Breaking News from Pod Save America - Top Trump Appointee ENRAGES MAGA In Uncomfortable New Interview (w/ The Bulwark's Tim Miller)

Episode Date: May 19, 2025

Jon Lovett and Tim Miller discuss top FBI appointees Kash Patel and Dan Bongino, and how the conspiracy-loving MAGA movement is twisting themselves into pretzels now that Trump is in office. Get tickets to the Crooked and Bulwark event on June 6 Photos courtesy of AP Photo Archive Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Last night, you spent two hours deciding what to wear to the party. This morning, it'll take you two minutes to list it on Deepop and make your money back. Just grab your phone, snap a few photos, and we'll take care of the rest. The sheer dress and platform heels you'll never wear again, there's a birthday girl searching for them right now. Your one-and-done look is about to pay for your next night out, or at least the right home. Your style can make you cash. Start selling on Deepop, where Taste recognizes taste. Hey, everybody. I am here with Tim Miller of the bulwark. We're here today to talk about what happens when a bunch of conspiracy theories making all kinds of claims about the secret history of the deep state inside our federal government takes the reins of that federal government, having made all kinds of promises about the revelations, about the epiphanies about to come before us.

Just to give you an example of where we're at, this is the question that Caroline Levitt, no relation, got today in the briefing room from a guy named Liam Cosgrove from an outlet called Zero Hedge. Let's take a look. And my only other question for you is so over the weekend, President Trump posted True Social, a video highlighting what most people call the Clinton body cap, which is the strange number of suicides that seem to happen in happening circles. I have a headline here from the Washington Post that said, Trump peddle's false conspiracy theories tying the Clintons to several deaths. So I just wanted to highlight real quick. This wasn't in Trump's video, but this is from the Arkansas Times. And it's the death of Mark Middleton, who was a former Clinton White House aide,

who was found dead on a Clinton Foundation property. And I'll just quote from the Arkansas Times, Middleton apparently shot himself in the chest with a shotgun and also hung himself from a tree with an extension court. So I have no idea how somebody commits suicide that way, but if the Washington Post is here, maybe you can enlighten us as to how that was actually a suicide. So anyways, that's just a lead-in to my question

about the most famous Clinton-related suicide, which is that of Jeffrey Epstein. There's still a lot of questions around that case. You've released phase one of the Epstein files. What was missing from that is any connection to his ties to intelligence agencies, and that's really the whole story that not just trafficking young girls, doing it on behalf of intelligence agencies and even potentially as part of a blackmail ring with potential ties to the Israeli government. So for phase two, when can we expect it?

Will it have information pertaining to those aspects of the Epstein case? I know the Attorney General has committed to releasing those files. I would defer you to the Department of Justice on her timeline, but when she has made a promise in the past, she has kept it, and I'm certain that she will in this case as well. More of a comment than a question there. Yeah, you get a lot of comments, not questions from that new media seat. So that is the kind of expectation that has been set for the Trump administration by itself, right? This is what they have created a kind of fervor around.

Trump has spread a lot of conspiracy theories a couple weeks ago. Pam Bondi released what was supposed to be phase one of the Epstein files. But so far, it's been pretty disappointing, hasn't it's him? It's been quite disappointing to the people, to the MAGA hordes, if you will. A quick, an amusing aside, can I do one amusing aside for people? Zero Hedge is somebody I followed for a long time because I like to monitor what's happening in the fever swamps. I've been intrigued by Zero Hedge for quite a while, many years now. And his avatar on his social media is a shirtless picture of a muscled man with like some blood.

down his chest and I guess maybe from fight club it is you've seen it as well I know I know that's how it's speaking of and so when I saw him for the first time in the flesh today I was like hmm that doesn't that doesn't seem like a fellow that's been in a flight club to me uh you know I don't know he had a little I'm not sure I think I'd probably have my money on love it if if you guys wow if you guys were to go head to head wow I mean I've been putting creatine in my smoothies so I know I'm my I'm going up in the ranks said I guess false advertising is all I'm saying on both, you know, his physique as well as on the subject matter at hand of the Clinton body count. You know, these guys, when you get into the FBI, when you get into the DOJ, there is this hope built up over many years that the evil that you said that you are fighting, that there will be some comeuppance, right?

Like, for a lot of the Trump fans, the comeuppance was just the fact that Trump won. Trump won, John Lovett cried, you know, he gets to be in the White House, right? Like that's it. That's enough for some people. But there are other fans that took this all seriously, right? Like the types of people that stormed the Capitol, the types of people that really did think that Hillary Clinton was frazzle dripping. And there's an expectation now from them that Pam Bondi and Cash Patel and Dan Bongino will go and punish their foes, just like the January Sixers were punished, right?

Like why has there not been indictments yet about any of the Clintons or the Biden crime family? You know, why haven't we gotten to the bottom of who, Jeffrey Epstein was protecting and who killed him, right? And so, like, these questions now, they have to do this dance, right? Like the Trump Whitehouse is like, well, you might want to ask Pam about that. Then Pam's like, here's some binders I'm going to give to some of you that has information that anyone that read the Miami Herald already would have known about Jeffrey Epstein, you know, because there's nothing, they don't, they can't do what they had promised, right?

And so they're left kind of having to play this, you know, game of, you know, this, what is it, the Monty? Three Card Monty. You're talking about Three Card Monty? No, it's not Monty. Let's get at the balls and the cups. It's a different game. What is the game with the balls and the cups called? They've got to do the balls in the cups. I mean, honestly, you could have gone with three card Monty.

It's the same idea. You know, idea. What's interesting about the Epstein of it all is Donald Trump was president when Jeffrey Epstein died. Is that right? He, yes, yes. He killed himself in 2019. This is, you're,

you're another person who's been, who's had their mind fucking white by Donald Trump. I'm joking. I'm joking. I'm joking. I do know that. Bill Barr was the attorney general. Alex Acosta was in the Trump cabinet who was involved in the initial Epstein legal team. Well, this is I'm very,

I go very deep on this. I'm quite aware. If anybody killed Epstein, it was somebody in the Trump orbit. Right. Well, the other piece of this, which has obviously been outrageous, is Acosta was somebody people pointed to as one of the reasons Epstein was treated so leniently in Florida. Donald Trump, obviously knew Epstein. And then we went through this whole cycle where all these conspiracy theories are interviewing Donald Trump. even fucking asked him about it. Well, no, because it has to affirm their, like, the

anti here, like the pre-existing, like, truth, so to speak, that must be confirmed by the conspiracy theorists is that there is a web of deep state Jews and gays and others, you know, that are responsible for all of this, right? And they are liberals, and they are all protecting the Clintons, and they are all powerful and hollors. And they are all powerful. Hollywood and finance and and these people need to be exposed. And so if you're if you're kind of working backwards from that base fact, you know, you don't let like inconvenient alternate facts, you know, get in the way of your investigation.

And that's what is happening here. Yeah. And so Donald Trump, I think, is clearly aware that basically he's spent years with these with his whole MAGA kind of media apparatus, getting a bunch of right-wingers rock fucking hard. And then he's just going to leave. And so he got he put this. That's what he's so he put this video out. He he re-shared it over the weekend.

Let's take a look at just the kind of unhinged content that Donald Trump has been sharing. This is from 2016. Let's see it. In 2015, Walter Shive, a White House chef hired under Bill Clinton, joined the list. His body was found at the bottom of a river, nearly two miles from the base of the trail he was reportedly hiking. An autopsy determined that Shive's death was accidental drowning, but he might have known too much. 27-year-old Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich was shot and killed in D.C. this year. There is speculation that he was the source of the controversial leaked emails allegedly sent by DMC staffers.

This is all obviously conspiratorial nonsense. But I forget the details of just how many people Bill and Hillary Clinton are meant to have murdered and how a nerd we are to the fact that the current president of the United States is sharing this kind of crap. I want to shout out. People actually care about the Seth Ritch case. There's a great book of death on W Street. The stuff the thing makes me so sad. and I'm sure it would make me upset if I knew the people involved in the 1990s nonsense.

This is just as a generational gap. But since we lived through the Seth Ritch thing, that story is so tragic. And like everything they say about it is wrong. And it is, like we are near. Like the idea that Trump, like the presidents can go out and just pop off on this thing and be like, my political rivals killed this random 27-year-old. And I've, you know, I've told my DOJ. that they should look into all this, right?

Like, that is not anything that is even within precedence. Like, there's nothing to compare it to. There's no real comp in our lives. I guess you go back to Nixon. There may be some comps, but in the post-Nixon, there are, like, really, really no comps to what he's been doing. And, like, I'm sure when you get into the cash in Bongino of this, but, like, the problem is that, like, you would think now,

by this time it's his fifth year in the White House that there would be some follow-through. on any of this, but I think the unfortunate kind of reality of like dealing with the conspiratorial mind is, I don't know if there has to be actually. I think can he just keep them riled up over and over again on different things or eventually does the bill come do on this sort of thing?

That's, it's a little bit like they're all following a cult leader who has told them when the world is gonna end. Yeah. But then the world keeps, not ending and so he goes back into his his yurt and like does the calculations and comes back out and says I have a new revelation the end of the universe will be six months from now but but I do think this is coming to ahead because for whatever reason the kind of maga conspiratorial online freaks

they can forgive the first four years because they believe he had not yet been able to grab the reins of the deep state. But I don't know how they get past this. We have FBI director, Cash Patel, deputy FBI director Dan Bongino. Say that again. Deputy director Dan Bongino. Deputy FBI director Dan Bongino. I just like to sit with it every day. No, I know you did. I know. I understood that we just need to let's just take, let's just make space for that. That's our defying gravity. We're holding space for deputy. We're holding space for deputy. FBI director, Dan Bongino. Let's hold space for that.

And, but, but they were sitting side by side being interviewed. First of all, a great, a great duo. I don't know who the straight man is, but seeing him side by side, it's gold. It's gold. The eyes. It's, what is happening on both of their eyes? It's, um, it's a beady off. It's, yeah, well, I would not, yeah, there, are they beat, Dan Bonino's eyes are

Beatty. Cash Patel's eyes are open. His eyes are fucking open. He is seeing it all. It's a, he has such a funny, he has such a naturally comedic resting face. It just, it is. Honestly, you can't teach it. You can't train it. It's a gift. Let's roll the clip. You said Jeffrey Epstein committed suicide. People don't believe it. Well, I mean, listen, they have a right to their opinion, but as someone who has worked, as a public defender, as a prosecutor who's been in that prison system, who's been in the Metropolitan Detention Center, who's been in segregated housing,

you know a suicide when you see one, and that's what that was. He killed himself. Again, you want me to get? I've seen the whole file. He killed himself. The lady doth protest too much. I mean, it was a little, Dan was really laying it on thick there. I don't buy it, I guess, is what I'm saying.

I don't buy it. Me neither. I'm with you. You know? I mean, if he was coming in and you're like, hey, Like we're taping a new season of NCIS. We're trying to find a new deputy FBI director to convincingly tell people that somebody who has murdered killed himself. And Dan Bongino gives that performance.

We're going to move on to the next person in line. Well, he does a little bit more. There's more to that clip. It's a longer clip. And he does a lot of kind of perseverating because clearly he knows that there are people that aren't going to believe. him and he knows he's you know part of this big kind of deep state maga you know back at you know the the it's easier being a podcaster you know seriously it must just be it's just much easier being a podcaster uh but the reaction to this i'm just going to read you a couple i have

reviewed the case jeffrey upsin killed himself there's no evidence in the case file indicating otherwise this statement by itself is enough reason for me to never believe another word that dan bingino says deep state trader. Love that. This is extremely insulting to the intelligence of the people who pay your salary. Your department promoted a key figure

in the persecution of the J-Sixers. You've done nothing to expose Ray Epps and the other feds in the false flag operation. James Comey's 8647 post wasn't a coincidence. It was a calculated signal from a corrupt insider. A former FBI director

doesn't get to play dumb about death threat slang while his agency claims to priorities, community safety. Epstein case closed with a wink. The same Bureau that spied on Trump now wants trust after years of targeting conservatives. You know, there are a few funny things about this that I think it's worth appreciating. On the one hand, if Kamala Harris was the president, I guess this is kind of sad and funny, the Dan Benjino and Cash, like their material would be indistinguishable from what you were just reading. Right.

You know what I mean? Like that was the type of stuff they were promoting. That is the type of stuff that got the stuff. them, you know, their Trump bucks, and they're, in Dan Bonino's case, you know, status on the podcast charts right below Podsave America. And like, that's how they did it. Like, like, that material right there. Ray Epps, like, these guys are pushing all that stuff. It was read, the Fed'surrection, all that. And so now they're in these shoes where they have to, like, you know, kind of try to backfill, you know, some reality and spoon-feed it to these people very

softly and nicely. I give them a little bit of ice cream with the bad news. You know, something to make it go down a little easier. So that part is funny. And then the other part is like, I guess, can I say something nice about Cash? Is that allowed on this channel? It's interesting because I think our minds are going to a similar place.

I want to hear you have to say. It could be, I mean, it could be way worse than this, right? I mean, they could be doing the thing where they're trying to, honestly, honestly. I'm just going to be fully honest. When Trump nominated all of the cabinet people and Cash isn't tucking the cabinet, but the cash is the person I was the most worried about

because the FBI can do a lot of shit before they indict people. Like the FBI, cash could just be out there, like doing, and maybe this will come at some point, but like doing investigations into people over nothing, doing these propped up investigations, hassling people, harassing people, tapping their phones. FBI has a lot of leeway before you get to a grand jury.

And the fact that they're not doing that and that they're doing these humiliating interviews with Maria Bar Romo, is like I guess good it's so funny I was I was thinking something similar which is really more to ask the question

why right like like there is a big space between issuing subpoenas for Hillary Clinton's Whitehaven house to look for bones and doing an interview where you basically

just come clean and say we checked it out he fucking opted himself like they could have they could have done more, they could have sort of fan the flames, they could have claimed that we'll never get to the bottom of it. I hate to say it because who knows what we have coming. But this, it's as if they're acting with a little bit of seriousness. There's like some element that there's some reason in which they don't want to, maybe it's because they have to lead these organizations and they have to actually work with people day to day. Maybe there's a human element to it. I can't explain it. My theory of the

case is, and maybe there's something else happening, I don't know, but my theory of the case is the FBI is like a little bit different than, you know, some of these other agencies, not to impugn the great and good workers at some of those other government agencies, but I do feel like you can kind of plop in at HHS and start like firing off crazy thoughts. And like you don't, nothing's really coming to the deaths of the HHS secretary that's urgent where it's like really important that you deal with the mid-level policy staffer who's the expert on cancer research, right? Like, like, you know, all of that stuff is the long lead. It takes time. As the FBI director and deputy director, you've got all these agents that you basically accused of being in on it, right?

Like, I mean, they were very skeptical of you to start a lot of these FBI agents. I mean, they were accused of being part of the Fed's erection by their new boss, right? And you get in there and they're serious and they're coming to you with like actual life and death cases and maybe reality is this too much to hope for am I spending too optimistic of a thing where like reality's intervened a little bit and they're just trying to like

calm the sharks while they like deal with the actual life of being at the bureau is that naive? I don't know it's naive unless it's true it's naive unless it's true there is a human element that I do think is part of this which is whatever their, whatever their, like, expectations of what they'd find, suddenly the people

they're working with are real people. And they're, they're, they're, they're, they're serious people. They're, they are FBI agents, leaders that, you know, are not going to be pushed around and, uh, kind of can smell weakness too. You know, they're, they're, uh, and not going to put up with fools. And I do think there's a human element of just they got to interact with these guys every day. And it's a little bit. It must be intimidating. It must be intimidating. Maybe also, like they think their fans are going to go along with it.

I don't know. Like if you're Dan Bongino, you've created an adoring fan base of morons, right, who believed your every word. And so now you, like, went and got to watch the Epstein tapes. Like, it's insane in this position you're in. And, like, you got to watch it yourself and look at it and watch the man die. and you're like, okay, now I'm going to be able to go back out to the people and be like, I watch the tapes. You can, you trust me. I'm Dan Bongino.

I'm the one that, you know, told you down was up. It's, uh, it's funny, though. They haven't been able to deliver on any of it, right? Like, we're not getting any fucking aliens. Uh, we're not getting any more, uh, more of interest on JFK or RFK. They've not delivered anything revelatory on any of the, you know, uh, conspiratorial stories around, whether it's MLK or. or fucking the people,

Hillary Clinton was meant to have murdered. Like, there's just no, they're not giving on anything. They're just batting it all down. That's enough to make you think they've been compromised. If they gave you one thing, maybe, but come on. None of it's true. The aliens, the second shooter, the Epstein murderer, you got nothing, you know, Whitewater.

I mean, look, you just hate to think that somebody like Dan Bongino, who is a former Secret Service officer or someone like how, Ash Patel, who was a part of the U.S. Attorney's Office, that these two people might very well have been plans from the deep state all along. These are two people that were there from the very beginning to build trust among the patriots in this country. And it is sad to see that the hope in Dan Bongino and Cash Patel that these hopes were misplaced because these were unreliable narrators from the beginning. Because who better to help protect the deep state's prerogative than two outsiders who the MAGA-based they could trust. Who better to allow the deep state's murderous rampage led by a cabal of wealthy international Jews to continue than two outsiders who claim they were there to stop it? It's sad to see. We should have seen it coming actually. On Cash Patel, we learned that Cash Patel was living with a rich man in Las Vegas for some reason. You know, that doesn't seem like kind of an independent-minded outsider. That seems like a man that might be compromised. You know, sometimes you can't see the

strings and those are the strings that are most dangerous to be pulled to you. It's disappointing. But I'll tell you something, Tim, here's one conspiracy theory you can take to the bank. The bulwark and crooked media have been secretly working together on a plot. We are going to be doing a big gay live show and fundraiser during World Pride in D.C. at the Lincoln Theater on June 6th Friday night. It is called Free Andre a fundraiser at World Pride. We're donating the proceeds to the Immigrant Defenders Law Center,

which represents Andre Hernandez-Ramaro and others being held in El Salvador, illegally, unconstitutionally. You can get tickets at cricket.com slash events. They're going pretty fast. It's a serious cause, but it's going to be a really fun show. Tim, me, Sarah Longwell, see if she can get a word in Edgewood. Doubt it.

You drink every time a lesbian utters a word during the show. How many words can a lesbian get in edgewise? That's what this show will be a test of. I think that you could get, you know, lightly tipsy by the end of the show at the end of that game. And it's going to be great. We're going to touch all of everybody's, you know, emotional pleasure centers. You know, we're going to have rage. There might be a little bit of rage and anger and passion and a little sadness.

But then laughter, joy, glitter, silliness. We're going to manage to do them all. We're going to touch them all in 90 minutes or so. Coming out with us, June 6th, Friday night, get the tickets at crooked.com slash events. And also do as a favor, subscribe to this channel. Subscribe to the Potsave America Feed on YouTube. It helps us grow this channel. Oh, my, look at that.

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