ripple effects of what's going on and so if we could all lead our lives in that way recognizing that we have an opportunity to lift other people up to try to move this forward in a positive direction and we must because we do have things like AI that are barreling down on us we do have darkness and evil or sinister or nefarious actors in this world that would love nothing more than to eradicate all of us plebs and live whatever their elite lifestyle and everything else that they, God knows what they're cooking up right now. And I don't want any of us to fall victim to that. I want us to to galvanize as a human species and recognize that we are at a

precipice and we have an opportunity to either step into tremendous amounts of light or we can all be brought into this darkness and fighting and hating and more fear. And that's exactly what that, that sinisterness would want us to do. Zach, I want to leave this right there because you really said so much in the last three or four minutes that I wanted to land on people. And I have no doubt I could feel Caleb already cutting up the highlights so we can open our show with this.

How have we not met you before? You like say all of the words that it's like the culmination of all 500 and something episodes we've done. It's just so nuanced and it's so intelligent. How did we not have you on your before? I knew Zach had this. Because I didn't have Zach DM me before. I think that's what happened.

You DM me or something? Well, one of your producers DM me? And they said, hey, I work with Dr. Drew. We'd like to have you on this show. And if you don't believe me, make sure you DM him. And I was like, I'm definitely going to DM Dr. Drew because I don't know who this stranger is. But I'm glad it was all legit.

And I'm glad it worked out. And thank you so much for having me on. Thank you for everything you guys continue to do. Again, we must speak truth and we must do it in love. And I believe that you're doing that. And Bati, who's coming up next, you're doing it. And I'm so grateful to have met you at least virtually. I hope we all get to meet in person at some point soon.

May we keep fighting the good fight. May we do it in honor of Charlie and everyone else. I get to do a shift in one of your clinics in Wildwood or something. You know what I mean? Would love that. You'll need people. You'll need, I have to get my license in Texas or something, but that shouldn't be too hard.

I appreciate that. Good luck with all of it. What's coming up? Where do you want people to find you looking forward? So, well, as far as acting work, I've got a film called Sarah's Oil that comes out November 7th in theaters. It's a beautiful true story about a young black girl.

She was about 10 years old in Tulsa, Oklahoma, in 1912, 1913. She and her family were, at one point in their history, they were slaves of one of the indigenous tribes. A lot of people don't know that, but everyone had slaves prior to slavery being abolished. And when it was, the slaves are the indigenous tribes all had to abolish their slavery. They absorbed those slaves into their tribes, called them freedmen, tribal members. And then when the U.S. gave some land back to the indigenous tribes,

Sarah was appropriated. She was given 160 acres of what the government thought was crap land because you really didn't grow anything on it. She was a special, beautiful, talented, precocious, intelligent young, girl who was very blessed to get to go to the school that she went to. She could read write and everything else. And she was reading the newspaper. She saw the oil boom was coming across the nation. She went to her land. She prayed over her land. And she believed that God told her that she had oil in it. And sure enough, she did. And she had the largest oil reserve in all of North America. She leased it to Rockefeller. She ended up being the richest woman in America

as a young 10-year-old black girl in Tulsa, Oklahoma. And nobody knows the story. And so we made that movie. It comes out November 7th. It's beautiful. It's inspiring. It's good for the whole family. And then there's another film that I did called Not Without Hope, also a true story, not nearly as lighthearted. It's a true story about these four friends who went on a fishing trip off the coast of Tampa, Florida in 2009. They got caught in the storm. Three of them ended up succumbing to hypothermia.

One lived. I play that gentleman, Nick. But that comes out in, when is it come up? December 7th. I'm getting the notes from the side here from my assistant. Thank you. Sarah's oil, is Sarah's all going to have a premiere or something? I want to support that film anyway I can't when it comes out.

I believe we're going to have a premiere. I don't know. It's an Amazon release. I haven't heard anything about those details, but I would love for you to be there. And I would love for anybody out there watching. Please go see it. It is imperative that we watch movies in the theater and not just monetarily to support the arts and support artists like myself, but please understand this.

When we all sit at home and when we watch movies, exactly, when we watch movies by ourselves in our own little kind of bubble, that can be great. But when we go to a theater, we understand that we're surrounded by a bunch of people that don't agree with us that do not see life in the same way. And yet we can all laugh at the same moments.

We can all tear up at the same moments. And that shows that we're all human beings. We're all feeling a lot of these same things. So I really implore people to go see them theaters if you can and if not, you can watch it at home when you do. Done and done, my friend. Zach, hope to meet you in person and hope to support that film.

Thank you for being here. Thank you, Drew. Thank you, everybody. And Caleb, Bastrop, Texas, shout out. That's where we're building Wildwood Studios. And I hope you get to come and visit it at some point soon. God bless you guys. Thanks for having me on. Thanks, man. I bless you. Exactly. Caleb is from Bastrop. So that's where he grew up. Yeah, that's where I homeschooled. Spent all my teenage years there back when it was mostly just farmland. And then as soon as I moved away, all of a sudden, Elon Musk wants to build rocket ships there. And then Zachary wants to go build film studios there. I tell my dad, all of my dad, the time like, I wish you had just kept

that land. Just, why wish you hadn't sold the land? Because now you could have sold it for so much more. Interesting. All right, let's get going. You lived everywhere. Zachary's very inspiring, but equally inspiring as Bacha Ungar Sargon. And she joins us right after this.

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Dr.com. Yeah, dot com through two. That's a one health, one wellness. It's very interesting. And they're going to expand on programs like that going forward. So keep an eye on all that.

All right. Equally as inspiring, as I said, is Bacha Ungar Sargon. Her new program is called Bacha on News Nation. Opinion editor at Newsweek, author of Bad News and Second Class. You can find out more about Baja,

of course, by following her on X. Bungar Sargon, that is her last name. And Baja, Thank you for coming back and joining us. As I said, last time you gave me hope that a young person could have such clarity and optimism. And I've seen you've been on fire with Pierce and Bill Maher. And so just wanted to, it's such a wild time. I just thought it would be an important person to talk to right now and what your thoughts are on the heels of.

So this is what I really want to talk about, the heels of this catastrophe with Charlie. And then the extraordinary, inexplicable. morally bankrupt reactions of some people. Do you hold people accountable for those reactions? Or do you give them grace and say, this is the people that brainwash them, this is the bubbles they live in, live in, that they would ever think that this behavior is anything other than reprehensible? So first of all, thank you so much for having me back. It's such a pleasure to be here with you. You are doing such important work. You're such a voice for sanity. You somehow managed to do it in a way that's not triggering.

And I really envy that because I feel that I sometimes trigger people. I'm sure I'll trigger somebody. I feel the same way about you. You're very thoughtful and even. And I don't understand why somebody will be triggered by you. That's my blind spot. I'm trying to watch all my blind spots because we all have them. I too am often mystified by why people are so triggered by what I'm saying.

But it does happen a lot. You know, it's very interesting because I'm a lot less interested in the, the soulless, obviously evil people celebrating Charlie's death for social media clicks. I think we can all agree, including a lot of people I've seen denounce it on the left, that this is just like utterly godless behavior. I don't really spend much time thinking about that. What I'm very invested in is the fact that the Democrats seem to be letting themselves off the hook with this both sides narrative, that political violence comes equally from both sides,

which of course it doesn't anymore. Maybe it used to. Maybe there was a time in American history when the vast majority of political violence came from the right. We are clearly in the last four years in a very different place to where the vast majority of political violence is coming from the left

and doesn't get counted in the polling. And so, you know, they bring you these cases and when you debunk the cases, they bring you the polls. And the polls, of course, are created by very far left-wing organizations. And the thing that bothers me so much about it is not the call for unity, which I endorse and I love. I'm a big unifier.

I'm a big believer that more unites us than divides us as Americans. What bothers me so much about the myth that political violence is equally distributed between right and left is that what the left is doing with that myth is asking the right, which is the victim of Charlie's horrific assassination, to bear 50% of the burden and the guilt of a crime against them, right? They're in saying it's equal from both sides, they are reassigning the blame from where it should be on the left to the right, which has been victimized by left-wing violence. And that's what I cannot stand, the reassigning of the roles of victim and perpetrator. And of course, I don't think Democrats writ large wanted this to happen. But it is obvious when you call your political opponents Hitler and a Nazi and fascist day in and day out, you are signing their death warrant. This is just obvious because the only thing to do with Nazis and fascists is to kill them. And so they used rhetoric that created an atmosphere in which conservatives were not safe.

And then they asked conservatives to bear 50% of the blame of it. And I have a real problem with that. Abraham Lincoln has a famous quote from the Cooper Union address and people that don't know after the Lincoln Douglas debates, which were for a Senate seat actually, he lost. And later on, his thinking got more and more crystallized. And the Cooper Union address is really what people think gave him the presidency. He said in the, it's a long speech. But in there he said it's this, he goes, you know, these people want to destroy the union and then they're blaming us for it. He said it's like you have a highway robber comes up and give me your wallet,

or you shall be a murderer. And this is exactly what that is. Yeah, it's you're taking the, it's your causing me to have to murder you, which is such a bizarre, distorted state for people to be in. But I do kind of want to drill down a couple things. You said, you called it polls, the polls that count the violence, right? you're talking about the research that's out there on violence, right? And I looked up, because I kept hearing these quotes that, oh, no, it all comes from the right

and there's way more documented cases from the right. And I thought, gosh, am I blind to it? Am I just not seeing it? So I went in and I started looking at the data very carefully. And the data confirmed it's exactly what they're saying, that if anything, it's equal. And then I thought, well, let's dig in further. And what is in the data? Well, what's in the data, it's very bizarre.

Like, for instance, Black Life Matters riots and the property laws and the violence there, completely not in any way registered as coming out of a different side, not from the right. And by the same token, you'll see these sort of these insane mass murderers who were unclear what they were politically being assigned to the right. So it's really wild trying to get through the data. How do we deal with that? Is there somebody going to collect the data or collate it and presented in a published fashion where it can be sort of even peer reviewed so people agree, okay, here's the data?

It's a really great question. I mean, what do you do in the economist? The economist is putting out just complete misinformation, right? charts that get shared endlessly in which Black Lives Matter and the hundreds of people who were killed during those riots don't appear at all. And moreover, if you look at all of the high-profile

assassinations from the left, these were done by people who literally sounded indistinguishable from top-tier Democrats, right? Whether it's Luigi Mangione or Elias Rodriguez who murdered the two young people outside the Jewish Museum or the trans shooter

or what's the, what Charlie Kirk's murderer allegedly told his family over dinner. They sound exactly like every other leftist. They don't sound crazy at all. Elias Rodriguez wrote a manifesto that sounds like a bad college paper. If you look at the people who allegedly are from the right, like the person who hit Paul Pelosi, for example, first of all, that guy lived in a commune that had Black Lives Matter

and gay pride parade flags on it. I'm not sure what sense it makes to call this person right wing, but he's clearly a lunatic, right? Same thing with the guy who killed those two Minnesota state senators. Let's stop with Pelosi. Let's talk Pelosi. So what I hear, the rhetoric I hear on that is, well, they celebrated, the rights celebrated that attack. And they're, and we'll talk about whether it was a celebration or not. And they're equating that with the reaction that people are having to Charlie Cook.

This is such a false equivalency. I saw people making fun of Pelosi's husband's attack, and that was not cool. It was demeaning and humiliating. It was disgusting, but it was making fun of, making jokes about and demeaning him and things. And really not at all cool, but not dancing on somebody's grave. Completely incomparable. And by the way, in the beginning, it did seem very suspicious the way it was being told. I think a lot of the jokes were made in the beginning when it seemed extremely suspicious,

although I agree with you, at no point was it, you know, fair to make fun of this. It was horrible. It was horrible. It was very sad. But it is not comparable. Posting a meme, you know, is not comparable to really saying that somebody deserved to die and you're glad they died or dancing on their grave, as you put it. So I think that that case, you know, totally incomparable. That keeps coming up. It's a good, it's a good case example. budget because it keeps coming up and it's like these are not equivalent.

And by the way, what's wrong with your, what's wrong with your moral sensibilities? Yes, neither cool, but one very different than the other. Exactly. The Minnesota state senators, the person who assassinated them was appointed by Tim Walz, wrote a letter confessing to the FBI in which he stated his motive. Now, according to the way this is being covered on CNN and MSNBC, his motive was clearly that he was a Trump supporter, right? That's the way they're covering it.

What was his actual motive? Well, when you read the letter, his motive was Tim Walz told me to kill them. Like, the fact that they were Democrats does not make their killer a Republican. Same thing with Josh Shapiro. We keep hearing. Josh Shapiro was almost assassinated.

His house was firebombed. It was by a free Palestine leftist. So every case breaks down. When you look a little bit closer, they have to go all the way back to Gabby Giffords. Of course, they bring up January, where nobody was killed, not a single firearm was recovered. The only person who died was

Ashley Babbitt, one of the protesters. So there just really is no equivalence. I read somewhere else that in all of those studies with the data and the polling, they count white supremacists killing each other in prison as right wing. During the Volvo Fall Experience event,

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Violence, are you kidding me? Well, but that's interesting. At least, I think, at least that's an interesting piece of data. It's something, right, right. Let's talk about that. Yeah, it's something. It's like, okay, all right. There's something that's not unrealistic.

I'm sorry, I'm getting a, this is a quick super check. I'm getting bombed by post saying the right is overwhelmingly caused the violence. How do we combat it? Well, that's what Batcha's talking about right now. She's giving you all the particulars. But it is become... By the way, can I just say one more thing?

Something that they should mention. Like, why do they keep going to the polls? It's because they don't actually have case studies. Like, when you say to the right, give us the examples, of left-wing violence. Like, Black Lives Matter, 127 people were killed. Luigi Mangione murdered out of leftist cause in cold blood. Elias Rodriguez murdered in cold blood out of a left-wing cause.

This guy, Robin Westman, Robert Westman. And then the guy who killed Charlie, Tommy Robinson, obviously motivated by actual left-wing ideology, whereas all of the cases from the right in the last four or five years are... And not just the ideology, by the way. It's almost unfair now to call it ideology. What it is is dehumanizing people. It is brainwashing people with these notions that these are people that do not deserve to live.

Or a logic, like you said, where they're fascist, Hitler, whatever. So they, what patriot wouldn't take somebody like that out? It's creating an environment for people, certain people, if they're vulnerable, that if they're in the echo chamber enough, could be brought to violence. And I don't see the same thing happening on the right, that same mechanism happening on the right side. But let's talk about this.

I want to drill on this because I'm trying, again, I'm sure I have cognitive distance, I have blind spots, we all do, how our brains work. I don't understand because I, see, for me, I could see that Trump is boorish and it says the rhetoric is on pleasure, And I, yeah, I don't like it when he talks a certain way. But I don't understand what is so triggering about it.

I was literally about to ask you the same thing. So I had a very close friend who after the first assassination attempt on Trump's life said to me, I wish he died. I wish he had succeeded. And I said to her, are you crazy? First of all, you know, we would have a civil war. She said, well, I don't want the war. I just wish he was dead. I wish he had succeeded, but we didn't have.

And I was like, what? has he ever done to you? I mean, to hate a person so much, you wish they were dead. Why? What has he done to you? Okay, so I have a recent theory of it, of the case, which I will talk about at great length on my new show on News Nation, which airs Saturday 4 p.m. Eastern, this is my opening monologue, and you all are getting a preview of it. Great. Okay, so here's my theory. Okay, In the 80s, I think the Democrats felt very locked out of political power. You know, Reagan won almost every single state. There was just this big, like the whole country moved to the right.

And they felt really locked out of political power. But you know what they had? They had cultural power. So they controlled the universities. They controlled Hollywood. They put out all the novels. They made all the art. They had real cultural power.

Every movie, the TV shows, they had a kind of liberalism, you know, inside them. in them. Okay, Obama comes along and suddenly the Democrats have political power back, but they don't just take the political power and think, oh, this is great. We should deliver on our campaign promises and then people will vote for us again. They convinced themselves that this was their birthright. So you really had this kind of like, they would write books about it, the coming Democratic majority, you know, they convinced themselves that they were on the ascendancy and they would never have to compete for political power again. So in that era, they had both cultural power and political power.

And they really became convinced that this was it. The other side were losers. They were never going to have to fight for votes again. Along comes Donald Trump, and he steals that political power back for the right. And this enrages them because they had forgotten that actually the democratic process is supposed to work that way, like you're supposed to fight for these things by delivering for the voters. They decided power was their birthright, and so they got very angry. And then, Dr. Drew, in 2024, the right stole the cultural power back.

It is now lame and cringe and old to be a Democrat, and all of the joy and all of the edginess and all of the vibrancy and all of the youth are moving to the right in staggering numbers. And I think this, more than anything else, is what makes them absolutely loathed, Donald Trump is because he stole from them a thing that they had decided was theirs for the having. And so, of course, the ironclad law of projection, every accusation from the Democrats is a confession. They say he's a threat to democracy. What they really meant was he is democracy.

He's a threat to their power. I think that's my latest analysis. What do you make of it? I think you nailed it. And I would go even one step further. Because I've been feeling like there's something sinister. a foot. And I think you may have been sort of putting your finger lightly on the sinister element, which is once they had power, they decided that we are in the right, we are in the no,

we are the just, we are the good. And anyone that conflicts with that is evil, bad. And that's where the good, evil thing came in. And that's where they felt justified turning all the power of the intelligence services, for instance, domestically. Because we needed to purify and clarify what was here so none of the bad people could do their thing. And then the bad person, somebody who represents the bad, quite well. He seems like he's, like he's, you know, he's not, he's not exactly an angel. As he's said repeatedly, a bad person came to power. I think that's it. I think they think he's, he's like he is the bad amongst the bad. And even though he doesn't do anything bad, they really are so trick.

by him. It's really something to behold. Yeah, I ask people the same thing. Why, why do you hate him so much? What, what is he? I think you're, I think you're right in the zone there, Bacha, where it explains what's going on. And we won't really be able to see it until we're further away. You know, how, I mentioned Hegel. I mentioned Hegel to Zach. And Hegel has a saying, the, the owl of Minerva spreads its wings only with a setting of dusk, meaning wisdom only shows itself long after, as nightfall, the day is gone, then you look back and the owl of Minerva reveals itself. And I think you may have, you may be the first boot of that owl telling us what has happened here.

And that's what, but you're a young person, you should be from where we get this information. because those of us that have, you know, we're encumbered by history or us. You know, we're like, now what's happening? And we don't see things. We're not as, you know, think about it. Who gets more, who is more attuned to the historical moment than adolescence and young adults?

They're the ones that, I don't know, somehow their bodies are attuned to it. They're living it. And you mentioned the Reagan thing. I remember, this would be interesting story for you. I remember the 70s sucked. They were even, they were, they were, this feels more violent, but the economically, they really blew.

And I remember my senior year in college, I walked out of my dorm and I, we get the Boston Globe every day. And there in my doorstep was this picture of these helicopters strewn across the desert. And I was like, oh, my God, we suck. We can't even get these hostages out of Iran. This is, but we're just done. It's over. So we just kind of, it just, everything was, look at all the films and TV. I think it was brown and everything was about no jobs, no jobs for people like.

Their racism was really alive and well then, too. And it was bad. And I'll never forget, I went to a party in the fall of 1980. I was in medical school then. And still, like, you know, just staying focused on my own stuff. But I went to this house party. And just the fact that there were a house party was already something like, huh?

People are partying again? And I went there and it was very crowded. and I don't know why I'm telling you the story, but I thought it might help you with the historical sweep of all this. Devo Whippet came on, loud. And everybody in the room started jumping up and down with glee and joy, which I had not seen. I had not seen joyous community sort of outburst.

I was like, I was looked at all, something's different. Oh, my God, this is so different. I've never seen anything quite like this. and then the 80s ensued. And it was a very upbeat time. So things can change very quickly, is the point. Yeah, I was aware of the moment. I was aware that night that something was happening.

Wow. What a story. I love that. And it's also an example of how young people were around it and we're in it and we can attuned to it. It's kind of crazy. So, Owl of Minerva, that is you. So I'm looking to you for on your show.

to give us wisdom every week. Tell us more about the show. How is it going to work? What are you going to do? You can interview people, I imagine? Yeah, it's going to start with an editorial, like the one that I just gave away. You heard it first on Dr. Drew.

Then there's going to be a big marquee interview and then a panel, a debate panel. And then it'll end with some fun media fails and a bit of culture. And also there'll be a segment with the debate panelists called Finding Common Ground, where we try to see if we can find something we can all agree on.

It kind of sounds like Bill Marshow. I've literally ripped off. I ripped off his exact format. I'm not funny, much to my chagrin. So it'll be a less funny version of, exactly, real time with Bill Maher. And so how did you find Bill when you were in there a couple, I guess it was a week ago or two weeks ago?

I was on Bill. Actually, I haven't been on since March. I've been on three times. When my first book came out, then when my second book came out and then they had me again last year. They found me. Yeah, I don't really know how. He's, I think he is, he has a very important role to play.

I think he's a, he and I've had a lot of conversations and he, I will tell you, he comes from a background that I, you know, an educational environment that I came from, and he values the truth. And that is a really important thing for us to get back to. The truth matters. The truth exists. Humans can only approximate it, but it is an important thing to get as close to as possible. And it's how science gets adulterated.

If there's no truth, well, who cares what, you know, science is, whatever you say it is. Well, oh, my God, we have been so adulterated in so many disciplines. So it'll be nice to get back to something like the truth. Okay, well, listen, I don't want to take any thunder away from your show. to send people there to hear more about you. And I want to go there to be a guest. So yes. And any more books coming? Anytime. Anytime. Doors open. Please. Yes. Um, you ask for me. Yes. Please come. I have a, my third book will be out in June. It's called The Left and the Jews or the Jews and the Left. I can never quite remember. And it's about why Jews became

Democrats and then why the Left turned on the Jews. And yeah, I'll come back and we'll talk about it. Are you a show filming in New York or where are you going to film? Yeah, in New York. So come to New York. Okay. I'm here now. I'm here a lot. I'm here. That's New York City behind me. So I will happily, happily, happily come to. And is it a live show or is it taped? It tapes on Friday and then it airs on Saturday. I'm Shomer Shabbas, so I can't film it on Saturday. But it's a Saturday show. So we film Friday and it will air Saturday, 4 p.m. and 11 p.m. because I told them that if it only airs at 4 p.m., nobody in my synagogue can watch it.

But if it airs after, everybody will watch it. Audience, yes, audience, no audience? No audience. I bet you, I'm going to predict you'll end up with some sort of little audience one day because it sounds like that kind of show that it should have that. I'm going to predict in success with every little audience there. All right, listen, Bacha, thank you so much for going back. you always give me hope and look forward to the show because then I can tune in and get hope

every week from you. So thank you so much. Thank you so much. God bless. We'll see you soon. All right. You got it. All right, everybody. This has been an interesting show. And I hope inspirational for everybody. Let me look at what you guys are saying on the rants. You've been pretty quiet over there. Hang on a second. That's funny. see you guys are yes yes you guys are fans of Bacha which is great you were also fans of

Zach I noticed I was watching you guys as you were talking I'm scrolling up to see if there's anything any questions or anything you guys are bringing up here it's so interesting I'm so fortunate yeah two things one of these guests though that go ahead oh yeah

I get so interesting that I lose track of you guys but go ahead notice how Bata is very talented she knows exactly what she wants to say she comes with really good points and the television business wrapped around her requirements she couldn't go and do a show on Friday night

to Saturday and TV wrapped around that and made it work that's what happens whenever you're a really actually talented person that they really want they will make it happen the other thing is I am just I feel so warm inside my heart just listening to Zachary

talk it's it to me it's just such a relief to hear somebody who's so prominent, who's not only been very successful in Hollywood, but also has taken the time to research this stuff. It's so rare. I don't know how some people find the time to be movie stars and found like a $100 million studio in Bastrop Tuses and then actually find the source.

At very minimum, when you're being a movie star, you're sitting in a trailer 50, 60% of the time. So you can read a lot. But it's the promotion of the movie that takes a lot of time. But I also appreciated that he didn't shit all over his peers in Hollywood. And I don't think that was political or strategic. I think he really just doesn't have that kind of thing in him, even though I would have been satisfied to hear a little bit of.

I wanted to ask him about, I wanted to ask Bacchia one thing. I just remember there was one thing I wanted to ask her about. I was asking about how Trump triggered people. And I also didn't understand what Colbert was talking about on the Emmys. Did you hear that, Caleb? where he goes, you don't really love something until you lose it. And I've never lived my country so much, meaning I've lost my country. And I thought, what do you mean?

What does that mean that you've lost your country? What are you talking about exactly? You're talking about the, is ice rays bug you that much? I mean, that's where we've lost our way or all these executive orders that you disagree. I just want to know what you mean. And by the way, you still, there's the constitution. is still intact doing its thing? Or is it

that what Bacha was just talking about that the previous interpretation of the Constitution was that a certain group should get in and hold power period indefinitely through all sorts of means? That's not the use of the Constitution. I understand it. That's sort of a problem.

It's a distortion that's getting maybe corrected. And is that correction feel like you've lost something? I guess. Something in that zone. Something there. What do you think, Caleb? I don't think I have a properly formed response to that. That was a lot. I think I do agree. Yeah. I was I was distracted because I was listening to you and also looking at my list of people that I've been keeping that are liberals, leftist Democrats who would never have supported Trump, never and never ever. And yet found the heart to go and say kind, compassionate words about Charlie Kerr. Someone that they would have disagreed on about everything. It's pretty wild the list of people.

Everyone from Chris Pratt, Jeffrey Starr, Kristen Chenoweth, Selma Blair, even Rosie O'Donnell, Jamie Lee Curtis, Deborah Messing, LeBron James. Rosie showed, Rosie has been sharing a lot of clarity in class lately. She'd been great. I was very impressed. I want to support all of them. Jamie Lee Curtis, yeah. All these people, they found the heart to say something kind and compassionate about someone that they would have disagreed with on everything. while their political opponents were hurting at the time.

And that takes a lot. That really makes them look really good. And I'm very impressed and I want to support all of them. It shouldn't. It shouldn't. It shouldn't. But that's the world we are in now. And then Mews is saying here that Batchi had some sort of interview with Fauci that was not good a few years ago.

I would love to know what more about that. And again, she's entitled to have, I will remind you at the beginning, the pandemic, I was saying, everybody listened to Dr. Fauci. He's been, he should be your North Star. He is somebody I've leaned on all the way through the AIDS epidemic and through the H1N1. He has been a useful leader. Lean on him again. And I was freaking wrong. Of course, as I was saying, calm down. That's the only part that got cut out of all the video montages of me. The part where I'm saying, listen to the CDC, listen, Dr. Fauci. That, of course, was cut out. And that was the part I really got wrong. That was the part.

really. And it's just, it's so ironic, isn't it? Uh-oh, here we go. Here's your list. Yeah, that's what I've gotten so far. I think we should support them, even if we're opposite of them politically. That was really nice of them to do. I have, I, Caleb, you are pretty much further right than I am. I'm so moderate. I can easily support people in different opinions. Well, it's so easy for me.

See, like this is what a lot of people don't know. And I think I've told you, but I may not have said it publicly. But I stood in line for six hours to, to see Bernie Sanders. I was a monthly donor to Bernie Sanders. Everyone's so confused that I would suddenly go over to like RFK and be on that side. And to me, it just seems like, well, it's just I don't understand why it has to be so malicious and so nasty to each other. I think it's, I want the same things that I wanted back then. I just got more realistic about how are we going to get there. That's right. We all want the same thing. And the idea that some people want,

something that other people don't want or want to do it at the expense of other people, it's just not so. It's just not so. I've never met that person. They don't exist. And if you're believing they exist, somebody is brainwashing you. It's all I'm saying. There are, not to say that there aren't, you know, psychopaths out there and there aren't rapacious people out there, but they're not talking about politics particularly. They keep things themselves and they do their thing. Believe me. All right, everybody, Kim Iverson had been forming as a COVID stuff

in the same show. Okay, whatever. Okay. Thank you guys. Tomorrow we're going to talk to somebody. I think one of the founders of fire, and this is a great time to be talking to them, which is, you know, remember,

we talked to Greg Lukianov from Fire. First Amendment, we're going to talk about, is there such thing as hate speech? And we've got, we've got so many guests. Camel Adipo is coming. Joel Adipo. I can't. Tyler Fisher's coming back. Excellent. AP Sears, Jessica Rose.

Leland Vitter, she's going to talk about his new book. That should be interesting. All right. A lot of great guests coming up your way. We'll see you in here tomorrow. Tomorrow is early, correct? Caleb? Does I have to gutt-fell tomorrow? Yes, it's tomorrow and does that just change? Let's see. It's tomorrow.

I believe it's at noon Pacific tomorrow. That's what's on my calendar. It's noon Pacific tomorrow. Let me double check everybody. hold on, give me two seconds here before I sign off. That is correct. Noon, wait a minute. I'm seeing noon.

Right, it's three eastern, noon Pacific, and I'll see you then. Ask Dr. Drew is produced by Caleb Nation and Susan Pinsky. As a reminder, the discussions here are not a substitute for medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. This show is intended for educational and educational. informational purposes only. I am a licensed physician, but I am not a replacement for your personal doctor and I am not practicing medicine here. Always remember that our understanding of medicine and science is constantly evolving. Though my opinion is based on the information that is available to me today, some of the contents of this show could be outdated in the future. Be sure to check with

trusted resources in case any of the information has been updated since this was published. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, don't call me. Call 911. If you're feeling hopeless or suicidal, call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 800, 273, 8255. You can find more of my recommended organizations and helpful resources at doctordo.com slash help.