Oscars Outsider - Have Spoon, Will Travel w/ Ji Hae Wiley (RHONY S14E10, RHOC S17E14, RHOSLC S04E02)

Episode Date: September 19, 2023

What a week in the Bravo-sphere and we've got The Real Bitch of Bravo Ji Hae Wiley here to talk about it! We're talking Real Housewives of New York S14E10, Real Housewives of Orange County S17E14, Real Housewives of Salt Lake City S04E02. In our RHONY recap we discuss Brynn Whitfield's flirting with Jenna Lyons and discuss whether Jessel Taank, Erin Lichy, Sai De Silva or Ubah Hassan will be one-and-done housewives In our RHOC recap we discuss hired-spoon Vicki Gunvalson and the Tres Amigas reunion. In our RHOSLC recap we discuss whether the fresh starts between Whitney Rose/Heather Gay and Lisa Barlow/Meredith Marks will stand the test of time. Chapters: 00:00 - Intro 02:49 - Real Housewives of New York S14E10 17:36 - Real Housewives of Orange County S17E14 41:13 - Real Housewives of Salt Lake City S04E02 1:02:19 - Outro Find Ji Hae Wiley on instagram https://www.instagram.com/the_real_bitch_of_bravo/ Find Dylan on substack at ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://dylanferguson.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠ Find "The Devil You Don't" on Youtube: ⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tBassBNwKc&list=PLCGSy4_xHhBsbX0VlG3JDJwaiqsBkiGDj⁠⁠ https://www.bravooutsider.com Music by FASSounds from Pixabay #rhoslc #rhony #rhoc #realitytv

Hello and welcome to Bravo Outsider. I'm your host Craig Midwinter joined as always by Dylan Ferguson. Dylan, how's it going? It's going good. Happy to be here, as always. How you doing? Yeah, I'm doing excellent. Stoke to be here.

And also stoked to have on the podcast this week from Real Bitch of Bravo podcast. It's G. Hay Wiley. I may be the real bitch of Bravo, but there's nothing fake about this bitch. That's good. That was one that you came up with on the spot? Yeah, that's on the dome. Sorry, guys. Sorry for the improv.

No, that's good. Glad to have you on the podcast. We did your show like way back when we were first getting started out and really finding our sea legs here. Glad to have you on. Do you want to let our listeners know a bit about your podcast? Absolutely. Well, first of all, I want to say thank you so much, A, for being on my podcast and B, for having me on your podcast. Craig and Dylan, it's a pleasure to be here.

Thank you, first of all, for that. Second of all, yeah, sure, you guys can, anywhere you get your podcast, it's the real bitch of Bravo podcast with G. Hey, Wiley. It's literally, that's the whole entire title because I guess I had to differentiate myself. But yeah, you can get me anywhere you get your podcast. So Spotify, Apple, Google Podcasts. Yeah, we just basically, it's me and my girlfriends and we get to bitch about Bravo. So it's amazing.

It's my great outlet. So I don't have to have my boyfriend hear me talk about. all the time. He should be so lucky. We've got a full roster of shows to cover this week. So we're going to talk about the most recent episodes of Real Housewives of Orange County, real hostwives of Salt Lake City and of New York. G.

Hey, which one of these shows are you most excited to talk about? All of them. All of them. I have no preference. You can go anywhere. Bravo just keeps giving men with all the drama So I love all three of these franchises I'm obviously a day oneer for Orange County

I ride for that Even in even before they brought Tamara back I still kept watching Rehaas of Orange County and those are some brutal seasons Let me tell you but yeah I ride for Orange County I'm glad Tamara's back And then maybe second would be Salt Lake City New York the new cast right now

I love them but this is my just my ranking. But New York, the new cast is great. Um, I do miss the old cast a little bit, but they're still doing a great job. I think that they're bringing the drama. It's not as much as obviously we would like. I think for me personally, um, but I still love it. I still think they're doing a great job. Yeah. Well, let's get into New York. I, uh, I'm really enjoying this cast. And you're right, it hasn't been like jam packed with, uh, drama. But I, I feel like they're bringing it in all sorts of other areas that really kind of make up for that for me. And I mean, this most recent episode seems like it's like queuing up the next one to be a

real heater. So I'm, I'm pretty excited about that. What were your highlights from this episode? I mean, the highlight, you're right, is the fight that continues, you know, in the next episode between Uba and Aaron. I think that that's probably what I'm looking forward to the most or what I was looking forward to with this episode. I thought they were going to give us a little bit more than what they

gave us. But I like that. Another highlight from this episode, I love the Jessel drama that they're like, you're a liar, but you're not telling us enough and like all the back and forth between that and all of her stuff, including the family, but not really including her life. And then her trying to, there was a lot, there were a lot of layers to that conversation about trying to get to know Jessel. So, which I really enjoyed. I thought that was funny. And those are probably my main highlights. Bryn with the flirting has got to dial it down for me. I know she never will and that's just how Brin is.

I think the flirting has gotten to the next level where now she's flirting, you know, with our main girl, Jenna Lyons, who I will ride for that woman. She is the apple of everything. Like, I just love her. And I think she is definitely the fan favorite. I think it's very obvious. But I think that the flirting just needs to take a notch down, sweet heart. Like, you're getting to like the lesbian.

side now of the flirting. I just I I I need you to taper it down. I I kind of appreciated how like indiscriminate she is about who she's flirting with like it's like if she sees that she can potentially like use it to her advantage she will and she's like having fun with it it it feels like more authentic to me than it ever has like that's just kind of how she operates whether or not that's like annoying or funny or whatever like i'm not gonna make a moral judgment on on that but uh for me i find it like engaging television i think it's just funny how much she she like changed tactics regard to jenna where in earlier episodes we saw her just be like i've got to like attack jenna like i've got to try to take her down a notch and make her like bad to the other girls kind of like a

like go straight for the queen kind of strategy and that didn't really work for her now she's like all right i'll just fucking flirt with her Let's try that instead. Can we also bring up the fact that Jenna said in her confessional that she'd love the pre-nup, she'd automatically pre-up Bryn? Oh, yeah. Which I don't blame her. I don't blame her at all.

I would pre-n up the hell out of Brin as well. So, yeah. Speaking of Brin, one thing that I noticed in this episode was like there's one specific confessional look that we've seen from Brin through the majority of the past. like few episodes that like session of doing the confessionals must have just like she must have just killed it for that session because it's pretty much the only outfit that we have seen in in those clips yeah no i i actually i'm not a huge fan of the confessional look but i am a huge fan of her confessional she has some great one hitters like she has some very good comical one hitters so i'll give it to her

on that one yeah Dylan what were what were your highlights from new york um yeah i i also appreciate the drama around Jessel and I get where the girls are coming from but it is it does seem like kind of very unfair to her at the same time to be like like oh you got to tell us about yourself no not like that and Uba said it really well in her confessional like Jethel's parent story is part of her story right it's it's not her complete story but yeah it's it's contacts and it like shapes who she is as a person so I mean If you're asking her to open up, I feel like it's completely fair to be like, you know, this is my parents' experience. You can like take from that how you will, how that shaped my, my experience. I don't know. I think like it's completely valid for her to bring that up, especially if she's, you know,

just trying to share. It's not like she was like being grilled by the cops. Yeah, for sure. If somebody asks you to tell your story, you got to kind of decide how to do that, you know, if that's her way to get to it. That's fair. You know, I also think it's funny that she's going out about her uncle and shit that nobody cares about. But, you know, it's not fair to coax somebody to opening up and then get angry at them for doing it the way they want to do it.

Yeah. I mean, I think that the same thing is happening with Jenna where they're forcing her to open up. And it's like she's going to do it. But, you know, you don't have to force anything. I think the whole entire Jessel thing with her parents, bringing up her parents, her uncle, all that stuff. is that Bryn did the exact same thing, but she did it in context, right? She did it where, like,

the two people that she was supposed, that were supposed to love her unconditionally that brought her into this world, they didn't, and this is how it affected my life. Versus, I think Jessel is just saying, like, this is her whole entire thing. No, you know, Dylan's absolutely right. Like, everybody has a story,

and it's always going to include your family. That's just a part of life. That's what it is. I just think that Jessel took the family part and made that the story instead of us knowing about, Jessel and that she had to shed paper in her internship and that was the only thing that I got out of that whole entire story about her now like now I know that her brothers or whatever are photographers and they

had to like sleep in and in the streets and be homeless in New York and I know that her parents like came here from Africa and immigrant like I know way more about her family than I do about her and I think that was the that was the disparaging issue that I had at least out of their conversation about trying to get to know Jessel. That was my only issue with that. I'm like, you can make your parents the story. You can make your family the story. And it should be this part of the story, but it shouldn't be all of the story. And that's what I felt like she was doing. I felt like she was giving just the parents side, just the family side. I don't think that was her intent. I just think that that just happened to happen. Do you, G. Hey, do you think that any of these cast members are going to be like cut? They

won't get a season two? No, I think all of them are bringing it for now. And also, None of them are adding each other, right? Like, none of them are really, truly going after them. I don't think that these girls have any alliances. They're a little bit more raw. They're a little bit more. It seems like there's very apparent alliances when it comes to Orange County. Like, everybody's coming after Heather.

There's very apparent alliances, you know, when you look at other franchises. They're obviously going after somebody, you know, Salt Lake City, et cetera. All of them have, quote, unquote, alliances. In this one, I think that they're all genuinely trying to get to know each other and be friends. And I don't think anybody's gunning for somebody's job or pushing for somebody to be out. So I think that they'll renew and these girls will still all be. We're going to see all of them, even though I think some of them shouldn't be on the show.

I think they're a little boring. But for the most part, I think all of them are going to stay. Okay, you got to name names if you say that. With the exception of her IVF story, I'm not a fan of Jessel. I think you can give her the boot. I know this is going to be controversial. and maybe it's just one of those things where you ride for one particular housewife

and you love that one particular housewife but then you hate a housewife and there's nothing there's no coaxing, there's nothing you can say there's nothing you can do there's nothing that you can do to change my mind I'm just not going to like this person or her character or whatever on the show and that's sigh I'm just not a fan

I just don't like her so I would I'd be okay if she left if she was gone everybody else I love I think that they're great they're good television. Bryn's amazing TV. Like she's epic Bravo television.

She exudes what reality TV is supposed to be. She's great. Aaron brings it as far as being a housewife. She definitely brings the drama. She brings, you know, the controversy,

whatever. She's the one that's the stir, this potster. So you kind of need that. I guess Sai is a little, and Sye's not really a villain. And what's with the complaining about the food? Like,

do you have a tape? Do you really do have a tapeworm? Maybe like you love, it's a lot, man. It's just a lot. So, and I mean, Jenna's, if she's going to leave because she wants to leave. She's not going to leave because she gets forced out. Dylan, did you have any other highlights from New York?

I did think it was a good episode for Uber. I like how Uber really kind of bucks the gang. She often doesn't like go in for kind of the pack behavior. Like when, yeah, like when she, she takes Jessel's side in her story, kind of. almost unexpectedly, I would think. And it is kind of reminiscent of how like when everybody was taking Brinside against Aaron, because Aaron was being kind of humorless about the flirting thing and Uber was like, well, oh wait, right, right, right, right.

Aaron's got a point here. I like that Uber doesn't go along with a pack that she often seems to be kind of copy up with her own opinions. I like that she continues to say weird things like something was in the back of my oblongata. And, and I think she kind of is right to be mad at Aaron. because, you know, hiding somebody's phone is maybe not like a horrible crime, but it is a very bad prank. Like, it's just not funny.

It's just not a funny thing to do, I think, to hide somebody's phone. So I'm kind of on Uber's side for that. Yeah, I, this whole, like, prank thing, I was surprised that this scene that we got between Aaron and Uber that we got at the very end of this, that has been teased so much leading up to this episode that it was about like a prank war gone wrong. Yeah. That was not what I was expecting whatsoever. And Aaron said in her confessionals, like earlier on in the episode, like, I grew up with, with brothers and pranking as part of my DNA.

Then how is she like so bad at it and so like humorless? Yeah. Like even when she was trying to get revenge on Uber after dinner, trying to push her into the pool when Sai eventually did. Like she was just making it so lame. Like it was painful to watch. It was funny though how it was. Yeah. It was drawn out like an execution scene and like a gangster movie.

It was like a Scorsese movie scene. It was like when De Niro realizes he has to bump Jimmy Hafa and the Irishman. It's just like slowly drank down realization. It was kind of funny. Could I mention the fact that Dylan has like the best references by the way? Like every time that you like compare something in House West history, it's always like an amazing reference. I just wanted to point that out. It's usually just like the last movie I watched to be honest.

Was the Irish from the last movie you watched? No, actually, it's been a while. But I'm always watching it in the back of my mind. The other thing I wanted to bring up was the scene where they were all sharing their most embarrassing moments. I really liked that we got this put in there as like a contrast to like Jessel's storytelling about her past. Like how she she did like the girls had a point. She did seem like she was a more open and honest. when she was telling this story, it just, like, read as more authentic.

So having that contrast was really funny, especially, like, compared to all the other, all the other stories that were told. Yeah, Aaron's not beating the humorless charges with her, like, oh, embarrassing story. Once my kid was crying out of play. Yeah. Yeah. Just pass if you know anything better. Yeah, right.

I'm a huge Aaron fan. I know that sounds controversial. I don't think a lot of people like her. I actually love Aaron. And it's also probably because I used to live in New York. So, like, I had a lot of friends that were from the city that acted exactly like this. So for me, I'm like this kind of girl is like I'm used to, I'm used to this kind of girl. But that being said, she's got to do better when it comes to those embarrassing stories.

Your kid was embarrassing. Stop. Like, you can come up with something better, I'm sure. Like, I'm sure you had, like, when you got bat mitzvahed or something, you had something embarrassing happened to you. Like, these girls are going way back into their role. a dex of embarrassment. Like you can you could up your game a little bit on that one. So yeah, it's kind of disappointed in Aaron with that.

Jenna's story was absolutely amazing. Oh, it was great. It was fantastic. Yeah, Ray Fines like being the big like reveal. Reveal. I don't know. I thought it was great.

Fun cabio, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I mean, that's why Jenna's awesome. Yeah. Am I the only one who thought his name was supposed to be pronounced in some fucked up way? Like Ray Fiends and not like Ralph Fines.

Did I just dream that? it's it's raf finds i think yeah okay the last name is spelled is pronounced normally but the first is like rave right yeah yeah yeah i thought there is some fucked up pronunciation there um by the way do you know his uh his brother's full name i'm gonna look this up right now because i looked up once joseph vines and was just like laughing for a whole day when i said out that his full name is joseph alberick twistleton wycombe finds uh this is you know that monte python like upper class twit of the year skit where they all have like these absurd like rich people names that's the best one i've ever heard did you ever watch uh did you make that up or is that real

that's real that's real like if it's wikipedia i just read it off wikipedia now that's amazing yeah and it's having having one of the finds brothers show up as like the the judgment judgmental person who picks you up is just an amazing way to end a story like that's so good um do you guys have anything else from New York before we move on? Quickly, it will be hypocritical because I was making fun of Heather for wearing a wetsuit, but Jenna does look good at a wetsuit. You can look good at a wetsuit. You know, it's kind of like Charlotte Rappling and Orca.

It's a really good look for some people, especially if you're, if you're long, like, like Jenna is. I was about to say, I'm like, I didn't mind Heather in the wetsuit. I think, I think she looked horrible. She didn't look great. No, she didn't look bad. It was just funny in the situation because they're, take, they're on a, slip and slide. Yeah, yeah, as opposed to like, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, no, I mean, but Jenna can make anything look elegant, to be honest, let's get real. Like, that woman can make anything look elegant. Well, let's, let's keep moving our way chronologically backwards. Let's talk about Real Housewives of Orange County. Gee, hey, what did you think of this episode? I mean, they all bring it. It's so good. I just, I have no complaints about Orange County.

I'm moving through my notes really quick so I can just, give you guys a little bit better. Oh, Vicky coming back. I mean, you can't talk about that episode without Vicky coming back. And coming back to Playa Del Carmen, which you can't have a Mexico trip without having Vicky there. I mean, it just seems really weird. I love the woo-hoo Vicky.

And I know she's going to come back. I know this is her like entrance to like get back in and get her orange back. I'm not really looking forward to it, to be honest with you. I'm not a Vicky fan. But I'm not a Vicky fan as far as like her being a housewife. However, I am a Vicky fan as far as her being a woo-hoo whoop-it-up kind of a person. I think she's great at it. I think it's wonderful.

I love the vacation kind of Vicky. It's the same thing with Shannon. I love the vacation, Shannon. Maybe she's having too much of a vacation right now. Sorry that that's happening to her. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I just, but as far as Vicky, the return of Vicky, I mean, it's epic.

It's everything. It's the moment. So I love that Vicky is back just to whoop it up for them and cause a little bit of, you know, drama. It gives me a little bit of the icks. But at the same time, I'm like, I'm here for it because the needle wouldn't move if she didn't bring it up. Right. So she brought up, you know, Jen's of Jen and the cheating again and all that stuff. So she's definitely good at what she does when it comes to the Housewives world. That's why she's getting that lifetime achievement award, I guess.

So I was here for Vicky. That was like one of my favorite parts that I think all of us were looking forward to because we saw it in the preview. As soon as she opened up the door and I realized that like she was coming back, I was like immediately paying like twice as much attention to the episode because I mean I am like a Vicky fan. I like make no. I don't hide that. I think that she's like a fantastic housewife and should never have been cut. I get that OC was in a place where it needed to like have a little bit of a shakeup, but I don't think that this was the move.

And this is like she made this episode that much better. Yeah, it's kind of funny that she seems to be there to do one thing, which is to like call it Jen's relationship that Tamara like basically asked her to do it. It seems even though Vicki doesn't fucking know these people clearly, right? Like she's talking about it and somebody says something about Ryan. and she's like, who's Ryan? Like, she doesn't fucking know what she saw and get about. Yeah, we've heard of hired guns before.

She's a hired spoon. Yeah. She really is. She totally is. Oh, it's so, so true. Oh, man. By the way, I don't know if you guys saw my post on this, but the water aerobics that they did when they sat down, before they sat down to lunch. I just sat there and was just like, I was like, you're not that.

old. Like, why are you doing, no offense to people that are doing water aerobics by any means. But, like, I'm like, you're not that old. I'm like, you may be abuela, but like, you're not ancient. Like, you're not like insanely old. I don't know. Like, not old enough to like be doing water aerobics. Like women in Orange County do yoga, Pilates. Like, water aerobics is the last thing that they're doing unless they're like 80. And none of these women are 80. So there's literally a last thing they're doing. Yes. Yes. Yes. But another, I mean, I think this is going a little bit viral on social media is Heather calling Emily snufflepagus and making it a compliment. Like, oh, honey, you're just digging your grave right now. And I don't think that she, is she, do you guys really think that she could fit in in Beverly Hills?

Because that's the rumor that that's where she wants to go, hence the L.A. home, et cetera. Yeah, I don't know. So I remember hearing that rumor that she was going to or she was trying to be back on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills a long time ago. Like right after she first left Orange County and there's always been like, oh, she's going to go there. I think even before she left, like when she was beefing with Kelly Dodd and she thought she was so much better than everyone on Orange County. I don't know. I mean, I think she's got some like transferable skills from being a hostwife. I think that one of her strengths on Orange County is to give us some sort of like benchmark to measure the kind of the wealth and the status of these other women in Orange County.

And I don't think that like Beverly Hills really needs that. I think, you know, that dynamic plays out a lot more interestingly in Orange County versus like on Beverly Hills. Everyone is just like so wealthy that I think most people aren't able to kind of get a sense of like, you know, the difference between each of the housewives. Like it's just at another level. yeah i just i think that she would be like a little bit more um a little bit less valuable on beverly hills than she is on orange county so yeah i i don't know i i could see it being a mistake a mistake if she's cast on beverly hills but you never know well and also those women have genuine friendships on that beverly hills cast like they actually hang out with each other like off

camera. They actually go on trips with each other. I mean, we saw Lisa Renna, Erica Jane. They were in Paris together for however long. You know, all of them went to her show, her current show. Speaking of that, are you guys going to BravoCon? No, are you? So I will be in Vegas for that weekend because I live in L.A. It's a 45-minute flight. Oh, yeah. So I will be there, but I haven't gotten a ticket yet. I'm trying. Cross your fingers. I work for the sporting tribune. So I'm trying to get a media credential. Like I'm pushing for that. I'm like, even if it's just one day, I want a media credential. Even if it's just Friday or Saturday, I don't care which day. I can't do it on Sunday because I'm going to go and watch football all day. But Friday and Saturday, I'm like

pushing to be able to go and cover it. And if not, I'm probably just going to do some like soundbites or whatever, just around the casinos or whatever. So, and just ask Bravo fans some questions. But I will be there. I just, so I might not be actually where the panels are and stuff like that. So. Oh, nice. Yeah.

I, uh, I think it's going to be like, yeah, it's probably going to be a blast. There's like things about the, um, the fandom that I find are just like not the most fun part of being a Bravo fan. So I don't know. the whole reaction to how Rachel has been treated has been really put it's really put me off of the fandom a little bit so um if it's going to be a big like you know scandible celebration of like taking uh Rachel down then that's not really what I want to go and like take part of it too mean about her lunches.

Those fig Newton's like good. But really, anytime like Tom or Rachel come up online, there's still like so many people are so like upset about it. And I don't know. It's just, yeah, I find it almost almost embarrassing that it's like,

you're still like that mad about this. Yeah. Yeah. I agree with you. I think I actually just did an episode before with a comedian, actually, René Gautier, and she was talking about the backlash and treatment. And she's like, I've moved on. How come everybody else hasn't moved on, right?

From the scandal. And some of them are like, they've never watched a show before. So I get it and like it because I mean, this thing was in CNN. It was on Fox News. It was like the amount of coverage that it got was insane to me. I'm like, wait, this was on CNN. Like, I'm thinking e-news, you know, it eventually got on the Wall Street Journal.

Like, how is this news? Like, how? Yeah, I did not know that. Yeah, I want to see Wolf Blitzer being like breaking news. It was crazy when it first came out. It, like, spread like wildfire. So when it initially came out, obviously, it's only on TMZ. It's only on E-News.

It's only going to be on like the Bravo network, all that stuff. But then it branched out because you do have celebrity, Bravo fans that were like going on their social media and talking about it, whatever. So news outlets were like, okay, well, this is actually something that people should care about, I guess. I don't know. So it went out and the environment that I work in, like nobody knows about Bravo. Like I kind of buried the lead on this, but I bet Shannon Bador a few months ago.

And by the way, sweet is pie, but she wasn't really wasted. So like I can't, I can't judge for that. but nobody knew who she was. There was maybe like less than a handful of people that knew who she was. So, you know, these people aren't really well known everywhere other than to us rabid fans. And so for it to get on, there was articles in the Washington Post in the New York Times on this, which boggled my mind. I'm like, how are you covering this? So, but that being said, I was just like, if you're a day one or,

and you've watched Vanderpump rules from the get-go, you're over this. You're moving on. You want to know what's going to happen next, right? You don't want, you're done looking behind. You want to keep going. And everybody else wants to just keep talking about it because this is brand new to them.

Yeah, I'm one of those people. I'm like, I'm ready to see what season 11 has in store. So let's talk about that and not talk about the rest of Scandibon. I'm ready to move on. For sure. Dylan, what highlights did you have from Orange County? The stuff like a good because it is really, funny to try to twist that and pretend that it's somehow a compliment without explaining how it's a compliment.

But also funny how nobody seems to know what stuff a lot of gives is. Right. Right. Including the producer who's like, he's not a dinosaur. No, he's not a dinosaur. He's a fucking mammoth or a mastodon or something. He's clearly a mammal. He's not a dinosaur.

He's not Sasquash either. And I really like how Tamara like trying to describe Sasquash is like the big hairy guy who runs the jungle. Like not to be too much. I'm a cryptid nerd, but that's not what sashwash is either, nor is it what's the love because it is. So, yeah, it's just really funny how nobody can correctly identify that. It's kind of gratifying, but also disappointing at the same time for me to finally see them like go Jen into like getting angry and start like acting, acting out against everybody,

like talking about her relationship. Because I feel like they've been trying to do that this whole season where she's been like, weirdly stoic and reticent in face of these accusations to the point where you kind of watch the show thinking like, wait, why is she on the show if like her like reaction to like people accusing her of things is just to kind of like not say anything not fire back, which I think is an understandable way to react but like not for somebody who's been cast on one of these shows. So we finally get her like like because Tamarang goes really hard on her actually like really maybe too hard.

Like, Tamara goes pretty hard digging into her and saying that, you know, she ruined her family. And also, by the way, your Fendi and Gucci is fake. Just going to throw that in there at the same time. I forgot about that. Yeah. So, you know, finally gets her angry. And I guess we'll see where it goes from there. But it was like, it was kind of, yeah, for me, it was like at the same time.

Like, oh, great. Finally, she's going to like, like, really put her perspective out there because she's going to be pissed off. She's going to try to defend yourself. But at the same time, I kind of like. was almost, um, almost, um,

almost feeling it, what she just didn't want to, like, like, like, I have to defend myself. Like, if I don't want to defend myself,

I won't. So, so at the same time, there was a bit of, like, disappointment, uh, in my reaction being like,

oh, well, they finally got you. You know, you finally walked into the trap that they've been trying to set for you and bait for you this whole time. Yeah.

I, like, I see where you're coming from with that. Like, it wasn't doing anything for me. but the fact that she was strong in her resolve not to like discuss this was was notable i i don't like it when you know housewives are not transparent especially if they're not really bringing anything else and i felt that way with jen i feel like i don't know i've got i've got cats and they have found

mice before and before they kill them they like play with them and that like it gets to a point where it's almost hard to watch them like torture a mouse. And this season of Orange County is starting to feel that way with Jen. Like she's just so ill-equipped for this job that she's just a toy for all of these, all these women that are much better at this than she is. I liked how Vicky, like, Jen set herself up for this by deciding to play church. truth or dare or whatever. Like maybe that was at the like producer's insistence, but like, you know, she, she's like,

oh, let's play truth or dare. Immediately asks Bicky, like, under the pretense of like trying to get to know you. And then like bails on the question thinking that she's going to shut down an opening for this. But Vicky, she's, yeah, because Jen's like, okay, well, how about we let someone who knows you better ask you a question for truth since we don't have a history? And Vicki is just like, well, I think that you and I. both have a situation where there's a man who's bad for us. That's my truth. Yeah. That was really funny. Not even waiting for a question. Just like, oh, truth means speak my truth about your shit.

Exactly. But I mean, that's why Vicky's a pro. That's why Vicky's such a pro. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That's why she's meant for reality television. I mean, minivan, you know, like she's very, she's very much an epic housewife and I totally understand that. I just still, I don't know. She's just, she, I just love to whoop it up, Vicky. I'm just going to keep emphasizing that. Like, I just love when she parties and has a great time. And like, you see her in the streets of T.J.

Like, pouring shots down people's throats. I like, I just love that, Vicky. I don't know, like every other Vicky. I just, her surprising, Ryan in college, I love that scene. That was just like, I wish my, I wish my mom. did that. My mom is insanely conservative. Like I wish my mom came in with a 12 pack of

beer and started shoveling vodka down my throat or something like at my sorority if I was in a sorority. You know, I would I love whoop it up Vicky. Need more of her. Yeah. I think the editors did a really great job with this like vacation party as well

and this this truth or dare conversation where you know Jen's only defense was like oh I've heard everything that everyone else has heard unless someone sitting on something and then immediately cut to Tamara like giving this like side eye while like drinking a sip of her her drink and uh yeah no and then the next morning like waking up hung over to that iyei aye aye aye song just like really well well put together yeah i mean that's why you have that those guys deserve raises i don't know how much they're getting paid but those editors deserve raises

they make they make the show so much more than it than it probably is um especially with the footage that they're given. I think they're given a lot, right? Like, these ladies are filmed for a while. Yeah, so kudos to the editors. It's insane what they give. Yeah, totally. So what do we think is, are Jen's designer clothes fake or not?

If they are, who gives a shit. Yeah, I also don't care. But I believe that Tamara knows what you're talking about. Yeah, no. And here's the thing. You can also rent those clothes, by the way. There's an app for that, heart. So if you really did need to, if you wanted to want to keep up with the Joneses, you can,

I just think it's so unnecessary because that's not what the real hospitals of Orange County is, at least not to me. Like, yeah, true. We, we see like, yes, Heather says, Heather Dubrow sets the bar for the wealth in Orange County. But Tamara's first season, or like after she got a divorce, she was in like a two, three bedroom home, you know, Gina is a great example. She was in a small little, you know, the small little, what is it called? The Casita, you know, with her kids. Like, we don't need the glitz and the glamour. You don't need the Fendi or the frauda or whatever.

We, like, we just want to see you in this. Now, Beverly Hills is a totally different. You just need denim. Yeah. Seriously. And bad hair. Like, I'm good. Like, you can, you can be you like in Orange County.

That's the beauty of this franchise is that when we initially saw, all of the ladies in season one, like, yeah, maybe they had some designer stuff or whatever, but they all worked. They all were like, you know, this is what I'm wearing yoga pants and whatever to get to my destination. Like they were real. And that's why I think what people appreciated a little bit more out of this franchise. Now again, Beverly Hills totally different because it's Beverly Hills.

Dubai, yeah, bring it. You better bring the Chanel and whatever because you're in Dubai. But you're in Orange County. If you've ever been to Orange County, stop. like nobody's wearing like normal people that live there are not wearing Gucci fendi Prada any of that stuff they're wearing bilibong Volcom and they're wearing like reflip-flops like it just it's not you don't need to wear any fake stuff like stop I don't know I um but I do believe Tamara it probably is fake

um I do want to talk a little bit more about Gina this episode because like I mean I keep saying it but I think that she's continuing her great season and everyone online seems like they're they're shitting on her saying that she deserves to be like demoted to friend of or kicked off but I thought that like she did a really good job you know kind of being a little bit nebulous with how she was arranging and positioning herself uh in an alliance with with Jen and then you know immediately she kind of seemed to realize that Jen was not going to to react strongly enough for her own shit. So she's like certainly not going to be, you know, going to back for Gina.

And she jumped, she jumped ship. I thought that, you know, that was smart. I also really like how we've seen a few times on this season where she has like taken the opportunity when Tamara has stepped away from the group in order to try to like reshuffle the deck. And we saw that at that lunch. And as soon as like, you know, Tamara went off after, after Heather, you know, she, she was trying to like, you know, just settle things out in a way that was advantageous for us and she, or for herself. And I think that, you know, I think that it's, it's smart to do it that way openly at the table when things look favorable to you as opposed to doing it kind of in back channel.

communications because then like people aren't able to use that like that conversation like oh you know Gina took me aside to talk about this if it's happening like openly here the only person that that information is going to have an impact on is is Tamara and you know if she sees tamara as like a you know a lost cause for her side then I think that that is that is smart yeah I mean I think she's an amazing shitster. I mean, we saw from the very beginning of this season to currently now, right? She's very good at stirring the pot. And she knows it too. I mean, I think she said it in her confessional. She's like, I'm fully aware that I am stirring the pot, that I am whatever, but she also says it about other people as well. She's learning. She's learning a lot quicker,

I think, than some other women as well. I think that granted, she had an alliance automatically, I think with Emily from the get-go and then that split, right? So then she had to learn, okay, I'm going to have to tie myself to somebody, she tied herself to Heather and then all this other stuff happens now that her and Emily are back. Yeah, I don't believe the hype. I love Emily and Gina. I think they're great.

I don't know where this hatred's coming from. I don't get it. Maybe is she just not glamorous as, you know, all these other women? Is she not giving you enough of her story? are bad things not happening to her. I think the second that she got sober is the second that everybody's like, I'm done with her because she's no longer drinking. She's no longer drinking.

She's no longer a shit show. So, you know, she's not getting DUI. She's being a responsible parent. Like I guess maybe they don't deem her, I guess, as like house-fized material because of that. But I think us seeing the development and the growth of her is a great story in and of itself. At least for me, I love seeing. her grow because, you know, she's, she's trying to get a career. Like, she has a developing story. She's not just stagnant, right? I don't know. I love Gina. I think that she should stay.

That orange needs to be permanently in her in her hand. Because she always, she always knows what's going on too. She knows how to adapt to the game. And I think that she's been trying to adapt, like, constantly. I think that's the big thing for me. Like, she's just a really good social player of the host wife game. She doesn't like, I don't think that she finds herself in a position that she can't, you know, get out of or that is, you know, I, I just love watching her play the game. I do want to have some time to talk about Salt Lake City because I think it was probably my favorite of the bunch, but there was one comment in Orange County that I just need to

address. There was Jen said something about like, so. Your job is to busy yourself in my pain directing that at Tamara. And yes, that is literally her job. That is what she gets her paycheck for. So, you know, maybe reread your contract there, Jen. Let's get into Salt Lake City. Ghei, how are you feeling about this season so far? I mean, coming out with a bang, aren't they?

I think it's interesting that I guess all good things have to come to an end. And by all good things, I mean like all, you know, fights and feuds have to come to an end. I just wish that it didn't come this quickly. I think what, it's been two years since Lisa Barlow and Meredith Marks and Heather Gaye and Whitney Rose were considered bad weather and just and the best of friends when it comes to Lisa Barlow and Meredith Marks. I'm wondering, I want to ask you guys, how long do you think this is going to last? because I just feel like Meredith is one of those people that she could just so easily be ticked off about a bathtub, about you talking shit about anything

having to do with her life. But that's why you're on reality television is to show us your life. And also certain things are said in Jess. Maybe you need to have a better sense of humor. I don't know. I just don't know how long this truth between Barlow and Meredith is going to last.

I was wondering what you guys thought. Yeah. I feel like, you know, three of those women are great housewife and the other is Heather Gay. And I think that the alliance is going to last as long as is beneficial for Whitney in the case of Heather and Whitney. I don't think she doesn't seem like she's like fully into it. She's just kind of like, yeah, whatever. She doesn't need Heather, I don't think. So I don't imagine that lasting very long.

unless, you know, unless it seems advantageous to her. I don't know that Heather provides, like, great support and is a, you know, a great kind of friend to bolster her side of things. So I don't see that being very long-lasting. And, you know, Meredith and Whitney are both, our Meredith and Lisa are both fantastic housewives. And I could see this lasting a bit longer since they, do have more of a personal history like prior to the show. They were long time friends apparently

before this. So I could see them, you know, maybe getting back to that. But Meredith is just like so hyper sensitive and it makes her a great housewife. But to be like in a friendship with someone who is that way and constantly like as a job with her being put into very, um, stressful social situations. I think that that might be challenging for her relationship. So I feel like that one's kind of short-lived as well. And I honestly, I don't think that Lisa is the type of hostwife that really needs that much of an ally in these situations. She just like floats through. she operates on her own like plane that is like you know a thousand feet above where everyone else is and just like thinking about maritime stuff all day and that's you know that's that's enough to

make her an icon i don't know she's got the it factor yeah no i definitely agree with you on on barlow i think i don't hate her but i don't love her i'm like that in between when it comes to lisa barlow but she's going to have that snowflake as long as she wants to keep it i should There's nobody's removing, unfortunately, and fortunately, I guess, for her, nobody's removing Lisa Barlow and her lost $60,000 ring. And nobody's going to remove Meredith Marks, I don't think, just because they do both bring it. One thing that did stand out to me that I did enjoy watching was Monica, the newbie and getting to know her a little bit more and a little bit more. And I think we're going to over every single episode, it's probably going to show us a little bit more into her life. but I liked this,

speaking of, you know, Orange County and fake Fendies and all that other stuff, like I like this side of this franchise because it doesn't all have to be glam, right? You know, she came. I don't want to say she fell from grace,

but, you know, she kind of fell from grace once she went through this divorce and once she got excommunicated from the church, which I find extremely hypocritical, and this is probably why I don't go to church anymore, that, you know, she gets punished, but the guy doesn't.

She felt bad. and was like, you know, she said, I'm sorry, I did this, da-da-da, and she gets punished again. The guy doesn't. But I'm glad that she shared that with us, right? I think that that's, I think everybody can kind of relate to that in some way, shape, or form, whether it's her buying her first Louis by herself or, you know, her getting excommunicated from the church. I think everybody can kind of relate to something that has happened to them in that

similar fashion or whatever. So I appreciate her doing that and coming out and showing us her insecurity. I think that that was like my huge is takeaway from the episode I loved her for that. This scene that we got between her and her mom where she's like crying about like buying

a Louis Vuitton bag was so honest and you know I love to see that kind of honesty especially like out of a first year housewife and it felt very raw and the fact that she was this honest about her feelings and her decision and everything in front of her her kid as well.

I really love that. She seemed like she is a great parent. So I loved seeing that. And I also love getting it like a contrast with the scene later where Lisa loses a $60,000 ring and is like a little upset about it. But it is mostly like, oh, whatever. I'm going to call and see like I can get a replacement. Just such a stark contrast to someone that is, you know, so like has. such like buyers guilt about maybe making a not so smart financial decision because they wanted

to fit in versus someone that just like, you know, doesn't have to think about that whatsoever. And such good work by the editors to underscore that too, because they keep every time like Lisa says something about, oh, it was $60,000 casually. They always have a cut to Monica, like kind of keeping her mouth shut, like, guiltily clutching her Louis, which is, which is great to work to highlight that contrast. Like I said, like I couldn't agree more with you guys. I love Monica in this episode. She's becoming a favorite for me.

And I really liked, I always like seeing somebody like express their insecurity about like wealth and social status gaps and to have the fact that she has like a, you know, an emblem of that with this like Louis Vuitton bag that she like feels that like kind of represents her insecurity, but also her guilt over feeling like she. she needs to compensate for that because she knows she doesn't want to feel like she has to like be, uh, to compensate to, to make these, these, uh, financially unnecessary gestures, uh, to, in order to play with these women, but she did it. And now she's guilty about that. And then when we have her like, uh, at like the airport, like, clutching her bag and be like, yeah, yeah,

I've got, being insecure. It's like, yeah, I've got my Zad X on me. Zad, he's in the Louie. And then like doesn't really get a reaction. And this kind of says it again, like a little bit more like guiltily like yes and he's in the louis just like her like kind of like awkwardness and insecurity is like very um empathetic i think and i she was my favorite part of the set so yeah and these are like these are the things that i love about reality television that you don't often see in other media like we've got these big sweeping season long stories that we're getting but also over the course of this this episode we got to see this complex relationship that uh Monica has with an inanimate object. And, you know, she's got this like guilt and this embarrassment

about this. And but she can't like just throw that away and put it aside and be like, oh, that was disgusting. That was a mistake. I don't want to look at it. She still needs that as a shield in this social situation. And like she needs to clutch onto that in order to fit in. And it's so compelling. And then to see that played against the relationship that Lisa Barlow has with something that, you know, should be a lot more sentimental and significant and is more expensive and it being, you know, um, less of a big deal for her is so compelling. Uh,

G. Hey, what other highlights did you have from Salt Lake City? Yeah. I mean, these are a little one offers. They're not like, I don't think like big huge moments, right?

But I mean, the Mary Cosby shade across the board is probably, um, a huge highlight for me as well. Her, first of all, her calling, uh, the motel trixie and asking if they have dawn.

I mean, you can't get more classic than that for Mary Cosby than the herb, the chips going across the way and her not wanting, you know, the dust or the crumbs or whatever. Like you peasants like put that away for me. And then the last but not least, but you got to mention it is when Lisa Barlow keeps mentioning the $60,000 ring

before she says, I'll just call my jeweler and make sure it's insured and get a replacement. before she says that. I love when she says that does not look like a $60,000 ring and just shades her like crazy. I mean, these are the small little joys that, like, I think people get when you get reality television, you get their little one zingers, one liners.

And Mary Cosby is really great for that. I think she's on the equivalent of level of Vicky for me as far as like zingers and coming in for like monumental like moments, right? So Mickey comes in and whoops it up and shakes things up and makes that episode a little bit brighter and whatever. Mary Cosby comes in for the shade and it's great and I'll live for it all day long because it's just comical. It just makes me laugh. Also, her not, but her not knowing, like, I think that she's happy with being a friend of and I think we're just going to continue to see her maybe being a friend of. I think that a lot of people want her to get her snowflake back.

And I think she's very okay with not having her snowflake. And I'm okay with that too. I think she's great as a friend of. But yeah, all of the, that definitely stuck out. I agree. I think that, I think that Mary is just fine as, as a friend of. When she was, when she did have her snowflake and was like a full, full blown housewife, we still didn't see her very like participatory.

She was often just shooting scenes alone in her, in her house. And, you know, that did give us like, something, but I think we're getting the appropriate amount of Mary. I'm really enjoying her this season. And, yeah, I think this is a good amount for for Mary. Yeah, Dylan, do you agree or do you disagree? Do you want more of Mary? I don't know.

I'll have to see some more. I think, you know, so for me, I never watched Salt Lake City before this season. So all these people are new to me. every time somebody shows up, it's a surprise, or in the case of Whitney's husband, a jump scare. But Mary is definitely really funny and unpredictable. So, yeah, I definitely would like to see more. I'm looking forward to the last thing I will say is that I'm looking forward to what Angie Kay is trying to expose between Meredith and her, like affairs or whatever. Maybe she's bringing up the past because all of them bring up the past a lot.

And then I'm also looking forward to just Meredith and another epic get out. You can leave kind of moment. I'm really looking forward to that. And then like you guys said, I wish that they would just expose names, but I get it. You know, they're still on a show. They got to let it linger a little bit. But Meredith is basically bringing up Angie Kay and like all of her dirt to Lisa Barlow. I want to know about that a lot more.

That just made me extremely intrigued at what she knows. and vice versa, what they know about each other. Because they do, they are, they were friends for like a while or they like they all of them like, I'm assuming salt salt lake's extraordinarily small just like pockets of LA and pockets of any area really. So they probably all know the tea about all of them. It circulates. So I'm looking forward to that for sure. Totally.

Dylan, what were your highlights? I did actually like like you just mentioned jehea. I do like the idea that they're all know these things about. other because yeah, Salt Lake City itself is I think like actually a pretty small place. Like it's like only a few hundred thousand people I think in proper Salt Lake City. So that kind of adds a new dynamic to it. And like I said, I'm still discovering the show. So I'm just delighted to learn more about the whole milieu.

I'm really delighted to learn more about the Mormon church and how fucking weird it is. This is very fun to me. And the way that they keep like referencing vaguely these things like death oaths and excommunications. And, you know, the mission and the. And the garments, you know, Heather says something very ominous about that you no longer have the garments, which I guess is some sort of like sacred underwear you have to wear. It all seems so bizarre and really fun to be. And I think you understand a lot about how these like kind of niche religions work, I think, by watching somebody like Heather, who, despite branding herself now as a bad Mormon, is clearly still extremely invested in the idea of how to be a good Mormon. and is very invested in policing other people's Mormonism.

And you see how much this is like part of her life and her upbringing, right? It's just like, it makes me think that for a lot of these like niche religions. Like a big part of the hook and the appeal is really just that you get to be good at following rules. They give you rules. You get to follow them. It's fun to follow rules. And it helps like nurture and breed these people like Whitney and Heather who are such fucking. like Prissy Hall Monitor, Tracy Flick kind of Elwoods.

Pick a Reese Witherspin character. They are Reese Witherspoon characters. All little Reese's pieces out there. But very invested in the idea of like following the rules and being and being good at it. And now that they're like leaving the church, but they can't really leave behind that obsession with like telling people how to like follow the rules properly and not um and i did see heather and wittany a bit earlier because i watched the uh the last ultimate girls trip and it was funny especially now in in retrospect seeing that the way uh Whitney and Heather bickered about like how

not to be a Mormon now that they're not Mormoning Mormoning anymore and and uh you there was a bit where like Whitney was almost like pulling like a reversal card on Heather being like oh but actually you haven't taken your names off the rolls because there are rules to to not be a Mormon. And now you're not following the rules to not being a Mormon. And really funny. But yeah, it does seem kind of fucked up too.

The thing about Monica's story is clearly fucked up. That she gets excommunicated, which is just such like, I don't know what that means entirely. But I mean, in the Catholic Church, if you're excommunicated, it's like an edict that you're not,

not only you're not part of the church. You're not going to heaven. Like you will not have like an afterlife in heaven. So, so brutal. And then the fact that, she's the one who came out with it and the guy she's cheating with doesn't have have anything happen to him. It's like even like I'm sure like most religions are just shitty about those kind

of things. But if you if you're in the Catholic church and you did that, well, first of all, you can like confess and it would be like and your priest would be like, okay, I'm not going to tell anybody because that's the whole point of this and you just get like five bonus guilt points. And if you get up to 100 guilt points this week, you get a stuffed pope. You know, it's kind of like bit its little game. But out here they're like, you know, okay, you came out with it. Well, you're dead to us now. Yeah.

Very fucked up. Very weird. But it's very interesting for me to learn about this stuff. Also, I was kind of surprised to hear them, like, talk a little bit more about what the mission is because when they first said, like, he's going on the mission. It sounded like so like monumentous. I thought he was going to go on like, I don't know, like go to like the Andaman Island. and try to like convert tribesmen will they shoot arrows out of or something and then I just

realize when they're talking about it that is just like he's he's going to go to south Carolina and do one of those annoying dorks with a tie who knocks on people's doors that annoys them so they don't choose their um where they go though so like he like they said like he could be going to milan or he could be going to like you know Tuscaloosa alabama like he like he doesn't know like they choose it for you and then I was raised around a butt a bunch of Mormons. So they, so they don't choose it.

They have to do it. It's a two-year commitment, like a two-year straight-up commitment. So he's gone for two years. If you're an athlete, you still have to do it. So a lot of people that were obviously go to University of Utah,

go to BYU, et cetera. Like, they all do their mission. A lot of athletes have to take time off and go do the two years and then they can come back and play. But, yeah, so all of them like,

they have to do it. And Heather's right. He's going to be a totally different person when he comes back. Like, I don't know if Lisa Barlow's ready for that. Because she, I believe she converted for John. So she wasn't raised in that church situation.

I believe so. She wasn't raised in that church situation, whereas her child was raised, Jake was raised in that, instilled in that, that was instilled in him. So it's a two totally different dynamic. And yeah,

because she's from New York. Like, how many Mormons do you know in New York? Yeah. You know, so I think it's got, she's in for a rude awakening. So I understand why Heather was like so gung-ho about being like, she needs to know all this stuff and blah, blah, blah. But if you're not, if that's not your everyday thing that you grew up with,

it's going to be, it's going to be weird. It's going to be different for her when he comes back for sure. So I'm looking forward to that. I do, however, don't think that Heather should insert herself. I'm like, it's her kid. Like, let her be. Like, leave her alone. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting that she would even like make this thing. There's no way that this can go like well for her socially. So I don't know. Heather, I think is on borrowed time as a housewife. I don't feel like she's bringing a lot. But yeah, I'll be interested to see how this plays out. Yeah. I think the only reason why she would ever come back by the way, though, is that feud between her and Angie Kay that she's making up, which is kind of ridiculous. she's repeating a rumor you should never ever like you should never ever sit there and be like oh they repeated a rumor it's like they're repeating a rumor they don't believe they might not believe the rumor they're just telling you the rumor like don't shoot the messenger so i don't know like this whole yeah i really love how they like how hether mentioned that they had known each other from middle school and the beef goes back to then and kind of like framed us the this

like weird like west side story type relationship between the Mormons and the Greeks. Like, such a bizarre middle school dynamic. I really appreciated that. But what was going on with Angie's dog? Did you guys pick up on this? Yeah, that was odd. Were they training for something?

Was there like a reason for the jump? I don't know. I don't get that part. Yeah. So it had like those equestrian jumping like things set up in the house and her like giant poodle was jumping over it and had like, like bright pink dyed ears. It was very strange.

But I don't know. Maybe, yeah, just not a world that I'm exposed to. You got to keep busy somehow. And then what was your thought, you guys, what, quick question, what was your thought on the fact that their 11 year old still sleeps with them? No judgment whatsoever. Like you do you for your kid, but like, I just thought it was odd. Yeah, I mean, 11 seems like a bit old for that.

But I, yeah, I don't know. Everybody raises their family different. I didn't even pick. Yeah, I didn't even pick up on that while watching the episode, actually. Yeah, it seems a little old for me. I feel like at a certain point, you've got to start pushing them to be more independent. 11 seems pretty old. But what do I know?

I don't have kids. Yeah. I think that about does it for Salt Lake City for me. Did you guys have any other thoughts? About covers it for me, I think. Yeah, that covers it for me as well. think awesome well thank you so much for doing this g hay it's been a it's been a blast uh want to let everyone know where they can find you no absolutely and thank you again so much for having me i will

always come on if you guys ever want me back um yeah um anywhere you get your social media you guys i am on threads and i am on um that's what the kids are calling it and then i'm also on instagram and facebook all the same handle the underscore real underscore bitch underscore of underscore bravo If you want to follow me on my regular one, you can. But I'm so boring. Other than Bravo, I don't think I'm that interesting. My personal social media, which is public, is J-I-H-A-E-E-H-E-H-E-H-O-U-E-H-O-E-W-E-E-Y. And you can follow me there and listen everywhere you get your podcasts

for The Real Bitch of Bravo podcast with G-H-H-H-E-H-E-E-W-Ly. Awesome. And Dylan, how about yourself? If anybody who loves the Real Housewives also loves cryptids and American history, I'm going to mention once again my limited history show that I've released recently. It's all available now just four episodes. It's called The Devil You Don't about the Cryptid, the Jersey Devil, and various bizarre stories from American history that have intersected with this legend.

Awesome. I'm Craig Midwinter. I don't really have anything other than this to plus. unless you like programming, you can follow me on GitHub, I guess. Just see what I'm, projects I'm into. I don't know. Yeah, that's been Bravo Outsider for this week. You can find us online, bravo outsider.com.

We're on Instagram, we're on X, we're on TikTok, sort of. Look us up on YouTube or wherever you find your podcast. Until next week, keep on wiping.