Oscars Outsider - Click Them Keys And Google Me w/ Rusty Robot (#RHOA S15E08, #RHOC S17E04)

Episode Date: June 30, 2023

In this episode of the Bravo Outsider Podcast, host Craig Midwinter and guest host Sandy Klowak are joined by Outsider Rusty Robot to chat about the latest episodes from Real Housewives of Atlanta, Real Housewives of Orange County and Kim Zolciak's hit "Google Me"   Find Rusty Robot on Instagram at: https://www.instagram.com/rustyrobot_101001  [https://www.instagram.com/rustyrobot_101001] Find Sandy Klowak on Instagram at https://www.instagram.com/corporealcurios   [https://www.instagram.com/corporealcurios] https://www.bravooutsider.com   [https://www.bravooutsider.com]   Music by FASSounds from Pixabay

Hello and welcome to the Bravo Outsider podcast. I'm your host Craig Midwinter. Dylan is away the next couple weeks, but filling in for him is a very good friend of mine. I've subjected her to my terrible takes in my Bravo group chat, and now I'm going to do it on the podcast. It's Sandy Cloac. Sandy, welcome. Want to introduce yourself to the listeners? Sure. Thanks.

Great to be here. I'm very excited to chat about Bravo. It's a passion of mine. and obviously we do a lot of that offline, so excited for our chat today. Yeah, absolutely. Each week we bring on an outsider who doesn't follow Bravo in order to get their takes on the episode. And this week, joining us is the one and only Rusty Robot. Oh, hello.

Oh, I'm going to do my tagline now. Okay. Yeah. I got to find it because I wrote it down. Well, I think I kind of remember it actually. Oh, yeah, I remember what it is. They say it takes a village. Well, I put the eye and team.

Talk, you come up with. Love it. That's pretty good. That does, like, definitely fit with, like, the tagline vibe that we've seen. Thank you. Were you inspired by any particular Housewives taglines when you were doing your research? Yeah. I definitely was, well, we thought of the, I say we, because we

I watched all these episodes with my wife, but we thought of the, uh, I put the eye in team is very, like, on brand for the, uh, the people in these episodes. Um, but then they all have like the, you think this is the setup? Well, this is the punchline. So we had a lead up as well. And the ones I really liked were like, uh, well, the ones I heard most, I guess, but, uh, like she by Sherey more like she broke the internet. Some of them are so funny and don't make any sense. Yeah, for sure. Anyway, they're great. They're great. Some of them just suck in our time of year. Yeah, it's true. There's always like a few duds.

I like for taco. I think that's Emily. Yeah. So normally when we have like just two episodes to cover, we like to do a round table discussion at the beginning of the show about some sort of theme relating to reality TV. But I have been waiting for the right moment to dive into some Bravo music. And I figured having a musician on is,

the perfect time to do that. So I gave you three songs to choose from. Coffee in Love by Ashley Darby. I do whatever I want by the O.C. Reels and Google Me by Kim Zolsiac. And you selected one. What was your selection criteria? And let us know what you picked. I selected Google me by Kim Zolsiac. Very good choice. It was hard to choose because they're all like fascinating. And they're, they're well done. They are well done. You can, hear that they weren't like they don't have like a past long music career. Yeah. Experience.

But it's really fascinating to see how hard they try and what they're trying to do with it and the kind of music they're trying to make and what they're and how that's forced out into the world. Yeah. Google me is great. I loved Google me. It reminded me of a bunch of things actually. Yeah.

This, you know, there's actually a pretty like broad variety. of songs and like ideas that are trying to be expressed in housewife music as far as I'm concerned. And some of it definitely leans towards a lot more like kitschy. And then there's hostwives on the other side of the spectrum that are really trying to like get something going and like do something serious. Like I'm thinking like Candace Dillard's latest effort is like she's trying to get something going. And we actually see on this season of Atlanta, Drew is trying to get something going. Um, that's right. Taking, taking it a little bit more, more seriously with like varying degrees of success.

But these three songs that I picked out were definitely on the like the kitchier side of the housewife spectrum. Um, so and I think Google me is maybe one of the all time goofiest Bravo songs that I've ever heard. And you know what? It's still like, it's still a bop. I think like I was, super memorable. So memorable. What were your highlights from this song? Well, right away, I thought like the music is really reminiscent of a few other songs.

I don't want to like, I'm not minimizing that like there's only a short percussion. But it really reminds me of, you don't mean nothing to me by Nellie Furtado. Like, it's kind of the same kind of song as that. Also, I love you to the moon and back by Savage Garden. If you sing those two songs while that song is playing, that's the same song. essentially. And those are great songs, and I love those songs. And then I also

looked into like, that's the second of three singles, I think she, like she has a song called Tarty to the party, Tarty for the party that came out before this with candy. So I think like this is like a is this like a retort song to

just, I actually don't know the context of this song. Like I was like exposed to it before or right as I got into Atlanta, which was after this was out for a number of years. And so I think having no context on this makes it that much more better. And I really couldn't find anything in the limited research that I did on this. Well, we found that Kim, oh, go ahead, sorry.

Yeah, no, I just like, I feel like Kim Zolciak is really always like pushing kind of her own personal lore out there. And the fact that this kind of stands alone and there's not other references. Like Tarty for the Party was reference again in the TV show that she had, like she spun off of Real Housewives of Atlanta. And that was a long running series. And so she's always kind of, you know, pushing her own personal lore of it. And the fact that this isn't ever reference in any of that really makes it stand on its own. Yeah, it's a hit.

I think it's totally, it sounds like a giant hit. on its own. I read that she thinks it's a like a rap song comparable to glamorous by Fergie, which I thought was, you know, that's a bold thing to review your own song like. And then that live version, you sent a link of that live version, it's just amazing.

But there's that host who introduces her on all these different live. Andy Cohen, yeah. Oh, is that? Yeah, he's like, I can't tell if he's like really, really excited or if he's mocking the situation or if he's being sincere. That's a great thing about it. He walks that line expertly

and that's why he's so good at his job. Yeah. Yeah. He is like for some context. He is like the godfather of Real Housewives and like Bravo in general. He he's like executive producer

on basically every one of these unstructured reality shows on Bravo. And he hosts a like a nightly late night show where he brings on celebrity guests and they sit on the couch, kind of like the, you know, the Letterman style, the Johnny Carson style, except a little bit more informal, but they always talk about like the events that are happening both on screen on the shows that are covered and also, you know, online or off camera and within the meta.

So it's kind of like if you want the pulse on what's going on in Bravo, you know, you tune in to watch what happens live or follow the updates and Andy Andy Cohen is everywhere. Oh, cool. So that's like a show that's like a, it's like a Bravo tell all that's like a late night talk show meets electric circus or something. That's kind of what it takes. Yeah, yeah, sort of. So he like, it's fairly uncommon that they will have like a live musical performance. They do it like from time to time. They'll be like you can find a performance of. like James Kennedy performed on Watch What Happens Live as well. And it does happen from time to time if like a housewife or another like Bravo celebrity has something out there that they want to push.

But for the most part, it is like fairly in line with the traditional late night TV format, but really focused on Bravo happenings. Cool. Sandy, what were your thoughts on Google Me? Well, I definitely appreciate it as a work of art. I think Rusty, you were very generous in your take on it. And I mean, it's, I almost have no words, but I was listening to the lyrics. And this is a new one for me.

I love all these songs that the hostwives come up with, but I think I only encountered this one in the last year. And it was quite a treasure. I was listening to some of the lyrics later in the song about she'll be, I'll be, difficult to replace. That's not, I'm paraphrasing. And all those other girls are fake Barbie. So I was wondering if it came when she was, when she left the show. I'm not as well versed in Atlanta as I am some of the other franchises, but I was wondering what the sort of drama was going on there. And also interested in like, who did write this and was it her? Yeah. No, we looked that up too. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He's written light nuts. Who was it? Angela Scott, who says written by Angela Scott on some credits we found somewhere.

Awesome. Oh, okay. Faceless genius, Angela Scott. Well, that's what makes, it's curious, too, because, like you mentioned, her first song, Tarty for the Party was, like, Candy. We saw on Atlanta, Candy helped her, like, write and produce this. And, like, Candy has, like, a huge, like, she's legit. She's got a Grammy. She's, like, she's a hitmaker.

So, you know, to have Google me kind of be the follow-up on that. I am very curious as to what Candy's thoughts are on that being side-by-side in the catalog. And from what I've learned about Candy just watching this season, it sounds like we probably do have her thoughts documented somewhere on this. She doesn't seem like that. We can probably find that pretty easily or see it in her face. What did you say, Sandy? Or see it in her face.

She's very expressed. I was just going to say, I can already see the look in her face when she hears it. I'm like, uh, excuse me. I love it. Yeah. One thing that I really, like, grew to love the song over listening to it on repeat over the past little bit in preparation for this was like just how overproduced it is. Like, just unnecessarily so, like, they're always sprinkling in that wind chime sound that is used like in a lot of like 90s. songs, but it's typically used

a lot more sparingly than it is in this song. They're finding every opportunity to put that in and also doing that that DJ move or it's like, research me, you'll find me. Yeah, yeah. I've remixed a song before where

I kind of like know exactly what they did there. They had to fill some space. So it's like, research me, you'll find me and you just need those extra beats, but you don't have the words or the takes. So you just cut it up and make it work. And then nobody can ever do it live, except you see her do it live. And they have just the backing tracks doing it. And then her

also doing it. And it's hilarious to me that, like, her live vocals makes the song worse. Like, just let the song play. It sounds better. I don't like mocking people's talent, though. So, like, I don't want to take that away from her. She's trying to do something with music. So it's not nice to mock her. But it does sound worse when she sings her on top of it. I think, like, the, you know, we appreciate all of the housewives work, you know, on a, they're working. And we, we are consuming it and we appreciate it. So it's that balance of, you know, commenting, honestly. And.

But really, like, we do appreciate it. We love it. We're here. We're fans. So I should speak for me and Craig, I guess. But, yeah, it's certainly bold. She went, here's one thing. She went bold with the lyrics.

the whole concept, the analysis of her own song, as you mentioned, Rusty. But she was not bold in that, in that performance. She was just curled up in the fetal position. That was kind of interesting to me. I don't, again, I don't, I really want to watch back episodes because I think she sounds like a pretty fun character, but I don't know too much about her, but is that, Craig, is that normal or, like, how did you take that? As someone who knows maybe her stuff better?

Yeah, there's like a little bit of, um, Um, she does come across very like timid in that, that performance. And I think that some of that is the result of just, you know, the situation, not being someone that performs on stage typically. And, you know, she is obviously a performer because all reality stars are. But like to be on stage on like a live show that doesn't have any like post production, uh, performing a song that is very like heavily. like has a lot of post production on it and doing that live you know yeah it's it's definitely like she's a bit a bit of a shell of herself in that live performance um and you really feel her nerves yeah and i think that that adds a lot to this like this video of this performance to me just

because like this song is such like a like a chest thumping like yeah you know research me you'll find me like I'm I'm I'm the boss and then to like just deliver it so meekly is it's so funny and you've got Andy Cohen like grooving and like grinning in the background so hard and smiled so huge and bright in the background she even she even mentions her Twitter followers amount which I love got to throw that yeah okay so I was like where is she getting this metric from like 22 million following me she does not have 22 million Twitter followers she has less than a million Twitter followers. So is she like,

would she like, combining like all platforms and just fudging it a little bit? I mean, and she's getting inviting us to Google it. So that's so bold. So bold. Yeah.

That's true. It worked. We did. We all Googled her. Another thing that I loved about the song was like, the use of auto tune in it really like hit with me. And I know that that was like, unintentional. Like it was definitely like it was used, uh,

for the original purpose that it was intended for of like correcting someone's pitch, but it was reminiscent of like, um, I read this like article from, like New York Times or something like that and it was about, uh, uh, the, the singer T-Pain and how he felt like he was misunderstood when he came out and was heavily using auto tune because he was like pushing to use,

this as an instrument for effect and like you know you play auto tune like an instrument as opposed to just using it to like correct your your vocals and like it was an effect that he was like specifically going to and people just like didn't get that and just like you know they they dragged them for it and there's also like I think it's like a tiny desk concert or something like that where you can see him performing acoustically and he's got a great voice he doesn't need to use autotune. So like I believe him when he's saying this. But it is very effective. And when you think back on like T-Bain's catalog, like it really stands out and there's like great hits and it's got like a certain effect. And you know, that I felt that in this Google Me track.

I felt like, you want to be like me. Like that the way that the auto tune like is use, it really reminds me of like the effect that T-Pain was going for even if it was unintentional. Oh, yeah. Unintentionally. I think that's so funny that that because, yeah, T-Pain won like the first season of the Masked Singer, I'm pretty sure. And it was like, for me, what made the mass singer like just like galvanized its place and like entertainment history because it was like it took this artist's career who has this

career that we all know and love and unmasked it for real. front of us that said, I also have this incredibly soulful voice that you will blow your mind. Like, he's a beautiful singer. Yeah. You would never think that with so much auto tune on his voice. So he can hit notes all he wants. But it's the fact that she's so far away from the note that the auto tune has to work so hard to pull it back into a note that it sounds like a non-human.

So it's just, it's kind of backwards how she got there, I suppose. But I love that. I think overall watching, as we've touched on definitely here, watching that balance between their sort of unusual confidence and is talking about all the Bravo. Let's say all the Bravo ladies who have chosen to do this, who can't sing on key, which are a fair handful. It's really interesting watching how they navigate that bravado

and like those moments of insecurity like we're seeing on this performance. I think of, you know, Luanne, she just always is confident, Never, never, never, never breaking. That's in Real Housewives of New York. And she's got several songs and she does a cabaret. And it's kind of, I think it's kind of attended ironically or like as fan. Like it's, you know, no one's going for her musical talent, but they are going for her performance and her persona. It's just, exactly.

And it's, and so she's very successful, but it's within that world of being a housewife. So it's super interesting to watch, especially for the ones that sort of keep doing it. Like I think Ashley did a one off, I think. the other option for today. But it's just, yeah, I find that very fascinating and how they kind of play it on screen because they're humans. And you see those moments of vulnerability

that are so fascinating. But they also know, like, they got to sell themselves. And this is its own absolute unique beast that they are, this thing they're doing. And it depends on that. I think you touched on something super specific there with the live,

her live performance of Google Me. She has absolutely no support visually with any humans around her. at all. She's just got the track in a microphone. And like you see on SNL there can be somebody who isn't the world's greatest musician, but has a team of theater behind

them putting on this incredible performance that is entertainment. That it's like some sort of spectrum between just music and something amazing for the eyeballs. And normally like if they're going to a dude ranch, for example, they have a team of goddamn

people dressing them to go do that so they feel confident. Well, she's on stage with no support. Of course her nerves were all over the place. I kind of feel for her in a way. No, totally. Yeah. And who hasn't been like Kim Zee in this position? Not like necessarily, you know, at this scale maybe, but, you know, who hasn't been in a position where they have to do something in front of an audience and they're in over their head and not feeling confident about it to begin with?

And, you know, the moment hits and, you know, just got to like muddle through. it with like classmates like snickering behind you it yeah it definitely like resonates with you a big time yeah yeah i certainly didn't mean i've been in her position at all yeah well in that way yeah no it's actually such a unique moment to watch that performance uh did you guys have any other thoughts on google me before we step into the the shows from this week i don't all right so we are covering real houseways of orange county and real hostwives of Atlanta this week. Russie, were either one of these shows, like, more compelling to you?

They are equally compelling in super different ways. And just like, my brain was hurting so hard after trying to understand what these people are doing, but in a great way because I do love watching reality TV. And I was making all these notes of who to get to know or of getting to know these people. So we started with Atlanta. Yeah. Atlanta's like strangely like way more over the top. And like you said, like actually trying to do these like big business entertainment things,

whereas Orange County felt more like fighting about relationships and money and doing crazy over the top things for the sake of doing over the crazy. I don't know. They're both different and I love them. Yeah. It's actually very interesting how. the flavor of each of these shows is influenced by their setting. That's one thing that I want to explore on our next show, actually. We're going to have an architect friend of ours named Billy Chung come on,

and we're going to talk about how physical spaces play within these shows. Cool. Let's dive right into Real Housewives of Atlanta. Who stood out to you from this cast? Shiree and Candy, for sure, stood out the most. me, well, of course they all stand out. They're all hilarious in their own ways, but Sherey and Candy definitely have these really

strong, I think, like, opposite ends of the friendship spectrum anchor points. And then everyone sort of, like even in, is this the episode where they went to dinner or is that, that was the previous episode that went to dinner, I think. Anyway, I think Sheree, like,

organized the dinner. Is that right? I know it's not this episode. Yeah. So, uh, there was like the, the Gucci lunch. That's what I'm talking about. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. So that was the prior episode. And here we kind of dealt a little bit with the follow up. But we got a great scene. And this was one of my highlights between Candy and Shari, where they went on that walk and kind of sorted out there. I've got it highlighted on my notes. There we go. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So this was a scene that I thought was fantastic where, you know, Candy and Shiret. Shri kind of get together and they go over the, uh, the beef that Shri has over the comments that Candy made on social media. And Shri actually gets an apology out of Candy who is pretty like, um, she's usually has a little bit of a difficult time kind of like admitting that she is wrong. I love candy as a hostwife and I think she's fantastic, but, you know,

getting this apology out of, um, of her, I think, was a huge win for Shari. Yeah. I think that, uh, I thought that this, that conversation was like, a, like a, almost like a, a thesis of the whole show in a way. Like, they talked about their arguments so in depth and like got to the crux of it. And she got that apology. And I thought that was actually kind of beautiful. Because like the communication was like, they were not getting communicated. And, um, the fact that Candy was spoofing about her business. to the public on the platform was, I think, the moment that was too far for candy.

I mean, for Cherie. And she've got that apology. And to just kind of ignore that, like, I was mocking. That's what I don't get about this show. One thing is like they perpetuate being a bully and mocking to so many people. And it being normalized that like, well, yeah, I was bullying you and mocking you on social media to millions of people. Yeah.

So, well, that's hurtful. And you got the homology. And that made me feel good when I saw that. And then also, like, talking about the rollout plan of, like, her fashion line there. But there's so many nuances to this argument, because Candy's right about how, like, well, you're just using other people's designs and slapping your thing on it now. And, but then talking about the rollout plan, and that's how you do an album, too. You make 12 songs, and then you put out one every four months for the next four years so that your project lasts for four. years, like this fashion design thing.

So I kind of related to a bunch of it. But yeah, I thought the apology was great. But I also thought the argument about like was exposing just kind of like how bad, they were just yelling at each other how bad they both are at their hobby businesses. Like, well, your restaurant can't pass a health test. And while your fashion line doesn't pay its people who does anything. So it was kind of sad and tragic. The apology was beautiful.

And that's what I got out of that scene. Yeah. I really like how it started as real housewives. But really, they're all just entrepreneurs at this point. And it's pretty much all of the shows are largely, there's other stuff in there, but it's largely like them navigating these businesses that, like, yeah, seeing if they can fly as, are they just hobby businesses? Are they legitimate?

And people throw a lot of things at the wall. It's pretty interesting. And it's, yeah, it's kind of cool to watch. Yeah, and yeah, that's a great point. I think there's like so many housewives, pretty much all of them that have like any ounce of savvy will attempt to, you know, build their own personal brand and launch some sort of product or something out there that they can use as a secondary revenue stream. And I think like we talked about this a little bit when we were talking about music and how, you know, people don't go. to watch Luanne for her music. They go, because it's like part of the housewives, like, experience and to get a deeper, like, embed yourself deeper in the, like, the housewife ecosystem.

And I think that's also true of, you know, these, these ventures. I don't think there's lots of people that are going to be, you know, that aren't familiar with housewives that are going to go and, like, buy some she by chay. Like, that's, that's not what's going to happen. or there's not like, I think a lot of people that are going to go to a place like Tom Tom or Schwartz and Sandy's or Sir, they're not going there for like the Go Cheese Balls. They're going there to get like the Bravo experience. Like these are. Yeah, it's housewives merch essentially.

No matter who's putting it out, right? It's merch of the show basically. Yeah, exactly. What other highlights did you have from this episode? Are you asking me? Yeah, you asking Sandy. Yeah, sir. Other highlights I have.

Ooh, I really love the moment in Drew's, when Drew's shooting her music video. And is that right? Her name's Drew shooting the music video. So I'm trying to remember everyone's names to this lot to remember at the roller rink. And I know I'm going to sound like, well, that's the show. Get over it, Rusty. But everyone's like mocking her music video about how it's a cute little roller rink. and while I had my party here, birthday party,

that video looked great to me. I thought it looked great and fun and awesome and colorful. But the beautiful moment I thought was when her husband, who's her husband's name? Ralph. And he wanted to be in the video with that duchy director guy. Rage. Rage.

Okay, Rage. Big shot guy. but I'm sure he is and I'm sure he's great I'm sure the video is awesome but uh so Drew's sister came back and her and Ralph sort of

budding heads or like unsure of the where the relationship stands and Drew mentioned that she had mentioned doing a roller skating video in the past and now it's coming to fruition and she's here for it and Ralph said it's like you were meant to be here or you're supposed to be here

and you can see that moment that the relationship changed and they're totally reconciled and their friends again and the grandma was happy about it and said that the blessings and the waiting or whatever she said there and I thought that was a really meaningful moment for everyone involved so that stood out to me yeah that was a very tender moment that I I liked a lot as well um it is kind of um it is kind of like reframed by the fact that drew and ralph split up after this and we have seen a history of Ralph be like a manipulator and like gaslight drew a ton.

Oh, see, now I feel bad for saying that it's beautiful. No, but in isolation it is and that's like. I don't have the context. Yeah, but I don't even think you need like context to really appreciate these things because like everything in life has like so much like context and there's just so many elements at play. And I think it's also important to like just appreciate things outside of their their context and like just, you know, just to, you know, get in touch with the actual humanity under this because this was clearly a very like real human moment between all of these people that do have real actual relationships. And, you know, how it doesn't matter that we have seen this history of toxicity and we have had like, um, the. the show frame him as a villain, whether that's actually the case in real life or not, is, you know, up in the air. He probably is a really, like, shitty guy from what we've seen. But, you know, it doesn't take away from the fact that those people actually experience, like, true joy and being able to, like, repair a little piece of their relationship and get some happiness out of it.

like that's that's real and for all the constructed situations that we see on reality tv um we still get moments like this where you know it adds it adds color and dimension to these characters that we see that you wouldn't expect to see in other like narrative forms of like fiction you're not going to write a character like ralph and give him a moment like this in a novel or a film or anything like that These are the sorts of like moments that you get for people that are villains that you don't see in other mediums. Oh, yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. Sandy, what were your highlights?

Yeah, sorry. Go ahead. No, I was going to say I did have some thoughts on Drew's video similar to what Rusty was saying earlier. I don't think that there was too much to criticize. In fact, you know, I prefer more disastrous. music video shoot as we have seen in other in other shows not too bad but yeah but this one went pretty well this one looked pretty pretty professional pretty solid and obviously drew is really talented um and there was i mean i guess candace in potomac had one in a parking lot was just like in the car her fancy race

cars that she ordered didn't come yeah so she just had like she made everyone like move their own vehicles in the background and it just it was so good as far as like i don't want to be that person that's like enjoying other people suffering, but there's a little bit of that. I don't know. I'll admit, but it was fun to watch and a lot of shade being thrown for that. And then there was Adriana in in Miami where she brought all her friends who really all hate her on this boat. And they just like fully ignored the frantic production director who's like, we're losing the sun. Everyone get dancing. And they were just drinking in like the bottom of the boat instead. So anyways, not to take away from Drew's success, but I wished it was more of a

disaster. Which it wasn't at all, which it wasn't even a bit. Otherwise, I definitely echo the Candy and Shire fight and

just again, Candy, this is my first season watching Atlanta and I watched, and I'm really loving it. I think all the women bring a lot,

like we said, and Candy is just a delight to watch every second she's on screen. So I appreciate that. She stands out. She's a highlight for me. Yeah.

for sure. Yeah, totally. And I don't think this was this episode. The fight between Candy and Candice, one of the new women, I just have to give it a shout out for being one of the most nonsensical fights in a world where nonsensical fights are, like the bar is high for nonsensical fights. I think it was, I think they've already put it past them by this episode, but it was quite a lot of drama because Candace, who didn't know Candy, met someone. who knew candy and that person said Candy said that Candy and Candice were friends when really Candy

and Candice didn't know each other and Candice was offended by that and told candy and if you if you can't follow that that's okay I was sitting here doing this with my finger Candy Candy Candice Candice Candice Candice Candice Candice Candice Kaye I'm trying to be in your

So it was pretty great I really enjoyed that this season so far and and I think I also had a moment this is not Marlowe's confessional background gave me a

kind of shocking realization that I had been really not critically thinking about what we're seeing behind these women in their confessions and I've been watching these shows for about a decade at least. And they look pretty real sometimes

and then I was like, well, were they green screens this whole time? Because she has a fire in the background but it's not moving. And that just all of a sudden, I was like, oh my God. And I never thought one way or the other, but then I actually went and searched it, and it sounds like they used to

use the people's real backgrounds in their houses. Then they changed from that at a certain point for maybe budgetary reasons. I was reading a little bit on Reddit. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I think yeah, do you know more about that? Because it just made me start thinking about it and I was really looking at everyone's backgrounds and yeah. I think it's been green screens for like, well, for as long as I can remember watching it. I mean, I haven't been watching it as long as you have Sandy, but yeah, I think

they've been using green screens for a long time. I don't think it was like a COVID measure. It's definitely like a lot better executed on real house size than it is on like shows like below deck where I feel like it's pretty clearly

a green screen. There's just something about the way that it's lit or the back drops that they use where it seems pretty apparent that it's a green screen. But on Housewives, they do a lot better job of making sure that they are lit in a way that it looks like they are in the environment that's projected on the background. Yeah, I didn't notice any green screen. Well, if you keep watching, now you will.

Now you won't be able to get it under. I think I'm hooked already. Like with any season of Big Brother, it's like three episodes until I know everybody. And then I'm like super hooked. Well, I've watched three episodes of these two seasons, and now I'm hooked. Hey, I just wanted to acknowledge it. I got a phone call about five minutes ago, and it said that I got cut off. The video got cut off, and it's re-recording now.

So I just want to make sure you got everything going on your end, okay, there. Yeah, yeah, it seems good. Okay. I did have one more highlight from this episode, unless we're going to move on. Can I say the F word on this show? Oh, yeah, absolutely. Okay. No, actually, she doesn't say it here.

I just found it again fascinating that So Marlow, like you're saying, going on this blind date, which I thought was a good way to end the episode with Hot Scotley, just like calming us all down. Oh, my God. But like the way the Marlowe was like upset that she didn't get invited to the music video, then it goes, oh, I'm going to call her on the music, but this fake ass bitch, I'm going to call this fake ass bitch.

Hey, beautiful! Like right away, like, easily like, like, goes from talking about how much she hates her. It's just saying how much she's beautiful. I can't do that. I don't understand how people do that. It's an art. I also noted that literally saying she's so fake and being the fakeest greeting ever, it's,

that's like takes a professional. Yeah. And then they get into the conversation and Drew's even like, well, I appreciate that or something like that. But, but or, and then she then she goes, well, I'm actually not kind of appreciating them how you're coming at me. Like, I'm in a music video. She can feel that this is really insincere. And then she's like, well, fuck you fake-ass bitch, and then hangs up on her to get rid of way, like 30 seconds later.

Oh, and another thing in the car that we both noticed because I watch the episode twice. And then I was the second time, I was like, oh, yeah. So she gets in that Uber or whatever it is. And then she, she like clears her throat. And she goes, oh, please, Lord, don't let me cough. And then the driver goes, oh, Lord, I've been praying for that all day too. And then they move on. And we're both like, what are they talking about?

I think it was for like needing to have a COVID test. I feel like this was, the production of this was still under like stricter COVID measures. And we see that actually on this season of Real Housewives of Orange County where, you know, households are getting like sidelined with with COVID. I see. It's already happened a few times. So I assume that that's what it's about. But yeah, that does be perfect sense now.

Yeah. I feel dumb free. bringing it up now. It makes total perfect sense. No, but this, this scene was also one that stood out to me. Like, I love that Marlowe, you know, we see her getting so nervous about this date and like, I'm not sure how to act. And, you know, then she decides like, oh, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to, I'm going to call Drew to get my blood going. Like, I'm going to just get fired up about like something else.

Take my nerves off of it and like just really get the adrenaline going as opposed to like just being like meekly nervous about going on this blind date. So she calls and just like decides like, oh yeah, the solution is to stir shit up with Joe. And then after she hangs up on her, she's like totally body shaming or is it talking about how she's built like a square and man, your man don't even want you. And I think that that's kind of horrible to put on TV and not nice to see another woman shaming another woman or anybody shaming anybody, really, you know.

But I know it's a show arresting. So shut out. But I think like you're like tapping into a internal conflict that, you know, we as viewers have to deal with when we're watching these shows. Like reality TV, it is, you know, watching it and consuming it, at least especially the Bravo shows, it's not this like pure endeavor. Like there's, it's a blood sport. I refer to it as a blood sport because, you know, there is a lot of mud that's thrown. And there's a lot of, you know, a lot of toxicity that is like existing and you're like engaging with by proxy. And, you know, that always comes at a cost of the other personalities.

And, you know, they're, anyone that is on these shows. Absolutely. I struggle. That's how the show runs. Yeah, I understand it. I mean, I, like, it's something that I think about. I'd be lying if I said that I struggle with it too much. I feel like, you know, it is a healthy outlet for, like, engaging in toxicity.

And, like, you know, that's way better than, not that the alternative is, like, doing it in real life. But it's, it is, like, a healthy. healthier outlet to sort of exercise and like engage with these feelings. And also it does bring up conversations and you need to think about these things from various perspectives and contexts in a way that I think like has a lot more nuance than you get when you're just exposed to a problem that gets reduced on Twitter and being like, okay, well, you're canceled for this specific isolated moment in your life. It has made you irredeemable.

But we see these people engage in problematic behavior. And sometimes they apologize and they do better and they learn from it. And we see that growth, which is a very like healthy thing to see on television, to see someone get past that and learn and show that people aren't these irredeemable people. And sometimes they don't. Sometimes they double down. Sometimes they like remain.

toxic and you know that's the case in real life as well and um i i i think that it generates a lot more thought and dialogue um than um you know then just kind of ignoring it and writing writing it off as something that is just purely toxic i think it's a little bit more nuanced than that totally i think you hit the nail on the head yeah like we we watched so much reality shows uh in our house and it takes three hours to watch any episode of anything because we do pause and we talk about well that makes me mad that that person said that about that to that person and i wouldn't say that would you say that or well maybe in these circumstances we would and these people on the show have all signed a waiver to be on the show

arguing about stuff so that we have these conversations you know yeah and some of the conversations that happen like on twitter or on social media surrounding these um they do lack nuance that is people just reducing and isolating things i think that's unavoidable with those platforms but in other places there are more nuanced conversations that happen about it. And also on Twitter and Instagram, you do see that sometimes. But yeah, and thinking about, you mentioned Big Brother and thinking about last season with Kyle. There was the big controversy where he was calling out a cookout 2.0 existing within the house. And, you know, that was a very nuanced situation that he did not have the social skills to navigate.

And, you know, but he also didn't have the background to realize what was problematic about what he was doing and how he was dealing with it. And I think that, you know, we saw kind of both sides of people approaching that conversation on places like Reddit where I, you know, engage with. Big Brother content and Twitter and Instagram, we see people like sometimes reducing it to this like clear cut. Like he's problematic. He's irredeemable. There's like, there's nothing that he can do to redeem himself. He needs to be cast off from society and go to canceled island or whatever. And then you've got people that are like, okay, well, you know, he needs to like learn from this and he needs to know that it's him that needs to educate himself.

about this. It's not anyone else's responsibility to do that and he needs to like grow and this is kind of like the path forward and it generates a good conversation about, you know, why is this problematic and lots of the commenters that you see weighing into this don't have all of the context, including like myself. Like I don't have all the the background and the education and the lived experience to really know how to, you know, the nuance of that sort of. situation and the dialogue that those situations generate is a way for people to educate and see another person's perspective. So I think even when we do get these toxic moments that crop up in reality TV, it is an opportunity for people to learn from that without making the same

mistakes that the people that you see on these shows do. Yeah. Yeah, those are great points. It's been interesting. Oh, sorry. No, you go ahead, Sandy. It's been interesting to see in the last couple years how Bravo has dealt with those sort of incidents that come up when people are saying things that are really problematic. And they were sort of, Bravo sort of started firing a bunch of people due to that. And then I don't know if they stopped because they realize they might run out of people. But either way, I think it was way better when they started embracing that this needed to play out on the show. And there's been some really interesting. you're saying things to watch.

There was, I think of Dallas when Brandy, I can't even remember what the context was, but it was, but she had to like live that on the show. And she, I mean, I think it was a really hard experience for her and but important. And it was such an interesting thing to watch and totally agree with you, Craig. It really does allow for some really interesting conversations and some self-reflection as a society. I mean, we look at Scandiball with with Banderpump Rules and the crazy reaction, their extreme reaction, I should say. And as you said, largely not nuanced enough for my taste, but we've had many conversations about that. And you've talked about it on this on the show. And there's so much to be

pulled and learn about our collective reaction to that and what it means and reflection as a society and et cetera, that there's so much depth to these shows that people might not realize if they're just sort of seeing an ad for them. Yeah, totally. Yeah. It's definitely not something that people, that people think about or talk about when you initially mention these programs. People don't respect the nuance of what these shows give us. Did either of you guys have any other comments on Real Hostiles of Atlanta before we move on to Orange County? Just I'm rooting for Scott Lee and Drew. Yeah.

Marlowe. Marlowe. But hey, maybe Drew single now. She can get in there. Yeah. That'll be some good drama for next season. Russie, what were your thoughts on the cast of Real Hostways of Orange County? Oh, my God.

Oh, they're hard to tell apart, first of all. Tamara, she's something else. Let me see here. I like Shannon a lot. Shannon, we were saying she's got big Carrie Fisher vibes. Oh, yeah. Does not give a shit what anybody else thinks. Sorry, I'm looking through my notes here.

I'll jump in. I love Shannon. She's one of my all-time favorite housewives. I think, Craig, you might agree. She is just such a perfect comment. And you need all the types of people. You need the villains, as I think you were saying in a previous episode, Greg, people kind of maybe sometimes shift through those archetypes.

But Shannon is just a great mix of lovable. and relatable and well-meaning, but also so messy that she brings, she brings the drama. She works, she does, she does her part on these shows. And she can't really, I think, control. Like, some of these women, like, are very, they produce themselves. They keep themselves in line, which I want to talk about a little bit for this show specifically. And Shannon just couldn't if she wanted to. Like, she's just herself. And she, it's just so fun to watch just, like, mess, mess, mess, but also you just root for her. And I just, yeah, I have lots of.

There's a level of sincerity that she gives off that, that you can tell is sincere. And that's totally relatable, yeah. And she's self-deprecating. Yeah, too. Yeah. And she is like so messy. And she can't help but be messy. Like watching Shannon navigate any sort of social situation on Real Housewives of Orange

County, it reminds me of there's an episode. of Nathan for you where the premise is basically to keep an antique shop open late at night and draw bar traffic in and get really drunk people to come in and break stuff because they can't like they can't like control

themselves in order to like sell in order to sell more antiques and that's like Shannon operating in Orange County like she is just no matter what she does she's going to turn around knock something over

and cause a problem, even if she doesn't intend to. It is very engaging. There's a reason why, like, you know, of the Trays Amiga's, Shannon, Vicky, and Tamara, Shannon was the one they kept around while they put Vicky and Tamara on a break, which I think was a misstep completely, but, you know, there's a reason why Shannon stuck around, and it is because she's likable, but also, like, she's messy.

like she's just like always is causing or has a problem and it's like it is a little exhausting to watch but I think that if Shannon was not as likable as she was then you know she'd be she'd be gone but she is likable and relatable yeah yeah I like the she's just kind of got this look on her face where it's like oh I'm fucking up again uh suck it I'm fucking up again too bad and it's like it's kind of like sometimes you're like Shannon Like when she was, they were on the boat. This was, I don't know if you saw this episode, but they were on a boat and the new characters was like telling this storybook, their adopted son and this foster care. And she's just like, there's not somebody in the boat? And it's just like, oh, you just, oh.

Just, yeah. Yeah, that was an amazing scene. And just, yeah, classic, classic Shannon. Russie, what were your highlights from Orange County? Okay, let me take a look here. Well, first of all, I was just thinking about Heather was another character that I've got here. My note says when I was just getting to know them,

she knocks husband's foot into capital letters that says elevator. And then what? They have an elevator in their house. They have too much. I think all these people have too much money, but they have like way too much money, I think the Heather family, the Posh Spice family.

That's what it seems like to me. That makes that Terry DeBrow. David Beckham. And that analogy. One interesting one interesting thing on that note about this show, and I don't know if it's so much played up anymore, but this is one of the few shows

where there's sort of been a deliberate exploration of almost different class hierarchies within the cast. So we had, we have poor old Gina who now has, her life has become stable. But earlier in the show, she had her marriage broke up. She had, I think, a DUI.

she was living in a casita they always made fun of in the back of a house she just she didn't have the money that these other women did especially heather who's the peak of this excess and wealth and most disgustingly and was played up that way and it was kind of interesting to see like kind of it was it was produced it wasn't necessarily super like organic but it was an interest it was interesting to see the show one of these shows engage with that because there was And you see it on here a little bit where, where Gina didn't invite Heather to something in one of the previous episodes because she thought, well, she's not going to want to come to a die bar. This is not fancy enough for Heather. And Heather was then offended.

And so there's still that strain in there, which is kind of interesting. Yeah. And you're right. It is produced. But also, I feel like it kind of almost needs that frame in order to explore it in a way. Like you need to have some sort of. framework that you can use to explore these ideas and how they approach things so differently and like how it colors their perspective. Yeah, I think that that is like one of the really

interesting things about Orange County, you know, over its lifetime, especially, you know, since bringing on Gina, who, like you said, had had a lot more humbler of a beginning than, and a lot of the other hostwives that she was cast with. I love to know what, like, how much money Gina actually has, like, compared to us, you know, because, like, all these other women, you're like, it's such a big amount. I can't even fathom it. But I'm like, well, her, maybe I could at least fathom it. And, like, I'd love to see the scale.

I'm sure you could do some calculations because we know what they get paid for these shows. And now they have the money from the shows, whereas at the beginning, they aren't starting with that. And that's interesting to kind of observe as well. You see that in shows like Banderpump Rules where they're just now really rich literally because of the show. They didn't start that way. Yeah. Yeah, totally. So fascinating.

Okay, well, my next highlight would be Heather packing for this trip, which kind of ties us back to what we were talking about before with, like, having support of a team of people making you feel confident, right? So they're going to this dude ranch. and Heather has like stylists and a personal assistant at her home store of costumes that are all Western like it seemed helping her pick out her own costumes like

we're trying to think of another scenario that another grown up would have that in and it's like no it's like a child's princess birthday party is the only time you have two people helping you pick out your outfit so you can go to this theme park of an outer nature

place where you're not going to do any outdoor stuff at all. But yeah, it was the packing that was fascinating to me. And what are they even packing for exactly? And packing for the airport and all these fascinating, fabulous clothes. Yeah, I love how removed, like, Heather is from the day-to-day reality of what someone who might be like a legitimate cow. boy is where her outfit is just so

costumy. Like it is so over the top costuming just because it does not like there's it it makes nods to being a cowboy because it's a hat it's like Western inspired but it is so removed

from that world that it seems so out of place. It's so it's funny. Well they're like Katie Perry costume for a cowboy themed song. on stage at an arena. But then I found, like, when I was watching the final scene on this episode, I was like, this standoff between Heather and Taylor, like,

it seemed so reminiscent of, like, a Western, like, bar scene. Like, it's like, this is the most cowboy shit I have ever seen on this show. Yes. That was one of my highlights is this. this fight. The whole script fight? It's amazing. Like,

it, this is for me, one of the first, maybe the first real storyline for Heather. Heather's, Heather's story, like she left the show and then came back and I, I think she's now left again,

maybe because of how this, maybe got too real for her, because this, her last storyline was like, I'm building my crazy mansion. And it was just, yeah, you know,

it wasn't interesting. It was the standard garbage you would think would be on these shows. And it's fine. It can be there, but it's not interesting. And she has a real career, but talking about like that balance of, like, she has a legitimate career as an actor from the past. But it's a bit shaky because she hasn't done it in years. And as we see in this episode, like her IMDB, it's all one episode.

It's not, it's not that solid. And that is going to, that is going to hit home to her in a way that I don't think she wants this show ever to do. And that's why this fight is so. good and seeing something real from the other is so rewarding because it's so real and we can understand that feeling of like someone taking real shots at what matters most to you. And when we see the flashback to when I guess it's Tamara and Taylor are talking about this in the restaurant, there's a flashback, which is kind of, you know, shady from the editors where

years ago she says, I got a job on this sitcom. It turns out every other housewife got that call. and she's like, oh, that was for a different part. You could just tell how, like, how that would have felt to her in that moment and trying to save face, but like, oh, my God, I'm just a housewife. Like, I'm not a real actor anymore. So then for, for Taylor to come with this weird, whatever movie and how that all played out offering this part that then, like, and Heather has a really good point. That is not how any of this would work. That's not a real offer of just like, hey, there's a part. it's just so compelling.

I'm so excited about this storyline. I'm kind of totally on Heather's side too on this. Oh, yeah. I got to say. Oh, yeah. That flashback you were talking about. So it was like, I'm not totally sure of all the context, but because of Heather's previous acting experience,

she was offered some kind of role, but so was everyone else in The Real Housewives. Sounds like it. But the nuance here that nobody said is they were only offering. that role because Heather has acting experience and whatever the show was, wanted to get Heather and then everyone else from the Desperate Housewives gets probably a non-speaking role, but Heather gets like a speaking role. Or am I wrong in that? That's what I gathered from this.

So they're all getting a role because of Heather's professionalism is what they're not saying out loud. But at the same time. Yeah, how true that is. Yeah. Who knows? It's pretty clear that. Despern I'm getting about this. It's pretty clear that Heather's most likely a better actor than these other random housewives, but for Heather is a serious actor to be realizing that her part, in whatever way, is associated with getting all these other housewives on a show as a gimmick, is going to be just as low a blow.

Yeah. That's not going to... Totally. I agree with you. Yeah. Yeah. And I feel like that particular experience that they highlighted is exactly why she doesn't want to do this, because she doesn't want to just get apart because she's a housewife because that blew up on her and totally minimizes before so um yeah and yeah this was the i i feel like this was an amazing story that is definitely um you know this is something that is constructed by by taylor like this is something that is conceived and constructed by taylor in order to like make a play at causing drama this is not you know just like a happy accident this is like her trying to make a mark coming in. And I feel like Taylor's maybe a little underestimated because she's coming on as a friend of the housewife.

So they, you know, I feel like her past since she was on Beverly Hills as a hostwife, like that wasn't taken into account as much as in terms of how much she could impact a story or have her own story since she was just coming on as a friend of. and we're seeing her make like an immediate play and she's playing it perfectly like I think she's showing her maturity as as a housewife in terms of like you know housewife tradecraft she's able to like come in as this angle of like I want to build a relationship with you Heather but really I'm setting myself up to like make a real deep cut on on you I like I'm like taking a shot at you and she's doing it like she knows that she can do it early on because on one hand she doesn't have like the social capital in order to make a big play by moving a lot of a lot of pawns like you know you see people like um on real house toys of atlanta like candy doesn't have to make things doesn't have to do anything on her own because she's got so many people that are on her team that she can move them as as pieces and that's something that we saw in real houseways of new jersey this past season like teresa and jenn you know manipulative regulating Danielle to do her bidding.

Taylor doesn't have that built up social currency in order to make people do stuff for her. But that also gives her the freedom. Like she's a like a complete like free agent. She's a rogue. She's a mercenary. She's going in. She's going to make her play to like really, you know, cut someone deep and then, you know, reshuffle the deck because the sides are relatively carved out on.

Orange County. Like those are very mature dynamics that all these people have. So to make a big cut and just see how the deck reshuffles, I think is, um, is a smart play from her. And we're seeing her, you know, her hostwife smarts come into play. That's such a good. So you're saying that like yeah. You're saying that like bringing the script to the, to the show basically, bringing as up as her storyline kind of thing and bring it to Heather is sort of like her plays kind of how you're saying what you're saying I think yeah I think like being like oh you know you can be in this movie with me yeah so she yeah I think she knows how that's going to play with with Heather yeah I mean I really I was really relating actually to Heather a lot because um I have a lot of people who I produce a lot of music and so a lot of

people come to me and do things like hey wouldn't it be fun if we do this thing together. And I think to myself, well, what's your budget? What are you trying to get out of me? Is what I think? How much time is this going to take? Are you going to pay me? Is it really going to be fun for me or is it going to be fun for you and you're going to get my work out of it? Right. You know, and so I totally was relating. And I kind of thought that the editor's shade was being given to the new person who's, what's her name? I'm sorry. Taylor. Taylor. when Heather was talking about like, what's the schedule? Who's the producer?

What's the director? What was the reshoot days? And they posted, they put all that on the screen. And to me, that was the editor going, yeah, that's how shows work. It's a lot of work. There's a huge team. So many logistics and money and budget and scheduling involved. It's not just now we're friends because I'm an actor and you're an actor.

And I got you this role. It's super minimizedy of Heather's whole career and everyone that helps her get there. and I really felt with her. Yeah. And I think that that would have landed more if, if Taylor actually cared about being an actress. Like that would have been a bit better of like a fireback at Taylor if she actually wanted to be an actor.

But she doesn't. She wants to be a real housewives of Orange County. He wants to get her orange. Right. So like, you know, the fact that it does get Heather worked up where she feels the need to like, like, minimize what Taylor's doing, just like,

by extension of the fact that Taylor doesn't actually care about doing this properly, it in turn further minimizes, like, Heather's career and the fact that she's taking this so seriously when Taylor's not. And she can see all that hat playing out, I'm sure, because she's a very smart person, like what everything you just is fadden and just probably just gets her goat so bad, like on these multiple levels. And it's in, I like what you're saying about Taylor. I haven't thought too much about her, but when she was back, when she was on Beverly Hills long ago, she was a really like meek and a meek character because she was going through some really dark,

like marriage stuff, like really dark. Like we didn't want to get into it. But I never, but she is underestimated like you said. And now she's, you know, it's like 10 years later or whatever, seven years. And she's, she's stable and she's ready to come back and like she can play that meek, do-eyed, oh, what? I don't understand why Heather's so upset really. well like you're saying and that's going to give her a really good in to to like mess with things.

So I like that a lot. Yeah. Yeah. And I love when you see like a host wife skill at the game play out. Like I love when you see something that is clearly like a social move. Like it's one of the things I love about Big Brother because you see that at a lot higher frequency because that game there is, you know, that imposed structure in how it works. But like you do see that on real hostwise.

as well. It's just a lot longer and like probably like a bigger chess board that that is in play that you have to think like a lot further ahead. You're not, you know, you're not constantly on the edge of getting like kicked off. But I love when you see someone's skill come out and how they manipulate social situations in order to position themselves and the people around them. And that's one of the things that I really like about watching real, real, real, Ultimate Girl's Trip when you've got that condensed format and you see the Housewives from different franchises. And I feel like on Real Housewives Ultimate Girls Trip 3, the one that just aired, that's something that we really saw a skill discrepancy between, you know, people like Giselle from Potomac and then, you know, Whitney and Heather from Salt Lake City just being like so outclass at the Housewives game. it is like really late there.

I want to see this now. Yeah. You should check it out. I will. And that was an interesting one because it was kind of, you kind of like it was a little dry, but then some people stepped up. And like it was, it was really obvious, but not in a unskilled way, but just an interesting way for the audience to be able to take it in.

So yeah. So I haven't, I haven't seen these spinoffs at all, obviously, but I'm assuming there's sort of parallel to like Bachelors in Paradise. Is it like a spin off of? Yeah, sort of. Like ultimate girls trip is like the Housewives All-Star game, basically. Yeah, that's what I figured. Yeah.

So you know how like we see in Real Housewives of Orange County this week? They're going on this trip to the the dude ranch or whatever. Yeah. Typically like a typical Housewife season has like two cast trips. There's a smaller one like the one that we're seeing here. And then there's like a big one where they, it's usually international, a lot more. glamorous and whatever. And so what they do is they take housewives from various franchises and they put them on a on a trip, like a glamorous trip together typically. And they then just let it kind of play

out. And, you know, they've, they've constructed the personalities that are in here based on like history and just like their personalities in order to see what sort of like bonds form and what sort of conflict arises and because you know these are professionals these are like you know it's not just like Joe Blow going on the this trip and like dipping their toes into the reality

like the relationships will continue on beyond this and they'll have business relationships networking and stuff there's there's that and also they've been like doing this they they know the game they know kind of the conventions and how to like play things so

it's a lot more interesting than you would think it would be. I still think that it's not as rewarding OAA viewing experience as watching a longer Real Housewives season play out. But it is kind of interesting in how it's different and you see a little bit more of the game exposed. Cool. Good to check that up. Yeah, for sure.

Did you have any other highlights from Real Housewives of Orange County, Rusty? I didn't, I don't think. How about she's handy? I mean, I'll talk about other stuff. I had one more. Otherwise, we kind of covered them. But so when Shannon left the table to go dress up in her saloon outfit, she said, I have to take a call. I have to take a call.

Oh, the person that was supposed to watch my kids didn't show up. And then everyone had a little back and forth. Well, like, her kids are 18. Like, what? And like, why isn't her boyfriend just living there? And it turns out that was like a. fake reason to leave the table, she says. But I just must know, did she actually hire a babysitter for her two 18-year-old girls? Like, that to me is like an unanswered question that I must know

the answer. Because Shannon would. We talked about it too. Well, we talked about the fact that she's got a huge property that needs a crew of people to take care of probably, right? And there's probably a hundred gates and security systems and stuff. And if I had two 18-year-old daughters and a 50-year-old old boyfriend, I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable with that new person staying. My 19-year-old daughters don't want him around. None of their business either is what I said. Yeah, maybe hire a groundskeeper, not a babysitter. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, this was another example also of Shannon just like fumbling her way through things. And if she was like, if she had the, you know, if she had the skills at the game that we were just talking about. This could be an opportunity that she created unknowingly to, like, have someone who's on her side be sitting at the table.

Oh, this is all the shit that they said about your relationship with John when you left the table to go and get dressed up, right? Like, that is a perfect opportunity to be, like, collecting information that you can use as a later date as, like, leverage in an argument or whatever. Your use of the word skill for the last five minutes just came into clear focus for me. Now I'm understanding what you're talking about. like planting people to get like clout within a drama arrangement and like that's that's insane but impressive sorry I interrupted you but it just oh no yeah but yeah no I think like if she was that sort of like

more strategic housewife then I think it was an opportunity to get information and you know information is we see it used in all sorts of ways like how it can get you can disperse it and see how it like passes through the group and how it ends up coming back to you in order to get a better read on your situations. Or you can use it by like sharing it with someone to strengthen your bond as like a, you know, having this like common thing to rally around. And you can use it in a variety of ways and a combination of different ways. And, you know, Shannon's just not the host wife that is able to do that. So it will be a little bit interesting to see if anyone like kind of comes to her to see if they can, you know, gain some goodwill with her or whatever. But I just thought it was an interesting opportunity that was probably going to end up getting missed.

It's interesting that it's nice to have that there's such diversity, right? We have these housewives who can play that game. We have the housewives who can't like Shannon, but still offer so much because it plays off the rest. Then we have like other ones who are less interesting and they shuffle off after a couple years. There's just so many different ways to be a housewife that is really interesting. And to your point about choosing what to do with information, I always find it really fascinating.

Like when people have a discussion, there's very deliberate decisions. Are you or are you not going to go tell the other person? And it's very strategic. And sometimes it's not maybe, but usually it's very strategic. And it's, you kind of never know how someone's going to go. And I don't watch Big Brother, but I imagine that's like the whole premise, right? It's just like manipulating people, et cetera. But it's, it's very interesting to watch that going on and picking up on the decisions being made and the level of skill when they make them.

Yeah, totally. Did you have any other highlights, Andy? I think we covered most of mine. Yeah, are awesome. Yeah. Awesome. I do have a question for you. What do you think of Jen as a.

rookie housewife. Sandy, sorry. I think it's TBD. I think the whole thing about her being with her partner now she met while she was in the marriage and it was an emotional affair if nothing else. I mean, they're trying to make that into a storyline with Gina being upset about it. I don't think there's much there. For one thing, there's been a lot more dramatic cheating storylines in this world and she's

really upfront about it. So I think it's to be. determined if she can bring it. I don't know. What do you think, Craig? Yeah, I find her so annoying, actually. I do not like her at all. I feel like she tries so hard and it comes across like very inauthentic and I just like, I don't know, I find her particularly phony. So even how she's handling this affair coming out is kind of boring to me. I was surprised that like Dr. Jen from last season didn't come back. I think like this is probably an unpopular opinion,

but I really liked her as a housewife. I love her. First of all, they're also, those two women are like twins, so you might almost not notice visually that they're different. Dr. Jen and her very sad husband, Rhine, were a highlight of last season. And watching their very uncomfortable relationship, relationship was fascinating and I really miss her. I totally agree. Yeah. And she was like,

she was so open about the problems that they were having and just like showing that part of her life and like Ryan hated it. You know, he hated being on camera and seeing this like awful relationship like having to engage with that and not being able to like hide his disdain. And I thought that yeah, Jen, Dr. Jen was like really trying to do. do stuff socially within the housewife's game as well. And so I don't know, I don't know why she was not very well received by the fan base in general. And they didn't bring her back. Noella also last season was like a really chaotic force.

Like I can't remember anyone coming on and being nearly as like having this like chaotic energy about them in recent memory at least. And so I feel like two housewives with a lot of potential just didn't didn't get asked back. And I'm a little disappointed that, you know, this new Jen and her husband or boyfriend knew Ryan are the replacements that we got. It just feels very hollow to me. Is his name also actually Ryan and her name is actually Jen? Like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

But not Ryan. Ryan. He hasn't he hasn't undergone the metamorphosis to Ryan yet. Oh, it's so funny. How would we ever make fun of him for that? Oh, I loved it all. Yeah. No, this is making me sad, Craig. I forgot about those two.

I missed them too. I forgot. Because this cast is a little, like, I've never loved this show the most. They're all as a little like trying, like, it's just not quite there, which is why I'm looking forward to the. The stakes are a lot lower. Yeah. That's why I'm really happy about. the Heather, the Heather storyline.

And I had one more question on that, actually. For Heather, why do you think she came back? Because she clearly regretted it. She came, she came back for one season? Or has she been here for two now? No, two. This is her second. Yeah, okay.

So, I don't really know what her motivation for coming back was. Money, maybe, maybe to show off. that her house was finally done because I feel like that storyline of hers was like three seasons long putting this house together. But yeah, I don't really know. I think Heather is likeable, but she's also kind of phony. She's out of touch of reality, totally out of touch with your reality. Yeah, and she's like very careful about how she presents herself and how she comes across. on these shows, which is not usually an asset unless you're able to do it really well.

And I think actually a housewife that I really love that is also similarly careful about how they get presented is Candy. Like Candy is a little bit standoffish in terms of like giving everything to the camera. She gives a lot to the show and she, but it's clearly like very self-produced. Heather is not as skilled at making those moments that she gives to the camera that are self-produced as authentic. Like, her and Terry's relationship always comes across as, like, stiff. And, I mean, it doesn't help that Terry is, like, only ever in his, like, scrubs with his name on it at home, like, lounging in his scrubs, unless he's going to, like, a theme party. it's very clear that what they're trying to do is build their brand.

But I don't know, I can take or leave Heather. I think it's really interesting that she's on here and we're getting this conflict with Taylor because Taylor is able to draw blood when she's making cuts. So that's interesting to see. And also I think the relationship between her and Gina being polar opposites of the social strata within the Orange County is an interesting dynamic as well. So there are sort of things that she lends to the show that is maybe not her intention and maybe not a reflection of her skill as a housewife. But I think she's like a valuable piece of the dynamic.

Agreed. Awesome. Well, I think that about covers all of the things that I wanted to talk about as well. Thank you so much for doing this. Russie and thank you Sandy for stepping in for Dylan while he's away. This has been a blast. I'm so, so happy that

had both of you on here. Rusty, do you want to let everyone know where they can find you? Sure, yeah. Thanks for having me on here, Craig. You can find me at Rusty Robot underscore 101001.001 on Instagram.

I'm also Rusty Robot on Facebook. I'm a music producer from Winnipeg, and I have a song called Northern Paradise that you can find on YouTube, which is a fan art theme song for Bachelors in Paradise Canada, which features Mike Ogilvie from Bachelors in Paradise Canada and The Bachelorette Canada. And I have a new song coming out soon, which you can find on YouTube as well. That's all. Thanks. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you so much. One thing that you didn't plug that I'm super pumped about

is the vinyl release of Combing the Clouds, which was an album that had a a huge impact on me when I was a when I was young um you know cool thanks yeah no it's it's it's actually yeah it was like one of my my most listened to albums when I was like in in high school so yeah I really stoked about that it was an immediate pre-order when when you drop that everyone everyone check it out thank you that's the first link in my bio and Instagram and now on to Sandy thank you Sandy, you want to let everyone know where they can find you? Sure.

It's pretty off topic, but if you're interested in checking out my art made with human hair, you can find me at Corporeal Curios on Instagram. Can you spell that, please? C-O-R-P-O-R-E-A-L, C-U-R-I-O-S. It's kind of the worst handle and business name ever, I realize now, but, you know. So it's corporeal what? Curios, C-U-R-I-O-S, or just search my name. Awesome.

Well, thanks again to both of you guys. That's been Bravo Outsider for this week. You can find us on Instagram at Bravo Outsider. On Twitter at Bravo underscore Outsider. We've got a website, bravoo-outider.com. Look us up on YouTube. You can find us wherever you listen to podcasts. Until next week, keep on wiping.