Breaking News from Pod Save America - Wow: Trump Sues Fox News Owner Rupert Murdoch Over Epstein Letter

Episode Date: July 18, 2025

Dan Pfeiffer and Tommy Vietor break down the latest twist in Trump’s Epstein scandal. After a shocking Wall Street Journal report revealed new details about Trump’s ties to Jeffrey Epstein, Trump is now threatening to sue Rupert Murdoch. What does it all mean — and how bad could this get? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

All right, this has been a truly crazy 12 hours of so of news about Donald Trump's disastrous handling of the Jeffrey Epstein file. So I'm going to catch you guys up quickly. First, there was this blockbuster story in the Wall Street Journal headlined Jeffrey Epstein's friends sent him body letters for a 50th birthday album. One was from Donald Trump. Shortly after that story was published, Trump announced on Truth Social that he will be suing the Wall Street Journal, its parent company, News Corp, and Rupert Murdoch himself. that big, known lib, Rupert Murdoch, Dan. Apparently Trump's contribution to the Epstein birthday album was like a poem and a drawing. It is described as, quote,

several lines of typewritten texts framed by the outline of a naked woman, which appears to be hand-drawn with a heavy marker. A pail of small arcs denotes the woman's breasts and the future president's signature is a squiggly Donald below her waist, mimicking pubic hair. Excellent. Inside the outline of the naked woman was a typewritten nose. This is our president in the United States, guys. Inside the outline of the naked woman is a typewritten note style that's an imaginary conversation between Trump and Epstein written in the third person.

Voiceover. There must be more to life than having everything. The note began. Donald. Yes, there is, but I won't tell you what it is. Jeffrey, nor will I, since I also know what it is. Donald, we have certain things in common, Jeffrey. Yes, yes, we do, come to think of it. Donald, enigmas never age. Have you noticed that? Jeffrey, as a matter of fact, it was clear to me the last time I saw you. Donald, a pal is a wonderful. thing. Happy birthday and may every day be another wonderful secret. Wow. Dan, I know you were forced to react to this story in real time by Favro when you were recording Positive America yesterday, but now you've had some time to kind of think about it all. How important do you think this journal story is in the growing body of evidence that connects Trump to Jeffrey Epstein? It's fascinating. It's super fucking weird. It's, you could do a textual analysis of this and come up with all kinds of theories about what the secrets are they share, what an enigma is, who's the

enigma in this mix, the use of the term age there. It's all very strange. What I think over the, I'm not sure it tells us a ton new, right? We already have the photos of them together. We have the blockbuster quote from New York Magazine 2002 about how Jeffrey Epstein likes women on the young side. So we know of that. I imagine over the course of time, this can, continues to put more pressure on Trump to release something in the Epstein files. It raises more questions among his suddenly skeptical MAGA base about his connections to Epstein. And really this idea that this whole time, Donald Trump was supposed to be the person who broke up this elite cabal of pedophiles, of sex traffickers who are sort of running America, which is the core fundamental criminology of both QAnon and the Epstein conspiracy. and now this is just more evidence that Donald Trump is more connected to it than almost any other political figure.

Yeah, I mean, the New York Magazine quote you mentioned is from 2002. He says, I've known Jeff for 15 years, terrific guy. He's a lot of fun to be with. It has even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do. And many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it. Jesus Christ, what more do we need to know? Trump apparently threatened to, that he threatened the editor-in-chief of the journal.

Apparently he called Rupert Murdoch, threatened Murdoch, said don't publish this piece. Trump then claimed to the journal that he never, he said, I never wrote a picture in my life. I don't draw pictures of women, he said. It's not my language. It's not my words. Twitter users quickly surfaced a doodle that Trump had done that had been sold at auction. We will put an image of that in here. I'm with you.

Like, everything we need to know about Trump and Epstein is already out there. But I do think it's relevant because, like, even the craziest magotypes will concede that Trump knew Jeffrey Epstein and that they were friends. But they claim that he, they claim Trump wasn't aware of. of or like party to these horrific crimes that Epstein did. This suggests they shared a secret. And then what was that secret? Right. And also just the timing of this reporting and the revelation.

Like this ensures that a massive number of people will hear about this story, which is not the case with every like paywalled Wall Street Journal story that gets published. Yeah. I think I am more interested in Trump's reaction to this story than the story itself. And I'm pretty interested in the story itself. So that says that the fact that he went to such lengths to try to get this stop that he calling the editor of the journal himself to try to convince them not to publish it, that he is calling Rupert Murdoch telling him not to publish it, suggests that he's very, very scared about

these connections coming more to light, which goes to the larger question of why he is working so hard, why he is willing to take on so much political water to keep the Epstein file secret. It just raises question after question after question of what Trump is hiding. Yeah, what is he hiding? Okay, we'll get to the lawsuit in a second. Trump also truthed yesterday, quote, based on the ridiculous amount of publicity given to Jeffrey Epstein, I've asked Attorney General Pam Bondi to produce any and all pertinent grand jury testimony subject to court approval. This scam perpetuated by the Democrats should end right now. Let's watch this

clip from CNN where legal expert Ellie Honig explains what's in the grand jury testimony versus what is assumed to be in the entire Epstein file. So first of all, Donald Trump is the one who tweeted about or truth social about this. a half hour ago. So this is brand new. And what Donald Trump said to do there is not to turn over all the Epstein files. I really want to make sure people understand the context here of what he did say he wanted release because it is a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of those files. We know from the FBI's memo last week that the entirety of the Epstein files is 300 gigabytes of information. I looked it up. I talked to a tech guy. That's equal to about 100,000,000

e-books. Okay, so think about a book, 300 pages, 100,000 of those. That's how much information is in the entire Epstein file. The grand jury transcripts means the written transcript that the court reporter takes of whoever went into the grand jury and testified. So already you are leaving out tons of documents. Most witnesses, as a federal prosecutor, don't even go into the grand jury. They just talk to you in a conference room, not in the grand jury. So very interesting context there. Also, Dan, I think it's worth noting that a couple days ago we were told the government like could not or should not release any of these documents. So it's a big flip-flop. Dan, do you think this selective release of documents is going to satisfy MAGA folks or at least like give the Trump defenders enough to point to

to say, look, he's listening. He did what we wanted. I think this could help with Republican members of Congress who are trying to find this weird middle ground between not inflaming the MAGA base against them, but also not getting Trump so angry at them, where it's like, there's now something to say, right? Where you can say, I'm for transparency. Even Trump is for transparency. He asked for this. And because this whole thing is, I think as Ellie really points out well here, but it's a very

transparent attempt to appear transparent without being transparent. Yep. Because it's the stuff that really matters is not going to come out. Most of it will probably not come out because of rules around grand jury secrecy. So you need a court to okay it. A court will probably not okay it. Even if a court did okay it, what would come out is not going to, it's a fractal. of what is out there and it's the least relevant stuff that's available.

For the people who really want answers here, the people who have turned on Trump, the people who have real questions about this, I don't think this is going to satisfy them because it's pretty clear to anyone who's paying any attention that this is fake, right? That it's not, it doesn't answer the mail. No, it doesn't. And also, this was an amazing detail. ABC News reported this, Dan, that remember back in February, Pam Bondi, the Attorney General, brought all these influencers to the White House and then, hands.

handed them, these binders that said the Epstein files, phase one. Now, most of that was information that had already been in the public domain. It was kind of a rehash. But included in the phase one binder of documents was a three-page catalog of evidence that, according to ABC, offers a roadmap to all the remaining documents, including, like, logs of who visited Epstein's Island, the records of wiretaps of Galane Maxwell, et cetera, et cetera. So like dumbass, inept Pam Bondi handed all these people who care deeply about the Epstein files documents that show just how little Donald Trump is actually trying to disclose here. And that also just once again speaks to just how much of a radical 180 degree turn the Trump administration did here is that this was phase one.

Phase one implies phase two, phase three plus four. And there's a roadmap of what's in there of what is to come if they were to go through those additional phases. And so they were headed towards transparency, very clearly. Something happened to change their mind to the point they put out that unsigned memo from the FBI and the DOJ say that there's nothing there. We're not going to release it. Stop talking about it. And that just raises a lot of questions that this grand jury ploy that Trump does doesn't answer. Yeah, sure doesn't.

All right, let's talk about Trump's lawsuit threat. So we have seen in the last few months ABC News been the need of Trump in a lawsuit. They absolutely could have won. we saw CBS settle the most absurd defamation lawsuit of all time because it was about their editing of an interview with Kamala Harris. Donald Trump wasn't even a party of it. CBS also pushed out the head of 60 minutes. Last night, we learned that they canceled Stephen Colbert show just days after Colbert

criticized them for folding in this lawsuit. And also remember, this is all happening as CBS's parent company is trying to get the Trump administration to approve a multi-billion dollar merger. So clearly like business equities are driving what's happening here. But Dan, interestingly, over the last six months or so, I've noticed that some of Rupert Murdoch's newspapers have been doing the toughest coverage of Trump, especially the Wall Street Journal. But often like New York Post front pages have been really rough. Now, Fox News is fucking state TV, right? And true to form after this story broke, I think Fox News literally cut to a segment about Biden's debate performance from June of 2024.

It's even worse than that, is that like Favreau and I, Laura Ingram was on air when this broke, and she said, we have breaking news from the Wall Street Journal. More on that when we come back. Then there was never more of that. In fact, according to Brian Stelter from CNN, it was never mentioned. The Wall Street Journal story was never mentioned in all of Fox prime time last night. Oh, my God. That is just incredible. Breaking news when we come back.

Just kidding. I don't know, what do you make of this latest kind of like lawsuit threat from Trump? I mean, I feel like he has one speed, right? Like he's going to attack, attack, attack. But is Murdoch going to fold here? I don't know. I would be surprised if Murdoch folded here. And I don't even, he doesn't have an interest before Trump in the way that Paramount does,

the way that ABC does. And he has more leverage than either of those folks do. It's interesting the way Murdoch is playing this, which is the Wall Street Journal is very tough, but Fox News, which he also owned is fully pro-Trump. The lawsuit will. Trump ever actually filed this lawsuit, will it ever actually happen, or he file it and then drop it like he did with his absurd lawsuit against the Des Moines Register and Ansela for a poll he didn't like in an election he won? Right. Right. This is just, I mean, he, Trump is trying to,

one, it is his like natural pavlovering reaction to a bad story as to threaten to sue. And that is, that usually it looks ridiculous. That has actually had great success as the media has become more cowed by Trump since he's been back in office. Whether Ruma Murdoch will be cowed, I don't know. But It is a way to try to rally the MAGA base against the media. It's just hard to rally the MAGA base against the media entity owned by the guy who also pays Sean Hannity's salary. Put together your summer wardrobe with Abercromey. First step, new denim. Abercrombie added new linen blend jeans their lineup.

They're really lightweight and a comfortable cotton linen blend you need for summer. Their archive shirt is your next must have. Cut at a 90s inspired oversized fit that gives a put-together but relaxed look. Pair it with their classic Poplin short and you have your new go-to outfit for the season. Set your wardrobe up with Abercrombie this summer. Shopping the app, online, and in stores. Yeah, well said. And apparently Rupert Murdoch was in Trump's box with Pam Bondi at the FIFA Club World Cup on Sunday.

So must have been some awkward chit-chat. Okay, last thing, Dan. So Rachel Bade is a reporter at Politico tweeted the following. counterintuitive take. The WSJ story just might be the best thing to happen to Trump since the Epstein story exploded. For the first time, those who most vocally criticized him, his admins, for not releasing enough info, are now rallying to his support. At least for now, we shall see if this holds. Seemed unlikely just a few hours ago, but looks like Trump is getting some in MAGA to embrace his new favorite phrase.

The Epstein hoax is a reminder that nothing unites ours more than complaints about the media. Okay. Dan, let's unpack that. I certainly like I try not to get mad at it right away like certainly the MAGA kind of professional influencer class they would rather attack the journal the right than have to criticize Trump and this gives them something to do. I'm also sure that like the info wars audience for example is not convinced by like anything in the mainstream media like they just fully distrust everything. But I keep thinking about the young men who are drawn to Trump because they saw him on Joe Rogan or

Fiavon or Flagrant or any of these other podcasts. Do we really think these guys are going to just write off the last two weeks of crazy behavior as like just fake news media bias? Like that seems ridiculous. Yeah. If you are looking for an on-ramp to get back on board with Trump, you could use this Wall Street Journal's story as a way to do that if you wanted to. But I just don't see how that solves the underlying problem.

Trump does not have an elite problem here. He has an actual voter problem. Yep. And you can see this because there is an audience for the criticism of Trump. People want it when like take Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk went to the TP, his TPSA conference. People were chanting about this. It was the number one topic.

Trump called him. He tried to watch out. I'm never talking about that again. And then a few days later, he's basically on a podcast begging Trump to address it because of all the comments he's getting from his audience about how Trump is mishandling. miss what the possible cover-up is. I just don't see how rallying them against the Wall Street Journal is going to solve what that. That's a grassroots problem. Can it help you maybe with a few elites? Can it get Elon Musk to send a tweet? Can it get J.D. Vance out of the bunker to defend you

for a second? Sure. But it doesn't, I don't see how it solves the underlying problem, which is very real questions about very suspicious behavior about Trump for an issue that Trump's allies made to be a central part of the story of what's wrong with America. Yeah, and it is worth noting. Elon Musk, 18 hours ago tweeted, wow, I can't believe Epstein killed himself before realizing it was all a hoax. I don't say he's on board yet. You love not on board yet. You're right, though,

J.D. Vance. J.D. Vance was suspiciously quiet about this, in part because I think Politico correctly perceived that he couldn't retweet things that were seen as attacking like the Maga flock. You know, he wants to get Trump's back, but not attack Republicans. J.D. Vant tweeted, forgive my language, but this story is complete and utter

bullshit. The W.S.J. should be ashamed for publishing it. Where is the letter? You'd be shocked to learn. They never showed it to us before publishing it. Does anyone honestly believe this sounds like Donald Trump? Has anyone sold their soul more completely than J.D. Vance? It's hard for me to think of one. Yeah, absolutely not. I mean, J.D. Vance is way further out there on release of the F.C. F.C. files than Trump himself. Yeah. He was on Theo Vaughn's podcast right before the election, as Trump's vice presidential nominee say declaring that they should release all the files. Yep. And Theo Vaughn very recently tweeted.

He retweeted that clip and he was like, yeah, what happened? What changed? So not, uh, it's not, it's not selling shady. It's just interesting here that all that, you know, Theo Vaughn, Rogan, Andrew Schultz, like a lot of like their core identity is anti-establishment and how this is being handled right now. Trump is now playing the role of the establishment. He's the corrupt political system they're against. And that, and that is turning them against them.

And that could have long-term consequences. Yeah. I mean, John and I did flagrant, uh, uh, Andrew Schultz is positive. the other day. It's very clear to me that those guys were completely wrongly characterized as Republican or MAGA. I think they're probably all mostly independents who voted different ways. But you're right. Like I think there is just a deep frustration with Washington and the status quo. And that comes from Trump lying about this, but also the feeling that Democrats were lying to them and saying, you actually don't Joe Biden's totally up for running again four more years,

et cetera. Right. And I do think this is a pretty shocking moment of just Trump going back, not only on a promise, but also really looking like he's covering up for like the worst people in the world. I mean, the, one of the fundamental problems for Democrats with the Biden age discourse, even before the debate was everyone had this opinion and elites within the party were saying, don't believe your eyes. Right. Exactly.

And that is what Trump is saying right here. He's saying, ignore everything I said to you before. Ignore everything you're seeing or rationally believe. Ignore the evidence. Listen to me. and within that dissonance is where you start having real political problems and real trust problems. Yeah, that's really well said. Yeah, the Wall Street Journal story is Joe Biden tripping over a sandbag on stage.

Yes. Okay, that's it for us on this. Thank you all for watching this Potsave America YouTube exclusive. As you know, we are trying to build a counterweight to all these right-wing garbage news outlets that have huge accounts on YouTube. And the problem with that is when people, normal people go on YouTube to search for political news, They find TPSA and they find Ben Shapiro and a bunch of garbage. And we are trying to build a bigger presence on YouTube so that people find good, credible information from a progressive perspective.

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