Blurry Creatures - EP: 305 CULTURE WARS with King Kat

Episode Date: February 25, 2025

The one and only King Kat steps into the Blurry Creatures basement to break down culture, the end times, and the deep spiritual battle woven into the music scene. He also shares more of his own journey—how the industry shapes minds, the forces at play behind the scenes, and his own awakening to the truth. 👕 Merch from "Blurry Creatures" https://www.blurrycreatures.com/store Become a member! https://blurrycreatures.supercast.com Full Episode Here: https://youtu.be/DuMMqlb53H0 Get our Book of Enoch! https://amzn.to/4gpV4yZ Listen to Blurry Creatures: Apple Podcasts:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/blurry-creatures/id1526885135 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPilMKgeZRAJ2AVwSdFRL?si=f42b58855ac7417e Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3Pqrl9X... Website: blurrycreatures.com Blurry Creatures Socials https://www.tiktok.com/@blurrycreatures https://www.instagram.com/blurrycreatures https://www.facebook.com/blurrycreatures/ https://www.twitter.com/blurrycreatures/ Special Thanks for Platinum Members! Joshua Drummond Maureen Munoz Amber Freeman Nicolle Benz Zach Mills Adam Dougherty Desiree Nichols Kate Logan Kimberly Lee Fayola Shakes Suzanna Wenzel Kent Denmark Michelle Watkins #demons #hiphop #culture  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Luke's so often, people email us, and they have this story. They're out in their woods, and they're looking in the bushes, and they go, what's that? And when you are pouring your dog food and your dog's bowl, that's the last thing you want to say. What is that? What is this stuff coming out of this bag? You know, I don't think a lot of us think about maybe what we feed our dogs, and that's why we partner with rough greens.

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You know, and I've got older dogs, Nate, as I said. And so, you know, since they've been getting Rough Greens with their food, I've noticed they have more energy, their joints hurt less. They're older. I mean, they were talking 12 and 13 years old. And Rough Green's really made a difference in their energy levels and the pep in their step. So if you want to do what we did, you can get a free jumpstart trial bag for your dog today. Just cover the shipping.

Go to Rough Greens.com and use discount code blurry. That's RUFFF Greens.com discount code blurry. Rough Greens makes any dog food better. Listen, Luke, we know that we live in a world where everything is fake, fake food, fake clouds, fake news, everything's fake. And you know what? You get tired of it. And you're just like, if I want to buy a shirt or something nice, can I just, please give me something real. Quinn's is an amazing company that does high quality everyday essentials.

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And it's because they work directly with ethical factories, cut out middlemen. So you're paying for the quality, not the brand markup. And everything is designed to last and look good, baby. Well, if you want stuff that's the real deal, go to quince.com. Like we have, got a whole fleet of new T-shirts this last time, man. Because I'm ready for the spring and summer. I got 100% ringspung cotton shirts. I got a couple floated shirts with light and air to wear around, work in the yard, or wear to the studio.

If you're like me and you want to get some new threads for the summer, refresh your wardrobe at Quinn's. Go to quins.com slash blurry for free shipping and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada. You're in America's hat. You want the goods. You can get it now. Go to Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash blurry for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quins.com slash blurry. If Jesus said that the Holy Spirit is the spirit of truth and he would lead us into all truth, then there is absolutely nothing that's going to remain hidden. Things are going to come to the surface eventually.

If scripture is our foundation, then why is Project MKO, or why is Project Naomi, why is Project Mockingbird, why is Project Paperclip something that we shouldn't talk about? You know, the Lord has really, he's really showing me that this is really the hour where he's doing the most work and he just needs people who are just willing to just walk the walk of truth with him. I started to see that my favorite rap artists were into the occult. That's when I was like, okay, so I can't put the Bible down and look at what I see on TV through my favorite, you know, rap artists and what I'm hearing through my favorite, you know, songs. I have to have both of them close together.

Get wisdom. but all you're getting get understanding. And when you really think about what the information war is, it's about understanding. And so if you can understand these topics, you can see right through Satan's trap of deception. But because you understand what the game plan is. You understand what his agendas are.

You understand what his agenda is. The history of our earth is so different from what we can imagine. Joy to join. The Smithsonian, and if they found out of, about a large skeleton somewhere was to go get it. I'm going to assume at least one person is right, because if one person's right, it bust the paradigm.

It all goes back to the fallen chair. And the problem with the modern day church, they have a very truncated view of the supernatural. This backdrop is just pregnant with all kinds of meaning associated with this Mount Herman event. And this guy defects from the kingdom. That's a big deal. All right, welcome back to the Blurringy.

We have King Cat on the show today. If you guys know King Cat, he is on Instagram. He kind of talks about all sorts of things in culture, hot topics, music, politics. And we basically have an off-the-cuff discussion talking about his life, how he got into this, what he's learned over the process. And we have more of a conversational style podcast with him because he's become a friend of ours. He was at BlurieCon both years. And he just kind of comes out of the woods and hangs out.

We're like, where'd you come from? Yeah, it's great to have Kevin. Kevin's got his finger on the pulse of what's happening, right? He's a truth seeker. He tackles hard topics. And like a lot of folks that sort of end up in his space, he's sort of the unintentional accidentally got into what he's doing, but he's run with it.

And he's an amazing guy who's got a great story. And this will be fun. We're going to sit down with one of our friends, talk through his story, talk about things that are happening in culture today, and how, in the intersection of the gospel. and politics and culture is really where Kevin lives. So I'm excited to have Kevin in with us in studio today.

And let's get Kevin on the show. Yeah. And once again, if you want to become a member of the show, Blurricutures.com slash members. And you get a bunch of bonus content, get ad-free experiences. You get episodes early when we get them done early. And tickets to events.

We had our first event here, sell out in a matter of not even all the members had a chance to get them, you guys bought them all. And we also have some merch available for those of you guys. want to go to our store. We got this awesome design here, a throwback to Unsolved Mysteries.

We got a ton of merch available at our store to, Blurier Creatures.com slash store. Head over to the website, sign up our email list. Let's get Kevin on this one. Thank you guys for supporting the podcast. Kevin Tom. All right. Come on down.

Welcome back to Blurry Creatures. Kevin Tom's in the house, everybody. We have you here in the 80s basement. You know, you have to pretend like the whole thing is actually real though. No, this is, this setup is, honestly, this is the dopest setup ever. Well, you got to actually tell people that's real because there's people saying it's just a green screen.

No, no, this is real. I'm touching bubble tape, great bubble gum right now. I'm touching a TV guide. I mean, Memorex, cassette tape. I mean, I can't, this is real. This predates you. You're not an 80s baby, right? No, I'm not.

I'm a 90s baby. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But we're technically in the same bracket. I mean. But, you know, in person. is kind of the fun part about doing the studio. We can all talk, hang out, and be here. And we thought it would be cool to have just more of an off-the-cuff.

Personal conversation, a little more of your testimony, how you know, you've become a big influence for people, especially on Instagram, you know, and all these people that are asking questions, trying to figure out what the heck's going on in our world. And that's how we became friends. And maybe talk a little bit about your own testimony. Because I think we all come into the blurry verse in our own way, right?

Yeah, yeah. Whether it's Heiser or. or some, like, you have an experience of your own. So welcome, welcome blurry creatures. And I'll say, yeah, like, you're just understanding, like, I'm excited to hear this because like how you, you know, how you go from being you, just doing you things, if you will.

You things. But, you know, the, yeah. Sort of the truth or space, if you will, right? It's really fascinating because. Blurry goggles. Well, folks like you, that just tell the truth. Yeah. You know, and cut through all of the names.

narrative stuff. You develop a following where people end up in a crazy way. And this is sort of what we saw through the election cycle is, is that legacy media, for all intents of purposes, is dead. Yeah. Elon Musk talked about that, where folks are now looking at things like X, formerly Twitter and Instagram, social media to find their news and the truth. Because we all, we've all lived long enough to see everything that happened, especially if you lived through 2020. If you didn't get red pill, black pill, whatever, what kind of pill you're doing? You got in 2020.

If you didn't, I don't think there's a whole lot of hope. Yeah, you know, the funny thing is when you talk about the media, I mean, we technically are the new media now. Yeah. And when you're living in the information age where information is at your fingertips, it becomes incredibly difficult to navigate what's true and what's not true. and it also becomes even more difficult to navigate, you know, who you can trust with the quote-unquote truth. Because nowadays, everyone's talking about subjective truth.

And it's hard to find something objective. Right. Especially if you're in the church. Like, if you're in the church, it's kind of, well, you know, you need to practice the sermon. But also at the same time, you need to have God's word in one hand and you need to have the news in the other hand. And you need to really be led by the Holy Spirit on, okay, can I trust this site? Can I listen to this individual? Can I like, like where?

Who can I trust and where can I turn to? I'm talking about discernment, right? Yeah, it's like the major distress in institutions. And if this person is being influenced by some sort of conglomerate, some sort of corporation. Yeah. I don't want to listen to them. If it's just one individual, then I have to decipher are they lying or not. Yeah.

And that's easier for me than who's paying this guy's salary. Yep. Yep. And a lot of people are, they're hungry for that. They're tired of the, I don't want to say the paid shills, but. They're tired of people in the background, you know. So you're saying you're free. I'm saying I'm free.

You're full free. It's the idea of being owned. Well, it's the idea of being owned, right? Who owns you, Kevin? Because that's one thing if you look into and you follow the money no matter what you're talking about. Whatever, whatever we're talking about, one of the main things you can really trust is to follow the money. Yeah. Right?

Like, and you talk about mainstream media and the sources there. And it's really owned by a very small circle of individuals. It didn't used to be that. Back in the 80s. Well, yeah, the journalism was alive and well. You had, you actually had investigative journalists that did their job that blew the whistle. Because you had so many limited channels, of course, there was a narrative. We've talked about Project Mockingbird, NK Ultra, et cetera, all these things.

Operation paperclip, all these things where the three and four letter institutions are taking control of outlets in order to move a narrative, usually for the military industrial complex, right? usually for the ideas of creating sympathy or momentum behind a war effort. Right. But like everything else, it never got turned off. Yeah. Just, yeah, like the Patriot Act, like Homeland, all these things that were meant to, of course, are always given to you as an illusion of safety, Nate. They never turn them off, right? And so then this is why I think the things like what you're doing are so crucially important,

especially when you talk about our space as well, where Nate and I sit in here and we do interviews about all these weird things, right? But, you know, our anchor point, our, our objective truth point is the Bible. It's the Word of God. It's the biblical text. That's where we go back to and filter everything through. And really coolly, really coolly done is you do the same thing. They practically, they realized the power of the media and they knew they couldn't turn it off. But what they didn't anticipate was the internet. And so the information age kind of shifted from you know, radio and television to this space that they just

could not control, right? Sometimes it feels like when you get that phone bill, it's like the crash site document, you can't read it, there's a bunch of numbers, random fees, vague language, stuff's blacked out, you're like, what am I actually paying for? I don't know about you, but I like keeping my money where I can see it. I like to be simple.

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trademark of the coca cola company and with the outburst of social media with all these different platforms specifically YouTube you know they realize okay if people are in these spaces where before people you know we're talking about baby boomers we're talking about you know the early 80s babies everyone kind of just trusted the television as their own main source of information and now that we're in this new age the information age with the technological advancements that we have with social media information is not just at your thinking It's everywhere. And so now you have to properly decipher, okay, like I was saying before, who can I trust?

Who's telling me the truth? And who's, like you were saying before, Nate, who's not bought off? Because if we follow the money, like what you were saying, Luke, you find out that a lot of people are technically paid to say specific things at a specific time and they're giving specific narratives. They're taught what to say what I'm saying. When did you start to see that? When did you start to like?

I started to see that when 2020 happened, BLM. And I mean, I'm in church, family and friends. And then growing up in New York, I'm starting to see the patterns that, you know, during the lockdowns, BLM was not going away. And it was infiltrated in a church. It was on TV. Friends and family were believing in the nonsense. And so I'm thinking, oh, well, this is easy.

Everyone can see through this, especially in the church. I was kind of naive in my perspective. because I just assumed, well, if you're in a church, everyone thinks everyone's, be pretty much have the same moral understanding of what this movement is really supporting, what this movement is about. So you hadn't been down any rabbit holes until-in-law. I did a couple here and there. I probably did like a little, like, minor research here and there about like Project Mockenberg,

project paper clear, project Naomi, Project M.K.K.O.T. You know, so those are minor. Right. Those are. No, but you had, I mean, so you had this burning interest in a lot of ways of that kind of set the fire. I wish, and this is why I blurred creatures such an important. this movement is important. And this is why I wholeheartedly believe it's a move of the Holy Spirit

because if Jesus said that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth and he would lead us into all truth, then there is absolutely nothing that's going to remain hidden. Things are going to come to the surface eventually. Scripturally speaking, that's what the Lord said. And so if that's our foundation, if Scripture is our foundation and Jesus said that the Spirit of Truth will reveal all truth,

then why is Project Enverbalt? Kiotro, why is Project Naomi, why is Project Mockingbird, why is Project Paperclip, something that we shouldn't talk about? Right. You know, why, why can we not have a place where we can facilitate this conversation? And honestly, a lot of people in the church are already questioning these things, but they're doing it secretly because they bring it to their pastor. The pastor doesn't necessarily have an answer for it. Or they bring it to their parents, their parents don't necessarily have an answer for it. And I grew up in a household where my dad questioned everything. And he didn't really come to faith until probably like five years ago and we had an argument about aliens. And he was,

he was a very strong proponent of watching ancient aliens. Yeah. And I could see right through ancient aliens, but he couldn't at the time because like I said, there's a level of discernment that you have to have when you're watching certain things. And so. Well, there's some truth in it. There's like a little little sprinkles. That's how they get you though, right? And little nuggets. And they use the Bible to distort the truth and push their narrative. Right. So it confuses people. And so that's, That's why I said I really do wish that we had, I mean, after my dad got saved, I mean, he started buying all types of tapes. He started buying Steve Quails tapes, Thomas Horn, Rust is Dark, God rest of soul, Tim's

stuff. You say tapes, actual tapes. Yeah, actual tapes and DVDs. So it's like, and we just started-busters baby. Right. And we just started binge-watching together. I'm like, okay, let's figure this out together, dad. Like me and you, let's figure this out together.

And then when he finally came to the conclusion that aliens aren't what ancient aliens was saying they were. That's when it started to click. And I kind of wish, this is why I'm, I fight for what you guys are doing so much is because if I had something like blurry creatures as a reference, I wouldn't have had to do the hard research myself, but I'm happy I did because now I kind of know how to navigate the conversations on my own. But if I had a reference point, right, yeah, that can just push people to like, hey, you should listen to this episode, listen to this podcast. Right. I think within that, we still ask people to do that. Like, with stuff we present, like is like, hey, this is, hey, this.

This is most everyone we have on the show is qualified. We try to keep it as high brow as possible. Yeah. You know, in the space where you've got academics and offers and professors, pastors, theologians. But the idea here is an open platformer to present your thesis. I like the spirit of ancient aliens. Yes. Like I like that it pushes the edge a little bit.

The church was afraid to do that. But the problem is it doesn't have that academic plug-in. So it gets a lot of it wrong. Or it doesn't, it's wrong. It's like, when, you know, guys like Heiser destroyed, destroyed their narrative because they were creating a fiction out of, out of the Sumerian and Mesopotamian stuff where you can't find a bureau in any, in any writing, any uniform, any carvings. Right.

So they've created this narrative. But what I think is brilliant about ancient aliens and is that they took something that people have been conditioned for, which is this Hollywood alien thing. Right. And they framed it in something palatable. They also know like the traditional history that we're being taught and told. There's evidence to suggest that, you know, the ancient world is not what we're being told. And so they take that idea and there is this sort of rebellious spirit that we all have.

I'm just saying I like the energy of it, but I think they don't have, they have their own narrative. They have they're trying to sell tickets. That's what they're trying to do. Well, it's deception, bro. It's like it's literally, there's enough truth that people buy it and there's enough conditioning that people say this could be true. but it's this alternative to Christianity, to religion. But it's because the church isn't addressing these things. And so they're going to, and they're going to take that lane.

And you know what? The unfortunate thing is a lot of Christians are listening to ancient aliens because they don't have an alternative for the conversation. And that's why, like I said, back to my dad, if I would have had something to reference to him, he would have listened to the blurry creatures, if blurry creatures was around because there was something to facilitate

what was going on in his, in his head, especially if you're a highly intelligent individual. Like you're going to want something to pretty much facilitate the conversation that you're already having in your head. And unfortunately, like you were saying, the church hasn't done a great job in just creating a place where Christians can just ask questions. And most of the time is because our, no offense to most of our pastors, they're not equipped to really deal with the hard question.

But what about aliens? Well, what about Palladians? You know, what about the universe? you know, what about Sasquatch? You know, so like, they have, people have questions and the Bible is a great, powerful book full of spiritual wisdom, truth in history. Unfortunately, it doesn't give us a step by step on what to do with the supernatural encyclopedia of questions that we really necessarily have.

And so when I figured that out, I'm like, okay, well, if, God is truth and he is not just truth, but he is supernatural in nature, right? Yeah. Well, then we should not be afraid to dabble into the conversation of what we would consider supernatural. We shouldn't be afraid to have those conversations. I should be able to talk about Area 51. We should be able to talk about Sasquatch.

We should be able to sit down and talk about Palladians. We should be able to sit down and talk about the fallen angels and the fallen angel technology. We should be able to really grasp at those difficult conversations and topics and just have a place where we can sit down and just say, hey, we have these ideas. There are a lot of people who have had these encounters with these supernatural beings. They have sat down and actually talked

with people who also have documented these things. Let's sit down and see what scripture says. Let's see what experiential knowledge says, because experience, a lot of people having abduction experiences. Right, anecdotal, right? Yeah. And there's 30 years of this.

This is Timothy Albarino space. Exactly. It is 30 years of research. But so for you then, it was your dad asking a question. You guys diving into Tom Horn, Steve Quayle, Timothy Albarino, Russ Dizdar. And that set you on sort of the trajectory. Right. And so when 2020 happened, it was, I don't want to say it was easy for me to really see through the facade of this political movement.

But when I started doing my homework on BLM and found out the history behind it, so it wasn't just this Marxist movement. It wasn't just this left. left this progressive movement, it was a full-blown spiritual movement. And the girls are, they're very, very, very strong in their perspective and saying how, hey, no, this is a very spiritual movement. We practice Nigerian IFA. Nigerian IFA is witchcraft. So, what is that? So Nigerian IFA is a form of witchcraft that has 16 points. And basically with the rituals, et cetera, et cetera, what I don't even want to really go into what they do, but it attracts a lot of women. And so the unfortunate thing with the three women who were leading BLM, Hopatamedi,

and Patrice Cullors, I forgot the name of the third girl, it gravitates towards them. Like they gravitate towards the teachings of Nigerian IFA. And the ironic thing is Nigeria and I feel like I said has 16 points to it. And Black Lives Matter had 16 chapters. And so in front of every Black Lives Matter, I want to say parade, but protests, they'd have that. drums there, they'd beat the drums, they'd have their little, you know, sayings that they say and repeat over and over and over again. Kayak gets my flight, hotel, and rental car right, so I can tune out travel advice that's just plain wrong.

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head. And then the drums in the background, the music in the background. And so when I actually started do my homework on them, when I started doing my research on what their narrative, what they're really pushing their agenda, I'm okay, so this isn't just a political movement. This is something that the church has to speak about. Like, we are forced to talk about it because there's a spiritual component to it. And because of my background, my homework, my own personal homework with Rustus Dar, with, you know, Tim, Steve Quayle, with Thomas Horn, I was able to see right off the bat what this was. And that's when the rubber met the road for me because when I started to take these things to church, I realized that most of the people in church already drank the juice.

And I kind of found myself in no man's land. Not the blurry juice. No, not the blurry. I wish they would have drank some blurry juice. But you were in, I mean, honestly, we're just sitting here like, you know, two white guys. You were, you were in a little red in me. But you were in a unique position though because you're a black man because BLM it really is to talk about it it's interesting because you talked at Blurie Kahn we talked about hip hop and the idea there was a religion behind that and we just talked about ancient aliens which there's a UFO religion yeah and then you talk about BLM and there's this religion yeah right and there's a spell do you I mean I think about like the so well the social pressure pressure too for everyone to change their so social media profile to a black

box yeah and you didn't you were a racist or whatever you know you put there was a It's a weird spell, almost, if you will, that was put over this. And it is so layered in a sense of deception because on the surface, the statement itself is, I mean, you can't, you don't disagree with. Of course, black lives matter. It's like, of course, you know, if you're a believer, everyone's, you get yourself in trouble, but everyone's life matters. The idea, right? So then they put forth a supposition that you really can't disagree with. Yeah.

because you do. Unless you're like, you know, I don't know. They play off your empathy. Right, but it's fascinating though because it is this sort of, it was a massive grift. Yeah. So people stole tons of money. And then also it was, you know, this violent.

It became a violent movement that, that, you know, in many metropolitan areas that unironically destroyed black neighborhoods. And people couldn't see. Well, they've been playing on minorities for a long time. Yeah. And the unfortunate thing is people couldn't see because that, spell had already been casted on them. And so, and that's, and that's the problem that I had. I was like, it's very easy to see the political component behind that. It was very easy to see

the destruction, it's very to see what their agenda was, especially for the black, the black family, especially for black men, because the movement was championed by three black lesbian women who didn't care about black. Targeting women, you're saying. Right, right. And those are, those become untouchables right. Exactly. And we saw, we kind of saw that shift with Kamala Harris, because when you see who Kamala Harris really tried to champion around her cause, it was black women. And she ostracized black men. It was pretty much the same spirit behind BLM previously. Well, I saw several articles saying that this election was young men. Because if you get the women, you get the husbands, but who's not controlled, young men who have no voice in their head, who are sort of on the

outside looking in going which side am I going to go for and if they see all the if they see like a massive like oh these people these women are under a spell you think they're going to be a little bit more they're going to be a little more punk rock and say I don't want to go that I'm going to do this I'm going to do my own thing and then obviously it's three dudes talking about what women think and yeah yeah but but I saw many articles say that it was about young men and I and I was like how does that make sense but this kind of connects the dots here yeah I mean so do you sort of me to this point when you see this, do you start feeling like you have this obligation, if you go, to start being public about what you're seeing? Is this how the King Cat, the King Cat,

the King takes off? I'm not going to take none. The funny thing was that I hated social media with a passion. Like, I just, I, I'm a bookworm by like naturally, if I had the option to defeat between going on social media, picking up a book, I'm going to pick up a book. Yeah. That's a good one. And on it, yeah, TV. is just me. And that's exactly what I didn't want to get on social media because social media was such a cesspool during 2020. It was like everyone, like you were saying, the black squares and on Instagram and then everyone trying to pretty much appease the progressive left. It was just, it was ridiculous. But there was being in New York City and because New York City is like,

New York City. Right. New York City is like the, it was the hub for BLM. I mean, even right now with this case, with um what's his name is it was his name penny or dan dan dan dan okay penny where they're they want a riot because he practically got they say he got off but he was a hero on on in the subways of i mean he saved the woman from practically getting killed so he's a hero he by definition that's what he is but because the narrative he's he's a white male and bLm is you know the new york city is a hubcat for for BLM, they don't want them to get off. So it's kind of the same situation that happened during, during 2020. And I'm like, I don't want to do this, but my sister really convinced she's like, hey,

like, if you have this burning desire, you got to do something with it. And I was watching a lot of, because at the time I was a youth leader in church, and I was watching a lot of them get really overly emotional about the black squares. And, you know, George Floyd. And I'm like, you guys don't even really know what you're talking. talking about, but you're emotional about it. Yeah. And I said, like you were saying before, like the, a lot of people are very empathetic.

And unfortunately, the devil knows how to deceive people through emotions. And I said, I can't watch. I can't watch this anymore. And I just did one video. One video, I was like, I can come and do this one thing. I just got to get it out there. I'm gonna leave it alone. And it was an eight minute video.

You kicked the bees nest. I did. But I didn't understand that at the time because I just, my heart was, I just don't want anyone more church. Or you put the honey out there, however you look at that. Yeah, it was just crazy. And the first thing I said was, hey, the issue with the black community is not the cops. I don't know what was that yet.

You could have had a 10 second video. Yeah, yeah. And that was it. And I kid you not, I laid out this case on how the issue is not the cops. The issue is fatherlessness. The issue is the rate of abortion. The issue is sexual morality in the black community and hip hop. because hip hop is a bear you touched all the idols i i i yeah i touched i touched all the idols i didn't

think i was in a backlash like that i didn't think anyone was going to see it right so i must i remember i wasn't even courageous were you king cat at this time where does that come from i was so we're going to go backwards yeah so cat is my initials kevin anthony tom okay and so king is just you're like carl anthony t so so king is i mean i just i love the concept of like kings and queens and you know One of my favorite verses, Romans 8, that we are heirs and co-heirs with Christ. And so, like, I really embrace that identity in the word. And so I just said, okay, okay, I'll just, I just threw it together. That's pretty much.

Yeah, there's not a lot of mystery. That's good, though. But that's how, but this is like how the birth of influencers happens, right? You put something out there in the world, and now it's just closed your phone. You're like, that was, I just need to say to get off my chest. Yeah, because I was, I don't, I wasn't even courageous enough to post it myself. if I gave the phone to my sister and I said, hey, you do what you want. He said, you do what you want. Because I just, I knew that if anyone of my, I was more concerned with people at church and my close

circle seeing it. Yeah. I wasn't considering the masses or whatever. The masses seeing it. Like that wasn't where my intentions, I wasn't, I wasn't trying to get big. I didn't care about social media. I hated social media. And so I gave the phone to my sister. I said, hey, you, you, you handle that and you do what you want. And within an hour, because remember, this is, I mean, everyone's on their phone. Yeah. You know, so during the lockdowns. Within an hour, I went from 300,43 followers to over 1,000. And my phone notifications were just ridiculous.

And I don't trouble with anxiety, but that was the first time I felt anxiety. And I said, I can't do this. I just threw my phone down for the night and called it quits. And my sister looked at my phone the next day. She's like, you're at 7,000 followers. And I said, okay, well, I'm going to delete my app now. I mean, who picked it up? How does that, I mean, it's, did.

So I posted it. Well, my sister posted it. And she did, she started tagging a bunch of people. And so she tagged Officer Tatum. And he saw it and he posted it. And it just went. Who's Officer Tatum? Yeah.

For reference. So Officer Tatum is a really big political commentator, influencer slash commentator on YouTube, on every platform really. And so he works a lot with Prairie U with TPSA. And his channel is like he's, yeah, he has a huge, huge, huge. Just for reference people listening. Yeah. So he saw it and he posted it. And my sister looked at me and she said, yeah, you can't stop now. And so, oh, yes, I can. I can't. I can definitely stop. Like I don't. Sister's fault. Yeah. Yeah. It's my sister's fault.

Yeah. But that's the beauty of being your own, your own man. You can do whatever you want. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's what people are looking for. They, they see an individual doing what they want and they they gravitate towards it because like this guy has figured it out and I think that's something something I think that the burden of all influencers is is then okay now even you have to sort of curate how you see all these things and if you have a good mind you can make sense of multiple things at once you can put them back in people's ears you can tell them something that they know is true but they don't know that they they don't know how to put it into words and when you put it into words it connects with them.

But this has to do with lots of things. Like, what are UFOs? What are, are there alien beings? Are they all demonic? Are they not? How do we interpret this as a church? Is BLM, is it actually legit? Or are they trying to hoodwink you?

And that is a burden. I think that's the anxiety that you feel is. Now I'm a voice to all these people. What am I going to say to them? And what if I get part of this wrong? Because I think Luke and I are in a lot of these rabbit holes. And a lot of people will, they will put a certain rabbit hole at the top of the

the arc and then everything has to filter through that and if any evidence comes and says hey you're a little bit wrong about that radical they're got no no no that's a deception right and so then you have to have I think a clear access to to to to what I think God is telling us and it's easy for I think spiritual beings to get into that like you said they can talk to certain like you think there's a spirit behind the whole BLM and the women thing and maybe they don't Maybe they're susceptible to a certain voice that maybe the other parts of the population aren't, and we have to kind of look at those things. But it's a burden.

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I think observation too is it's so interesting. Just kind of the way that the things happen, the way that God works in some ways. Because you're someone who's not, like I don't want to do this. I don't want social media. And then. Now your voice. Yeah, you kind of back your way into it. So what do you do next?

In some ways, it's not like Nate and I didn't set out to be in this basement necessarily. I mean, we were just like, let's do something. fun that we like and maybe my, I always always do joke. I mean, I know my mom and dad will listen and maybe, you know, maybe I can rope my brother into it and then like some of my pals. I knew the big foot space. I thought there was a few people that would listen to that. But then now you're on the, you're on the, like,

you're on the global scene. People are following you. It was, it was kind of intense because, you know, when you don't have a framework for what they call going viral. Yeah. You kind of don't know what to do. And so my sister was like, hey, you can't stop an out like you have to keep going. I'm like, no, no, I can't stop an out like you have to keep going.

I'm like, no, no, I can. stop. Like I can, I can, I can completely delete this, this, this video. I can completely delete my Instagram. Like, I don't need. She's like, no. Like, people are now looking to you, like you were saying before. Like, they're looking to you as like a voice because you don't, you're not just making sense, but you're speaking to truth. They're gravitating towards you. And they just want someone to also speak the truth along with them because they don't have a voice. So now you have no option. And I'm like, crap. And so, so the second, I had had no choice but to do a second. And my problem is I'm consistent.

And so if I start doing something, it's hard, like, it's hard for me to stop. Yeah. And so that's good and bad at the same time because I really do need discernment to know, okay, when, when something's dead. Stop beating the horse. Right. When to stop beating a dead horse. So it's, but, apparently, you know, the Lord has really, he's really showing me that

this is really the hour where he's doing the most work and he just needs people who are just willing to just walk the walk of truth with him. Because really, it's really a work of God. Because like I was saying before, Jesus said that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth. And he's going to reveal all truth. Yeah. And so if we're having these conversations and we're seeing minute fractions of the truth being exposed here and there, like Project M.K.O.

Like, I think if there's a conversation I love talking about is MK Ultra because we see how the mind games and the history behind that is not. just a government thing. We were seeing the spiritual aspects of what MK Ultra really is about. And so we can't ignore the spirituality behind these movements and behind these big quote unquote projects. Unfortunately, we have to address them because there are measures of truth to it that have controlled the minds of the masses. And so if we're going to lead people closer to Christ, we're going to have to talk about the hard topics in order to remove the veil and the facade over the eyes of people for them to see like, oh, that's what it was. And unfortunately,

the media and entertainment has played a huge role in that, specifically movies and music. And when I started to see that after, you know, me dropping, you know, certain videos here and they're talking about political topics, when I started to really dive deep into the spiritual underworkings of BLM and the witchcraft, that's when I started to learn about Crowley. And that's when, well, I started to understand Crowley before because I was kind of studying New Age. I had a lot of friends who were into the New Age stuff. And Christ's consciousness and all that,

all those other kind of nuances into the conversation with New Age. And I started to learn about Alice Bailey and Elista Crowley and Jack Parsons. And I'm like, what the heck is all that? The rabbit trail that I was going down led me into hip hop. Like, I wasn't searching for it.

Like, it led me there when I started to realize that a lot of my quote-unquote favorite rappers were Crowleyans. They were doing blood rituals. They were practicing the occult. Like, these were things that I couldn't ignore, but also at the same time, I didn't see anyone in church talking about it because almost everyone in church I knew loved rap and hip hop, especially like Christian hip-hop. So I'm like, well. And how do you filter the good from the bad? Because I think that is something that is always the question of like, how does that when you, dissecting this information,

finding this information, what goes on inside of you to go, this feels right, this feels wrong. Early DC talk, good, like when they turn to an alternative band, bad, that kind of thing, right? I think, they know something's wrong.

Yeah. But then they come up with their own conclusion of how it's wrong. And then they go this way. And then they throw the whole baby out with the bathwater. Alex Jones is a complete deception. Like, no, a lot of things he says

are actually right. Right, right. But that doesn't mean that he hasn't gone astray somewhere along that path. And so how do you stay on the right path and how do you know what that is? Honestly, that's a good question. I think for me,

when I really started to like, I don't even want to say I kind of dove deep. I feel like the Lord kind of, it was kind of like he was taking me step by step the way that I kind of look back in hindsight is okay, so you did your homework on this topic. Now I want you to cover this topic. Sometimes the topic's just kind of just shown up

if that makes any sense. Like when I was really questioning about the issue between aliens and, you know, fallen angels and all that other, all the kind of extremities, that's when the Lord kind of led me to Thomas Horn and Steve Quayle. I wasn't searching for them. Right. They kind of just, they kind of just popped up. And then the next step was, for me, was, it was music. And so I'm like, okay, well, what's the deal with rap, hip hop? What's the history behind that?

Is there like some type of spiritual underworking? Like we've talked about Blurikon. Yeah, there's a whole lot of spirituality behind that. We were talking about the Divine Nine or talking about the issues with how they perceive white people and black people and the spirit behind hip hop, you know, the history behind like Osiris and Africa Bambata, what they thought of when, why they went to Africa to receive,

the spirit of hip hop came back and they created a whole genre for the black community to really get close to their quote-unquote ancestors and all that stuff. And then the Lord showed me through scripture that the gods of Egypt just made their way here to America. And they used a vehicle called music. And one of the favorite genres of that music was rap and hip-hop. And when I started to see that my favorite rap artists were into the occult, that's

when I was like, okay, so I can't put the Bible down and look at what. what I see on TV through my favorite, you know, rap artists and what I'm hearing through my favorite, you know, songs, I have to have both of them close together. Because if I put my Bible down, I know for a fact I'm going to be deceived because I love the music too much. Yeah. But if I just totally put what I'm seeing in music and culture and entertainment down, I'm kind of, I'm going to stay in this bubble that I know for a fact the Lord doesn't want me in because they're, too many people who are like me who are still stuck in this realm and he wants to see them set free so he's giving me the understanding to help them and but i didn't see it like that at first because i was just like who wants to you why do you want to use me like i'm just this kid from queens and i had to kind of get over that that form of false humility because that's really what it was um not me thinking

that i'm kind of this lesser vessel for him to want to want to that that's a form of false humility because that's really what it was um not me thinking that I'm kind of this lesser vessel for him to want to use when really God wants to use every one of us. The only issue is that a lot of us don't want to answer that call. And I'm, like I said, I'm grateful you guys did. And you might think it's small, but it's not a small act. Like, this act of obedience was something that is going to echo into eternity because there are a lot of people who are stuck in culture. They have questions. And we've seen that through BlurieCon. Like, a lot of people have had questions, but they just didn't have a place to get those answers. Or even discuss them.

Or even discuss them. Yeah, just to have like a discourse about. You said this place was steps from the water. We just haven't found the steps yet. How much did we save? Enough. Enough to get lost. Or you could book a stay with Hilton.

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And it gives people that place where it's like, oh, I'm not crazy. Like, oh, I thought it was just me. Like, oh, this is like a breath of fresh air that the questions I had circulating in my head, contemplating by myself, these questions are questions that it's okay for me to have. because there's a space where these two crazy guys decided to create a podcast and call the blurry creatures. Like, oh, there's a name for what I'm experiencing. Yeah, it is blurry.

Yeah, what do you think your topics people come to you? What do you think they want? It's definitely, definitely music and politics. Like I said, I didn't want that. But unfortunately, I was good at talking about it. Yeah. And that's because. Unfortunately.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I say unfortunately because those are things I was just naturally. I naturally love talking about. Gravitated towards. Right. And so I'm like, oh, why not?

Let me talk about the things they tell us not to talk about, politics and religion. Well, let me talk about another topic that they really don't want to talk about and that is music and entertainment. So let me ask this then. What was it like stepping into the arena,

if you will, right? Because all of a sudden, I mean, we talk about this on the show. Like, the idea of spiritual warfare is fascinating. Because I think all Christians would acknowledge that that's a real thing. But I feel like in a lot of ways,

church on Sundays sort of underserves us to understand the realities. And we Nate and I talk about all the time when the Shut Lake, we're born in this ancient war. We are now put on the chess board in this ancient war. And if you choose to step into it and to get on the board, there's a lot of resistance. And there's a lot of things that come in that choosing. What was that like for you? Because I can't even imagine. Like if you're putting out a video and you're not in the game and all of a sudden you're in the game and your video,

is the antithesis or it's coming up against this religious movement at the time really Well you're going against all kinds of different groups It's not just going against ancient aliens You're speaking out against the church You're speaking out against the culture

But also it's not just like you don't like social media Now you've stepped into the lion's den Like you are now you've created You're a mark now Because you're swimming upstream against The narrative It was kind of it was intense because to go off what you said on spiritual warfare,

I mean, we're born into warfare, whether we acknowledge that or not. And when I actually put my, I shouldn't say I put my foot in the water, like I jumped in the water and I didn't know how to swim. I still to this day don't know how to swim. Like factually, I don't know how to swim.

Like actually swim? Yeah, like actual swim. I need to learn how to swim. Come to Costa Rica with us, bro. We'll go do so. We got to talk about that. Like I definitely do want to come to Costa Rica. So I didn't realize how social media was its own monster.

And I didn't understand the warfare between that. Like I participate in spiritual warfare. I mean, I've seen people get delivered set free. I've seen people come to Christ. I've evangelized outside in Queens. You name it, I've done it. But this area I wasn't prepared for because the level of spiritual warfare in terms of information is heavy because that's what sets people free, really.

So if we go through scripture and Proverbs says the Lord is proverbally speaking through Solomon says get wisdom, but in all you're getting get understanding. And when you really think about what the information war is, it's about understanding. Yeah. And so if you can understand these topics, you can see right through Satan's trap of deception. You can see right through his cobwebs. You can see right through his web of deception. You can see through it because you understand what.

the game planet. Yeah. You understand what his agendas are. And I was able, by the grace of God, to see, okay, well, there's an agenda in politics. There's an agenda in music. There's an agenda through entertainment. There's an agenda to capture culture. And if we, if I start talking about these and I continue talking about the attack on

culture in this way, spiritually and supernaturally, in my head, naive pre-2020 Kevin was like, no one's going to listen to me, who cares. I didn't realize that all the topics I just listed were topics that the enemy carefully had in his little clutches and he did not want anyone inside his little mass web of destruction. I was jokingly talking, but it's true, you start touching the idols and it's like whether it be music, politics, these are all religious. whether these hot points are what's what people consume it's it's it's what's on the surface it's

what's available it's like Beyonce or Taylor Swift you touch those things oh yeah yeah yeah yeah forget it I mean the women will come after you the teenage girl will come after you and you know if you start talking about Jay Z and Beyonce you know black people come after you so so it's just one of those things where it's like which idol am I going to touch today you know Lord which which idol do you want do you want me to talk about to see it you know be exposed and be brought down today and like I said at first I didn't my intention was not to to be the quote unquote which I appreciate that about you because I think a lot of people what Luke and I have found is that the algorithm heavily favors politics and things like that like our show would be 10 times bigger if we talked about oh forget it

you guys start talking about politics that you guys will blow up overnight but I think I think you know the reason why the show is what it is because I think we went backwards and like what influences the politics, what influences the music. It's this ancient war. It's these things that nobody wants to talk about. It's whoever built the pyramids. It's all the way back there. And you're like, what? But I think that that's what's a good one to punch because we start the conversation. It goes all the way back. We could talk about politics what's happening right now. And that's what people want. They want the, you know, obviously there's cultural stuff here. You know, we, we don't shy away from the 80s and how all the music, like how all these things shaped are our worldview,

but I think in blurry creatures we go back further. So I'm surprised the algorithm actually does what it does because Bigfoot isn't the hot topic on Sunday morning in church. It's political stuff. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you guys would be surprised. I mean, how many people are questioning the things that you guys discuss and we discuss on practically a weekly or daily basis. People are secretly questioning things about Sasquash, Area 51. Skin Walker Ranch. I mean, Skin Walker Ranch is probably

one of my favorite topics next to MK Ultra and, you know, project paperclip because it's like... But if you do a video about abortion, you're going to get 5,000. Oh, you're going to get... You're going to get 50,000 views. Right. Right. You're just like, this is... And you look at the camera, you say the line. And we know, like, yeah, that could be... But I think that

your humility is a huge part of what you do because sometimes I see those channels. I'm like, yeah, technically they're saying the truth. But it feels like they're kind of using people's emotions to build their own, like, conservative following, rather than actually really trying to say something that is important and not let it be about them. And I think it doesn't feel like it's about you, Kevin. It feels like you're trying to help people. And it also doesn't feel like hot takes, right? Because we live in a hot take culture, like whether it be first take and, you know, skip Bayliss and all these different things.

People just are like, here's my hot take opinion. Right. Which I appreciate about you because everything is, you talk about being a bookworm and on your channel, it's like you break down your topic based upon research. It's, it's, it's your, you're finding the objective facts and you're just saying, here you go. Yeah. This is what the truth is. Hot take people don't really like us. We get a lot of those channels like slandering us, saying the terrible things about this.

They don't even really know what we do. They don't have, there's no knowledge of the catalog, the guests. And so, you know, sometimes you're just like, whoa, what is the deal? Oh, okay. Yeah. We're not saying the thing they're saying that they're saying. And because we're not saying what they're saying, they have to attack us. I can, I mean, we can talk about that for the next hour because.

No, no, seriously. When I first, when I first started talking about, you know, especially during BLM 2020, I mean, if I were to tell you how many messages and calls I got from well-known people, you'd be like, oh, well, it's, I understand why it's. easy to sell out. I understand. Because when you start getting those calls and getting those messages from blue checkers, like, wow, like I'm getting a lot of reach. If you saw me, then wow. But the reason people don't really like this, specifically blurry creatures is because you're not paying, no, who's paying, no, no one's paying you to do this. Right. You know, there's, there's no, like, if you

follow the money, where is it? Where is it at? You know, so it's like one of those things. those shoes up on top of the, yeah. You know, so it's, it's one of those things where you know this movement was something that the Holy Spirit brought up because the only thing that you guys really care and champion is the truth. Right. You just, you just want, okay, well, let's just have a space where we can talk about this stuff.

Like, we're not telling you to agree with everything that we're saying. We're just saying, hey, there's this topic. Let's talk about aliens. There's this topic. Let's talk about Skinwalker Ranch. Hey, let's talk about the Freemasons. Let's, let's talk about satanic ritualistic abuse. Let's just talk about it.

And I do think a spirit will come along when you start to go down these rabbit holes and try to distract you and go, we'll go this way and be an extreme down in this rabbit hole. Go real far right or left in this specific rabbit hole. And that seems to be something that we constantly come up against. And so you need more voices and there needs to be more unity of like, I personally feel like the alien abduction phenomenon is one of the biggest issues in the church's that nobody wants to talk about. Either they say it's a deception, it's not happening,

or it's all demons. And you're like, people are being taken. Pregnancies are being taken. Craft is being found. This is a complex issue. And everyone goes, blurry, you guys are part of the deception because you're trying to put more context

to this discussion. And Luke and I are like, man, there's so much evidence to suggest. It's way more complicated. Why can't we have that conversation? And we're also not saying we know the answer. That's always the problem. Right. Like, we're just like, let's let's add this to the discourse.

Well, some, we don't know a lot. Let me say this. The reason why you guys are getting so much pushback is because they can't control the narrative. And because of they can't control the conversation, it's, oh, well, you guys are part of deception. Why aren't you having this conversation in church? Well, it's not that we don't want to. It's like, you want to open up your church for us to have it there, you know, so it's kind of one of those things where. There's a few glory churches. There are a few, praise God for them. The ironic part is that these conversations are the conversations we have with our friends,

around a fires, with a cigar, whatever it is. We talk about these things. These are all guys that go to my church or go to the churches. But you're right, though. Blurry creatures is as defined as it gets. That's very broad, right? And some people have a very specific, they are da, da, da, da. And they are in a certain camp, and then that's where they stay.

And we're, you know, our podcast title is pretty vague, pretty broad. And I think that welcomes more conversation. It's also a Mitch Headbird jokes. It's like not too serious. Well, yeah, but I mean like it is it is like the more you try to figure it out, the blurrier it gets. The more complicated it gets, the more people you talk to that have experiences, specifically abduction people, it gets bizarre. And you don't, and you can go, well, this is all deception. I think there's something that's like I want to ask you very, because I think what we're sort of dancing around talking.

about is discernment. Right. So how do we, in your mind, how do you discern what's true? Yeah. And then how do you approach that? Because I think this is a very nuanced and complicated topic, especially in our spaces and in the church, is that the idea of discerning the truth is often hijacked for an agenda. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it also can be very subjective, right? Or if someone challenges your truth, they're just... Right. And I think everybody who grew up in the church, and we did have seen this abused as well. Like my, God said this or the boy spirit said this or my discernment is this. Well, it's like that video that's going viral. I said it to you last night about the guy that gets on stage and he's like at church. He goes, my wife is here tonight.

And the Lord told me. And it's all these women in the crowd just kind of going, oh, oh, no, no, bro. No, no. And it's like that's exactly what you're talking about. It's like you grow up and there's all these awkward Christians. who say awkward stuff, awkward youth pastors. And then you find out, oh, the narcissist is the pastor, and he has this whole history of abusing people.

And it destroys the church. It's like it's a magnet for these types. So how do you discern? Man, we can have a whole conversation about narcissism in the church because it's just, I mean, we're seeing it right now. I know friends who are dealing with it right now as well. And so it's just, I think discernment, the only way for us to really navigate the times and topics

that we're talking about is to have the word in one hand and a cultural trending topic in the other because we're seeing politics and prophecy kind of display itself on live and I think the only I think that's the only I don't have a I don't have a enlightened explanation you need to have the Bible in one hand and you need to be I would say knowledgeable on what's What's really happening right now? Because you can either be swayed one way or the other. You can stay in this big Christian bubble like we were talking about earlier and pretty much want to have nothing to do with what's going on outside.

But then at the same time, you can be in your cultural bubble and not have anything to do with the church and pretty much miss both. Well, so kind of what I'm hearing is like it's a humility part of it. Yeah, you have to. I mean, I would never approach a topic with, yeah, I know what's 100% certain that this is incorrect because I'm not an absolute like I don't have absolute knowledge on any topic and that's why that's why going back to what you guys were saying before that's why blurry creatures are such a phenomenon because you

guys are talking about uncontrolled topics in a very I don't even want to say nuanced way but in a kind of nuanced way where you are you open yourself up to criticism and scrutiny that a lot of people especially if you're in a position of you know power and authority you know I'd want to use the term like past pastoral where you don't kind of want that to be challenged because a lot of if we're being honest a lot of churches and people in position in church they don't like the idea of being challenged knowledgeably because you know they want to be viewed as a point of authority right and that's pretty much it and like you were saying that narcissism runs very deep in the church

if i control the narrative i control the fan base right i control the money right and it's like if humility is the gasoline behind a true influencer what is humbled you? you. Man, definitely the fear of the Lord. Like specifics in life though, because like I think that, you know, we all have things that happen to us, you know, like I think Luke, this isn't Luke and I's first rodeo. We've been tempted to have, you know, in the music days and in the sports days and in, you know, in the media days, there's things you know you can do to level up. And I think if you turn those down, you know, so in some ways, we've, We've gone through that temptation and we've seen our friends if we haven't personally dealt with it.

Oh, this dude took this contract, said this thing and this thing, it destroyed his life. Yeah, that's a good point. But what happened in like your life specifically do you think that helped you maintain focus and stay on the path? I would definitely say the death of my close friend right before 2020. she had took she took her life and I would never forget the feeling that that that brought me the first thing that I thought about was when I went to her funeral specifically was man can I fill up a room like if something were to happen to me today like can I fill up a room and her funeral was like there there was only standing space there like everyone did she had a line of people that standing outside waiting for just to see her in her in the casket and I'm standing there I'm thinking I'm because I saw her Thursday she she ended her life Friday and then the funeral was I think the week or a week and a half afterwards and that was an earth-shattering moment of my

life and when I look back on that the first thought I had was where am I going in my life like am I going to have an impact where I can look back 20, 30, 40 years from now and say, Lord, I'm happy that I didn't compromise myself. I'm happy that I just was led by you. I'm happy that I didn't allow this voice or that voice or even my own internal voice to mute what it is that you want to say to say to me. And, you know, unfortunately, like you were saying, I've seen a lot of close friends who, you know, on social media, who that I've befriended throughout the past couple of years, who have compromised themselves.

And unfortunately, you know, it's compromising for the sake of influence I realize is not one of the main things that people compromise them for is usually monetary. It's usually financial. And I've seen a lot of people go down the route of, hey, like I'm about to make bank. like why not? And just completely lose all their values and their mindset and just throw away biblical principles altogether and just walk away from the faith because I've seen that throughout this as well. And so there's nothing that terrifies me more than having to have to stand before Jesus one day and give an account. And that's really what keeps me because everything that I'm doing or everything that I say, I'm going to have to give an account for it one day. And I just want to make sure that if I do say something, it's going to lead someone closer to the cross.

It's going to keep someone at the feet of Jesus. And if someone from the outside looking in, it's going to make them curious enough to want to stay. It's going to make them curious enough to want to ask questions, even if the questions might not be something that the church is comfortable with. I feel like that's a minute-to-minute relationship with God. Because, like, Luke and I are, I know just doing the show, it's like minute to minute problems arise. Questions come up. What do we do? What do we say?

Is this right? Is this not right? How do I deal with this one particular issue? What's going on and with all these drones flying around? We get thousands of messages and it's like, I don't know what's going on right now. I'm just going to sit here and do nothing because I can have this overreaction. Oh, yeah, the aliens are here, the UFO. Project Bluebeams happening right now.

Or I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what's happening. And that's a big part of influencing is saying, I don't know. And you know what? People hate that. Yeah. People can't stand that.

Well, they want to be told what to think. Yeah. And I was just about to say people want to be told what to think. People want to be told what to believe. And when you position yourself as a point of authority on a topic, people will automatically come to you, but they can't stand the idea that you don't know something because they're like, what do you mean you don't know? Like you have this topic.

You spoke about this before. Like, you should be up on like, no. Like, these things are much more difficult to discuss. and kind of navigate than you think. Like if they're difficult for you, don't you think they're difficult for me too? Like we're all in the same boat together. The only difference between, you know,

a listener and someone who is actually providing the value of content is that we were just brave enough to just put the camera on. I don't, I think that's probably the only distinction is that, hey, we were like, let's just, let's just talk about it. Do you feel the way their responsibility? Yeah. I think it's something that's like been impressed upon,

unlike with blurry as well for us, is like, I mean, at its core, we wanna have these discussions about weird stuff, but I mean, I think deep down, I think we won't folks to have a place for discourse, but to encounter the gospel, right? And the, that is primary, but there is a weight and responsibility when you become, you know, a,

and I hate the term influencer, because I think it's, there, and what I like about you do is, I think people set out to try to have, what you have and when that is their goal I feel like it never it never succeeds right well there's more responsibility because you're driving the car where I feel like we're like

ADHD church where you know we get the back seat and all kinds of weird topics come in and people that's the critiques you talk about Bigfoot getting shot one episode and then Mount Herman the next episode and Jesus coming back it's like yeah it's ADHD church like we it's just

that was the whole point of this podcast we're not afraid of the gospel but we're all over the place. Yeah. And that's how my brain works, but you have to be very specific. I had a lot of pushback on conversations with me. I didn't think music was going to be such a huge.

People love it. Yeah, a huge debate. I was just sharing what I obviously knew. People love their politician. They love their musicians. They love their thing. You know, where it's easier for us because, like, people don't necessarily know what they think about Bigfoot.

They're not married to an idea. They know something's weird about it. I mean, some people are. Same with aliens and the UFOs. Yeah, it's like it's bizarre. It's weird. Let's talk about it. I don't know what I think about it.

It's more broad and loose. But when you tack specific thing people love, it's different. Yeah, it is. And I had to learn that the hard way because I, you know what really, what really upset me about talking about music was the pushback I received from the church. Because I wasn't expecting. I was assuming that, you know, people from church, would agree with my take on Jay-Z or Beyonce or even Taylor Swift.

I wasn't expecting, you know, someone coming at me on, you know, about Ariana Grande. I'm like, the girl came out and said she's a witch. Don't come at, don't get my, don't get my me. Like, I didn't say she was a witch. She said, I'm just agreeing with her. Get mad at her. Get mad at her. But they, but when you, like you were saying before, like when your identity becomes

a favorite musician or actor or actresses, like you're a yoke to these things, then that's a problem that you now have. with the God that you claim to worship because the only thing he wants you to be yoked to is him. I mean, Jesus said, take upon me my yoke. But isn't the nature of humanity though, like I think we see that in our faith, in Christianity in the church. Like people become yoked or married

to these specific theological ideas or denominations or, right? And they become division points. Right. And so instead of us becoming you know, attached to, yoke to, married to the idea of Christ and the gospel, we pick these other things and they become points of identity. It's a weird part of human, the human condition. It's like faith. You're describing faith, I think. And that's, and that's a huge, that's another

component between the division is that, especially with the conversation with blurry creatures, is that there's, there's no denominational line that you guys are, are really supporting. And I think when you start to talk about these topics, these different camps, whether you're a dispensationalist or whether you're a reformer or whether you're a Protestant

or whether you're Orthodox or Catholic. Yes, all the above. So it's like these topics kind of... Do you feel that way? Do you feel like you're in that same boat, but just a different lane of influence? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I get feedback and push back from all camps.

I mean, I start talking about music or, you know, Protestantism or the charismatic movement or, you know, orthodoxy, which has been a recent one. The pushback is kind of crazy. It's ridiculous. But because we have this mindset in the body of Christ where you're not in my camp, so you're wrong. You know, you're clearly deceived. And this other camp is saying the exact same thing. It's like with these topics that we're discussing, let's just discuss. it, but there's the blind side is if I'm in this particular camp, I'm supposed to have,

not just the mindset, I'm supposed to have the right theology, doctrine, the right, the train of thought to stay in this camp. And if I even so much as, you know, have a different mindset or if I bring up a different topic or, you know, I'm all of a sudden ostracized from the camp that I claim to be a part of. And so it's, I think God is doing this on purpose. because we shouldn't be married to one Pacific camp or another. And like 99% of the time it's not a salvation issue, which is the irony in all of that, right? Even in our spaces that there's like people choose these very odd hills to die on.

But it's an understanding issue, you know, like the more context you have. I think when we talk a lot about how the biblical writers had a ton of context. They knew everything that was happening. They knew cultural significance. They knew ancient books. And so people go, oh, you can't talk about the book of Enoch. because it's deception. And you're like, well, they knew about it.

They knew about it. I mean, Jude quoted from it. Yeah, right. They actually wrote this. Oh, but then they'll say, no, he didn't actually quote from it and this and that. They have all these ways to take down anything that comes at them. And it's like, like Heiser said in our show, if one of these things is true, we have to make room for it. Right.

And I think there are a lot of singular stories in scripture that you can't find anywhere else. It's one story, but it says a lot. Like, you know, I was saying this in our members group the other day that like that one verse when Jesus says, you know, like Satan can't cast out demons, right? That, that, that or cast himself out. Yeah, cast himself out. It's like that whole idea, I think, it illuminates an entire understanding of, you know, what Satan does and doesn't do. Not everything is a deception. There's certain things he doesn't do, particularly because it goes against his, his agenda and his way. So we have to sort of read between the lines a lot, and people don't want to read between the lines.

is they want a very black and white fundamentalist view of Christianity. And if you say aliens or aliens, people go, no, you know. And it's like, why not? Well, I know. What do you know? It's a deception. Why? Because the Bible says there's deceptions.

Yeah. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait, I don't know what they are. And I definitely, that's the whole point of the show is we don't know. Yeah. But we have that luxury, I think, sometimes to be like, and next episode, whereas you have to wrap up your video and actually make a point.

so now we know less let's see you next week to know even less and you know what I had to really early on I realized be okay with not knowing enough it's okay not knowing enough

but I think because people kind of have this idea that if you're going to be in these spaces that you need to know a lot about everything where it's like no that's a very unrealistic expectation to hold upon someone else, let alone yourself. You don't even know everything. You don't hold yourself to that standard. But to hold the standard of, well, you're talking about it, so you should therefore know everything about such, such topic. Like, no, that's not how that works.

That's not how learning works. And so for me, I humbled myself really early, like, hey, just have fun learning. Like you're, you never know enough about a topic. You're always learning. And so approach everything with this child, not childish, but childlike heart where it's like, wow, I didn't know that before. That is so cool. I don't ever want to get to the point where the older I get, the more callous I get in my understanding. Like I want to, or entrenched. Or entrenched. So the only thing I know for certain, but absolute is that Jesus is who he says he is. You know, it's funny. When I think, when I think, yeah, I love that. When I think about people who have influence in like the Old Testament, for example, I often think about Noah, like year 60.

like we have this idea that we go through these hardships. But imagine being 60 years into a project and everyone thinks you're nuts. I mean, you and I deal with and Luke, we all deal with some scrutiny for, you know, but it's been a couple years and we can put our phone away and we can go back to our life and we have friends and we have life. But this dude stuck to that task year after year after year after year after year when there was probably no such thing is rain. Rain, yeah.

But the mindset, right? The kind of people that God uses are a particular type of unicorn. They are stubborn, but they are open-minded, right? They are loyal to God, but they also can be influenced. And their hearts are moldable. Or if you're Moses is the most humble man that ever lived, and he told us about that. It's such a unique, yeah, right? It's ironic, right?

But it's a unique, it's a unique individual. It's like a Candace Owen is, she's a unique, person. She sure is, yeah. If there's if there's an individual who like pisses everybody off at once it's her. Equal opportunity. Yeah, I mean it's it's her but you know what not to not to go off the to the trail with Candace but it's a particular type of person and that guy is easy to take shots at. Because he's doing his own thing right but he's also loyal to God. Yeah. So there's this sense of self-entonomy but also following directions. That's a weird combination. Right, right. And

And because the antithesis is that you chase and you grow and pride becomes involved. Right. And you start to take credit for the things that God is doing. But you have to reject that power. So the people that God does use ultimately reject power, but they need some kind of power to do their job as well. So it's like it's a dance. And it's constantly confusing humans. Who's actually got the humility and the influence at the same time versus who

pretends have the humility and the influence. These people aren't actually humble and they're influencing you. Wake up. Those are the videos you make. Not us. We don't have to say that. So in your mind, right? Where does this go from here for you? Because you know, you've built a sizable following social media. You've become unintentionally a lot of ways a source of truth on the topics you choose, which is political and the music space. Although you dabble other places which is great. I love when your Venn diagram overlaps ours. It's a lot of fun. What do you see next with this vehicle that you've been given? Steward. Stewardship over, really. I mean, honestly, what's next? You know, I don't see myself stopping

anytime soon because at this point it's become it's become something I've loved to do because I realize that what I have been doing is something that people. It resonates. Right. And so if no one kind of, and I'm not saying I'm necessary because I'm not, but if certain topics that I covered were not topics that people wanted to cover, I'd still probably cover because I'd like it. Right.

But for me, I really do think that if I can continue doing what I'm doing and grab as many souls as I possibly can into the kingdom of God, then I would consider that work well done doing. Yeah. And so for me, that's where my mindset. That's where my heart is. Because at the point, at this point, like, well, why do anything else? You know, if it's not for the glory of God and it's not for seeing as many people come to Christ as a possibly can. Kingdom work. Yeah. And so, so I think for me, that's, that's kind of where I want to see it going. I started my new podcast. I didn't even want to do that. But people were asking for it. And I said, okay, well, I guess if I have to do something off platform off Instagram, then I could. could probably start doing that. And so, but honestly, I just love, love seeing people come to the knowledge of the truth. And that's through information. Right.

The more information you're exposed to, the more you will come to that conclusion. Is that how you feel? Yeah, that's exactly how I feel. And so, because that's where I was years ago. I wish, I wished I just had someone to walk with me through difficult topics, wasn't afraid to challenge difficult topics, wasn't afraid to challenge difficult topics, wasn't afraid to talk about things that the church was afraid to talk about and just sit down and have like a bro conversation, kind of like what we're doing right now. I wish I kind of had that in my journey of truth. I just wish I had someone to just walk with me. And I kind of, that's where my

heart is. My heart is I just want to be the one person that people are like, okay, at least I have someone who is unafraid to talk about the things of politics. Yeah, you feel like an open, open-minded ally and I think we have a lot of closed-minded people that attack us and then everyone's what we know that there are some open-minded allies in this space where we can kind of go to each other and if we have a problem with each other I will just message you or you'll message Luke or we'll communicate hey what do you think about this yeah you're going this direction I don't know yeah what do you think what do you think and it's we're all in this trying to figure this out together versus I'm going to build this wall and I'm going to start launching missiles at you yeah attack you so I can build up my

little following because it's all about me. Yeah. And I don't think you, you don't, that's not what you do. I would close all my accounts immediately if I found myself even remotely going in that direction because at that point, because I've seen it happened. Yeah. At that point in time and it, when the message becomes just about you preserving yourself image, preserving your, your perspective, preserving your knowledge, your thesis, everything to becomes surrounded with you. Like that's, that's not just a dangerous place to be your, yeah, that's a prideful place to be. And it's only a matter of time we can start counting down. It's a spirit?

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's pride, you know, at that time. But is there a spirit behind that, like, specifically? Mm-hmm. I really do believe it is. I believe that, quite frankly, it's, really it's lustful and not lustful in the sense that we think the idea of lust is sexually. It's, it's that measure of lusting after your own desires, wanting your own thing, and doing it your way on your time, regardless of correction for. anybody else and I've seen I've seen that kind of happen I shouldn't say kind I've

seen that happen time and time again for the years that I've been doing this whereas someone's lust for notoriety becomes so strong that they don't receive correction from it and I'm happy I have older brothers like you guys to be like not that much not that much older like please yeah not that up much not that much but please please correct me I saw this in theaters so how old wow wow wow I saw that at home that's still one of the saddest moments you know where Whereas you become your own arbiter of truth. That's a very dangerous place to be.

And I realize that if you have people in your life who are willing to correct you, you have really good people. And I realized very early that I need people in my life to correct me, to tell me, hey, like, you wind down, boy, like, calm down. Like, maybe you shouldn't have said that. Maybe you should probably think about that. And that's a perfect place to be. Because when you have, when you're, if your circle is full of yes people. I mean, why have a circle at all? We're tethered to nothing.

Right. So at that point in time, I'm like, no, like, I need, we all need people who love us enough to correct us when we're going in a specific direction that is just uncanny and just, like if we talk about individuals like Candice Owens, for example, Candice is, and I don't want to say she's very opinionated, but a lot of the things she says ticks people, off and a lot of people think that she's an unchecked personality. Whereas I look at her and I'm like, is she really unchecked or is she saying things and challenging things that you don't want to be challenged? And I come to the conclusion that's kind of what it is. And so you're kind of, you're kind of in one of these two spaces is either

people look at you as a personality that is unchecked or look at you as a personality that is checked. And if you're a personality that is unchecked, they'll label you. Like, oh, you know, you're all about yourself, you know, you're all about your own image. You know, you're all about, no, like, I'm just, I'm just an individual who is questioning the obvious things. Whereas if I'm checked, obviously you're going to start to ask questions, well, who's telling you to say these things? Are you paid to say these things?

Like, who is, who is funding you? And unfortunately, when you're doing what we're doing for a long period of time, people start to look at you as someone who is. a wild card like you're you're unchecked and I'm like no I'm I'm not unchecked I'm I'm I'm basically trying I have people in my life who are willing to correct me and tell me whether or not something is wrong right whether I'm going in the right direction I'm going in the wrong direction or you've had enough experiences right I mean I think there are very few Tim Tebow's in the world where it's just like the guy I was just born humble kind of I don't I don't I don't know Tim I don't

I don't yeah Luke knows Tim but the guy from my perspective and you can speak if I'm right or wrong it's like he was just thrown in the spotlight and 99 out of 100 people would have like taken all that and it would have totally changed them. Yeah, yeah. They'd become a big deal in their head. Yeah. And it's like he seemed like he actually rejected that. I think that's a very rare personality trait.

And I think a lot of these young influencers, especially in the Christian space, they open their Bible. And there's a lot of power talking about it on the internet. And all of a sudden they have all these followers. Yeah. And then they feel this old. But that's the first time in their life they've ever tasted that. Yeah. Versus I think, you know, when you've gone through life and you've been kicked to the curb,

but you've been beat down, you've been near death, you've gone through the desert. Yeah, yeah. Then you start to actually understand, okay, God, I'm done. Yeah. You do this thing because- Take the wheel. Yeah, well, it's like I don't trust someone who hasn't been through a lot of stuff. Yeah, yeah.

It's like, like Theo Vaughn says, I like raisins. Their grapes should have been through something. You know. It's like, I like. I like raisins. You know, I like people who've been through something and then talk about their thing. What have you been through? And that's why I asked you that question because I think that really takes the word of God

and sets it to life. It's like some of these guys in the Old Testament, they did something with their lives before God's like, okay, now I'm gonna use you. Now you're ready. Yeah. You feel like- I agree with that wholeheartedly, with all my heart. And I think the unfortunate thing with the influencer culture is exactly that. you have a lot of people who haven't really been through anything and they want to talk about

everything. Yeah. And it comes from a place of deep immaturity and insecurity, if you really think about it for a long period of time because you want people to see you as something when really, you know, you should first find your identity. It's imposter syndrome. Right. It is. It is imposter syndrome. And so, but I think God is really going to correct that. And I, I, people can see through that, those types of personalities as well, like someone who eventually. Right. eventually. And so unfortunately. Sometimes it takes a long time.

Yeah, sometimes it takes them to fall. Sometimes it takes them to like gain everything that they wanted and lose everything at the same time actually go through something. Yeah, yeah. You know, I, unfortunately, I've seen it. And my prayer is just constant like, Lord, I need to stay in your presence. The only thing that has kept me centered is the presence of the Lord. And so, and of course, new brothers like, you know.

Yeah, friends. You've got a brand new podcast, right? I know we've got, we're wrapping here, but we've got a brand new podcast. Tell our listeners, because there's this really cool Venn diagram. I talked about it again that overlaps between your folks and what you do and blurry creatures, which has been a really cool thing to see happen.

Yeah. And to get, you know, you showed up at BlurieCon 1 just to be there and we dragged you on stage. And then you were, we did an interview with you at the last one. Yeah. It's been a really cool piece for us. We're grateful for the piece. Yeah. Your humility has.

Yeah. Like you actually were just. And you were just in the crowd at BlurieCon one, like, what are you doing here? Come on up, you know. And I like that about you. That's kind of some questions here. You're not pretentious in that sense of like, yeah, you know, people know who you are there, but it's not about you. We're grateful, though, for like the piece that you play in our story, right?

It's like I feel like that in the craziest way, these, the guests that we've had helped to build this picture of maybe understanding, at least better understanding of the, of the weird and the blurry, but also a voice in your space that feels part of this mosaic, right? As we try to understand the mysterious, right? And ask questions that, you know, about hard questions that may not have hard answers. Yeah. And you've been, you've been a really cool part of this. So we're grateful for you, man. But yeah, tell folks about the brand new podcast you've got. I know it's not brand, brand, brand new, but the new podcast. Yeah. So I launched a Good Ground podcast and you can find on YouTube you can just type in Good Ground Podcasts.

And really, I didn't want to start a podcast, but almost everyone I know was trying to convince me, like, hey, like, you do way too much on Instagram. You should probably just start a podcast. Diversify, baby. Yeah, you should probably just diversify. Which is harder because it's more freeform. Well, you've also been deplatformed.

So we've been deep platformed, like, at least twice on Instagram. And quite frankly, I realize, man, I need, if I'm going to keep doing this, like, I have to, like you were saying, I have to diversify, but I just didn't want to start a podcast, especially on YouTube. So I was like, okay, let me start on Spotify. I really like Spotify, because like I can just talk about technically whatever I want, technically. And, but everyone was pretty much saying, like, hey, like, we want to see you.

Can you do something visual? And I'm like, I don't want to go on YouTube. But if I have to, then okay, I'll go on YouTube. They're a little bit better. They're not canceling people as much as some people that money make her baby. Yeah. So I said, okay, let me just. started on YouTube. So I just, I just launched it on YouTube. So you can just type in Good Ground

Podcast and it'll be, he'll show up. I'll be uploading probably all my other videos, well, audios into videos and throw them on YouTube as well. Awesome. Well, Kevin, thanks for coming in the blurry basement. Man, I love you guys. Thank you all so much for inviting me back. In person. And it's fun to have just an off-cuff conversation. And hopefully listeners like that, it's a little different than what we normally do. But I think, you know, we've developed the friendship. And I think that's what it's about. And I think that we, in a lot of ways, We reject the big personality is with like, with that spirit, you reject. And I think we find a lot of comfort in that we're trying just to push through all this information.

And let's have a good attitude when we're doing it because nobody knows. Nobody knows all the answers. And I like, I love the humility. I love the, we're actually friends in real life. And it's not just this thing that people do. Yeah. In this influencer space, like, I'm friends with this person I don't like. It's just connect just for the sake of content.

Yeah. Guys, just, I hate that, man. Yeah, you're the real thing and appreciate that. And that's rare in this world and you keep going. King Cat 2.0. Check him out, follow them on Instagram. Check out the Big Round Podcast. Anywhere you want to listen to or and or watch your podcast on YouTube. Yeah, love you.

Love y'all. Love y'all. Good to have you, Kevin. See you there. Thank you all. So much for having you.