BEING HER with Margarita Nazarenko - 48: LONG DISTANCE RELATIONSHIPS & FERTILITY STRUGGLES. Don't Give Up Your Career For A Man with Erin Holland.

Episode Date: February 19, 2024

My first interview podcast is with erin holland, my best friend and a total inspiration. She discusses her fertility journey with IVF, her 9 year long distance relationship to cricketer Ben Cutting, her beauty secrets, her diet and I ask her a question I have been meaning to ask her.20 feminine energy principles:https://www.margaritanazarenko.com/20femininesalesPolarity MasterClass (20 secrets to long lasting attraction & love) :https://www.margaritanazarenko.com/polarity-masterclassAmazon book list:https://www.amazon.com/shop/margaritanazarenkoBecome Magnetic (Free Ebook):https://www.margaritanazarenko.com/Email me: [e-mail]:IQBAR: 20% off all IQBAR products. Text MARGARITA to 64000.OSEA: Get 10% off your first order sitewide with code BEINGHER at OSEAMalibu.comPlease note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.Produced by Dear Media.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Hi, friends. I'm Cameron Rogers, host of Freckled Foodie and Friends podcast, which is now on Dear Media. Are you wondering what just happened to your life after having a baby or struggling with your mental health during postpartum? That was me just a few months ago. Are you working on healing your relationship with yourself, your body, and or food? Same. We are all on a journey to self-love and acceptance, and I am right there with you. That's what Freckled Foodian friends is all about. Remind you that no matter what, you are not alone. Make sure to tune in for Season 5, launching with Dear Media on November 9th, and subscribe to listen to new episodes every Wednesday morning.

Hi, I'm happy. Please welcome Erin Holland. Society kind of hasn't evolved with how women have. The reigning Miss World Australia. Dads are all sitting up straight now. Do you know what? You are. The Queen of Many Things.

That is presenting. That is looking hot. That is being Miss World. We are working longer and having a mirror. of different careers versus what we used to. It's so tough. I mean, I actually found out I had fertility issues because of the show. So because of SAS, when I did that show, we did medical and physical and psychological

examinations. So they wanted to know, obviously, were a sound body and sound mind and able to cope with the torture. Being tear gas or thrown out of a helicopter. I find you so inspiring. Would you like to be her good one? Are you serious? Erin. Hi.

How are you? I'm good. Do you know what? You are the queen of many things that is presenting, that is looking hot, that is being miss world, but you are trying not to love. Trying not to love. The thing that people want to know about that I don't know so much about, because I close the gap as soon as that started is long-distance relationships.

You are so the pro at it that you've made it into a long-distance marriage. Yeah, nine years, baby, nine years and counting. So I get these DMs, how do you long-distance? How do you long-distance? Well, when I long distance, I was like close the gap because I'm not doing this. To be fair, other side of the world is a little bit more difficult than one and a half hours away in a plane. But how long have you been in a long distance? The entire relationship.

So we're talking from just taking over nine years. And that is to my husband, Ben. Yeah. Yeah. So he's a professional cricketer and he's away a lot. But it turns out I'm away a lot too. So equal. Why did you make the decision to not close the gap?

The decision wasn't one that was able to be made without severe, I suppose, changes on either part. So we're talking, would have to change career, would have to pick up and move everything. Like, there were big asks, particularly, you know, when you first started in a relationship, you don't know if it's going to work out. You don't know how much to invest. And for us, it was either I pick up and move my whole life on a whim, change my whole job, change my whole career trajectory for, you know, a guy I literally met him,

on Instagram. We'll get to that. Yeah, it just, it wasn't a decision that I, I felt comfortable making. It wasn't one that he could make at all, given what he did for his job. And yeah, kind of as our careers progressed, it became easier in some ways to spend time, but also completely impossible to actually make those decisions. So yeah, we kind of decided, I reckon, very early on, maybe two months in that this was something that was worth the distance apart and fighting for. But not something that I think either of us could have lived with had we kind of like, you know, thrown everything out of the, out of the pram and just went right, let's just, let's just go all in. I didn't think that was a healthy way of progressing the relationship either.

Women feel a lot of pressure to do the moving, though. 100%. And I was very staunch from the word go, I was like, I'm not moving for you. I'm not moving for anyone. I'm finally getting where I want to be with my career. Either kind of get on board with that or this is not going to work. So was that the right decision looking back? 100%.

100%. I think resentment is the biggest killer in relationships for someone like me anyway with my personality type and there's zero resentment there now. And, you know, if it's meant to be, which obviously it is for now. What's the plus side of that long distance? Plus side is you get a lot of time to focus on yourself and for me it's career because we don't have family yet. So for me, career was like the biggest thing because my career and my passion

and are kind of one and the same. And that's always really hard because I reckon there's like career, passion slash hobby and relationships. So like they're really big thing. Hi, talking about family. Welcome to the combo, Miss me. Talking about balancing family and long distance and everything.

Stop screaming. Oh, sweetheart. Yeah, so, you know, when there's three big pillars in life for me, when two of them are wrapped up in one, which is for me, my career and what my passion is, two outweighs one, which was kind of meant I've always left my relationship on the back burner because if I satisfied two massive parts of what fulfills me, I could kind of live with that the other one. And yeah, unfortunately, for Ben, that's mean that I've never thrown myself

100% wholly into the family aspect yet. But I guess that's something that will be happening in the foreseeable future. So do you feel pressure for that? 100%. I think, 100%. I think. Are you scared? Looking at me right now? I mean, it's crazy. Making it work. Yeah, making it work. People are like, how are you going to do the podcast, bring the baby with you?

I actually have someone here helping me, but the reality of kids is they don't always want that someone. You know what I mean? You could align everything, put everything in the right place, but it's not always going to be exactly what you want. So what are you going to do when it's time to have the kids? Is that a pressure? I mean, it's always a pressure. And I think, unfortunately, like society kind of hasn't evolved with how, women have. So no, biology hasn't evolved the way that women have in society. So even though

we are working longer and having a myriad of different careers versus what we used to, you know, hundreds of years ago and where therefore procreating later, therefore it's so much harder to build that family unit just biologically. And I find that the most frustrating thing in the world because if I have my way where I feel like I'm finally at my career, I want another five years before I have to start thinking about this. But the reality is, but the reality is I'm going to be 35 soon. And I already know I have fertility issues. It's like if I feel like I'm backed into a corner and I have to do it now and it's not

that I don't want to do it. And to be very clear, like I've always thought, future Aaron wants a family. It's just the idea of how you make that fit into current Aaron's situation. I've kind of supposed to stop my head in the sand and just worked my head, you know, worked myself to the bone for the last 17 years of as soon as I graduated high school to get to this point. And then he kind of like, oh, heck. Like, now I have to take a step back.

But it's finally getting so good. So frustrating. And it gets better and better. Like, this is the best my career has been. And now I'm having kids. And it's like this moment of everyone wanting you. Job. Kids want you.

Like, she's attached to me. I'm doing this. It feels great. And there's going to be this lull later where nobody wants you. I don't mean that in a harsh way, but just like, they'll be like, mom, leave me alone. I don't know why they're American, but we moved. And it's like all or nothing it feels like in the fear of being a woman.

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vegan skincare and body care from Osea. And right now we have a special day. We have a special discount just for our listeners. You get 10% off your first sitewide shop with code Being Her on O-Ca-Malaboo.com. You'll get free samples with every order and free shipping with orders over $60. Head to Osea. That's O-S-E-A-Malibu.com and use Being Her for 10% off. What has made you be able to say, do you know what? No, I'm not going to move and I'm not going to have kids yet without that fear of, like, to say it harshly, but losing him, I guess. A lot of girls, I say that because that's what I see in my DMs, you know. They have to sacrifice their careers and move.

They have resentment. They're alone. I think your instinct and your intuition is everything, right? So if you said to me very early on, either you dig your heels in and you go, no, I'm sticking in Sydney. I'm doing like that. That's all my focus is. What hurts more that or losing him?

And honestly, it was losing the career, particularly early on. And that's just true because you don't know where a relationship's going to go. And, you know, I have experienced what happens in life when relationships don't work out, whether it be with family, whether it be my own personal ones. And I'm not the whole, you know, you've got to look out for yourself and no one else because the end of the day, all you have is yourself. I don't think that's true. I think you do find people who stick with you for a lifetime rather than a season or a reason.

but I think for me that the guttural reaction was, no, this is what I want. And only now is that starting to recede a little bit. And I'm kind of going, oh, but maybe now is the time to actually take a step back from work and go down the path of family. So it's interesting how that changes. But I think intuition is everything right in relationships, whether or not we care to admit it to ourselves at the time. First listening, it's not me crying and I'm hearing it or Aaron's saying.

It's my child for some of my child. and crying. Because you've heard it all before. Yeah. You've heard my trauma before. Let's actually for the listeners, maybe it is me crying. Who knows? Because some of them are watching and some of them are listening. They're thinking Margarita's really touched by this. You're like, please don't leave Sydney. I cry.

Literally. This is shocking and appalling what you're going to do. But on the light of long distance, how do you keep it spicy? How do you keep it alive? That's the other one. How do you, how much DMing, how much messaging? What is the baseline of what you're required? And can you stop crying? It's not that serious. Communication. It's all about communication. I mean, like, it seems so basic, but it's so true. Communication is everything, and I think long distance is trust. And if you don't have trust, it's impossible.

Do you get worried he's cheating over there? Like, never. And that's the thing I have been in the past, as you well know. And I have been cheated on. And it's so funny. My husband goes away for work, and people joke at me and they're like, him I have a girlfriend over there. Every weekend he's going. And I'm like, I wish you would. Do you know what I mean? Like, take some of the pressure of me. You'd have to go out and have some fun for that to happen.

Yeah, exactly. As he gets older and being an athlete, your body doesn't kind of play ball as much as it used to. Like, the man is foam rolling for five, six hours and I just to get on the park. Like, we have no time to go out and get out. Where is he? With his phone roll out in the bar? Yeah, like literally like with what time? But that's, he's the sort of person that I don't operate under the guys that everything

is 100% forever, even though it may be in this particular moment for him, people change, people can change. But in Ben, in the version of himself that I know, it's just, it just wouldn't happen. And I know that wholeheartedly, like, he'd be more the sort of person that would come home one day and say, I just don't want to do this anymore before he would cheat. That's just the kind of person that he is. And I wholeheartedly believe that. Like, your value is a lion, you know.

He trusts him as a human being. Half the freeze over if I ever found that out. And it's been, yeah, been a nine-year-old. relationship now, which has been entirely other than COVID, and even then, like, the guy was overseas playing for months on end, that we've done long distance living in two separate cities. And there's never been a time where I've ever considered that he would do that, had any reason to believe that he would do that. There's been once or twice based on other people getting in my ear and, you know, they love that.

They love to do that. Well, people put their own trauma onto other people. And they do that with love, I think, to try and give advice or to try and understand the situation that you're in, because maybe it's not a situation that they've ever been in before. And had old Erin from previous relationships, you know, kind of gone into this the same way, like I would agree with them. But now after nine years, I can say, like, I got feeling, intuition, no reason to ever doubt him. Once or twice, I've done the very, very naughty, take a little look at Lemberb. How do you control the psycho? I was going to say that.

Because every woman's got the psycho. I mean, but that's just insecurity. I genuinely like, fuck the whole, oh, she was crazy. No, no. What were you doing to her to make her feel insecure? Nine times out of ten. And if someone did come into a relationship with crazy, it's probably because of the damage from before.

Like, I remember when I started dating Ben, I was like, FYI, I'm never moving. He's like, I love you. I'm like, yeah, cool. I don't believe you. Like, it really took me, I reckon. six months of, I want to say love bombing because it wasn't, but like he really was dropping the eye love you after three weeks of me to actually believe that he wasn't going to leave.

Do you know what I say in my podcast is like the only thing you got to have is him be sure about you? Yeah. Like everything else, I mean, is compromisable. But women trying to convince a guy who's half ass, like use your whole ass. Yeah. Stop up asking. Always using your whole ass.

Anything you take out of this. Yeah. Always use your full ass. But he was sure. And even though you. You weren't. You were like, convince me. Yeah. Nine years later, still convincing.

Marriage later, still convincing. I like it. Keep it that way. And I think it's changed as times progressed in my careers, progressed, and my financial position has progressed. But when we started, I couldn't afford to get on a plane twice a week, as in like once up, once back, to go and see him when he was there. But he couldn't afford the time because of the training, the games, all of that. So it was always equal in that it was my time.

time, but he would pay for the flights. So there was an equal exchange of, you know, money and time are both very precious things. And so it did feel equal. And I never felt like I was, you know, in debt to him because he would always pay for my flights. No, like you, although this wouldn't happen if I didn't get on a plane and come and see you. I'd say time is more precious. You can't make more. A hundred percent. A hundred percent. You contributed more. And that's kind of always been our relationship, which I kind of regret now because now I've lulled him into a sense of, well, I'm always the one, which is just women, right? We're the ones that are valuable. We make time. We do the movement. We look at our schedule of, you know, back to back Monday to Friday and somehow

find a window to, well, you procreate and me get on a plane and go and see my husband. So I've kind of trained that into it. I'm trying to like train him out of it now to be like, well, no, like I don't have time to do that now. You can come down and see me. Like people came to our wedding who'd never met him. I remember. That is wild. Wild. I watched this video of you yesterday. I googled your name on YouTube because I was like, who's interviewed her? I'm going to do it better. Can you stop crying, please? And I saw the SAS interview with you talking about how I'm vulnerable you felt when some men broke into your house. I perpetually right now cannot sleep because I imagine people breaking into my house, not from your interview, by the way, but just from becoming

a mom of a newborn and a toddler. Oh my gosh, it's very, very confronting. And I'm like, it must have made you feel so vulnerable. I was a little bit tearful watching that. That feeling of vulnerability you get as a woman is like a realization that despite you thinking, like you said, you're independent, you got this, you're like, wow. And becoming a parent has made me feel that way. I remember I was walking in some kind of mall. And, you know, the local crazy was doing his local crazy thing. And for the first time, I don't even notice that kind of stuff. But I was like, right, so I've got to grab my child. I've got to put him on my shoulder. I've got to grab the baby. I've got to somehow like the realization of your vulnerability is so

And the realization of your physical vulnerability is so confronting. Like I've always been like, I can do anything, I can survive my own, I left home at 17, I don't need anyone to do anything for me, I will figure it out. But in that moment, when there are three guys trying to break into your house when you are completely unawares, what would you do in that situation? And it was really hard because I tried to explain to my husband at the time why it affected me so much because he would say, but they didn't get in. It's like, yeah, but what if they did, Ben? Then what happens? And I'm asleep and I've got no one. And it's, there's, you know,

your mind goes to a million and one different places. And I always struggled to sleep on a massive nine hour. But after that, I didn't sleep for like three or four months, I reckon, properly at all. I know, because you'd be texting me at 2 a.m. Yes. Yeah. And you had a child. Yeah. So I was awake. So you were awake, which is great. That sense of vulnerability of your mortality as well. Like I'd never been confronted with that before and as someone who really prided themselves on being very independent. I don't need anyone. I don't need anyone around me.

I'm fine. Dog was useless. Don't even wake up. Thanks. Thanks, girlfriend. But, you know, that really kind of shook me to my core, I think. And more scarily, probably subconsciously. I didn't even deal with it consciously, probably until I did, I did SS.

A.S. And they actually sit you in there after handing your ass to you for, you know, 12 hours a day of exercise. So you're physically broken. And the inroads that you make mentally when you are so physically exhausted are, yeah, really interesting. And talking about the body and its limitations, you were honest about your IVF journey. Yeah. What made you be honest about that? I'm someone who grew up in a family that didn't talk about anything. We shelved everything, shoved it under the rug. Like, no one wanted to ever talk about anything. And so I think I've had, sometimes we turn into our parents and other times I think we have a complete adverse reaction. And my response was to have a completely adverse reaction. So,

you know, we see a lot of people superficially and what we do. There's a lot of events. There's a lot of meeting new people all the time. There's, there's also people that you see in a regular basis wherever you go. And I didn't want to rock up to work one day and someone go, how are you? And I really struggle to lie, kind of look someone in the eye and be like, yeah, I'm fine. Or if I was a little bit off that day, I appreciated maybe someone realizing that there was potentially a reason why. So for me, it was kind of, A, good for me, but also B, I thought, you know, might give me a little bit of leeway, a little bit of grace if people who do know me were like, oh, Aaron's not her normal, 100% bubbly switched on self, you know, maybe this, maybe this is why.

So it was kind of three-folders for myself. It was potentially if anyone else out there needed to hear it because I found myself always searching for content of people going through the similar thing. But in real time, there's plenty of success stories out there of the struggle post the fact, or maybe post the fact that you've decided it isn't for you, but people in real time going through it, there's a lot of people who are able to share that. And I get it, man. Like, it's, it's a lot. It's amazing what you find when you start to search, like when I went through pregnancy loss before my kids, one in four pregnancies don't work out and you're like, what?

And you never hear about it. Yeah. And they're the ones that even happen in the first place. Exactly. And how did you, the juxtaposition of always feeling like you've got to decide when to have kids, you're on contraception, you're always deciding when to have kids, you're trying to prevent, prevent, prevent, for rent, you've got a long-distance relationship, maybe not right now.

And then you find out this information. How does that work with the not even being ready at the same time? as knowing your body needs help? It's so tough. I mean, I actually found out I had fertility issues because of the show. So because of SAS. When I did that show, we did medical and physical and psychological examinations. So they wanted to know, obviously, were of sound body and sound mind and able to cope with the torture.

Being tear gas was thrown out of a helicopter. But when I was in there, everyone talks about the AMH test. Yes, it's not indicative, obviously, of quality. but it can let you know what your egg count is, which as an aging woman in her 30s plus is valuable information in my opinion. An aging woman, she said. An aging woman. Which is I hate that, but it's just, it's inevitably true, which fucking sucks, but it just is. So I did the AMH test and it actually came back at the very low end of normal,

or the high end of poor, as Ben, my clucky husband liked to shut down my throat. Yeah. So lucky. He is the coquiest. Which ended up being a very wrong reading because I was on the pill at the time it threw off my reading massively but it was enough to make me go

okay well I'm not ready now at 32 but if there is a problem and I don't have a lot of eggs maybe freezing embryos whatever it is is something that I need to consider so at the end of that year we went in to see a fertility specialist organized. What was your initial feeling

when you got that news? I was devastated and it shocked me that I was devastated so basically... So you weren't always ready for it. for it. No, no. But when we got the results that I actually had the completely opposite issue of too many eggs but terrible quality and I had a condition called PCO and a myriad of other things, that really got me. And I remember I was in quarantine in, this is COVID times, in quarantine in Abu Dhabi,

by myself in a hotel room for another five days at this point, getting this phone call the other side of the world. It was just, it was really tough. And that was my first. indication that, oh, this is a, like a trauma response to bad news, you do care about this. And I'm big on these, I'm really big on gut intuition. So however I react immediately. And in the moment, I feel like always tends to be actually where I sit on things. It's so big for women. Yeah.

Yeah. You know, the heart, the heart immediately knows how it feels. The brain tends to confuse things for me personally because I'm very indecisive because I worry about what everyone else thinks. and being a perfectionist. So gut reaction is big for me. And it was, yeah, it was really devastating. And that ended up being four rounds of IVF to create embryos to freeze the next year.

So 2022 was full of egg collections and to varying degrees of success. I remember the first time and the reason why I ended up sharing is because I went through a $20,000 IVF cycle to end up with nothing. and that really got my that broke me how to make you feel awful awful awful awful and guilty self judgment

self judgment guilty you know as someone who always struggles with not feeling enough to then be told that literally like your body is kind of broken and not able to do you know quote unquote

the one thing that women can do and it doesn't help your husband's so clucky and he and you know he's desperate to be a dad desperate to be a dad so you know there was guilt on his part but then dealing with the fact of, but I knew I wasn't ready in that moment anyway. So at this point, I knew if it was something that I wanted in that moment,

I would have obviously stopped everything and thrown everything into trying to have a kid. But even in that moment, I knew I wasn't ready yet. Isn't that interesting? So interesting. The way you have to balance that as a woman to want something so desperately, but not yet. And it's just... And I don't think you ever feel ready. Never.

I'm not ready right now. As she's literally on you. I am not ready. Help me. But, but, you know, when the decision's taken out of your hands sometimes, as in, you know, if it happens, it happens, and then it happens, you rearrange accordingly. Yeah. And for someone like me, I think it's a real travesty that that won't happen because I think

someone like me needs that, needs it to just be like, oh, whoops, well, make it work. Because I always say you'll be a brilliant, not even mum, but brilliant parent because you're responsible. Like, I know you'll be there if I need you, for example. You are not. But, yeah, someone just needs to, you know, somehow knock you out and start that I've been. process. Actually.

And because of the way that it works for me is everything has to be created. So they have to create a cycle because I don't get one with my PCO. They have to create the lining. There's progester and there's like a six-week build-up to every transfer. So now I have to find the time in the schedule six weeks where I'm in the country, which is like near damn impossible. Like I'm overseas all the time. And obviously I'm going to have to take a step back and I've got a window in mind of when

I will do that this year. And for the first time, I feel comfortable with that decision because it fit in with the big things that I wanted to still be able to do if I still want to do them. I mean, I don't know how I'll feel once. If, you know, whatever's up there willing that it actually happens. But for the first time ever, I actually feel like, oh, no, I've made peace. This is good. This feels right. It's time.

And that's, yeah, I didn't even know if I get to that, to be perfectly honest. But I think, yeah, I think the obstacles that we've had. had along the way even since that have that's happened. The way that I've responded to that, the like, you know, kind of the raw emotion, that's kind of what I base my decisions off now because I think mentally I just sort of get way too up my own head. I was not sure when I wanted to have kids and then as you know, I had the twin pregnancy that didn't work out and then the feeling of sadness from it, obviously you're going to get sad, you know, it's like a big hormonal shift as well. But I was like, for the first time, I was 29. I was like,

oh, actually, it means something to me. I want to do this. It happens so fast for you to. For me, I was like not aware of what is going on. So in a way, I think I can imagine being you and having those nights where you're just sitting there and you're thinking, how do I decide? Relax. How do I decide? We're not putting you away.

We're going to stay. How do I decide when to do this? That's almost harder, you know, than having it happen for you. Yeah. I think. And, you know, you make a decision, I think. particularly if it's a planned pregnancy. Like, okay, well, now we're going to give this a crack.

But the meticulous nature of how this has to work is even more frustrating for someone who is not sure how to make it work. And it hasn't been the sole focus. It's, I kind of, yeah, I wish the decision would be taken out of my hands. And I just go, okay, well, like we have been for the last many, many years. If it happens, it happens. And it still hasn't, which means it's going to have to be. I'm excited for you and apprehensive.

But what's the IVF process like for someone who hasn't done it yet? I have not done it, obviously, and I wonder because it looks tough, Erin. It's really tough. And what shocked me is how physically tough it was. I think I always knew it would be quite emotional, but how physically taxing it is. Obviously, I'm not a doctor. Whatever your condition is will probably change your situation with how it works. But for me, as someone who has an abundance of eggs, it means that I don't ovulate ever.

My body's in a constant state of, like, hormone override. So for me, they had to put me on the pill, take me off the pill. So you've got, you know, kind of four weeks there to bring on a bleed. And then you start the injections on the bleed. Where do you inject yourself? In your abdomen, so below your belly button, and you move the injection site all around. Scary? Not for me.

I have no issue with needles, thank God, because you'll be having hundreds of them. when you do IVF. Lots of blood tests as well, injections once or twice a day, depending on your situation for around two weeks. Lots of internal ultrasounds, delightful. Joy. And my doctor's hilarious. He's always like, so sorry about this. My, mate, we are like, it is what it is. You don't even have to ask anymore. We're like wild. You know, the amount I've been poked and prodded, but, you know, and then you'll go in and have a collection. I always opt to have mine under general. I couldn't imagine doing it under local in a chair, but some people do. Yep. They drain your follicles and hopefully find little eggies. And then they, if you choose to go down making embryos, which is what we did,

freezing an embryo is a lot stronger than freezing an egg. Then they'll whip them together in a lab. And hopefully you get a miss V in about five or six days. You get a little, a little blastocystice that they can either freeze or do a fresh transfer. Yeah, you were a blastocystice once day, my girl. She knows all these things. Once upon a time. Once upon a time. Okay, gorgeous. This episode is brought to you by IQ Bar. And I want you to know one thing right now on my healing journey, on my self-bettering journey,

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See terms for details. You are stunning. For everyone who's not watching, you are like elite stunning woman. Stop it. But I talk often about the fact that beauty is not always just like born beautiful and you are beautiful. You've not always felt beautiful, have you? God, no, no.

Yeah, I grew up as a massive tomboy. I was really tall. I've been this height since I was like 12 years old. So then there was, yeah, like 5 foot 10 when I was 12. And then I stopped. And everyone got tall, I think God. I was a band geek. I played a lot of music.

I was, I matured very early as well. So I've kind of, I always felt very big in, gangly and just, I don't know, not disproportionate, not very feminine as well, which is something that I do enjoy feeling. I always felt very out of place, but I did feel like I found my community when I was in school because I was in, I was a muso. I didn't care that that wasn't the coolest thing to be growing up in far north Queensland. And for those who aren't from Australia, we're talking like very regional, very remote, you know, two hours on a plane away from a major city. Great place to grow up.

Think like Great Barrier Reef and sun and palm trees and stuff, but very remote. Crocodiles? Oh, yeah, in the backyard. I made kangaroos, jellyfish, fighters, snakes, plenty of snakes. Snakes in the backyard. No, I really didn't. And I still don't. I think I've learned how to dress up for work.

Do you think it can be cultivated? beauty for most people? I think the conventional version of beauty can be. I think true beauty is just literally a person and within. And we have all known someone who might be aesthetically very pleasing on the eye, but they're not a very nice person. And so you just cannot see the aesthetic beauty once you really know a person. But I think with social media now and TikTok and an incredible array of products on the market, you can present in a way that you. might feel looks better than how you wake up in the morning. But for me, it's kind of a, we're both performers, right?

So we've grown up on stage our entire life. I feel like I'm playing a character when I go to an event. Exactly what I say in my book. I can do my hair. I can put my lipstick on. I can play the part of whatever it is I need to do if it's a red carpet or whatever it is. But yeah, I think I'm still figuring out what beauty actually is to me.

I say that in my book in a chapter. Wow, did I just announce my book this first time I ever talked about it. There you go. Exclusis. exclusive, but you know, I've known about it for ages, but I'm going to pretend to be surprised. Exactly. Well, hey, I just grew up being like this average, you know, not even chubby, but just like disproportionate teenager. And when I did Miss Universe and you are Miss World. A long time ago. It doesn't matter. It's still factual and actual. I never thought, oh my God,

I am gorgeous. Look at me. I still feel like I'm playing a role. You could equally present as quiet, homeless and, you know, as people say, the homeless look, you know, the bun on your head and everything, and you can equally be gorgeous. And I think every woman can be with a mount, with, you know, if you put in effort. Yeah. And I think it just depends on what, you know, in what version we're talking about beauty, I suppose. Like, yeah, there's the, the ideal of how you present physically. But I think, thank God, we're really coming back to the internal, like, because that's far outweighs whatever's going on. on the outside. I saw a TikTok of a girl doing her makeup and she had, by her own profession,

a big nose, like smaller eyes, small lips, no injections that are down. I thought, oh my God, these comments are going to be, you know, she looked like a Renaissance woman. Honestly, to me, she looked like a Greek goddess. She was actually, I watched it for so long because I was like, I've not seen a face like this for a long time. Everyone looked at the same. And then I looked at the comments and to my surprise and relief, people were like, wow, this face is so interesting. I'm not seen this for a long time. I'm like, is it over? Is the era over? I pray to God.

Are we making saggy, like, stuff fashionable as well? Are we making progress? Are we, like, making big bellies like a thing? No, I don't think that's ever going to happen, is it? It's big bums, but not big bellies, hey? Pregnant bellies. We're getting them out now. Big fan of that.

What are your products that you go back to? Three products. Ooh. I know the girlies want to know. Okay. Vitamin A with skincare is revolutionary. I use a gorgeous Aussie brand. called MX skincare, but vitamin A is like retinol can be really harsh, but for the desired effect

of resurfacing, particularly if you get a little bit older, this is probably for girls in there, you know, I reckon 30s onwards. I'm not suggesting anyone goes and does anything younger. You don't need to. Your skin is amazing. Just stay out of the sun. Vitamin A is great. I find that's really good for my skin. Really sort of treats resurfaces, good for fine lines and all those wonderful things which when you spend your life on camera you do sort of are privy to. So a big fan of vitamin A's product wise. We're talking about makeup or? Just any products, three products that you just like, if I had to, you know, take them away, you would feel some type of way. Oh, okay, okay, okay. Yep, I'm a big hair person. I feel like if my hair's good, I've got my shriads together.

So anything in DHD, really, whether it's my hair dryer, my travel hair dryer particularly, I take them with me all over the world now because, yeah, I think hair is such a big thing. You know, here I am with my hair extensions and all these sorts of things. I do feel more put together when the hair is sorted. These are great lengths. Little. I'm going to show them. For those playing a while at home.

Oh, oh, there they are. I'm actually a natural blonde. She is so blonde. I'm so blonde. This is all fake. Oh, my gosh. As I talk about playing a character. Yeah.

I work in Asia a lot now and I dyed my hair dark for a job. More relatable. I guess so. Yeah, that's sort of been the feedback. When I was really blonde, it was cool, but this is, yeah. Like when you're like DeNaris, it's nice, but, you know, I was that blonde. Yeah, it's stark and it's like not achievable for a lot of people. So, GHD, vitamin A from MX.

Yeah, it's amazing. It's really, really good. And as I get a little bit older and with how my skin's reacted with a lot of the IVF hormones and hopefully, that's my. me knocking on wood, pregnancy hormones and things in the future. Something natural that doesn't have the parabens, or the SLS, the palm oils, nothing nasty is really important because my skin's getting more sensitive as I get older, which is crazy. But no vitamin A when you're pregnant. No, which is very sad. Could be a disaster. But you can use the other ones in the range,

which is good. I highly recommend. There's a beautiful facial oil as well, which is really good when you travel all the time. Yeah. And hydrolyte, because I'm... Because I live on a plane. That's true. I had 133 flights last year and I feel like a prune. You are up. 133. I counted them.

133. I've had 17 this year already and this is like the 3rd of February or something like that. So I feel like my insides are a bit cooked at the moment. So I take you a little hydrolyte. I just get the little tubes and find one in a water bottle and just sort of try. No. But you love sugar, don't you? I do love sugar.

They taste sugary. Oh my gosh. She loves sugar. She loves red frogs. Are we allowed to say that? Or are you supposed to be a health queen? No, God, no. That's just reality.

I think I have some in my handbag at the moment. Yeah. So rituals. What's your rituals to maintain your body? Because I cannot even. She's sitting down, but the body is bodying. Go on her Instagram, Erin Holland. Stop it.

The one thing that I've had to let go of when you have such a hectic job with travel is you actually don't have any routine. And you just have to be okay with that. So one thing for me is, whilst I don't have any regularity to my life in terms of routine, where I live, where I sleep at night, what I'm eating, it's very hard to stay on top of. It's just a mantra of just trying to make good decisions as often as I can. And I trained before I came here because I could today. I trained yesterday.

I'll train every day I can this week. There'll be weeks where I can't train it all, maybe once or twice. There'll be weeks that I do every single day, like this week's looking like I'll be able to do that. It's all scheduled dependent, but not to beat myself up about the fact that, you know, life just doesn't allow for it in this particular day. And there used to be a version of myself, which would go, right, well, I'll get up at 4 a.m. To get it done. It's like, no, actually, sleep is important.

And sleep. My who thinks so. Oh, well, you're welcome for getting on the boot bandwagon, which is so confronting when you wake up and you think that you've had eight hours sleep because you went to bed with eight hours until you had to get up. And I never have a lot of sleep you've had because my week's on. You can see. And it's actually like, you slept for six hours.

I'm like, what did I do for the other two? Do you know what the downfall of this group is? My husband wears one, gets in bed for like 10 hours because, you know, he's not looking after the baby. Must be nice. And it says, slept for four hours. He's like, see, this is why I'm tired. Meanwhile, me over here, I get in the bed for five hours.

It's like five hours sleep. Because you died. You literally just. And it's like, you've had more sleep than me. I'm like, listen. Listen. Listen. Do you want to die?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh my God. We need to get him just a day in the life, I think, just to really appreciate everything that you do. But yeah, I think rituals-wise, it's, it's, I move my body every day, whether it's even just a walk if I can't get to the gym. I found that's been so important for my mental health

and for everything when you're, I think when you're moving around, you feel like endorphins, getting outside the elements. Spending time outdoors, as the we've always asks. You know, and with food, it's making the good decisions whenever you can, but I'm not going to deprive myself just because the only thing available in the morning is

a muffin rather than, you know, a nice, sit down, healthy-ish breakfast. It's just trying to be more kind to myself as I get older. What's your eat in a day? People love an eat in a day. Oh, it's, I couldn't even tell you because it's just so varied depending on. Try, Aaron. Well, last week I had six flights. I was in five cities. Let's be real.

Five different cities and I had six flights. So you don't get any sort of normality except knowing what the lounge has to offer for breakfast that morning. So it's, you know, I'm not a breakfast eater. I never have been. I've always done it. You love an oatmeal cookie. I know that. Like an oatmeal kind of situation.

Yeah. Or I've got muslin bars and protein bars. That's the one. Yeah. Try and keep snacks on me at all times. I spend a lot of time in the car when I am in Sydney as well because I've got a million-to-one appointments or things on. It's, yeah, it's trying to make good decisions whenever I can, but not beating myself up when it doesn't kind of work out the way I wanted it to that week because it's,

health is holistic, right? And it's not just what you did that day. It's what you did that month. It's what you did that week. And so I think that's taking a lot of pressure off. They say the body you have now is the habits you had a month ago. Yeah, 100%. You know, that's a reframe. It's not like I ate well today. What is happening tomorrow? And I'm sorry, this is the result of what you did before. So if you were talking to girls, what would you say? How do you reframe your mind from, say the girl we're talking to is not in her best shape. She's not where she wants to be. Don't worry, Valentina, fine.

What would you say? I think it's easy to get overwhelmed and feel like something's too far gone. Like, oh, I didn't train it all this week. It's Friday. So I'll just start next week. Well, if you want to and you have the time, get up and go on Saturday and Sunday. And everything you do differently has a reaction right. We know that the more you move your body, the better it is for your fitness,

the more you nourish your body with good foods, the better you'll feel. And just because you know, how to blow out that week, it doesn't mean that you can't just get up tomorrow and make a difference. You don't have to write off the rest of the week. I think it's just, you know, we're all human. We all make decisions in the moment. And, you know, even if you had a quote unquote, I don't like using this terminology, but, you know, a bad week is in like I really didn't go to the gym.

Yeah, I didn't go to the gym. I ate really badly or whatever it is. tomorrow's a new day. You don't have to wait for a new year for a new resolution or a new month or whatever. Like, just no time like the present. So I think, yeah, I think that's been how I've sort of, I've dealt with it. I find you very inspiring with that. And just for my own personal self, I'm really excited to what you do, the postpartum experience. Because suddenly you wake up from having your normal body, suddenly you gain a lot of weight that no one talks about because, you know, you're supposed to be like, I'm a pregnant goddess. Which I know that I will struggle with.

Because I've been so conscious and regulated in living in an image-based industry for 17 years. It will be a struggle to reframe my mind. Maybe I'll love it. Maybe I will like, boom, baby. You will love the pregnancy experience because you are kind of round and taught and everyone thinks you're adorable. And then the baby comes out and then you just left a bit wobbly and fat, which is fine to be wobbly and fat. Yes, celebrate. The body did that, da-da-da.

But at the same time, it's a confrontation because it all happens in nine months. It's not like you gradually got older and fatter, like as life went on and, you know, that's just what happens as we age. It's like very fast and suddenly nothing fits. So I'm excited to see you go through that. I'm not because I hate you because I want to see you turn it around because of you are you are. The expectation on women is just so ridiculous. I mean, like I look at you and our other friends who, yeah, you, you who have procreated several times now, some of you. You've literally created human life.

There is a heart, lungs, a spine, a little brain, little ears, like sitting in your arms. It's just incredible. And the fact that that's even a thought post doing all of that, oh, I need to bounce back. Like, look that. I just, it blows my mind. And I think on the internet you'll find equal parts still that aspirational. Oh, but look at what I did. Like there's some chick that did a pageant 17 days after giving birth.

That one that trans-bubter. The farm chick, what's her name? Oh my gosh. You know the one that I mean? Yes. You know, and I just look at that and go, oh my God, imagine if I was just struggling to get out of bed, which if you had a C-section, you literally would be 17 days. And I don't know, is that inspirational or is that hurting me?

Probably knowing myself, it would hurt me to see that and not be at that position. How about this heartbreaking TikTok before body really fit, like nice looking girl? And then afterwards, saggy belly, you know, everything, you know, stretch marks. And she goes, I don't mind. I've made human life. She's happy. She's dancing. Same bikini. Cool. Comments. If I was you, I wish I'd never had children. Not worth it. And I'm like, contrary to like the nose and face thing, body, we're still not progressing on.

Yeah. You're all right. Calm down. Sounds like a grumpy old man. Whereas, you know, what she's, the message that she's posting and what she's saying is so fucking awesome and important. I think it gets you down sometimes. We can live in our own little corner of the internet too, where there are like-minded people who share like-minded values and you feel really supported.

And then you just realize that there's a whole other portion of the internet that still living in the Stone Ages, who haven't sort of broken out of that yet. And it's a bit depressing, isn't it, sometimes when you see that? And I just think, like, I hope it doesn't stop her putting more of that out there into the universe. So that's all I hope is that people can silence that sort of negative feedback and and find a way to keep doing that because I know that's what I'd want to see if I was in that position.

I think I'm excited to see you do it. I'm excited to see you live life. I know that sounds really strange because you're my friend, but also I find you really inspiring. I think the way you balance being a woman and the way you're so strong in your career and your marriage and I want to see you do children just for my own like viewing pleasure. I want to see it like a movie. It's really, really exciting for me. So it's really cool.

But I did want to ask you one last question. I read online that you're not supposed to ask this question in front of other people. So if... So obviously you're going to ask. Yeah, so I'm obviously going to ask. And I will cut it if you don't want to answer it. Yeah. So I'm supposed to ask you by ourselves in like some cave.

I don't know. Or I'm supposed to gift you something or like I'm supposed to give you a card while I'm asking. But I find you so inspiring. Would you like to be her good one? Are you serious? You know, it would. Hi, darling. Cuddle.

Give me, baby. Are you serious? Oh, oh. Hi, baby. Make me cry. Oh, stop. I know my friends was unscathed. So, um, don't answer now.

I don't cry. I'm really tough. I'm just hormonal. Thank you. I would love that. Would you really? You're stuck with me for ever. Yeah.

She's really happy about it. She's not that. I love you so much or give you back to your mom so you don't cry. Are you sure? Yeah. I ordered you. She loves me so much. She loves you.

Don't worry. Easy. She's really happy about it. Look at the joy. I'm only crying because I'm a hormonal. Don't worry. I don't care. I don't care.

I don't like care. I'm joking. No, but you are so inspiring. So I think you're the perfect Godman for a girl. So don't answer yet. Answer me later. Yes. On the record.

Yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes. Oh. Thanks. That's all. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.