Oscars Outsider - Bravo Outsider: Disappoint My Dad Edition w/ Dale Ward and Randy Kirkpatrick (RHOC S17E06 RHOA S15E09)

Episode Date: July 14, 2023

I made my dad, Dale, and his friend Randy watch Real Housewives and then talk about it Find Sandy Klowak on Instagram at https://www.instagram.com/corporealcurios https://www.bravooutsider.com Music by FASSounds from Pixabay

Hello and welcome to the Bravo Outsider Podcast. I'm your host Craig Midwinter. Joining me once again this week is Sandy Kloak. Sandy, how's it going? Great, glad to be back. Yeah, glad to have you back. Super excited for our guest this week. I had to work really hard to secure them.

I think they were a little bit reluctant based on the material, but it's my dad, Dale Ward, and his BFF, Randy Kirkpatrick. I don't tell you which is which. Okay, Dad, read your tagline. Hi, I'm Dale. I'm a fixed income freeloader. Okay, Randy. I'm Randy.

But enough about me. Tell me what you think about me. Yes, Randy. Okay, you got it. Dad, not so much, but... Not so much, though. Thank you guys. this game.

Randy is too. What's your excuse? And it's a first rub. No, but that was actually a great tagline, Randy. That was like really captured the spirit of like the housewives tagline. Yeah. Yeah.

I read a whole bunch of those taglines that I thought I got to come up with one. Yeah. I could like that. I could hear your research in that. One thing that we do when we have a guess on, we always ask. them what their past experience is with reality TV, like what shows they watch. Dad, I'll start with you.

What reality shows have you watched? Not many. I'm not a big reality show freak. I mean, no, it's like Ted Lassow. I'm a Ted Lassau freak. Yeah, well, that's certainly not reality. That's not reality, but I can't think of any reality shows that I'll sit and watch. Oh, okay.

Well, I'm going to have to, like, call you out a little bit. What about like Pond Stars, Storage Wars? I know that you like watch that. That's reality? Yeah. What would you call that real? What would you call it? Okay.

Well, I'm not sure. Well, yeah, I guess Pickers, American Pickers would probably be the one that I would tune in the most if it's on. And maybe Pond Stars from time to time, but that way wears a little thin. And then if you go back to the time of what's the storage war. kind of thing that was on, but that's way in the past. Yeah. Nothing recent though. Like growing up, I remember in our host, we had reality TV on all the time.

It wasn't like real housewives because that was not like the unstructured reality genre that like housewives is a part of had not yet been defined. But I remember like trading spaces being on, which is definitely reality. I mean, I remember watching like the first few seasons of. Survivor and Big Brother. Yeah, that goes way back. Yeah, exactly. But as you know now, the TV in ROs is permanently tuned to HGTV because that's all

Mum Watches is home improvements shows. So I never get a chance other than sports. And I think like the home improvement genre of reality is like a subgenre of reality TV. Like it is like constructed in a very. similar way. And sure, it's got like pretty different roots from, you know, something like real housewives or even something like Big Brother or Survivor. It's very distinct. But, you know, I think like something like this old house with Bob Vila, which is like kind of one of the proto home improvement shows, was like really like proto reality TV. There was constructed stories that

happened in that and that really helped build the foundation that you know something like real housewives is is built upon yeah just by the way though it's not reality when you can renovate a kitchen a half an hour you're right about that we had like at our place we had like no tile on the wall after almost completing a kitchen rental for about a year until finally getting it done so i yeah that That's definitely accurate. Randy, how about yourself? What reality have you watched? Well, you know what?

I hadn't really thought about it when you guys were just going through the history of reality shows or whatever. Definitely American Pickers started off watching Pond Stars, that sort of thing. I'm kind of into a new one. It's called it's a motel renovation. I don't know if you've seen those ones or not, but it's quite interesting. But I hadn't really thought about this old house because that was something. and I used to be glued to. And this was before HD TV, actually,

this old house. And that was really interested with Bob Vila. And then I guess he had some of his Norm Abrams or whatever, was his sidekick or whatever, it was a master carpenter in that. But, yeah, I haven't really thought about it that much. But I can't say I watch a whole lot of TV in the first place. So that's where I'm sitting at.

Yeah, I think people generally just like underestimate how much reality TV they actually watch. I think like so much content that we consume is so, if it's not directly reality TV, it borrows lots of tropes and, you know, conventions of reality TV. It's really a genre that we have seen emerge within the past, I guess, like, 25 years, maybe longer than that now, and really change the structure of the content that we consume. Like if you were to take someone from like 40 years ago and like put them in front of a TV showing content from today, even if it wasn't a channel that's dedicated to reality TV like Bravo, I think that they would be stunned at how different the format is, you know, if they were to compare it to,

you know, the content that was produced 25 years ago, I think, or 25 years prior to like the time that they came from. So I think that it has like TV has evolved so much within the past 25 years, thanks to the advent of reality TV that, you know, it looks completely different. And, you know, some, I would argue that there's points that are more honest about what. what is presented on television nowadays compared to 25 years ago. But there's also things that are a lot less authentic about it because, you know, reality TV is also like it is very constructed, but it's presented as, you know, um, very like factual.

So Craig, tell me something. Are you old enough to remember when TV actually ended at night? They did the national anthem. Yeah. God's sake the queen and then they shut off for the evening. Yeah, well, I don't think I stayed up late enough most nights to do that. I was always a very obedient son that went to bed at his bedtime. Here it comes.

You know, I was just like so perfect. But I do remember getting up early in the morning and watching YTV, which in Canada for our American listeners, is like a kids channel. And they always started the broadcasting day by doing like the Canadian. Anthem. So yeah, I remember that. And it's really interesting that you bring that up because, you know, I remember slowly watching like every single channel after, you know, or I remember hearing about this. I didn't stay up that late. But after the broadcasting day ended, instead of signing off completely, it was slowly each channel being filled with infomercials. And That was something that I think is kind of an evolution of television that we have seen.

That is also, you know, also influences reality TV. The like the product placement and the like the way that we see like confessionals, I think is like kind of a staple of reality TV that was introduced. And I think that that has a lot to do with, you know, people that were typically advocating for like products being like, oh, this changed my life, you know, the whole like talking head, streeter type, like news vibe that you got. Um, we see that on Bravo shows especially, but like pretty much any reality TV show is going to have some sort of like confessional mechanism, some sort of like talking head where they're

talking directly at the camera narrating, giving like a first person perspective. Um, and I think that that is like, that's inspired by the infomercial. and news to a degree. But I think like infomercial was the, you know, use it as a storytelling mechanism in a more like dramatic way than the news ever did. And I think that's where reality gets at. So that's really interesting that you would bring that up. So is reality TV is for the most part scripted as well, right?

So these shows that you look at, there has to be. scripting and that's one of the the knocks that's been on shows like Pickers and that or storage words that these things are all been set up. They're not reality in the true sense of the word. And that's what I wonder about with

these as well. Yeah. What's imprompt you and what's not? I think like it depends on how you define scripted because I don't think that like there's there's constructed situations like you know there's

certainly. scenes that we see where people are put together for the purpose of like a story being like put moved forward or having a fight or like you know whatever there's certainly that aspect of things but i don't know that that is directly scripted because all of the people that are involved at least on bravo shows but i think like broadly across the genre um all these people like they're actual people that have like actual human considerations that they need to make right they're you know it doesn't matter how much a producer wants to enforce a certain like storyline if someone is like really cognizant about what the implications for their brand is or like you know what the potential

fallout for their family is and they they've got all of these influences plus all of their past uh experiences influence their decisions, there's no way that you can actually fully script something to go exactly the way that you want it to. A skilled producer will certainly be able to influence things, but there's always going to be that unpredictability that is introduced just by the nature of people actually being humans. So, Craig, to Dale's point there, would there be retakes?

Oh, yeah. A certain scene? For sure. there would be yeah okay and actually like in terms of like bravo news this past week we saw that vanderpup rules has resumed filming and they have had to do retakes just because of unruly fans uh yelling while things are happening and like really like ripping into some of the character because they are so upset with these people for their actions and so they they've had to do like retakes of of things so I think like you you can often like tell when these things are happening to an extent, you know, when they are retaking things for the purpose of storytelling.

But yeah, absolutely retakes happen. But I don't think it's like scripted in the sense of, you know, oh, you're going to have to fight with this person. You're going to have to like, you know, argue about this. I think that one thing that is really interesting for me as a viewer of reality TV is actually watching these people as their own like execute their agency. So they have to make these decisions like, oh, am I going to fight with this person or am I going to like retain this information and, you know, decide to use it strategically later? do I want to build an alliance here? Even though this isn't a competition game like Big Brother or Survivor, that happens on Housewives constantly.

That's almost entirely what is happening in these like social situation. People are making decisions about how they interpret and how they act upon and disseminate information. and it's really interesting because they're like their actual human experiences influence that. There's other shows on different networks maybe that you can tell it's a lot more script. I shouldn't say more scripted, but there's shows that read scripted. Like if you're thinking about the hills, people are coming into scenes. And it's very clear they have to ask a question of this other person and it's pretty awkward.

And I think that is happening, as Craig saying, on the Bravo shows as well. But I think it speaks to the, like, the talent of the, of the personalities on the show. Not that they're asking and it's not necessarily that, but just that the dynamism there and the life that they can bring to it and the authenticity that these Bravo shows, I think, personally read a lot less scripted. Yeah. And also, I think that's like the caliber of the producers. Like the producers on Bravo are, you know, top tier.

I don't think that there's anyone that's better. Even on, you know, the networks like ABC who produces The Bachelor, which is probably the biggest reality TV show in the game, I still don't think they come close to the actual skill in terms of actually managing people and trying to manipulate storylines and foster these relationships to, I don't think it comes close to what we see on Bravo. And yeah, to Sandy's point,

put it in like a bit more context because I don't think that dad or Randy have watched the hills I could be wrong but um but something like love it or listed which I know that dad you have seen um oh yeah you can actually see in in those uh in those scenes when someone is coming in it being a very like forced moment. It's like, okay, well, we need to have this moment

where this renovation is going to cost way more. It's like, oh, these pipes are like all messed up. This is going to cost you way more. Like, you know,

those are very like clearly telegraph. Formula. Yeah. Well, there is, there is the formula that plays into that. But there is also just the, um,

there's a certain skill in hiding that. making it feel a lot more natural that I think the TV personalities on Bravo and the producers on Bravo are a lot more skilled in being able to hide that aspect of that. You don't see their hand in the same way. You don't see the producer's hand in the same way. You don't see, you don't see it as like this structured like moment necessarily. It always has a little bit more nuance, I would say. Deeper than I ever thought. Yeah, well, yeah, I think it's deeper than a lot of people thought.

And I mean, I think you're right that you probably haven't considered it deeply. But I don't think that that is just you or just your generation or just like, you know, men of your generation or men in general. like maybe disproportionately I think men do dismiss reality TV and the art surrounding it. But I think broadly reality TV does not get the respect that it deserves and there's a lot more going on than you would think. But let's get into the shows that we watched this week. So we watched an episode of Real Housewives of Orange County and an episode of Real Housewives of Atlanta. I'm going to just say let's jump into Real Housewives of Orange County to get things started. Dad, we'll start with you.

What were your first impressions of this cast of character? Confusion, really. That's probably where I would start with, is not having watched any episodes prior to when you sent the two that we should have a look at. I have no idea what was going on. and it's just trying to sort through the personalities, I guess. You know, I think the opening of that one, it started with a crotch shot of one of one of the stars. I mean, well, what the hell is this all about? Oh, yeah, when they were wrestling.

When they were wrestling, right, I said, okay, am I supposed to remember where that one's going? I have no idea. Well, I told you to make note of memorable moments. well that was that that kicked it off i suppose in terms of looking at that and just trying trying to and in both of them in uh orange county and in Atlanta it's just knowing who's who like in orange county they're all blonde except for one so i think it was Heather yeah was the only brunette and that so she was easy to kind of focus in upon and she was kind of an i don't know whether you'd call it an agitator or whatever you'd want to call it,

but she was kind of a focal point of tension between some of them. Yeah, so what did you think about, like, the conflicts that you saw with Heather? I, you know, I don't have an opinion. I mean, I just really just, you'd look at, there's no way you could deduce from that. Who's right, who's wrong, who's justified, who's not. and all of that, it's just very difficult to decipher. I mean, like, if you take off your, like, trying to find all the contacts emotionally, were there anyone in particular that you found, or did you, like, side with anyone in any of these conflicts?

Because she had a notable conflict with Gina, I think, is one of the big ones that we saw. We also saw the resurgence of a conflict that she had with Taylor, and she was also starting shit with Tamara and Shannon. Were there any of these conflicts during this isolated read that you had on this, that you thought that maybe she was in the right, or was she broadly in the wrong? No, I mean, I don't think they were going with your highs and lows when they're going through it. And one of the highs with, I think again, it was his, Heather, they talked about, was shoveling horse crap off of a truck was a high part of what she saw. That's interesting. And then I don't know whether it was just because of all of the blondes compared to the Burnett, that she was the one being left out of things, or so she claimed. And whether that was real or not, I'm not sure.

I get you got kind of caught up I did got caught up in the excess of stuff right and so here they are in Montana camping ostensibly camping in Montana and yeah it could be nothing could be further from the truth in terms of like wearing a Gucci toque or you know I got a kick out of all of the red black Transcona tuxedo pajama things that they were

wearing and it's such a world apart from I'm out of the cottage right now and it's just matlock

isn't like that yeah it was it was hardly roughing it um yeah randy what were

your first thoughts of first impressions of this cast well it's kind of funny Dale just stole my thunder because that's exactly

what I was going to say I couldn't tell any of the girls apart. And even to, you know where they would have a still shot or they'd go to a one-on-one little interview with the girl. They would pause it and go to a quick interview or whatever. I couldn't tell who they were talking about. All the blondes appeared to be the same. Even though I wrote down the names, Taylor, Gina, Tamara, Heather, Jean, or Jen, I guess, and Shannon,

I couldn't tell which one was which. I know for a fact, now, having said, that's that this has been going on for, I believe, OC-17 seasons, right? So obviously there's a following, number one. Number two is, obviously they have ratings. So they did do some flashbacks to 2000, and I want to say 12 or 14 in this particular show, and I thought, oh, I mean, obviously the characters have been around for, that long. I understand

that some have come and gone and maybe are re-emerging, if you will, but I just found that I was confused a lot because of it. I mean, a lot of drama, but I'm guessing that's what they're looking for, number one. As Dale

mentioned, that Heather seemed to be the one that seemed to be the focal point for all of the conflict and the drama that was happening there and the different sides she was taking in that. But it's just it was interesting because there just seemed to be a lot of anger and the first thing that came to me was if they've been if they've been like this for so long why are they still together like that's what i don't really understand really does that make any sense like if yeah if dail and i were going to fight constantly i mean we probably don't want to you know be hanging out with each other either but if there was a big like paycheck and involved, then that would probably change things, right?

True. That's very true. And obviously, sorry, go ahead. Sorry, the leg. I was just going to say to that point, that's one of the things that does sort of make it hard to suspend disbelief that this is all reality. Sometimes these are groups of women that are genuinely friends, but sometimes they're very clearly just put together for the show. And as you said, it's very clear that they don't want to be together. And they are calling each other friends, but they're not friends.

And so it's interesting to compare if you watch a lot of the different shows, the dynamics. And in this group, there are some true friends, but there's probably a bit of that as well. So good point. Yeah. But, yeah, the other point with this thing was, I don't know, I'm looking at some of my notes here that, The accusations of this Ryan, who was, I think, a husband of one of the other ones. Sort of. Yeah, he's a point.

Yeah, screw the other one. And this was going back and forth and confronting him with it. And I'm going, thinking to myself, on camera, really? You'd go through that type of confrontation or conflict. And I don't know. It's just, it's just so weird. The guy that, that, the person that stuck out on this and didn't come. into it until the end of it was, I think, this Travis.

Oh, yeah. Who was, I think, the boyfriend of Emily, or no? Gina. Gina. Gina. Yeah. Right. And he was the guy that kind of at the end, she unloaded on and went through this whole process

of what had gone down. And he was the most reasonable, I guess, balanced character in that whole episode that kind of salvaged a little bit of normalcy if you want to call it that. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. This was a very like, this was a big note in my notes as well in terms of like memorable moments. And Travis is someone that we have seen for a few seasons on Real Housewives of Orange County.

And he just comes across like so genuine and like an actual like nice guy. He was saying like all the the right. things and yeah you know he just seemed like very grounded and like you know very emotionally supportive and um you know just like a really honest wholesome like nice guy that i would love to be friends with but get the fuck out of this show like i want conflict i like you know i i want these characters to like go at it i want them to be like have very like problem problematic engagements with each other. Like, don't see a therapist.

Where did I go along to, Craig? Somewhere I took a really wrong turn with you. No, but. Go ahead, Randy. I was going to say, so here's a question. Like, they do introduce some of the boyfriends, right? In the husbands, if you will. I think there's Eddie and there's Travis and Ryan.

But do they play a semi-big part in any of these shows, or is it all about the gal? Yeah, good question. So on OC, sometimes, I would say OC has like a bigger house husband presence than other shows. I'd say it's about like kind of average for their engagement. The episode that we saw was mostly taking place on a cast trip. So we didn't see a lot of them. But on a show like Real Housewives of New Jersey, they play a huge part.

They're almost like close to being on par with the actual housewives. And then there are shows like Real Housewives of Atlanta where you have barely, you barely see them. Yeah, you hardly saw them at all. Yeah. Yeah. And then there's also shows like Real Housewives of New York where they pretty much don't have husbands. So they, you know, they are non-existent. There's no real housewives of Matlock, eh?

You can start that franchise up, Dale. Start recruiting. Yeah, I don't think so. Yeah. Yeah, interesting. So, Randy, what were your highlights from Orange County? Highlights? Hmm.

I don't know if I had any highlights. What was memorable? Observation. Well, you know what? It's funny. When they all went white water rafting, if you want to call it, that it all looked like they had $500 pair of sunglasses on. That's kind of stuck up with me right away. I got a kick out of the fact that they were showing the family jewels of the Kevin.

Kevin, is that his name? Yeah. I think it was like Kevonne or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. And even little idiosyncrasies, like there was one gal that, remember the water and ice was being poured from a picture and it triggered bad memories. Oh, yeah.

Whatever. Yeah, that was Heather again, I think. Was that Heather again? Yeah. Yeah. Again, I had a hard time. Oh, it's camera. Camera.

I had a hard time differentiating who was who. But having said that, I mean, if you watched it, I don't know, four or five different episodes, you'd probably pick up on all that. Yeah. Fairly easy or whatever. I didn't. Obviously, they're all very well off. I mean, some of them, there was one gal, if I'm not mistaken or do I have the wrong show. They were married.

One was married to an ex and a NBC. player and one was married to an ex-NFL player. So they're all doing really well for themselves, and I think a lot of them are their own entrepreneurs as it is, right? Yeah. Or I can't remember if I get the same show writer. No, I apologize. I was watching Atlanta today trying to go back over it again,

and that's what it was. You're hooked? No, I wasn't hooked. I wasn't be prepared. I thought, you know what? It was three days ago I watched it. I want to be prepared, so I went back and I watched it again. So, yeah.

All of Prince guests get up. Obviously. Yeah. Oh, no. Say it is so. So much for American pickers. Yeah. PVRing real house lives now.

Well, I did ask my girls, you know, to give me some cold notes on what, you know, if they've watched them. or whatever. And they said they haven't watched these two particular shows, but they watched the other housewives. Oh, yeah. What's the other? Beverly Hills, possibly. And one was New York, I think, yeah. Yeah. Well, I just, I went into the cottage here and Tom was sitting, he says, by the way, if you want, come in and watch, I think it's Miami. It's his real housewives of Miami was over. Oh, yeah. That's a, that's a great series. We, is it really? Yeah, we, we covered the, the very tail. end of this past season of Miami.

And it was fantastic. So how many different shows are there and how hard is it to keep, you know, up to date or, like, differentiate who's who in these particular shows? I would say if it's like following them. It's not. Yeah, exactly. And there's like six, six of them maybe? I think there's seven.

Let me count. there is Orange County, Atlanta, Miami, Salt Lake City, Beverly Hills, New York, New Jersey. I think I got them. Sandy, is that right? Yeah, that's seven. Oh, no, Dubai. Sorry, Dubai is the other than... Dubai.

Oh, geez. Taking it up to a whole new level. Well, okay, so Dubai is an interesting one because Dubai is like, that is considered an American Real Housewives franchise because it's on like Bravo, proper. But there's also like a whole bunch of international real housewives shows. Canada has had two real housewives shows. There was real housewives of Toronto, which was like trash. Don't watch it. And then there was Real Housewives of Vancouver, which came first, which was fantastic. Do go and watch it because it's amazing. But yeah, there's so many other countries that have their own

like variation on real housewives that there's a ton of, a ton of international franchises. But Dubai is like a, you know, a proper Bravo real housewife show. My God. There must be money in that one. Oh, yeah. Big time.

The only other, like, memorable things from Orange County was sitting back. And when they, half of them went whitewater rafting with Kevin with his package hanging out. Yeah. And the other group went with fly fishing. And I remember thinking to myself, this guy that's trying to teach them how to fly fishing, it's probably thinking to myself, they're not paying me near enough. They were so pathetic and they're falling in the water and they're getting water in their, hip waiters

hip waiters and all that oh my God get them the hell out of there it's funny there was like a lot of fishing content on Bravo this week because there is a spin-off of Real Housewives of New York called Luann and Sonia welcome to

Crappy Lake and they go fishing in one of the episodes that aired and it was similarly fish out of water experience but yeah no that scene with like where Butch takes the girls fishing

I thought was really entertaining as well Yeah And then lastly on that one And I had more takeaways I know we've been talking mainly about Orange County More takeaways from that one than I did from Atlanta Because I was just trying to still understand it

But was the other one with I think it was Emily's daughter, Annabel. Yeah. When they brought her into the thing, I'm thinking, this poor little girl,

I couldn't help but think about Jean Bonnet. Oh, Ramsey, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and how this girl is just going to have such a twisted view. She won't have a chance. No, well, I mean, I guess have a chance. I guess it all depends, but how grounded could that girl ever be?

But is she the one that had the attitude, too, the little girl? Yeah, she had an attitude. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I was going to say about that. Sorry. I think that's simply Emily having no storyline this season, and I don't have any interest in seeing the child do her fake modeling career.

I'm not too worried. I don't think it'll go away. Yeah, it was interesting to get that, like, forced upon us. I think, like, you said, this is not. very interesting to me as a viewer. And, you know, I feel like whenever we see Shane, who is Emily's partner on screen, he comes across as like such a dick and he's like so sarcastic. I feel like he's like one of these people that just it doesn't translate.

And I think that her daughter, Annabel, like has that exact same like sense of humor and delivery. So I feel like she's trying to be funny when she's coming across this way. and it runs kind of in the family that it doesn't, it doesn't land. It lands more like being an asshole. But yeah, that, that whole scene was really like a big nothing burger for me.

Sandy, I want to move on to your highlights. What were your, what were your highlights from Orange County? Yeah. So, totally random tiny one. Gina was making a lot of peanut butter sandwiches,

and I was just wondering what school is still allowing those anywhere, unless it was some sort of other product that was no nuts at all. Anyway, I think that I was interested in the Heather saga with Gina, and I was interested in your take on that, Craig, too, because last week we were talking about Heather being strategic and trying to get in with Gina by giving her this advice and giving her shoulder to cry on. And then we see that kind of not panning out for Heather in this episode because Gina is really, really upset and feels like she hasn't, Heather hasn't followed through with any support after she told her she could not speak to her partner about these issues she was having. and then of course Heather also was playing the side of feeling really left out of Tamara and Shannon getting their friendship back together as if she had always had a really good relationship with

both Tamara and Shannon when that is a total rewrite of history because she treated Shannon like a pariah for the early years of this season she called her crazy needing to go to a mental home kicked her out of her house etc etc so that's kind of interesting too so I'd also like your take on on those little things that Heather's trying to do. Yeah, while I was watching, I was like, did I give Heather too much credit last week? Because yeah, I was like, oh, she's being really strategic here when she's trying to align herself with Gina and kind of getting in. I still do think that, you know, she was trying to think strategically, but she was so messy this episode. She was like very unclean in her execution of anything that she was like doing or trying to do.

And it was really confusing. It was almost like watching like a kamikaze pilot go and like just really burn everything down because that scene that, um, uh, dad, Randy brought up where they're doing the peach in the pit. Like there's no reason for her to do this. does not track at all with, you know, the approach that she was having. And I was really struggling to figure out, like, what was going on here. And I think that this is one of those things where you see someone's, like, humanity come through. I think she was actually, like, feeling genuinely left out a little bit. And that is totally what motivated her to bring this up.

I thought it was really, I thought it was really funny when she, like, isolated, like, feeling left out, you know, 45 minutes earlier when Tamara and Shannon and her were in the same room, like, getting glammed up. Like, that was her, her pit when she had that big blowout with Taylor. Like, and I think that Tamara and Shannon were right to kind of call her out. And, you know, I think that, you know, even if you're thinking about things from a emotional point of view, they were right to call that out, but from a strategic point of view,

to really like undercut any sort of leverage that Heather could try to cultivate from using that information or that like circumstance as being a, you know, a situation where she was done wrong by socially in order to like be able to cash that in in the future

being like, oh yeah, well Shannon, you know, you and Tamara, left me out of this situation. So, you know, to prove your loyalty, you should, you know, do this. That's kind of like the subtext of how you might use that information. Strategically, you wouldn't come out and say that in those words, but those are the types of conversations that you would have. And that's how you would kind of use that as a housewife. But I think that Tamara and Shannon, just like immediately calling that out and being like, no, that's, that's bullshit. Like, we let you in. We were like, we were fine. Why are you bringing this up when you had this big fight with

Taylor where you told her to fuck off? Like, how is us like somehow excluding you when we actually didn't? How is that your pit? I think that they were right to turn that on its head. And I think it was like, I think we're watching the drowning of Heather DeBrow. I think we're seeing her like having completely misplayed this season. This is the repercussions of last week when we see her kind of turn Gina in as being like a

shitster when she really wasn't. She was trying to like build a relationship. I think we're just seeing her misreads catch up with her and her really drowning socially in this.

But yeah, I could be like wrong on that, Sandy. what were your takes on that? No, I think that makes sense. It was a bit, it was pretty chaotic, like you said, and it seems like she's, I think drowning is the right, the right word,

because it seems like she was just kind of grasping at whatever she might be able to grab onto as she, she sunk in the river with her hip waiters kind of thing. So, yeah, so we'll see. But we know she doesn't come back. So it's interesting to watch with that knowledge. Yeah, is that confirmed? I do have a question then.

Just listening to what you both are saying. You're talking about Heather being strategizing, manipulative. Just curious, like, this isn't like Survivor where they sort of, you know, opt to not bring back certain people, do they? Or? It's not, like, explicitly like Survivor. So we're going to see them for the rest of the season. But, you know, in the meta, like, The strong characters are basically weeded out, but not the stronger, the weaker ones?

Yeah, the ones that aren't able to really, like, contribute in some way. So, like, there's not, like, a hard and fast criteria for whether you're going to come back or not. It's really just, like, are you going to, like, contribute to it being good TV, meaning are you, you well liked? Are you like able to, um, are you able to like carry some weight within the show? Um, so there's not like this process of being voted out. It is ultimately up to production. But I mean, there is kind of this like, um, meta game that that happens. There's, you know, um, you do are, you are trying to secure a spot for next season. You are trying to like bring bring something to the table.

And so that's like a very valid, like, gamey situation that happens. So this show has been on Orange County 17 seasons. Yeah. So 17 years. So the cast of characters within this mix has to have completely turned over maybe two,

three, four times over that course of time. Oh, yeah. I would suspect, right? Yeah. So they would have to It's evolved like a ton Tamara who's returning this this season is like I think she was introduced in like season three

Of Real Housewives of Orange County So she is like one of the longest standing housewives But she had like a couple seasons Where she was put on put on a break But yeah There's usually a new housewife every season On these shows There's like usually

But do they mix them in with the same group? Yeah. They always mix them in with the same. There wouldn't be any history then. Yeah. There's a, like a, well, yeah, so there's a degree of history because there's always like this existing social situation,

unless it's like a brand new show. So, but like they're often almost exclusively, like introduced as being, having some sort of social connection to someone. Sometimes they'll just introduce them raw, but they'll try to find some sort of meaningful connection. Like they'll put them in the same yoga class or something like that. They'll give them like some sort of foothold.

And, you know, this is like you said, it's like one of the ways that we can see that this is constructed. But once they get in there, they're kind of on their own to like go forward and try to. to use this, you know, this handle that they have to try to navigate the situation. And we see people like handle it in a variety of different ways. I think on Orange County, we're seeing it be just, we're seeing an example of a brand new

host wife just like really struggling with the whole thing. And actually, one of the questions that I had written down for you guys was if you could potentially identify who was the new housewife this season on real housewives of Orange County who seemed the least experienced not a clue I wouldn't have a clue let me think about this Tamara I wrote down the Tamara reconnected with Shannon so that tells me that she's been on there for a little while um Emily well Emily well Emily well Emily wasn't really on there that much. She was kind of away from the situation, if you will.

And I think Shannon's been there for a while. So I'm going to go Gina. Oh, interesting choice. Dad, who's your guess? As I say, not a clue. I don't take anything from there that I would suggest to me that the one's a newcomer. Okay. I couldn't even venture a guess.

The answer is Jen. Jen is the new housewife this season and I don't know as someone who has watched a lot of hours of this like a lot a lot of hours of real housewives. It's very clear that she's a new hostwife. I think that she's really really struggling and this is actually one of the worst first like season efforts that I can think of for a housewife. Why? Well, okay, so we talked about this last week. I won't like go over too much ground, but she's making like the weakest choices. She is like really just curling up in a ball for like any time that she is confronted and like always like always on the defensive.

she's not seeing any way to use any situation strategically socially she's just I don't know it's just a really it's just a really bad like strategic playing of the host wife games which on its own that's that's fine you can bring other things to the table than being good at being a hostwife and being able to like manipulate situations and handle information and like play the game and being like there's there's ways that you can be a great housewife and like be not smart like but she's also just boring like she's not interesting in any way uh sandy what are your thoughts yeah i totally agree as we discussed last week and i was interested on the preview for next week. It's looking pretty interesting.

And Tamara throws a napkin in Jen's face. And it's almost like, you know, if you're, if you're an improv or in sports, and you're passing someone the ball, you're trying to go, yes, and. And she just sits there and she's stunned. And she kind of whispers, what are you doing? Why are you doing this?

And I'm like, because you're on reality TV, ma'am. Can you please join, like, join in? So she's getting handed these. moments where she could make things interesting and she just seems to not ever be able to do it. Yeah, totally. She's in all of these situations where it's like, do something with this. You are being given so much. And also, I think like, because of how she has been playing things, and I said this last time, like, if you're in sports, you know, or if you watch sports, you know that anyone that is playing a very offensive game in order to do that, you need to expose certain.

defensive weaknesses. And the same thing is true about Housewives. If you're going to play a very offensive real Housewives game, you are going to expose yourself to various, like, defensive weaknesses. And Jen is like not capitalizing on these moments where these girls are making them vulnerable to like her potentially using this information in these situations socially. And it is so frustrating to watch. It is. like just watching like the worst sports team. It's like watching the worst football team. The Cleveland Browns?

Like the Cleveland Browns? Yeah, the problem. But the thing is with like the Cleveland Browns or like the bombers when they were terrible or like the Blue Jays when they were terrible, all these like teams that I have watched, they'd give you glimmers of hope. And at the very least they would show like they would show you moments that were somewhat inspiring and like you could kind of root for them but like Jen is not doing that she's

not giving any of that and it's like why why are you here if you're just if I'm just going to watch you fumble all all day like I I I am so over her I'm curious what comes the rest of the season and it's really lucky that I think that we're otherwise getting a lot of really interesting gameplay because gameplay is a big part of what I like about real host so I was watching this dynamic and I think that we're seeing some really interesting dynamic shifts

especially with how Heather's playing and the reintroduction of Tamara and I think Gina is doing really interesting things this season I think all of that is like giving a really like interesting like flavor to the season oh and Taylor as a friend of, I think is doing really interesting things.

So, I mean, I think that those women are really carrying this season. And it's at least interesting to watch. But having someone like Jenon, that's not what Orange County needs at all, in my opinion. So is there a Susan Lucci of this group that's been there forever, like a constant through all this? Like, do you know who Susan Lucci was? No, no, enlighten us. Days of Our Lives, Soap Opera. She was kind of on there 25 years or something like that,

and she played the same character, which was kind of unheard of in terms of longevity on a show. And I think her claim to fame also was whatever the soap opera digest Emmys are, whatever you would call. Daytime Emmy. She was nominated for best actress like 22 years in a row and never won. Oh, okay.

Is that her character name? Because I was looking at this up for some reason. Erica Kane was her. That's right. Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, Susan Lucy was legendary in that genre of television. So we're thinking about 17 seasons

that this has been on and there would be massed a lot of turnover. Is there been somebody that's been there right from the start that's been the glue? So I would say like Tamara is

the oldest housewife on here. I think we're going to see in a couple weeks we're going to see Vicki Gunvelson return who is like the OG.

That's like she has been on there since season one Orange County, which is the oldest franchise. And like, you know, she's, she's been a star. She should never have been. That's the oldest one? Vicki Gunnelson, yeah.

We didn't see her on this episode. She's not a full-time hostwife on this. And we haven't seen her a couple years. Lawrence County is the oldest one that's been of the, all the league. Okay. Um, yeah. And so I, I would say like maybe her. Um, you know, no housewife has won.

Emmy, but they probably should have. But yeah, I would guess that Vicky is probably the kind of analog that you would look for. But there's a lot of iconic housewives. Like Teresa Judeyce, I think, is someone that is, you know, immediately identifiable. If you think of a housewife, she probably comes to mind as number one or number two. So there's probably lots of people that could, you know, fit that criteria. So then with Sandy and with Craig then, because you follow this and you're, you know, obviously really like it, would you have gone back and watched from season one and watched every episode? No, I haven't.

but I would like to, but I, you know, I have not yet had that wealth of time to do that. Why is that great? Yeah, parenting is hard, but also, like, keeping up with the, like, current. Like, there's a lot of shows that come out on Bravo that are, you know, like, staying up to date with all this stuff. and you know, I think one thing that is kind of underrated about the like, um, like following this is kind of engaging in the like the meta conversation and like experiencing it in in real time with everyone else. There's so much that happens that isn't captured in these episodes that like is is kind of fun

like watching these conversations happen about how like people are playing the game and, you know, um, it's, It's interesting. So there was this scandal. I don't know. Have you have, have either of you guys heard of Scandibal, Dad or Randy? No. Okay. So have you heard of the show Vanderpump Rules? Yeah. I heard of it. No idea what it's about. Okay. So it's a show on Bravo. It's actually a spinoff of Real House of Beverly Hills. Fantastic show. One of the best shows ever on television. But anyway, so there was this character that's been on there since the beginning. it's in season 10 that just finished airing and he like cheated on his partner of six years or nine years or I don't know what how long they were together but um it was this big scandal and it uh erupted on social media as the season was airing um I saw a clip where people were talking about this and

and they were saying how usually when you're watching Bravo and engaging in these conversations, the fans are divided. There's like people on both sides and there's never this aligned perspective. And the difference with Scandival is that you have everyone on this one side and everyone is seeing the same like point of view. And I, the way that they were talking about. talking about this made it seem like that was like a fun thing. Like that added like something to the experience.

But I personally feel like that took away from the experience because I think when you're engaging in these conversations like that creates a dialogue where you have to, in order to engage in a meaningful way, you need to put yourself in someone else's shoes and like try to see their perspective. like even if you're not just trying to like emphasize empathize with them but if you're trying to like completely destroy their point of view you need to do that if you want to do that effectively like if you want to like if you want to tell someone why they're wrong you need to like see where they're coming from in order to completely deconstructed and decimate that that point of view

and so having that um like having to go through the process of like putting yourself in someone's shoes and having like people coming from like different perspectives. I think that's one of the things that really adds nuance to the experience of being a fan of real housewives or Vanderpump rules or these types of reality shows because it's not so black and white because these characters are actual people that have like motivations that you have to rationalize and like try to understand. That's not something that you get. with a character that's written in order to forward a plot or in order to like empathize a theme it's it's just it's so much more nuanced so daily you had a question but

I have one after you well I just I don't want to turn the tables on you're asking the questions of us of our observations no go go forth yeah the curiosity I have is what do these people make like you know what they earn as being characters on these shows or how is this lucrative? I would suspect it is, but. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think like, I think I remember reading a few years ago where the highest paid

housewife was like a million dollars or it was like between one and two million dollars is what the highest paid housewife was per season. So like, yeah, that's, you know. that's good money. I think like, um, both of the housewives are making less than that. But,

you know, that's, that's really good money. Yeah. I was just curiosity. Go ahead, Randy. Well,

um, you, you were talking about Scandibald and, uh, there was a, one of the guys who cheated, right? They would marry for six years or whatever.

Um, now, how do I say this? Is this part of the show or real life or are they one in the same? Yeah, it's one and the same. So we saw this all come to light after the season had wrapped. Like they stopped filming and they, the show was airing. It was like episode four.

I think it was like right before episode four of the season had aired when this all broke and and it all came to light. And so that immediately changed how people were viewing this, this show. Like people started viewing this as a like, they were looking for clues. They were reading into this like storyline that, you know, hadn't been, um, hadn't necessarily been like captured in. in the initial edit of things. I mean, I guess that's debatable,

but, you know, it immediately just changed how people were watching it because they knew that there was this bombshell that, like, had, that was brewing underneath it all. And production, like, spun back up in order to catch, like, the fallout because they'd already stopped rolling. And they won't, so they, wanted to like start back up again and like catch what was happening so we got an extra episode at the end where they like caught the fallout of this and then all these shows have reunions where

everyone like gets together after things have wrapped and they like you know air out all their grievances after the uh after the show has aired so um the last like the last episode that wasn't a reunion was really interesting because we were catching. It was very raw. I think like if you watch like Real Housewives or Vanderbump rules just from like a production perspective, there's a lot more, the setups of production are a lot more elaborate. Like there's better like lighting and camera angles and stuff like that. But with the last episode of Vanderpump Rules, it was very very,

very run and gun. It was like single setup on a single camera, someone handheld, like trying to capture things in a room that was not like well lit. It was very, very raw, very emotional, very effective. And Vanderpump Rules has actually been nominated for its first two Emmys this season because it was fantastic. It deserves both of them. But anyways, so it was like a very,

raw experience watching those. Do either of you guys have any final thoughts on real house size of Orange County before we move on to Atlanta? Sorry, go ahead. I was just going to say, I know a girl who would fit in perfectly with them, but other than that, no.

Okay, now you got my curiosity, but I'll save that for another time. Okay. Okay, I'm going to isolate this as a reel on Instagram. If you're watching this on Instagram, tag whoever you think would fit in perfectly on Real House, Oz, or County. Oh, man. Okay, let's move on. Oh, no, go ahead.

Sorry. I said the only other line that I picked up from that thing that I don't know which one of them said, but they were in the midst of some crisis going on. and somebody said, what would Montana Barbie do? What would Montana Barbie do? I thought that was kind of cute. Oh, actually, I did have another note on Real Jose of Orange County. One thing that I thought was particularly notable was it was very early on in the episode

where Heather, of all people, pulls out a joint and they all. decide to like get high and we get that little like montage or whatever and she's like if if you've watched housewives she's kind of like the last person she's very like up uptight um but she's like oh yeah I only occasionally smoke weed and then we get this like flashback to her at a dispensary buying this week she spends five hundred dollars on which like I have smoked a lot of weed in my life. I've never like spent $500 and like one go buying weed. And so I really don't understand where this, where's the rest of the weed, Heather? Okay, that's all I had for my scroll notes on that. Um, Real hostways of, uh, Atlanta. Um, dad, when you message me after

watching this episode. I had not yet watched it. And you're like, I did not pick up on anything meaningful. I did not like, uh, I did not find anything interesting. I was like, oh my God, how like, how awful is this episode of the podcast going to be if he's not open to this? And then I watched the episode and I was like, oh my God, my dad was right. There's like nothing going on in this episode. It was like, um, very. empty and yeah, I also did not have a lot

to comment on probably a little bit more than you did just because I think there was a scene with the OGs of Real Housewives of Orange County that needs to be commented on but overall, you're right.

This episode was really vacant. Dad, Randy, I'm curious what you thought about this episode in contrast with Real House of of Orange County. Oh, boy. I have to admit, I watched it a couple of days ago. I rewatch it

this afternoon just to see what I would pick up on that sort of thing, right? You're a keener. There was two sets of friends, I think, for Shiree. Is that it? Because she, there was the candy and the Drew Marto, Kenya, Shiree, and Sanya. And then they went out for dinner and there was Lisa Deshaun and Kim. So there seemed to be, she seemed to be, she seemed to have two different sets of friends, and these sets of friends didn't get along with the original sets of friends, because I did go back and I see that there was a battle between two of them. They sued them. One girl sued another girl over a song title of some sort.

Do you remember that? Yeah. Okay. So that scene, that dinner scene that we saw was the one that I think needs to be commented on because that was a dinner scene of like oh geez of real housewives of orange county so those are from like the original season of real housewives of orange county so there's like a lot of history and we haven't seen most of them in many many years so they were all like brought on for this dinner scene together and i felt that deshaun just kind of sat there and didn't say

anything at all. She seemed to be quite uncomfortable sitting at the table and even she was, when they would do cheers or whatever, she was like a minute behind, that sort of thing. Yeah, she was on

a delay. I can relate. No, go ahead. First note, like I was, when they started that one out, they had at least listed the names of the characters first. So that I kind of scrambled to write down who was who.

Incredibly difficult time trying to determine who was who after that because you don't know the characters. But Sania? Sania, yeah. I think it was San. She was the one that was kind of the spearheading this auction thing for Mummy Nation for a fundraiser

that was the mover and shaker on it and relying upon Kenya to do the auction. who was kind of a little flighty and was, and I guess that's where the title came from was better late than ugly, because she showed up just at the last minute to do the auctioneering. So I figured, okay,

that must have been where, where that episode title came from. But I, seriously, and again, you mentioned my note to it afterwards. How am I going to offer anything of any substance on that show? Because that's about the extent that I took away from that one. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's why I saved this for last.

I feel like there's not a lot to really talk about, especially for anyone that has not been following these shows. Randy, what were your thoughts on this cast? You know what? Again, to Dale's point, I mean, every time they went to a different character, I try to remember, okay, I'd go to my notes and look at them or whatever, but then they would do a still photo and they would go and they would interview this person one-on-one and I didn't have a clue who they were talking about.

I thought it was interesting. Like they showed a couple of things that they were going to do a trip to Portugal and one of the girls says, well, I've never actually been to Spain. Yeah. That was pretty funny. But I kind of like the music. Yeah, exactly. There was another one where I can't remember who it was,

but it might have been Saniam, possibly, or whatever, but the pressure is getting worse, sir. And I just thought that was also interesting. And I thought, well, if, in fact, it was scripted, then they probably would have cut and rerun it or rerun it or whatever. But, you know, again, I watched it. Would I watch it again?

Yeah, possibly. Just to maybe find out who's who in the zoo. but it would take so many episodes to figure out who's doing what and that sort of thing. Now, is this the one I might have watched? I did. I watched the previous episode also just to find out what exactly was going on previously. And so I guess they just, yeah, I'm not really sure what to say here. A lot of it towards the end had to do with the auction that I guess Shire was putting on or whatever.

And just the amount of money that the ladies were bidding, I mean, obviously going to a good cause in that. But did they actually have that money, possibly? I mean, they seem to be pretty, they're all self-employed. They seem to have quite a bit of money there. But, yeah, they raised $78,000. and it went to a good cause, like I said, but that's a lot of money. I mean, one of the gals gave about $10,000 that night. So, yeah, that was interesting.

I didn't take away a whole lot, actually, no. The only other segment of that that I thought was mildly interesting, it was Drew and her sister going back and forth. And I think the mother was sitting on the couch. as well about, you know, I don't even remember what the aspect of it was, but they were kind of bearing their soul on something

like that. And yeah. But her sister, I just remember, like I didn't copy it all down, but all the different jobs that she's done was amazing. Yeah, yeah. But that's it. Like I have about a half a page of stuff on that one

and I got about a page and a half on these on the Orange County one that I thought was more of a fun watch than Atlanta was. I would absolutely agree. I'm ready to pronounce Real Housewives of Atlanta in its current format, dead right here. I was really disappointed in this. I think it's like really been a disappointing season. Yeah, we got this season.

We got this scene. Actually, you know what, Sandy, I wanted to give you a chance to give you your highlights from this episode before I completely like write it off. Okay, it's my chance to go to bat for this show, I guess. Well, not particularly. really generally agree, but I don't know. I really enjoyed the dinner with Kim and the other former past members. I don't, I haven't watched Atlanta before this season, but it actually makes me want to go back and watch for Kim

because she seems to really bring a lot. So that was fun. There was that apparition of her husband, Croix, above her head when she was talking about him, which was just special. And of course, her going on about her marriage doing great. She's now divorcing him and it's like a nasty divorce. So always nice.

And then Randy, I have to disagree with you on 78,000 being a lot of money. And that is because a few episodes ago, Sonia spent $100,000 on the birthday party for her husband. So she could just skip one birthday or skip this entire gal that probably cost that much and probably donate more. or obviously we're looking for content, so it's a little rich to criticize that. But I see this happening in real life all the time. I've been invited to gala's through work, and I'm like,

how about just don't have that and donate the money? So that's kind of funny. I also enjoyed Kenya being super late to that. I always love those kind of things. And she did a great job in the end, but I really like those, like, are they going to ruin this event kind of storyline? So I like that.

And I liked when when Sanya called Kenya to ask where she was. She's like, oh, just emergency all day. And Sania said, oh, what happened? And she's like, and then just totally changes the subject. So I thought that was pretty fun. So I don't know, a few little pieces that I liked. About the leading arrangements, yeah. Yeah, I think, like, Kenya is a fantastic house life.

Like, I would put it up there with, like, one of the great. I'm a bit disappointed in her this season because I feel like, you know, she's very much just riding on like she's taking a season off. She's just like co-sing. That's not what this franchise needs. It really feels like it's on life support. And I actually feel like you can feel like the CPR compressions on this show when we see that dinner of the OGs. like we see you know uh we see kim and all them getting together and you've got this dinner that is so out of context and very um it was the most interesting thing that happened in this episode that's

really not saying very much it did feel out of out of character and really like trying to inject something into this season and that that scene as much as it was the highlight for me from this episode. You know, that was what makes me want to pronounce this show dead. It needs a reboot like Real Housewives of New York. And I

feel a little reluctant saying that just because I think that currently there are some like of the best on-air housewives that we have are, they're currently part of this cast. I think Kenya is one of the best housewives we've ever had and continues to be. But the fact that she's kind of taking the season off and not doing anything, that's not helping.

I think Candy is one of the best housewives that we've ever had. And she's really like taking a backseat. And, you know, even the fact that we've got Marlowe, who has been the best, like, friend of a housewife, forget like be a full-blown housewife for a second season and you know she's like bringing something to the table kind of but it's still uh i don't know not like not anything super interesting i don't know there's nothing that is really driving me to continue watching real houseways of Atlanta so um i don't know i was excited to see kim zolsiac come back on for you know a walk on appearance, but that was really the only thing that was interesting about this. We got that

constructed storyline about, you know, Kenya holding things up. That's, you know, I think that was Kenya, you know, helping this episode in, to a certain degree. But yeah, there's, there's nothing really going on here. Well, I feel somewhat vindicated, Craig. That's helpful because I thought it was just me. Yeah, no. And like, yeah, I also feel let down by the Real House Icemanina because we've got you guys on here. I wanted to put in front of you an episode that has some substance. But instead, you know, they laid a goose egg here and it was very disappointing.

Okay, let's talk about Ted Lassau now. We'll save that for the... the Ted Lassen Outsider podcast. Okay. I could go for days on that. All right. Well, thank you guys so much for doing this.

This has been so much fun. I am curious. Like, I don't expect you guys to be, like, tuning in week after week for households. But did you gain any sort of insight or did, like, this surprise you in any way? Do you think there's more to, housewives than you initially thought going into this experience?

I'm going to say no only because I think I've seen it on like in the background when I've been coming through the living room, that sort of thing, right? And I've stopped and caught snippets of it here and there. So I've kind of seen it and I guess I've heard you talk about it quite often, Craig. So it doesn't surprise me. not something that I'm interested in, but you know what? Just not all about me either. Yeah.

No, I appreciate the honesty. Apparently it wasn't in your tagline. Your tagline was it's all about you, wasn't it? That's right. Yeah, that's right. I forgot about that. Enough about me. Enough about me.

What do you think of me? Tell me what you think about me. Yeah, no, I'm the same boat. It's not something I would ever make a regular habit of tuning in. I don't know. I find it so foreign in terms of their situations and the wealth and just all the other stuff that they make seemingly crises out of that is just hard for me to kind of understand.

For somebody that's really struggling, I think it would really be hard to relate to. So, and I mean, I know, I know the relationships and that and interactions between people are really always interesting to watch. And I get that. And you can certainly see it within it. But it didn't give me an appetite for becoming a regular viewer. Yeah, no, I don't expect you guys to, like, become regular viewers. But, like, do you relate to everyone that, you? you watch on television or is that like the number one criteria for you know something that

you find value in on television to some extent yeah i do i do have to have some kind of a of i don't know visceral connection is probably not the right word but some kind of of a connection where you know you can see aspects of your life or your situation within certain things within certain situations or storylines possibly? But that's me. Everybody's different, right? Yeah, yeah, for sure. But what about something that is like, you know,

like far removed from your current, like context? Like if you, I mean, I don't think either of you guys really watch science fiction or fantasy to a great degree. But like if you think about like police procedural, something that is like highly structured, where, you know, you're seeing dynamics at play that are not something that you enter into on a day-to-day life. What, like, what motivates you to watch those? And, you know, what, you know, did you see any dynamics within housewives that could potentially motivate someone to be interested in it?

despite not necessarily having a relationship, like a direct relation with the characters that they're seeing on screen? Personally, no, no. I mean, it's funny because as you were talking there, your initial or opening question to us was about what reality TV do you watch and that? And I guess it tied me back to this closing part of, and Randy, you'll relate to this because I get sucked in by border security when you watch these shows on people coming across at airports and that your life was at the airport and you worked in the security field and that and then with ASE's job at airport the stuff that goes on every day at airports all over the world right it's just fascinating to see how what people try to get away with how stupid they are in certain case and we only see a slice of it

but those those type of things are really to me something and again it goes back to the point I made before but you kind of have some connection with it because your your life in some way shape or form revolved around that so I don't know that I'm going off on a different track but that's it just came to mind as you were talking about it which doesn't really answer your question so my point going back to it is it's not something that after watching two episodes I would get drawn into or be tempted to even watch more of this because I don't really, I can't relate.

So, I mean, like, I understand that, like, you love Ted Lassu, and that is mostly informed by your experience managing a soccer club in England. What about the other shows that you watch? Well, I don't really watch. Well, we said, like, there's not a lot of other shows that I do watch regularly. absolutely detest real house or not real house big bang theory i just can't gut that one you know i go back to cheers and some of the old series and Seinfeld yeah yeah yeah yeah

Seinfeld yeah signfield yeah friend there's certain tv shows when you're when you're surfing and you come across you just get drawn in like diners drive-ins and dives that sort of thing whatever you're kind of into at the time or whatever. I don't normally get sucked into the dramas, if you will. You could go on about movies. That's a little bit different or whatever. But there's certain shows that, yeah, you look forward to watching. Again, I'm an American Pickers fan.

Even though it bothers me that it is staged at one time, it's almost like finding that Santa Claus isn't real, really. when I found out that Mike and Frank were going there the previous day and they were making all these deals and everything was set up in advance. It kind of ruined it for me or whatever. I still watch it a little bit. But yeah, again, to your point, Dale, I probably wouldn't watch these two particular shows. But, yeah, it's just. it's all different strokes or different folks

Yeah, yeah, for sure Yeah, absolutely Well, thank you guys so much for doing this This has been a lot of fun I enjoyed that Yeah, yeah, thank you I want to ask Is there anything that you guys want to promote

Plug? Randy, we'll start with you Oh, boy, that was quick Promote or plug Yeah, where can people find you? We'll build your online You know what? Wildwood golf course on Wednesdays and Friday. It's a pro shop.

Yes. I'd like to, well, no, I'll let you plug yourself, Dale. But, um, yeah, fixed income playing, uh, White World Emporium, beautiful Matlock, Manitoba this Friday, be there. Awesome. Which means nothing to anybody. If you are in Winnipeg, check out, Randy at the pro shop at Wildwood Golf Club.

And check out my dad at Whitewold Emporium. His band Fix Income is playing regularly. What's the next date, Dad? Tomorrow. We're playing tomorrow, which is the, what is it, the 14th? Tomorrow? Something like that. Well, the 14th.

That's when the next episode is coming out. So tonight. Ah, today. Get your ticket. Yeah. And go to Whitewold. If you're in Winnipeg, which most of our, listeners aren't, but if you are, check them out.

For sure. Again, thank you guys. Thank you guys so much for doing this. Sandy, do you want to let everyone know where they can find you? Sure. I am at Corporial Curios on Instagram or just search my name. Awesome. That has been Bravo Outsider for this week. Sandy, thank you for filling in for Dylan. I believe he's going to be back starting next week, but this has been a lot of fun. have you on again in the future to, you know, indoctrinate our outsiders. We're also going to be changing up our release schedule and releasing episodes on Mondays, starting next week.

Sunday night will actually be live streaming the night of the Real Housewives of New York reboot premiere. So subscribe to us on YouTube and check that out. We'll be going live before and then doing our episode recording afterwards. if you want to see us kind of fumble along. Check it out. You can find us on Instagram, threads,

Twitter, Spotify, TikTok, wherever you listen to podcasts. We're Bravo Outsider at Bravo Outsider. Bravo Outsider.com. Until next week, keep on house wiping.