Bite Back with Abbey Sharp - Why Your ADHD is Making “Healthy Eating” So Hard - The Truth About Cravings, Fixations, Overeating, and Food Dyes with Rebecca King, RD

Starting point is 00:00:00 It's the impulsivity piece. It's the executive function piece too. Being able to connect not just with hunger, but also with fullness. It's like all the factors of ADHD just kind of create almost like the perfect storm or disordered eating behaviors. Welcome to another episode of Bite Back with Abbey Sharp, where I dismantle die culture rules, call it the charlatans spinning the pseudoscience, and help you achieve food freedom for good. Today's episode is for my friends and family with

Starting point is 00:00:40 ADHD or the family of neurodivergent folks who want to support us because we are going to be talking all about nutrition for ADHD. If you've been a long time Abbey's Kitchen subbie, you may have heard me talk about my own experience getting diagnosed with ADHD in adulthood. In fact, it's only been like 18 months since I got my diagnosis and it's only been like 18 months since I got my diagnosis, and it's probably been one of the most relieving and validating experiences of my life.

Starting point is 00:01:11 I have spent so many of my years feeling embarrassed or ashamed by all of my little daily struggles and quirks. The impulsivity, the inflexibility, the extreme sensitivity, the overreaction, and the tunnel vision have all brought me so much shame and anxiety because I had no explanation for them other than that I was wrong or bad. But getting a diagnosis has alleviated so much self judgment and has truly boosted my self-compassion and confidence in myself. Not to mention, it's allowed me to reframe my struggles as superpowers,

Starting point is 00:01:50 knowing how hard I've worked to get where I am today. And most importantly, it's allowed me to get the help that I need via therapy and medication to truly thrive. It's been undeniably one of the best things to ever happen to me. But since joining the neurodivergent community, I've been privy to a lot of myths and misinformation about diet and ADHD that can further complicate ADHDers' relationship with food and perpetuate stigma.

Starting point is 00:02:22 So today, I've got my fellow neurodivergent RD on the line, Becca King, to help us demystify eating with ADHD. Becca, AKA ADHD Nutritionist, as she's known by online, specializes in an anti-diet culture approach to ADHD management, helping ADHDers stop binge eating, learn meal planning skills, identify food triggers, and

Starting point is 00:02:46 improve their relationship with food. Even if you or your kiddos don't have an ADHD diagnosis but you're struggling with forgetting to eat and then bingeing, you will likely find a ton of helpful tips in this episode. Quick disclaimer here, this content is never a replacement for personalized healthcare advice, and we will also be talking about eating disorders, so feel free to skip this if it's not supportive to your journey. Also, of course, on a brighter note, I would love if you would please please leave bite back and review for this episode and the podcast at large, and also if you could subscribe

Starting point is 00:03:22 or follow wherever you get your podcast, because it really really does help me out as a new podcast. Becca I am so excited to chat today. Yes me too Abby. Okay so this is totally top of mind for me right now because I feel like I'm trying to catch up on learning everything there is to know about ADHD as a new diagnosing. So I'm just like balls deep on the neurodivergent literature on the regular. When were you diagnosed? I was diagnosed at 19 years old.

Starting point is 00:04:00 So like going into my kind of like beginning of my sophomore year of college was when I got diagnosed. Yeah, obviously for all of its challenges. I truly believe that, you know, a lot of our ADHD traits can also be superpowers in a lot of way when, you know, harness with intent. So just as a quick little neurodivergent affirmation, what is your favorite part of having ADHD? Oh, I think I have two, honestly. My ability to problem solve and see things in a way that maybe other people don't see them. And then being able to hyper focus.

Starting point is 00:04:34 And I love being able to just get in the zone. And I love, especially with research and nutrition and things, getting in a rabbit hole and just going is just so enjoyable to me. I know I love it too. I love the hyper focusing. For me, I feel like I'm a really empathetic person and you know, to my demise, sometimes I feel like I'm a very good friend and people feel very comfortable talking to me because I'm kind of so open in that way. But yeah, there are so many wonderful things

Starting point is 00:05:10 about having an ADHD mind. Now, obviously, as two dieticians with ADHD, we also do know that ADHD can make kind of quote unquote, healthy eating difficult in a lot of ways for a lot of people. So I really want to go through some of these kind of unique challenges that we have and also just talk about some solutions that you have because you're an expert in this.

Starting point is 00:05:32 So I want to first talk about forgetfulness because it's obviously super common for folks with ADHD to kind of get distracted or like you said hyper focused on a project and we're in the zone and we're in the rabbit hole and we just kind of don't feel that those hunger cues until we are so ravenous that we binge or overeat. Can you describe that typical pattern that you often see? Yeah. So one of the bigger patterns I see is I call it kind of like the ADHD binge restrict cycle where you might like eat, you might have breakfast,

Starting point is 00:06:05 maybe, or eat something in the morning. And then, you're kind of usually really busy for a lot of my clients, they're super busy, going through their day, and they just forget to eat. It's just not on their radar because they have so many other things in their brain that feel more important and like tasks, I need to get these things done because we're usually you know I'm behind on all these things and you'd be doing these things I need to be busy and eating just doesn't feel like a priority and so usually it's like I'm not eating or I'm waiting until you know I'm I hit like a wall and I'm ravenous and then it's like what's the quickest fastest thing I can eat and usually those aren't always the things that make us feel our best or

Starting point is 00:06:40 maybe the things we wouldn't have chosen if we weren't super, super hungry. And so that can obviously set up some kind of, you know, very inconsistent eating patterns. So it's kind of like all or nothing. A lot of times it's like I'm eating nothing and then I'm eating everything. I call it the hunger monster that comes out. Oh, yeah. We all feel that sometimes. And obviously, you know, that hunger monster also comes into play for those of us, you know, taking stimulant medications in the morning, which can, you know, lower our appetite. So we don't eat as much in the day. And then we like rebound and overeat at night when our appetite does come back. Yeah. Do you have your clients engage in like mechanical feeding? And maybe you

Starting point is 00:07:22 can just kind of like explain what that might look like. Yeah, so I caught it's kind of like I think of it in like intuitive eating kind of like that practical hunger piece of like eating when you might not be hungry, but logically, you know, you need to eat because I've heard people you know, like if I just ate intuitively, I wouldn't eat all day and then I would binge at night and I'm like, well, logically, I know, you know, that doesn't feel good. Exactly.

Starting point is 00:07:43 So yeah, we might want to make lunch or we might have to explore alternative eating patterns so that it might not look like the oh, I eat three meals and a mid morning snack and a mid afternoon snack and maybe an evening snack. It might look different. Like I have some clients who eat a larger breakfast and dinner and we kind of have like little almost like mini meals or snacks throughout the day. So that way they can still eat, but it doesn't feel like this big task. Because sometimes when you look down when you're medicated, and like you're have like a big like a regular sized

Starting point is 00:08:13 meal, it just looks like way too much food in your brain is like, Nope, you gross, I'm not eating, finding some alternatives. I mean, alternative like foods or safe foods, even like foods, you know, hey, 99% of the time, I can tolerate this or a good percent of the time, I know I can tolerate this and eat this on my meds. Like I have certain foods I keep on hand and prioritize always having some of them in my house. So that way, if I'm not hungry, but I'm like, you know, it's time to eat. Like if you need to eat something, I can get that down and that and then like,

Starting point is 00:08:43 oh, I actually noticed I feel a little bit better afterwards. Imagine that. And so even I'm not hungry, like physically hungry, sometimes I can tell that I need to eat. So yeah, I think it's really important because you know, we're talking about intuitive eating, people automatically think it's just the, you know, eat when you're hungry, stop when you're full diet. And again, for folks with ADHD, who also often struggle with introspective skills, that feels like, okay, I can't do that. Like that feels like an impossible task. Because again, if we were to just rely on our hunger cues, and we aren't hungry in the morning, because of our stimulant,

Starting point is 00:09:19 and we are hyper focused, and all these things are kind of acting against us, then we're not going to get the fuel that our body needs that we know helps us actually, you know, perform our best throughout the day. Especially if we are kind of struggling with a lot of the kind of ADHD symptoms, whether it's forgetfulness or, you know, difficulties with, you know, being able to sit down and pay attention, things like that. Even decision-making, like being able to sit down and pay attention, things like that. Even decision making, like being able to make choices and be harder, like so many things. So many things are harder when you aren't, your body is not fueled when you don't, your brain doesn't have adequate energy.

Starting point is 00:09:57 So I think it is kind of combining that, you know, the interceptive skills, but of course, your own, the data that you have collected over the days and the months and the years on what actually makes your body feel good and what actually body and that piece is so important. So I know, like, for me, one of like the little things that I always do, when I, you know, to make sure that I'm getting that the fuel I need, even if I'm not kind of in that like hunger zone is habit pairing.

Starting point is 00:10:30 So like, I know like, you know, I pair, like, I'm never gonna forget to take my, to drink my coffee because that is like such a habit, I never ever, ever going to forget that. So I know like, while I'm making that coffee, I'm gonna make myself my bowl of my breakfast. Like so it's just creating those little habits, the things that you know you're going to do in your day with preparing a meal, with preparing a snack and just getting it ready.

Starting point is 00:10:55 Yeah, I do that with my dog. I'm like when I take my dog out in the afternoon, I come back in and I make lunch. Yep. And because I know I have to take her out. And so it just makes the transition like that transition from work. It gives me a little buffer, take her outside, we walk, come back in, and then I make lunch and it just makes life easier that way. Exactly. I think that's a great tip. And this also plays into some of our challenges with, you know,

Starting point is 00:11:21 executive dysfunction. So neurotypical folks might not ever have to really think about this, but there are a lot of steps involved in just making a sandwich from recognizing hunger to getting yourself into the kitchen to identifying the kind of sandwich you're going to make, getting all the ingredients together, et cetera. And all the healthy eating tipless would be like, meal prep, meal prep, meal prep. Meal prep does not work for a lot of us. Like I don't want to eat leftovers for five days. So like, what's our alternative? And I just want to say like when I was in my internship to be a dietitian, I had so much shame because I was like, I'm going to be a dietitian and I don't know how know how I can't get myself to meal

Starting point is 00:12:05 prep, you know, what's wrong with me? And like, and I was like, wait, but I'm still feeding myself. Yeah, there is alternatives. That's when I finally I was like, I don't really have to do that just because other people do it. Like, and if it works for you, amazing, like exactly. But I find some things that help like batch cooking. So maybe like batching like cooking ingredients versus or parts of your meal versus like actually compiling the meal together. So

Starting point is 00:12:30 maybe you cook up some chicken, maybe you, you know, roast some potatoes, or maybe you chop up veggies so that they're prepped and ready and you can throw them into whatever you're cooking. So that way, it you don't have to eat the same exact thing every day. And you can, you don't have to eat the same exact thing every day and you can you know have parts of the process or some of those steps taken out of the process for me I try to if I batch cook things it's the parts of cooking that I don't that feel like they take up too much time or energy while I'm making it so it's like protein for me is a big one like it I will air fry

Starting point is 00:13:00 up some chicken tenderloin things so I have them and I can put them in pasta or I can put them on a salad or in a wrap or whatever and they're ready to go and I don't have to think. Yeah, I do the exact same thing. Any other great ones? Another one, I find this works great for people who, if you make a dinner and if you go to work the next day kind of thing, making dinner and just having that as lunch the next day, if you're okay with kind of repeating a meal but you don't want to repeat it every single day of the week, that's a good way to like kind of make it easier on yourself. That's what I did a lot when I was in my internship

Starting point is 00:13:32 was like, I'll make dinner and make an extra portion, pack it up and bring it, you know, bring it to the hospital with me for lunch the next day. Yeah, I know for myself as a mom, I feel like just the idea of even meal planning can be very overwhelming. And so like having theme nights has been so helpful for me because I just know, like, you know, just one less decision. Like rather than I have to like think about the world of recipes, the world of recipes that I could possibly make on a Tuesday night, I just have to think, okay, it's pizza night. What are we putting on our pizza? Or like stir fry night, like what protein am I using for the stir fry? Am I doing noodles? Am I doing rice?

Starting point is 00:14:14 There are fewer decisions that I have to make, which is so key when I'm already kind of run down at the end of the day. So I feel like that's really helpful too. I find theme nights were great for families. The other thing I'd say is like automating some of your meals, which like to me, I call automating is like there's certain meals or like a couple meals that I will rotate through, especially for like breakfast and lunch. So again, fewer decisions, like there's like two or three breakfasts and like different versions of those like oatmeal or like some version of toast and eggs. And I kind of have either or those because I don't like I've made those things so many times I don't have to think about it. So it just takes out and if I really want something else, I'll go get it.

Starting point is 00:14:53 Like if I want to bagel in the morning, I'll get bagel still. But it just makes it a little bit easier. Yeah, I think this is a really important point, you know, coming from two dieticians here, when we have become used to seeing all of these influencer what I eat in a day is where they are preparing these, you know, very elaborate, beautifully presented, beautifully styled meals, they're cooking from scratch three meals a day, plus making desserts plus making snacks. And it's like, you don't have to do that in order to eat a healthy, balanced diet. And you can keep- That's their full-time job.

Starting point is 00:15:29 That's their full-time job. And who knows if they're only doing that one day that they filmed. Most probably. You know? I don't have the bandwidth to be in the kitchen 24-7 making my kids cereal from scratch. So it is okay. Don't, absolutely do not feel guilty about taking shortcuts about using the bag and using the rotisserie chicken and using the you know, the the microwave rice and things like that. Like,

Starting point is 00:15:57 those are all great tools in the toolbox to get a healthy meal on the table. And we should not be feeling guilty or ashamed of those things. Because I live for that. I know. So I know. I'm like, so many dieticians do it. And we're like, it's okay. They're like, what? And so like, what? And then they do it. And they're like, oh, my gosh, I love, like, I'm actually making food at home now. Like, I'm, you know, not relying on my I'm not ordering door dash every night, or, you know, having to go out to eat, which

Starting point is 00:16:27 adds up, it's expensive. So it's like, cool, I can do these things and I don't have to spend hours in the kitchen preparing something that's still going to be nutrient dense and tasty and delicious. Absolutely. So this kind of brings me to like food hyper fixations because, you know, a lot of us, we get hung up on this like specific or snack, and we eat it every single day until we get the ick, right? Yes. It's such a cycle of us going through this.

Starting point is 00:17:12 It's such an ADHD running joke that, oh, this is my food hypersensitization. I'm going to eat this for six months and then never eat it again. So do you have any tips for us folks who have a really hard time like deviating from like a very, very specific snack or handful of food? Yeah, one thing I find helpful if it works for you, like great. It's just kind of knowing like, at some point that snack or meal is you are probably going to get the ick from it. So like being prepared for when that comes because you're gonna still have to eat when you get the ick. So one thing I find helpful with my clients is like making a sensory profile of kind of like what are the tastes and the textures

Starting point is 00:17:58 and the aromas that I like or is there any like styles of cuisine or ways that I like to eat foods like do I prefer to eat things you know like I really like eating of cuisine or ways that I like to eat foods? Like, do I prefer to eat things, you know, like I really like eating out of like dishes that I can eat out of a bowl, things like that. So kind of brainstorming some of those things. And for my clients having that like a little visual of that is helpful that they can refer back to of like, you know, I'm over this, whatever it is, you know, I'm I can't think about that food. But let me look and see if there's

Starting point is 00:18:25 anything else that maybe, hey, like for me, sometimes I go on kicks with like buffalo sauce, or I want buffalo sauce on every single thing that I eat. Um, and that started from like a buffalo chicken salad. And then I was like, I'm going to get sick of this salad. So I was like, okay, I'm going to put it in a wrap. And then I started doing like loaded baked potatoes that were like Buffalo style and then like chicken wings, things like that. So that way it was like, I still got to have the thing I really wanted, which was the buffalo sauce. But I got to, I kind of incorporated it into different things so that I wouldn't get bored. I love that. You know, full, this real talk, this like literally just happened to me. I'm

Starting point is 00:19:02 pretty good at like switching up my like daytime meals, but I find at the end of the day, my bedtime snack, it's like I have no executive functioning skills at that point, my byvance is not byvancing. And I can't think of like, I just can't think I can't bring myself to like, think of anything new. And I got I got sick from my my my go to bedtime snack and I was like, I don't know how to feel myself. I found that, you know, thinking about it earlier on in the day when I did have, you know, those skills, and like planning being like, okay, I know I'm not gonna want this snack anymore. I know I'm not

Starting point is 00:19:41 gonna want my like, you know, my my Greek yogurt parfait. So what can we plan right now when I've got the skills, when I've got the time, when I've got the energy that I know is gonna also hit the spot, that it's also gonna be satiating, that's gonna also make me feel good and get me through the night without getting hungry early, waking up early hungry. And I think it's just like,

Starting point is 00:20:03 I found that if I plan it earlier on the day, I just, it's ready for me. Yeah, it's just kind of like thinking about your future self, right? Like what would future me be happy with? Which also helps if you're not motivated to do something. If it's like, I don't want to do this, like, well, would future me be glad

Starting point is 00:20:24 I put some of those dishes in the dishwasher. So tomorrow, there's no dishes in the sink kind of thing. A lot. Yeah. So obviously, you know, general dopamine seeking and stimming also very common traits for us ADHDers who we basically have like dopamine dysregulation going on. So I'm curious, you know, how does that typically play out for a lot of us

Starting point is 00:20:49 when it comes to eating and nutrition? Yeah, so this is kind of the other, another eating pattern I see a lot, especially for folks diagnosed later in life, or if they're not medicated, where they're kind of like always eating almost, or that's what they feel like. They're like, I'm grazing all the time. I'm not hungry, but I feel like I need to eat. Like I need

Starting point is 00:21:10 to do something with my hands or my mouth. Or there's this very specific taste or tech, like I just want to crunch on something, or like the fizziness of soda or carbonated water or chew gum. Totally. Like sweets in particular, carbs are a really quick, easy source of dopamine. So a lot of it's why ADHDers like sugar. It makes perfect sense because it is a way that we're kind of self-medicating.

Starting point is 00:21:37 So I think that I try to not demonize it because I don't think it's helpful to be like, never eat for stimulation because that's just completely unrealistic. But kind of finding some ways to like, try to be a little bit more connected to like the sensory experience of eating, because that helps us get stimulation.

Starting point is 00:21:57 As well as like, yeah, and that also connecting to that, I find like you get a little bit more satisfaction and it's a little bit easier to like stop eating versus like, oh, I'm completely disconnected from this food and I'm just typing and eating and not really getting to actually enjoy some of it. Right. Yeah. Now, I think also finding some other dopamine booster is so important. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:22:22 There is this, it's called a dopam menu. So it's kind of like a visual for all the things you can do for stimulation. I'm sure if you Google it, you can find a bunch of examples, but it's kind of like, yeah, visual. So that way you don't have to think of in the moment, I'm bored. So I'm just going to go get something to eat. It's like, okay, no, I'm bored. I'm under stimulated is what that probably means. So like, let me what else can I do that might be more fulfilling and get my brain that dopamine. And if nothing else sounds good, like, obviously, go give yourself

Starting point is 00:22:52 permission to have have something to eat. But like finding some other things like I keep I don't have in my hands right now. But I have like little magnets that I fidget with called stim mags. Those are great. So like when I'm on work calls having like fidget with me or when I'mget with, called Stimmax. Those are great. So like when I'm on work calls, having like fidget with me or when I'm watching TV, having something in my hands is super helpful because TV is usually not stimulating enough for ADHD brain. So we need to do something else. So it's like why a lot of us- All the things.

Starting point is 00:23:17 Yeah. We're like usually like eating and on our phone and watching TV. And if someone's with you that doesn't have ADHD, they're like, can you please pay attention to the show? You're not even watching it. And you're like, I actually am. I'm watching it. But I have to also do all these other things. Otherwise, I just will want to die. Like, it feels like I'm like crawling out of my skin if I just watch TV. So having other things or like movements are really good source of stimulation too. So like going

Starting point is 00:23:44 and going out being outside so I walk my dog a lot and listen to music and that kind of stuff and it just I think making or trying to be intentional about making time in your day for things that are stimulating activities and things that bring you joy to really helps activities and things that bring you joy too really helps for myself. And a lot of my clients are like, oh, this is like actually making time for this means that I'm not going for that quick, easy, you know, whether it's like snacks or food or, you know, your phone, whatever it is, it's like, oh, I don't need that as much.

Starting point is 00:24:20 So, so great. So because yeah, doom scrolling, online shopping, all those things that are like, they're, they're not the most fulfilling sources of dopamine. Like on your Dopa menu, they'd be a dessert. They'd be like, they're easy to overdo, but they don't leave you like, oh yeah, I just like, you know, when I finished going for a walk or run, like I'm, I can go do things and it's a lot easier. But if I doom scroll for, you know, an hour, I'm not like, oh, I'm so motivated to go do something. So on their Dopa menu, you have the little starter section is quick little ways you can get stimulation. So I think of it as if you had to sit down for a call, what could you do in five minutes to kind of get yourself ready for that? Your mains are going to be things that

Starting point is 00:25:04 provide more stimulation but require more time and energy. So a walk would be a good example for that. Your mains are going to be things that like provide more stimulation but require more time and energy. So like a walk would be a good example for that. Your sides would be fidgets or things you can do to help you pay attention when you're doing another task. Your desserts like I said quick easy things of fructopamine aren't very fulfilling a lot of times. Your specials would be things you can't do all the time, but they're maybe really big sources of stimulation. They require a little more time and money. So like traveling, maybe- Roller coasters. Yeah, roller coasters. Oh, that's a good one. I don't think anyone's put that on. I do. We do a dopamine menu in my group call. You definitely can't just live

Starting point is 00:25:42 on a roller coaster, unfortunately. Yeah, exactly. It's like, oh, I can't do that all the time. And then the last little sections are like late night snacks, which I think of those as ways to unwind from too much stimulation. Because a lot of ADHDers are always like, I need stimulation, I need stimulation. I'm like, sometimes we actually don't need stimulation, especially in the evening time. We actually need to start to decompress a little bit. So finding things that actually help us relax versus wind us up and help us keep going is probably going to keep us up late. And most of us already struggle enough with sleep. So yes, we do. Now the dopamine

Starting point is 00:26:22 seeking can also cause a lot of binge eating behaviors as well, as we're kind of like using food as our sole source of dopamine. And there is a huge overlap between ADHD and eating disorder. So like 30% of people with ADHD will develop an eating disorder. And between 20% to 50% of people with an ED also meet the criteria for ADHD. What's going on here? It's kind of like a combination of a lot of the things

Starting point is 00:26:52 we've been talking about. So it's the impulsivity piece. It's not being able to not in the moment be like, oh, I'm walking through the kitchen, and there's cookies on the counter. And all of a sudden, I'm just eating all the cookies in it before I even think about it. It's the waiting until we're really ravenous, it's the executive function

Starting point is 00:27:12 piece too and being able to connect not just with hunger but also with fullness so some of my clients they might recognize that they're full and they're eating for stimulation but they don't care because they want, they still want more of that dopamine. So it's kind of, it's like all the factors of ADHD just kind of create almost like the perfect storm for like disordered eating behaviors. Because a lot of times it's not necessarily intentional. Like there are, like, I don't, I still think ADHD are still subjected to diet culture and we're not immune from it. So that definitely still plays a role.

Starting point is 00:27:49 But there's a lot of times where there's still just like, you might have completely rejected diet culture, but you forget to eat all day and then end up binging and you're like, this is, that's how I was in grad school. I was like, I don't understand why I can't stop binging. I was like, this is so annoying because I'm not dieting. I'm not really restricting. But I just actually wasn't eating enough on my medication. I mean, I had to

Starting point is 00:28:09 learn like you need to eat more than what like what it feels like is is enough on my medication because I'm still ravenous when my meds were off, which means I'm not eating enough. So yeah, it's kind of untangling to like the diet culture and ADHD and kind of untangling to like the diet culture and the ADHD and kind of being able to understand like what's more ADHD related and then what's more related to diet culture and some things with ADHD. It might be like, okay, I might need to take like a little bit more of like a harm reduction

Starting point is 00:28:36 approach with things because it might be that there are parts of ADHD that are going to get in the way of things. And so I need to figure out how I can kind of reduce some of those disordered eating behaviors, but they still might be there and being kind to ourselves about that. Totally. Yeah. And I mean, there's also just, you know, you think about comorbidities with, you know, anxiety and higher, you know, eating and sensory sensitivities and like the and sensory sensitivities and like the perfectionism, low self-esteem, especially when it's, you know, you haven't really been diagnosed and there is this kind of belief that internalizing of you always being wrong or bad or not good enough. Just a lot of the criticisms that

Starting point is 00:29:18 and the microaggressions that we have had to kind of endure all of our life. I know that's what happened to me. Again, I wasn't diagnosed until I was 36. So I spent my whole life feeling that there was something wrong with me. And I feel that that played into a lot of that, the tendencies toward eating disorders. For sure. Yeah. And it's, I will add add to for folks who are in larger bodies, like there's, there's a lot of intersections between ableism and an anti fat bias. And I will say like, if for folks in larger bodies, they might actually experience more ableism because of their body size, which is

Starting point is 00:29:58 awful. So there's just yeah, it's like a lot of those messages of imagine hearing that and from in multiple areas of your life, like you're just not trying hard enough. You're lazy, you don't care. And you're like, No, I actually do. Thank you very much. I'm trying really hard. You know, to really hurt. Yeah, like I'm trying really hard to, you know, eat nutritious foods or make my own foods or do all these to go grocery shopping, all these things I'm trying, but sometimes my energy is getting in the way. Yeah, and that actually leads me to talking a little bit more about kind of the intuitive eating,

Starting point is 00:30:27 the mindful eating piece. Because, you know, as we've discussed, in a lot of cases, we do need stimulation at meal times. Like we do kind of need to like watch a show or be playing with something or, you know, setting alarms to eat or eating when we're not particularly hungry and all of these things that seem at odds with intuitive eating and mindful eating, and everything we've heard

Starting point is 00:30:50 about intuitive eating. But you're an intuitive eating certified counselor. So how do you encourage folks with ADHD to kind of get started with those mindful eating and intuitive eating principles? Yeah. So one thing I find is like figuring out, like I call it your Goldilocks spot with stimulation. So like how much is enough for you,

Starting point is 00:31:14 which will be different for all of my clients. So like personally for me, I watch like a show that I've seen a million times, like the office or parks and rec, it's kind of like background noise. It's not something something I need to like it's not my new favorite tv show that I don't want to take my eyes off of kind of thing um so that helps me like I can still like be aware of my food or I'll listen to music so kind of having like more auditory stimulation for me so I can still like visually engage with my food and see how much I'm eating, you know, that kind

Starting point is 00:31:46 of thing, like being able to check in and be like, okay, let's pause a little bit. That's one thing, a three bite check in, which is something that Evelyn Tripoli recommended when I was like, how do I help people who like, you know, need like, feel like they need to eat with distractions? You know, how do I help them start this? And it was like, yeah, do a three-byte check-in. Check-in at the beginning of the meal with your hunger and your fullness, the taste and texture of the food. Do that again, somewhere in the middle and somewhere at the end. So there's at least touch points of mindfulness instead of just sitting down to eat and just eating and not even thinking about it. That can make it a little bit more manageable. For some of my

Starting point is 00:32:26 clients, they'll usually tell them like, hey, maybe start with a snack instead of a meal. If they're like, I really do want to try to eat without distractions. Like, let's start with a snack, because that's not going to be as long of a time. Like the first time I tried to eat without distractions was a lunch and I was in my internship and I sitting in this courtyard trying to eat and I was like, it was like a nails on the chalkboard experience. I was like, what do people think about when they're just sitting here and eating and I sitting in this courtyard trying to eat and I was like, it was like a nails on the chalkboard experience. I was

Starting point is 00:32:45 like, what do people think about when they're just sitting here and eating and I think I maybe lasted like five minutes and put my AirPods in and I have the most enjoyable eating experience after that and it wasn't like it wasn't mindful I still enjoyed the tastes and the texture and like the experience of eating that food I just needed something else. Eating with other people can be a way to get stimulation to like, because there's someone you can talk to. But when you're

Starting point is 00:33:11 sitting by yourself, it's just like, sitting in my apartment. Yeah, me and my brain don't need to just sit there and eat because it's not I will just eat really, really quickly because I'm sitting there thinking about all the other things I need to do. Yeah, I'm like, all right, well, we got to get back to work. We have to go do this next thing. So then I eat really fast. And that's, that's not enjoyable. But if I have have something I can listen to, I can slow down,

Starting point is 00:33:34 I can savor my food, enjoy it. And then it's not this like, kind of just almost dysregulating experience to eat with not enough of distraction. And even my whole family, like looking back, I'm pretty sure most of my family has ADHD. And it's just like, yeah, we never, I don't remember ever eating a meal where there wasn't TV or music on in my house at all.

Starting point is 00:33:57 There was always some extra sensory input, and there still is when I go to my parents' house and eat. There's always some extra stimulation there. Yeah. I always try to tell people all the time that the principles of intuitive eating are not going to be perfectly applicable to every single person every time. The bones obviously are still going to apply. We can still reject diet mentality and still respect our body. And that might mean like sometimes respecting our body

Starting point is 00:34:28 might mean eating in the absence of hunger cues. And it might mean, you know, like, I think that's really important to know that what works for our body may not be what's kind of written as gospel and stone and being flexible with that, right? Ultimately, it's about self-care and self-care is fueling your body with what it actually needs. So one thing I, you know, I talk about a lot here on the podcast is about how wellness culture typically perpetuates this like healthism, pervasive belief that your health outcomes are 100% within your control.

Starting point is 00:35:22 And so we know there's obviously so much misinformation online about diet secure, you know, ADHD, which was BS because ADHD is like 75 to 90% genetic. And yet, you know, we still, you know, we don't fully understand neurodivergence. And obviously, that's because we all present differently on a spectrum. And, you know, there's just so much advice out there about avoid this, cut this, go carnivore, do entreatment fasting. I will go into more detail on that later on in this episode, but is there any nutrition tip or nutrition recommendation

Starting point is 00:36:00 that most of us could benefit from? I would say this eating regularly, so eating every three to four hours, which to me is kind of like, before I even talk to my clients about the what piece, that's where we start. That's kind of like our foundation of let's get you eating regularly first,

Starting point is 00:36:19 because most of my clients have inconsistent eating patterns. So it's like, let's start there. And for a lot of them are like, oh my gosh, I feel so much better even just doing this. Like I haven't really changed any of the foods that I'm necessarily eating, but I'm just eating more regularly instead of, you know, eating, you know, waiting six hours or seven

Starting point is 00:36:38 or longer to eat, you know, they're like, oh, this actually feels a lot better. So eating more regularly, protein is a big one that I actually find makes a big difference, especially from the satiety perspective. And because at 82 years, again, we like carbs, so we might not always think about protein, and we might just naturally lean more towards foods

Starting point is 00:37:00 with carbs, not that we still need carbohydrates, but just making sure that we're incorporating protein in regularly because proteins also provides the building blocks for our neurotransmitters like dopamine. And there's some specific amino acids that there's some research that's like, hey, these might be helpful with dopamine production. Like tyrosine is one of them. So it's like just eating protein rich foods is a great way to get those amino acids because I've seen people be like, oh, you can supplement with that. And like there's no actual studies to show

Starting point is 00:37:31 you need to supplement with it. So just eat protein because that's a lot more affordable. It's basic stuff, right? Like people love to overcomplicate nutrition. You know, I read this meta analysis and the best diet for neurodivergent folks was found to be like a Mediterranean style diet. So that's one that's rich in veggies, fruits, legumes and fish, and then lower in red meat,

Starting point is 00:37:54 refined carbs and sugar. But another thing is like protein is incredibly important because it's the building blocks of our neurotransmitters. It's just not as like exciting for our especially for ADHD brains. We're like, let's do that fad diet because it's, it's flashy and it's new. And, you know, and it's kind of usually they're kind of extreme. So like, it's that dopamine or it's like the the like 30 day fix, right? Oh, okay, I only have to eat like this for 30 days. And, and then I'm done. So like, oh, I can do that. But then we kind of were like, oh, this isn't as exciting and fun to do the things that we've all heard a bajillion times over and over and over again.

Starting point is 00:38:38 Of course. I know. Nutrition science is just never very sexy, is it? Yeah. At the end of the day. And then you get the like, yeah, all the bros who are and like the wellness people who are like, here's all these other crazy things. And you know, that's that's not it. Oh, for sure. For sure. Do you have any quick or, you know, specific final tips or like secrets or hacks that have really helped you or like have helped your clients in helping them thrive with ADHD?

Starting point is 00:39:07 Oh, that's a really good question. There's probably a couple of things. One from like a meal planning-ish type of perspective is having a whiteboard on your fridge. Love that. That one is really helpful because you can use it however you want. So I've clients who use it in different ways, but like if you open the fridge and you always look at and you're like, there's nothing in here But if your fridge is full putting things you need to eat on the whiteboard helps or like hey What meals did I pick that? I'm gonna cook this week write them on the whiteboard. So you remember like oh, yeah I bought the ingredients, you know to make chicken fajitas

Starting point is 00:39:43 So let's write it on there So I don't forget why I bought the chicken and the peppers and the onions and the tortillas and all that stuff. Or they're like, Oh, we don't have anything. Let's just get Dordash. No, we have stuff. And so that I find is really helpful. Making food as accessible as possible, like figuring out how to lower barriers so you can eat regularly, you can do these things

Starting point is 00:40:06 that like for all a lot of my clients, they've all died for a really long time. They all know they all are like, I know what I quote unquote should be doing. But I can't do it because of you know, x, y, and z, you know, I because they're usually trying to do everything in a very neurotypical way. So it's like, hey, let's take those shortcuts. Let's make food. Let's even just leave food. Let's take a little snack bin in your office. So that way you don't even have to leave your office and get distracted and you have something quick and easy.

Starting point is 00:40:33 I'm a big, like people demonize, I process food so much and it is so helpful for neurodivergent folks, especially if you have sensory sensitivities, they're safe foods and they still get us nutrition and they make get us nutrition and they make eating accessible for people with executive dysfunction. So being okay with using those foods, I find, makes such a big difference for a lot of my clients.

Starting point is 00:40:56 Fed is best is a very common thing a lot of people in their divergent community say, and I think that's especially true that if we're eating, that's what matters. And getting the nutrition in is what matters, making sure that we're fed and not feeling bad about doing it in a way that works for us. You shouldn't have to feel like it's a full-time job to nourish your body. Amazing. Amazing takeaways and tips. And thank you so much, Becca, for joining me. That was so helpful, so validating of my own experience. And for everyone who's listening, I'm of course going to be leaving links to all of Becca's content. And you've got a course as well. Yes. Yes. I have a 10-week coaching program as well. So I usually have one every couple of months. So if you are looking for like ADHD specific support

Starting point is 00:41:46 with intuitive eating, that would be a great program for folks. Perfect, yeah, we'll leave that as well. Thank you again. Thank you. Okay, I loved that so, so much. And as I briefly touched on with Becca, wellness culture often teaches us that

Starting point is 00:42:07 if we just try hard enough, that we will never suffer from any health problems. And despite the overwhelming hereditary nature of neurodivergence, there's still a big, big movement to like squash it out with the latest diet fad. So I wanted to go through what the research actually says about some of the most common cited ADHD triggers and whether or not you should cut them out. Number one, sugar. The connection between sugar and hyperactivity has been an ongoing academic debate. And while some studies have found no association between sugar and ADHD symptoms, others suggest

Starting point is 00:42:53 that excess sugar may quote-unquote turn up certain ADHD symptoms. So one study found that the more sugar already hyperactive children consumed, the more destructive and restless they became, while as another study found that high sugar diets seemed to increase in attention in some kids with ADHD. What's likely happening here is basically like a transient blood sugar spike and crash that neurodivergent folks might just be more sensitive to. But that doesn't mean you need to like fully go keto. In fact, simply dressing up naked carbs or high sugar foods with sources of protein, fiber and healthy fats can help to stabilize blood sugar levels and minimize risk without overt restriction.

Starting point is 00:43:42 without overt restriction. Number two, food dye. There is a lot of talk about banning food dyes right now, and while I generally think that the concern is overhyped and is probably designed as a red herring to distract us from much bigger public health issues, there may be some benefit to minimizing impact for some folks with ADHD. According to a 2004 analysis of 15 studies, artificial food dyes did slightly increase hyperactivity in children, but in other research they concluded that the effects seemed to be genetically or perhaps neurologically

Starting point is 00:44:20 determined and not all kids were affected. Another event analysis estimated that food dyes negatively affect only 8% of kids with ADHD. Now personally I'm pretty confident that I'm part of that statistic and unlike carbs or even sugar for example, food dyes don't really add anything remarkable to my day-to-day life and they're also pretty easy to avoid without scarcity mentality or deprivation. But I will never say no to like a birthday cake because of a little red 40 and if you don't notice any specific differences in your symptoms when you eat food dyes I really see no reason to cut it out. Number three are preservatives and other additives.

Starting point is 00:45:15 We are currently in a heavy anti-additive era, but this narrative has really always had a stronghold in the neurodiversion community and the most well studied additive other than food dye is probably sodium benzoate. In one study they found that when sodium benzoate plus food dye is probably sodium benzoate. In one study, they found that when sodium benzoate plus food dye was given to children, their parents noted an increase in ADHD symptoms. But interestingly, there was actually no detectable differences in the lab. In the end, the authors estimated that eliminating additives might reduce the percentage of kids diagnosed as quote unquote hyperactive to the point of impairing performance from 15% to 6%.

Starting point is 00:45:53 But it's really hard to kind of tease sodium benzoate away from like food dyes or other additives because they often coexist in the exact same foods. As for the laundry list of other adjectives that you'll hear you need to eliminate, the research is even less compelling if it exists at all. I actually only found one study on MSG and it was in rats. Aspartame, even at crazy high levels, seems to have no effect. And while every single website seems to suggest that you need to cut out nitrates, I couldn't find a single reference to support that.

Starting point is 00:46:30 Obviously, when we're talking general nutrition, even for neurotypicals, it's probably advantageous to limit our consumption of highly, highly processed foods, which often come packaged with all of these allegedly problematic additives. But in a lot of cases, especially for us neurodivergent folks, I don't see the benefits outweighing the risk of a full-out militant ban. Next, let's talk about dairy. So based on the very limited research that we do have, it does seem that neurodivergent folks are just more at risk

Starting point is 00:47:05 for various food sensitivities and intolerances. We aren't sure why this is, but it's likely related to systemic inflammation, variations in immune system responses, and the strong communication between the gut and the brain and vice versa. And since dairy is just one of the most common food intolerances, and not just in neurodivergent folks but in neurotypicals too, it obviously makes sense that folks with intolerances will see improvements when they cut it out. So in one very small study, researchers compared 27 different possible food triggers in 16 kids with ADHD and 11 out of 16 of those

Starting point is 00:47:46 kids saw an improvement in symptoms when they cut out dairy. And it's a similar story when we talk about gluten, where some but certainly not all neurodivergent folks will simply just be more sensitive to gluten. One small study found that kids with ADHD showed improvements in hyperactivity symptoms when they went gluten-free, but other research hasn't been so convincing. So it's very clear that not all neurodivergent folks need to or even should cut out dairy or gluten or really anything for that matter. So no different than with neurotypical folks who have some potential food sensitivity induced symptoms, this requires a lot of trial

Starting point is 00:48:30 and error and definitely an individualized approach. And most importantly, as I'm about to discuss, an ongoing risk-benefit analysis. So as Becca and I chatted through earlier, there is a massive overlap between neurodivergence and eating disorders. Both conditions share common genetic risks, thought patterns, comorbidities like anxiety and depression, and neurological changes. So we need to keep this elevated set of risk factors top of mind because there is a really great chance that it will become

Starting point is 00:49:05 physically or emotionally way more damaging to cut out all these potentially problematic foods than to not. Like for an adult with ADHD who's constantly forgetting to eat until they're starving at lunch, grabbing that yogurt cup at Starbucks even if it's not sugar or dairy free, might be the key to preventing a midday binge. Likewise, if we are struggling to muster up the executive function skills to prepare a basic sandwich for lunch, having to read the ingredient list of every single bread in the grocery store out of fear of some potentially alleged bad additive is likely to tip the scales

Starting point is 00:49:45 on our executive function and capacity. That could be the difference between providing your brain with fuel that it needs to think clearly throughout the day and not eating anything at all because of the crushing food anxiety that you're experiencing. And that reads to me a lot like an ED, like orthorexia.

Starting point is 00:50:04 So for a lot of us, it would just be counterproductive in the big picture of health to obsess over every aspect of our diet. Fed is best, and that goes for us adults too. And speaking of Fed, I better get myself a snack before I get kind of caught up on my next project. But whether you're applying this information to yourself, your kid, or just looking to better understand your neurodivergent loved ones,

Starting point is 00:50:31 I hope this episode was as helpful for you as it was for me. Again, thank you to Becca King for working with me on this episode, and a big reminder to please rate and review and leave me a comment on this episode. It really does help me out as this is a new podcast. Signing off with Science and Sass, I'm Abbey Sharp. Thanks for listening. you

Bite Back with Abbey Sharp - Why Your ADHD is Making “Healthy Eating” So Hard - The Truth About Cravings, Fixations, Overeating, and Food Dyes with Rebecca King, RD

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