Oscars Outsider - Real Housewives of New Jersey S14E08 & Dubai S02E04 Recap/Analysis (feat YoureLiterallyOnPodcast )

Episode Date: July 9, 2024

This week, Dylan and Craig are joined by Dacey O'Kelley of the You're Literally On podcast! We're breaking down the fallout of Danielle vs Jennifer, dissecting Jen Fessler's no-win scenario and speculating on Jen Aydin's motives in our coverage of the latest episode of Real Housewives of New Jersey (RHONJ) Then we dive into the queen party in our recap of RHODubai If you enjoyed this breakdown, don’t forget to hit the like button, comment below your favorite moment, and subscribe for more Bravo content! 🥂 About Bravo Outsider The Bravo Outsider Podcast offers an outside perspective on Bravo shows like The Real Housewives, unlike any other Bravo podcast! We focus on the artistic value of these shows while providing strategic analysis of the social game at the core of the Bravo docu-soap. We love thick literary references and diving into themes before diving into the drama! 🍸Featured Bravolebs: Real Housewives of New Jersey: Teresa Giudice, Melissa Gorga, Dolores Catania, Margaret Josephs, Jen Aydin, Danielle Cabral, Rachel Fuda, Jackie Goldschneider, Frank Catania, Gia Giudice, Joe Gorga, Milania Giudice, Luis Ruelas, Bill Ayden, Jen Fessler Real Housewives of Dubai: Sara Al Madani, Chanel Ayan, Caroline Brooks, Lesa Milan, Caroline Stanbury, Taleen Marie 📣 Stay Connected: Find You're Literally On on Instagram: hhttps://www.instagram.com/youreliterallyonpod/ Find Dylan Ferguson on Substack at https://dylanferguson.substack.com/ Find Bravo Outsider on Instagram at ⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/bravooutsider https://www.bravooutsider.com 📖 Credits Music by FASSounds from Pixabay #RHONJ #vanderpumprules #bravo #realitytv #thevalley #RealHousewives #vanderpumprules #scandoval #pumprules #rhodubai

explaining to Gia and Tepisa that John Fuda would never bring up to his name. Why are you discussing John Duda? You're upset with me. Why are you bringing that up? What the f***. Hello and welcome to the Bravo Outsider podcast and happy holidays to all of our listeners in the U.S. and Canada. We were off last week celebrating the holiday, but we're back. And since there was no Real Housewives of New Jersey that aired over the,

the holiday weekend. We're going to cover last weeks since we were off. So it works out perfect. Joined as always by Dylan Ferguson, and we are very excited to be joined by the host of the You're Literally On podcast, Dacey O'Kelly. I made design games, but I don't always play by the rules.

Oh, nice. That's great. Well, we've got a lot to get into for Real Housewives of New Jersey and Real Housewives of Dubai this week. So let's roll into it. I think we should start with Real Housewives of New Jersey. Dacey, do you want to give us a three sentence summary of what happened? Okay, so I'm not like a Jersey girl.

So I've only watched like the first and I think second seasons. Oh, okay. Yeah, my three sentence summary for the episode that I watched in this season would be Danielle and Jennifer get in a fight and the fallout is resolved. Lines are drawn in the sand and teams are pig. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,

when Bucci Kids is dropped. Yeah. Again. Yeah, again. Yeah, again. We got a rebrand. Still haven't fixed the way they spell Bougy about to have changed the logo, I guess. They've chose the worst possible font for it.

Oh, my God. Yes. I was sitting there like, I was like, what is this? Like, it's a rebrand. You should rebrand your name. The Bougy Kids just sounds like kind of cheap. I don't know. That's in my opinion.

But Danielle said that she spent like countless nights learning how to like code off of YouTube in this episode, but didn't spend as many nights scrolling through the available fonts that she could choose, or license. Just went with the default from Windows there. Love that for her. Let's dive into our artistic analysis. Daisy, was there anything that's set out to you in terms of like dominant themes or literary devices or cinematic devices or the presentation of this episode that was particularly

interesting to you? I I know maybe I'm just not used to like the jersey format but one I did like the highlighting of the children especially because we ended with bougie kids so but also I don't know I did like the presentation of like

picking aside and then trying to stay in the middle like there was a part where Jennifer Kessler yeah Jen Kessler at the very end she is like put in this like no when situation and she's like trying to play it in the middle and so I think it's kind of like foreshadowing one, the continuing feud between Teresa and Melissa because Melissa is just going to be anti-Torisa's side and vice versa.

And so I did like that. Kessler is kind of like our Fessler. Is I named Kessler Fessler? Fessler, yeah. Fessler, yeah. She was put in just like lose-lose situation. Yeah. Yeah.

I think that this is like a really interesting like strategic situation that she has to navigate here because Teresa has done a great job of like forcing this Kobayashi Meru situation on her where there's like no way to actually. win this. You just have to navigate it the best you can. Dylan, was there anything that stood out to you in terms of the artistic presentation here? Yeah, I'll give a little shout out to aesthetics in this episode, which I don't usually do because Jersey isn't normally the most like aesthetically pleasing show are the most like stunning artistic presentation. But I really did appreciate the way they presented Joe Bonino getting his news about about his,

his diagnosis being kind of, well, not positive, concerning, I guess. And the way that that was presented with, first of all, no music, which is key, but also just lots of shots of him kind of just staring into the middle ground, lots of shots of hands, lots of handheld cameras, kind of peering around corners, he'd be that sense of intimacy, that sense of being in a room with people who didn't

necessarily invite you into the room with them. That was as a good example of using the toolkit of documentary filmmaking to create a sense of a reality that puts you in the room with the people. And I, you know, I really felt for Joe in that moment. And he's a guy who I don't usually think of Joe Benino's emotions. You know, he's normally just kind of shuffling around in shorts and graphic teas, you know, fixing lighting or cleaning the pool or whatever. I just got to shuffle it around back there saying, yeah, sure, to whatever Marge says. And without him, ever really expressed it because he's clearly the kind of guy who does not really express his emotions. The documentary aesthetics do a good job of making us consider his emotions in that moment in a way that I thought that actually worked for me.

That actually hit for me. I was really feeling for the guy there. Yeah, totally. That's a great read. I love this scene as well. I think when you mentioned that, you know, Joe Benino not being someone that we as an audience typically like attach a like an emotional lens to, I think you're spot on there. And we've seen that be like built up just through Margaret's dynamic.

And a lot of the kind of the heavy emotional relation that she has is with her ex-husband, Jan. We've seen over the like seasons and seasons where, you know, she has children with Jan and there's a lot more emotions just because it's, you know, raw because there is infidelity there. and, you know, Joe Benino has been a lot more of a stoic personality. And you're right, they did a great job of really making this an emotional moment and kind of flipping that switch and being like, okay, I really like feel for this guy. He's going through something really human. And one thing that I thought was key about how they did this was they normally will see like so many scenes of housewives at home just with their husbands, you know, doing. whatever we saw it a million times in this episode, any given episode,

we just jump into their life at home. This was actually introduced with Margaret, with her friend in the kitchen, and Joe was in another room, like doing his own thing. And we saw, like, we saw Margaret's friend actually physically leave the scene,

like exit the scene. And then we were left alone with the couple. And it was like, it made it feel that much more like personal and intimate. that we were, you know, seeing something that someone else, we saw someone leave the room in order to give them their space for this intimate moment. And we were left with this almost voyeuristic view of it. Like you said, peering around corners and really getting the close-ups and the staring off into middle space.

Yeah, I thought this was a fantastic scene. Yeah, absolutely. There was one other little piece that I wanted to call out while we're doing this. we've talked about like tokens being a part of this jersey season obviously with the um the the bottle at the the party but another key token this this season has been the the book jacky's book and we got some resolution there i feel like we just need to like call call out the fact that we got a little bit of resolution that margaret finally got this book that she has been making a big deal over like not receiving and she got a very like impersonal note attached to it so um i think jacky was trying

to resolve this and be like okay you don't have anything to to come at me with anymore but um obviously margaret is going to use whatever she can't so she's she's got this like impersonal note and that's that's probably going to be a bigger deal than not having the book at all yeah she'll find something if there was no note she'd complain that there was no note and there is no note and there There's a note. Now she's going to complain. There was a note. Yeah.

Awesome. Dacey, do you want to give us a quote that stood out to you from this episode? Yeah. So I really loved, I don't remember who said it, but somebody was talking to Danielle at her bushy kids party. And they said, you said the dress code was casual. And she was like, I'm, we're sneakers. And I really love that quote.

And I also loved when she was talking about her dad potentially coming. And she was like, well, she had the bra on and she was like, well, now my boobie's her out. I think she said hoo-hahs. That's what it was. It was the Danielle term part. Yeah. I just thought that was a funny, nice quote. Yeah.

When I feel like Danielle just gives us so many great quotes whenever she's on screen. Because another one that stood out to me was, or her assistant said, if you vomited, this is probably what it would look like referring to like the party, which is, Like normally if you said that something looks like like vomit, it would not be, you know, a nice, nice characterization of something. But he or she meant it, she meant it as a compliment. And I really love that. Let's dive into strategy here. Dacey, what's it out to you in terms of strategy?

I'm sorry, what did you mean by strategy? I'm so sorry. Oh, yeah. So when we talk about strategy on hostwives, what we're typically talking about is like how the social game is played. So you mentioned how we saw like a lot of like changing of sides. Kind of the decisions and the small pieces that really go into that and how people kind of move their like jockey for social position within within the dynamic. All right.

That's what I thought you meant. But I was like, let me just get clarity. Yeah. Okay. Because I did have notes about this because I was like, ooh, these are interesting dynamics. on here. Okay. Yeah. Um, number one, I think that, okay, I'm super pacifist. I'm like such a non-aggressive person and like super not violent. However, I think if you like put your hands on another person, like, you can't then be upset by their response of you putting your hands on them. So I do kind of get

like Teresa's point. Like I kind of agree with Teresa that like they both kind of were in the wrong that Jennifer Aiden did put her hands on Danielle first. And then Danielle, you know, obviously escalated. It took it from like zero to 60, throwing the drink on her, or she threw a glass on her or something? It didn't show it in the recap. So yeah, this is like, this is something that I was actually wondering about it. Because when it happened live, I thought she smashed a glass against her head. And I was like, whoa, buddy, that's intense. But they were talking about it as a cup. So I was like, oh, is that just a plastic cup? Because if it's a plastic cup, that's not nearly as intense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So we got like a little bit of a like Zapruder tape treatment of this at the beginning of the beginning of this episode where they're doing the recap, but not nearly enough. And I think it was a plastic

cup. And it's hard to tell from that shot. But when I was watching the previous episode to this for a second or third time or whatever going into our last episode, I noticed that there was like a B-roll shot of a little like of a plastic like labeled cup that was like brought by I guess one of the caterers or whatever. So I think it was just a little plastic cup. that that was smashed. Glad we got that time. Yeah. And I feel like when they were at Jennifer Aden's house, she was clearly being like, oh,

if somebody punched you in the head, then I would like have your back. So one, like I said earlier, I think that they were setting Fessler up for failure. Like she was in such a lose-lose situation because she was taking up for the other woman's husband. And I couldn't catch her name. Oh, yeah. She was sticking up for John Fuda. John Fuda's wife. Yeah.

And I was like, why is this woman mad? And it was kind of like a damned if she does. if she don't. Like, there was no way she could win because she was like taking. And also, I didn't like Melissa's quote about, well, Gia 17, that's a child you shouldn't be talking about. It's like, yeah, Gia is 17. That is technically a child.

But also, she's 17. She's old enough to like ask questions if somebody's saying that she's doing cocaine at parties. Like she's older enough to understand that and like get clarification on a rumor about herself. So yeah, I think that she said. Yeah, I thought that Gia was actually older than that. I thought that Gia was like 21. And so the whole like she's a child thing really didn't make sense.

Yeah, I thought she was like 21 too. I thought she like, oh, I thought she was 17. Yeah, I was like, okay, she's technically a child, but old enough to like, they were definitely talking about the things that John Fuda had done that he was arrested for what happened when he was 17. And I think he said, I was younger than your daughter is now. And I think Fessler did a really bad job of actually defending it because she starts talking about it like, oh, it's like mistakes that she made when she was a child,

but he never said anything about her doing coke or anything like that. He just like picked a close at hand example of somebody being somebody she cares about who is young. And I didn't think there was any comparison to like or any implication of her drug use in what John Fuda said. Like I don't like John Fuda at all. But to me it seemed like he just said, oh, you know, like I was younger than say your daughter, a person who's who you care about whose age was similar or whatever. You know, like, and I thought Jen really put her foot in it by implying that he was talking about Gia's drug use when he never mentioned that at all. So I think like the context on this is, and I know you guys haven't watched this season, but I think like three seasons ago when Jackie was like a full blown housewife, this was a big conflict between Teresa and Jackie where Jackie made like an analogy and referred to Gia doing. Coke in a bathroom, like as an analogy for, you know, the rumors that Teresa was spreading about

Jackie's husband, Evan, you know, being unfaithful to her. And so I think John Fuda made reference to this, like, being like, oh, you know, I was younger than Gia was at the time when Jackie was made the analogy. And so that's how they kind of linked it back. But yeah, you're right. He was not, like implying that she was doing cocaine and um and jacky wasn't really implying that either she was trying to make an analogy that you know teresa grabbed onto and like blew up uh which john fooda should have known better maybe it was like intentional that he he did this to try to to trigger her but i am kind of losing my faith in the fact that rachel and john fooda have any sort of strategy operating here whatsoever. I think that they're just like going purely on emotion and yeah,

they just don't know, don't know what's what. Because Rachel's reaction of the party did made like zero sense to me. You know, if she doesn't want, if she doesn't want to give Teresa any ammo, like if she is like brought into what I think is Margaret's master plan and trying to freeze out Teresa, she's doing a absolutely terrible job of it. She's giving them, like, her nothing but ammunition and, like, talking points. And so if this is her finally being like, oh, I want to put my foot down, just don't, don't talk about me. I think she's like, she picked the wrong moment to try to do that.

And she made a big deal out of it, which is obviously going to make it a thing on camera. And, yeah, I have no idea what, what Rachel's trying to accomplish. And I think, I don't think she does either. I think both Rachel and John came into the season ready to fight, but not necessarily ready to play. Like, they're, they're very blunt instrument. And we saw that when John had the chance to sit down with Theresa and Louis. And he was almost immediately like, nope, I'm refusing this, this meeting.

I'm leaving and this is going to be my terms. And Rachel does something very similar in this episode where she's like, nope, that's, I decide that this is cross the Gilead and I'm going to walk away. they're trying to strengthen their position by saying that they can choose when to end any conversation at any point,

but the more skilled players are going to be using those opportunities rather than walking away from them. Yeah, totally. One thing that I thought was really interesting strategically is what Jen is kind of doing here because obviously her number one is

Teresa, but Teresa has a substantially higher, like, position within the show than her. Like, she's almost, like, kind of the godfather type boss. And what Jen is doing by forcing this conflict with Danielle is really interesting because she picked Danielle, because Danielle is good with, with Teresa. And the fact that she's kind of, like, forcing a bit of pressure upwards towards Teresa, I thought was, was interesting. I don't know why she is doing it, but it does, like, it's just a light, a little light amount of pressure there just to maybe be able to create some leverage with Teresa later if she needs it being like, well, you've got to pick me or Danielle later.

Or, like, you didn't really stand up for me. You went to Danielle's party. I need you to do this for me. So maybe I can use that in another situation down the last. line, you know, in some some larger, larger play. So I'm curious to see what comes of this and how it evolves. But yeah, I thought it was an interesting choice. That's definitely the thing that interests me,

about this episode strategically, is just the question, like, what is Jen Aidan doing? Because we see Teresa is not ready to be on board with her screw Danielle. Daniel's the enemy thing that she's going with. because Jen Aiden has clearly made a choice that she's going to set about attacking Danielle the way the previous season she made a choice that she was going to set about attacking Margaret, but it was more clear why she was attacking Margaret last season. And this season, it's really, that's kind of the big question for me is like, why is Jen doing that?

Because she clearly has decided and now she's picking little elements to justify it. Like, oh, you were rude to a hairdresser once or I don't like the way you run your charities. You know, she's clearly just finding justifications, but has made the choice. that I'm going to attack Daniel. I'm going to make her my enemy. And I agree that it's very hard to understand if you just look at it from the lens of she's an adjunct for team Teresa. Like she's just tied with Teresa's interest.

And we've often talked about Gen Aiden that way too. But I wonder if the solution is simply that, you know, Jen Aiden is also team Jen Aiden. And she's also playing for herself. And that maybe this is a way for her to, to try to grab the spotlight and become a central player too, which is surely something that she wants. And you could look at it from her perspective,

and she's seeing what's coming up in the events planned to be filmed. And this has been a very like Danielle focused, at least first half of this season, right? We have like Nate's recovered from brain surgery party. Then we have a lot of stuff about bougie kids being at New York Fashion Week. Now we have a bougie kids brand relaunch. You could see Jeddian looking at at these events coming up and being like, okay, Daniel's just going to be in the spotlight.

Like, she's got to be the central focus. So my path to the spotlight is to become her number one enemy. And I wonder if it's just as simple as that of just her saying that like, to be the, to have the most leverage and to be the central focus, I've just got to make my intanginess be the person who's already going to be in the spotlight. Yeah, that's interesting.

I think like one of the things that is we saw earlier this season where Teresa said to like Jen Fessler basically, I don't care like who you're friends with. It doesn't matter like where you go. She also said that to Jen and let Jen go to Melissa's party and was like, I don't care who you're friends with. But now in this episode, we saw, you know, Jen say in a confessional that she's hurt by the fact that Teresa is going to the bougie kids lunch. So it's there might be a more like emotional play here. Like Jen is more concerned about who's on whose side than Teresa is. Teresa will just play the field however it's laid out and she can she can work with it. whereas Jen is maybe more intentional about how she plays things.

She might be more threatened by the idea that Danielle is, you know, kind of straddling the line. And she is working better when, you know, when she knows very clearly who's on either side. So it could be like, I don't, since I don't trust you, since you are, you know, being, you're getting tighter with Rachel. You're getting tighter with Melissa and Margaret. I don't trust you anymore. So I want to make sure that you're firmly on that side of the room. And, you know, I can better play when I know who's where. And her growing attachment to Jen Fessler to try to bring her on board,

it might be influencing that because she's seeing that she's making progress there and she doesn't have the need for Danielle, especially when she sees her influence waning. A lot of progress. Fessler is the most vociferously defending Gen Aiden's position post-scrum. And that's a great example of why you shouldn't underestimate Gen Aiden's ability to get things done because Jen Fessler was staple to Jen's number one enemy last season, Margaret. And we see that little bit of a victory lap there when Gen Aiden calls back to that point last season

where Margaret is saying of Jen Fessler, do you think she'll ever love you as much as she loves me? And Jet Aiden's like, well, look what I got done. I ripped her off your side and stapled her to my side. Like, she can get that stuff done. Yeah, brilliant callback too. I love that. Did either of you guys have anything more on strategy that you want to touch on before we get into our highlights? No, I think that.

I think I'm good. Cool. Yeah, let's get into our highlights. Dacey, we'll start with you. What were your highlights? Um, one. Okay, I really liked Margaret. I didn't know that she's not a fan favorite. I really liked her. And two, I really love. Oh, she's a favorite. Yeah. I think she's like, okay, okay. I was like, I love her house. I like am a maximalist. So I really was like, oh, okay. Yeah. Want to live in her house. That was one of my highlights. And, um, yeah, because I feel like, I feel like the highlights of this episode were the strategies that you guys are talking about, especially like the Fessler callback of being like, well, now you love me more. So I feel like, I feel like, I feel like, she's like already implanting that like little inside joke, you know, with with Fessler. Aiden is.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. Dylan, how about you? I do like Fessler's awkwardness in this episode and how bad she face plants. And I also like how she's, she keeps going around at the end.

I'm not campaigning. I'm not campaigning for anybody. Meanwhile, she's dressed like Nancy Reagan for some reason. I was like, yeah, she's dressed like a campaign manager the whole time. Exactly. With the tight ponytail. Yeah. Well, in the middle of this like glitter bombed like Barbie, Katie Perry themed party,

for some reason she's wearing like pearls in a red pants suit or something. So that just also just makes her business and that much more awkward visually in that scene too. So that was great for me. I think that my highlights. So one thing we didn't talk about is we got Melissa's cousins. wedding. I actually really like Joe's speech. I thought that, you know, it seemed pretty authentic coming from him.

And I don't know, I really liked it here. So I want to give Joey G. some props here. I thought that that was pretty good. It was pretty good, though. I do think there was maybe too much emphasis on how he was accepting or rather than like on the people who was actually marrying. You know, he was kind of like, when he came to me and told me he was gay and I accepted it right away. Like, dude, it's not really about you, actually. I did make a note.

I was like, does he know this wedding isn't about him? But then I was like, okay, it is like a sweet speech and I guess he's proud, but also like it's not your wedding, my God. This is not your stand-up set. Yeah. And aside from that, I think we covered most of my, oh, of course, how could we forget the big to-do? Rachel's arthritis event. Getting more of Rachel's arthritis storyline.

Craig is so sick of Rachel talking about having arthritis. Actually, I did make a note about this because I'm a person that has a chronic illness that is invisible. So I was like,

I thought this was a really nice moment because to hear the little girls be like, I don't want to be known as the kid that's heard all the time. And I was like, I feel like that's really relatable. So I really,

I did like that scene. As I can relate to that seventh grade girl. No, yeah, I definitely. I just think that the way that Rachel is kind of trying to play this as a storyline is, you know, it kind of lines up with what she was doing last season with her, like, adopting her stepson storyline. Like, there's almost this, like, you know, we see so many hostwives that are, like, grasping for, for storylines, and it feels a lot more

organic. But the way that Rachel is handling this, specifically things like making sure that she gets a phone call in, like stepping outside to phone Dolores while she's at this event to like segue into getting coverage on this is what is. I think the thing that sounds out to me as being like annoying about how she's handling this. And, you know, it's something that she's really like bringing up a whole bunch. We heard nothing about it being like part of her, you know, part of her life until the very beginning of this season. And all of a sudden it's like, this is my thing. I'm like, you know, yeah, I just feel like her handling of this is really inorganic.

Yeah, it is kind of giving a Viva dresser when like in her final season where I was just like, what is this? I would just fast forward through the scenes, but that is what that reminded me. Okay, let's let's get into our stars. Dacey, what are your stars? Oh, yeah, I think Danielle was amazing. She looked good. She slayed. She slayed the whole episode.

Yeah. I, yeah, Daniel's my star, honestly. I liked Margaret and I liked her husband. Those are me too. I really liked them. I was the most invested in what they had going on. Awesome. Dylan, how about you?

Let's give first star to Jan Aidan. I think she's, the fact that I'm just trying to figure out what she's cooking up here is great. like she's she's the most interesting player for me right now and and always fun to watch too. So let's give her a first. Why don't we give a second start of Joe Benino? Only time that's ever going to happen. But you know what? He got some emotions come in there.

He had some moments that made me really think about the guy where he's usually just kind of like one of the dogs, just one of the something that's happening in the background. And so good to have Joe get a moment in there. And hopefully everything's okay for his results. fingers crossed for my buddy Joe, who's now my buddy. And third star, you know, let's give a third star to Margaret, just because she was part of that moment too. And it's nice to see that angle on her. I don't always love Margaret because she is such an intense presence.

But in moments like this, we get to cease kind of the anxiety, the kind of the things that she's gone through that are part of her personality and part of. of maybe why she is an intense person. You know, she's had to have to deal with a lot of stuff and is still dealing with things. And it's good to see that angle on her as well. Well, this shocking snub of Jen Fessler is not going to last here. She's going to be my number one star. Yeah, I think that the mess that the Fessler has gotten herself into is, you know, it's a thing of beauty.

and it is, you know, just this complex web that Teresa has weaved and, like, trapped her in, but how she's, like, navigating it and the way that she's operating, I just really love it. I love that she, you know, kind of got into a position where she has to defend Jen Aiden at the beginning and then has to, like, defend her, like, defending Rachel to Teresa to, Back to Rachel, I just really love this dynamic. And, you know, Jen Fessler, I think is just great television. She's great to watch. She just has a way about her.

So, yeah, she's my number one star. You guys touch on the other. I think Danielle definitely deserves a star here. And Jen Aden would be my other star, even though we don't really see a lot of, you know, Jen Fessler on screen, like in terms of raw screen time. but the impact that she has is as far reaching and it's raising interesting questions. And so for her to make as that much of an impact with that little screen time, I thought, you know, she definitely deserves a star there.

Also, I find it really entertaining how one of the subplots for me is that we have these, these two women who are like standing on the sidelines when all this shit was going down in the previous season and Jen Fessler and Jackie. And this season, they both, like, jump into the middle of the ring and both immediately faceplanned. It's been really funny. Yeah. Funny for me. Awesome.

Well, we're going to talk about Real Housewives of Dubai right away. But if you're enjoying our discussion, please be sure to like and subscribe to us on YouTube. Find us on your favorite podcast platform of choice. Subscribe and review there. It helps us out a ton. leave a comment we try to respond to all the comments on our YouTube channel so yeah hit us up we'll we'll write back I promise awesome so let's let's jump right into Dubai I think that this so we're actually a week behind on Dubai just because of the holiday

but we're going to talk about the fourth episode of season two of Real Housewives of Dubai. Dacey, do you want to give us a quick summary of what happened in this episode? Yes, women build each other up just to go to dinner and call each other a bitch. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, really good. Yeah, I want to say that I'm like one of the like five people that genuinely enjoy Real Housewives of Dubai. Like I'm a Dubai fan. There are dozens of us out there. So I am like,

I'm warming up to it. I have, it's been a little bit slow to grab me, but, you know, I, yeah, I am warming up to it. And that's mostly because, like, I think Chanel Iian is a great housewife. She would be an absolute, like, All-Star if she was on one of the more marquee franchises. And, yeah, I think that she's fantastic. Yeah, Chanel and Ion, you will always be famous. Like, she's really well. Let's talk about the artistic presentation here.

Dacey, do you want to get us started? Yeah, because I do have notes about this one. So the episode starts with Talene talking about her workout business and how she's like doing it to empower women because there's a lot of women in Dubai that don't want to go to the gyms with men. And then we cut to Ayan talking about like empowering things that she does for women. Like she goes and gets her teeth inspected and like talks about her mother and stuff like that. And then we have, oh my gosh, we have the mothers in this episode.

So there was like this huge focus on like girl boss, feminism. And then we get to the dinner. And there are these like amazing shots. Like first of all, first of all, Dubai, 10 out of 10. No misses on that cast. You get these like really powerful slow-mo shots of them walking into the hotel with like the flames coming up. And some of them wearing crowns. Like they're just decked out.

They look great. They look really powerful. And then, yeah, they get. to the dinner and they immediately are like praising each other and then it's like one tiny thing and the whole thing just unravels. And I was like, this is such a good like buildup to this dinner where you like see how fractured the friendships actually are because we got a lot of makeups this episode. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's a good read. And this dinner I thought that it was like visually interesting. I love that the use of like, um,

opposite elements like fire and water like brought together behind you know the table in this big like fountain with flames i i really like it was nice to look at i feel like the like the polar opposite representing like the division between the the two housewives and how it was like kind of together and kind of separate i just i i liked it a lot there was a lot to uh feast the eyes the feast the eyes the eyes on. Dylan, what stood out to you in terms of the presentation here? Yeah, I did like the setting for the dinner at the end too. I do like the jets of water being blown everywhere as well, like underscoring the drama. And also it kind of reminds me of like that thing in Dune where like they show their wealth by having plants that take a lot of water when they're in

the middle of the desert. It kind of feels like that. You know, they're in the middle of the desert. And there's like, look, look how much water we can waste to show how wealthy we are. I do think it's a great choice of location for Aion to make. I also feel like you, Craig, maybe even more so that, like, thank God she's on the show, because otherwise, I don't know why I would be watching it. But I do think that she's probably a good fit for the show too, though. Like you said, she could really kill on another show, probably. But there's something that makes her appreciate the setting a little bit more for me when I normally wouldn't really appreciate that much.

Because there's something about her, which is kind of like the city and that she's kind of like this, this cipher, which has like an impeccable facade, kind of an intimidating facade. her aesthetics are always very impressive and very big. And but you don't really, she's kind of mysterious beyond that. She's kind of sphinx-like, you know, we don't even know how old she is. We don't, like what is her inner life like? I have no idea. How many teeth does she have? It's just, there's like all this mystery behind this kind of intimidating facade.

And that combined with her being just like an extreme. entertaining delightful presence on camera. Makes me like the show more. And I love the way that she shows up first for her dinner and just like talks incessantly with a guy showing her to the table and then does an impromptu photo shoot because she's there before everybody else. Like it's all like like classic Chanel shit. And it's just great that she as at the same time being like, this is the queen party

and we're here to, you know, build each other up and tell each other how great we. we are and I pick this spot to make you feel all jealous about my seats at Beyonce. That's great. The double-edged sort of that is just very unread and just like very well done. Also, I don't like the whole like the aesthetic is queen is something that I don't like really understand in the real world because it's like what does an actual queen look like? like just some decrepit old parasite. Like, what's it, that's an actual, I feel like you could come up with a better term than

queen to, to indicate like, like, powerful woman, you know? That's just me. I mean, Catherine, the Great overtook Russia in a bloodless coup. So, I mean. Yeah, sure. But that was a long time ago. Yeah, that's okay, true, true, true. I thought that this idea of a queen kind of ties in.

to something else that was just a little subtle comment from Talim where she was, she says, oh, you can't get like chefs and servants like this in, in America. I love the luxury of Dubai. Right. And it's like just like basking in this like economic disparity between, you know, the elites in Dubai and like the people that are actually like making everything happen. Totally. That's enough for me too. It's like, yeah, you can hire those people in America. You just have to pay them a fair wage. Yeah. Yeah.

That was literally my first thought. I was like, we have that here. Yeah. Yeah, I thought another theme and something else that added an element of interest to this episode for me was the dynamic between Sergio and Caroline here. Right. That's still happening. Yeah.

Yeah. I like, I can't stand Sergio. He's great, great TV. here. But yeah, it's just this argument that they are having where he is just so fragile in his, like, masculinity and being like, no, you, you, you, you come to me first. I'm your husband. I'm the man of the house. You, like, you prioritize me is just like, it is so toxic and him just, yeah, I, uh, he's, he's, he's awful. Yeah, I, I made a note about that because literally, the episode before this one is Stanberry doing her like hypnotherapy and she tells him point blank like

you need to like think and act for yourself like I can't micromanage you all the time and he's like no no no like I like it I like it and then this episode he's like screaming at her and no he's the man house and yada yada yada and it's like just 10 seconds ago like you couldn't like put up handbags by yourself like what do you what do you want from her like these are mixed messages so i just thought I was like, I wrote Pick Elaine Sergio in my nose. Like, do you want her to micromanage you or do you want to be the man of the house? Like, which one do you want to do? Yeah, there's all sorts of questions about how like labor is divided in this relationship that are kind of unanswered to me.

Like, I don't know what Sergio actually brings to the table because he can't like, he's clear. He's yellow and hot, Craig. Like, what do you? Yeah. I mean, I think it's kind of obvious when he brings to the table. I don't know. Yeah. he's less than half her age.

I think that he really does, like, worship the ground she walks on. And I think that Stanberry enjoys that aspect because I don't think she got, I didn't watch, well, she was on Ladies of London, right? Right. Yeah. And I didn't, I didn't watch that. But I got the sense from the clips we got in this episode that her ex-husband wasn't very, like, present in her life. And Sergio was like up her behole constantly. And I think that's what he brings to the table is like, he's obsessed with her.

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I thought that this like his inability to see that she's like working and just like pestering her with questions was really interesting because it does bring up like something that I think is, you know, a lot of a lot of couples will have arguments over the division of labor. and for him to just be completely blind to everything that she's like juggling right in front of him and just prioritizing his own questions over, you know, what she's trying to deal with. I thought that that was like a really interesting dynamic to see on screen. It was very real. I don't get a sense that any of this is like produced by either of them.

and this situation that they have been living in in, like Carolyn's friend's house and like Sergio having to be confronted by someone and every like thing that he does is like perceived as a slight towards his identity as a man, I think is really interesting. Like everything seems to be like something that he is taking personally. Like just like harmless jokes or maybe not harmless jokes, but just like barbs from Carolyn's kids are like cutting him so deeply that he's like going and venting to the guys about it on camera and, you know, talking to Talim, who Carolyn points out, like, they don't know her. They just, they just met her.

Why are you talking about this? Yeah, I just thought that that was such an interesting dynamic. He's such a liability for Carolyn. I feel like his shelf life is rapidly coming to an end. end here. And I think that it, there was an interesting callback to this idea of like the division of, of labor or responsibility when we hear Carolyn Brooks talking about how, you know, friendship is, is 50-50 and like, you know, needs to go both ways. And so to see that, you know, that Carolyn is having to, Carolyn Sanbury is having to overcompensate in one area and is, you know,

maybe neglecting a friendship in another area as compensation. I think that is interesting. I'm curious to see how that evolves, whether there is, like, if this is actually an honest, like, dropping the ball from Carolyn Sanbury, or if it is, you know, a more strategic move that I think,

like, Carolyn Sanbury is definitely capable. That's TBD, but it's something that I'm, I'm interested in watching. Yeah, just a piggyback off what you said. I also think the Surgeoning and Carolyn thing, like, it really highlighted their imbalance of power because, like, she holds the purse strings. Like, she is the reason he can live in Dubai.

Like, she is the reason they have this house. Like, it's all in her name. And I think that there is this, like, this, like, power struggle between the two of them. That I think is, like, a really interesting dynamic that you don't see coming from, like, a woman's perspective a lot of times. You see it typically from, like, the husband's perspective. So, I don't know. I really liked that.

And I also, I personally think the imbalance of power is one of the reasons why I'm more sympathetic to Sergio than you guys are. I do think he sucks. And I do think it's shitty that he's being like, oh, you know, I'm the husband. You have to prioritize me. That's that's shitty stuff to say. But I do think he's in a very vulnerable position because she has the power in the relationship. And I do think she's very cruel to him and treats him like he's not a human being. And I think that we do actually say him apologize for the way he spoke to her, which doesn't make it so mean it's okay. But we never. see her apologize for like being very rude to him and treating him kind of like like he's her dog I think so I think from both ends it's a toxic relationship. No he's worse than a dog he's dirt. She doesn't need to apologize. He's dirt. I do agree though that he she I think she does treat him like a human being until he has like a human reaction to how she's being towards him and then she's like what are you this is not no no no this is like not the part you play. Yeah, he's basically like supposed to be a statue.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, let's get a quote, Dacey. What's set up to you in terms of quotes here? Yeah, Chanel Ion's quote in her confessional, the best thing I have realized with Brooks is to be nice to her because she is like the hungry hyena. The nicer I am, the calmer she gets.

And I am not like, I honestly did not go into this season, because I'm not a Stanberry fan. And I was like this season, but she clocked in. And Brooks, I feel like is kind of clocking out. I know she's got a lot on her plate, but I wasn't expecting to not like Brooks as much this season and prefer Stanbury. But yeah, I was like, oh, she's kind of right with the way Brooks has been behaving. And then I liked Lisa's reaction to Ayan being nice to her,

where everyone's like, what is happening? But Ayan, she's so strategic. Like, she's playing the game. Yeah. And like her position in the middle of that table, It was just like perfect, perfect. The whole scene, it's just such a great scene. Yeah, totally.

What does, I did not understand this quote. I had it written down as well because I just did not understand the like the hungry hyena, the nicer I am the calmer she gets. What is like, is that a, is that a comment? You clearly have not had much experience with hyenas, Craig. Yeah, no, I don't. I think she's just saying like she's not going to like attack, like, attack. she's not going to go out of her way to be mean to her and provoke her.

She's just going to try and like, you know, not coddle, but like pacify her a little bit. Oh, okay, yeah. That makes sense. Let's get into the strategy here. Dylan, we'll start with you. Anything stand up to you in terms of the strategic decisions? You know, I think the strategy is still kind of baffling to me on this show. I'm not really sure what anybody's going for, to be honest.

I do find it odd that they do like a what seems to be like a classic housewives game of like everybody go around and say something about somebody else. But she's just like and say something nice and uplifting about everybody else. And I'm like, that's not how it usually works. You're supposed to say something mean and terrible. And they do get around to being mean a bit eventually. But it just, you know, there's supposed to be a gimmick in there. Like, you know, we're going to do a compliment sandwich where you got to say something mean between two nice things or something like that.

But yeah, too much positivity is bad for drama. Yeah. Daisy, how about you? Yeah, Dylan, I'm going to have to disagree with you because this episode, we get Saba. So now Sarah has, she's got a tag team partner. We've got Teline, who is supposed to be Brooks's tag team partner. But what does she do with this dinner? She goes for Stanberry.

And Stanberry is like such a pivotal player within this group because you have Lisa and I on and they're, you know, like, they're a duo. You have Sarah, she kind of like floats around, does whatever, but now she has Saba. And then you have Brooks, who's kind of like an island on her own. And she brings in Toulin to the group. And Stanberry is also another person's on her own, but she kind of has this like essence of you have to kiss the ring, even though you like don't for her. But she thinks that. And so I think they all kind of like buy into that concept. And they see that she's getting close to Ion. They know ion is the fan favorite. And I like that she pulls Stanberry away because it, it, it, immediately like set all the other ladies off and it like you really could see like oh this is like

loose ice we're standing on all of these groups and that one little thing was enough to like tink chink and i think teline sees it because now she's in a position of power amongst the other women because now she has a secret with stanberry that's nobody else's business and it's not it's genuinely not anybody else's business so stanberry's going to back up that claim and i just was like that's a good move on her i actually looked up their star signs because i thought it was so interesting because Talene is a Libra like me. And Sandbury is a Taurus. So I liked that, like, you could actually see, like, kind of, I don't know, those, like, weird dynamics at play.

Yeah. This was a, like, this was, I think, the pivotal decision that stood out to me as well. I think that you're right. This is just really savvy play by Taleen. She does it. She, like, pulls Stanbury aside. She gives them this, like, this. piece of information, this currency that they can share together. She doesn't do it publicly,

per se, like she doesn't air it out there so that it still has value between, like shared value between the two of them. But she introduces it to the group by doing that in a public setting. She didn't call her like before. She didn't like go to lunch. She pulled her aside at, at a dinner. And that is what gives that even more power. And I, I just thought that this was like a really smart heads up thing to do here. And she probably anticipated that she would get heat for this from the group, which she does. And I think that she did a great job of, you know, she handled it really well. Like she said, you know, it's none your business. Like I was, you know, it's nothing. It's just something between, between us. Don't

worry about it. We're good. And that just made people. even more like shooken. And she also, one thing that she did that was smart was she didn't try to bring Stanbury back into this. When all the wolves were coming for her, she just like, you know,

fended them off herself. She didn't try to rope Stanbury back in. She was just like, it's none of your business. Just like drop it. And yeah, I thought that this was really smart. It gives her a lot of,

a lot of currency with, with Stanbury. And it gives her, you know something to navigate the dynamic with um so yeah i i agree this was definitely a smart play um any other pieces of strategy to talk about before we get into our highlights i want to somebody okay so we've we've had the the labia gate for like an episode or two now and taline constantly is saying about like she's over like she knows that sanberry was joking like And she was just having fun, like whatever.

They've like squashed their beef. And so we've seen Brooks like go so hard for like the vagina gate stuff. And then all of a sudden like somebody else picked up the mantle. And I do not remember who it was. But it wasn't Brooks. It was like, it was like a completely different lady. And I was like, this is interesting. Like we're still fighting battles or somebody else's gentles.

Like, and it's a different character on the show. And I was like, that's a really interesting point. And now I'm kicking myself. So I don't remember who it was. But that was interesting. Hopefully we get to hear more. about, you know, vagina's next episode. Let's get into our highlights.

Dacey, what are your highlights? Okay, yeah, my main one is, why is Stanberry so orange at this Queen's dinner? Her makeup was, like, it was bizarre to me, and she always has, like, a pretty good beat. So I was like, like, her foundation was just really throwing me up. She's moving. Maybe it's, like, in a box that she doesn't know where her good makeup is. Yeah, she did. But she has a glam squad.

Like she has glint. Yeah, that's true. That was the highlight. I like drew a star. Like, what's wrong with her face? I liked the foreshadowing because we know that there's going to be a fallout between Ion and Lisa. And I liked that like the final quote of the show was, this would never happen between like Lisa and me. I would always have her back.

And you like, see at the dinner, Ion is like just backing up Lisa without even knowing what's going on. Just like echoing her like a little parrot. And I really liked the setup of that. And I liked Ion's teeth stuff. I like that she thinks her body is 60. Typical 60 year old. Yeah, yeah. I was like, yeah, okay.

But yeah, those are my big three. Awesome. How about you, Dylan? Just quickly, I'll say that, even though I'm not a huge fan of Carolyn Stanbury, when she was talking about like Chanel Ion's like procedure, she was kind of on fire. She had some great lines about being like, oh, that's why she's so skinny because half the food is falling out the side of her mouth.

And like, you know, I never noticed she's missing teeth because she never smiles when she's around me. So she had some good lines in there. Yeah, I agree. I think like, like Carolyn Stanbury appreciates when people can take their, the, a ribbing that she's wanting to give out. Like, we saw, you know, Talim has made such good ground with Carolyn Stanbury because she was able to be like, I realize you were like, like joking and I'm not like going to make a big deal out of a bit. And now she's tight with Stanbury. And I think that the fact that, you know,

Chanel Ayan is able to handle this, this season is helping solidify their relationship a bit. So yeah, I, um, I like that as well. Mm hmm. Uh, any other highlights?

Yeah. I don't think so. Okay. Oh, I didn't, I didn't give mine actually. Um, yeah, I,

I was happy to, to see Sabah again. I really like the scene where they got Krak is it, I think. You know, we got a confessional, like a pretty good confessional look from her. And the fact that she's getting a confessional means that she's going to come into play here. So I'm pretty excited about what she is going to bring to the table. We got the, I need crack in the morning. I need crack in the afternoon song in this, which was, which was really good. So I, uh, I, uh, I need crack. I need crack in the afternoon song. in this, which was really good. So I,

I like that a lot. There was another scene with Carolyn Brooks. We're seeing her kind of retreat into her family this season, I feel like, and not really involve herself too much aside from just getting into it with Stanbury. But there was a scene where Carolyn Brooks is kind of grappling with her kid becoming like a tween and starting to create some, some distance here and it was just something that like like resonated with me and it just like kind of tapped into my own like like I worry about this happening with with my kids and when they're going to eventually start creating distance. My eldest is five right now. So it's like a few

years off but just seeing her kind of see this evolution of this dynamic between her and her her child is, you know, it tugged on the heartstrings quite a bit. So, yeah, that was a highlight. I think that's about all the highlights that I had. Let's get into our stars here. Daisy, who are your stars? Number one would be Teline's vagina because it is caused so much, like, friction amongst this group. And for what? And it's like, I really hated like Panty Gate from Beverly Hills. But this, this one, I'm like, I just really love it because Talene is openly being like, I am over this. And all the other women are like fighting. And I just really, I'm like, this is the true star of this show.

Like, um, my other star is, uh, Brooks's mom. I really, really loved their, their phone call. Honestly, all the moms, I think Sylvia's, Tulines. And then, uh, we saw Lisa's mom as well. And I, I just thought it was this like really beautiful. I don't know. It was really nice. And I really liked that Brooks's mom was like, he hates you now, but don't worry.

You guys will be best friends in a few years. Made me miss my mom. So I was like, yeah, but I was like 10. I probably wasn't super nice to my mom. But yeah. And then I really like to lean this episode. And Sabah, I'm obsessed with her. I mean, I just love them both.

Yeah. Sabah being introduced as the sabotage is just like, I am waiting for her to like start a fire or something. I'm just looking forward to what she could bring to the table. I hope it wasn't to this false billing because I'm really. latching onto it. But yeah, really excited for her. Dylan, who are your stars? Obviously, first star goes to Chanel, I.N. She's just the most exciting presence on screen. You know, I'll give a second star to Carolyn Stanbury just because, like I mentioned, she had a couple good lines there. She was having fun with Chanel, and their dynamic is pretty good.

Let's give a third star to that little alien figurine that we see that guy giving to Sarah, because, you know, that's, he knows the way to her heart. Yeah. Weird alien paraphernalia. So that's like a super savvy move by him. I hope he comes on the show. Yeah, totally. Yeah, I think my number one star has got to be Chanel.

And, you know, she's just heads and shoulders above the rest. So, yeah, I love her every moment that she's on camera. and I think that I've got to give my second start to Sergio. He's dirt. He's awful. He's so annoying. But it's making me feel something. Like it reminds me that I'm alive and engaging with art.

When I really feel like something so primal, this like primal annoyance with someone and just like distaste for them. Yeah, it's like, you. You don't have to, one of the things I enjoy about reality TV is like you can engage with these characters on different levels. And Sergio is definitely giving me that right now. It's compelling. So I got to give them some points there. You can get my number two star. And then third star, let's give another one to Chanel I.N.

I just think she's giving that much. No, I'll give my third star to Teline because I think she is playing a savvy game. man, I'm liking what she's bringing to the table as a first year housewife. So that's pretty good. Awesome. Well, this has been a blast. Dacey, do you want to let everyone know a little bit about your podcast?

Yeah. So I read and review and discuss books written by reality TV stars. We have, you know, a few episodes about Jay Wals dating book. Like, no one is safe. We just released an episode on Erica Jane's book. That's really fun. Yeah, I basically read them and just subject my friends to them so that I can force my hobbies on everybody else in my life. Have you got Jackie's book yet?

I haven't. I literally have like so many. I'm actually working on Rick Harrison from Ponsar's book, which is like the most unintentionally funny thing I've ever read. So I'm really excited for that one. That's amazing. Yeah. And people can check that out on all podcast platforms. Yeah.

I'm everywhere. You're literally on. And then on Instagram, Twitter, Blue Sky. Awesome. Dylan, how about yourself? Yeah, well, I just want to say thanks so much, Stacey. And I'm glad that we had somebody on who is just deep reading Dubai, because it wasn't me. And I think the next time we talk to Dubai, Craig should ask you to be co-host because your read on it was great.

And you can find me on Substack writing about movies very occasionally. The name is Dylan Ferguson, D-Y-L-A-N, by the way. Awesome. I'm Craig Midwinter. You can find me just manning some of Bravo. Outsiders, podcast, socials, uh, were on Instagram at Bravo Outsider on TikTok at Bravo Outsider. Just Google us.

You'll find us. But the important thing is to leave a comment on this video. If you're watching on YouTube and hit the subscribe button, uh, tell your friends about us. If anyone's asking for Bravo recommendations, tell them about our show. It helps us out a ton. Let's us know that we're not screaming into the void. Uh, and we appreciate all the feedback that we get. It helps make the show better.

even if you've got something negative to say, we take that to heart. We will change our identity to suit your needs. Absolutely. We will completely overhaul the show if you say one thing is wrong with it. Until next week, keep on wiping.