Oscars Outsider - Greek Easter w/ Megan and Wendy of Girls Gone Hallmark (RHOSLC S04E07, BD:MED S08E04)

Episode Date: October 24, 2023

In this riveting episode of the Bravo Outsider Podcast, hosts Craig and Dylan are joined by Megan and Wendy from the Girls Gone Hallmark podcast, creating a powerhouse of TV analysis and commentary. The group dives headfirst into the Salt Lake City episode of the Real Housewives franchise, unpacking the bewildering secret marriage of Mary Cosby's son. Next they dissect the intense conflict between Heather Gay and Lisa Barlow. The group also delves into Whitney Rose's heartfelt conversation with her husband, exploring the intricacies of their marriage and relationship dynamics. The episode reaches a climax with a detailed discussion on the confrontation between Monica Garcia and Angie Katsanevas at the Greek Easter party In addition to the Real Housewives drama, the group also covers the latest from Below Deck: Mediterranean, sharing their insights and opinions on the season's unfolding events. They discuss the importance of tablescapes, a recurring theme in the series, and reflect on the crew's performance and guest interactions. Find Megan and Wendy on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/meganandwendy/ Find Girls Gone Hallmark on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/girlsgonehallmark/ Find "The Devil You Don't" on Youtube: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tBassBNwKc&list=PLCGSy4_xHhBsbX0VlG3JDJwaiqsBkiGDj⁠⁠⁠ https://www.bravooutsider.com Music by FASSounds from Pixabay #rhoslc #bravo #realitytv #realhousewives #belowdeck #belowdeckmed #realhousewivesofsaltlakecity

Hello and welcome to the Bravo Outsider Podcast. I'm your host Craig Midwinter. Joining me as usual, it's Dylan Ferguson. Dylan, how's it going? Gritch, Christos Anesti. Everybody, cheers. Happy to have you here. And we are very pleased to be joined by Wendy and Megan from the Girls Gone Hallmark

podcast. Merry countdown to Christmas to you guys. Thank you. Hallmark's all about the perfect romance. but I'm all about keeping it real. I may host a Hallmark podcast, but I'm anything but cookie cutter. Excellent, excellent taglines there.

I want to just start things off because I mentioned off the top that the countdown to Christmas has started on Hallmark, and I take it you guys have started watching the 40 film slate that they've got planned this season. On slot. Really? The barrage. we have. We jumped in with both feet. This weekend had three new movies, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. And of the 40 movies, we're reviewing 28 during this season and we'll get to the other 12 next year. So we watched two of the movies this weekend. We're full steam ahead for the next eight weeks. Oh, awesome. What are your thoughts initially on the ones that you've watched so far?

Oh, Wendy's making a face. We haven't recorded. We're recording our reviews after this. so I actually have no idea what she thinks. So this is very interesting. You're resisting getting their spoilers out there. That's what you're doing. No. I honestly, the first movie that they, when I was checking it twice, was their kickoff movie, I kind of thought it was a swing and a miss.

Oh, a mixed sports metaphor there. Yes. I thought it was a decent star. Again, I would agree. It wasn't a out-of-the-park home run. but what's really interesting is in our Facebook group and online, the feedback we're seeing in a lot of these movies is completely opposite of my feelings on these movies.

Oh, interesting. Yeah, people are loving things that I didn't. And yeah, so I think it's going to be an interesting season. Homeark is trying a lot this year. Which I appreciate. Yes. And even this first weekend, we had a character who, turned black and white, like the entire town turned black and white.

Oh, like a pleasantville type thing? Yes. Yeah, and it was, it's creative. I mean, it's not perfect. You're working on a hallmark budget, but I thought the creativity was there. Let's do that for our YouTube version. Let's have a black noise. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, just another reason that you should subscribe to us on YouTube. If you're watching anywhere else, check us out on YouTube. Before we get into the Broadway, I'm not done talking about Hallmark because I've mentioned on the podcast before. I just love Hallmark movies. I moderate the Hallmark subreddit. He's so excited about this episode, by the way. Yeah, I am.

To have you on. We're so happy to be here. I don't know if I've been this excited since we had Comrade Britt from Soi Trek on because I'm also a big Star Trek fan and that was a fun one. But who are your like your favorite Hallmark stars? is like who do you really look forward to seeing their their movies that season and what kind of what kind of specific like subgenres of Hallmark movies are you guys fans of? Oh.

In terms of favorite actors and actresses, I would say Paul Campbell is one of my favorites. I don't know if you're familiar with him. He does a lot of funny work, I think. Oh, okay. Yeah, comedically he's great, which is not really a comedy and Hallmark is not a combination you think of. but I would encourage people to rethink that. Yeah. And then in terms of actresses, I mean, I love Queen of Christmas, Lacey Chabere.

Oh, yeah. I really enjoy her movies quite a bit. What about you? There's, oh, I mean, there's so many. I love Nikki DeLoch on screen. She's one of my favorites. And in terms of actors, just this weekend, we saw Michael Rady in a movie, and he's quickly becoming one of my favorites on Hallmark.

just I think he's so enjoyable to watch on screen. We recorded an episode of an older movie of his recently, and I said, I feel, this is going to sound ridiculous. I'm embarrassed that I started this end, but I feel safe when he's on screen. Like, I just feel very comforted when he's in my movies. And in terms of genres, though, that's a good question. I'm almost leaning away from, you can't really get away from it, the movies that are strictly romance.

I'm like, tell, give me a, we've seen. movies that are focused on like the female friendships. I'm like, oh, I love that. And the romance is secondary. Yeah, I agree with you. You know, I, when Megan and I first started this podcast, I'm the one who hates Hallmark movies. I had never seen a Hallmark movie before starting our podcast. Oh, wow. Yeah. And so Megan has been like a lifetime watcher, not Lifetime the channel, a lifelong watcher of Hallmark movies. I'm kind of new to the game. So like, the stuff gets a little old to me, but I think since the change over in Hallmark in terms of like who runs their company, there's been great strides since 2020.

Agree. Yeah. It's interesting because, yeah, like you said, last, last year, the movies that they put out, they were definitely trying like a bit more different things and not just like in terms of being more progressive, which is a great change. but I thought there was, I can't remember the name of the movie off the top of my head, but the one with like Amy T. Garden, who I really like, or it's like a high school reunion. Oh, the Christmas class reunion.

Yeah, and they played around with the format a little bit, and I just, like, I really enjoyed that. I'm always a fan of the, like, you know, the traditional, like, the hometown Christmas type thing, too, but to see them, like, play around a little bit. And then we got, what was the one with, like, Taylor Hines and Andrew Walker, the three wise men and a baby? That was a ton of fun too. So it's interesting to see them like branch out. And you can, I find that when you have a Hallmark movie that, you know, takes a few more risks, you still get to like, you get to see what really is that core to the brand of Hallmark in terms of having that safe film experience that, like I started watching Hallmark movies just at night because I would get anxiety. at night and wouldn't be able to like fall asleep and it's just like I can put on a

Hallmark movie realize that the stakes are going to be super low and nothing is like going to go wrong and I think that um you know that there's something to be said about that experience and being able to kind of see what is uh you know see a film take risks with within the the bounds and the world that Hallmark kind of confines you to is uh is fun yeah I think that's the draw for a lot of people is like they know what they're going to get, especially we live in a world that is so chaotic. Like I said, we started in 2020 doing this. You know, obviously there was a lot of stuff going on during that time. And I think a lot of people are drawn to Hallmark knowing they know what they're going to get. It's always going to be a happy ending. You know, like you said, like it can

really calm your fears, I guess, in a very loud world. Yeah. Yeah, totally. Awesome. Well, let's get into the the reality TV. Do you want to just give a little bit of background on both of your experience with reality TV, how much you guys watch or don't watch? Can I go first? Please. Bravo is Appointment TV in my home. I watch a lot of it.

Vanderpump Rules is by far my favorite. I've watched from the very beginning. Hell yeah. But I watch them all. I watch most all of the housewife franchises, all the below-the-es. all the below decks, top chef, all of them. I watch all of them, and have for years. Oh, awesome.

So, yes, this is where we swap, wow. This is where we swap places because I was like the Hallmark expert. She's our Bravo expert. And I have like a toe in the Bravo world. I have been a watcher of the Orange County Housewives since day one. Oh, nice. And I've seen two seasons of very, under comp rules.

One and ten. Everyone had to watch ten. And I've watched a couple of the other housewife franchises, but I'm not immersed in the world. And I don't regularly watch either of the shows that we're talking about today. So half of my notes are like, why is she met at this person? What's the rumor? What's going on? What do you mean he got a new job?

What was he doing before? So I came with a lot of questions. And Wendy and I were downloading before. I could get caught up a little bit. Oh, awesome. And I think you guys had mentioned you're located in Orange County, correct? We are. We are. Land of Housewives out there. How do you find that the area is represented? Like, do you find that there is, I don't know, a distinct, like, cultural and, like, geographic identity that's portrayed on these shows, or could it basically just be anywhere? Well, I think with Orange County, Orange County is a huge place made up of a ton of different cities.

And so I think it is representative of a segment of the Orange County population. But it certainly isn't representative of the county as a whole. I mean, I think the vast majority of people of housewives are more like Wendy and I, right? Like average Joe's. And the show has got in a good way, in a good way, I think. And the show, Orange County started, obviously, in a different style than all the rest of the housewives and has gotten a little more aspirational. And it definitely wasn't. Yes, they filmed in Cotto that first season and they were like, oh, behind the gates of this exclusive community. But for the most part, those ladies were housewives. They weren't influencers. They weren't television personalities. And it has changed quite a bit since then.

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And there. There's definitely been like a ton of change and how like what a hostwife franchise is. It's definitely evolved a ton since that first season of Orange County. Let's dive into our content. So today we're going to be covering below deck Mediterranean. We don't often get our feet wet, as we like to say when we cover below deck. But we're going to do that today since New York is in reunion mode and Salt Lake City is for now the only housewife show that is airing new episodes.

Which would you guys, which did you find more compelling? Where would you like to start? Salt Lake City. Agree. All right. Let's, yeah, let's dive into Salt Lake City. What did you guys have for your highlights here? I need to talk about Mary and Robert Jr.

I have a lot of thoughts about that interaction on the couch in her home where she's discovering or trying to discover if in fact her son is married. And it was so, this is such a funny scene to come in as an outsider because what's weird is I don't think I actually have any less information than anybody else does in that moment. But when she was saying, are you married? And his response is, kind of. I thought, what do you mean? That's a horrible. I thought someone needs to smack the smile off his little millennial face because it's just such a young adult way of.

of speaking and I thought, answer the question. But it's just wild to me that they could live in the same house. They must have enough of a relationship that they share a home together, but not enough that at one point in the past year he couldn't disclose that he and his living girlfriend had gotten married. Yeah, it's like not only is he kind of married, he's kind of married for, I don't know, about a year. Yes.

What? How is this? Are you talking about this? It's just the most meaningless information. It's so insane. It's no big deal. Like, yeah, we had Chipotle for dinner last night. I don't understand. Like, where's Mary been for the last year that she doesn't realize that these two are together?

I know she's heard rumors because a couple of episodes prior to this episode, I think she had mentioned like, oh, I, I, I heard. heard that Robert might be married and so I'm going to need to talk to him about it. She's like, where have you been married? Put it on the to do list. Yeah, exactly. Get around to asking your son if he's married. And if that were me, I would have, whatever I was doing, dropped everything and raced home and pounded on their door. Excuse me, are you married?

Because that seems like pertinent information. Because it seemed implied that the girlfriend slash wife lives there at their home, right? Yeah. Yeah. She saw them running. at full speed down the hall. And I need to know why. Why did you have a secret wedding? Why?

That's a good question. Because Mary is different. It must have something to do with like the church. Maybe she does not go to their like, because she's like a cult leader, right? Yeah. And so maybe she lives like outside of the cult and, you know, you don't want to let your parents know that this girl you're seeing might be deprogramming you from being brainwashed in the cult. I don't know.

Interesting. Yeah. It's so wild to me. But I guess they can kind of like coexist fairly separately because Mary's house is huge. We got that scene when like Meredith shows up and it like they go into like a walk and talk. Like it was an Aaron Sorkin production. It felt like I was watching the West Wing as they're going through this long conversation. I love that. And she does make a comment to Meredith. She's like, well, we live in different. different wings and I thought, well, must be nice. As we record from my kitchen here.

All right. Yeah, what other highlights did you have? Well, the Whitney, I'm saving the best for last, okay? But I kind of wanted to talk about Whitney's meal with Justin, who I assume is her husband. Yes. And it looked like lunch, but they were eating like dinner. Like it was bright outside, but they're having a filet. I'm like, is this lunch?

Is this dinner? I got really hung up on that. But you didn't get hung up on the amount of food that was brought to the table. Well, I was surprised that they ordered a full meal, like a housewife ordering a filet plus I was impressed. Well, that's my favorite part on Housewives are any of these Bravo shows is like we hear their orders always. Yeah. And they brought so much more food to the table than they ordered. I thought it just was so random to me.

Yeah. It was almost like they were about to like shoot a commercial for this restaurant. They need to have, like, everything on the menu. I was wondering if the restaurant was, like, just trying to get as much on camera as they could just to try to milk their screen time. Look at our beautiful plating. Yeah. Yeah. So this scene, I had some deep thoughts on.

First of all, apparently Justin's gone back to work. And in that moment, I was like, was he not working before? Like, was he just a house husband? Oh, okay. And then he had a one year, like, non-compete clause so he couldn't work for a year or something. Oh, so he couldn't go back to? work. So she's complaining like, you know, he's like, I went to work and she's like, yeah, and I did everything else. And they were having this. She's like, you don't help. And he's like,

well, you don't have sex with me. And I thought, yikes. Early in my marriage, someone gave my husband and I the book, his needs, her needs. And ultimately, like, the whole point of the book is like, if your needs aren't, needs aren't being met, you're not going to be willing to meet your partner's needs. And you can get locked in this like dance and like, well, I'm not going to do anything. anything for you if you're not at some point something's got to give and the whole premise of the book was like well if you don't meet your husband's needs he's going to cheat like I'm not recommending this book but it did stick with me and I totally was in this one I'm like oh they're deadlock like someone something's got to give yeah someone's got to be the first well the background I

read on Justin is he's like direct sales president yeah it's like a multi-level marketing thing exactly exactly for for a company called awaken which is like it's it's it's supposed to like it's health and wellness and wealth oh he's a scatner let's just say it he's a skater yeah yeah health and wellness and heavy quotation marks right so it's kind of funny but I thought are these two headed for next season's like a vow renewal episode oh yeah maybe which is actually Kind of a kiss of death in the housewife world, but I thought, oh, we have some, you know, tension between these two. Could they possibly renew things next year because they're stronger and better and then, you know.

I think that that would be compelling television. Whitney is one of my favorite housewives on this franchise. And, you know, I think she's only kind of tapped like a quarter of her parents. hour. So seeing her kind of be unshackled by the burdens of Justin would be very compelling to me. But yeah, this scene was like, I thought it was really, I thought that Whitney did a great job of kind of communicating with Justin on this. And I kind of love seeing guys like Justin on these shows because it really sets a very low bar for me as a husband. You know, the idea that he's, just sitting there watching TV scrolling on his phone while she is getting the kids ready

and getting out the door and cleaning dog shit off the carpet or whatever it was that she said. It's just like so mind-blowing to me that you would have a dynamic where you don't try to carry that that load when you see a partner that is kind of juggling a bunch of things. but yeah, it seemed like she was doing a great job of communicating and for that to be just met with, you know, well, I don't want to be the one that always initiate sex is. Yeah. It's like how I'm always the one who initiates sex.

Is it like that? Is it really like that? Or were you just looking for any opportunity to say that? Yeah. Well, but you, it was like that I have nothing else to stay here, so I got to throw something back at you. Did you guys have any other highlights from this episode? I mean, it's got to be the party with its dual conflict at the end there.

Yeah. This is the Greek Easter party, which I was not able to ascertain what makes Greek Easter different from, you know. It falls on a different day. Oh, okay. My husband's Armenian and like the Greek and Armenian communities are very similar. And there was some other tie in here to that that I cannot. Oh, the money dance when they did that at my wedding to Armenian dancing. Oh, 100%.

It's on video. And one of my husband's friends is like, it's like a Jay-Z video in here. It just made me laugh that they were doing it at this like Easter celebration. And it's a whole thing. So anyway, that's, I have lots of thoughts on these arguments. Okay. So should we do, should we do? It was a hard scene to watch because it was like inner cut between like,

like Heather and Lisa's conversation and then Monica and Angie's conversation. So, but I think both are important to talk about. Yeah. So let's talk with, can we, can we cover Heather and Lisa first? For sure. Yeah. So I think Heather needs to stand down because Jack going on his mission has nothing to do with Heather. She should not have an opinion on it. And I felt for Lisa and thought she had an appropriate response to Heather. She was like, I'm just trying to support myself. I'm sorry that doesn't work with, you know, your bad Mormon narrative right now. So I felt really bad for Lisa. But like, Heather, it's not of her business, right?

Well, and I think it supports her position as this bad Mormon who's like left the church and is now I'm so accepting and like I'm so excited for the bigger, wider world. We also need to be accepting of this choice, right? You don't. You're supporting your friend and her son going on. the mission doesn't mean like I believe in everything you're saying. It means like, I'm your friend. I'm going to be here for you. Your son's leaving for two years.

That's a hard thing for a mom. It's a hard thing for a kid who knows where he's going to end up somewhere in the world. That's all you need to do here. You don't need to be like, I don't believe in this and you shouldn't either. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, totally. And I think like Heather is, she's got her own like stuff that she still needs a process from leaving the church.

obviously. But I think part of that is just realizing that, you know, missionaries aren't as like, they're not as effective as she seems to think they are. Like, like, how many doors is he going to knock on and how many people is he actually legitimately going to convert and balance that against, you know, what your supposed friend is going to be going through by, you know, not being able to see their child for two years. It's a numbers game, right? It's like telemarketing. You, you, you, even if it's just like one hit per 100, it's like still enough that it's going to be worthwhile for the organization. Otherwise,

they wouldn't do it. Yeah, yeah, true. I do have, I do have a little bit more sympathy, I think, for Heather's position than you guys do, just because I do think that, I mean,

yeah, I mean, she's being like trying to sell her book narrative too. I get that. But I think she is being a little principle too in the sense, like she had a conversation with, um, with Whitney,

I think in the previous episode where she was like, you know, we agree the church is bad. We agree that it's, homophobic, that it's misogynist and things like that. So like, why can't other people stand on principle and say, I'm just not going to support it? Because it's like, you know, the principle of not supporting an institution that's that we agree causes a lot of harm is, is kind of more important than just like being a good friend and being easygoing and everything's fine because we're buddies or whatever.

I think there is something to be said for like having the more principled position of being like, okay, there are bad organizations. I won't support them. Yeah, I think that's fair if she was more like broadly attacking this idea of people going on missions. But it's very selective, selectively directed at Lisa and Jack. Like I don't know. I haven't, you know, I've read about it's going out and saying like, fuck you, Jack. I hate you or anything. Right.

She's just like not wanting to be one of the people who is like, oh, that's so great. I'm so happy for you. Yeah. And she's like, how come you haven't read my book, Lisa? Like, why don't you read my book? Lisa hasn't even read the book of Mormon. She's not going to read Bad Mormon first. The book of Bad Mormon, yeah.

Wendy had an interesting take on why Heather might be clashing with Lisa. Do you think it's possible that Heather is jealous of Lisa's relationship with the church? It's wildly different than Heather. You know, Lisa drinks, she owns a liquor company. Like, how is that excessive? in the church. I just think Heather is struggling with with that. Yeah, like Lisa gets to have like the best of both worlds, right?

Because I don't know Heather's entire story, but I do think there's part of her that accepts like there are positive parts of the church, like the community piece. But so she had to leave that behind in order to be her own person and Lisa hasn't had to do that. Yeah. So I think jealousy is one way to look at it. I think another way is that Heather still has this. conflict within herself because I think she's such like a rules based person and a lot of that has to do with the fact that she grew up her whole life basing her personality around being the one who

can follow the rules to being a Mormon better than everybody else can follow the rules to being a Mormon and now that she's decided she wants to break from it she wants to be strict about following the rules to not being a Mormon and I think she she has trouble with people who are less rules based than her and are more like yeah I do a bit of this and a bit of that when her personality is like very invested in, like, following a code. Yeah, that's a good point. How do you guys feel about the church being almost like a housewife on this show? My things about the show, I think.

Yeah. Yeah, right? It's just so interesting. It's so interesting from like, especially an outsider perspective. Like, I don't know anything about the Mormon church. So it's so weird to see, like, and interesting to see these people, like, have these, like, struggles, these really internal struggles. So I find it one of the most interesting parts of the housewife franchises because none of them have anything like this.

Yeah. And one of the things that I think is very interesting about that is the fact that when you watch any sort of other media or art that kind of focuses on the Mormon faith, it is very focused on like, the text and the ritual of it all and the church as an entity. Whereas this is one of the unique shows that I feel like you kind of explore Mormonism, if that's how it's, is it Mormonism? Mormonism? I think so. Yeah.

Where you get a sense of like it as a culture and the sort of the culture and the culture and the community around it is, I don't know. I enjoy seeing those insights because we've talked in the past about how the geographic culture of these shows really plays a part. And I think that maybe only New Jersey comes close to that being as true a statement as on Salt Lake City. I agree. You want to talk about Monica and her mom?

Oh, yeah. Yeah, Linda. L.D., Craig. L.D. This was, we went back and forth about this because I didn't know the Monica backstory, but, you know, Wendy's perspective is like Monica was the messenger and it's kind of like the messenger's getting shot in this moment. Yes, right, because correct me if I'm wrong. Meredith is the one who started the rumors about Angie's husband, right? Or is spreading the rumors.

Not according to Meredith, but according to other people. Right. But Meredith doesn't seem to understand what it is to spread a rumor. She's like, I'm not spreading rumors. I'm just talking about the people that are spreading rumors. That's the same thing. I don't know if we actually caught Meredith saying anything specifically. We didn't get her uttering the exact text of the rumor. We had her saying that they're rumors.

You want me to talk about her husband because I'll fucking go there. But I don't think we actually heard her talking about her husband. I had a show second. I love the marriage contraction. I had to show Megan that clip this morning. I was like, wait, wait, wait, you need the backstory on this. You got to watch this. But I also, I know we need to talk about Monica, but I also love Meredith in that moment where

she gives her own basically like, I have gay friends. So obviously I couldn't be spreading a rumor about someone being gay. And I was like, oh, this is not the flex. I think it is. Like, I'm going to the GLAD Awards. Yeah. So is Angie pissed at Monica because Monica, because Monica, went to Angie and said there are rumors being talked about you?

I guess so. I think my my personal take on it was that it is a more like strategic move. Like I feel like she's attacking Monica because Monica has the least social currency out of all the other housewives. The other ones have seasons under their belt. She can like, you know, Whitney basically set Monica up to be someone that could be. someone that could take the fall for putting this out there. And, you know, Angie's kind of taking the bait. It's the easy way out for her. Yeah. What I think, I think that Angie does have a reason to be

mad at Monica. But the reason isn't the reason she's attacking her for. She should be mad at Monica because of what happened when they went on their trip to Palm Springs there, where Monica was supposed to be Angie's friend just was like freezing out Angie and was totally sucking up to Meredith the whole time at Angie's expense. That's what Angie should be mad about. And maybe that is what she's mad about actually, but she's redirecting it to being like, oh, you're the one spreading rumors, which doesn't make sense because, like, Monica was the one who got goaded by Whitney into participating into going to Angie and saying, you should know that people are, are spreading rumors. But, you know, Angie's like, oh, if you're concerned about me, you should just take me aside and tell me that people are

saying things. That's what she did. That's exactly what she fucking did. Like, she seems to be using this as an excuse to get mad at Monica. Not, I don't think it's the real reason. Not very Christ-like of her. Yeah. Well, Monica in this scene gives me real Kelly Dodd vibes. Like, she's like a dog with a bone and she can't let it go. And, you know, when she's like, you tell her to be quiet, I was like, oh, Kelly Dodd is in the house right now.

I am torn. Sorry, go ahead. No, go ahead. I'm torn about LD's response because on the one hand at the end Monica's like, I just want a mom who supports me. But Wendy and I, I mean, we're parents of teenagers and like I support my kids, but I don't encourage them when they're acting like jerks. I'm not standing behind them like, yeah. I'd be like, and granted my kids are still children. They're minors, but I don't necessarily think she was fully in the wrong telling Monica to stand down a little bit here.

Yeah, have you seen the backlash against LD online? Yeah, I have. And actually, like, it kind of, I was on Monica's side a bit here. Like, for one, I feel like Monica gets a little bit of leeway because it is a reality TV show. Like, this is exactly the place that she should be having this fight. That's what you're supposed to do. It's the job description. I thought that, like, Linda.

I didn't really like the way that she carried herself. I got a comparison to another host wife. And actually, she speaks Bravo, which is an Instagram account and YouTube channel that I watch. She's really good. Emily Hanks. She said that Linda reminds her of Ramona singer from New York. And immediately, like, I was like, that is who she reminds me of. Like, that is 100% who I get from that, just being very, like,

self-centered and unaware. And the way that she kind of navigated this situation really felt like, you know, Ramona navigating things, which, you know, great, great housewife. I probably wouldn't want Ramona as as a mother figure, though. Personally, I'm totally on Monica's side, honestly. I haven't read the backlash either. I try to stay out of that if I can. But I feel like it's just like it's like the worst.

nightmare growing up example of like having your mom stay with you during your sleepover and just like really piss you off. I think the thing about Monica and her mom's relationship on the show, which we've seen a lot of, is that Monica seems to be really coming from the perspective of like, okay, this is going to be a chance for us to do therapy about all my childhood trauma on TV. And Monica's mom's perspective is like, this is a chance for me to be on TV. Right. Right. And. And. And show everybody what a good mom I am. Like, this is what I expect of my children. Look what I've raised.

Yeah, from the moment she shows up at the party and says, I'm LD, to the moment where she like sits down with the guys and is like, oh, I'm going to sit with the guys now. Do any of you guys play college ball? It was just clear that she was just like so ready to just be like, I'm going to be on camera. I'm going to be like a star here. And I just thought that was really at the expense of her daughter because, yes, I do think, like, Monica was was dialing it up pretty hard.

And I get the perspective that, like, oh, you're in somebody else's house. You shouldn't have attacked it too hard. Angie did kind of start it, though. And again, it's a housewife show. That's what you do on these shows. And I do think that, that, I don't think that, that Monica's mom had to be like, yeah, go, I'm in your quarter. I'm, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm your coach, Rocky. Just go get them.

I don't, but I don't think she had to, like, just keep saying. over and over again, come with me to the bathroom, come with me to the bathroom. And then being like, oh, I'm so sorry, you know, to Angie. And just, like, apologizing profusely for her daughter who's really upset right now. I just think she could have been a little more understanding of her daughter's perspective because that's your fucking daughter. And I, and I did feel bad for little Monica when she had, when it, like, obviously opened up more wounds for her because she still has, she clearly has so many wounds from her relationship

with her mom that she's, like, trying to find some way to navigate. and it's trying to do that on TV. And it's obviously just a very vulnerable situation. But I did feel bad for Monica more than anything else. Yeah, I don't know. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. No, go ahead.

I was going to say, like, I had a really volatile relationship with my mother. I don't think I'd ever be like, you know what? Let's go on a reality TV show. We're going to work out. Like, no, never, never, ever. Yeah, and I think Linda missed an operational. opportunity to stand down. I can understand the like, hey, maybe we calmed out. And then that needed to be it because Monica wasn't having it. Yeah, exactly. Once it's clear, Monica's not going to go

talk with you in the bathroom or whatever. Yeah, you're escalating the situation. Then stop trying to make yourself the center of it and stop trying to constantly hang around while she's trying to discuss with somebody else. And asking the host's father if he's single and. Yeah, everything beyond that first attempt to like, say, you know, just calm down. Everything beyond that, it felt like it was a show for the camera to be. It was a show. It was so performative.

And the way that she like lit up when she got called fun at one point later on in the party, it was like, okay, this lady is really looking for validation in front of the camera. Like not just trying to be there for her daughter or to build some bond or the motives are purely like self-centered. That's my perspective basically. Yeah. Interesting. And I thought the like the ending note for this show was amazing how they cut this together with the confessional of Monica saying, I wish I had a different mom and then people

being like, I feel so bad for her mom. Just, you know, posing that as a question to the audience. I just thought that that was a really powerful way to end this show. Yeah. Me too. It was sad. It was sad, right? It was bad.

I thought that heard. Yeah. Did you guys have any other thoughts on Salt Lake City? Other than I would like to go to the Wick Lab and Mary's lunch spread when Meredith came over, it was truly impressive for two women who were going to stand at the counter and talk together for ten minutes. I was a giant charcutory board. I was like, oh, look at you.

I mean, I know that's like a staple of the housewife world. I just thought, you know, if that were me, it would not look like that. Dylan, what are your highlights here? The intro with Easter Bunny. Great work by everybody involved. In Heather's car. In Heather's car, yeah. Unfortunately, we had that moment kind of spoiled because they kept showing it in like

teasers, but just a great collection of little clips of people being creeped out by an Easter Buddy. Love the fact that when Easter Buddy shows up, he gets little Kyron. He has a little name tag that says Mr. Bunny on screen. just great work by the editors, great work by setting them up. The little bit where Mary rolls down her window with the most awkward smile on her face is brilliant. Wonderful montage right there. That's basically it.

Otherwise, we basically covered the grand. Yeah, I think we covered most of what I wanted to talk about as well. The only other note I had here was like Father John looked. like he was rented from Party City. Like he did not seem authentic at all. I don't know where they got this guy from, but he looked like he was like from an S&L sketch or something. And then Angie's long-winded story about Christ,

where she's really like talking about herself, I thought was so hilarious. For me, that was very reminiscent of Vicki Gunwelson, did it in Orange County to at one point. years and years ago, I don't know how long you guys watched these shows, but like she, was she baptized or was Tamara was baptized? Tamara was, yeah. She was talking about like, I don't remember. It was very similar though, but very funny. Yeah. Yeah, I feel like Angie is doing a great job just coming and like making the most out of

every moment that she gets. Really, really driving home that message. that she is in fact Greek. And yeah. Yeah, no, let's move on to below deck med. What were your guys' thoughts on this, Megan and Wendy? Below deck med is real hard to take notes on because the scene to scene is so fast. Oh, yeah. It is so fast.

I've never really watched it like that closely. It's a big cast, too, right? It's a lot of people. cast and Megan was like I have no idea these people I was just writing like French guy Australian guy yeah yeah that's basically either to me or Natalia I don't know which one's which like it took you know 40 minutes into the episode I'm just trying to guess by the accents of like South African is this another South African how many South Africans are there on the yeah it's funny watch because I watch these back to back so housewives is very like this is the party scene

this is the lunch at our like everything is very broken up and below deck is not lot like that. And I think it speaks to the show, too. It's so much more chaotic because they're actually working these charters. But my notes are all centered around like the three main conflicts in this episode because I feel like that's it's all conflict. Which conflict was the most compelling to you? Natalia and Toomey is the most compelling, although I did feel pretty strongly in a lot of cases. But in a vacuum, so I watched this episode in a vacuum. Wendy was giving me a little bit of the backstory on Natalia and Toomey. But as a viewer, I felt like Natalia needed to maybe check herself a little bit because

Toomey's her boss. And so when Toomey says, hey, this is how we turn over the rooms in the middle of the day. It's whether Natalia did it differently in her time as Chief Stu doesn't really matter anymore. Like I think it's, you need to say, okay, these are the expectations. And when Toomey says, hey, I'd like to have a conversation, and Talia says, I'm not speaking to you. We can speak through Kyle. I thought, who talks that way to their boss?

Right. And I get it's compelling TV. But I just, I felt like Toomey did try and come in with a little bit of kindness and grace in spite of being incredibly frustrated. And Natalia at no point returned that. Yeah. This was a really. interesting conflict because I can totally get that read on this in a vacuum. And I think like,

even with extra context, like, yeah, Natalia needs to tone it down a little bit. But I thought especially the scene that we got towards the endish where, uh, after things had de escalated a little bit and Tumie tries to approach Italia in the laundry room, um, I thought that Tumie had a great approach to opening up that conversation with, um, I thought that Tumie had a great approach to opening up that conversation with Natalia but also I think that like Natalia's complaints are very valid and to me did not do a good job of like hearing that even after you know recognizing that she should like take the L and like try to move forward for the sake of being a good leader and having a good like chemistry on on the on the the job um you know you can't like go back in time and remake the rooms or

like unsend the text or whatever. So like you just have to like find a way to move forward the best. And I don't think that Tooby did a great job of that. And my thoughts just on like how the situation got to this point. I can totally get where Natalia is coming from because she did like step into that chief role. And like by my perspective did a great job on the first charter. And then to have Toomey come in. yes she was expecting her to be chief stew but then to me to just be like by the way you're going

down to like third stew you're going to be in the the laundry and like not really be very grateful i can kind of see how she was rubbed the wrong way and then to have that like not just be ungrateful but to get a text message or relayed to her through kyle who says that to me's like, oh, I'll just fire her is would definitely fire her up. So, yeah, it's a really compelling conflict. And let's not forget about the third person in this conflict. Kyle, he's the biggest problem in the conflict, I think. I mean, they all have their issues, but Kyle is being so two-faced.

Like, he goes to Natalia and says the shit that Toomey said and then goes back to Toomey and says that stuff. So, like, I don't understand how these two women are not really. realizing that he is like the common factor that is causing so much like miscommunication and toxicity and you know. I feel like Kyle just fucking loves it too. Like he just relishes being the intermediary and he makes sure he's the one, you know, organizing between people who are in an argument.

Like he just seems to love that role. Well, that's what I said. Like he wants to stay relevant. Like when she, you know, as long as they're mad at each other, they're coming to him. So he's in the mix. It's wild to me because Natalia and Kyle worked together last season and they fought a lot too. So I'm like, why is Natalia like confessing to Kyle or venting to Kyle? She has experience knowing that Kyle's going to turn around and say whatever she's saying or repeat what she says to the chief.

So Natalia needs to be smarter. Yeah. I actually like, yes, I also blame some. some blame on on kyle i think like maybe natalia feels a little trauma bonded to him like they went through a season on a yacht together and so she perceives their bond as being stronger than maybe it is but i think a big like uh culprit in this situation is sandy like i feel like this situation would not have been the way it was if sandy had her shit together and had the boat in order when everyone came on wouldn't have set like natalia up to be disappointed and and and

fail and it's just like a complete mess that to me has to come into and navigate um and like also knowing that to me doesn't have experience as a chiefs do that she's going to have to navigate this brand new situation um she's really setting to me up for failure as well and i like to me's not really hitting the ground running like she runs. to Sandy almost immediately indicating that she can't like handle her crew. But yeah, it's, uh, it's just a mess. And I think like a lot of it has to do with the fact that Sandy just doesn't have her shit in order.

Well, in terms of Sandy too, I really hate her management style where she's like, I'm going to be hands off. You guys need to figure it out. And that goes too far because it's like imploding by the, and it's never figured out. And then Sandy's like, she's going to end up having to fire one. these people. Maybe. I don't know.

I just don't like Sandy's management style. Captain Lee would never. He would have had, like, I don't know if you guys watched this show, but Captain Lee would not have allowed this bickering to go on for so long. It's true. But like Captain Lee also has like a relatively hands off management style, but he like seems to handle it better. Like, I don't know.

he's able to handle his leads better than Sandy is because he makes it known that if you if it gets to a point where it's coming to me I'm going to deal with it and that's how it's going to look for you whereas Sandy is like okay let's be she's very wishy-washy

and hands off and then like people come to her it cut like more problems end up coming up to her and she doesn't give good solutions she just like kind of pushes things back back off I agree. Yeah, it's a mess. Yeah, that was kind of my reading out too.

I'm also, like Megan, I'm also coming into the show for the first time. I've actually, I've never watched it before. I'm just getting into below deck, even though I'm pushing to include more below deck because I'm starting to really like it. But not knowing the broader context, my reaction to Natalia versus to me was basically the same as Megan's. Like, I feel like Natalia was the one who was getting too. defensive and too angry and that again yeah like that is your superior officer you have there has to be like some sort of you know chain of order or it's just not going to work and the fact that she's the one natalie's the one like it's not like to me's coming to her and being like you did the work wrong and

chewing her out natalia's like oh i heard you thought i did the work wrong i'm going to call you on the radio and be like come over here and talk to me like what what the fuck are you doing like and and and i think that sandy should have handled that way better because it is the captain's job i think to enforce the order because otherwise it's just going to break down and it's just going to fall along personality lines instead of like chain of command lines. If you just say, oh, you guys work it out or to say to me, you apologize to her, which I thought was a really bad read. I think like the captain's perspective should be like first and foremost, you know, you don't

talk to your superior officer that way. So let's like just reinforce the structure of the workplace, like first of all. and say to Natalia, if you have a problem with, like, the way that Toomey is handling you, you come and tell me about it. You know, you come and tell me, and then I'll talk to Toomey. You don't just go directly and start shit with her. So, yeah, I, I, just in this episode out of context, it felt to be like Natalia was the bigger problem, but also more broadly that Captain Sandy was not handling it.

Well, I do agree with that with you guys on that. Do you think Sandy's going to end up firing? of these two? I think someone, yeah, someone is going to leave. I don't know whether it's going to be a firing or if it's going to be someone walking. But I guess it's hard to say because Tumi was on Blow Deck Down Under, right? In Natalia, this is her second season. So, you know, if one of these was a returning Yachty and the other was new, I would put money on

whoever the new one was being, like, leaving. but I didn't watch Below Deck down under, but I did watch the previous season of Below Deck Mad, so I'm familiar with Natalia. I don't know what the reception was on Toomey, and if she is much of a favorite or how she's going to, she's a bit more like unpredictable in like my mind because I just don't have the contacts on her. So I don't know what what is going to happen here. It's kind of up in the air. This is why Below Deck is one of my favorite shows to watch.

I just love it. I love it so much. I'm telling you, Appointment TV. My husband and I watched this on Monday nights together. It's just so good. It seems like there's more actual stakes. I mean, I understand like they're on a show, but they're also doing a job outside of their job as reality TV stars.

Yeah. So the stakes are a little bit higher. And there's the fact that people get, fired on this show. People get fired mid-season. So it's not like you don't know week to week whether someone is going to actually make it through the week.

They can actually amp up the drama to a point where we see someone like leave for good. And that makes it extra compelling. Yeah. Speaking of getting fired, I'm certain Max is going to get fired.

Oh my, please fire him. I don't want him to get fired because he's funny to me. I'm watching. Oh, sorry. I'm sorry. No, I'm sorry. This is actually, some of these things in these shows are like especially relatable to me too because I work in the hospitality industry so I see some of these like relationships and I'm like, oh, this is too relatable to me. But Max in particular, where I work, I've got

lots of young French guys working for me and a lot of them are just like this Max fucker who are just basically had this perspective of that like work isn't real. You know, like you're just here to do a job in theory, but you're basically just here to be here. And I just find Beck's hilarious. And I know exactly how fucking frustrating it would be to have to work with this guy. But to just be able to watch him is a delight. I find it really funny. And I love how, like, yeah, right at the start, we got this bit where, like, where he's, like,

struggling to communicate. And his coworker is like, oh, take the passerell and move it. And he's like, what? I don't understand. Like, Passell is literally a French word. Why is that the one word you don't understand? This makes no fucking says. He blames all of his.

He's like, well, on friendships, we don't have this problem. It's the Americans that are causing the problem. And I was like, first of all, I mean, I guess Captain Tandy's an American, but it's not, anyway, the Chandler Bing Giff where he's like, shut up, shut up, shut up. is how I felt about Max this entire episode, although I will say, it's really funny when liners came out of their interactions with him, or she's like, we can't just sit around and wank,

like get up your ass and climb up this hill. He's funny, but so frustrating. Like, they just need to drop him over the edge at some point. Yeah, I really love that line for I think it was Haley right at the end when they're working together. And she's like, can you just shut up just a little bit? Yes. A little bit.

I really enjoy the deck team on this, on this boat. Like I love like the two strong girls and Laura is probably my one of my favorite deckies. I just love the stuff that she says. She's so funny. Yeah.

I got kicked in the dick or something. It's great having Laura and Max because they're total opposites where Max is totally like work is fake. It's not a real thing. And Laura's like it's just all work. Like you just, we're here to work. Everybody's here to work. Just like total polar opposite perspectives.

I love it. I love it. Yeah, he's the perfect foil. Yeah. Now, do you think Luca is over his head a little bit as this new Bosen? He was on below deck down under last season. Oh, okay. And kind of a fan favorite, like, because everybody thinks he's super cute.

So coming onto this, onto this, on below deck med, I think he just got thrown into that Boson position, but I don't know. I don't think he knows how to handle Mac. like this it's out of his range you know yeah i i don't know i i feel like i haven't seen enough of luka like working meaningfully like it seems like a lot of the focus is on everyone underneath him on on the deck team like so i i don't know um yeah i'm curious what what your take is on that because i like i said i hadn't seen the below deck down under i think lucas kind of like an all good vibes kind of dude.

And now that Max has come in and kind of like disrupted the deck chemistry because it was so good in the first charter, I think that it's going to be interesting. I'm curious to see if he still tries to be like, oh, it's all good, everything's good, and work with Max or how frustrating Max is going to get to him. I don't know. I don't know. It's going to be interesting because I'm sorry. Luca had come on mid-season on Below Deck Down Under, too.

So we didn't get a ton of him there. Oh, okay. Yeah, anyway, I'm just curious. I watched, like, the beginning of Below Deck Down Under up until, I guess, shortly after the, you know, the controversial, like, sexual assault scene. So I've got, like, a little bit of context on these people, but not a, uh, uh, to, ton. I guess I'm going to have to start keeping up with the other below deck. Actually,

down under is the only one that I haven't really followed because I love below deck adventure, the one with Fay, who's a chief stew. Yes. Anyways, I think on like Sandy's boats, I feel like the deck team is at a bit of an advantage because that is kind of her space where she feels like a little bit more comfortable.

And I think she does a better job of, handling and managing a deck crew, whereas with the service team, she's just like, oh, whatever, you figure it out. You're right, because historically, I think she's always been very supportive of the deck crew. And like, if you remember Malia, she was always very supportive of Malia up and coming. And on the interior, like, her and Hannah used to go head to head all the time. Yeah. So that's a really interesting take.

Yeah, I think. And like she firmly came down on the side of Malia in that. And I think that was, you know, I feel like Sandy and Malia were dead wrong on that. And mostly because I'm just really disappointed because I think Hannah was one of the best chief stews. I love Hannah. These shows are really like driven by the chief stews on these shows. I think like if you've got a good chief stew, that's what makes the show. For me at least, like I think, you.

You know, Kate Chastain is one of the all-time best reality TV personalities that has been on Bravo or anywhere else, in my opinion. Hannah was fantastic. I like Daisy on Blow Deck Sailing Yacht. I think Faye is great. I'm a little, like, lukewarm on, what's her name, on Blowdeck Down Under, but Asia. Yeah. I think she's, I think that she's fun, but I don't think that she, she, has the

chemistry to like carry a franchise in the way that any of the other chiefs do that we've got have had. This is Wendy's Roman Empire. So what's your favorite what's your favorite below deck franchise?

I like Mediterranean. I like I like Sandy's. I don't I don't love Sandy but I love, I don't know. I think Mediterranean. Oh, I do like saline though too. Yeah, sailing's really good too. I like Captain Glenn and Gary's problematic.

So, yeah. There's so many. There's so many. And they like start right after it. There's always a below deck on. There's always a below deck on, yes. Yeah. And for a while there, there was like two episodes.

I think sailing yacht was it that they did like they released two episodes a week or something like that? Yeah, there was a lot to stay on top of. They just had so much. There's no shortage of Uber wealthy people chartering boats. Evidently willing to have their lives filmed. Well, that's the final interesting thing to me is the editing of the guests was really interesting because up until the final dinner scene, we got like the tiniest snippets.

Like they'd order a coffee or they're walking and shopping and we get two out of context lines. And I thought it was so interesting. They're like, we don't really want you to buy into these people because they're going to be gone, but we just want you to see what's happening. But that final scene made me so uncomfortable with the tone. Oh, the pan-fried tofu versus breaded tofu. And I'm over here, I'm like, that is a legitimate method of frying something. Right, that's what I was thinking too.

Yeah, yeah. You did not say bread at first. Yes, it's fine to want what you want, speak up, but that isn't what you said. Can you even imagine, I'm just not this person, but I wouldn't be like, bring the chef to the table, please. Oh, gosh. I would like to rip him a new one. I would rather jump over deck than something like that. I would be mortified.

There was a hair in my food I wouldn't ask to speak to this chef. There's nothing you could do. I love when guests go bad. These guests are not even as bad as some that we've seen. Oh, yeah, you're right. I know the vegan or the plant-based eater was caused some trouble. She likes what she likes. And this is one of those moments.

You kind of feel like it's probably been building up, right? She's like, I know I'm getting a subpar experience because they're cooking these full meals for everybody and then they're having to make an alternative meal for me. It's never quite as good and I'm just tired of being kind of the afterthought and I just want this easy to make thing and it didn't come out the way I want. And I just, I could feel her frustration coming through in that moment. I get it. But the semantics were wrong. And she wasn't the like the primary guest, right? She wasn't the primary who has like the special like.

the special like pull so um yeah i i could just never see myself in that position but that's one of things that is so fun about these shows you get to see like i've worked in customer service before and so like i have seen these people you know smaller versions of these people play out and so to see the like the super villains of customer service a rogue's gallery of them coming on every every few weeks is really entertaining. What was I going to say? My husband and I always have this running joke when we watched the show. We're like, what would you order?

Like, what would be on your preference sheet? And ours is always like, put some chips and dip out and, like, leave us alone. We would be fine. Like, we don't need to be cater to. I don't need a seafood tower. I don't, whatever, you know? I'm like, just don't serve me kangaroo, which they served on below deck. Oh, no.

Down underlaw last season. But it's so funny to watch these guests come on and be so demanding. Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy. One of the things that always stands out to me on these shows is the parties too. They always request theme parties and like how great of a theme party can you have on a boat? Why is that not a good enough theme? Like just being on a yacht.

See, go out. It's beautiful. I feel like that's enough. I would never expect, like, the deck crew or the interior to be like, now entertain me, you know, like, I don't need you to put on a comedy show or whatever. Like, no, leave me alone. I've seen a handful of other below deck episodes. And I, they have, and I don't know if it's the same on this because we didn't really see it, but they have one person who's in charge of, like, table scapes. And their whole thing is, like, all the decorations they bring.

And I think, what a waste of time. Like, put beautiful flowers out. I just think you're paying this. Surely there's a better use of this person's time on this boat with limited space. Well, Sandy always has a hard on for like it has to be great tablescape. Always. And they haven't, she was always on Hannah, remember? Because Hannah was not great at it.

And, but they haven't really like focused a lot on that this season. I just don't think the guests care. No, I wouldn't care either. You can have like this like perfect like 10 course meal come out. But if there's not enough of those little glass. beat Sandy's like, oh, service needs to step it up. Yeah, did you guys have any other final thoughts on Blow Deck? That's it for me.

That's it for me too.